Old Yank is right… Cheato admitted his wraps were loaded.Posted August 25, 2013 1:51 am
Capatillo said that he made and innocent infraction in putting a protective knuckle pad in the wraps and that was not capable of hurting others. Margarito felt the pad and said in court that it was not at all dangerous.
And people with a enough experience, common sense, and independence know that a kangaroo court when they see one and the Los Angeles court that persecuted Margarito is ranked 2nd worst in the U.S.
atra.org/reports/hellholes/2006/hellholes2006.pdfPosted August 24, 2013 2:40 pm
NO! The bottom line is that Capetillo CONFESSED to loading Margarito’s gloves and Margarito did not deny, even once, that his gloves had been loaded by Capetillo. His case was ENTIRELY based on ADMITTING his gloves had IN FACT been loaded but DENYING any PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY! These are FACTS! GUILTY! You can get into quite a frenzy licking your balls, but it will not change the facts!Posted August 24, 2013 1:41 pm
Old Yank, the Superior court that you hold in such high esteem for dissing Margarito is also a Judicial hellhole. here is just a bit about Judge Yaffe who misjudged Margarito.
Judge Yaffe is the “tip of the iceberg” of the largest judicial scandal in American history. In Los Angeles County alone, approximately $300 million of illegal payments have been made to Los Angeles Superior Court judges from Los Angeles County since the late 1980’s.
Judge Yaffe Violated Due Process by Holding a 69 year old man in Contempt and Ordering him and Keeping him in “Coercive Confinement” Without a Hearing.
Judge Yaffe’s Actions are Not an Isolated Incident But a Continuing Course of Conduct that Mandates his Removal. “By keeping him [Fine] incarcerated for 18 months, the court has deterred others from defying its orders …”
Judge Yaffe Committed “Fraud Upon the Court” By Presiding Over the Marina Strand Case While Having Received Illegal Payments From Los Angeles County and Not Having Disclosed Such Thereby Voiding All of His Actions. Then Violated Federal and State Due Process, His Oath of Office and the Supremacy Clause of the U.S. Constitution by Judging his Own Actions in the Contempt Proceeding Ancillary to the Marina Strand Case.Posted August 24, 2013 1:21 pm
Ha..one of my very points! The lab results were mysteriously not available to the trial but they did sensationalize two elements (sulfur and calcium) that are found in what the CSAC ” accused Margarito of using.
However the lab results are not consistent with plaster or calcium sulphate because without the third element– oxygen, its like saying: we found some hydrogen and all that was missing to make water was the oxygen.
its correct that X-ray X-ray fluorescence does not detect oxygen but its easily detected with an electron microscope, which any modern lad should have had.
Moreover, the accusers conveniently left out the fact that that these elements are also found in SKIN CELLS, HAIR, SWEAT, BLOOD, Hand LOTIONS and a gazillion other things.
Bottom line is that the dots make a frame– Margarito was framed on trumped up charges for a minor infraction of rule 323 .Posted August 24, 2013 1:17 pm
maracho — CO2 is found in your lungs. It is also found in tree bark. I’m willing to wager that any person with a lick of common sense would conclude that the CO2 in your lungs is associated with the air in your lungs and not with tree bark in your lungs! I’m also willing to wager that any person with a lick of common sense who examined the pads would conclude that the chemical substance on the pads was more likely associated with a plaster-like substance than any of the crap you postulate. Capetillo CONFESSED to loading Margarito’s gloves. Margarito NEVER ONCE denied that the load was found in his gloves, he simply denied that he was responsible for placing them there. END OF STORY!Posted August 24, 2013 11:10 am
The lab reported the chemical composition of what was found on the pads. That composition is consistent with a number of things found in any number of places. It is also consistent with plaster of paris and consistent with what each commission member could conclude via common sense after seeing and handling the pads for themselves.Posted August 24, 2013 11:03 am
maracho — There was no hearing before the Department of Justice. The pads were presented as evidence at both hearings before the CSAC. each member got to examine them, feel how hard they were, get a sense of their size and more. They were passed around in an evidence bag after being examined by the crime lab. Again, all of these facts are readily available. If you persist in relying on lies to prop up your delusions then we will eventually recognize you as delusional. I mean no harm to you. But I do mean to keep the facts straight on this thread.Posted August 24, 2013 11:00 am
Maracho — You are woefully misinformed about everything Margarito in the glove-loading incident. Richardson did not turn the pads over to Goldenboy, A very specific chain-of-evidence procedure was followed that turned the pads over to CSAC officials, not to Goldenboy. All of this is easy to find fact about the case. If you feel a need to prop up your fantasy with a collection of imagined things that happened, then that’s your choice. But don;t come on here peddling your lies — they are just too easy to call out.Posted August 24, 2013 10:56 am
Supreme Court, the Lidocaine/Xylocaine that Floyd uses is not topical but rather is injected into his hands with a syringe.Posted August 24, 2013 1:50 am
he should have said “I cited…”
Maracho you are not a Fraud….
(Un petit malentendu…Maracho est rehabilite…)
However, the referred studies are about a different method of application… The compound is “injected into the system…Whereas in the case of Floyd it is a local external application….
You are trying so hard to link Floyd to PED…Posted August 23, 2013 11:59 pm
Richardson came in lake like gangbusters but complaining and making Margarito wrap his hands a couple times before finding the inserts that only he referred to as rock hard. Then right in front of all the inspectors, he illegally takes possession of these inserts and hands them over to bossman Golden Boy.
Inspector Che Guevara in the meantime pleads ignorance in not seeing the inserts but is still a main witness against Margarito. Oh and then he immediately gets a big promotion at the CSAC.Posted August 23, 2013 7:16 pm
The Department of Justice mysteriously and illegally kept the knuckle pads from the hearing because they wanted to sensationalize lies and hide the fact that the lab results were more consistent with calcium sulfide which is derived via carbothermic reduction (removal of 02) of calcium sulfate. Calcium sulfide, fairly common in Nevada, is a salt used since ancient times in homeopathic remedies, particularly for fungus and infections of the skin; and which would go quite nicely with a gauze used to prevent infection of a boxer’s bloody knuckle.Posted August 23, 2013 6:33 pm
Capetillo has already admitted using the knuckle pads in practice with several fighters but he also made it clear that these knuckle pads where not plaster and where merely an innocent mistake. In court when Margarito was asked to pick up the pad and describe it, he said “the pad didnt look dangerous or illegal at all”. When Mosley was asked about the pad, he also said that it was not hard. other former boxers in the hearing also referred to the pads as soft. The prosecutors claimed that the pad was meant to harden but it never really did. The old blood stain only confirms Mosley’s testimony of a “soft knuckle pad” was never meant to “harden”.Posted August 23, 2013 6:29 pm
The incessant crimes committed by the California courts and CSAC are factsPosted August 23, 2013 6:27 pm
Thanks mountain mommas!Posted August 23, 2013 6:13 pm
caffeine modulates neurotransmitters too.in a way far more helpful to athletic performance and is safe enough to take at levels with a systemic effect. if the strongest evidence to ban something is two case studies with a CNS adverse event you certainly wouldn’t be allowed to take Tylenol/paracetamol, and cut men wouldn’t be allowed to use adrenaline/epinephrine during fights to close up cuts.Posted August 23, 2013 5:21 pm
Yes indeed. Naazim Richardson should be strung up for finding a foreign substance of the same chemical compound as found in plaster of paris in Margarito’s gloves. Capetillo was of course LYING when he identified them at the CSAC hearing as what he placed in Margarito’s gloves and took full responsibility for preparing them and wrapping them in the gloves. And no legal principle of ship-captain should ever be applied because it is NEVER a fighter’s or captain’s responsibility to be legally prepared for combat, it should always be someone else’s responsibility for the captain to know what’s going on. No man making nearly a million bucks for a fight should ever think twice about protecting his purse by acting in a legal manner and forcing his crew to do the same. Every official from those in the crime lab that identified the substance to those connected to the Superior Court of the State of California was involved in a conspiracy to take down Margarito. Yup…that’s the ticket! DUNCES, TOTAL DUNCES!Posted August 23, 2013 5:13 pm
Mama bears from Hebron to Megiddo
Maracho proved that California is a judicial hellhole, especially the one that tried Margarito but then lynch mobs dont really care about that do they?Posted August 23, 2013 5:00 pm
Mama bears from Hebron to Megiddo
Silly Court, the term submit is most often used when one writes and then submits the paper to be reviewed
Anyway, just scroll down and you will see where our Maracho presented you with two peer reviewed articles about mind altering Lidocaine, one of included the article and journal title, abstract, and publishing date, and the other a link to the same info.Posted August 23, 2013 4:53 pm
I painted no one in California as an angel. I presented the facts about what happened in California. The fact that the CSAC found Margarito guilty and that the Superior Court of California upheld the conviction is instructive. The fact that it was referred to the California Department of Justice for consideration of criminal charges is instructive and a fact. It paints no California body as angels nor devils. It simply is a statement of facts. Because you’ve taken a ride on Margarito’s nut sack you’re apparently pissed off about the facts. I can’t change the facts, they are what they are. You may speculate about all you like, but the facts about what happened are what they are.Posted August 23, 2013 4:48 pm
You are a fraud!
Any researcher, scientist, faculty, postgraduate would use the verb ” submit”, not “present” ( a peer-reviewed article)…
I challenge you to state the title of your alleged paper….
( A beau mentir qui se cache derriere un clavier)Posted August 23, 2013 2:30 pm
Mama bears from Hebron to Megiddo
Maracho es nues oso peligrso de montenegro como mismo de MoisesPosted August 23, 2013 1:39 pm
Yes, I was exposing the frenzied evils of Golden Calf fanaticism and falsification against a great fighter named Margarito when you came along with this long letter that you claim proves that Margarito should literally be sacrificed to hell. It goes on and on about the evils of Arum and Texas while trying to make the Los Angeles law dogs look like angels
Your same article also briefly blames Arum for getting Valero re-licensed and again said nothing negative about your Golden Boy. So I simply countered with the more knowledgeable Dan Rafael article, which actually focused on the Valero re-licensing case and which doesnt even mention Arum or Top Rank.Posted August 23, 2013 1:23 pm
maracho — How do you feel about Buffalo Boy likening you to an old Jewish woman?Posted August 23, 2013 12:43 pm
I suppose you would know.Posted August 23, 2013 12:41 pm
Guido from Buffalo
Adults? You remind me of a Nazi who would torture an old Jewish woman after she offered to give you chicken soup to ward off the cold.Posted August 23, 2013 10:47 am
FACTS: Arum’s attorney, armed with the Mesi legal case, got New York to admit that they cannot legally suspend a license that they never issued. Arum cleared Valero’s suspension in NY and that cleared the path for him to be licensed in Texas. Valero’s first bout in 2009 after the NY suspension was lifted via Arum’s efforts was as a Top Rank fighter. It’s the plain, and easily documented record of truth.
When someone catches your mistake and it’s obvious you made one, it is best to simply thank them for correcting the mistake. It’s how adults behave.Posted August 23, 2013 10:42 am
maracho — FROM YOUR POST FROM BELOW:
“Oh but Old yank never treads on the golden Boy’s holy water. For instance, he claims that Arum got pycho Volero cleared when it was actually Godenboy who did that.” Posted August 21, 2013 1:11 pm
So let’s be clear: You CALLED ME OUT! Your words fool, not mine — you state that Goldenboy got Valero cleared to fight. YOU ARE WRONG, YOU WILL ALWAYS BE WRONG and I’VE spoon-fed the truth to you. But you spend DAYS refusing to be educated by spoon-fed FACTS and spoon-fed TRUTH!
And…I HAMMERED Mosley in the past for using PEDS! HAMMERED HIM! Even DEMANDED that his wins over De La Hoya be changed to No Contest due to Mosley’s confessions. I HAMMERED De La Hoya for his STUPID training camp in prep for Pacquiao – -HAMMERED HIM!
OH…And…Hopefuully Buffalo Boy will catch your misspelling to Valero’s name.Posted August 23, 2013 10:35 am
Guido from Buffalo – Thanks for the correction.Posted August 23, 2013 10:23 am
No, I presented a recent peer reviewed article of men getting high from a regular dose of local anesthetic called lidocaine, which Floyd uses before boxing matches and which modulates fight hormones, neurotransmitters, etc..Posted August 23, 2013 2:11 am
Let me clear up your frustration. What I said the other day was that Valero signed with Golden Boy in 2003 (not 2004) but his fist fight back in the U.S. against Pitalua and after the long suspension was promoted by Golden Boy who won the bid to promote it even though Valero was signed under Arum.
Oh and how did I abuse the article when I simply quoted it word for word?Posted August 23, 2013 1:57 am
And in March of 2008 when ESPN published the article you TOTALLY ABUSE in how you reference it, Valero was STILL NOT LICENSED. It makes no difference what the F was printed when Goldenboy was FAILING to getting done what needed to get done. ARUM got done what Goldenboy could not! And in April 2009, as a TOP RANK fighter, Valero fought in teh USA for the first time since his license was suspended because the BOBFATHER did his lawyer magic. You are an ineducable dumb ass who cannot read and cannot learn even when SPOON FED!Posted August 23, 2013 12:57 am
Maracho – so your proposition is that you inject Lidocaine in your hand in such a volume that it travels around your body and modulates the adrenaline fight/flight response?
If this is the aim, why not just drink a cup of coffee?
There is a reason local anaesthetics are local and not general.Posted August 23, 2013 12:52 am
NO! YOU DUMB ASS FOOL! Valero was first signed by Goldenboy in 2004 after his great showing in California in 2003. The “groundwork” Goldenboy was laying for Valero to get licensed failed. Goldenboy SOLD Valero to Top Rank. Bob Arum got the NY suspension lifted. AND THAT IS THE STORY OF HOW VALERO GOT LICENSED TO FIGHT AGAIN IN THE USA. THE END!Posted August 23, 2013 12:52 am
Hmm. but its its obvious that Arum and Oscar are playing Democrat/Republican. In other words, they are only public enemies so as to keep the public wondering who’s really at fault, when in reality promoters are greedy lobbyists in essencePosted August 22, 2013 4:57 pm
“Although Valero was later cleared to box by several California doctors, New York refused to remove him from the suspension list. ……….For the past several months, Teiken, with help from Golden Boy, has been laying the foundation for him [Valero] to be licensed here.”
Valero signed with Top Rank but the first fight was promoted by Golden Boy
“But I have all the faith in the world that I will be fighting in the U.S. next year,” he said. “With Golden Boy and Mr. [Akihiko] Honda [of Teiken] behind me, I believe that opportunity will eventually be given to me, and I am hoping it is in 2008. I would like to fight the best at 130 pounds.” Edwin Valero
Published by By Dan Rafael ESPN.com March 25, 2008Posted August 22, 2013 4:45 pm
MARACHO — DO YOU KNOW HOW TO READ? Goldenboy signed Valero in 2004 and was UNABLE to get him licensed. He was finally licensed in Texas in 2009 via efforts by Bob Arum. Arum picked him up from Goldenboy and was successful in his efforts to get the NY Commission suspension lifted, allowing him to be licensed in Texas. He fought in the USA in 2009 for the first time following the suspension against a fighter named Antonio Pitalua in a bout promoted by Bob Arum’s Top Rank Boxing (not by goldenboy). The ESPN article does not say a WORD about Goldenboy getting Valero licensed — they simply state that Goldenboy signed him in 2004. All of my facts in the post below were confirmed by the ABC when I was researching for an article on a related matter. I don’t know what some people can be spoon-fed the truth and still choose to remain ignorant. Go ahead, look it up. Who was the promoter for Valero’s first bout back in the USA following his suspension?Posted August 22, 2013 3:52 pm
Rafa’s link below says Golden Boy and Teiken got the suspension lifted in California and Texas for Golden Boy’s Lightweight Lighting Event. So take that up with Dan whom I hate to say is usually more informed than yourself in these matters.
Second, its physically impossible to repeatedly punch someone while having a hard knuckle pad taped on the puncher’s knuckle without severely damaging said knuckle.Posted August 22, 2013 2:34 pm
maracho — LISTEN UP you total DUMB ASS! Goldenboy could NOT get Valero licensed in TEXAS because he failed am MRI in New York that resulted in the NYAC SUSPENDING his license. The Texas commission made it clear to Goldenboy that Valero would not be licensed in Texas as long as his license was suspended in New York. HERE IS WHERE BOB ARUM STEPS IN. Again, listen up you uninformed DUMB ASS! Are you familiar with the Messi case? Joe Messi was denied a license to fight because an MRI showed residual damage from a prior brain bleed. The state that suspended Messi issued boxing licenses that had to be renewed every year or else they automatically expired. Messi’s attorney allowed the license to automatically expire and then successfully argued a state cannot continue to suspend a license that does not exist. He successfully argued that no other state commission could honor a reciprocal-suspension of a license that did not exist — Messi’s had been allowed to expire – he had no license – without a license there was nothing to suspend. Arum hired an attorney and approached the NYSAC on Valero’s behalf. They argued that New York never issued Valero a license and therefore there was no NY State license for them to suspend. Indeed they refused to grant one, but BASED OIN THE MESSI CASE they had no legal authority to suspend a license that did not exist. They threatened to sue the NYAC if they failed to recognize that no license existed for them to suspend. Arum’s attorney used the Messi court decision to argue before the NYSAC. The NYSAC folded and dropped Valero’s medical suspension, agreeing that they had no authority to suspend a license that had never been granted. Once the NYSAC suspension was removed, the path was opened for Goldenboy to re-approach the Texas commission. The Texas commission agreed that since Valero no longer was suspended in any other commission jurisdiction (New York in this case – New York – the HOME of BOB ARUM), that they would grant him a license. It was BOB ARUM that picked the magic lock that opened the door for Goldenboy to get Valero licensed in Texas. Now please SHUT UP! You don’t have a CLUE WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT! TOTALLY CLUELESS!Posted August 22, 2013 12:45 pm
Fact: flomos fear the factsPosted August 22, 2013 12:33 pm
He is contributing to your education…Posted August 22, 2013 10:11 am
Fact: injecting lidocaine modulates fight neurotransmitters which are produced by both glands and neurons and travel through both the nervous and circulatory systems.Posted August 22, 2013 9:51 am
I love coca ine.Posted August 22, 2013 6:07 am
Ah you are right on that, lidocaine it can cross the blood brain barrier – I should have picked that from cocaine doing the same and being part of the same family.
Some neurotransmitters are also hormones – such as Adrenaline, but that doesn`t translate to saying that you release some neurotransmitter in your hands and they cross to your head.
You inject adrenaline, it’s like the endocrine system – it is acting as a hormone. Thats the definition of hormones – they are released into the blood – they have their action away from their site of release.
Yes there are neutransmitters all over the body since there are nerves all over the body and various nerves will communicate with different neurotransmitters, but that doesn`t mean you create serotonin in your intestine to be used in your brain.
Injecting lidocaine into the hands is simply a useless way to try to act on the brain to induce euphoria. This isn`t a drug that helps athletes – the systemic side effects would inhibit performance. The only positive use is to reduce local pain.Posted August 22, 2013 6:03 am
Is euphoria a side-effect of lidocaine? Anaesthesia. 2004 Dec;59(12):1253-4.
Is euphoria a side-effect of lidocaine?
Lidocaine is widely used for local and regional anaesthesia. It is also administered intravenously to control ventricular arrhythmias. The main systemic side-effects of lidocaine are dizziness, drowsiness, coma, seizures, respiratory arrest, muscle twitching, paresthesia, dysarthria, numbness of the tongue, tinnitus, diplopia and other visual disturbances. We report an unusual side-effect which followed lidocaine administration in two patients. A 24-year-old man, ASA I, with no history of epilepsy or CNS disease, was admitted for wound repair of the left forearm. An axillary block was performed
A 56-year-old man was admitted for right femoro-popliteal endarterectomy under LOCAL anaesthesia. After infiltration of 50 ml lidocaine 1%, he developed an unexplained feeling of exaggerated happiness.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15550004?dopt=AbstractPlusPosted August 22, 2013 3:59 am
No, an intramuscular shot adrenaline is actually the route of choice for anaphylactic shock, to quickly improve breathing, stimulate the heart, raise a dropping blood pressure, etc… that’s because neurotransmitters are “transmitted” throughout the entire nervous system, which runs throughout the bodies of all animals. Seratonin is produced mostly in the intestines. Dopamine is found in all the organs as is adrenaline.
Lidocaine can get you high like Cocaine. ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8657816?dopt=Citation
local injections of Lidocaine can cross the blood-brain and placental barriers, presumably by passive diffusion and systemic absorption may be rapid.
Very well said.Posted August 22, 2013 2:04 am
Lidocaine is a local anaesthetic, it`ll affect the neurotransmitters around the nerves at the site of injection.
It blocks sodium channels – sodium is a charged ion, and it is the rushing in and out of ions that create the electric current in our nerves.
Different nervous tissue has different neurotransmitters though.
If you inject in your hand it`s a local anaesthetic and it`s Acetylcholamine that you`d be affecting.
Dopamine and serotonin are neurotransmitters in the brain, no lidocaine is getting up there from an injection in the hand. There is a blood brain barrier that prevents this.
In fact if you start having any systemic (body not local) effects from an anaesthesia is going to be bad – palpitations, twitchyness, nervousness etc.
Lidocaine is a PED in as much as you might hit someone harder for long than you would have since you can`t feel the pain, but that is all.Posted August 21, 2013 11:42 pm
Supreme Court, a simple ggoogle search will bring up a multitude of documents on fight or flight neurotransmitter like adrenalin, serotonin, dopamine, etc..Posted August 21, 2013 11:07 pm
Valero, mercy on his mighty soul, signed with Golden boy in 2003 but failed a MRI screening in 2004, which banned him from fighting in New York. Valero and Linares were also co-promoted or co managed by Teiken in Japan. Although he later briefly signed with Arum, it was Golden Boy and Teiken that had Valero licensed to fight in Texas under Golden Boys Lightweight Lightning event.
sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=3311639Posted August 21, 2013 11:04 pm
The $Moron$=of-the-day goes to Maracho!
“He also ignores Floyd’s use of Lidocaine, a PED that directly modulates fight/or flight neurotransmitters, as do amphetamines and anabolic steroids”
This is the case of a conceited person, who attempts to give the impression of “knowledgeability”.
He is telling us , with a straight face, that in human biology, there is such a thing as “fight neurotransmitters”!
What a $moron$!
( Un pedant qui prend sa vessie pour une lanterne!)Posted August 21, 2013 8:50 pm
“No. Boxtra became so annoying and childish that posters began to put Boxtra’s name on their toilet seats. Now “Correctamundo” has earned that position.”-LOL. I didn’t ask you where to FLUSH your ASININE pick of Cleverly over Kovalev. Because I already KNEW that.Posted August 21, 2013 7:06 pm
“Yes you did Assadamus.”-Well I THANK you for admitting it. I was CORRECT yet again!!!Posted August 21, 2013 7:04 pm
CORRECTION…..learn how to turn your attention to picking the overwhelming WINNER instead of the stoppage victim LOSER.Posted August 21, 2013 7:02 pm
Another great article on the end of Margarito can be found here (google): “one more round:too much to ask”Posted August 21, 2013 3:00 pm
And finally, I have been an outspoken pitbull against enhancing — including speaking out against Holyfield, Mosley and many, many others. I was drawing attention to the EPIDEMIC of enhancing in boxing while guys were swearing it was only one-off issolated insidents here and there. I knew better. Don’t even try to imply that I’ve looked the other way. That dog won’t hunt!Posted August 21, 2013 2:50 pm
maracho — Are you one of those “entitled” guys who has no need of ever taking responsibility for your actions? Margarito was a dirtbag cheat! Without loaded gloves he could beat virtually NO ONE! He went 1 and 3 with two of his three losses getting stopped inside the distance once the plaster was removed from his fists. Look at his record with plaster and look at his record when we are CERTAIN he was not loading his gloves — NIGHT and DAY baby, NIGHT and DAY!Posted August 21, 2013 2:46 pm
maracho — It saddens me how little you know while being such a huge fan. I’m from NY baby. I know what action Arum took with the NYAC to get his medical suspension lifted. Arum threatened legal action against the NYAC because they suspended Velero without ever first granting him a license. Arum equipped with the Messi case, threatened to sue the NYAC for suspending a license that they never granted. The NYAC folded and removed the suspension. Once the suspension was removed by BOB ARUM at the NYAC, then GOLDEN BOY had an open door to get Velero licensed elsewhere. Listen up young man — you are obviously a great fan but you are often CLUELESS about what happens out of the ring.Posted August 21, 2013 2:40 pm
And I know first hand that if any of us were to report any gross endangerment by fat cats like GBP, no Attorney General, State’s Attorney, local prosecution attorney, warrant officer, politician, athletic commission, police station, etc. etc.. would lift a finger to do anything about it.Posted August 21, 2013 2:17 pm
yeah supreme court we all know YOU would lick his sandals….Posted August 21, 2013 2:12 pm
Oh but Old yank never treads on the golden Boy’s holy water. For instance, he claims that Arum got pycho Volero cleared when it was actually Godenboy who did that. He ignores the all cheating by Mosley who more than likely was on Oscar’s best roidze the night he beat Margarito. He also ignores Floyd’s use of Lidocaine, a PED that directly modulates fight/or flight neurotransmitters, as do amphetamines and anabolic steroidsPosted August 21, 2013 1:11 pm
The California Attorney General, CSAC, Department of Consumer affairs, and the Dept of justice are all unjust. They tried their best to put Margarito in jail. The justice depart made sure the knuckle insert lab results never even made it to court because they new the results were consistent with calcium sulfide; an ancient common fungicide ideal for skin abrasions exposed to the inside of boxing gloves in humid Tijuana.
They only cleaned the house of members that were in favor of testifying on Margarito’s behalf. If anyone should have been cleaned out it was Guevara but instead they gave the goof a promotion. Thankfully what goes around comes around and the CSAC is finally getting its arse cleaned.
And all because of Oscar’s nasty pride and after they had Margo beat by a real steroid cheat.Posted August 21, 2013 1:03 pm
( Old Yank est une mattiere grise au-dessus de la moyenne…)Posted August 21, 2013 1:01 pm
Elanore — When did you learn to read? Congratulations! Now go for your GED. Before you know it you will be off welfare, off foodstamps and a contributing member of society. Good luck to you!Posted August 21, 2013 12:21 pm
maracho — I forgot NOTHING! By the time the Margarito affair came before the CSAC there had already been a MAJOR HOUSECLEANING! You cannot spin gold from crap and you are trying desperately to save a soul condemned to hell by painting him with fool’s gold. Glove loading is THE most loathsome crime in boxing. And…the matter was turned over to the California Justice Department to consider criminal charges. They concluded that the case was too week to obtain a likely conviction. However, when Arum’s henchman attempted to appeal the CSACD decision he was smacked down HARD and reminded that his client was damn luck to escape criminal prosecution. The statue of Margarito you attempt to erect is covered with pigeon crap 6 feet deep!Posted August 21, 2013 12:19 pm
Elanore the Withered Hag from NYC
” the incomparable boxing writer “old Yank” Schneider” WTF. One of the worse writers in ESB history who remains a legend in his own mind. This a-wipe is cluelessPosted August 21, 2013 10:58 am
For the past six months the California SAC has been increasingly ineffective and negligent. Finally, the Association of Boxing Commissions stepped up to cut ties with the administration.
Old yank, your article goes on and on about Texas licensing but y’all forget that California licenses come from the Department of Consumer Affairs, a vastly more corrupt entity.
Guevara, the major power player at the California State Athletic Commission for many years, entered a resignation letter. Guevara was the henchman for the bureaucratic behemoth known as the Department of Consumer Affairs in Sacramento, an outpost featuring some of the craziest political animals you have ever seen. It’s practically a revolving door for cronies affiliated to powerful politicians in both the state Assembly and state Senate (plus the Governor’s office). All of the political interfering over the years with CSAC has to do with major politicians who micromanaged a lowly athletic commission into the mess that it was in when Andy Foster took over.
Turbo-Hamster, my list of mysterious are facts, not theories. Yes facts really are stranger than fiction, especially to Calipornia pawns led to believe that governments are here to help themPosted August 21, 2013 9:33 am
Gonzo the Dragonborn
Most of the time they’re real wusses too. Empty vessels make the most noise. When do you ever hear King Daddy G banging on about how bad-ass he is because he comes from Kazakhstan? That’s right never.Posted August 21, 2013 7:21 am
Gonzo the Dragonborn
I’m from Brooklyn! I’m so bad-ass cause I emanate from the borough of Brooklyn. You best not mess with me, dawg! Why not? Erm, because I already told you I emanate from the borough of Brooklyn.Posted August 21, 2013 7:11 am
Gonzo the Dragonborn
I hope King Daddy G puts that stumpy little loud-mouthed cnut in the hospital. The ugly little classless bastard looks like a weeble and I just hope he’s as difficult to knock over as one and ends up taking the beating that he so richly deserves.Posted August 21, 2013 6:58 am
Maracho…..conspiracy theories are great for movies, but in real life they rely on lots of people displaying far more competency, cooperation and clarity of purpose than they ever otherwise do.Posted August 21, 2013 3:30 am
“Oscar is a spoiled old man. He’s no longer a fighter, he’s a business man. And if you ask me, he’s a smart business man. Oscar will not fight me because he knows I’ll retire him and he’s not ready to stop deceiving the public. I always made Oscar bleed when we sparred. I would hurt Oscar so much that he would have his trainer dismiss me from his training camp. Oscar wanted to hit, but he would get upset when I would hit back. I loved sparring with Oscar, I always wanted to show I could last with him. I always went in with the mentality that Oscar was helping me and not I helping him. Oscar says he has about three more fights in him, but he wants to make sure those three fights are against opponents he will beat and he knows he can’t beat me. This is to tell you I’m definitely not being considered.”Posted August 21, 2013 3:08 am
Court Journalist Avila said : “One of the actual knuckle pads used by Capetillo on Margarito’s hands was on a table 10 feet away from me. I walked over to the table and asked the deputy district attorney Chappelle to feel the knuckle pad exhibit and object of the hearing. I felt the knuckle pad that was placed in a plastic zip wrap a good 15 seconds and realized that it felt soft. Maybe a little old and soft, but not hard as I expected. It felt like old gauze. One of the doctors told me that when it is moistened it would get harder. And that is why the Commission makes it illegal to wet hand wraps.”
Anyway many the witnesses including Mosley himself said that the pad was NOT hard. Some of the people said it was hard but not hard, and others said it was wet and getting hard. Which is it?
Whatever kind of hard these two knuckle pads were, it certainly wasnt hard enough to hurt Margarito’s knuckles.Posted August 21, 2013 2:12 am
no they were sensationalizing in order to promote their HBO Restro documentary to the mob mentalityPosted August 21, 2013 2:07 am
maracho…, Don’t be an idiot.. Lampley was just reporting the news on TV.. Kellerman was simply interviewing Miguel Cotto who showed the photographic evidence to the TV audience with Cheato looking on.
I’m not using them as “witnesses,” I’m just saying the evidence has been all over the TV, newspapers, Internet, boxing commissions, sanctioning boards … you name it.
VIVA COTTO!!! … You ended the career of the master of plaster.Posted August 21, 2013 1:40 am
Old yank,, in the article Schneider says: “The ABC draws its membership from state and tribal commissions in the US and Canada. It was spawned into existence by The Ali Act of the United States Congress. Those who have had the pleasure of contact with its leadership universally recognize the ABC as a collection of one of the most knowledgeable groups of competitive sports talent in North America and universally recognize the professional conduct of these individuals at the executive level as impeccable.”
If that aint a joke. The Ali Act was “supposed” to legislate against exploitation, rigged rankings, conflict of interest, enforcement, etc. If you truly believe that they are actually upholding the job that they are supposed to do then you my friend are in total denial.
Case in point: the ABC told Schnieder that the violation was serious yet the letter still clearly indicates that “he [Margarito] is now free to pursue licensure with any ABC member commission.” Heck even the first letter by the ABC says: “the Texas Combative Sports Program would not be in violation of the federal law should your office license Mr. Margarito after expiration of his current license issued by the CSAC.”Posted August 21, 2013 1:35 am
Tark recently ridicules Lampley’s and kellerman’s objectivity, bias, ignorance, and conflicts of interests but now succumbs to using them as his top witnesses? Thats kinda sad, especially in light of how these same two lied on television when they incessantly likened Margo’s soft lil inserts to that of Restros sledgehammersPosted August 21, 2013 1:32 am
You DO know what’s going on if you’re hitting people with plaster… Cheato is a damned liar.Posted August 21, 2013 1:04 am
Hamster…, I’m glad you feel Cheato should have been banned for life.Posted August 21, 2013 1:01 am
In any case the real reason I posted it was just so people could see the detailed account of what is actually being argued about – the hard inserts within the knuckle-pads, and the presence of chemicals found in plaster of paris.
The way it is discussed sometimes it is as though he was dipping his hands in a bucket of plaster in the dressing room.
I`m certainly not on Margarito’s side in any of it. I would have life banned him.Posted August 21, 2013 12:59 am
TARK, he isn`t a professional apologist working for Cheato’s team.
Read the ful larticle not just the bit I posted.
He states all those things in the article – including the lab tests.
It isn`t a question of if he was cheating then had to stop, it is who knew about the cheating.
He ends the article asking 5 well respected professional trainers if they could use illegal knucklepads without the fighter knowing and they all say it is possible.
I don`t know if Margarito knew either way, the article is a comment on whether a life ban should have been in place for Margarito as well as his trainer and the answer is that morally – if he knew then yes, if he didn`t then no.
Personally I think he did, but if you are going to swallow RJJ’s “Oh I didn`t know re steroids, then why not Margaritos “Oh I didn`t know what my trainer was doing”?
This is why I take issue with you sometimes – you can be presented with accounts, that are clearly researched from guys who were present when events took place, and you`ll refuse it and claim a special insight.
And what is that special insight based on – nothing you will actually substantiate.Posted August 21, 2013 12:56 am
Hamster.., Don’t believe stories from professional apologists working for the cheato team. Richardson doesn’t always object to the wrappings. That’s ridiculous. They definitely found powdered plaster, i.e. plaster of paris on Cheato’s wraps.. A lab did the analysis for the commission and the wraps were definitely dirty and contained plaster as reported by Jim Lampley.. I also saw photographic evidence that Cheato used loaded wraps in the 1st Cotto fight. There was definitely chalky plaster powder on his wrists and hands after the fight. Miguel Cotto himself, in a televised interview with Max Kellerman—with Cheato present—presented photographic evidence—on camera—that showed cracked plaster on Cheato’s wraps. A lot of people caught that telecast.
On top of all that—use common sense. Cheato never hurt anyone, or stopped anyone after his cheating was uncovered.. He got his ass kicked badly without plaster. Talk to Miguel Cotto himself. He will tell you Cheato was killing him in their 1st fight and it felt like he was getting hit with cement blocks.. Cotto will tell you that Cheato never hurt him at all in the 2nd fight. He was able to punish Cheato as he pleased, batter him … and forced the doctor to stop the fight.
VIVA COTTO!!! You ended the filthy career of Cheato…Posted August 21, 2013 12:40 am
This article is as unjust as Kalipornia’s kangaroo courts. I mean it repeatedly accuses Margarito of committing “the most loathsome violation in the sport “and then backs it all up with totally false allegations. For instance, it wasn’t Arum that got Valero medically relicensed but rather Golden Boy. Plus, several California doctors cleared him before the Texas one.
The article says that the CSAC did their due diligence in conducting a fair and impartial reapplication hearing. Ha ha ha.. The reapplication hearing basically told Margarito that they found him guilty for none other than his so called stubborn refusal to plead guilty. Now aint that about as Kangaroo as it gets?Posted August 21, 2013 12:30 am
Ah screw it I can`t post whole thing…..
Just get rid of the *’sPosted August 21, 2013 12:02 am
Aplogies for the length of this, but this article by Thomas Hauser cover the Margarito issue pretty well. Hauser is actually a proper boxing journalist and author so he researches things where two-bit bloggers do not……
By Thomas Hauser
A fighter’s fists are his weapons. Tampering with a fighter’s gloved fists is one of the worst offenses imaginable in boxing. It subverts the notion of a fair fight and puts the opposing fighter at exponentially greater risk of serious injury or death.
On January 24, 2009, Antonio Margarito fought Shane Mosley at the Staples Center in Los Angeles. In the dressing room prior to the fight, an illegal insert was found in each of Margarito’s knuckle pads. The inserts were removed and the fight proceeded as planned. Mosley knocked Margarito out in the ninth round.
Margarito’s license was subsequently revoked by the California State Athletic Commission. On August 18th, the CSAC will consider his application for reinstatement. That is expected to open the door for a proposed November 13th fight between Margarito and Manny Pacquiao.
There has been considerable debate during the past eighteen months regarding the Margarito handwrap issue. But the lines have been blurred by inaccurate reporting and the tendency of some observers to take sides based on their fondness or antipathy for Margarito’s promoter, Top Rank.
Let’s put the nonsense aside and view the Margarito handwrap issue in perspective.
The taping of a fighter’s fist begins with a roll of gauze being wrapped several times around his hand. Then a pad that has been previously fashioned from multiple layers of gauze is placed over the fighter’s knuckles. That’s followed by the application of more gauze and tape. California rules allow for the use of gauze and surgical adhesive tape when wrapping a fighter’s hands; nothing else. The application of water or any other liquid to the gauze or tape is prohibited.
Margarito’s hands were wrapped in his dressing room prior to the Mosley fight by his longtime trainer, Javier Capetillo. The task began under the supervision of inspector Che Guevara with Naazim Richardson (Mosley’s trainer) looking on.
Before a big fight, Richardson usually objects to the manner in which an opponent’s hands are being taped if for no other reason than to upset the opposing fighter. Here, he lodged numerous objections to the taping of Margarito’s right hand. Several more inspectors, including chief inspector Dean Lohuis, came into the dressing room. Richardson’s objections were overruled.
Then Capetillo began taping Margarito’s left hand, and Richardson asked if he could physically inspect the knuckle pad. Lohuis instructed Capetillo to pass the pad to Richardson. Naazim felt it and said that it seemed unusually hard. He then handed the pad to Lohuis, who agreed that it felt stiffer than is normally the case.
CSAC inspector David Pereda, who was in the room, later testified, “Naazim opened the gauze and pulled something out of it. He showed us what appeared to be an old gauze which had been used before and hardened from perhaps being sweaty and wet many times.”
Inspector Guevara testified, “It [the knuckle pad] was a clean new bandage. But within it, in the inner layers of it, was another bandage wrap. It was not as white as a new bandage wrap would be. It was used and it looked almost like it was sweat soaked and that’s what caused it to have the discoloration. It was harder in certain areas than it should be for pure gauze. It was definitely firm and hard. I believe there was a little bit of, it looked like old blood, on it.”
Mike Bray (an inspector who entered the dressing room during the dispute) recalled, “I observed what appeared to be a blood stain on the corner of the pad. I also noticed that it was moist and dirty-looking. The pad had the appearance that it had been used before. After looking at the pad closer, I could see a white substance smeared across the face of the pad and into the gauze. I touched the white substance, and it was hard to touch. It looked like a cast plaster or maybe a thicker type of white out that you would put on paper.”
Lohuis confiscated the knuckle pad and instructed Capetillo to make a new one. Capetillo did so and wrapped Margarito’s left hand. Richardson then asked the inspectors to examine the knuckle pad on Margarito’s already-wrapped right hand. Lohuis instructed Capetillo to remove the right handwrap and a similar insert was discovered inside the pad. Lohuis confiscated that pad as well and ordered Capetillo to prepare a new right-hand knuckle pad.
After the pads were confiscated, Mike Bray (at Richardson’s request) brought them to Mosley’s dressing room, where three members of Mosley’s team were allowed to touch them under the inspector’s supervision. An undetermined number of commission personnel also touched them.
Three days after the fight, the California State Athletic Commission temporarily suspended Margarito’s boxing license and Capetillo’s trainer’s license, and set February 10, 2009, for a hearing on the status of both men.
Capetillo testified at the hearing that he prepared Margarito’s knuckle pads in the dressing room at the Staples Center and put them on top of the contents in his training bag. Then, when it was time to wrap, he pulled the wrong knuckle pads out of his bag by mistake. He further testified that the confiscated pads had most likely been used by another boxer while hitting the heavy bag in the gym.
“They just throw their things in my bag,” Capetillo told the commission.
The following colloquy exemplifies his testimony:
Q: Is this the kind of pad you usually use in a championship fight?
Capetillo: No, sir.
Q: Have you ever used a pad like that in a professional boxing fight?
Capetillo: No, sir.
Q: So is it your testimony that, when you wrapped Mr. Margarito’s hands, you reached into your training bag and grabbed the wrong pad?
Capetillo: That is correct . . . I put my hand in my bag to pull out, they are like little pads. And by mistake, that I had those in my bag, I put them on and I wrapped them on without realizing that it had been a big mistake.
There was no direct evidence that Margarito knew about the inserts inside the knuckle pads; only inference. Antonio denied any knowledge of the inserts, and Capetillo testified, “I commit a big mistake and I acknowledge it. I don’t want that this young man have any problem because he is not at fault. He didn’t realize what I had put on.”
Prior to the hearing, the California State Athletic Commission sent one of the inserts to the Bureau of Forensic Services at the California Department of Justice for testing. The Commission rejected a request by Margarito’s attorney to allow his own expert to analyze the inserts. The lab results were not in before the hearing. On March 19, 2009, the Bureau of Forensic Services forwarded a report to the CSAC that read, “Calcium and sulpher, two elements found in plaster of Paris, were found on the submitted gauze pad using an X-ray fluorescence [XRF] spectrometer. The elements calcium, sulpher, and oxygen are found in plaster of Paris. These three elements are also found in substances other than plaster. Oxygen is not detectable by XRF.”
Margarito’s defense team contends that calcium and sulpher are also common elements in hand cream and salves.
The options available to the California State Athletic Commission ranged from taking no action against Margarito and Capetillo to a fine, suspension, or revocation of their respective licenses (the maximum penalty under law). In the event of revocation, either man would be free to reapply after one year with no guarantee of reinstatement. An irrevocable permanent ban was not an available option.
At the close of the February 10, 2009, hearing, the commission voted to revoke each man’s license. It made no finding that Margarito had knowledge of the inserts, but held him responsible for Capetillo’s actions. In so doing, it relied on Boxing Rule 390 of the California Code of Regulations, which states, “Any licensee who conducts himself or herself at any time or place in a manner which is deemed by the commission to reflect discredit to boxing may have his or her license revoked, or may be fined, suspended, or otherwise disciplined in such manner as the commission may direct.”
In making its determination, the CSAC imposed a doctrine of “strict liability” upon Margarito. That’s similar to the position that most commissions take when a fighter tests positive for an illegal performance enhancing drug. A fighter, the theory goes, is a professional athlete. He’s responsible for his body and his equipment. If someone who works for him puts something illegal into his body or on his hands, the fighter should be held ultimately responsible.
After Margarito’s license was revoked, he filed a lawsuit to overturn the commission’s decision. The matter is currently pending in the Second Appellate District of the California state court system.Posted August 20, 2013 11:59 pm
maracho — google “old yank abc’s of margarito’s texas license” and be prepared to be schooled. It’s a comprehensive article by the incomparable boxing writer “old Yank” Schneider and gives all the real information about Margarito’s cheating.Posted August 20, 2013 9:11 pm
If Margo’s knuckle pads were as you say, then he and his coach would have been convicted of criminal intent but they were not as you say so he got a year suspension. The fact is that all knuckle inserts are illegal as are the various types of wraps that many if not most most well known boxers have been caught using. Margo’s wraps were simply sensationalized by the same fat cats, bureaucrats, and kangaroo courts that have always corrupted boxing. Heck they even made some documentary money out of it.Posted August 20, 2013 7:46 pm
LOOK… Cheato was caught with plastered wraps, which when they harden are hard as a rock.. OK?? He was suspended for a year and his trainer’s license was revoked.Posted August 20, 2013 7:07 pm
No Margo’s blood stained knuckle pads were even used in prior fights and never did get hard like does plaster.Posted August 20, 2013 6:32 pm
maracho you’re ignorant.., The device Cheato used was wraps that were wet with powdered plaster, that dries harder and harder as the rounds roll on. It’s been used for generations so it’s a well known cheating strategy.Posted August 20, 2013 6:27 pm
Duran.., I hope you mortgaged your house and dumped it all on Canelo. That way you might keel over and die when the decision is read to a hushed crowd and Floyd wins his 9th World Championship.Posted August 20, 2013 6:23 pm
No plaster hardens but Margo’s knuckle pad never did.
Plaster is only an effective knuckle cheating device if it is rigidly braced against the palm of the hand or the wrist. Margo’s was simply taped to his knuckle. See court docs.
Courts are bullies too.Posted August 20, 2013 6:23 pm
Really, I’ve known people to use brass knuckles and it never shattered there knuckles or broke bonesPosted August 20, 2013 5:25 pm
maracho…, Plaster hardens and molds to your knuckles you dummy. Learn what the Hell you’re talking about…
Cheaters have been using plastered wraps for generations.Posted August 20, 2013 5:24 pm
You basically took my analysis that the score would probably be no more one-side than 116-112 for Floyd, and gave yourself more room by allowing for an extra round possibly won by Floyd.
Fine.. That’s still more contested than the Cotto fight.Posted August 20, 2013 5:22 pm
The test results showed that Margo’s knuckle pads were made of gauze that had a paste more consistent with medicine than plaster and not hard even months after the fight.
Plus its common sense that a hard knuckle pad totally defeats the purpose of a pad in that it would have shattered Margo’s knucklesPosted August 20, 2013 5:15 pm
Old Yank.., Cotto had only one legitimate fight with Cheato. I saw the photos of the plaster powder on Cheato’s hands and wrists following their first fight… Cotto showed photographic evidence, during his interview with Max Kellerman for the second fight, of a crack in the plaster on Cheato’s wraps…
Cotto whipped Cheato every round and stopped him when we KNOW Cheato did not have loaded gloves… We also know that Cheato didn’t stop ANY of the 4 fighters he fought when we KNOW he DIDN’T have loaded gloves.
Obviously it doesn’t follow that A beats B and B beats C so A should beat C… However it’s a clue to who the best all round fighter is. Other clues are: what styles of fighters are A and C??? … Are the vulnerabilities exposed by B going to be easier or harder for A to exploit??? … Are the weakness A showed in other fights easy or hard for C to exploit??? … Who has the most power? Who has the most skill? Who’s bigger and stronger? Who’s faster? Who’s tougher? Who’s smarter?
Sometimes – like in Cleverly-Kovalev – there are NO common opponents and NO losses by either fighter.. In that case you do a straight analysis of styles, skills, speed, power, experience, etc… So knowledge of the game is more of an asset in those cases.Posted August 20, 2013 5:06 pm
It is easy to be a defensive fighter against a fighter who is mainly a defensive fighter himself and mainly counter punches. Trout really didn’t have a clue how to press the fight. He was waiting for Canelo to do that but after the score cards where read after 4 Canelo knew he didn’t have to press the fight.Posted August 20, 2013 4:37 pm
Appreciate the nod! Also note that Taylor often looked like he had a high ring IQ. Then we got to see it tested when Taylor was not having his way. We learned that when pushed he was not bright enough to regulate his gas tank. It cost him his title against Pavlik and when on his way to a solid paper win over Froch, BANG — it cost him the win — out of gas!Posted August 20, 2013 4:36 pm
With all due respect, even Litzau has shown moments of speed combined with technical execution of combinations, defense and footwork — none of it added up to ring IQ. When Jason Litzau could have his way he looked brilliant. When his game plan was tested, he had no plan B (i.e. lacking the ring IQ to clench when necessary). We have yet to find out if Canelo can execute a Plan B if Plan A is not working — and that is how we discover if a questionable ring IQ has been well hidden by always having his way. Technical execution is exactly that – ring IQ is something different. Ring IQ is about an ability to adjust; about strategic clenching; about setting traps; about tying together clean punching with effective aggression, defense and ring generalship when PLAN “A” WENT OUT THE WINDOW!Posted August 20, 2013 4:22 pm
Oh and by the way…I will start putting out my own analysis “Head to Head” articles like I used to…and this time, I will take the prediction portion of the article a bit more seriously…since many seem to merely focus on that…even though I clearly point out scenarios in which both competing fighter could prevail.Posted August 20, 2013 4:08 pm
I couldn’t agree more, Old Yank…very solid predictionPosted August 20, 2013 4:05 pm
My bet is that they split the opening 6 rounds and then Canelo struggles to win at most one of the closing 6. It will end 8 rounds to 4 or 9 rounds to 3 with no knockdowns — 116-112 or 117-111.Posted August 20, 2013 4:03 pm
Canelo’s ring IQ has been on display in each and every one of his bouts over the past year and a half.
His combinations are very creative and extremely difficult to anticipate…he also showed against Trout that he is a much more proficient defensive fighter than most realized.
Very smart fighter, but I’m not sure if he can do enough to win this fight. Unless he’s been working on fighting more aggressively in camp, he won’t be effective in this bout. And judging by who he’s currently sparring with I doubt that he has.Posted August 20, 2013 3:59 pm
Canelo didn’t have to cut off the ring against Lopez…in bouts where he has moved forward, it hasn’t been against fleet footed fighters who are used to using the entire ring.
It’s always been against guys like Hatton, Rhodes, and Lopez.
As for Canelo dominating the center of the ring and making Floyd come to him…good luck with that. When have we ever seen anyone force Floyd to fight their fight?
Floyd will jump in and out while landing single potshots in the outset of the fight and rack up the first two or three rounds basically on style points and clean effective punching…this will force Canelo out of the pocket and move forward…playing right into Floyd’s hands.Posted August 20, 2013 3:54 pm
TARK — CORRECTED: Why do you persist in the faulty logic that if A beats B and B beats C that it means that A will beat C. In no particular order: Mosley was able to man-handle Margarito. Margarito gave Cotto a beat down. Therefore Mosley should have really given Cotto a beat down squared. It simply does not work that way.Posted August 20, 2013 3:40 pm
TARK — Why do you persist in ignoring the fact that A/B followed by B/C means that A will beat C. In no particular order: Mosley was able to man-handle Margarito. Margarito gave Cotto a beat down. Therefore Mosley should have really given Cotto a beat down squared. It simply does not work that way.Posted August 20, 2013 3:38 pm
Joseph Herron — No disagreement from me. I will however point out that when a singular plan to impose will and skill has been 100% successful, ring IQ has yet to be fully tested. What happens to Canelo’s game when the 100% plan is not working becomes an IQ test we’ve yet to see if he can score well on.Posted August 20, 2013 3:33 pm
Canelo cut the ring effectively against Josesito Lopez… He was the much bigger man and just thumped Lopez with blazing fast combinations … He bullied the crap out of him.
Because Canelo is bigger and stronger than Floyd his punches carry more power.. Therefore he can dominate the center of ring with less effort.. He can relax more and doesn’t have to throw as hard.. Floyd rarely throws when he doesn’t have a target but that was true of Trout as well.. Trout found himself throwing when nothing was there to hit … and Canelo countered very effectively.
Floyd never fought anyone as good as Trout. The closest was Cotto, who tagged Floyd up pretty good.Posted August 20, 2013 3:29 pm
Rigondeaux… Ward… Floyd… and Haye are also on that list… Alvarado, Vasquez, and Huck aren’t — you color conscious jackass.Posted August 20, 2013 3:17 pm
Canelo has an unusually high ring IQ for a fighter of his age, and he is by far the physically strongest opponent mayweather has ever faced.
But, styles make fights.
One of the reasons why Canelo fought most of the Trout fight defensively, looking to counter and set traps, is because he knew Trout has never been an effective aggressor.
But neither is Canelo. I don’t know why everyone seems to think that he’s going to be aggressive in this fight. If he’s facing an opponent who lets his hands go, like Mosley and Lopez, then we see a much busier fighter.
But against Mayweather, he’s going to have a lot of problems. Like DLH, Canelo is not effective when he has to cut off the ring and chase someone. He is a pocket banger like DLH and is always looking to counter with explosive combinations.
Unless he’s been working on cutting off the ring and fighting more aggressively in camp, I don’t see him being effective if he can’t make Floyd take the lead.
But even if Canelo does, he’s going to have a lot of trouble countering Floyd because the P4P king doesn’t give his opponents a large enough sample to time and counter.
He throws one shot at a time by design…and with Floyd’s speed and reflexes, he will consistently be one step behind.
Cotto is a much better at cutting off the ring than Canelo…one of the reasons for Cotto’s mild success against FloydPosted August 20, 2013 3:11 pm
TARK — So now you are saying that if Canelo uses his size and strength wisely AND is faster, moves better, cuts off the ring, lands more jabs, gets hit less and hits Mayweather more, then he’s got a chance of winning? Well, DUH!!! C’mon old friend — I get it! Canelo is a genuinely fine young fighter with a hand full of bouts against great challenges where he’s looked good imposing his will, skill and style on these guys. Because of that he approached Mayweather and offered a catch weight in order to reach for the money ring. It’s all good and we should be happy that this bout, along with Garcia/Matthysse, gives us fans a rare opportunity to watch the best fighting the best. To be sure, there is fine, old school wisdom in picking the bigger man when a good big man climbs in the ring with a good small man. But every once in a while we see wisdom turned on its head — Pacquiao has done so; Armstrong did so often; and Mayweather has stretched his size more than once. It’s going to be a hell of a bout and I too see it at around the odds you do. If things get out of hand to the point where Canelo becomes a compelling live dog, I’d end up placing a few green presidents on him just for the hell of it. But I’ve just never seen Canelo adjust the way I think he will need to against Mayweather and although there is always a first for nearly everything, it is a hell of a bout to try to discover a game plan that you’ve never fought or discover adjustments you’ve never made before.Posted August 20, 2013 2:32 pm
And Unlike any other MW,
This fight is actually less predictable than the Garcia # mathysse….Posted August 20, 2013 2:11 pm
Wait a min…..
Sivens had put Andre Dirrel on a Lance Amstrong bike for 12 rds, more than Froch did.
Dont satrt calling me hater… I was the FIRST here on esb to back GGG, 2 yrs ago, before the herd of socially-programmed-sheep-like came on board…
Given that GGG gets hit, and only breaks down fighters who have not been in the category of elite fighters; this fighter can end up in Stivens favour when he connect.
I would advise you to look at Stivens 2013 fights, particularly against Finley (prove he can take a shot, box and go distance); and against Ayala (who was # 6 top MW)
( Reflechir est un art tres mal partage…)Posted August 20, 2013 1:55 pm
Old Yank.., You don’t follow my analysis very closely — and you put your own erroneous spin on it.
Obviously Canelo’s size and strength are going to help him vs Floyd, just like DLH’s size helped him a little against Floyd… Too little… Because that’s all he relied on to beat Floyd.
Oscar was too slow… His head was immobile… His jab wasn’t sharp enough… His right uppercut was nowhere… He wasn’t fast enough to cut the ring off… and he mainly got popped in the face every time Floyd threw anything because he was too fat and sluggish, and Floyd whipped his ass running away… That won’t happen with Canelo.
Canelo is very aware of Oscar’s failures… Oscar talked to Canelo a lot and is picking Canelo to win… but says Canelo must be fast… must have the jab tuned up to perfection… must have his defensive skills razor sharp… and his counters blisteringly responsive — like they were vs Trout only more so … He’s got to be tuned to perfection on the night.
Canelo needs to be the sleekest and sharpest he’s ever been because Floyd KNOWS damned well this is his toughest fight ever. Cotto was rough and tough, and Floyd is saying Cotto’s a better fighter than Canelo … but Floyd doesn’t really believe that. Canelo is bigger, faster, stronger, and more skilled … and how exactly, did each man fair against Austin Trout??? Floyd isn’t blind.. He saw those fights.. Floyd is preparing like never before regardless of what he says.. He’s trying to sound complacent … and he isn’t.Posted August 20, 2013 1:53 pm
Tumbo.., I was never super high on Williams or Chambers. I knew Williams was good enough to beat Margacheato. I always had Floyd beating Paul if they ever met. Floyd would have jabbed and right handed him to death.
I knew Chambers was good enough to beat Dimitrenko. I always had Wladimir beating him, and Haye beating him anytime as well … and I predicted bad things for him when he hooked up with Victor Conte.
BTW.., I’m favoring Floyd in this fight, 8:5 … I just figure it’ll be a very close, tough fight. Most think Floyd will run away with it and I’ve seen odds up to 3:1 … Canelo is a better boxer than most people think. He actually outboxed Trout, who is a tall, rangy, slick, southpaw who’s not easy to outbox.Posted August 20, 2013 1:23 pm
TARK — So let me see if I’ve got this straight: The BIGGER and STRONGER man is NOT going to use his size and strength advantage to his advantage? You’ve got to be smoking dope to get that foolish. OF FRIGGIN’ COURSE Canelo is going to attempt to use his size and strength advantage. Every fighter that even approaches this level of the sport has a game plan going in. Some remain on plan because they don’t have any other way to fight (see Margarito, Pavlik, Williams, GGG, Rigondeaux, and many, many others). In spite of their skill set they are/were not great men at adjusting to what ends up in front of them. They’ve all had/have their luck/skill in their game plan be enough. I’ve not seen Canelo fight much differently from opponent to opponent — he’s been blessed with sufficient skills that Plan A (his game plan) has always been enough. He’s always been able to impose his will and plan on an opponent. When one-dimensional PLANS (not to be confused with one-dimensional fighters), are forced into adjusting for the first time, some rise to the challenge with great skill in adjusting (Hagler being forced to adjust his game plan following the BS decision v Antuofermo) and others just can’t adjust enough to stave off an embarrassment (Pavlik v Hopkins). WE DON’T KNOW if Canelo can or will adjust. We KNOW Mayweather can adjust. I find it hard to see a vision where Mayweather fails to score enough points to win.Posted August 20, 2013 1:20 pm
I’D BE VERY SURPRISED IF STEVENS GIVE GG A GOOD FIGHT. HES ONLY ABOUT 5’6 & THAT WILL WORK AGAINST HIM.Posted August 20, 2013 12:40 pm
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the Lone Ranger didn’t know Correctamundo had disguised himself as a doorknob, and he immediately shot his knob off.Posted August 20, 2013 12:19 pm
“Boxtra became SO GREAT that posters began to put Boxtra’s name on their posts like little kids put Jordan, Kobe, and Lebron’s name on their BACKS. ”
No. Boxtra became so annoying and childish that posters began to put Boxtra’s name on their toilet seats. Now “Correctamundo” has earned that position.Posted August 20, 2013 12:15 pm
Stevens has had a nice career resurgence. That big KO in the 1st round helped create some buzz. But GGG will demolish him and he knows it. That’s why he fussed over the payday, it’s a cash-out.Posted August 20, 2013 12:13 pm
“I SAID that IF Rigo followed my advice and abandoned that NON sense he was barking before the Fight he would WIN and I was CORRECT.”
Yes you did Assadamus. You’ve also never admitted you were wrong by picking Donaire to beat Rigo. Instead, You go on about the “advice” you gave Rigo. But you were WRONG. AGAIN. Flap you wings all you want. You’re still a little chicken.Posted August 20, 2013 12:10 pm
correction: IMO, outBoxing Mayweather is not a realistic option.Posted August 20, 2013 11:22 am
my primary concern about Canelo’s chances v. Mayweather is Tark’s almost naïve faith in his fighting ability. reminds of his previous Manny*-worship or certainty about the pending greatness of Williams and Chambers. ALL of whom I dismissed as limited, vulnerable, and/or overrated at the peak of their hype. the boxing fight-plan that Tark just prescribed for Canelo is a Huuuuge Red Flag. IMO, outBoxing Canelo is not a realistic option. it’s Plan C and I don’t believe that Canelo is preparing anything more than Plans A and B. he’ll test Mayweather’s resistance early but must ultimately settle into a busy, effective, and unrelenting fight-plan that might smother Mayweather’s best and provide Canelo with an edge on the scorecard. otherwise, the “speedy, mobile, razor sharp jab, left hook, straight right, masterful uppercuts, blazingly fast combinations, and flawless defense” sounds like wishful thinking not based on Mayweather’s or Canelo’s proven mastery of the fight-game.Posted August 20, 2013 11:21 am
Oh, and as for all the bull crap about poor Marquez when Mayweather did not make weight…what about poor Matthew Hatton when Alvarez did not make weight? I recall something about throwing stones while living in a glass house as appropriate here.Posted August 20, 2013 9:39 am
junior — Bulls eye!Posted August 20, 2013 9:36 am
Alvarez/Hatton was contracted at 150 and Canelo could not make weight. Canelo had been inching up in his walk-around weight and inching up on his fight-night weight. Many were predicting Alvarez might have weight issues making 150 — that was March of 2011. We will see Mayweather/Alvarez some 2 1/2 years later with Canelo (still growing, still inching up in his walk-around weight; and still inching up in his fight-night weight) needing to make 152! Please: Stop selling that weight is not or will not be an issue here — no rational fan is buying it!Posted August 20, 2013 8:55 am
TARK — I fully agree that Canelo and his team are approaching the weight issue with every defense against it becoming one. But if I learn of a star corner-back scheduled to take the field on Sunday under the assumption that everything humanly possible to heal his injury from last week was done, there are no claims of him being 100% that I’m ready to take the bait on. Canelo may or may not overcome the issue and the corner-back may or may not play at 100%. My point is that Vivek made light of 3 ounces and I thought it a tad foolish to paint the weight picture with such a light brush. It was brushed off without any serious thought of what the hell is really going on here. Again, a fighter does not hire a nutrition coach for the first time in his career and get to have writers suggest that the fighter, fans and observers should not see weight as an issue. One cannot watch Canelo grow out of 140, out of 154 and unofficially weigh in at a career high of 172 in his last fight-night weigh-in and get away with giving weight short shrift. This bout is at 152; seeing Canelo use a nutrition coach for the first time in his career; Canelo has been easily observed as getting bigger and bigger; and more…weight issues here are more than 3 ounces!Posted August 20, 2013 8:25 am
CORRECTAMUNDO — PLEASE GET A GRIP! If I look throughout boxing history I see a relatively recent change called weighing in the day before the bout rather than a few hours before the bout. In addition, of the thousands of bouts that take place now in a give year, the number of unofficial weigh-ins is a miniscule percentage. In addition, of the thousands of bouts that take place every year we have very little information about what the walk-around weight of the fighter was before he went into training. What we have is known as anecdotal information. So the fact is that statistically speaking we have insufficient data to arrive at any conclusion that holds much statistical significance. And that my misinformed friend is why I referred to your post as interesting but a tad misleading.Posted August 20, 2013 8:15 am
“It’s not that they didn’t “qualify,” it’s that you DIDN’T KNOW”-NOPE. ITs that they didn’t qualify. Therefore they don’t get paid MUCH attention TO. SO what I DID or DIDN’T know doesn’t apply…..What I DO KNOW is that you picked Cleverly over Kovalev and I almost laughed my HEART out when I came across it. That had to be one of the WORST picks I’ve ever SEEN. NO man with two GOOD eyeballs should have picked Cleverly IF they actually watched tape on HIM vs. tape on Kovalev…..as SOON as I watched tape on both I proclaimed right THEN and THERE that Kovalev would WIN by Welshman WILTING stoppage and I was CORRECT….You saw my analysis on it where I even stated WHY Kovalev would WIN and you still went the other way….That’s called being a DOOFUS.Posted August 20, 2013 6:47 am
“If you are such an expert at analyzing fighters’ skill levels why didn’t you make a pick in the Geale/Barker fight? Doesn’t matter if they “qualified” or not.”-YES it DOES matter IF they qualified or not. I watched Barker get stopped by Martinez and he didn’t impress me a lot. He’s not BAD but he isn’t ELITE….and neither is Geale. Therefore I don’t pay MUCH attention to them and I pass on using my gifts on Fights that don’t catch my interest. Like I SAID let them face Quillin, Martinez, or GGG and I’ll make a pick on their Fight.Posted August 20, 2013 6:39 am
“Like any of your lists mean anything, Putzamundo.”-Yup. It meant that Cleverly was going to take the LOSS. Kovalev is #6 on my list and Cleverly is #0 and you KNEW that. SO how in the heck could you be dumb enough to take Cleverly????? Ignoring my CORRECTNESS does not erase it.Posted August 20, 2013 6:32 am
“You picked Donaire to beat Rigondeaux so that means that you BACKED Donaire”-Nope. Go get you some reading SKILLS. I said that IF Rigo DID what I SAID to DO he would WIN….and OBVIOUSLY I back my own advice.Posted August 20, 2013 6:29 am
“you didn’t tell them anything. You told us. They’ve never talked to you in your life. Or listened to you. You don’t even know them. Clownamundo.”-Welcome to the 21st Century Hissydalgo. HERE no one needs to KNOW you. Everyone in the World who has a connection to what’s called the internet can read what you type HERE. Rigo followed my advice to the TEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!…..and Donaire DID not. I SAID that IF Rigo followed my advice and abandoned that NON sense he was barking before the Fight he would WIN and I was CORRECT. GOOD thing that ESB has it archived where the World can SEE that that was my last words before the Fight and THAT is what counts.Posted August 20, 2013 6:23 am
Canelo is a veteran of cutting weight for the weigh-in… But this is a special fight that could change his life and have a big impact on Boxing History… So if he leaves—or his team leaves—a stone unturned, it’s just too bad.
It’s one of those fights where you don’t forget the extra mouthpiece… in case you need it for God knows what reason.Posted August 20, 2013 2:02 am
Old Yank.., What I believe is the weight is not going to be a major issue that could cause Alvarez to lose the fight because the Canelo team is going to have it handled … I could be wrong. They could be stupid, but I don’t think so.
If 3 couples pile into a car to go out partying, and everybody gets drunk but the designated driver, and she drinks soda pop all night, and drives everyone back safely with no problem … then getting arrested for drunk driving was not an issue.Posted August 20, 2013 1:52 am
“My ability to analyze Fighters SKILL levels is GREATER than yours…and that’s why you took a guy on the wrong end of a SPANKING.”
If you are such an expert at analyzing fighters’ skill levels why didn’t you make a pick in the Geale/Barker fight? Doesn’t matter if they “qualified” or not. If you have such great analytical ability, you should have easily been able to predict who would win that fight, and you wouldn’t have hesitated to. But the FACT is that you had no idea. It’s not that they didn’t “qualify,” it’s that you DIDN’T KNOW. So rather than embarrass yourself you chose to hide behind your “qualification” wall. More ridiculous excuses by ridiculous you.Posted August 20, 2013 1:35 am
“Hissydalgo I already answered you on another thread”
Like any of your lists mean anything, Putzamundo.Posted August 20, 2013 1:30 am
“Anytime I give both Fighters advice and only one uses it I back the guy who took my advice”
You picked Donaire to beat Rigondeaux so that means that you BACKED Donaire.Posted August 20, 2013 1:28 am
“I told Donaire…I told Rigo…” But you picked Donaire to win you smelly fart! And you didn’t tell them anything. You told us. They’ve never talked to you in your life. Or listened to you. You don’t even know them. Clownamundo.Posted August 20, 2013 1:17 am
“I acknowledge the FACT that I gave both Fighters advice on what to DO to WIN but only one guy USED it.”
LMAO @ “advice.” Clownamundo.Posted August 20, 2013 1:15 am
If Canelo’s getting a big purse and cut of the revenues, I wouldn’t mind it at all if he busted weight and came in heavy. You know, give Floyd a taste of his own medicine. Heck, Floyd busted weight for a $600K penalty. I’ve read that penalty for not making weight in this fight is $1mil. It would be nice if Canelo could literally afford to not make weight. I’d really like to see how Floyd reacts when an opponent screws him as he screwed Marquez.Posted August 20, 2013 1:13 am
“Floyd’s camp is saying that they won’t step in the ring unless Canelo makes the agreed weight, but everyone knows that they would never cancel that fight…too much money riding on this one.”
Very likely, Joseph. Floyd is more concerned about money than anything else. Do you happen to know what the agreed-upon purse and revenue split is?Posted August 20, 2013 1:11 am
Floyd’s camp is saying that they won’t step in the ring unless Canelo makes the agreed weight, but everyone knows that they would never cancel that fight…too much money riding on this one.Posted August 20, 2013 12:54 am
Squared-Circle Real Talk (a.k.a. The Lion King of Beat Street)
Correct me if I’m wrong, but the fight IS ON as long as Canelo makes 154lbs, right? I realize he would get fined a few hundred thousand dollars for being a couple pounds overweight, but I don’t that’s his #1 concern here. What do you think???Posted August 20, 2013 12:35 am
I heard it through a reliable source that Canelo is already down to 159 lbs.
?????Posted August 19, 2013 11:57 pm
Old Yank-Hatton and Chavez Jr. are exeptions to the rule. But you need to ask yourself. DO you want tonadd your name to the list with Chavez Jr. and Hatton on it or DO you want to be added to the list with Mayweather Jr., SRR, Harry Greb, Wladimir and Vitali Klitschko, Bernard Hopkins, Manny Pacquiao, Gene Tunney. ..and SO on.Posted August 19, 2013 11:40 pm
Uglyosaurus- I acknowledge the FACT that I gave both Fighters advice on what to DO to WIN but only one guy USED it. Anytime I give both Fighters advice and only one uses it I back the guy who took my advice…I told Rigo to Fight very Defensively and keep his combinations to a minimum to limit Donaire’s opportunities to counter punch….I told Donaire to lay off on the looping shots and focus on straight shots. …when yoi face a guy of Rigo’s Defensive caliber you have to shoot a lot more straight shots than looping ones because those are hardly ever going to land. Rigo or someone on his team reads ESB and Donaire doesn’t. He shouldn’t have needed to though….Robert Garcia should have pointed out the same things that I DID and worked on it in camp. But the guy lets Donaire train HIMSELF and then just collects the paycheck…..at least thats what it looks like on the outside looking IN…IF not then Garcia is even POORER than I thought.Posted August 19, 2013 11:31 pm
Old Yank-Whats misleading about it???? IF you look throughout Boxing History you will find that most of the BEST Fighters stay around their Fight night weight without having to dehydrate and the ballon back UP to get there….obviously the Old school Fighters had same day weigh ins SO they had little opportunity to DO that. But it doesn’t change the FACT. It only ADDS to it.Posted August 19, 2013 11:14 pm
Correctamundo/Boxtradamus, you predicted that Donaire would beat Rigondeaux and you REPEATEDLY said ‘if they ever fight, Donaire will spank Rigondeaux’. Why do you continue to ignore the FACT that you made the wrong prediction in that fight?Posted August 19, 2013 11:13 pm
Weight loss or not, canelo should of hired a few nutritionists years ago but then you have to educate yourself to in order to weed out the quacks. I’d be buying organic grains, seeds, roots, sweet potatoes, kale, apples, watermelon, etc.. And while I was sprinting the California hills I’d be hunting deer, fowl and fish. Thats also what Matthysse does.Posted August 19, 2013 11:00 pm
Hissydalgo I already answered you on another thread. I SAID that Barker and Geale aren’t on my radar because they’re not GOOD enough. Beat Quillin, GGG, or Martinez and they’ll be on my radar….OH I forgot. Barker already TRIED that…Kovalev is on my personal P4P list and thats why I made a call on his Fight. He remains at #6 on my list despite you saying that Mares should be ahead of him based on SKILLS. My ability to analyze Fighters SKILL levels is GREATER than yours…and that’s why you took a guy on the wrong end of a SPANKING.Posted August 19, 2013 10:30 pm
TARK — When a designated driver is appointed to a group of party animals one assumes some alcohol will be consumed. When a fighter hires a nutrition coach for the first time in his career one assumes someone is concerned about weight. Potato-potato, tomato-tomato and concern-issue; no one’s going to call the whole thing off, but I assure you that changing the language from “weight issue” to “weight concern” is not an indication that weight is not an issue!Posted August 19, 2013 9:54 pm
CORRECTAMUNDO — Your comments about walk-around weight being close to fight night weight is interesting but a tad misleading. Hatton used to rehydrate big between weigh-in and fight night. He also was a human yo-yo when it came to walk-around weight vs weigh-in weight. Canelo appears to be a bit more disciplined about his walk-around weight but his yo-yo string seems to be creeping up a bit as his celebrity soars and his sense of invincibility gets into his head. Joan Guzman is another great example of a big head leading to a sense that he could make weight by wishing his way there. How many scale issues did that fool have (at least 4 that I can remember). Guzman allowed his walk-around weight to creep up and creep up until his ego was too heavy to allow him an ability to make weight. Here is the truth: Canelo is still a growing young man. He’s moved from 140 to 147 to 154 — his last unofficial weight (Trout/Alvarez) was 172 — the heaviest unofficial weight of his career. When weight classes move up and then unofficial weight within the class moves up, it is not about how close walk-around weight is to fight night weight. It’s about fighting the scale and Mayweather shaved a precious 2 pounds off a scale that Canelo’s history of increasing weight can ill afford to give up.Posted August 19, 2013 9:49 pm
@Hidalgo – that could actually be quite an intriguing fight.
They could call it “Gobby at the Garden”.
I`d keep two scorecards, one for the boxing and one for the smacktalk.
I`d take Judah to win the fight and Malignaggi the talk.Posted August 19, 2013 9:30 pm
How about Judah vs. Malignaggi?Posted August 19, 2013 8:43 pm
“Hiring someone to get you down in weight shows that you’re a LAZY slob in between Fights OR you simply need to move UP in weight.”
No it doesn’t. To date, this is the most important fight of Canelo’s career. Hiring a nutritionist just means that Canelo wants to make sure he performs at his very best. As for the lazy slob comment, well, we all know you’re way off base on that.Posted August 19, 2013 8:42 pm
Your mama’s mouth as well Ernie. She reeks of filth. I accidentally came within a half mile of your house when she was over. peeeyyoooouuuPosted August 19, 2013 8:36 pm
“GOOD guess though. Boxtradamus SAID he retired because he had become bored with his own GREATNESS much like Jordan DID at the end of the 1993 season. ”
Assamundo, you should marry Mayweather. Then you two could talk to each other in third person all the time. Meanwhile, stop the charade. You are one in the same as the original Boxtradamus. He “retired” so you could give yourself a new nick.
BTW, you continue to ignore me. I asked you why you didn’t make a pick in the Geale/Barker fight? What’s you answer? I made two predictions and got one of them right. You made one prediction because you’re really not a boxing prophet–just a good guesser. You didn’t make a prediction on the Geale/Barker fight because you don’t really follow boxing. You just bark at it like a coyote does at the moon: a lot of noise. no purpose.Posted August 19, 2013 8:34 pm
It’s Me, Ernie
The Tard scribbled:”I would be a mouthy and nasty promotion.”
You said it brother…Posted August 19, 2013 8:08 pm
Stevens would get knocked out way before round 9, round 1 or 2, round 3 if he is lucky.Posted August 19, 2013 7:53 pm
Stevens has no business fighting GGG. He doesn’t have the resume, experience or all around skills to defeat a high quality fighter like GGG. He hasn’t proved a thing. GGG is one of the most well rounded fighters in boxing. Stevens is in for a big surprise if he thinks that left hook is going to beat GGG. He better be prepared for a lot of punishment. GGG is a truly solid fighter, and he will expose and knockout Stevens before round 9. Take it to the bank. This is guaranteed.Posted August 19, 2013 7:45 pm
Who is Stevens, he won’t get a big enough payday v Triple G, Stevens has not earnt any money in Boxing, he is a nobody, he should be grateful to earn some money 20 times what he has earnt and get knock out against Triple G.Posted August 19, 2013 7:34 pm
Broner would beat Judah.., I would be a mouthy and nasty promotion.Posted August 19, 2013 6:47 pm
Broner would lose, he would not fight Judah.Posted August 19, 2013 6:18 pm
Zab judah v Adrien Broner, one of them loses, make the fight.Posted August 19, 2013 6:17 pm
Hopefully Canelo was toying with Trout as a ploy to to lure Floyd inPosted August 19, 2013 6:15 pm
Using a lot of weight is usually an issue even when you got a lot of baby fat but canelo is feeding off of the media concern because its a reminder that Floyd was afraid to fight him unless he sacrificed extra pounds.Posted August 19, 2013 6:13 pm
Hiring someone to get you down in weight shows that you’re a LAZY slob in between Fights OR you simply need to move UP in weight. Stop doubting your SKILLS and move UP IF its SO much of a task to make weight.Posted August 19, 2013 5:32 pm
Zab vs. Broner is a MISMATCH. Zab fought his BEST Fight in YEARS and STILL ended UP being LESSER than Danny Garcia. Zab should rematch Khan IF anything…..or take on Malignaggi in NY. Zab is NON Championship material.Posted August 19, 2013 5:29 pm
Boxers should really hire dieticians to work with them rather than nutritionists.
Dieticians have genuine qualifications, are evaluated – it`s illegal to call yourself a dietician without them.
ANyone can call themselves a nutritionist right now and start giving food advice – often total quack rubbish.
In any case that is an aside, but the effect of good nutritional advice is really going to be modulated by how poorly the person was eating initially.
There is only so much that fat and water weight that you can lose, and the actions that you would take to specifically maximise fatloss, are not always conducive to optimum preparation for fighting.
There`s a balance there, and it doesn`t always have to be that the weightloss killed you so much as that it distracted you.Posted August 19, 2013 5:28 pm
Old Yank-Most of these guys like to play Circle jerk because they don’t know Boxing SO I choose to entertain them with that from time to time. But I’d MUCH rather talk Boxing. That’s the MAIN reason I come to the site….As for the weight issue I already pointed out that the BEST Fighters in the World usually stay around their Fight night weight Year ROUND. IF Canelo DID that then he wouldn’t need to LOSE much weight to make 152. SO IF he can’t make it its his OWN fault for trying to CHEAT the system. He should be Fighting at 168 or 175 where he doesn’t have to concentrate on losing weight. HE can just concentrate on his Boxing SKILLS like Floyd DOES. Floyd doesn’t have to concentrate on making 152 because he’s already MADE it 30 days AHEAD of time. SO his last few weeks of training focused on mostly SKILLS and ENDURANCE….while Canelo has to step on the scale everyday to see where he’s at and what he needs to DO next to LOSE more weight…..And fit his SKILLS training in there TOO.Posted August 19, 2013 5:26 pm
I would like to see Zab/Broner. I think GGG KOs Stevens, but it will be fun to watch.Posted August 19, 2013 5:25 pm
PEEJ.., You’re feeling that Trout beat Canelo is completely irrelevant… Three judges… Three American commentators… And three American newspaper reporters at ringside all had the fight for Canelo except for one score a draw… That tells me most people agree that Canelo won it.Posted August 19, 2013 4:40 pm
Do you guys talk boxing any more or are you in some dimly lit basement playing a teen game of circle jerk?Posted August 19, 2013 4:35 pm
“He changed his neick to Correctamundo when someone starting stealing his Boxtradamus nick. “-Nope. GOOD guess though. Boxtradamus SAID he retired because he had become bored with his own GREATNESS much like Jordan DID at the end of the 1993 season. He went out with a BANG as he gave Rigo the perfect advice to defeat Donaire and Rigo was smart enough to abandon his own plan for Boxtra’s…Boxtra became SO GREAT that posters began to put Boxtra’s name on their posts like little kids put Jordan, Kobe, and Lebron’s name on their BACKS. Thats called reaching the PINNACLE. When you’re SONGREAT that people no longer want to be themselves. They want to BE YOU…… I Congratulate Boxtradamus on that.Posted August 19, 2013 4:14 pm
CORRECTION. ..How DID Halfbrainedalgo get it WRONG???Posted August 19, 2013 4:04 pm
MOMMY it only takes quarter of a brain to pick Kovalev over Cleverly SO How DID Halfbrainedalgo get it WRING???….”HE only has an EIGHTH of a brain sweetie…now don’t you be teasing him”..OH OK sure.Posted August 19, 2013 4:02 pm
“LOOK! MOMMY, MOMMY! LOOK! I CAN EAT WITH A FORK! LOOK!”-Nope. I SAID LOOK!!! MOMMY LOOK!!! Someone got a Fight wrong that was EASIER to get Right than eating with a FORK!!! LOOK!!! MOMMY even YOU can pick Fights BETTER than THAT!!!! HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!Posted August 19, 2013 3:58 pm
“Correctomungo you’ll never be as good as Boxtradamus give it up bro”-I already KNOW that. Boxtradamus predicted the GREATEST KO in Fistic History as TARK would say. WHO can top THAT???
All I can DO is try to come CLOSE and IF I’m successful with that I’ll have blown away the competition.Posted August 19, 2013 3:54 pm
It’s Me, Ernie
SC wrote: “Do you have a crystal ball?”
No, no he doesn’t, just a shriveled up pair of raisins.
That is the main reason most posters don’t care for the douche-nozzle, he makes statements way before a fight then renigs faster than Don King when the fighter’s purses are due…Posted August 19, 2013 3:48 pm
Canelo should give up some of his purse , and come into the fight with a weight advantage much like Floyd did when he fought Marquez.Posted August 19, 2013 3:43 pm
“WOW you actually got one right FOR ONCE”-Nope. You mean the ONE pick that I made over the weekend I got it RIGHT.Posted August 19, 2013 3:43 pm
PEEJ — Well said!Posted August 19, 2013 3:34 pm
Tark you says: “The weight is not going to be an issue for Canelo Alvarez. ”
How the hell can you tell my friend!
This is not witchcraft for God sake! Do you have a crystal ball?
( Parfois, il apparait comme un illumine, ce Tark)Posted August 19, 2013 3:26 pm
The Real Vivek Wallace
I see the funny guys are on the loose again LOL. I could say many things but the best thing I’d like to say is thanks to each of you for reading. EVERY WEEK. Much love, fellas.Posted August 19, 2013 3:24 pm
Trout is not on Floyds level as a boxer and Canelo didn’t run through Trout. I thought he lost by a round. There are many folks who feel the same way. I also feel like the fight could of gove either way, it was that close of a fight. But in no way is Trout in the same league as far as boxing IQ with Floyd.Posted August 19, 2013 3:13 pm
Ah the Amish and Quakers…now there’s a bunch who know how to tell others how to live.Posted August 19, 2013 3:09 pm
TARK — We don’t know if the weight is going to be an issue for Canelo. A fighter does not pre-spend his purse on a nutrition coach for the first time in his career if making weight is not an issue. Perhaps he believes that with a nutrition coach it will not be one — but the fact that he hired a nutrition coach is a signal that weight might be an issue. Next we have a growing boy. Canelo hung at 140 for a relatively brief time before outgrowing the weight. He hung at 147 for less than 4 years before outgrowing the weight. He’s now been hanging at 154 (and entering the ring at 172 for his last bout), for over 3 1/2 years. The notion that with the stroke of a keyboard you can declare that weight will not be an issue is a tad hard to believe. EVERYTHING points to weight being a factor in this bout that only the foolish can afford to ignore.Posted August 19, 2013 2:57 pm
hidalgo, we know, you know better.Posted August 19, 2013 2:33 pm
Stevens is not going to be a problem for Golovkin… The problem for GGG is getting the appropriate fights with Martinez and Quillin. There is no way GGG should be fighting somebody like Stevens with much better middleweights out there to be matched against … Do fans deserve to see the best fights? Or not?Posted August 19, 2013 2:29 pm
Schaefer was quoted saying that the contract penalty is “over a million dollars”. Canelo is reported to be using a nutritional coach for the first time in his career. Some folks think that it is great for Canelo to be changing things up in his diet program for this bout. I’m here to suggest that ANY change up in a career-long routine is not always all it is cracked up to be. Look, nutritionist or showing up the size of a horse, it does not matter – this bout is going to the cards and I think it a tad foolish to believe that Canelo can out-point Mayweather over 12.Posted August 19, 2013 2:24 pm
Tomato Can — I’d love to see the contract. My bet is that Canelo’s penalty for failing to make weight requires cutting off a body part or something radical like that. Canelo WILL make weight.Posted August 19, 2013 2:09 pm
That was me.Posted August 19, 2013 2:06 pm
Hidalgo — Points well made. Keep in mind that nearly every fighter that outgrows a division does so in a learning experience — one that disappoints fans (and others) by failing to make weight; one that leaves a title on the scales; one that tried to build a bridge too far; one that ends in a sigh of relief in it being the last bout at weight. Remember, Canelo’s unofficial weight against Trout was 172 — a light heavyweight. That’s a hell of a lot of big-boy to stuff into a 152 pound bag! Someone’s exiting this bout with a learning experience to think about — based on Mayweather’s multi-generational experience around the game, my bet is the learning experience will be Canelo’s to own.Posted August 19, 2013 2:06 pm
There’s no guarantee that Avalrez will make 152. I wonder what Mayweather will do if he doesn’t?Posted August 19, 2013 2:00 pm
Well it was Canelos team who asked for the 152lb catchweight. Canelo looks ripped already and it always suprises me that people can lose that weight when they look that ripped up.Posted August 19, 2013 1:55 pm
“And as American football can come down to a game of inches, boxing can come down to a game of ounces.” This is a fact, Old Yank. But Canelo’s team did right. No need to break the horse before the race. Canelo’s team started weight reduction in earnest after the 30-day weigh-in. He only has to lose about 1/2 pound a day for the next month. Most likely they’ll get him down low enough so that he can shed a few necessary pounds just before the official weigh-in. By that time I imagine they will have had him training and sparring regularly at increasingly lighter weights. Still, it’s going to be a struggle for Canelo. Not to say that he can’t make it, but Mayweather wouldn’t ask for a two-pounds catchweight for no reason at all.Posted August 19, 2013 1:50 pm
And honestly, Vivek, those are unnecessarily windy answers to simple questions.Posted August 19, 2013 1:41 pm
Changed his “nick” not “neick.”Posted August 19, 2013 1:40 pm
“Correctomungo you’ll never be as good as Boxtradamus give it up bro.” KOrnerman, Correctamundo IS the original Boxtradamus. He changed his neick to Correctamundo when someone starting stealing his Boxtradamus nick. The current Boxtradamus is someone else. Correctamundo is still the same old immature a-hole though. Too bad ESB has to babysit such a little mongrel.Posted August 19, 2013 1:39 pm
“Kovalev WON by Welshman WILTING stoppage just as I CORRECTLY called !!!!”
LOOK! MOMMY, MOMMY! LOOK! I CAN EAT WITH A FORK! LOOK!Posted August 19, 2013 1:37 pm
Golovkin would smash Dirrell. He’ll smash Stevens too.
“and his skin already appearing a little flush” Probably one of the dumbest questions I have ever read. Canelo’s natural colors are red, white, and pink.
Judah: He’s shown that he can still fight and still put on a good show. GBP wants to make fights that draw revenues. Judah is still doing that.Posted August 19, 2013 1:36 pm
ray gordon reid
GGGPosted August 19, 2013 1:20 pm
Yeah but what he did for yall after the 1 and 4 start is pretty dang good. Not to mention winning a playoff game against the Steelers. Yes the Steelers were injured but still he put on a good showing. I just think he was treated bad before Manning became a Bronco. But I will say this, I would have no problem playing back up to any QB as long as I am getting paid those NFL dollars. Also what the Jets did to him was just terrible. Sanchez sucks also.Posted August 19, 2013 1:14 pm
Squared-Circle Real Talk (a.k.a. The Lion King of Beat Street)
As a life-long Broncos fan, I couldn’t have been any happier when I heard that Denver cut Tebow and picked up Manning.
Tebow was a great QB in college, but is in the process of washing out of the NFL — unless he wants to play back-up to Tom Brady and other top-tier, starting QBs for the rest of his career.
Personally, I think he should quit football right now and follow his true passion: becoming a Evangelical preacher at one of those mega churches in the Southeast. Maybe he can eventually become a televangelist like those low down con-men Creflo Dollar and Joel Osteen — and make his mega-millions selling and exploiting Christianity for the sake of BIG $$$.Posted August 19, 2013 12:39 pm
It was wrong the way the treated Tebow in Denver but they got Manning so what else can you say about that. All Tebow does is win. But I don’t think he is a victim of bullying and if you can’t take being bullied then you better grow some. But Tebow just can’t throw the ball. He is not a great throwing QB. But until he actually has a losing season, you can’t really say he is not a good QB. He is just not a good thrower. But unfortunately that is one of the things you need to be able to do at QB.Posted August 19, 2013 11:51 am
Elanore the Withered Hag
Tumbo’s rant was unintelligible.Posted August 19, 2013 11:38 am
nicely put Maracho.. somebody intelligent in the eastside boxing house ;)Posted August 19, 2013 11:01 am
Vivic, Judah still is an elite fighter as proven by his performances against Garcia, Mathysse, etc. Heck he’s probably better now than when he fought Kosya.
Tim Tebow is also an Elite player but is suffering from none other than bullying. Most people dont understand that bullies also focus on victims that they are jealous of and consider as a threat to their ego, especially if they feel they can get a way with it like in the secretly cheaty bureaucracy of the NFL. Oh and yes it happens in boxing too especially via the group evil of officialdom.Posted August 19, 2013 10:54 am
also, Jason ain’t from Elm Street :PPosted August 19, 2013 10:23 am
“. . . every [Judah] he steps in the ring it’s reminiscent of Friday the 13th, walking down Elm Street! In apt fashion, most of his battles end with a lot of blood a temporary defeat”(?). that happened ONCE v. Garcia. otherwise, prominent meltdowns, crash, and burns are what defined Zab “Super Erratic” Judah’s ring-legacy. Judah is only second to “Juice” Mosley when it comes to unearned title-shots.Posted August 19, 2013 10:16 am
SHOOT!!! It wasn’t until the third paragraph that I realised we were talking about CURTIS STEVENS and NOT southpaw, ADONIS SUPERMAN STEVENSON!!!!
I saw CURTIS’ KO on TV last week and a couple of things come to mind….
Curtis looks a bit mechanical and trigger happy if he gets an opponent with a big shot, but he executed 2 perfect left hooks – as opposed to his looping and forced shots, earlier- the latter as a counter to his opponent’s own big shot, which if he lands would DETONATE on GGG’s chin!
I personally think Stevens’ only chance is to land his hook as a counter to GGG coming in – this counter hook is thrown from a relaxed start point and whips in at a few inches – the perfect hook….
IMHO, this is the only time he throws the shot correctly – as a counter, which seems to be a natural-reaction punch!!!
Apart from this, I think Stevens is not ready for the top tier in the division, but conversely, if anyone has the style to beat GGG it is Stevens, if he can turn it into a firefight…..
I would like to see GGG in this matchup… He looked so smooth against MACKLIN, effortless, that I would like to see him again with the spotlight on him and see if he can perform as well.
I personally think heis more of a precise puncher and boxer, rather than a monster hitter- but, with precision you do not need monster power…..Posted August 19, 2013 10:08 am
I am liking the Stevens vs GGG match up. I think GGG wins by stoppage here but I like it because I hate when folks try to say someone is the most feared fighter. There are a few fighters calling out GGG which means he is not the most feared boxer. Same with Matthysse. They tried to say the same thing about Margacheato and Williams. I hate that moniker on fighters.Posted August 19, 2013 9:51 am
The Real Vivek Wallace
OLD YANK: Fair play on your points. I don’t know that it’s really a huge deal, but the closer we get to the fight, the more it very well could surface bcuz as you aptly pointed out, the goal is 152…no 154. We’ll see what happens.Posted August 19, 2013 9:35 am
Hmm Vivic willfully ignores Saturday’s Kiko, Barker, and Kovalev.
Likewise conveniently forgets that its only fare that Canelo come in two pounds over just as Floyd did against Marquez. Oh my gosh imagine the the rage, the riots, the tears? Ah come now, suck it up and take like a MarquezPosted August 19, 2013 9:28 am
Vivek — You, more than most should know what 3 ounces can mean when the scale on the second weigh-in says you still gotta lose ‘em. For a fighter the last 3 ounces may as well be 30 pounds because when you’ve given all you have to make weight, that last 3 ounces can dehydrate the cortex, zap you of strength, and make 8 weeks of training a total loss. OK, so we’ve still got 30 days to go — it ain’t the weigh in. But should Canelo be 3 ounces over at teh weigh in you can bet your last dollar that Mayweather does not give a crap about getting extra money to fight an over-the-limit Canelo — Mayweather WILL force him to lose the last 30 pounds — I mean 3 ounces!Posted August 19, 2013 8:45 am
WEIGHT: With all due respect, it ain’t 3 ounces. The Mayweather/Alvarez bout is scheduled for 152, not 154. That would make Alvarez 2 pounds, 3 ounces further to go then at his last 30-day weigh in — not just 3 ounces. Alvarez continues to grow. Making weight will be a greater challenge for him more so this time than any other. Canelo will not be struggling to make 147 against Francisco Villanueva; he will be struggling to make 152 to prepare for Mayweather. And as American football can come down to a game of inches, boxing can come down to a game of ounces.Posted August 19, 2013 8:40 am
junior in all fairness it would have been funny hearing the announcer say that ” and the defending champion stopped due to a WILTING Welshman stoppage” hehePosted August 19, 2013 8:18 am
Correctomungo you’ll never be as good as Boxtradamus give it up bro.Posted August 19, 2013 8:16 am
I boldly predicted someone would win the fight and was right. I’m the Greatest boxing quicker picker in the history of boxing quicker pickers.Posted August 19, 2013 8:15 am
in fact I thought he won by TKO I’ve never heard of an official Welshman wilting stoppage finish.Posted August 19, 2013 7:54 am
WOW you actually got one right FOR ONCE, good for you bawbag.Posted August 19, 2013 7:51 am
Kovalev WON by Welshman WILTING stoppage just as I CORRECTLY called !!!!Posted August 19, 2013 7:43 am