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It’s Me, Ernie

It must be horrible to be you.

Posted November 21, 2012 3:36 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

The article you posted was actually supposed to be Evander’s actual medical records, but it was a failure, which is typical from a chode such as yourself. Please leave the posting to folks that make good points, and that can actually back them up. Your feeble attempts have at best just been a long line of failure after failure.

Posted November 21, 2012 3:35 am 


TARK

Kenny Weldon…. Holyfield was one of the best Heavyweights ever—and if he hadn’t been suffering from heart problems—as the article I posted documents—he would never have lost to Moorer or Bowe.

Posted November 21, 2012 1:28 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

The cruiserweight battle with the Camden Buzzsaw was epic. I was a Tyson fan also, but felt he was always afraid of Evander since the amateurs.

Posted November 20, 2012 10:27 pm 


Anonymous

I am privy to all records on Holy if I want them .The man is one of the best heavyweights to ever live on this planet.He has proven it many times over.Too bad his “hateing” enemies dont get it…..God bless….kenny weldon

Posted November 20, 2012 7:35 pm 


TARK

You’re still an ignoramus.

Posted November 20, 2012 6:37 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

I got served, LMAO!

Posted November 20, 2012 2:02 pm 


TARK

You’re still an ignoramus.

Posted November 20, 2012 11:56 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

You’re still a chode.

Posted November 20, 2012 11:19 am 


TARK

I’ve seen the proof of your ignorance and stupidity schnozzle sucker.

Posted November 20, 2012 1:54 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

Still haven’t seen the proof of your Tarkism. What a chode.

Posted November 19, 2012 9:13 pm 


TARK

Right Schnozzle Face., Those details were made public in news stories.. Holyfield is a famous public figure.. Writers and commentators are curious about the activities, misadventures, and travails of famous public figures—and if they uncover any fascinating details they disseminate them to the public.

Got it yet?

Posted November 19, 2012 8:23 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Quoting your dumb ass: “Details of Holyfield’s medical records were made public”. So it was a “Tarkism” as suspected.

Posted November 19, 2012 3:06 pm 


TARK

LMFAO Enema Schnozzle…, I never said, “Holyfield’s personal medical records are available to the public.” And you know it.. Think about this for a minute: Whatever has been revealed in news stories, is part of the public record. Take a few months to absorb this. I know you’re slow on the uptake.

And why is it a bs newspaper article? Are you privy to the real truth?

Posted November 19, 2012 2:52 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Nozzle, you said his personal medical records were available to the public, I challenged you to prove it and you once again failed. Posting some bs newspaper article doesn’t get it done.

Posted November 19, 2012 12:09 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

You’re the idiot that made the statement that the records are public and anyone can see them, yet failed as usual to come thru. It’s just another case of your useless drivel with no substance or fact. It must be really hard for you when you constantly get called out and look like a fool.

Posted November 19, 2012 2:21 am 


TARK

Look Enema Schnozzle… Holyfield was compromised my his well known heart problems.. Details of Holyfield’s medical records were made public because of the media and general public’s interest in them—as such they were newsworthy.. As such information came out it’s part of the public record.. They don’t have to send every living human a copy of Holyfield’s medical dossier from the time he was born for my post to be true.

You are so dense it’s unbelievable.

Posted November 19, 2012 12:49 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

We know the heart issue was all over the media nozzle, but what about those med records you mentioned? Must have been just another one of your ‘tarkisms”, a useless statement contrived to try to make your weak points valid.

Posted November 18, 2012 11:29 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

LMAO @ Douchenozzle Tard and his “Tarkisms.” Since Evander’s medical records are readily available “public records”, then post them please. I am a big Holyfield fan, but medical records are fudged constantly and many of the “Doctors” in the fight game as well as other sports are on the payroll.

Posted November 18, 2012 10:10 pm 


TARK

The reason HIde is a better win for Vitali than for Bowe is, Vitali didn’t get his ass busted for 3 rounds before winning—or use illegal tactics to maul a much smaller man… Vitali won much cleaner, much faster, and without getting badly out-boxed first like Bowe…

Vitali might fight Haye, I don’t know. I think he beats him if he does, but it will be one Hell of a fight. Haye is a very great fighter as everyone would have see if he hadn’t had the unfortunate injury to his toe vs Wladimir, and at 100% we would have seen a more competitive fight.. It’s a fight I’d love to see, but Vitali is 41 and already deep into politics.

Ominous electrocardiograms, MRIs, and extensive tests by cardiologists on Holyfield’s heart are part of the public record—so his malfunctioning heart stories are true.

Posted November 18, 2012 5:39 pm 


SREDMOND

Gonzo, you really don’t register with me at this point, your analysis is weak, your satire is mired down in the same overplayed homoerotic imagery… I KNOW you want my attention but the fact is I don’t find you stimulating and thus you are largely invisible to me with your LONG posts totally devoid of any insight, cleverness or nuance which I appreciate.. I see you believe that there is a “poster of the year” award, well newsflash there isn’t and you CERTAINLY would not qualify as a small mind from a small obscure English town by your own admission. The smoothest, no nonsense poster on ESB is AD and his opinion is well regarded by most… My power is that I don’t need consensus, or cheer-leading to feel valid in my opinions PS… Applauding your OWN posts is corny, get a new routine you are like a comic telling “knock, knock” jokes in 2012…

Posted November 18, 2012 2:06 pm 


TARK

You sure are Enema schnozzle.

Posted November 18, 2012 2:34 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

pitiful.

Posted November 18, 2012 1:42 am 


TARK

Unbecoming are those hemorrhoids on your face.. Enema schnozzle.

Posted November 18, 2012 1:29 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

Tark, your righteous indignation is unbecoming for even a tool like you…

Posted November 18, 2012 1:15 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Please approve my comment Mr Mod. The truth can be unpalatable occasionally but you’ve just got to chow down on it sometimes for the good of all no matter how bad it tastes. I know you feel the same bro.

Posted November 17, 2012 11:00 pm 


TARK

I see it’s you Enema nozzle… I never had a hemorrhoid but you have them growing out of your face.. But that makes sense because it’s where all your crap comes out.. I don’t believe in faith healing but Evander does.. And sometimes what you believe works for you … You’re a bunch of negative creeps who are intolerant of other people’s beliefs.

Posted November 17, 2012 10:24 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Hey Goosey, don’t belittle faith healers so fast, after all one of them did heal Tark from his stage four hemorrhoids…

Posted November 17, 2012 9:56 pm 


Goosey

faith healers … FTW… lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:40 pm 


Goosey

TARK.. Flog your Dead Horse on another thread.. It is well past it’s sell by date on this one.. No matter how much bollocks you type…

Posted November 17, 2012 9:39 pm 


Goosey

All good for a laugh though.. Lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:37 pm 


TARK

Cardiologists extensively tested Holyfield’s heart and said he could never fight again because his heart was performing so badly.. But then after after treatments in Mexico and Asia, and going to holistic healers and faith healers who actually helped a lot, his heart started performing better.. And just through a lot of faith and belief he went back several times for more series of tests because his condition was improving—with fewer bad days along the way.. His heart was obviously getting better.. He went from being a dead dog in some of his fights to feeling like he was 22 for the Tyson fights … If you can’t see the difference in his performance from the first Moorer fight, where he felt like a dead duck, you’re blind.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:36 pm 


SREDMOND

Lmao, I don’t know who is crazier, Tark or us for trying to sort things out with someone so full of oddball ideas and theories created on the fly…

Posted November 17, 2012 9:19 pm 


Goosey

“Opportunistic Ventricular irregularity” I cannot breath.. LOL.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:09 pm 


Goosey

But we are forgetting about the Magic Ventricle Procedure that TARK is going on about.. So who knows..lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:04 pm 


Goosey

Lol Sred.. Something like that anyway… :)

Posted November 17, 2012 9:02 pm 


SREDMOND

Holyfied is special Goose, his only appears during fights he loses and then clears up during bouts he wins…Its a unique condition coined by Tark called “Opportunistic Ventricular irregularity”…. Sheesh!! :)

Posted November 17, 2012 9:02 pm 


Goosey

TARK. A heart condition is just that, a heart condition… It does not “clear up.” You are stuck with it.. I know this because I have one, my older brother has one and so does my dad.. TARK is talking bollocks again, to try and sell his point.. Lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 9:00 pm 


SREDMOND

Goose, he has an excuse for EVERYTHING peripheral to the Klit story…. Bowe cannot get any credit so suddenly Holy had a transplant before their fight…. Even though the heart scenario was never discussed till the Moorer bout…. Tarks a serious fraud!

Posted November 17, 2012 8:54 pm 


Goosey

No doubt Wach would beat all of them… Lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 8:46 pm 


Goosey

TARK “Holy had a heart condition.. but it got better, depending on how I want the result to sound..” Lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 8:44 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, I am NOT a fan of excuses, that the province of Klitschko fans… NOW you are suddenly a passionate defender of Holyfield? you have NO abiding stances… Holyfields bogus heart problem that mysteriously went away or was healed by that damn faith healer don’t interest me, he LOST to Moorer (credit Moorer) then he came back and stopped Moorer (credit Holyfield) Holyfied was unbeaten when he faced Bowe and he LOST that 0 fair and square, do you really expect me to take the testimonial of a boxer who lost??? As for Bowe getting respect for his wars, 2 wins and stoppage over Holy thats how boxing works… You and your crew try to build Vitali off of a LOSS to Lewis, whereas Bowe actually booked 2 wins off an ATG and he stopped a guy Vitali held out as one of his better wins for YEARS (Herbie Hide) before Vitali did…

Posted November 17, 2012 8:17 pm 


TARK

Sred…, You never heard about Holyfield’s heart problems that first surfaced in the flrst Moorer fight??? Holyfield’s 2 Moorer fights were day and night—Why? The first he was sick. The rematch he was healthy. You didn’t hear how he was way underweight in the first Bowe fight because he had been sick again?? He was lighter than he was for any heavyweight fight at 205 and didn’t have any strength to fight a big guy.. You didn’t hear how the ventricle problem came back in the 3rd fight and his endurance evaporated?? Talk to Evander. He says he wouldn’t have beaten anybody in the top 10 that night—but he did blast the wide open Bowe to the canvas before he completely died out there with his heart condition.. That’s Bowe’s whole freakin’ resume.. Holyfield.. A man who would have given him a 12-round shellacking or a KO loss in all 3 fights if he were in the shape and weight he came in for Iron MIke … He got the ventricle fixed by that time.

Posted November 17, 2012 7:08 pm 


SREDMOND

Fair play Tark, you did say 4KO defeats but alas Rahman has 6 losses and and NC before Wlad thumped what was left of him… His resistance was token at best and he was done at the World level…

Posted November 17, 2012 5:54 pm 


SREDMOND

Goosey, you are 100% right he is SUPER impressed by Ruiz scoring a KD against an OLD Holyfield but gives Bowe very little credit for stopping a PRIME Holyfield and taking his 0, the only guy to do it while Evander was anything resembling a young man… And this is a guy who fought Foreman, Lewis 2x, and Tyson 2x… Tark is a sad, sad, ailing guy..

Posted November 17, 2012 5:52 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark you were JUST saying that a 41 year old Vitali might not be able to beat Haye DESPITE his massive size advantage AND the fact that he (Klits has not lost in 10 years) 41 is OLD in boxing and the guys who are the exception to the rule DON’T change the rule… I guarantee if Vitali got knocked out by Haye people would say “Klits got old” You can play dumb, trot out Foreman, or Hopkins but in this sport older fighters usually get dusted and Ray Mercer is NOT a Foreman or Hopkins….

Posted November 17, 2012 5:49 pm 


TARK

Right Goosey.. You’re at your best once.. Every other time you’re not.. Ruiz wasn’t at his best but he wasn’t at his worst.. He was still world class and that’s the point.. He fought a decent fight with Golota.. Golota fought a tough, close, distance fight with a World Champion caliber fighter—after fighting a draw with another World Champion caliber fighter.. Then he fought a cataclysmic puncher named Lamon Brewster and got KTFO in 45 seconds.. A different level performance than he had vs Byrd, Ruiz, and Bowe.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:45 pm 


Goosey

Anyway.. Going out now.. Cheers.. Don’t forget the trivia..

Posted November 17, 2012 5:34 pm 


Goosey

Yup.. Just like Holy was NOT at his best when he got knocked down by Ruiz.. IE: the very point I was making in the first place.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:24 pm 


TARK

Goosey says…. “Next TARK will be telling us that Erik Morales was at his best when he lost twice to Manny Pacquiao, after beating Pacquiao first time out.” … Morales was actually at his best when he took out Junior Jones.. He’s a guy who beat Barrera twice but Erik destroyed him.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:20 pm 


TARK

And Sred… You have to read my posts more carefully… I said Rahman had 4 KO losses and Walcott had 4 KO losses at the time in question.. Walcott had twice as many total losses as Rahman so it made his upset of Charles that much more amazing.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:17 pm 


Goosey

Next TARK will be telling us that Erik Morales was at his best when he lost twice to Manny Pacquiao, after beating Pacquiao first time out. Yup it’s all down to trivia..lol.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:11 pm 


TARK

Sred says…., “Next you will say “Mercer” Mercer was a damn good fighter but he was WASHED up when he fought Klits at 41 years of age” … But I didnt rank Mercer did I? You’re putting words in my mouth again …. And what’s so bad about being 41? Wasn’t Holmes 43 when he gave Mercer a boxing lesson? … Wasn’t Hopkins 46 when he gave Pascal a boxing lesson? … Wasn’t Foreman 45 when he suckered Moorer into a fatal lapse of focus? … Wasn’t Vitali 41 when he whipped the undefeated challenger Charr? … Being 41 is better than being 42.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:10 pm 


Goosey

Funny how TARK is being a cheerleader of Ruiz for knocking down Holy, yet he goes on and and on about how much Bowe sucks. (Bowe being only guy that had STOPPED Holy, over six year before Ruiz scoring the knockdown that TARK seems to be so proud of.) Good stuff TARK. Way to prove your point.

Posted November 17, 2012 5:06 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark the assertion that “underdogs win” basically provides justification for ANY fight being scheduled…Wlad has had better wins over fresher opponents ie Chambers, Chagaev and Byrd… Rahman was a relic just like Shannon Briggs was for Lewis.

Posted November 17, 2012 4:52 pm 


TARK

Anon… WGAS? …. Holy was still boxing at the world class level and Ruiz kicked his ass and decked him in a scheduled 12-round fight—simple as that.. Holy was good to go.. Did Dawson get credit for beating a 47-year-old Hopkins? You bet he did!!!

Anyway Sred.. Rahman had 4 KO defeats when he fought Wladimir—and Walcott had 4 KO defeats when he KO’d Charles for the title.. Was Walcott favored??? Hell NO.. But underdogs sometimes win and that’s why they fight the fights and fans show up.

Leon Stinks beat Ali for kri sake—Larry Holmes was available to fight—and wanted a shot… Do I care about Rahman? WTF does that have to do with it? He was a 3-time Heavyweight Champion who wanted a shot–so why not? I didn’t rank him 1 through 9.

Posted November 17, 2012 4:38 pm 


Goosey

That is my comment..

Posted November 17, 2012 4:16 pm 


Anonymous

TARK “Goosey….. Who TF cares what the sequence was??? Ruiz and Holy fought to a draw and each won one in their trilogy.. That’s a tie.. Don’t get caught up in trivia man.” ..Here is a bit of trivia for you.. You were the one that mentioned “the sequence” (twice). You got “the sequence” wrong both times, you even said Ruiz fought Holy before Lewis did… I and SREDMOND both corrected you. Here is a bit more trivia for you. Holy won his first world title in 1986. 15 years and 30 fights later in 2001 he lost to Ruiz, after beating Ruiz the fight prior and holding a win over every other fighter he had faced in his entire career apart from Lewis who he went 24 rounds with. During those 15 years he won undisputed world championships at cruiser and heavy. Yet to try and prove your latest point, you will try big up Ruiz for scoring a knockdown against Holy at near 40 years of age, after Holy had won multiple world titles in two weight classes, during a career that was in it’s third decade and after he just beat Ruiz anyway.. Nice logic.

Posted November 17, 2012 4:14 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Hasim Rahman NEVER was nor ever will be George Foreman, and George Foreman was NOT absorbing TKO’s and KO’s the way Rahman was…. C’mon man Maskaev put him out of the ring and Lewis almost killed him second go around…

Posted November 17, 2012 3:45 pm 


SREDMOND

AGAIN Tark you have 0 interest in Hasim Rahman as a fighter he was who he was, Wlad got a WORN OUT dazed 36 year old version that had been pummeled by multiple fighters… These posts will play well for you with someone who is new to the sport or someone who is hanging from the Klits balls like you are but those of us who really follow knew that Rahman had very little to offer Wlad Klits… He could not even get by fat James Toney for gods sake with a win…Rahman is NOT one of Wlads best wins and I am sure Wlad would not put the then TAME Rahman out there as his stiffest challenge…

Posted November 17, 2012 3:28 pm 


TARK

Last I heard, Holyfield just reiterated, “People just never believe me.. I’m not going to quit until I’m the unified Heavyweight Champion of the World. That’s all there is to it.”

That’s what I call persistence in the face of negativity. However I don’t know if he said that as a joke or not.

Posted November 17, 2012 1:59 pm 


TARK

How many losses did Joe Walcott have when he knocked out Ezzard Charles??? He had more than twice as many losses as Rahman had… And two of those losses were to Charles with no wins over him—and it was Walcott’s 5th title shot… Ol’ Jersey Joe just kept trying… Rahman just “fought” another title fight—which I suspect will be his last. Foreman was 3 title shots and 7 years into his comeback when he knocked out Moorer.

“There’s something to be said about those who persist in the face of negativity.”

Posted November 17, 2012 1:48 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Basically, it’s just more of the same douche-nozzlery…

Posted November 17, 2012 1:21 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, seriously you are not offering anything intelligent as it pertains to the sport except overblowing lackeys and their performances against OLD men…Hasim Rahman with 6 booked losses, and Jameel McCline are NOT strong endorsements for Wladimir Klitschko…But like your protege Bears, you are greedy and illogical, Chambers, Brock, Chagaev, and Byrd look far better than…

Posted November 17, 2012 1:15 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, good on Ruiz getting his win but he was fighting the LAST of Evander Holyfield so whats your point?? Still trying to prove Golota was an awesome opponent in top form so that the Brewster win is magnified and thus Wlad looks better for getting a TKO over and underdog opponent that almost had him out of boxing AFTER that opponent was softened up during a fight where he sustained damage to an eye that is NOW actually DEAD…

Posted November 17, 2012 1:10 pm 


TARK

Goosey….. Who TF cares what the sequence was??? Ruiz and Holy fought to a draw and each won one in their trilogy.. That’s a tie.. Don’t get caught up in trivia man …

Roy Jones Jr, quote, “Ruiz beat Holyfield twice so I don’t think that’s a necessary fight for me. All of their fights were close. My win over Ruiz was a shutout. I got touched with maybe four good punches that I felt.” … There’s a man who keeps the big picture in focus.

Posted November 17, 2012 12:25 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Not being able to concede one’s nuthugging and realizing his man-crush is overwhelming the fact that Wlad has had his ass handed to him more than once is played out. The broken record Tark’s ignorance is only surpassed by his insignificance.

Posted November 17, 2012 11:43 am 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

Goosey Holy did lose in his next fight but was givin a gift of a decision thats why they were forced to do it again

Posted November 17, 2012 11:37 am 


Goosey

TARK..”OK… So Holyfield went 12 rounds with Lewis twice, lost once, and then lost to Ruiz in his next fight…”

Holy BEAT Ruiz in his next fight.. Man you are all over the place..

Posted November 17, 2012 11:09 am 


SREDMOND

Yeah Tark I am going to call you “DUMB” when you try to sell Wach, McCline and that version of Rahman as some of Wlads better wins if that tops his list then you regard Wlad as a lessor boxer than I do…You keep throwing name after name out there with NO concept of nuance and how the fighter was regarded when he faced Klits… Next you will say “Mercer” Mercer was a damn good fighter but he was WASHED up when he fought Klits at 41 years of age, Vitali does NOT mandate the expiration date of other fighters so get that thru your THICK head…This is why you call a 47 year old Foreman a “Cherry Picker” BUT you won’t sign off on a 41 year old Vitali who has not lost in 10 years facing David Haye…You are an open book to me man…

Posted November 17, 2012 8:50 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, NO ONE sees Vitali Klits as HW Champion from 27 to 41…. The dude was LIGHTLY regarded going into the Lewis fight due to his quitting against Byrd and booking no wins over Top 10 comp at the time…That WBO belt got VERY little respect, NO ONE regarded Vitali as “the man” in boxing except for a BRIEF stint after Lewis retired and he beat Johnson… Being ranked while you are retired for 4 years means what exactly?? Just tack on that time also?? LOL…. Vitali Klits is a singlebeltholder and #2 man of the ERA who topped out beating Sam Peter and losing to Lennox Lewis.. PERIOD….

Posted November 17, 2012 8:45 am 


SREDMOND

AD, makes a solid point as it pertains to the assignment of a career ending beating by the Klits…Guys were saying Wach, and others should retire because they lost to a Klit and took some shots… ALOT of times its just a way to gloss over the spotty futures of fighters that were NOT that good to begin with.. Wach as we ALL know was not beating high quality fighters before Wlad so what makes us think he is going to dive into the top 10 and become successful at age 32 when he could barely get off a punch against Wlad??? He will likely do what Tony Thompson did which is go back to beating fighters with double digit losses and journeymen…

Posted November 17, 2012 8:36 am 


AD

I think the eye injury vs Liakhovick probably had more of an impact of Brewsters career than teh Wlad I fight. Brewster did go on to have 3 decent wins after the Wlad fight, and it is only after the 2nd fight he really took a noticable dip. Of course any beating affects the course of someones career, but there isn`t something special about a beating from Wlad or Vitali that means we have to give them credit for their opponents subsequent defeats. It isn`t like Brwster took an exceptionally long break after the first WLad fight. If you take that tack, then WLads revenge over Brewster owes more to Liakhovich

Posted November 17, 2012 3:41 am 


TARK

Not quite Enema nozzel… You mean great reporting.

Posted November 17, 2012 2:17 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Great fiction Douchenozzle

Posted November 17, 2012 1:49 am 


TARK

Brewster should get full credit for his win over Wladimir.. He paid dearly to get the win.. The punishment he absorbed probably had an impact on the rest of his career.. Wladimir and Brewster’s careers have taken divergent paths since that fateful night.. Wladimir has gone unbeaten and untied, and Brewster, with his brawling, balls out style, has gotten tagged up quite a bit.. Wladimir thanked Brewster. “Our first fight made me a much better fighter. I’ve spent countless days and sleepless nights thinking of what I have to do if I encounter certain situations in my losses. Each fight helps me improve, but a loss is worth 10 winning fights as a catalyst for refinements.”

Posted November 17, 2012 1:37 am 


TARK

Lewis beat Rahman at his best, which is a good deal… But he fought McCall 3 years after his loss, and McCall was at his worst.. You can’t always do a rematch, as in the case of Vitali when he lost while being ahead on points and never knocked down.. So Lewis is fairly lucky to get his rematches and Vitali wasn’t so lucky.. But consider that Vitali held Heavyweight Championships from age 27 until he was 41, albeit taking a 4-year break to heal various kickboxing injuries to his legs. Vitali retired having never been knocked down or ever being behind on points, that’s pretty astonishing.. And retiring with a winning percentage and KO ratio that are the greatest for any Heavyweight Champion in over 50 years makes it even more incredible … It has to also be remembered that Vitali knocked out 3 heavyweights who knocked his brother Waldimir down 8 times, and stopped him twice, while Vitali was never down himself.

Posted November 17, 2012 1:06 am 


TARK

When blithering imbeciles like Sred and Ernie call me names I consider the source… A lot of people call Obama names, including “incompetent moron” but he’s the President of the United States and graduated from Harvard Law School Magna Cum Laude, and was president of the Harvard Law Review. They thought they could beat Obama with 2 billion dollars of super-pac money but they made a really ignorant bet… “So they can all go to hell” David Axelrod said… I feel the same way about these two punks.

Posted November 17, 2012 12:34 am 


AD

So Brewster IS now getting some credit for his win over Wlad?

Posted November 17, 2012 12:15 am 


TARK

I think it’s interesting… Lewis couldn’t knock Holyfield down, but Ruiz did.. And Ruiz can’t punch.. Ruiz can’t knock Golota down but Golota knocks Ruiz down.. And Golota is a weak puncher.. Golota knocks Bowe down, I can’t remember how often.. Bowe can’t club Golota into the canvas like he does to smaller heavyweights.. Bowe has great difficulty hitting defenseless Golota with a jab, even though Golota has an immobile head.. If Golota had any kind of sustained work with a world class trainer he’d of beat Bowe with ease, if he was taught to think.. Punchers like Lewis and Grant pound on defenseless Golota.. Grant is as slow as almost any heavyweight on the planet, but punches Golota more frequently and harder than Bowe without gettng fouled.. Tyson with great hand speed, makes Golota quit quickly.. Brewster, bigger and stronger than Tyson, with good hand speed, smashes Golota into a wreck in seconds … Brewster takes the cake.

Posted November 17, 2012 12:05 am 


It’s Me, Ernie

“You are seriously and idiot”, That’s an understatement.

Posted November 16, 2012 11:40 pm 


TARK

OK… So Holyfield went 12 rounds with Lewis twice, lost once, and then lost to Ruiz in his next fight… To me that still shows Ruiz’s viability as a fighter.. He’s not getting stopped or beaten up by Holyfield.. He’s not getting knocked down, like he gets knocked down by Golota.. He knocks Holyfield down.. He’s viable.. He’s OK.. He bearly beats Golota, many disputing the verdict.. Than Golota gets smashed in thunderous fashion by Brewster in 45 seconds.. I don’t see why that isn’t impressive power, the kind Bowe didn’t like to deal with.. Ruiz still got more title shots after that so he wasn’t done by a long shot.

Posted November 16, 2012 11:23 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, here is a link from Boxrec with Holyfields record… NOTE that he fought Ruiz 3 times AFTER he lost to Lennox Lewis…. Get it together

Posted November 16, 2012 11:05 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Golota was NOT winning and that pattern is NEVER a good leadup to ANOTHER fight… Like I said you can try and promote that as a PRIME Golota but after Tyson everyone knew he was a bonafide headcase… Of course you want to act like he was the same fighter that gave Bowe such hard outings but he was shaky and inconsistent as evidenced by his lead up to Brewster who snuffed him like Lewis and Tyson had…

Posted November 16, 2012 11:03 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, MAYBE you need a trip to BOXREC because Holyfield fought Ruiz 3 times AFTER he Hoyfield LOST to Lennox Lewis…. You are seriously and idiot….

Posted November 16, 2012 11:00 pm 


TARK

And Golota didn’t lose to Byrd… So I’m not using “losses” to substantiate Golota’s viability when he fought Brewster… I’m using a very close fight where he floored Ruiz, and a draw to Byrd to substantiate that Golota could still hang with Heavyweight Champion caliber fighters — in 2 fights just before Brewster KO’d him in 45 seconds.

Posted November 16, 2012 10:58 pm 


TARK

You’re WRONG again Sred…. Ruiz didn’t get a win over a “post Lewis Holyfield”… He got a win over a pre-Lewis Holyfield.

Posted November 16, 2012 10:51 pm 


TARK

OK… Take Rahman off as number 10 victim and put Ray Austin there. Austin drew with Sultan Ibragimov who easily beat Shannon Briggs.. Wladimir beat Austin so easily it was ridiculous. Austin has no punch resistance, so maybe Wach deserves to be # 10 it’s hard to say. How bout Tony Thompson who had only one defeat? DaVarryl Williamson? No. How about Monte Barrett at # 10? He had one loss and was prime..

I’ll tell you what… You line up Ali’s top 10 victims and I’ll shoot holes in them… Like Ken Norton being smashed TFO by a kid who had only 12 wins — and weighed 188 … It’s pretty damned easy to be negative.

Posted November 16, 2012 10:46 pm 


SREDMOND

Using LOSSES to substantiate a mental case like Golotas standing when Brewster cracked his melon is just dimwitted and illogical…

Posted November 16, 2012 10:35 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, NO ONE considers John the “Quiet Man” Ruiz a big puncher at HW he is more reknown for grappling and making BORING fights… He was just ANOTHER World Class fighter that Golota could NOT beat the night he faced him because Golota was on his way down… Ruiz getting a win on a post Lewis, Holyfield is what it is… Evander had ostensibly dropped two to Lennox and he was looking old in the ring… AGAIN Golota NEVER beat Ruiz so trying to pump Golota with a loss to Ruiz is just MORE of your weird thinking…

Posted November 16, 2012 10:30 pm 


Goosey

Lol..

Posted November 16, 2012 10:29 pm 


TARK

It doesn’t stamp Brewster as the greatest… Just shows the difference in caliber between Brewster, Ruiz, Byrd, and Bowe — and who can flatten certain people and who can’t.

Posted November 16, 2012 10:22 pm 


TARK

“Light” puncher Ruiz floored Holyfield and beat him… And stopped Oquendo.. And also beat a prime Rahman.. So I guess flooring Ruiz and losing a tough 12 round fight wasn’t the worse performance ever for Golota… Nor was a draw with slickster Byrd… But getting smashed out in 45 seconds flat by Brewster??? That was smokin’

Posted November 16, 2012 10:17 pm 


TARK

No… I didn’t say Brewster was god-like.. He performed better against Ruiz and Byrd than against any other World Champion caliber fighters.. That’s what I said. Nothing more.. He came off those good performances, which many fans thought he won, and got crushed by Brewster … Nothing great considering it was Andrew “Stinking” Golota.. But a thunderous smashing of a man who beat up a prime Bowe and made him say “Oooowwwweee!!!”

Posted November 16, 2012 10:08 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, When Golota was in with Byrd and Ruiz he was in with two LIGHT punchers ONE of whom was of VERY little threat at HW (Chris Byrd) that said why was Golota NOT able to win the fights if he was up to snuff when he fought Lamon Brewster?? The reality was that Golota had fallen apart as a fighter the night he was in the ring with Tyson.. NO ONE including his trainer could predict if Golota would ACTUALLY perform in a fight let alone win one…Good on Brewster for knocking him out but Lamon is not godlike for the endeavor….

Posted November 16, 2012 9:17 pm 


SREDMOND

Wlad beating Brewster in a revenge match was solid but lets not forget the first fight he got sent to the hospital and Wlad was beating him DIRECTLY off a loss, one year layoff and surgery on his retina AFTER Sergei fought him…. Kudos to Klits for getting his revenge but Lewis knocking out Rahman in the NEXT fight cold certainly trumps that in the “what comes around, goes around category”…..

Posted November 16, 2012 9:11 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, your reeducation must continue, you hold out Hasim Rahman as one of Wlads best wins? Rahman had 6 losses at the time Wlad fought him and he had been brutally knocked on multiple occasions, Lewis, Tua, Maskaev 2x and he looked TERRIBLE against FAT puffed up SMW James Toney the fight before Wlad beat him… Rahman was a worn out relic and retread… That was HARDLY one of Wlads best wins NO ONE In their right mind gave Hasim a chance… Rahman had been looking OLD in the ring for YEARS…. Sheesh who do you think you are talking to?? You call Rahman a GREAT win for Wlad but again Holyfield was pedestrian for Bowe in his prime???

Posted November 16, 2012 9:08 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark this is where your BS trips you up, EARLIER you were SCOFFING and Bowe booking TWO wins one by stoppage over a prime version of Holyfield BUT now you want to give Chris Byrd big props for beating a 40 year old spent version of Holyfield… Moments like this tell me that you ARGUE just for arguments sake….Of course you will try to spin this infraction but once again your pants are around your ankles!

Posted November 16, 2012 9:03 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you REALLY want to put Jameel McCline out there as one of Wlads best wins?? A guy who booked 13 losses in his career, has been knocked out multiple times and lost to plenty of fighters smaller than him? Get real…. Chambers, Byrd and Chagaev are intelligent choices, Byrd beat a SUPER faded version of Holyfield, do you appreciate the reality of a guy beating a NAME as opposed to a solid version of a fighter? Seriously Jameel McCline is NOT on anyones watch list as a TOP Wlad opponent and if he is that does NOT speak that highly of Klitschko

Posted November 16, 2012 8:59 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Oh shut up for once.

Posted November 16, 2012 8:41 pm 


TARK

Best wins of Wladimir’s career? … Chambers, who boxed the bejabbers out of Peter and Dimitrenko, was 35-1, with his lone loss disputed and partisan… Haye, a 2-Division World Champion with great speed, skill, and power… Chagaev, an undefeated World Champion. A tricky southpaw. WK completely white-washed and stopped him… Ibragimov, another southpaw World Champion in a unification fight… McCline, because he knocked out Grant, dominated Briggs, and floored Peter 3 X… Peter, a solid tough slugger who was touted as the next great heavyweight, although SP was pretty much destroyed the 2nd time WK beat him… Byrd, a slick World Champion boxer who beat Tua, Vitali, Holyfield, and McCline, although he was a mile behind Vitali and won due to Vitali’s injury… Brock, a promising, 27-0 contender until Wladimir crushed him… Brewster, a steel tough puncher… and Rahman a 3-time World Champion who flattened Lewis… That’s 10.

Posted November 16, 2012 8:18 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

I think the best opponents of Wlads CV are still in the future. He has wins over some very solid guys but none you can compare, at least historically with the good uns of yesteryear. Byrd, Chambers, Haye, Chagev, Brewster, Peter the first time, maybe even Thompson the first time. All solid guys who could have given the likes of Bowe a fight (and possibly won if they turned up focused) But history will say not. Anyway I don’t particularly rate Bowe.

Posted November 16, 2012 7:34 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

Golota had the potential but didnt have the mental faculties to release it all. Did he just have Bowes number? As Tark sez he came close to Ruiz and Byrd and was unlucky to be on the wrong end of a close call. He did have talent but woulda been manhandled by either bro, of that Id bet the house

Posted November 16, 2012 7:23 pm 


AD

I think the person to ask about the heart problems is Evan Fields.

Posted November 16, 2012 7:16 pm 


TARK

Again Sred… What were Golota’s 2 BEST showings of his entire career against World Champion caliber fighters??? His Byrd and Ruiz fights—just before he faced Lamon Brewster.. Best ever showings by Golota against Byrd and Ruiz—followed by a 45-second smash out by a ferocious, cataclysmic punching, and brutal Brewster.

Two other good showings by Golota—not his best because they were marred by fouling tactics—where his Bowe fights.. No sportmanship awards obviously.. But nobody can deny he beat up Big Daddy Bowe and made him say, “Oooowwiee.”

Posted November 16, 2012 7:08 pm 


TARK

Holyfield had a heart condition—and also had a badly injured left shoulder for his first Moorer fight… In his 2nd Moorer fight Holyfield knocked Moorer down five times. stopped him—and was a totally different fighter … In his Bowe fights Holyfield didn’t look himself again in the 1st and 3rd fights… He was the lightest (205) he ever fought as a heavyweight in their first fight.. He was sick in camp.. In their third fight Evander’s heart problems popped up again. He suffered severe fatigue again like he did against Moorer… It was a ventricle not working right, and he had to get it fixed—which he did before he fought Tyson … Ask Evander about this and he’ll tell you himself.

Posted November 16, 2012 6:46 pm 


TARK

Golota was NOT spent when he face Brewster… Or he wouldn’t have done so well versus Ruiz and Byrd—a close fight where he preformed well—and a draw… You’re making stuff up again because those were the 2 BEST showings of his career against World Champion caliber fighters.

Posted November 16, 2012 6:37 pm 


Daly jr

Your a fruit cake. i was told that me and Goosey are the same person, and now me and jaunma are the same person. WHAT A FREAK!!!!

Posted November 16, 2012 6:32 pm 


Daly jr

Fella you just proved evry1s point. Youv bin caught out and cant own upto it. That simple google search showed the only person on this website callin Haye toe fairy is you (k2fan). And your not man enough to own up to it. What do you see when you look in the mirror? It aint a man!!!! Anyway, its friday night and im sittin here stareing at my fone and my drinks goin warm. Peace and love to all. Bless

Posted November 16, 2012 6:31 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

but dont you worry tranny. Even though the days ahead may be hard for you, ima always have your Back. Thats my promise to you sunshine ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 6:19 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you keep pivoting away from statement after statement…AFTER I showed you that Golota was not considered the same fighter when Brewster got him you move on to him being dirty ect… Fighters are sometimes NOT the same throughout their career, you do realize this? Golota was spent when Brewster got him after all those beatings, Tyson, Bowe, ect…You say that Bowe “swarmed over smaller fighters” Wlad leans all over them and (Poor Mormeck) and he does it with boxers that never rise above the PEAK level of Good fighter… You say that Golota gave a spent version of Bowe, trouble which is true… But if we are to judge Bowe overall on those performances where he was getting the life blown out of him by shots to the scrotum… How do we view Wlad who got cracked by Purrity, Sanders and Brewster? What assumptions are we to make??

Posted November 16, 2012 6:15 pm 


TARK

Tua and Tyson were little short guys, but Bowe was afraid of them… He was afraid of Mercer and McCall and didn’t want to be any place they were… He pretended to be brave when talking to Lewis in person, knowing that Lewis was mentally stable enough not to go after him and beat the crap out him outside the ring… But he would walk a few steps away from Lewis before talking his trash, and say, “OK knock me out” after Lewis threatened to ice him on the spot… He wanted to make sure there were people in between them.. Some of the other heavyweights who wanted Bowe he wasn’t so sure about—because they might haul of and punch him out at any time.. I don’t think Golota would have been able to intimidate any other top heavyweight of that era, except Bowe … Basically Bowe was a coward.

Posted November 16, 2012 6:15 pm 


TARK

I never claimed Golota was any good.. He was even a dirtier fighter than Lewis and Bowe, and couldn’t box or punch well.. Again, you keep attributing statements to me that I never posted, and make up opinions that you attribute to me … Golota was horrible but Bowe couldn’t jab him, couldn’t avoid his punches, and even though Golota had a terrible chin, Bowe couldn’t put him away.. Whenever Golota faced a great puncher he got knocked out.. Not only did Bowe refuse to face great punchers but he wasn’t a great puncher himself.. He punched about as hard as Golota, and not as hard as Michael Grant.. Since he had no boxing ability he swarmed over smaller and lighter fighters, overpowering them wtih his strength, and wrestled and mauled them into submission … And you’re wrong about Lewis being the only puncher he ducked. He flat out refused to face huge, tall, 240 pound heavyweights with good boxing ability and lights out power.

Posted November 16, 2012 6:00 pm 


SREDMOND

Typo=Golota slamming his balls

Posted November 16, 2012 5:46 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark we agree that Golota was getting the better of Bowe but he was also taking fire in return…If he was so in command of the situation why did he contiually foul Bowe horribly despite his corner protesting his punch placement?? Duva screamed on him to stop hitting Bowe low, but the truth is that Golota did not want to be in there anymore…You wanted to DQ Lewis for punching Vitali in the face but you are lauding Bowes INSANE butchering of Bowe’s nutsack…. Hypocrite

Posted November 16, 2012 5:40 pm 


SREDMOND

You go OUT of your way to bolster fighters like McCline, and anyone else who can advance your cause!! This leaves you going on and on about fighters like McCline and washed up versions of fighters.. In your mind you STILL think that Holmes beat a PRIME Ali…. And you do this because the truth is you don’t know boxing…. You think Wach and McCline would stop Bowe, when Bowe was NEVER stopped and they are relative scrubs who accomplished NOTHING noteworthy in boxing absent losing to Klits…

Posted November 16, 2012 5:36 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Golota was a PATHETIC specimen coming off that fight with Tyson and the reality is that he dropped those fights and was coming off a loss…YEAH he was washed up!! Do you remember his trainer I believe it was Duva SCREAMING at him not to capitulate against Tyson?? Dude was a broken fighter, he was losing and Brewster cleaned his clock… Do you want to tell us that was PRIME Andrew Golota in there?? or even a mentally stable version?

Posted November 16, 2012 5:18 pm 


TARK

I’m not shaping facts, YOU are.. Golota was never very good but his fights with Byrd and Ruiz were very close.. They weren’t super great either.. Golota was one of a very few who knocked Ruiz down some had him winning because that fight was so close.. Byrd was also a World Champion and that fight was a draw.. To say Golota was washed up coming off of THOSE fights is YOU shaping facts to your own biases.. Brewster smashed Golota flat—and neither Byrd or Ruiz would have been able to do that.. Since Golota beat the crap out of Bowe, it stands to reason that Brewster could have done the same thing to the wide open Bowe … One thing Golota and Bowe have in common is they were both wide open for any great punch in your arsenal.. Both ate jabs, hooks, and right hands like they were hamburgers—so that’s why they cowered so badly when facing a big, tall, huge punching heavyweight with lights out power.

Posted November 16, 2012 4:55 pm 


TARK

A lot of people thought Golota beat Ruiz—and it was a close fight—as was the Byrd fight… Coming off those super close fights with World Champions doesn’t mean Golota was finished… Brewster was another level up from Byrd and Ruiz—and didn’t make tough work out of Golota… Golota was very fearful of heavy bombers and it showed against Brewster, Lewis, and Tyson, who quickly clubbed Golota into the canvas… Brewster would have smashed Bowe out in the first round because Bowe was even easier to hit than Golota … Regarding Lewis, McCall, Mercer, Tua, Tyson, and Ruddock.. They all would have smashed the cowardly Bowe out in 5 rounds or less … if he had the guts to fight them.

Posted November 16, 2012 4:14 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark AS USUAL we have to watch you overturn history, call someone a cheat or debate reality in order to puff up a Klitschko client.. NO ONE sane puts Big Bowe and McCline in the same sentence, his record speaks for itself… He was NOT a true Champion as a fighter and when he stepped up he LOST…. Get over it you sound like a MAJOR loser waxing on about lame ass “Big Time” McCline

Posted November 16, 2012 3:58 pm 


TARK

HAAHAHAHAHA!!!! Brewster wouldn’t have lasted 8 rounds with Bowe??? LOL!!! Bowe wouldn’t have lasted ONE round with Brewster.. How long did Andrew Golota last with Brewster??? 45 seconds… How long did Golota last with Bowe??? Long enough to floor Bowe several times and beat the living crap out of his so-called pair — if he had any.

Posted November 16, 2012 3:51 pm 


TARK

I’m not saying that McCline is great… I’m not even saying he’s super good.. I’m not saying he’s a great boxer such as Haye, Vitali, or Wladimir who even you have to admit are great boxers.. McCline lost to a lot of good fighters.. He booked some very questionable losses to Byrd and Peter which depending on which judges were watching, those fights would have gone to McCline.. Ezzard Charles and Joe Walcott have more losses than McCline—because they both fought way beyond their prime… As did McCline… Does that mean they weren’t great??? McCline was far from great—but he is what he is… He’s a big, strong, towering heavyweight who could box, punch, and take a punch, and who would have beaten the living crap out of a cowering chickenheart like Bowe—who avoided every big, tall, hulking, tremendous punching, slick boxing heavyweight of his own era.

Posted November 16, 2012 3:44 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

tranny wishes she could fall outta love with me that easy ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 3:22 pm 


TARK

McCline was bigger, taller, faster, stronger, and a better boxer than Bowe… McCline put Shannon Briggs on his back with one shot to the head, and stopped Michael Grant (31-1) in the first round … Bowe didn’t just duck Lewis.. Bowe ducked every natural heavyweight of his era who was a great puncher, i.e. Lewis, Ruddock, McCall, Mercer, Tyson, and Tua.. You’re defending a coward who couldn’t box or defend himself very well … Even Fou Pole Golota beat Bowe up—and Golota couldn’t last one round with Ray Austin, Lennox Lewis, or Lamon Brewster..

Posted November 16, 2012 3:01 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, it is FUNNY how your initial sell was Jameel McCline LOL then you pivoted to Bowe ducking Lewis… We KNOW that Lewis beat him as an amateur and that he ducked him as a pro but putting a relative lame like McCline on par with Bowe is foolhardy…. The reason there was a discussion of Bowe vs Lewis was because Bowe made himself relevant in the ring, McCline was someone better fighters beat up on…Bowe fought a TRUE Champion successfully capturing 2 out of 3 meanwhile McCline pretty much just lost to that caliber of fighter…

Posted November 16, 2012 2:46 pm 


TARK

Sred says…, “You LOVE to think that you provide some sort of extraterrestrial insight by putting forth unheralded fighters.” NOT TRUE!! All were heralded to one degree or another.. Tim Austin fought a draw with Sultan Ibragimov who whipped Heavyweight Champion Shannon Briggs with ease.. Jameel McCline whipped Heavyweight Champion Shannon Briggs when Briggs was in his prime.. Kirk Johnson knocked out Heavyeight Champion Oleg Maskaev, without even trying, in Maskaev’s prime.. Maskaev knocked Heavyweight Champion Hasim Rahman out TWICE just in case you never heard the news … To say the K Bros never beat heralded guys, or only beat guys who never accomplished anything is ridiculously biased, Sred.

Posted November 16, 2012 2:30 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

wow tranny way to lick some arse! “the 2 biggest and best on this site” awww :) Is that your new ploy to try and get your crusty and hairy old crack licked one day? :)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:28 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

tranny if your gunna come out with a line like i “do not listen to FACTS” then be so kind and state what these “Facts” are, no? We all know how you fanatize doin lines off my nut sack but thats a different story alltogether. Remember tranny…just a bit of restraint even and then who knows? A wish might just come true…even for one night only ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:26 pm 


Juanma

Gonzo, id put you and SREDMOND on the same level. lol. in terms of relevance the 2 of you are probably the 2 biggest and best on this site. Sreds ongoing feud with TARK however tends to grab most peoples attention.

Posted November 16, 2012 2:25 pm 


Juanma

ok then, i shall take a leaf out of EVERYONE ELSES book and just ignore you. I see your deal now……….None of the other kids wanted to play with you,………….. aaaawwwwwwww poor bubah :(

Posted November 16, 2012 2:19 pm 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

You can’t even name one guy or gal on here who’s in my league? Not even one that comes close? Thanks guys, reassuring to know I’ve still got it and that there’s life in the old dog yet. :)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:19 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

Still waiting for these facts tranny. The only fact ive observed is that i have you turned on but very frustrated since im not givin you any. What did I tell you tranny? coming across to eager and thats gonna turn any man off surely? ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:18 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

Yet you are still responding Juanny :) And no i ve changed my names? Well its true i have changed my my name a few times this board…did it show? ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:16 pm 


Juanma

its strange this this guy thinks i will listen and respond properly to him even though he just brushes off my (and other peoples) comments and comes back with some random crud

Posted November 16, 2012 2:10 pm 


Juanma

my how your tone has changed mr rubes. you used to be almost relevant

Posted November 16, 2012 2:09 pm 


Juanma

ive just been down this thread, and you have had arguments with almost every poster on here lol. using your many different names ofcourse. iluv being the main one. Mr Rubes being the one you havnt used since you were chased off the site by sredmond, daly, and goosey……hahahahahaha busted rubes. how pathetic

Posted November 16, 2012 2:08 pm 


Daly Jr (Juanma, same tranny) likes to touch herself

So what are these boxing “Facts” Tranny? :)

Posted November 16, 2012 2:00 pm 


Juanma

you teach little boys how to suck dingaling. thats about it homeboy.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:57 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

Catch ya later Tranny. In the meantime, remember what ive taught ya ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:55 pm 


Juanma

unbiast dane, the twerp stated that vitali always goes to the body. Your right, if it aint broke dont fix it. He doesnt need to go to the body, but why pretend he does when he doesnt

Posted November 16, 2012 1:54 pm 


Juanma

come caca Hijo de perra

Posted November 16, 2012 1:52 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

The only fact ive observed is that i have you Very sexually turned on and frustrated at the same time. But didn’t I tell you already. To win me over you gotta show restraint and then ‘maybe’ you might make a lil progress with me ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:52 pm 


TARK

Sred….. What happened when McCline stepped up to fight Michael Grant??? He blew Grant away in the first round… What happened when McCline stepped up to fight Shannon Briggs??? He boxed the bejabbers out of Briggs… What happened when McCline stepped up to fight Sam Peter??? He floored Peter 3 X and came very close to beating him… I doubt very much that Bowe would have ever gotten into a ring with the bigger, taller, stronger, faster, and better boxing McCline.. Not with Bowe’s history of avoiding hulking heavyweights like McCline—who could box.. McCline would have tattooed Bowe as easily as he tattooed Michael Grant and Shannon Briggs — and that’s why that fight could never be made … Bowe was one cowardly shrinking violet.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:50 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

Facts like what tranny? :)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:49 pm 


Unbiased Dane

Juanma : please address your outburst. :-) I agree with you that namecalling should be avoided.
You said following about Vitali ” when he does go to the body, he is inefective! ” Vitali is one of the most effective fighters ever, so crucial bodypunches doesnt mean that much, he gets his oppoenents out enyway. As they say if its not broken dont fix it.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:49 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

“Facts” like what tranny? The fact I have you sexually turned on but frustrated at the same time since im not givin you any? Told you already, work on that restraint boy and then maybe you might come across more desirable. But even at that its still only a maybe.. :)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:48 pm 


Juanma

When did i say any of those guys went to the body fool? You are dilusional

Posted November 16, 2012 1:44 pm 


Juanma

Your own moma dont love you kid! Who could love you? you are nothing! im wasteing my time here because we have already established you do not have the brain power to take onboard what other people are saying. In the civil world we call it a conversation, or sometimes a debate, or a discussion. What you do is say your own little part, and not listen to the views of others, and in some cases you do not listen to FACTS which are being thrust upon you.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:43 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

On another note everyone knows that since the 50s other than Tyson, VK is the most active downstairs. Fact. Tranny when you can link us up with Ali and Lewis and Holmes and Foreman and all the rest showing more activity downstairs then prove it sonny otherwise continue workin on your courting skills :)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:41 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark is trying to sell Jameel McCline as a GREAT scalp because AGAIN Wlad is hurting for them… But in fairness to Wlad he is NOT one of Wlads name worth mention… Byrd, Chamber, Chagaev, Haye and others look better than McCline who was just BIG with a suspect chin….Bizdon wants to diminish Bowe beating Holy who defined himself a success at HW with 4 trips to the title… BUT one of Wlads BEST wins was Byrd who came up from LHW and became a Champ but did NOT accomplish as much as Holy… I know your pea brains will say “but he beat Evander at 40 years old” yeah and that is what it is… Evander was washed up…. Taking Evanders 0 was a tremendous accomplishment because Holy was a winner before and after the event… FACT

Posted November 16, 2012 1:38 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

tranny juanny once sed he would stop responding. yet hes still responding. The man loves me. He went under the knife hoping he’d be more attractive to members of the manly sex. Whats up, aint it working out for you tranny? :) Heres my adice, treat em mean, keep em keen ;) Your love for me is too obvious therefore its off putting. Show some restraint tiger ;)

Posted November 16, 2012 1:38 pm 


Unbiased Dane

Tark , did Bowe avoid Galota ? he fought him twice ? Enyway Bowe fights against Holyfield was great to watch, but they way Bowe struggled against Galota does not make me rate Bowe all that high.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:37 pm 


Juanma

sred that was not aimed at you. its all for the worm boy who cannot read or understand whats infront of him

Posted November 16, 2012 1:33 pm 


TARK

Wladimir fought several heavyweights similar to Bowe… But Bowe NEVER fought ANYBODY similar to Wladimir… Bowe DID have a chance to fight someone like Wladimir—a very big, tall, strong, smart, fast, superior boxer with a great jab, and great right hand—although he lacked a left hook as good as Wladimir’s… That heavyweight was Lennox Lewis, who even Sred admitted Bowe avoided… Bowe is younger than Lewis, who critics claim had a weak chin—the same knock often put on Wladimir—but Bowe was scared to death of Lewis.. He ducked Lewis throughout his career—and ducked every other natural heavyweight who was a great puncher as well.

Posted November 16, 2012 1:33 pm 


Juanma

i just cannot beleive that there are morons like you walking the planet. You should be put down. You are a troll. I bet you could not fight your way out of a paper bag! Chinga tu madre !

Posted November 16, 2012 1:31 pm 


SREDMOND

EVERYTIME McCline stepped up he LOST did you really propose him as a Bowe equivalent?? Yeah you did because you are a JOKE of a poster

Posted November 16, 2012 1:28 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, who the hell is Derrick Jefferson?? Why do I ask that? because he NEVER accomplished ANYTHING even close to what Bowe did and neither did Jameel McCline… You know SOOOOOO little about boxing that you propose any big body as equivalent to a guy that was HW Champion on more than one occasion and was Undisputed booking wins over Evander Holyfled… When I propose guys that I think might trouble the Klits do you see me putting forth scrubs that were not able to accomplish ANYTHING or note during their time in the sport… You LOVE to think that you provide some sort of extraterrestrial insight by putting forth unheralded fighters but instead you just look DUMB… NONE of the fighters you sell have to prove a damn thing… Its laughable

Posted November 16, 2012 1:19 pm 


Juanma

You are soooooooooo inferior that you cannot even think of your own moniker, so you just mock other peoples names. You unimaginitive little worm of a man

Posted November 16, 2012 1:19 pm 


Juanma

Yes mate, no-one agrees with you so there-for everyones the same person. Whats happened here my boy, is that people agree that vitali does not go to the body much, because its a fact! and when he does go to the body, he is inefective! Please argu with that fact. Link us upto vitali hurting and stopping people with his great body attack. Sredmond said Ali attacked the body. YOUR A DIV!!! you call people names. like ur a little girl

Posted November 16, 2012 1:16 pm 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Just out of interest, can anyone name a better poster on this site that me? I’m just a bit curious if there are any other posters on here that I might not be familiar with whom you chaps consider to be even in the same ball park as my good self?

Posted November 16, 2012 12:59 pm 


TARK

Sred says W Klitschko never fought anyone like Bowe… Wladimir fought MANY heavyweights similar to Bowe.. Derrick Jefferson was a huge scrapper. An easy-to-hit 6’6”X250 swinger like Bowe. Wladimir destroyed Jefferson quickly with smashing jabs and right hands. Jameel McCline was a 6’7” X 260lb boxer-puncher who boxed better than Bowe. McCline knocked out huge slow Michael Grant (31-1 and 6’8” X 260) in the first round.. McCline floored Sam Peter 3 times.. McCline stopped prime undefeated Cedric Boswell.. McCline easily out-boxed Bowe-slow Shannon Briggs—another inept swinger like Bowe.. Wladimir was WAY too fast, too skilled, and too hard punching for McCline. Tim Austin was another 6’6” X 250lb swinger who Wladimir KO’d with ridiculous ease … When it came to big tough opponents such as this—Bowe avoided them all.. Even slow, chinny, dumb, soft punching, inept Golota beat up Bowe.

Posted November 16, 2012 12:47 pm 


Daly Jr likes to touch herself

Raaaaaaaaasssssss LL is a lot better then Holyfield, that aint like and like, but both legends. True

Posted November 16, 2012 12:34 pm 


TARK

Sred says WK never fought anyone like Bowe… Wladimir fought MANY heavyweights similar to Bowe.. Derrick Jefferson was a huge scrapper. An easy-to-hit 6’6” X 250lb brawler like Bowe. Wladimir murdered Jefferson quickly with smashing jabs and right hands. Jameel McCline was a huge 6’7” X 260lb boxer-puncher who boxed better than Bowe. McCline KO’d giant slowpoke Michael Grant—31-1 and 6’8” X 260lb—in the first round.. McCline floored Sam Peter 3 times.. McCline stopped prime undefeated Cedric Boswell, a better boxer than Bowe.. McCline easily out-boxed Shannon Briggs, a slow, Bowe-like brawler… Wladimir was WAAAAAY too fast, too skilled, and too hard punching for McCline. Tim Austin was another 6’6” X 250lb swinger who Wladimir KTFO of with ridiculous ease… When it came to big, strong, 250lb opponents such as this—cowardly Bowe avoided them all … Even the slow, chinny, pathetic Golota canned Bowe.

Posted November 16, 2012 12:31 pm 


RAAAAAASSS

Neither klit fought anyone as good as holyfield! Oh wait, Vitaly fought Lewis and……………..

Posted November 16, 2012 11:55 am 


Bidzon

” Wlad NEVER fought or defeated a fighter like Bowe in his prime…. FACT

” – the same thing can be said about Bowe. The only one name which come close is Holyfield (cruser.

Posted November 16, 2012 11:39 am 


Bidzon

What makes you think Bowe would fight WK, based on his history with LL it is safe bet he would do the same thing he did with LL – run.

Posted November 16, 2012 11:30 am 


SREDMOND

Tark says “Bowe would have given Ali nightmares” newsflash a PRIME Bowe would have given Wladimir Klitschko nightmares.. He was EXACTLY the type of fighter Klits would HATE to fight with because he was took a good punch, threw a good punch, he was aggressive, willing to infight and BIG enough to scrap it out….I know that you and some of the crackpots on this site think that Bowe and Mariusz Wach are both different sides of the same coin but anyone who knows boxing can note reality…. Wlad NEVER fought or defeated a fighter like Bowe in his prime…. FACT

Posted November 16, 2012 10:30 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

edit> Lewis does, or did rather, hit harder than Hide.

Posted November 16, 2012 9:32 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Golota wasn’t even a banger but he was hurting Bowe plenty. Don’t get me wrong, Golota hit pretty hard but a legitimate banger would’ve gotten Bowe out of there.

Posted November 16, 2012 9:05 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Tark.. Yeah, Lewis does hit harder than Bowe. But then again, do you think Bowe was going to credit his archrival and former conqueror? lol

Posted November 16, 2012 9:00 am 


Daly jr

Sex pest? loooool………. This little mincer is either BOX SMART or Mr Rubes. BOX SMART just plain dont like me coz i dared to speak out about that ATG tyson Fury, plus boxsmarts obsessed with sexuality ie david price and Tony Bellew. OR…… Or its mr Rubes coz me and a few others chased him off the site, oh and i threatend to bum him……….. Either way, both non-entities with no knowledge of this once great sport. Both biast, both blind, both homophobic…………..

Posted November 16, 2012 5:22 am 


Juanma

Just read through Dalys posts, and he never said Ali goes to the body. It was sredmon who said that. You seem to have this weird fixation with daly. i agree that VK hardly ever goes to the body too. in the link u put up, there was not 5 body shots. there was 1, and another 1 which ‘half threw’. Your ignorance and agenda have blinded you. good luck with your life you angry little man. an angry little man who is too thick to realise that no-one on this thread wants to interact with you becoz ur too dumb to take anything in

Posted November 16, 2012 4:06 am 


TARK

Hide was the hardest puncher Bowe ever fought.. He was correct in saying that.. But he meant as a pro—where Bowe refused to fight brutally hard punchers like Lewis, Tyson, Ruddock, Mercer, Tua, and MCall.. The hardest puncher Bowe EVER fought was Lennox Lewis—in the amateurs … Lewis knocked Bowe out of course and that’s where he got his fear of big punchers.. He was a bully who loved to fight the Bruce Seldons of the world.

Posted November 16, 2012 12:46 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

FTR, Herbie has about 30 plus pounds on me and he never went full out in sparring. However, trust me when I tell you we went at it pretty hard and I held my own in there.

Posted November 16, 2012 12:07 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

KL.. Like I said, it’s plain to see he gassed to those of us with the gift of sight and a modicum of intelligence. You don’t even need to have a discerning eye to see it, just a rudimentary grasp of body language will suffice. I knew before the first bell had even rung he was going to run out of steam early because it was patently obvious he was a nervous as hell about fighting over in the US and on such a huge stage for the first time in his career, something he even admitted to me at a later date in gym. And when he bolted out of the starting box like a demented greyhound on an industrial dose of bath salts, I knew the fight was as good as over if Bowe could weather the storm for the first couple of rounds. I notice that neither you nor SRED’ I’ve Got a Tattoo of Andre Ward’s Bollocks on my Forehead’ MOND failed to address any of the other salient points I made in my post like the vicious rabbit punches Bowe landed on the back of Hide’s head, which clearly had a huge effect of the course of the fight and turned it in Bowe’s direction?

Posted November 16, 2012 12:05 am 


TARK

Bowe would have given Ali nightmares.. It would go similar to the Hide fight … Consider the trouble Ali had with 6’5″ X 219 Chuck Wepner.. Wepner wasn’t as big, hulk strong, or as powerful a puncher as Bowe, yet Chuck mauled Ali—hitting Ali with numerous rabbit punches, and even decking Ali.. Smaller boxers who weren’t dynamite punchers were Bowe’s meat.. He would absorb tons of their less than smashing punches, tear after them with manic savagery, and club them down with his wild, roughhouse, mauling tactics.

Posted November 15, 2012 8:14 pm 


TARK

KL… NOPE. You missed my point… Being bigger and taller didn’t help Ali when he was whipped by little heavyweights: Joe Frazier and Leon Stinks… So “what IFs” in size and toughness weren’t going to help Ali … Herbie Hide was a giant compared to some of the guys who whipped Ali — but little a midget compared to Ridiculous Bowe.

Posted November 15, 2012 7:36 pm 


KL

Tark you seem to miss my broader point……….which was that you cannot “create” a boxer with the “what if” scenarios.

Posted November 15, 2012 5:25 pm 


KL

Gonzo…………..you sparred against Herbie Hide many times………..and you STILL think Hide gassed against Bowe…………..wow Herbie must have knocked your head a few times……it’s showing!

Posted November 15, 2012 5:19 pm 


TARK

Right.., How about Ali cherry-picking Leon Stinks 6-0-1, 6’0″ X 197, to avoid Larry Holmes, the best heavyweight on the planet — and in so doing gets stripped of the title … Fast forward 2 years when Ali is broke and Larry is champ, “I WANT LARRY HOLMES”

Posted November 15, 2012 4:35 pm 


Daly Jr is a sex pest

Did some tool just say the Kbros “cherry pick” LMFAO. So who have the Ducked oh sage??

Posted November 15, 2012 3:52 pm 


TARK

Boxing is exploding in Europe…Vitali is retiring but Wladimir looks good for a couple more years—and then it will be Pulev, Haye, and Price in Europe and Americans Wilder, Hanks, Jennings, and Mitchell should start sorting their rivalries out.. The K Bros didn’t give rise to MMA although they come from a kickboxing background, MMA started in the early 90′s and it’s not cutting into Boxing’s fan base. Boxers are still the highest paid combat sport athletes and Mayweather and Pacquiao were the highest paid athletes in the world on the most recent rankings … But there’ll be some amazing heavyweight fights in the next two years and it will be interesting to see who moves against who.

Posted November 15, 2012 1:21 pm 


Daly jr

TARK, i was reffering to iluv as the bad smell, and i was saying talking to him was like banging your head against a brick wall. He doesnt rate foreman atall, so maybe you should share your views with him.

Posted November 15, 2012 12:22 pm 


Daly jr

only when im home alone

Posted November 15, 2012 12:14 pm 


TARK

Daly….., You’re a jerk

Posted November 15, 2012 12:10 pm 


Daly jr

maybe you should share your views on foreman with iluv……….. its like banging your head against a brick wall

Posted November 15, 2012 12:02 pm 


Daly jr

you argue about his age, then you make out age doesnt matter…….. Sorry bud, but that bad smell is back.

Posted November 15, 2012 11:58 am 


TARK

Daly….. Bernard Hopkins put a whipping on Jean Pascal when he was 46 to take the light heavyweight title. Maybe you got confused. I give Foreman tremendous credit. Moorer was so far ahead he was getting lackadaisical and slapdash. George caught him napping. It was the only KO or knockdown Foreman scored in his last 7 fights—but he was very alert and suckered Moorer into giving him that opportunity. It was an amazing ending. Moorer looked like a guy who lost a lottery ticket with 6 winning numbers. His face said “WTF happened.”

Posted November 15, 2012 11:55 am 


iLuv

“pathetic views which you put accross as facts” Really? Well Ima still here to be proved wrong in the view that Ali had no decent body attack Foreman couldnt box worth a damn. That the bros are genrally viewed as modern day legends and not just “the best of their era in every continent other that europe” as one of you ladyboys said. What else?? :)

Posted November 15, 2012 11:40 am 


Daly jr

correct me if im wrong, but didnt Mccline put Peter on his back 3 times in 2 rounds? hardly an iron chinned monster was he………….

Posted November 15, 2012 11:38 am 


Daly jr

Who did Peter beat before that fight??? A blown up pot bellied James Toney ? or a half dead mccline? he was hardly foreman, holmes, or Ali caliber was he. Show some neutrality for your own sake

Posted November 15, 2012 11:33 am 


TARK

NOBODY else ever stopped Sam Peter until after Vitali murdered him… Peter came into that ring with a Mariusz Wach chin and left with an Audley Harrison chin.

Posted November 15, 2012 11:22 am 


Daly jr

Oh, and when he came back, he won 18 ina row by ko/tko. Aint any worse than Vitalis record against ‘cream puffs’ is it…………

Posted November 15, 2012 11:19 am 


Daly jr

my apologies Trak, Foreman was 44 when he fought Tommy gun. twas a typo which i missed so never corrected. Happy now? just to clarify, foreman was born in 1949, and he fought Tommy in 1993 = 44 years old

Posted November 15, 2012 11:15 am 


TARK

Daly says.., “Foreman lost to Tommy Gun at the age of 46!!!” Total BS.. Foreman was years younger than that–so why do you guys LIE and continually fudge stats??? When Foreman came back at 38 he fought a bunch of creampuffs to pad his record.. When Vitali came back at 37 he fought Heavyweight Champion Sam Peter right out of the gate — and crushed him like he was a 3rd rate sparring partner.. It took Foreman 7 years to get his title back after being boxed to death for 10 rounds.. Vitali took the title IMMEDIATELY while boxing and punching the never previously stopped Sam Peter—the man who gave the weaker and shorter Wladimir Klitschko a tough 12-round go—to death in 7 rounds.

Posted November 15, 2012 11:07 am 


Anonymous

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,lеbеdеv, аll division
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will bеаt klitschko аnd othеr mofos. forgеt hеlеnius ,furу,
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еrа coming soon

Posted November 15, 2012 9:22 am 


SREDMOND

Its time guys stop trying to combine the accomplishments of Wlad and Vitali and view them as distinct boxers… Wlad has simply done MORE and, has beaten better fighters and has been the true ruler of this ERA… Vitali is a solid #2 man but his docket looks weak as it pertains to foes..And how much of the HW landscape he conquered, too much of his rep is subjective ie “he would be the man if he wanted to fight his bro” “he would have won if Lewis had not opened his face up” “he would have beat Byrd had his arm not started aching” ………….. Sorry but you have to judge a man when the smoke clears on what he actually DID do, NOT what you think he can..

Posted November 15, 2012 8:54 am 


SREDMOND

See this is where these lames on the thread betray their ignorance, Vitali and Wlad began boxing professionally in 95 or 96, Vitali had a PERFECT shot to become “Undisputed” without having to bash his damn brothers head in… He could have got in the ring and actually BEAT Lennox Lewis!!! BUT we know that was not going to happen because he got his shot at an aging ATG and could not cut it…. Both Klits had ALOT of years to attain something more than the WBO belt but Vitali was losing to Lewis and quitting and Wlad was getting knocked out in his 40th and 45th fight thus rendering himself irrelevant… The HARD truth is that for all the chatter about Vitali he is a SINGLE beltholde and that does NOT rate alongside guys who Unified divisions and conquered multiple straps….While I understand the rationanale for not fighting ones brother in this case it mitigates you accomplishments… YOU NEVER fought the best of your time…

Posted November 15, 2012 8:36 am 


huckster

Pulev-Wlad 2013 . . . that might be exciting.

Posted November 15, 2012 8:29 am 


huckster

It is not unreasonable for Wlad to fight Vitali. If you boil it down to a sport, it is not unreasonable. If you see it as a fight between brothers, we are all brothers in God’s eyes. Some closer than others. A mother’s promise is a mother’s promise. That sucks for HW boxing. If you want to blame it on anything, that is where it lays. They were not secretive in what their intentions were when they were after the belts. It took them a while to even hang on to one belt. They have learned the business side of boxing. They have learned that sometimes taking less is worth more than risking all. They are very shrewd business men. They have gone beyond naive in the businees of boxing. They paid for it at times. There are lot of crooks in this business. No, it is not unreasonable for the boys to fight. Wlad’s best chance is now. It will never happen. I don’t get excited over the idea. It is wasted fantasy.

Posted November 15, 2012 8:28 am 


Daly jr

and you state that sreds argument is unreasonable !!!!! lmfao. what a moronic weak excuse for a human being. Crawl back into your cave maggot

Posted November 15, 2012 7:54 am 


Oscar

Damn this iluv guy is ignorant and dumb. i think i will joing the party and ignore what you have to say too iluv. you are the extreme minority here and you seem to think you are the only one who knows anything. Ali was not a great boxer? foreman could not box? neither could bowe? this is the craziest thread i have seen

Posted November 15, 2012 7:36 am 


Daly jr

iLuv, ive been on this site for around a year now, and this is the first time ive read your name. You remind me alot of Mr Rubes and Tark. Maybe you are there child?? Juanmas spot on, you cannot take on what others are saying, and you rekon your thoughts are facts. Whilst i was away, all you proved is that YOU have nothing better to do than sit on here like a troll writing to people who clearly are not here! lol. Like Juanma, i will disregard you from now on, because you simply do not matter. Gonzo, SREDMOND, Goosey, KL, TARK, and others here can have a conversation. you dont have that ability. See what im doing iluv? its called being the bigger man!

Posted November 15, 2012 7:12 am 


Juanma

ILUV I WAS BLOCKED BRO! do not for a second think u could chase anyone out of a thread with your no-hope comments, childish name calling, and pathetic views which you put accross as facts. Youve made yourself irrelevant in this thread and website in general mainly because you think your views are gospel, and you dont have the ability to take onboard what others are saying. I mean, you realy showed your class and intelegence when Daly jr said he was going to do some work and wouldnt be here to read your posts. You came on acting the big man again. You are not e person of high regard on this website. Your a joke like Boxtradamus who just like you seems to think his thoughts hold water. I wont be addressing you anymore, i dont deal with children

Posted November 15, 2012 7:05 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, Vitali NEVER became Undisputed Champion like Bowe, Holy, Tyson or Ali… He never got the straps that Wlad got… The whole “behind on points” “never down” argument is supposed to be a filler for the glaring LACK of realestate captured by Vitali Klitschko during his career….AGAIN we know you are going to try to staple him to Lewis ballsack to negate the reality that he is a singlebeltholder but thats not really gonna fly… Yeah Klits record looks good, but he has also NEVER been successful against ANY HW better than SAMUEL PETER…. After 16 years in the game thats the BEST name Vitali could produce?? Well he is in proud company with Robert Helenius and Eddie Chambers though he beat FAT Sammy down first…. The aforementioned Champs had BETTER foes to face and conquer in order to get their props…..When has Vitali had to Unify?? NEVER dude basically signed a contract that says “#2 during the era”

Posted November 15, 2012 5:12 am 


SREDMOND

Ken Norton was 6″3 or so and he gave Ali all he could handle and George Foreman was 6″3 as well…I know that Foreman did NOT do enough in boxing to compare with the likes of Wach and Timo Hoffman for your liking but the rest of the planet sees that differently… The best actual HW boxers “including accomplisments” that Wlad faced were likely Byrd and Chambers (skills wise) Byrd was a hell of a fighter yet undersized, Chambers was a hell of a fighter yet undersized, BOTH men made a move back south of HW so AGAIN who are the terrfic fighters physically comprable to the Klits?? This forces you BACK to the Lewis discussion and thats always going to end with VITALI LOST

Posted November 15, 2012 5:05 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, your post below is a PRIME example of why you cease to make ANY sense… You try and put Ali out for being 6″3 but where the HELL are the really good or GREAT or even just good fighters the Klits are fighting that are 6″8 or 6″6????? There are NONE and using Holmes as a proxy of who Ali was is running counter to history, because he was VERY washed up… Larry Holmes gets VERY little credit for beating that version of Ali, he was simply pounding an old name who could no longer fight at that level…. I know you will say “38 going on 39″ is a boxers prime but thats absolute BS… And the minute we discuss Haye getting in with Vitali chumps like yourself start shaking in your boots… Even though Haye is a former Cruiser and Vitali has not lost in like 10 years..

Posted November 15, 2012 4:58 am 


SREDMOND

TARKS POST………….TARK

Daly jr…, Ali fought only one (1) heavyweight who matched him in size—over 6’3″ X 210, and who was aslo a good boxer and puncher.. That was Larry Holmes to whom Ali lost every minute of every round … Don’t tell me that Foreman could box.. He was pecked to death by Young, and was even outpointed by gawd awful Tommy Morrrsion..

Posted November 15, 2012 4:53 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Cheers man, I appreciate the kind words. Thanks to AD, too. I like reading yours as well bro.

Posted November 15, 2012 4:35 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Cracking posts they were too Gonz.

Posted November 15, 2012 4:34 am 


iLuv

Jaun if your gonna make a tool out of yourself at least have the courtesy to respond once youve been corrected. I wont be holding my breath for an apology mind even though thats what you oughta be presenting me with ;)

Posted November 15, 2012 4:17 am 


Juanma

di bellas a 2 bit promoter who said macklin was better than daniel geal! Rafael is a nobody who seems to think lil floyd is a middleweight. U plainly dont listen to the word of others so why would you listen to there word? Did you know that for 2 weeks ring mag did not rank bam bam rios atall? i was writing to them pointing out there mistake, and they sent me a gift voucher and a hand written apology!lol. my point being even ring aint the boxing bible they are seen to be, so why take di bellas or rafs word? Now im a tranny lol. your childishness knows no limit. You have made yourself a joke on this site wit ur name calling bro. time for you to find a new sport. im out too, ur making a bad smell in this thread

Posted November 15, 2012 4:12 am 


iLuv

Ad for the record the Kbros aint the only ATGs who fought in a so called “thin era”. Yet do you hear people saying Joe Louis or Jack Johnson or Rocky Marciano aint great coz the era they fought? Only first class A-holes would. Similar to the first class a holes on this board tryna tear strips out of the bros.

Posted November 15, 2012 4:09 am 


iLuv

Tranny Juanny sez
“In ‘the americas’, mexico, the uk, asia, and africa the Ks are seen for what they are= the best of this era. Its only in mainland europ that they are seen as something else” And do you live in all continents to know that for sure. Werent both Lou diBella and Dan Rafael, based stateside don’t cha know, calling the bros ATGs as recenty as Saturday gone?

Posted November 15, 2012 4:04 am 


Juanma

For the info of people who think the Ks are regarded in the same league as ali and the boys from the 60s to 90s. think again. In ‘the americas’, mexico, the uk, asia, and africa the Ks are seen for what they are= the best of this era. Its only in mainland europ that they are seen as something else

Posted November 15, 2012 3:59 am 


AD

iLUV, yeah but that is how I would aint it when pushing their case. You look at the last 9 years – and is there anyone else as dominant as the brothers have been – they have owned the blue ribband division for almost a decade. It`s incredible and I can really only think of maybe Mayweather and Pacman who have maintained that kind of consistency. WK especially I think has some of the best weapons of any heavyweight ever , and I`d bet on him vs almost anyone from history at the moment. That doesn`t make Wach, Thompson or Mormeck any better though, and it doesn`t make the heavyweight scene as tasty as it might be if the contenders actually whittled eachother down and got seasoned vs good opposition. To my mind only two things let the brothers down in terms of being put at the top of an ATG list one is that their peers are not playing their part on creating a great era, and the other is that they both turned pro in 96 but it wasn`t until after Lewis retired 7 years later that either took over as no 1 heavy, and that was with a gallant loss. If you don`t stamp out the previous era, then it is hard to put you at the top of all eras.

Posted November 15, 2012 3:58 am 


Juanma

WOW iLUv you seriously are a moron. He said he wasnt gna b readin your replys and u carry on writing to him. Wot a spastic hahahaha. No-one has said Ks aint great. they are. But they aint beat anyone of norton, ali, LEWIS, foreman, frazier etc calibre. Big boys? you think your a big boy here on this website? honest? you know nothing from what ive read. you put your own views accross as facts and do not listen to others. very childish. and you call cats names. very very childish

Posted November 15, 2012 3:56 am 


AD

If you are going to push the case that either or both the K-Bros there are a load of ways to do it without Making excuses for every loss Trying to convince everyone that Vitali did in fact beat Lewis or Selecting various contenders from today who are yet to beat even a fellow top 10 contender, and equating them with guys like Holyfield, Bowe, Frazier, Holmes, Foreman and Norton. For sure people have the rose tinted spectacles on when they look back at those guys, but you`ll need rose tinted binoculars to look back on someone like Wach.

Posted November 15, 2012 3:41 am 


Daly jr

iLuvboys, you include in every post some weird little self hyping statement like you have acheived something. But your posts are not hard hitting, they do not change peoples minds, and they just show how closedminded you are. If those 5 punches you are citing as bodyshots were infact body shots, your man VK needs some advice on how to throw a body shot!

Posted November 15, 2012 3:37 am 


Daly jr

You looking for someone who was over 6ft 3, heavier than 210lbs, and a good boxer and puncher. I would love to hear who fits that bill on either of the Klitz resumes Tark? Do you realy rate Solis or Briggs higher than Norton and Foreman? A prime Holmes would have blasted out anyone in the history of the sport IMO, so to ridicule an OLD Ali for taking a beating from a young Holmes is crazy. Now, so far in this post weve heard, Ali was not a great boxer, Ali never went to the body, and a load of other junk, NOW FOREMAN COULDNT BOX?!?!?!?! What world do you people live in??Foreman lost to Tommy gun at the age of 46!!! He lost to young by way of a very bad nights work on his own part and his own fault, inwhich that weak KD in the last round didnt do him any favours.

Posted November 15, 2012 3:32 am 


AD

WTF – everything get censored here.
Where is my post?

And I wouldn`t mind reading GOnzo’s either

Posted November 15, 2012 3:24 am 


TARK

Daly jr…, Ali fought only one (1) heavyweight who matched him in size—over 6’3″ X 210, and who was aslo a good boxer and puncher.. That was Larry Holmes to whom Ali lost every minute of every round … Don’t tell me that Foreman could box.. He was pecked to death by Young, and was even outpointed by gawd awful Tommy Morrrsion..

Posted November 15, 2012 2:53 am 


Daly jr

Knock out percentages dont count for anything when your comp is not on the same level. The defining point to this ongoing argument for me is that Ali (for example) fought 9 ATGs, coming out of them with 7 wins (?). Vitali Fought 1 ATG, and got his face torn appart, and came out of IT with a loss. Gotta go to work ;) bless

Posted November 15, 2012 2:18 am 


Daly jr

iLuv, you have a real strange complex. Either that or you just feel the need to belittle people to make yourself somehow look better. Your go-to thing with me and KL was calling us women, and (me mostly) a 14 year old. Well, if we in fact are women or 14 year olds, so what? Are women and 14 year olds not allowed to watch boxing? i dont get it. For the record i have a 5yr old and a 6yr old. Do the math!!!!!

Posted November 15, 2012 2:12 am 


TARK

Sred says…. “Bowe was HW Champion on two different occasions.” … Vitali was Heavyweight Champion on THREE (3) different occasions.. He has never been behind on points in his ENTIRE career. He has never been floored. His only 2 losses were due to injuries while he was ahead on points.. VK has knocked out 3 heavyweights who knocked Wladimir Klitschko down 8 times—and knocked Wladimir out twice.

Vitali has a better winning percentage and KO ratio than Bowe, Holmes, Lewis, Wladimir Klitschko, Ali, Holyfield, Tyson, Foreman, Louis, Johnson, Jeffries, or Dempsey.

Posted November 15, 2012 2:12 am 


Daly jr

which I missed when Charr was in the corner*

Posted November 15, 2012 2:08 am 


Daly jr

iLuv, i like the way you declared yourself some sort of ‘winner’ of the debate when ESB stopped me from posting! In my last deleted post, i stated the times, and gave my opinions on those supposed body shots. Of the 5, 1 was a genuine body shot which missed when Charr was in the corner and VK was on him, i hold my hands up (like a sven ottke oponent). Another 1 of the 5, VK didnt actualy throw! He ‘half’ threw it, then pulled it. The other 3 cases were ALL supposed to be rights to the head when Charr was ducking down, which all landed on Charrs left arm/shoulder. So there was 2 body shots in the first 2 rounds. Not 1, my apologies.

Posted November 15, 2012 2:07 am 


Daly jr

test

Posted November 15, 2012 2:02 am 


TARK

KL SAYS…., “If Ali had the size of the K brothers and chin of Oliver Mcall he would have destroyed everyone.” ..NOT TRUE.. You’re forgetting one thing KL.. Ali had a size advantage on all of his conquerors.. Ali was bigger, taller, and heavier than Joe Frazier and Leon Spinks—Frazier being 205 when he whipped Ali and Leon Spinks was 197. Both were much shorter. Ali was slightly taller than Ken Norton—and heavier—when Norton busted Ali’s ass.. Holmes was roughly the same height as Ali, and Berbick was an inch shorter than Ali. Ali had Holmes by 6 pounds and Berbick by 18 pounds … In short, Ali had a size advantage in all his losses. Toughness played no part either—because Ali was only stopped once—after losing every minute of every round.

Posted November 15, 2012 1:29 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

KL.. Yes, I did watch it live and I’ve seen it at least 2-3 more times since then. And FYI, I’ve actually sparred against Herbie on numerous occasions thank you very much. I bet you’ve never sparred against Bowe though. I win. lol.

Posted November 15, 2012 1:20 am 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

edit> ”bashing up their best fighters”. And please Mr. Mod have the good grace and the common decency to approve my post this time. I think even you recognize it was a hell of a post even by the lofty standards I am famous around these parts for.

Posted November 15, 2012 1:17 am 


KL

What’s this nonsense Gonzo talk about Hide “gassing” against Bowe………….Hide was a fast, accurate boxer that was doing well against Bowe………..until his face made contact with Bowe’s jab……..then it went all downhill from there.
Like I said I watch that fight live on tv…………did you?

Posted November 15, 2012 12:15 am 


KL

I”f Herbie Hyde or Buster Mathis Jr had the size and chin of Wach they would have destroyed Bowe”……..Tark If Ali had the size of the K brothers and chin of Oliver Mcall…….he would have destroyed everyone Tark………including Wlad & Vitali……….. the “If” scenario is kinda meaningless really.
If Andy Murray had the clay court skills of Nadal he would have won the French Open……….If think you get the point!

Posted November 15, 2012 12:07 am 


Decker

Bowe was overrated – ducking LL. RB was a big HW even by current standards. Was one of the “great” 90s US HWs. Would have lost or ducked prime K bros.

Posted November 14, 2012 11:59 pm 


TARK

Holyfield wasn’t right when he lost to Bowe… You know Holyfield often had problems in those days.. He had physical problems… He had marital problems… He had problems with all his kids and he had a lot of those… He had health problems… He had women problems… He had heart problems… He had shoulder problems… He hooked up with the wrong juice man—and that’s the truth. Holy often had more troubles than your 20 peskiest relatives put together… It’s like Jermain Taylor beating Bernard Hopkins.. Weird.. Jermain didn’t have half the ability or talent of Hopkins but somehow he got 2 wins.. It happens in Boxing … Bowe was a piece, but he beat Holyfield.

Posted November 14, 2012 11:52 pm 


rod

shame we never got to see Valuev face Wlad or Vitali. It would have definitely gone the distance. The K Bros would have got to show case their skills against a gigantic freak of nature

Posted November 14, 2012 11:20 pm 


rod

WELL I AM ACTUALLY GOING TO GIVE WLAD MORE RESPECT THAT VITALI. HE HAS SIMPLY FACED MUCH BETTER OPPOSITION. HE IS THE REAL CHAMP AND HAS BEEN FOR ABOUT 5 YEARS. VITALI IN HIS PRIME WAS A FREAKING BEAST BUT THAT WAS ALONG TIME AGO. WANTING TO SEE PULEV AND PRICE MIX IT UP WITH WLAD ON 2013

Posted November 14, 2012 11:19 pm 


SREDMOND

Hide “Gassed” alright when those overhand rights started bouncing off his damn head… he was in tremendous shape and was facing a BIG fighter who presumably was going to be the one with stamina problems OR are we saying that Big Bowe had BETTER stamina than Herbie Hide???? Ohhhhh we are saying that Hide was “nervous” hmmmm so we have to accomodate his “nervousness” and his poor stamina??? Bottomline is Herbie got BEATDOWN something awful and after the last trip to the canvas he had mercy on himself and STAYED down..

Posted November 14, 2012 10:46 pm 


Goosey

until he gassed. Lol.

Posted November 14, 2012 10:33 pm 


Gonzo the Dragonborn

Herbie Hide was beating him like a red-headed stepfather too until he gassed. The occasion clearly got to Hide and it was plain to see he was nervous as f@ck about fighting over in the US and on such a big stage for the first time. Bowe, like most of your countries best fighters never dared to step foot outside the protective sanctuary of the US during his prime and as such never had to deal with a single one of the numerous hardships or disadvantages away fighters have to deal with when fighting on the road. They all add up and they can and often do mean the difference between winning and losing, hence why American fighters generally end up getting their asses kicked on those all too rare occasions they manage to locate their balls and get on a plane and fight on a level playing field for once in the lives.

Posted November 14, 2012 10:22 pm 


SREDMOND

Yeah Yeah Tark but you seriously fail to account for his success as a HW the way you describe he he sounds like Mariusz Wach or one of these other inept HW’s that cannot beat one of the suspect contenders of today…He was a fighter no one ever described him as silky smooth… BUT somehow despite your scatching critique he was NEVER knocked out 3 times like Wlad Klitschko NEVER quit like Vitali Klitschko and retired having defeated every man he ever fought with the exception of an NC…. He was HW Champion on two different occasions and Undisputed… As it pertains to accomplishement the ONLY HW’s active today that accomplished as much as Bowe or close are Wlad and Holyfield…. Because as we know despite his defenses Vitali is a SINGLE beltholder… Klits has been stable but he also has NOT captured much realestate in the HW division.. NEVER unified but of course he is on par with Wach… What a joke!

Posted November 14, 2012 9:48 pm 


Goosey

TARK and iLuv “Sez”

Posted November 14, 2012 8:20 pm 


Anonymous

Off subject- Why can’t more managers let there boxers fight away from home? Gary Hyde’s working well with English middleweight Mark Heffron & Irish light-middleweight Dee Walsh, by setting them up with contests on the continent. So why can’t the rest follow suit?

Posted November 14, 2012 8:12 pm 


KL

And Gym rat…………as for “ownage” I think you might be looking through “Rose tinted”glasses…………..valid points have been made on BOTH sides of the argument………I think it’s more like a draw neither side has completely been able to “own” this argument.

Posted November 14, 2012 8:06 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, the difference is that Ali had ALREADY booked GREAT fights with GREAT fighters and he was NOT trying to overhype Spinks who upset him the way you guys are droning on about Wach…Ali was at the end of his career and he was inactive for close to 2 years when Holmes came and beat the OLD man… You were just recently trying to keep Vitali out of the ring with Haye who is FAR smaller even though Klits has been unbeaten for 10 years or so? Meanwhile Ali had dropped one to Spinks and his “Ring Age” was showing when he went kamikazee and fought a streaking ATG in his prime…

Posted November 14, 2012 8:05 pm 


KL

GymRat…….you lost me……..what do you mean about “dig up the past?”

This is a fairly deep thread………but I joined it when poster Reem state that Wach would have beaten Foreman & Frazier………..and then the discussion then went on to discuss Ali………so It wasn’t me who “digged up the past!

Posted November 14, 2012 8:02 pm 


SREDMOND

Gym Rat, you say “relavant time” sorry in a guy with 15 or 16 years in the game thats his career… While I know it is PAINFUL to illuminate the 75% of Wlads career where he displayed unusual vulnerability its is a point of FACT… His current run has been admirable and has firmly inserted him as the BEST HW of this ERA… The desire to segment the Klits careers absent relevant prime years in a boxers or athletes life are nonsensical and revisionist in the extreme…. Wlad and Vitali became forces AFTER Lennox Lewis and Co retired and thats just reality….They were not bashing top fighters early on absent Byrd for Wlad (Vitali QUIT of course)

Posted November 14, 2012 8:01 pm 


SREDMOND

Gym Rat, you are obviously a unschooled in boxing reality, Wlad became a TRUE force AFTER he got thru Sam Peter knocking him down 3 times in his 48th fight… 3 fights removed from the Lamon Brewster beating… As for Vitali he was TKOed by Lennox Lewis, having concluded his business with a 6 round 60 stitch stoppage of the OLD Klit Lewis retired as one of only 2 or 3 Undisputed HW Champions…. Vitali was not good enough to pry that belt from around his waist….

Posted November 14, 2012 7:57 pm 


gym rat

would love to hear the thoughts on what i just wrote by some of these klit deniers

Posted November 14, 2012 7:49 pm 


gym rat

i think unless you have a very bad dose of hate and klit denial everyone else is agreed that Wladdys gr8ness came after the brewster shock and in his dominace since and Vitalis started when sending Lewis into retirment and the numbers hes gathered since then

Posted November 14, 2012 7:47 pm 


gym rat

i have enjoyed looking over the posts. I have not witnessed ownage like that in some time. kudos to tark and luv. kl convienent then dont you think that your like dig up the past when tearing down the bros but every1 else who see clearly how “great” they are actually stick to the relevant time, ie now an the past 8-10 years.

Posted November 14, 2012 7:38 pm 


KL

Well, whilst you make a sound point about Spink’s lack of fights…………we know Ali was just about cooked after the Thrilla in Manilla…………..when people talk about Ali being “great” they aren’t really referring to Ali past the Manilla fight……….just as Holyfield will be remembered as a “great” before his fights with Ruiz..

Posted November 14, 2012 7:17 pm 


TARK

KL…. Yes Hammer was 7-1.. and only had 8 fights.. Wach was in the development stage.. How many fights did Leon Stinks, 6-0-1, have when Ali cherry-picked him to defend his title against? …. 7

Maybe that’s why Ali was stripped of the Heavyweight Championship and Holmes and Norton were named to fight for the vacant title… I guarantee you that’s the only way Holmes was going to get his legitimate shot at the title — because Ali wasn’t going to fight Holmes unless Larry already HAD the title.

Posted November 14, 2012 7:02 pm 


TARK

Sred…. “relative refuse like Wach.” … Refuse??? You use hateful words and you’re a hater.. Wach is a very nice man with a beatiful family and he’s making a nice living for them.. How can you call a man you don’t know anything about refuse and garbage??? Did you see Wach’s fight against Haggler??? Who I think was around 26-3 and one-time touted as a future heavyweight champion by his trainer.. You tell me if Wach is as slow and lumbering as Tex Cobb as he fights Haggler … I never claimed Wach was great.. I never said he was a masterful boxer.. I never said he was a future Heavyweight Champion.. I never said he was going to beat guys like Haye, Price, or Pulev.. He was an elective fight like Ali fighting Alfredo Evangelista or Jean Pierre Coopman.. Although Wach would club dimunitive Evangelista and Coompan out in a hurry!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:52 pm 


iLuv

no takers?? Thought so ;) It must b a hard hard life being a full time K2 hater. the uninterrupted success going on what? Almost a decade now? LOL

Posted November 14, 2012 6:51 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Wach Blasting out Kevin Mcbride means what??? Who the hell is Christian Hammer?? Reality is that a C level fighter stopping some D level fighters is not impressing anyone but a NOVICE like yourself… Price knocked out Audley Harrison you probably think he is ready for he HOF by now?? Helenius knocked out an OLD beaten up Lamon Brewster, ATG yet??

Posted November 14, 2012 6:50 pm 


iLuv

Maybe this other tool Sred would care to answer? Since all are obvious experts on ho bad the Ks are and how great the past champs are compared :)

Posted November 14, 2012 6:46 pm 


KL

Tark………..yeah I can see you’re point…………Wach can look good & powerful against that all time great ………….Christian Hammer!
How many fights did Christian have before he met Wach?………. 8!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:46 pm 


iLuv

KL in your obviously very informed opinion who had the greater and more potent body attack, VK or Ali?:)

Posted November 14, 2012 6:45 pm 


SREDMOND

KL they want Wach to be something more than a C level fighter because Wlad fought him and his size gives the impression that he was MORE of a threat than he actually was… Truth is the guy was awful from an offensive standpoint against a world class fighter… Slow, poor form and a non-existent defense…

Posted November 14, 2012 6:44 pm 


KL

Iluv………..now you are putting words into my mouth……..NAUGHTY Boy……………I thought you’re mom had already sent you to bed!!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:42 pm 


iLuv

So KL you admit Ali was hopeless downstairs. We are making Progress!! Good boy. Now, who else do you love? Lennox Lewis? Okay link us up of his great attack downstairs :)

Posted November 14, 2012 6:39 pm 


KL

Come on guys tell me what the hell do you see in Wach………I’m waiting!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:37 pm 


iLuv

KL it “Seems” the case or it IS th case? Both Ks are basically Julio Chavez in terms of body attack hen compared to the overratted Ali.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:37 pm 


TARK

KL says…. “Even the punch Wach landed on Wladimir wasn’t that powerful.” … Go to youtube.com and watch Wach’s KO’s of Christian Hammer and Kevin McBride.. The blasting out of Hammer was CATACLYSMIC!!!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:36 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark are you BACK touting a GARBAGE fighter like Wach?? Again unlike Wlad Ali did not need to be defined or build a rep facing relative refuse like Wach.. He is remembered for Liston, Frazier, Foreman, Norton, Lyle and Shavers….. 3 time lineal HW Champion… Fighters like Wach are important to Wlads legacy because he has NO ONE legit GREAT or historically relevant to discuss… NO ONE was talking about Wach before and they are NOT going to talk about him AFTER because he did NOTHING… He is the 2012 Tex Cobb..

Posted November 14, 2012 6:35 pm 


KL

Hey Iluv…….YOU’RE the one who brought up thus whole body shot discussion!!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:35 pm 


KL

Err no Tark read the thread……..I was repeating what Iluv stated.
But the REAL point being that in general the K bros especially Wlad do not employ the body shot……..and it certainly seems the case with Ali ‘s pro career too.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:34 pm 


iLuv

So come on KL we dont have all day. If you are gonna talk smack about the Klitz for having no body attack show us all Ali with his great array down stairs LMFAO

Posted November 14, 2012 6:33 pm 


iLuv

KL you crowing on about VK throwing at least 5 downstairs that round and then mentioning Ali throwing One the whole fight against Williams? L to the OL! No more!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:31 pm 


TARK

KL… You say Vitali only throws 5 body shots against Charr? … He throws one hell of a lot more than that—you can’t count.. You say Ali threw one body shot against Williams? He also threw one against Jimmy Ellis about 6 years later.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:28 pm 


KL

My last comment was addressed to Tark.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:26 pm 


KL

I can understand you putting in a case about the K bros……..but Wach????
What is it that Wach has achieved that elevates him so much in your estimation………I don’t get it………Wach is slow…….too slow for someone with Ali’s speed.
As for power……….didn’t see too much in his fight with Wlad……..even the punch that did land on Wlad wasn’t THAT powerful.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:25 pm 


SEANTRADER2001@YAHOO.COM

The point with the Olympic medal was a response to Tark harping on Vitalis amateur background..If you did not know or did not see Ali went to the body at times then you don’t follow boxing … We all know the Klits don’t attack the body… Both men are primarily Jab, Jab, right hand and if you don’t know won Olympic Gold then bone up on your history son… Showing a clip of a Klit throwing one or 2 bodyshots does NOT change the reality of both men (Klits) not being proficient in that regard…

Posted November 14, 2012 6:24 pm 


TARK

KL…. You posted the Ali-Williams fight.. Williams couldn’t take any exertion because he was shot by a policeman and took about 2 years to recover some basic functions.. His weight actually went down to 150 at one point in his recovery and he never beat a good heavyweight again.. Williams was done and Ali knew it.. How about posting Ali’s fights with: George Chuvalo, Ruddie Lubbers, Mac Foster, Alfredo Evangelista, Leon Spinks, Ernie Terrell, Joe Bugner and other punching bags who he couldn’t knockout or even knock down.. All of them would take a severe beating from the bigger, taller, stronger, tougher Wach.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:20 pm 


KL

Iluv if you are going to be THAT pedantic……..you said Ali NEVER threw body shots……….well there’s at least one body shot in the Cleveland Williams fight I linked to.

Posted November 14, 2012 6:19 pm 


KL

Iluv………..5 body shots…………..Wow that certainly sealed it…………NOT!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:16 pm 


iLuv

Sred sez “Ali had an Olympic Gold Medal and he knew how to go to the body” Prove it. Link us up

Posted November 14, 2012 6:16 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, NOW you are making excuses about “amateur career” Ali had an Olympic Gold Medal and he knew how to go to the body… Face Facts Wlad and Vitali are not prodigious body punchers..

Posted November 14, 2012 6:15 pm 


iLuv

So KL what exactly have i do dig myself out of? Did I now just show VK throwing at least 5 body shots?

Posted November 14, 2012 6:14 pm 


SREDMOND

Yeah Tark, “Deficits” if you are getting knocked out 3 times in your first 45 fights clearly you had some “Deficits” thats 75% of your career, You can try and confine discussions of Wlad to the past 15 or so bouts but thats NOT accurate… There is a REASON that Wlad and Vitali were unable to really takeover till they were in their 30′s it did not take other fighters that long to start really making a splash…

Posted November 14, 2012 6:13 pm 


Daly jr

i just wrote out a big old response iluv but it hasnt come out lol. im goin to bed!

Posted November 14, 2012 6:10 pm 


Daly jr

At 1:50 of the round that is an attempted right hook because Charr ducked, vitali was not going for a body shot! at 1:32 is a weak right to the body which i missed, at 1:18 once again charr ducked and vitali attempted the right hand to the HEAD, at 0:29 vitali went to throw a right to the body but stopped it half way lol, at 0:21 vitali throws a right which hits Charr on the left elbow. Where are all the body shots? i missed 1, so there is 2 in 2 rounds. my apologies. Its funny when you look at things through biast eyes you can see thangs which do not actualy happen. Ive noticed the guys bleeting on saying ‘the only ones who dont rate the Klitz’ are Americans and Brits’…….. But the Only people who try to build the Klitz up are Germans/eastern euros. Oh and ofcourse Tark, but he seems to rate Vitali higher than Wlad, which ive only just noticed, and its kinda strange considering he has acheived far less, and holds but 1 of the MANY belts in the division. I know for a fact i am not biast, afterall Britain do not have any active top HWs for me to route for vs a Klitz….. What i see i both those guys is nothing remarkable, they are both good, and ofcourse the best of this era. And they would have been COMPETITIVE if we could put them in with Ali, Tyson, Foreman, Holmes and co. But there is no way these guys would have ruled in the 60s 70s 80s or 90s. Im up at 5am, so its off to bed for me, if anyone feels the need to abuse me whilst im gone, just know that i wont be reading it !!lol

Posted November 14, 2012 6:09 pm 


KL

Unbiased Dane, If you read earlier into the thread, it was Iluv who said Ali wasn’t great because he didn’t throw body shots……..so naturally it was only a matter of time before someone would respond with the lack of body shots the K bros throw.
Iluv, kinda walked into that one………but couldn’t really dig himself out……….so he’s called it a night (Iluv that is!)

Posted November 14, 2012 6:03 pm 


TARK

Sred…., Deficits??? Good video post by iluv… Shows Vitali throwing numerous body shots against a man young enough to be his son.. 10 or 15 years ago Vitali didn’t throw many body shots.. One of the problems with an amateur career of 100′s of fights such as Vitali had—and he fought twice as many amateur fights as Ali did—is that you can land 15 effective body shots and only 2 scored because of the limited ability of 2 judges to see them—and they have to score them at the same time.. So you go with head shots because they are more visible to more judges. But Vitali unloaded a few left hooks to the liver, a new punch for him … Ali was a guy who didn’t have a body attack, so with him that critique would be legitimate

Posted November 14, 2012 5:46 pm 


SREDMOND

Unbiased Dane, the Klits do indeed knock off most guys blocks the convo was centered on various facets of the game… As usual guys who are proven Greats were being knocked while some of us had to QUESTION the Klits LONG learning curves and the deficits in their games.

Posted November 14, 2012 5:43 pm 


Anonymous

ali beat 9 hall of famers whooooowee

Posted November 14, 2012 5:30 pm 


Unbiased Dane

Against Williams of course

Posted November 14, 2012 5:30 pm 


Unbiased Dane

Kl: Ali was just as good as Mac Foster. who ever he was.

Posted November 14, 2012 5:29 pm 


Anonymous

lennix lewis whipped that ass the only hall fighter they fought they .lost end of stroy

Posted November 14, 2012 5:27 pm 


Anonymous

beating bum after bum after bum after bum does not impress most boxing experts

Posted November 14, 2012 5:25 pm 


Anonymous

rated by all boxing experts the man who beat 9 hall of famers ali had to be the greatest so put that under your kkk hoods the only fighter to beat 9 hall fighters can the kilt’s just beat 1

Posted November 14, 2012 5:24 pm 


Unbiased Dane

And now the problem is that the Klitschko´s doesnt throw bodyshots jesus !! these Klitschko´s hater have such a hard time.
Who cares when Wlad and Vitali almost knocks their opponnents head of :-D

Posted November 14, 2012 5:24 pm 


Anonymous

ali ,must have been the greatest

Posted November 14, 2012 5:13 pm 


SREDMOND

I Luv, how many fights had Wlad had when he faced Rahman?? He was OVER 50 fights into his career I believe… That said how damn long does it take to start going to the body and why do we have to suspend disbelief forever? Should we looking out for an uppercut from Wlad in 2040??? He is highly effective, but trying to sell his as a threat to the body ignores his history…

Posted November 14, 2012 5:07 pm 


TARK

iLuv makes a wonderful point…. One can never argue, “If you haven’t developed your craft by this number of fights you’ll never be great.” … Wladimir-Steward was one of the greatest boxer-trainer relationships in the history of boxing.. Maybe Wladimir would have quit boxing after the Brewster disaster if he wasn’t with Steward.. It certainly looked terrible for WK.. Getting knocked out.. Losing for the 3rd time on a stoppage.. Running out of gas in just 5 rounds.. “Wlad you have to quit” his brother Vitali told him. “It’s not working and you don’t want to risk your health. I’m the fighter in the family and we only need one. You have more money than you can ever spend.” …Wladimir nodded in agreement, but he knew, “I said yes, but I was never, ever going to quit. I wanted to be the best heavyweight ever—and that burning desire never left me for a split-second.” A decade later he hasn’t come close to losing again, and believes he’s 5 X better.

Posted November 14, 2012 4:53 pm 


Goosey

Again.. I never said “every Kbros fan”

So?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:49 pm 


Goosey

Herol Graham was a better boxer than Julian Jackson.. What happened here?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:44 pm 


Daly jr

round 2 @ 2:30 seconds vitali threw a left to the body. 1 body shot in 2 rounds. do i need to watch the 3rd round?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:43 pm 


iLuv

Well if YDGAF why the duck did you ask me then?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:39 pm 


SREDMOND

I Luv, I have been calling the Klits HOF boxers forever have you missed that memo? I respect accomplisment and the Klits rule this era…That said Wlad trumps Vitali and Wlad is trumped by a number of boxers, the gaudy record belies a persistent quality deficit saying Sam Peter and maybe Chris Byrd are your best scalps is not impressive when positioned against other fighters… For Gods sake, Byrd was leveled by Ike Ibeabuchi like it was easy as 1,2,3 meanwhile a HUMONGOUS Klits went 9 or 10 and QUIT…. Byrd was damn good but he is not an ATG or even HOF HW scalp, he ended his career losing at LHW or Cruiser I forget…. QUALITY is the Klits deficit

Posted November 14, 2012 4:39 pm 


Daly jr

iluvboys………… I just put match sticks in my eye lids and watched round 1 of Vitali vs Charr, and guess what iluv, VITALI DID NOT THROW A BODY SHOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You said he throws body shots every round. So please explain yourself iluv, are you new to the sport? Would you like me to educate you? Well lets start with the BODY SHOT!!!!! A body shot is when you throw a punch to the body!!!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 4:38 pm 


KL

Well this discussion seems to be going round in circles……. I guess there is no definitive definition of “great boxer”.
Tark, can you truly be a great boxer…….without being a great fighter?

The way I see it there are valid arguments to say the K bros aren’t “great” boxers.
I view the K brothers as very very effective boxers that use their advantages well……..but they don’t have the punch variety or the inside work to be classed as “greats”
Much preferring to just win their fights at distance, an effective strategy….. but doesn’t show case “great” boxing skills.
They will arguable go down as having the best boxing records……….but great boxers………..I’m not convinced.

Posted November 14, 2012 4:38 pm 


Goosey

DILLIGAF

Posted November 14, 2012 4:36 pm 


iLuv

wtf is wrong with saying “sez” anyway? If you prefer I’ll say “says” always, how#s that Goosey?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:35 pm 


Goosey

KBros fans sez “Wach is better than all those old crap HW’s that used to fight B4 Kbros.”

Posted November 14, 2012 4:34 pm 


SREDMOND

Ali was out 3 years during his PRIME NOT by choice and so was Tyson due to prison…The reason that its relevant is that Ali was fighting 15 round fights all thru his 30′s agains TOUGH foes while Vitali was on ice coming back against the likes of Samuel Peter… Ali knew how to box, how the hell else was he able to win 56 bouts and NOT get knocked 3 times or more like Wlad Klits? The dude was NOT a huge puncher so how did he win?? Ali had a terrifically fast jab and pretending he didn’t is nonsense…. Wlad ATE the wrong shots against Brewster, Sanders and Purrity…Difference is that Ali was about 10x tougher than Wlad and did what HW is supposed to do, he ate the blows and kept fighting… The concept of guys NEVER getting hit is NOT realistic and part of Vitalis rep is built off him taking some BIG shots (pretty much from Lewis) or else why would his chin even be discussed had it NOT been tested???

Posted November 14, 2012 4:34 pm 


Goosey

KBros fans sez….

Posted November 14, 2012 4:32 pm 


Goosey

Sorry? Did I say “every” KBros fan?

No..

So?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:32 pm 


iLuv

Goosey, and what? So why did you ask me then if you know I aint every kbros fan?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:30 pm 


iLuv

Sred. Did you say you believe Wlad is currently great? At what ‘point’ did you reach this conclusion?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:29 pm 


TARK

Ali was out for 3 years… Tyson for 4 years… Vitali for 4 years… Louis for 4 years… Foreman for 10 years… Holmes for 5 years… Dempsey for 3 years… Tunney never took a break but quit very early at 31.. “I’m still getting better with each fight, but boxing is a kid’s game—there is nobody at my level anymore to even box—and it’s time for me to become a businessman and get on with my life.” … When a boxer is away from his craft it definitely thwarts the development of his craft and skills. You master something by doing it. Roy Jones was a masterful boxer—a great boxer—but destroyed his reflexes with his fast weight reduction to fight Tarver.. Roy Jones could lay people out with a body shot.. And you never saw a prime Roy eat jabs or hooks like Ali did. Ali was a great fighter — but not a great boxer … I would even call Bowe a very good fighter, but a lousy boxer.

Posted November 14, 2012 4:28 pm 


iLuv

Sred says/asks “And if they were such destroyers why was Vitali UNABLE to ascend at the age of 31 when he faced Lewis and why was Wlad getting blown out 45 fights into his career and damn near out of boxing 48 fights into his career??” Simple answer. Experience. They werent great from their first pro fight. Who was ffs? Fighters peak and excel at different stages. Only a fool would call Wlads loss to Brewster and before that a “prime Wlad”. Dito for VK. They have since BECOME great. Red was LL great in your eyes after Mc Call sparked his ass? At what point and how many fights in did LL get that status in your eyes? And do you think that ‘point’ is the same and has been the same for each fighter in history?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:28 pm 


Goosey

I’m not ‘every Kbros fan’

I never said you were.. I never said you “sez” this TARK….

Posted November 14, 2012 4:27 pm 


Daly jr

Goosey, i was just thinking ‘iluv’ might be Mr Rubes, but since you mention Tark, could be!

Posted November 14, 2012 4:26 pm 


Goosey

iLuv

“Daly sez” .. Tark likes to say say “sez” too… You both must have a lot in common, the pair of you are the only guys on this thread that “sez” this while making a quote…

Hmmm?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:25 pm 


KL

Iluv “Ali said he was the greats and chumps like you lap it up.”…………….are you calling the K bros “chumps” now!!!!! LOL

Posted November 14, 2012 4:24 pm 


iLuv

Daly sez “Vitali Klitschko doing the Ali shuffle!!!!!!!!! Hahahahahaha youtube would shut down! That would be fcookin HILARIOUS!” teah it would probably cause a chuckle or two, as it would the same with most other big guys you care to mention. Bowe, Lewis, Price. How old are you out of curiousity. 14?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:22 pm 


iLuv

I dont know Goosey, why dont you ask them. I’m not ‘every Kbros fan’

Posted November 14, 2012 4:19 pm 


iLuv

Daly sez ‘As a Klitschko fan, how can you criticize Ali for not going to the body much when your heros are robotic, throw straight punches 99% of the time, and hardly EVER go to the body?? especially in Vitalis case’ proving he is both Not a K2 fan and also is lack of knowledge of the sport. Son, VK goes to the body in just about every round, as he has done since his comeback against Peter. He goes to the body 10 times more than Wlad. I’ll finish with you now son since its no use educating someone who hasnt even a basic foundation in the subject. Scan a few youtube vids, read a few books, then get back to us.

Posted November 14, 2012 4:18 pm 


Goosey

iLuv

“Odlanier Solis and Alexander Povetkin also won gold. Would you call them great?”

No.. But KBros fans still call beating Solis a great win, for some reason.. Why is that then iLuv?

Posted November 14, 2012 4:17 pm 


Daly jr

Vitali Klitschko doing the Ali shuffle!!!!!!!!! Hahahahahaha youtube would shut down! That would be fcookin HILARIOUS!

Posted November 14, 2012 4:17 pm 


SREDMOND

This “they would be Crusiers today” argument is another used to act like HW boxing began when the Klits began to become sucessful… And if they were such destroyers why was Vitali UNABLE to ascend at the age of 31 when he faced Lewis and why was Wlad getting blown out 45 fights into his career and damn near out of boxing 48 fights into his career?? Ali was a WORLD Champion and beat the then “MAN” Sonny Liston when he was around 22 years old… Meanwhile all we hear is that “Wlad was still learning boxing” to explain away his historic level of vulnerabilty… Dude was stopped TWICE in 5 bouts by some whatever boxers… Ali was already a legend by the time he was 45 fights into his career.. When did the Klits EVER face the #1 or #2 man of their day??? Ali fought Frazier, Foreman and Liston.. Vitali for all the buzz is a SINGLE beltholder, Holyfield had 2 belts the night he and Lewis fought to Unify…. The Klits have had it EASY post Lewis

Posted November 14, 2012 4:16 pm 


iLuv

Daly you are clearly new to the sport so i’ll give you a pass and a education lesson too. Winning olympic gold dont necessariy a “great boxer” make. Did you know both Odlanier Solis and Alexander Povetkin also won gold. Would you call them great? Beat hof fighters. And? Is that an elite club? I can think of many average boxers in there and many average boxers who have beaten hof fighters. What has winning a “known” fight got to do with anything? LOL. Are you talking about exciting fights Daly? Gatti was in a few back and forth foty candatates, would youi call him great? Daly Ali said he was the greats and chumps like you lap it up. Advice, get to know the sport a bit better then maybe you can critique what actually makes a great fighter instead of rolling off some lines that “sound great”

Posted November 14, 2012 4:14 pm 


Goosey

I just spent a while looking at some of Wach’s other fight on youtube. Then I watched the the Bowe v Holy trilogy.. It was like watching two different sports..

Posted November 14, 2012 4:12 pm 


SREDMOND

Ali was FAR from an average boxer and neither was RJJ, its impossible to divorce an athlete from his gifts…Speed is one of the things that seperates athletes and when its lost a dimension of the athletes game is negated… Ali and RJJ got old but in the interim they wreaked havoc on their foes… That argument is the WORST BS, when they were young RJJ beat worked B-hop and Toney like a pro, and to dismiss his Greatness after getting clipped 50 fights into his career at age 35 is revisionist after 4 weight classes and being fighter of the decade…Ali was not trying to prove Greatness against LAMES like Wach and Mormeck… While Vitali was retired, guys like Ali were still fighting 15 round bouts… The Klits are NOT the standard for Greatness in this sport or excellence they NEVER lifted the belts from the REAL hard men of the prior ERA… (Lewis, Bowe, Holy, Tyson) Dudes were winning from Herbie Hide (WBO) and Chris Byrd….

Posted November 14, 2012 4:10 pm 


KL

iLuv, tell me why do the K bros regard Ali as a great boxer………..they said that Ali was the greatest boxer to hold the belts they wore………. I’d fire off an email to them and tell them that they were wrong! LOL

Posted November 14, 2012 4:08 pm 


Daly jr

What makes a great boxer??? Hmmmmm, winning olympic gold, beating HOF fighters, winning THE 2 best known fights in the history of the sport (thrilla and rumble). That would be a start.

Posted November 14, 2012 4:05 pm 


iLuv

KL, break it down then for me son. What consists a “great boxer” to you? A guy who got gift decisions a few times in his career? Well Ali ticks that box. A guy who was put down on his ass a few times against opponents would would be barely cruisers today? Ali ticks that box. A guy who has next to no body attack to speak of? Yep, another box ticked by Ali. So KL instead of LOLing, why not give us your critique out of what a great boxer maketh?

Posted November 14, 2012 3:58 pm 


TARK

I agree with KL… Ali was a very good boxer…but purely in a technical sense—my list was compiled on objective technical criteria not the historical evaluations of starry eyed pundits—he wasn’t a “great boxer” such as Holmes, Johnson, or Tunney… Boxing is the “Manly Art of Self Defense.” Ali wasn’t a great defender. He was vulnerable to left hooks and jabs, and didn’t have the long-term dedication to developing a great defense.. We see fighters, even in their late 30′s, such as Hopkins, Martinez, and Wladimir who were still passionate about mastering defense, footwork, and getting better range and pop on their jabs and straight power shots—so even as they’re declining physically, they’re improving technically and manage to stay on top of their divisions. Ali was declining physically and his natural gifts of speed, balance, and reflexes started to desert him at 36, he lost to neophyte Leon Spinks, who had all of 7 fights, weighed 197.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:58 pm 


Goosey

KL

“I first saw the K bothers fight many moons ago well before they became champions when my analogue satellite receiver picked up German tv channels for free (No longer though!)”

That brings back good memories.. Those old analogue satellite receiver were great.. Cheers.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:57 pm 


Bidzon

KL – absolutely. I agree, Ali used his natural gifts, he never learned how to box, at best he was average boxer- the moment that “speed” you are talking about gone – he was sitting duck, well, in his case, laying on the ropes duck – was he not??? You can be great boxer without “blazing speed”.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:56 pm 


iLuv

Redmond I don’t think Vitali was at his best against Lewis. Physically he might have been in and around his prime but he still hadn’t faced many top rated guys when compared to LL at the time. Hardly been to that “big dance”, whereas LL was well used to it. I thought VK looked very stiff and awkward in his fights leading up to the Lewis and figured it would be Lewis Grant all over. Vitali surprised me with his pretty good hand speed, counters, heart and chin. No doubt he was outboxing Lewis at the point of the stoppage. They should have had another go. But I’ve been thinking since then, what would a more experienced version of VK have done to LL that night. Only a fool would deny that VK hasnt looked a lot smoother and fluid in his fights against the likes of Arreola, Briggs, and Adamek. Although his last two fights he’s looking like he’s slowing down.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:54 pm 


KL

iLuv Ali being a “great boxer” was a myth LOL
I suppose that’s why so many including the K brothers say that Ali was indeed the “Greatest” boxer.
Ali might of been able to fool the public…….but fellow professional boxers……..NOT likely!

Posted November 14, 2012 3:53 pm 


KL

I first saw the K bothers fight many moons ago well before they became champions when my analogue satellite receiver picked up German tv channels for free (No longer though!)
My first thoughts were………these brothers are very mechanical & robotic like……..BUT very effective!
My thoughts on the K bros hasn’t changed.
Now sure Wlad has pretty good hand speed, but Ali’s hand speed was lightening fast…….and that was the large appeal of Ali his speed……….and I really can’t see either K brother being able to do the Ali shuffle!

Posted November 14, 2012 3:50 pm 


iLuv

KL Ali wasnt a great boxer. Its a myth that he was. He basically never went to the body. Ever. His defense, a bit like RJ was his reflexes and foot speed. When that deserted him he would lie against the ropes for most of the fight trying to counter. He wasnt a terrible boxer either mind, don’t get me wrong. But “the Greatest” (in his mind) was an average boxer when you broke it down.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:47 pm 


Goosey

Hide came out fast versus Bowe as expected, jumping in and out, throwing combinations and outboxing Bowe, as his Dancing Destroyer name suggested he would. The truth is though, Hide started blowing hard from the end of the second round and soon after was up and down like a yo-yo.. Hide boxed well in this fight, and even had Bowe in trouble during round five for a while, but he got beat up in the end.

I am from the UK and I wanted Hide to win, but he got beat up. That is what happened in this fight.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:45 pm 


SREDMOND

These guys have gotten so used to the Klits fighting guys like Mormeck, Charr, Wach, and Tony Thompson that they FORGET what solid matchups between real Champions look like… The best proxy for the Klits against a GREAT fighter is Vitali vs Lewis and where was this impregnable defense? where was Vitali running ruffshod and safely taking NO fire? What happened? he eked out 4 rounds while his face was pounded to mush… How would a fight between the Klits look????? They will NEVER have to answer that question and can build a legacy off of EVERYONE EXCEPT the 1st or 2nd best guy at HW during the ERA…. Laughable

Posted November 14, 2012 3:40 pm 


SREDMOND

Bidzon, we disagree Ali was indeed a GREAT boxer because he was able to prevail against TOP comp and continue on even during adverse circumstances… You guys think the Klits are fast because the guys they face are often SLOW as all hell…It is curious that guys are turning Wlad into a speed demon because he picked apart a CLOD of a boxer… Ali when he was young was fast of hand and foot, he fought guys who ACTUALLY were determined to win Foreman, Frazier, Norton, Lyle as opposed to the many of the Klits foes who really come to get a standing ovation because they threw ONE punch during a 12 round fight… Say what you will Wlad is the guy who was stopped 3 times by unremarkable fighters, Ali during his prime NEVER let a scrub stop him and only succumbed as an OLD man to a GREAT like Holmes… Underestimate him if you will

Posted November 14, 2012 3:36 pm 


KL

“Ali was not a great boxer”………..Bidzon………did you REALLY just say that!!!!
Sure Ali was not as physically big as the big boxers of today……..but to argue that Ali was NOT a great boxer is just silly………next you’d be telling me Foreman was feather fisted!!!

Posted November 14, 2012 3:36 pm 


Bidzon

Sred – Ali was probably the best HW during HIS time. But there is no way ALI could compete with modern behemoths. Little Joe Fraizer was able to left hook Ali over and over and over. And if joe could land so will VK, Wk, LL. yes Ali could take a punch and yes he was brave man but be real Sred if LL, WK land on Ali he would be dead, because remember Fraizer did it. Now, Tark was talking about “GREAT” Hw boxers – Ali was not a great boxer, h#ll without his reflexes he was a punching bag (am I wrong????), LL was great boxer, so are Kbros – look at Ali and look at them what more prove do you need. Absolutely, Ali was more accomplished nobody is arguing that. But Tark was making different point.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:23 pm 


Goosey

TARK trying to tell us all that Wach has a faster jab than Bowe is lol-tastic.

Posted November 14, 2012 3:22 pm 


SREDMOND

ALOT of guys look terrific when they are NOT forced to prove GREATNESS Haye can hit but who was his BEST kill in his SHORT tenure at HW?? He knocked out Derek Chisora who will NOT be making anyones top 50 list of ATG HW fighters… Ali stopped Foreman and Frazier…Its EASY to look at guys in a vacumn… I like Haye but he got the title from a fighter that is NOT well respected and it was not and overwhelming performance… He certainly deserves to fight in THIS era but according him respect over LEGIT Great HW’s is bizzare in the extreme….If all it took was winning UNDER 10 HW bouts and smoking Derek, Chisora, Harrison and Barrett then boxing would have about 500 David Haye equivalents…He is a talented athlete but he is being ranked by TARK alongside guys who history has signed off on for decades… Ludicrous

Posted November 14, 2012 3:19 pm 


SREDMOND

In Tarks world you do NOT have to accomplish ANYTHING you only need to beat Derek Chisora and Nicolai Valuev to be ranked AHEAD of Muhammad Ali, Marciano and Bowe, Tyson, and Holyfield…. How nice it would have been if those fighters did not have to fight the guys they did in order to be ranked BEYOND David Haye? Tark you have hit a NEW low….I think Hayes a talented athleted but his HW tenure is FAR from legendary…. Get real

Posted November 14, 2012 3:04 pm 


SREDMOND

Did ANYONE note that Tark called David Haye a “GREAT” HW boxer????? YET he omits Ali from his list????? How credible is Tark and how seriously can he be taken…. I mean David Haye has had FEWER than 10 HW fights and Tark ranks him AHEAD of Ali and the GREATEST Cruiser to become a 4 time HW Champ in history…. Evander Holyfield…. Any shred of credibility that Tark might have had died with that statement…This is truly embarrassing

Posted November 14, 2012 2:58 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Wurd.

Posted November 14, 2012 2:54 pm 


Anonymous

no one even televiise these bums no hbo showtime and please you know ppv will never put these bums up

Posted November 14, 2012 2:43 pm 


Anonymous

the hw today are so sad no one televises these bums who wants to see this garbage

Posted November 14, 2012 2:42 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you in essence compared Wach to a boxer that despite his foibles is regarded as one of the more dangerous and became Undisputed HW Champion?? You basically said that Wach could beat Bowe and a slew of other boxers by extension…. Bowe beat Holy, Tucker and Donald… You make these assertions when Wach has NEVER defeated a ranked fighter in his life so YES you are GROSSLY inflating Wachs stance and painting him to be GREAT….

Posted November 14, 2012 2:42 pm 


TARK

Obviously Tunney was a great boxer and a few others… I’m not making a comprehensive list… But obviously Wach wouldn’t be on it—it’s just that Sred attributes a lot of ludicrous positions to me, and twists my words, a regular tactic of his.

Posted November 14, 2012 2:39 pm 


TARK

Sred sez…. “Tark thinks Mariusz Wach is a GREAT boxer” … Another pathetic lie by Sred.. I said Wach is big, tall, strong, tough, and a hard puncher.. I certainly never called him a great boxer — or even a good boxer.. There are fewer than 10 great boxers in heavyweight history: Maybe Johnson, Louis, Holmes, Lewis, Haye, and the Klitschkos — too say I said Wach is a great boxer is just a general tactic by Sredmond—always attributing quotes to me that never showed up in any of my posts.

Posted November 14, 2012 2:35 pm 


Anonymous

every hw in today’s game is a bum larry merchant and roy jones talked about the pathetic hw division there is no one out there thay all are uums

Posted November 14, 2012 2:21 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you being stubborn is making you look like a SAD bitter man….Bowe destroyed Herbie Hide and and took his 0 in impressive yet rough fashion…He did what he was supposed to with the smaller man and bullied and overran Hide 4 years before Vitali fought him and tried to build a rep off of one of Bowes OLD retreads… Bowe became Undisputed Champ, whereas Vitali is just a BELTHOLDER, and perinneal #2 man after his brother who’s coattails he rides along with Lewis who he lost to… Like it or not Bowe is defined by a GREAT trilogy with a GREAT fighter whereas Vitali is defined by a 6th round TKO to a GREAT fighter….People talk about Bowe’s wins and they discuss Vitalis loss as his pinnacle…

Posted November 14, 2012 2:18 pm 


SREDMOND

NO Tark, he does NOT have 2 losses EXCEPT in your mind…. Move on, growup and not being able to box in your estimation did NOT make him unable to fight and as for ducking or fighting the BEST HW around when are Wlad and Vitali going to fight instead of taking pathetic options like Charr and Wach?? The Klits have had it easy neither man had to EVER be successful against another GREAT HW and NOW you are bashing Bowe for having 3 wars with Holy??? If Evander was just a silly Crusier then why did he give Bowe HELL for 3 bouts and have a win over every man he faced up until Lewis at age 36??? The Klits and their opponents barely get tested and when they do and FAIL (Vitali vs Lewis) or a guy like Wach striking out horribly against Wlad… You make excuses then give them a pass… Weird

Posted November 14, 2012 2:14 pm 


Anonymous

another european bum in the sorry hw divison how pathetic

Posted November 14, 2012 2:13 pm 


TARK

Right…. 43-1, couldnt box worth a damn, and ducked the best natrual heavyweights of his era…which you admitted he ducked Lewis.. Bowe actually had 2 losses because he was DQ’d against Buster Mathis Jr. after getting thoroughly out-boxed for 3 rounds and fouling out in the 4th … Explain that one to me.

Posted November 14, 2012 1:57 pm 


TARK

Ernie you’re an ignorant jackass… Hide didn’t throw the kitchen sink at Bowe you lying piece.. He boxed him carefully and cautiously like anyone his size who need to do against a much bigger, taller, stronger man.. He easily out-boxed Bowe for the first 2 rounds and much of the 3rd.. Bowe’s only chance, since he knew he couldn’t outbox his much smaller and shorter opponent, was to make it an ally fight … and that’s what he did. He was the one throwing the kitchen sink.

What that shows you is why cowardly Bowe ducked Lewis, who was not only bigger, stronger, and tougher than Bowe, but could box as well as the much smaller Hide.

Posted November 14, 2012 1:51 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Bowe was SOOOOOO easy to beat that he retired 43-1 and was Champion on more than one occasion while also being Undisputed….You cannot substitute your online choreography for REAL World Results…

Posted November 14, 2012 1:45 pm 


SREDMOND

Yeah Tark “All he had to do” but he didn’t!! Hide got destroyed and Bowe took 2 of 3 from Holyfield including the FIRST loss and stoppage of Evanders career…Your online choreography cannot compensate for REAL WORLD results… This is why you and Bears and probably the two MOST ridiculous posters on ESB…. Elevating NO NAMES like Mariusz Wach to legendary status to further your agenda…

Posted November 14, 2012 1:43 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

A lack of knowledge of the sport prevails in most of douchenozzle’s comments. Hide was desperate against the big man so he threw the kitchen sink at Bowe in the first two rounds, which literally did NOTHING, but get him pulverized from there on out. Hide is just the latest in your continued weak attempt to show your wee-wee.

Posted November 14, 2012 1:28 pm 


Daly jr

Tark, whats realy interesting about your reply to me is that you list the fighters Bowe ducked— Lewis, Tyson, Ruddock, Mercer, McCall, Tua. Thats a far stronger list than the list of guys you said would beat Bowe from this era.

Posted November 14, 2012 1:23 pm 


TARK

Sred sez…., “Tark, I agree that Bowe ducked the hell out of Lewis.” …. Then you agree that Bowe was a ducker, a coward, and a four flushing trash talker who didn’t back up his mouth.. Holyfield didn’t have to “sell out” to beat Bowe.. All he had to do was box like he did much of their 2nd fight where he was awarded a strategic win.. Bowe was so easy to out-jab all you needed was a consummate jab, slick countering ability, and some size would have helped Holy … The first 2 rounds of the Hide-Bowe fight WEREN’T “feeling out” rounds.. Hide was busting Bowe’s tail and continued to do so in the 3rd until Bowe forced a mauling brawl on Hide. If you’re feeling somebody out you’re not punching the crap out of them—which is what Hide was doing to Bowe.

Posted November 14, 2012 1:18 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

meh, Thanks for posting that link…

Posted November 14, 2012 1:08 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, I agree that Bowe ducked the hell out of Lewis but who are all the BIG High Quality HW’s that Vitali Klitschko has beat?? Are you gonna rave about him winning 4 rounds off Lewis as if that is the goal in a 12 round fight???…. Vitali has been beating ALL smaller men his whole career and the guy he QUIT against was the smallest (Chris Bryd)

Posted November 14, 2012 12:55 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, ONLY a novice like you is overly impressed by the early feeling out rounds 2 stinking rounds then Bowe caught up with Hide and he took a BEATING from round 3 on…Herbie was smaller and faster which is to be expected… But if Bowe was so slow then how did he catchup to Hide and beat him into submission so quickly?? It took Vitali 10 rounds to get Adamek out of there and he NEVER put Thomas on his knees or BUTT…. Reality is that Bowe walked thru Hides little flurries and crushed him when he was an undefeated fighter…Using that fight to discredit Bowe indicates that your OBVIOUS mental illness is progressing at an accelerated rate… Sheesh..

Posted November 14, 2012 12:53 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Holyfield is GREAT because unlike the myriad PUNKS that operate today he actually CAME to WIN….He was not there to win a few rounds, so in order to compete with Bigger, Stronger fighters he had to do what he had to do in order to get close and land… You guys applaud fools who sit on the end of the SAME jab and SAME one/two from the Klits and don’t cause any trouble…I like Adamek, but he did NOTHING to give himself the slightest shot of winning… Holyfied got hit by Bowe because he had to sell out in order to have a chance…. Purrity, and Brewster BOTH sold out in order to get the shots in to GREAT effect against Wlad…When Chisora ATTACKED Vitali he had the old man stressed and backpedaling….Holy was not “Dumb” he did what it took to win against a guy who had 25 pounds and 3 inches on him….He was a 100 times more brave than Wach who just took punches and barely punched back…. LAME

Posted November 14, 2012 12:47 pm 


TARK

Daly… Yes I do.. Go to Youtube and watch the first 2 rounds of Bowe’s fight with Herbie Hide, a very small heavyweight.. Bowe was in good shape, but so slow and punchable that Hide was boxing the trash out of him.. Only Bowe’s size, strength and rough-housing won the fight for him.. Little Buster Mathis Jr outboxed Bowe easily.. Mathis easily won the first 3 rounds but was knocked out by a foul blow.. Mathis was awarded the fight on the deliberate foul but commission corruption changed it to a No Contest.. Bowe refused to fight Lewis, Tyson, Ruddock, Mercer, McCall, Tua, or any big puncher of his era.. I view him as a coward. Bowe could beat slow, inept, punchable big heavyweights like Golota with great effort—and very small heavyweights like HIde and Holyfield by using his size and strength to overpower them.. He could punch, but he was a very poor boxer.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:44 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you are basing the idea that Helenius would get stopped on Wach being able to take a horrible 12 round beating with NO response from Wlad Klits…You credit Wach with throwing ONE flailing punch and suddenly he deserves a gold star? I am NOT big on Helenius but he has fought the BETTER fighters and had some success, while Brewster, Peter and Sergei were washed up they had some experience and even Chisora was a live body…. Wach has been beating NO ONE that warrants anyone betting he can win above the level he already has displayed competence (D level boxers)….Again Wach is the flavor of the month because you want the Wlad win to take on GREATER importance… Wach will SOON be forgotten, just like he has been up till age 32 as a professional…. Sheesh

Posted November 14, 2012 12:25 pm 


TARK

Helenius looked soft, limp, weak, and slow against Williams.. His movement and speed were horrendous.. He didn’t look like the same fighter who desroyed Liakhovich, Brewster, and Peter, although they were pretty much beaten to death when he fought them.. I don’t think anyone is touting Helenius as the next big thing at this point. If they match him with Wach, or even rematch him with Chisora, he’ll get stopped … At least the way he looked against tubby journeyman Williams.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:20 pm 


Daly jr

TARK, i have a certain amount of respect for you as i consider you to be one of the 2 most passionate posters on this site, the other being Sredmond. But some times you go over-board. Do you honestly beleive the likes of Fury, Chisora, Povetkin, Ibragimov,Jennings, Wilder, Hanks, Mitchell etc etc would have beat Bowe? Really? Im not going to pretend Bowe was an ATG, but as of yet none of those guys even come close. The Ks would have both beat him (unless wlad got tagged on the chin), but you do go a bit crazy some times

Posted November 14, 2012 12:20 pm 


TARK

Wach would beat Bowe.. He’s much bigger and stronger. It would be a fight not a boxing match.. Bowe had a slower jab than Wach and was slower defenisively.. Wach is tougher, taller, bigger, stronger, faster, meaner, punches harder and more fluidly.. Wach also beats Golota.. Golota couldn’t box, take a punch, or defend himself—but beat the crap out of the inept Bowe—and left him in a sorry messed up state. Today’s Heavyweights today who would beat Bowe are: The K’s, Jennings, Wilder, Hanks, Mitchell, Price, Dimitrenko, Chambers, Fury, Haye, Chisora, Povetkin, and Ibragimov … Holyfeld was stupid—he’s a very small heavyweight—if he simply boxed instead of brawled he would have easily whipped the plodding, blundering, bungling Bowe in all three fights… Holyfield was a natural cruiserweight, but still beat the hulking Bowe, fighting Bowe’s fight.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:03 pm 


SREDMOND

Guys need to stop thinking that EVERY tall fighter is going to be the next Klitschko ie Fury,Price, Helenius, Dimentrenko, Wilder, certainly NOT Wach, its possible the NEXT Big Time HW will still be a solid 6″3 to 6″4 with some serious skills…. In my estimation a guy with some FAST hands, and really good power who sacrifices some of the ridiculous bulk we see on alot of these guys will have an advantage….Time will tell but as of today Wlad is the premier HW in the world, but I don’t see equivalent potential in ANY of these current skyscrapers…

Posted November 14, 2012 11:59 am 


huckster

Now, there’s some serious logic. Pulev-Wlad 2013!

Posted November 14, 2012 11:56 am 


SREDMOND

Rod, I see Pulev trying to mix with some of the other relevant names and build towards a shot with a Klit, whereas Price has NOT booked a win over anyone better than Audley Harrison to my eye….The “Tall fighter” argument was an outgrowth of Tarks assertions about Bowe beating a “BigTall HW” and dismissing Bowe’s win over Hide while simultaneously lauding Vitali who beat him 4 years AFTER Bowe….I think the advent of the Klits has EVERYONE giving too many points for being tall and NOT enough for skills… Fact is that ALOT of these tall guys simply are NOT that good!! They are big and create problems but the skills, punch variety, fluidity and speed are sorely lacking…. I give Wlad much credit for being a superior athlete compared to most of these mopes.

Posted November 14, 2012 11:20 am 


SREDMOND

Rod, I give Wlad ALOT more respect than alot of weirdos on this site who try to promote his FAR less accomplished brother as the premier HW of this ERA… Wlad is a terrific fighter and he has been building an important legacy…..He has the defenses, belts and Ring Championship (Vitali does not compare) As for Price and Helenius this is a bit of desperation, David Price is 29 and he has NOT beat anyone of note….Whats the MOST highly ranked competitor he beat??? Helenius has been exposed in my estimation he rightfully should have lost to Chisora and he looked TERRIBLE against a FAT 5″11 journeyman (Sherman Williams) who landed the best punch of the fight…I know guys are desperate for a defining fight but trotting out guys who are just “Tall” and overemphasizing amateur accomplishments vs the BEST HW of the ERA is not going to work…

Posted November 14, 2012 11:12 am 


SREDMOND

Seriously you guys need to consider sunsetting this “he won a few rounds but lost badly or via KO” its literally a SAD argument…Bowe completely dominated and stopped Hide in 6 rounds, If 6 KD’s does not impress you then Oh well…..Wlad beating Brewster for 5 rounds does not impress me, he LOST the bout via TKO…ALOT more was expected, Wlad beating Purrity then getting stopped does NOT impress me… It shows he could NOT close the show vs some serious underdogs…. Getting a hard on because Botha got knocked clean out by Tyson after some early sloppy rounds AGAIN is not overly impressive… Wlad beating a fighter who has NO success against Top 25 competition is nice but its hardly a marker of Greatness…. Wachs a NOBODY we see this when guys step up in class that severely… Mayweather has done this against HOF fighters like Marquez whitewash the guy for 12 rounds…. Wach?? LMAO!!

Posted November 14, 2012 11:06 am 


rod

Sredmon you are very bias but I agree with one thing. Wlad needs to face more tall good opponents. Price, Fury Helenius are out there and Wlad will need to fight one of them soon. I think Price will take wlad. Vitali only faced Timo who was his size and it went 12 rounds. Yeah it is a shame he never faced other 6’7 – 6’8 guys who were around. That is one weakness in Vitali’s resume. Wlad right now is the BEST HW ON THE PLANET. HE IS UNDISPUTED, HE IS THE CHAMP. ALL CONTENDERS MUST PROVE 1) WORTHY TO FACE HIM 2) TAKE THE BELT FROM HIM. Personally I think only two guys out there can do it Price and Pulev. Sredmon, time to give Wlad some respect. He is the champ, he is great.

Posted November 14, 2012 10:48 am 


SREDMOND

Comparing Holyfield to Adamek or any other Crusier who came up to HW is a JOKE and its part of the reason he is an ATG fighter that enjoys MASSIVE respect… He ducked NONE of the big men and fought them all HARD….He went a full 12 rounds with Lennox Lewis TWICE whereas Big Vitali in the prime of his life was only good for 6 bloody rounds then the shower…. Up till he faced Lewis, Holy owned a win over EVERY man he had ever fought and that was not lames like Kingpin Johnson, Sosnowski, FAT Kirk Johnson, we are talking Bowe, Tyson, Moorer, Foreman, and Mercer YEARS before Wlad beat his 41 year old corpse… I have alot of respect for Adamek but he could not hold Evanders JOCK at Cruiser or HW…. To compare Vitali beating him up to Holys stature is nonsensical…. What unification match at HW did Adamek fight in it???

Posted November 14, 2012 10:46 am 


SREDMOND

Really a guy who won the HW Championship 4 times and from a territorial standpoint accomplished MORE than Vitali Klitschko ever has (Becoming Undisputed) he is somehow still a “Blown up Cruiserweight” Hide was a blown up Crusier, he dropped back down for the latter part of his career, Adamek was a blownup Cruiser he never got a title at HW, Gomes was a blown up Cruiser he never accomplished a damn thing at HW…. David Haye at LEAST grabbed a major belt at HW whereas Vitali LOST to the ONLY BLOWN UP LHW he faced (Chris Byrd had to QUIT… Holyfield is a Crusier and HW legend the only man to become Undisputed in BOTH divisions….. Get out a pen and a pad SON….

Posted November 14, 2012 10:31 am 


SREDMOND

Mcbride and Williams got an OLD washed up version of Tyson that was done as a prizefighter… Mike Tyson had ONE loss when Evander Holyfield stepped up and beat him down, he had unified the division and become a historical KO threat….Hence him being seen as the favorite… When have the Klits had to get in the ring as underdog to HOF fighter and win??? Oh I know you are going to tell me that Vitali won 4 rounds from Lewis!!! Before he predictably LOST which was his M.O against high level comp at that time (Byrd, Lewis)….

Posted November 14, 2012 10:24 am 


SREDMOND

Botha, looked terrific till he got knocked clean out with one shot!! LOL you guys kill me lauding guys who win rounds and LOSE fights ie Vitali Klitschko vs Lewis and Byrd, Wlad Klitschko vs Purrity and Brewster…. Learn boxing winning rounds does NOT mean a damn thing UNLESS you can close the deal and win the fight….:)

Posted November 14, 2012 10:20 am 


gym rat

the monkey says ” But alas he was a GREAT fighter, stepped his game up and took Mike out” And so did Busther Douglas, Lewis, Mac Bride, Williams. Have I left anyone out? LOL. Wasnt Botha outboxing Tysons ass for 4 1/2 rounds before landing a lucky punch

Posted November 14, 2012 9:01 am 


gym rat

what was so special about the ducking donkey bowe anyway? He beat a blown up cruiser weight with no punch. Heart yes but no punch. How long was the reign of bowe Sreddy? How many defences did he make sreddy? Is he in the hof sreddy? The only reason Holy was a champion was coz he had EASY marks to beat at championship level. If he was round during the K2 stranglehold he would be beaten from pillar to post. But that in your spliff and smoke it. moneky

Posted November 14, 2012 8:58 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, you say that “Bowe never beat a big strong HW like Lewis” neither did Wlad or Vitali Klitschko the guys Timo Hoffman, Wach and Thompson were WEAK unheralded fighters so whats your point?? Thompson was Wlads old sparring partner for god sake, and he said he realized he was NOT strong enough to compete with Klits back then and he NEVER was during professional fights….You give Bowe slack for being 6″5 and beating a guy like Holy… Whats up with Vitali being 6″8 and beating on a NON HW Champ like Adamek who looked like his son in the ring??? When Vitali got in with a BIG HW he got beatup to the face worse than ever and lost…. Wlads version of a “Big strong HW” is a relative SCRUB that you are trying to rank over guys who became Undisputed Champ… What a JOKE!!

Posted November 14, 2012 7:58 am 


SREDMOND

Bears and Tark, I know you guys think beating Samuel Peter and Mariusz Wach ranks right up there with Bowe taking Holyfields 0 or Holyfield handing Tyson his second and 3rd defeats (first by massive upset TKO) but the reality is that you are delusional… NO ONE will remember Peter and definitely NOT Wach who never was a Champion or beat anything that resembed a ranked fighter…. Tysons in the Hall and Holy is going…. Wachs going to go back to being a sparring partner

Posted November 14, 2012 7:53 am 


SREDMOND

Bears, beyond the lumbering HW’s of this era you are BARELY a boxing fan, I have seen you try to get up to speed on other divisions but your knowledge is a bit above a novices.. Reciting OLD commentary about Mayweather and others… Your answer as to why Sanders was so fast was “I googled it” LOL…..For the record Holyfied was 3-3 leading up to Tyson having gone thru a 3 fight war with Bowe and losing to Moorer, most thought he was a spent force and that Tyson was gonna stop him …… But alas he was a GREAT fighter, stepped his game up and took Mike out…. Tark will say “Tyson had trouble with Big tall guys” FACT is most guys that Tyson beat were taller, and Holy at 6″2 was not especially tall and the perception was that Tyson was gonna chop him down…How wrong they were…

Posted November 14, 2012 7:50 am 


SREDMOND

Bears, if you say “Holyfieds scalp ain’t worth much” then you basically say the Klits have ONLY defeated complete GARBAGE because Ring Mag and most credible scribes consider Evander one of the Greatest fighters to ply his trade at HW… I know, I know becoming HW Champion 4 times, engagiing in some of the most epic battles of the time, having a ton of Championship fights, beating Foreman, Moorer, Bowe, Tyson 2X and Mercer is something that Sam Peter did as wel??? Evander Holyfield is an ATG, and the Klits don’t own a win over SINGLE fighter of his caliber, he redefined “tough” and NEVER quit against guys like BIG Bowe or Lewis whereas we had Klitschko waving the white flag against a former LHW…. Yeah in the history of boxing sorry to tell you, Evander Holyfield is a pretty big deal he was Undisputed Champ…. When did Vitali unify? or even Wlad FULLY unify the WBC and WBA?? Seriously you don’t know boxing

Posted November 14, 2012 7:34 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, your argument is weak and Hides 2 rounds of looking decent culminated with him beginning to hit the ground in the 3rd round and from there it was pretty much doomsday till he was knocked out after being down 6 times… Bowe basically made him quit, Hide either would not or could not get up after his final trip to the canvas and he was outta there… This is the problem with your bizarre analysis your mind gets locked in a couple of feeling out rounds where Hide produced no KDs and being the smaller quicker guy got off some nice combos… But the NET result of all that was futility because he was badly beaten and suffered his 1st loss at the hands of Bowe…. Only a sad guy looking for a way to dredge up credit would harp on about a guy who was hitting the canvas after the second round and basically in trouble for MOST of the fight….. WEIRD

Posted November 14, 2012 7:24 am 


TARK

So Bowe has as many losses as Lewis and Vitali with fewer fights… And he never beat a big, strong, tall heavyweight, such as Lewis, who had great skills… Hide was a relative midget and outboxed Bowe by a million miles until Bowe started rabbit punching and mauling.. Naturally if the referee lets you wrestle, push, throw, rabbit punch, and maul you can beat a much smaller and weaker man… The sport is Boxing … and that is NOT Boxing.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:30 am 


TARK

Bowe is not 43-1… Not only did he refuse to fight the best heavyweights his size, he lost to Buster Mathis Jr.. He was getting badly outboxed by Buster Mathis Jr. and fouled Mathis deliberately, causing the referee to DQ him and award the win to Mathis.. This was overruled by the corrupt commission, and you know how corrupt Boxing is in the US.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:22 am 


TARK

You’re being ridiculous… Hide outboxed Bowe by a very wide margin in the first 2 rounds, hitting him at will.. If they were the same size Hide would have knocked Bowe out.. Slow assed Golota hit Bowe almost at will—especially in the balls.. My point is Bowe was a terrible defender, not that Bowe couldn’t absorb a whole lot of punishment and survive to physically beat down a much smaller and weaker man.. It was a battle of attrition for Bowe. If you want a long career on Boxing, and a great life after Boxing; where you can be productive and contribute to the world instead of being a burden on society — then you should learn how to box instead of sucking up punishment like punching bag Bowe did… Wladimir keeps getting better—more than 16 years after he signed his first pro contract.

Posted November 14, 2012 12:17 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, no one disagrees that Bowe was not disciplined and that he had to get out of the game early but he accomplished alot and retired 43-1 which is pretty damn impressive considering the booked 2 wins over a prime Holy and booked his only loss to Holy…Wlad has certainly righted himself and excelled since his first 48 fights but that is a LONG time into his career!!! You cannot pretend he was not getting laid out by Sanders in fight 40, stopped by Brewster fight 45, and then bouncing off the canvas by Peter (3X) fight number 48.. Its just asinine to use a fight like Hide to try and paint Bowe as a scrub… Meanwhile you are RAVING about how Wach eats punches like skittles…???? Learn the sport!

Posted November 14, 2012 12:05 am 


SREDMOND

Tark, bottomline is that you are trying to use a fight where Bowe had Hide in trouble by round 3 and bouncing off the canvas again and again as proof he is a bad fighter? He simply stalked Hide, walked him down and destroyed him the first time he EVER lost… You write off Wlads losses as if they never happened, but fact is they are part of a sorrid and very relevant part of his career… Like I said you are trying to ding Bowe for WAXING Hide but you want to applaud or grant amnesty to Klits for getting stopped 2x in a 5 fight span, one with the GREAT Steward in his corner wondering WTF??

Posted November 13, 2012 11:56 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

“Dude is weird”…understatement of the week right there…

Posted November 13, 2012 11:47 pm 


TARK

Wladimir lost 3 fights.. Rahman KO’d Lewis and stopped Sanders, after being hurt and knocked down himself by Sanders, for his best 2 wins to go along with many losses.. All of Wladimir’s losses were before he learned anything well embedded from Manny Steward.. Wladimir had horrendous holes in his game … He’s a different and much better fighter today, and even you realize that. Wladimir whipped guys like Haye, Peter, and Chambers who are much better the guys who beat him.. Wladimir keeps improving his technical skills 16 years after he turned pro—at an age where Bowe was becoming punch drunk because he never learned defensive skills and loaded everything.. Even Buster Mathis Jr was easily out-boxing Bowe before he was hit with an intentional foul blow from Bowe.. Bowe was very easy to hit, very undisciplined, very slow defensively, and became a tragic case because he was so easy to hit and absorbed too many head punches.

Posted November 13, 2012 11:33 pm 


Anonymous

gymrat…Cobb was in the ring against decent fighters before he faced Holmes..and Cobb had some ringmanship.Cobb was not worldclass by no means but he knew the game some..unlike this 32yr old clubfighter Wach who never stepped-up and has no skills.God I think if the K-bros signed to fight Chumlee from porn stars…some guys would say well hes never lost and he is a big guy a full blown hvwt….lol and I do like the K-bros…but really.

Posted November 13, 2012 11:01 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Bowe DESTROYED Hide, by your logic how much more credit to Hasim Rahman deserve for knocking out Sanders as opposed to Wlad getting blown out in 2 rounds?? Lets hear your excuses about not getting warmed up and tell us how Sanders was a “Great” fighter? Nonsense…. Wach is another C level opponent who came out of nowhere to fight a Klit…

Posted November 13, 2012 10:54 pm 


SREDMOND

In Tarks book he gives Wlad more credit for getting TKOed by 3 unremarkable fighters than he gives Bowe for knocking out the unbeaten Herbie Hide?? Tarks logic is backward, he is praising the hell out of a C level fighter like Wach and dismissing a former Undisputed HW Champion…. Dude is weird…

Posted November 13, 2012 10:51 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark you are a RIDICULOUS guy that really is borderline beneath conversation,,, You bash Bowe who was a legit Undisputed HW Champion of the World and who beat Holyfield twice, stopping him the ONLY time in his prime… But you want us to sit around and listen to you laud a scrub boxer like Mariusz Wach by comparison… You say Bowe sucked because he KNOCKED Hide out….. Hmmmmmm what are we to say about Wlad who got knocked out by 3 unremarkable boxers?? One of them a BUM? Now explain to us how awesome Klits looked before he got stopped by a C plus level boxer like Sanders and a BUM like Purrity??? But Bowe is terrible because he knocked out Hide in 6 rounds?? You are illogical to the extreme…

Posted November 13, 2012 10:49 pm 


It’s Me, Ernie

Big Daddty whipped Hide’s hide from pillar to post…

Posted November 13, 2012 10:27 pm 


TARK

Great video Huskster….. Bowe loved to talk trash to Lewis — but was scared to death to fight him. Lewis would have smashed Bowe in the first round like he did Golota as they were both punks.. I always heard Bowe was afraid of certain heavies: Mercer, McCall, Ruddock, Tyson, Lewis, Tua, mainly big, strong, tough heavyweights who could punch a ton—but the fear of Lewis was real because he threw a championship belt in a garbage can rather than fight mandatory LL and fought Jesse Ferguson for a lot less money … Bowe was being badly out-boxed and embarrassed by Buster Mathis Jr—so he landed a brutal and intentional foul blow while Mathis was on one knee … Bowe lost that fight on a foul—but he had political pull and it was ruled No Contest …. Anon – I know you’re Sred.

Posted November 13, 2012 9:56 pm 


Anonymous

Tark you bloody fool. I can’t believe after the beat downs you’ve taken on this site from all/sundry, you’d still step to this site to offer you uninformed tripe. You must be a masochist. That is; obviously you are.

Posted November 13, 2012 9:31 pm 


Unbiased Dane

lol Saunders never fought a Klitschko

Posted November 13, 2012 8:20 pm 


gym rat

doc the difference with that link is that holmes Allowed Cobb to press forward and throw leather. you honestly think wlad would have allowed cobb to dictate the tempo like that? Hell cobb wouldnt have seen 5 rounds against wlad. wlad has the footwork, the skill,s the Game to Dictate. the reason your rarely seeing guys amount a decent attack on a bro is coz they aint Allowed to.

Posted November 13, 2012 8:05 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, the reality is that Hide got dominated by Bowe first then Vitali he was not a guy beating world class comp but Bowe got him first…If you have to try and build Vitali too much off of Hide, you betray the weakness of his resume..

Posted November 13, 2012 6:02 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark you cannot undersell Bowes performance against Hide, he had him down 6 times in 6 rounds and stopped him when he was an undefeated fighter… A few tough moments are what they are but your boy Vitali got his 4 years later… You always cry foul when a guy you are trying to support gets beat up…ie Lewis was dirty, Bowe was dirty when he beat up Hide, you are beyond full of it… Bowe took Hides 0 and Vitali took Bowes leftover (Hide 4 years later)

Posted November 13, 2012 5:54 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you love to create narratives for fighters how the held do you know what Wach wanted to do? Reality is that Grant knocked him out in 3 and then Wach got him(Fields) in 6 rounds.. You act like you have been following this dudes career like a hawk, you are full of it because you NEVER mentioned him before Wlad decided he wanted to beatup a taller man…Do you think you are fooling anyone?

Posted November 13, 2012 5:51 pm 


TARK

Right… Tye Fields has no chin… I’ve said that a million times… Fields was as chinny as that bum Golota, who was often knocked out quickly as well … Wach wanted to get some rounds in because Fields had Klitschko like size and was trained by Manny Steward. If you’re aiming for a Klitschko you want to get a few rounds in with a Steward trained heavyweight who’s 6’8″ X 250.

Posted November 13, 2012 5:21 pm 


doc

One other point: Showing heart doesn’t mean just walking forward and getting punched in the face. It also means trying to win by fighting back.

Posted November 13, 2012 4:58 pm 


huckster

PULEV-WLAD 2013!

Posted November 13, 2012 4:50 pm 


Halberstram

SREMOND is just pathetic.

Posted November 13, 2012 4:45 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, you were raving about common opponents, even and OLD Michael Grant who YOU just knocked stopped one of Wachs big names (Tye Fields) in 3 rounds a YEAR before Wach did it in 6 rounds… AGAIN the attempts and rebranding Wach are not going to work…

Posted November 13, 2012 4:39 pm 


huckster

Wach is tenderized now and ready for cooking.

Posted November 13, 2012 4:34 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, suddenly you would bet on Wach against ANY boxer not named Klitschko your motives are transparent!! if this man was so terrific why have we NOT been discussing him before and how does a beating where he made Wlad look like he could not miss make him terrific??? Golota lost to Brewster LONG after he was done as a fighter and the reality is that Golota had been in with a NUMBER of World Class fighters… Yes Lewis blew him out, he was the LAST Undisputed HW Champion of the World…. Golota fought Bowe 2x, Tyson, and Lewis…. Grant beat him when Grant was WORLD RANKED and undefeated.. Wach has fought BUMS then got beat up by Wlad…He is a nobody, not even a contender he was a prospect…. Golota fought Bowe to death and Bow had been an Undisputed Champ with ONE close loss to ATG Holyfield on his record… Wachs NO ONE

Posted November 13, 2012 4:16 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Bowe put Hide down what 6 times and he stopped him 4 years BEFORE Klits beat him… I don’t consider him a big deal but the fact remains Bowe got to him first and smashed him… Vitali fought the leftover… FACT

Posted November 13, 2012 4:10 pm 


SREDMOND

HitMachine, where was this head shot?? Are you giving Wach credit because he did NOT get hit with EVERY single shot?? Jesus the bar is SOOOOOOOO Low that any club fighter could hit the mark absent going down… Where was this head movement? Rafael and Co were remarking on how he was not moving head… And as for speed the guy looked like he was made of clay….I have seen bodies with Rigor Mortis move faster..

Posted November 13, 2012 4:06 pm 


top hat

that

Posted November 13, 2012 4:03 pm 


top hat

wach wast thay slow? Wach was soooooooo slow he stoped

Posted November 13, 2012 4:02 pm 


???

“LOL Wach’s team tried to cheat, one glove was missing some padding …” … your wrong, the glove contained two big bricks, a saw, 3 horse shoe, and an elephant, you can clearly see them thru the entry when Vitaly tried to pull them out but failed, that is why he ordered to change the glove.

Posted November 13, 2012 3:43 pm 


Hitmachine

Lenny had HARDER jab, but when you think it overall as accurate, speed, power and punching rate Wlad owns better jab than no other.
Wach was not as slow as many (especially Sredmond) say and he had quite good head movement so that he was able to avoided many Wlads’ hard right hands. Truth is however that so many really good straight right met its target and Wach didn’t went down and not even wobbled badly. This rise a question that has Wlad start his way to downhill because what boxer lose first is explosives of his punch .

Posted November 13, 2012 3:42 pm 


top hat

He blew his chance because instead of punching wlad he spent the whole night getting beat up. Wlad thinks he looked good smashing a guy who is levels below championship level.

Posted November 13, 2012 3:40 pm 


TARK

My money is on Wach in any fight against Golota… Golota was so slow, inept, and so wide open he got his head ripped off by Lewis and Brewster in one (1) minute each—and Golota quit after 2 rounds of getting punched non-stop by Mike Tyson.. Super slow Michael Grant proved faster than Golota and made the Foul Pole quit after he beat him to the canvas with lumbering punches.. Wach has a great chin and Golota has a relatively vulnerable chin.. This would be a messy, sloppy contest where both fighters would score hard punches—but Wach’s physical toughness, height, reach, and heart would prevail after a few rounds of crude brawling.

Posted November 13, 2012 3:12 pm 


SREDMOND

Bears, Thompsons opponents were TRASH absent Witherspoon who was his BEST win over that span…The guy Thompson beat PRIOR to facing Klits the SECOND time was Maurice Harris who had a sparkling record of 24-14-2…..Still wanna talk about the fodder he was beating leading up to Wlad like Owen Beck?? :)

Posted November 13, 2012 2:58 pm 


SREDMOND

Bears, Larry Donald beat Holyfield when he was an OLD man and everyone knows he was washed up…You will say “But Vitalis 41″) but then we have to ask why YOU try and sell a 41 year old Vitali as TOO vulnerable now to face the far smaller David Haye?? Holy had been booking losses at that point, Vitali has not lost in what 10 years (including retirement) as standing Champ why not face Haye if he chooses to keep boxing??? Ah the myriad double standards of ESB fool Bears

Posted November 13, 2012 2:53 pm 


SREDMOND

Golata was a BETTER fighter than Wach get a grip… Wach NEVER beat nor looked decent against ANY top ranked fighter AGAIN you seek to confer attributes upon this soon to be forgotten fighter because you are desperate to make Wlad look good… Face facts he was a PUNCHING BAG and thats about it…. As for Tyson losing to a guy like Holyfield, Evander is an ATG fighter as was Lennox Lewis and since you want to reference Tysons height as a handicap then why did Wach NOT make more of himself and his career?? I know you will say “he is undefeated” YES fighting guys who are NOT even in the top 20…Wach is BEYOND slow and any honest fight fan can see that…

Posted November 13, 2012 2:37 pm 


SREDMOND

Bears, you probably did not even see Larry Holmes fight, you are a fanboy who has limited perception… You see Wlad in the ring with a guy who is a tad slower than a statue and you want to discuss “how fast he is” a YOUNG Lewis was faster in combination than Wlad is get real….Before its all said and done you will say that Wlad is faster than RJJ… LOL Klits jab is NOT the best, it is terrific but Lewis was better as was Holmes… Lewis was moving a man like Vitali BACK with his jab you are tweaking out of your mind because Wlad beat a C level fighter like Wach…..Pathetic

Posted November 13, 2012 2:33 pm 


BEARS

who were the world class opponents foreman beat to fight holyfield in the early 90s and morrison in the mid 90s? was larry donald beating world class fighters when he wooped holyfields ass? LOL. continue eating your klitschKO man meat sandwiches sredmond. we know you cant get enough klitschko sack. bhaahahahahahahaahahah. If you have a problem with tony thompson ko’ing his last 5 or 6 opponents and through the ibf/ibo’s elimination process becoming number one contender. take it up with the ibo/ibf and the contenders in the organization who were all offered to fight for number one contender spot. Like pulev has now done in his success in his eliminators. If yo have a problem with a heavyweights “VOLUNTARY’ defenses. take it up both the people that pay millions to watch such contests as wlad vs mormek and the sanctioning bodies that give their champs the FREEDOM to voluntarily “defend”. numbskull

Posted November 13, 2012 2:28 pm 


TARK

Tyson didn’t outscore any prime slick boxing heavyweights who were great big and tall… Douglas, Lewis, and Holyfield had a field day on Mike because Tyson lacked a superior jab, superior defensive finesse, and was a midget… As far as Holyfield is concerned the slow, lumbering, dumb, wide open Bowe beat EH 2 out of 3 for the simple reason that Bowe’s much bigger and stronger… But Bowe couldn’t out-box the inept stumble bum Golota—who is much SLOWER than Mariusz Wach. Golota couldn’t escape KO blows for even a minute against the faster Lewis and Brewster.. Cowardly Bowe refused to fight Lewis although he’s younger than LL.. The best heavy to come out of that lame era was LL, who was KO’d by Rahman and McCall and was outboxed by Vitali through six…

Posted November 13, 2012 2:24 pm 


BEARS

wlad has the best jab. If we were putting together an ideal heavyweight ther is no doubt he would have wlads left jab and strait right. holmes did not use it better and holmes was nowhere near as powerful. i dont believe holmes jab was faster either. holmes jab will not do more damage than a wladimir klitschKO jab. it will not set them up like a wladimir klitschko jab. it just wont have anywhere close to theeffect a a wlad klitschko jab has and a wlad kltschko jab is more durable and has more resilience. ex. apparently holmes hurt himself using his jab and was never the same again.

Posted November 13, 2012 2:20 pm 


Swedish Boxing Fan

Mariusz Watch did the best he could end took the champion by huge suprise with his iron chin. Watch sure haves good power in his right hand and that is his best weapon, but don’t you think Wladimir Klitschko knowes that? Seriusly now, if it is something Wladimir have learned now in his pro career is this of many things – NEVER UNDERESTIMATE AN OPPONENT! He knew from the start what Watch game plan would be like and Wladimir is now an expearenced champion and knew exacly what to do to defeat Watch and Wladimir pulled of it all right with style, skills and power. Watch did alot better in the title fight then millions of people expected him to be and he made all 12 rounds, took over 420 punches and still was dangerous to tangle with in the 12th and final round so no, don’t criticise him like this, he did the best he could but Wladimir is the best heavyweight in the world and Watch can’t compete with him, but belive me, Watch will now get more lucrative fights then before becouse now he have made a name for himself as an decent contender and have won new fans and critics respect for his hearth and determination to fight hard. I belive Wach will get another shot in WBC rank after Vitali have retired, but hey that belt will and should land in Wladimir Klitschko’s hands as he have the rest and deserves all belts. Chris Arreola, Alexander Povetkin, Tyson Fury, Odlianer Solis? They don’t dare fight Wladimir so they don’t deserve to hold a world title belt as long Wladimir is the champ and rules the heavyweight ranks.

Posted November 13, 2012 1:52 pm 


SREDMOND

Bears, where do I say that “Holy was better at HW” what I do say is that he fought and BEAT BETTER fighters than Wlad and Vitali combined… I do say that he had faster hands than Klitschko but obviously not the reach and mass of either man… There is a strong case that Holy did more at HW than Vitali Klitschko who AGAIN peaked at beating Samuel Peter?? Beating Sam Peter is NOT a marker of Greatness in isolation….Evander’s career is laden with RISK at HW, whereas Vitali put himself out there ONCE and LOST to YOU KNOW WHO in the process

Posted November 13, 2012 1:38 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Wlad is in there with guys like Wach, Mormeck and Thompson II and what did ALL these fighters have in common?? NONE of them have been beating ranked HW’s and they were going against the champ… Again I am not fooled, Wach presented NO threat beyond being able to look Wlad in the eye…Klits has still not prevailed against a GREAT opponent and that will always cast somewhat of a shadow on his accomplishements… Again his last 3 opponents were NOT successful against World Class boxers..And try as you might all opponents are NOT created equal…

Posted November 13, 2012 1:33 pm 


SREDMOND

Bears, Holyfield, Tyson, and Haye are faster than Wlad thats EASY to see… Klits is getting pegged as “Mayweather fast” by novices like you because he fought a guy who could not be SLOWER if he tried…Larry Holmes was 6″3 which is different than 6″6 1/2. I believe in 60 pro bouts Wach was the FIRST guy taller than Wlad or even his height?? Larry Holmes jab was incredible and his timing and skill with it were amazing… Wlad does have one of the more dangerous right hands I have seen, but I would bank on Lewis with a combo more than most….

Posted November 13, 2012 1:28 pm 


TARK

Sred…. Holmes had the best jab ever, but it’s pretty close.. Holmes tore his left biceps a few days before the Norton fight and tore it up it severly during their fight. “I couldn’t spar or train, and word leaked out to the Norton camp.. I got intensive medical treament on the arm as was able to jab well for five or six rounds.. But it kept getting worse and worse. I ended up brawling like crazy because the jab wasn’t working real well.” He always had the same pop on it, but he could never retract it as fast after that … Shavers, Snipes, Witherspoon, Michael Spinks, Tyson, Holyfield, McCall, Mercer and others caught Larry with major right hands because he had to retool the punch so much..

You can’t get a right hand off against Wladimir anymore.. Chambers and Haye were practically shut out.. Chambers said, “My jab is great, but Wladimir’s jab is unbelievable.”

Posted November 13, 2012 1:20 pm 


SREDMOND

How do these guys make it to 29 and 32 fighting hopeless fighters??? Price is fighting fodder next his record suggests he is not ready to face a guy like Wlad… I am starting to pickup the trend, you guys are mesmerized with almost ANY BIG fighter who can compile a record against LOW level competition… Reality is that you think Helenius, or Price will be the next Wlad or Vitali meanwhile these guys are not booking those type of wins…

Posted November 13, 2012 1:19 pm 


BEARS

Another day another klitschko wang in redmonds mouth. Good morning all BEARS is here to say wlad klitschko IS that fast as emanuel steward said he was. Wlad nulified hayes speed and forced haye to run. For redmond to act like holmes wasn’t tall is pathetic. For redmond to whip out some generic post on wlads dimintions followed by what was essentially “holmes didn’t have to be wlad to do it” wlads jab iss the best o all time we all know it same as his strait right. That’s why wlad is the most talented in stewards book. Speed and striking. Holyfield was not by any means faster and holy was a feather fist which means at heavy, feather fists are looooooooow on the totem pole. Holy was the best cruiser. To start calling holy a better heavy than the klitschkos means again your a fool. A hater. Can u believe this sredmond comes on to east daily for ample helpings of klitschko meat in his mouth? Redmond must like it

Posted November 13, 2012 12:56 pm 


Unbiased Dane

meh: if Price is reday why does he fight some old hopeless fighters like Sexton, Harrisson and Skelton ?

Posted November 13, 2012 12:33 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, Wlad is a terrific fighter but if you want to talk about jabs, Larry Holmes was unbelievable and he could snap a mans head for 15 rounds with it… He booked 48 straight wins with that weapon and he did not need to be 6″6 1/2 to employ it…. Don’t get lost in the moment Wlad is NOT faster than David Haye as a HW or even Evander Holyfield (prime) he is unusual because despite his size he does move very well….

Posted November 13, 2012 12:28 pm 


SREDMOND

Tark, if you have “never” seen a faster right hand from a HW then you have NOT watched much HW boxing… Wlad is fast for a man his size but he is not a speed demon by any stretch.. You saw him in the ring with a guy who is extra slow… Alot of times he was simply punching through Wachs porus guard which is a testament to his strength and power as opposed to lightning fast hands… A prime Mike Tyson could hit a HW in combination faster than Wlad can get off one shot…Wlad had almost no real incoming fire to contend with against Wach, that sure makes it easier to tee off…

Posted November 13, 2012 12:18 pm 


TARK

Price is not ready for Wlad.. Pulev is closer, and he’s taking on the toughest heavyweights who will get into a ring with him — and stopping them.. But Kubrat wants a few more fights if possible so he can let Wladimir age a couple more years.. I believe Wladimir hit his career peak in this fight, as far as a combination of youth and skill — I don’t see him getting better at 36 with Manny Steward gone.. This fight will give Pulev, Price, Haye, and other contenders pause as to just what they have to do to beat Wlad.. I’ve never seen a better jab, a faster or more unreadable straight right from a heavyweight, or better and faster footwork from a man that size..

Posted November 13, 2012 11:40 am 


the voice of reason

Rod – are you serious in saying that price would beat wlad?? come on man! now what i would like to see is price vs wach! – theres a fight that makes sense. Lets see how good price really is.

Posted November 13, 2012 11:25 am 


Matthews

If he faces Price he might even lose. SMH, And Price has fought who????

Posted November 13, 2012 10:57 am 


SREDMOND

Some of you guys are saying “Wach would have given 95% of heavies trouble” that statement is highly misleading because is this is a credible statement then where are Wachs wins against ranked opposition??? The guy is 32 years old and he is beating on Tye Fields and Kevin Mcbride…Wach was NOT on the tip of ANYONES tongue before and the only reason he is after is because he took a high profile beatdown from Wlad…If the measure of success against a Champion is being offensively inept and defensively wide open then Wach is the MAN!!! I know you guys need an angle to oversell him but there is none, when he talks to his grandkids one day he will say “I went 12 rounds getting punched in the face by Wlad Klits and I did not fall”…. Beyond that anyone who cares for Wach had to find that fight difficult to watch… No rematch necessary

Posted November 13, 2012 10:56 am 


rod

Wlad is freaking awesome……………….saying that I think Price would beat him and Pulev would also give him a hell of a fight. Everyone else NO

Posted November 13, 2012 10:56 am 


SREDMOND

If we are going to laud EVERY boxer who has a punchers chance then why not put ANY HW with anything that resembles a punch in the ring with Wlad? Right now there is some guy knocking out club fighters in rapid succession and the minute he steps up he is going to be blown out of the ring by a Wach type…. The GAP in class between Wach and even Wlad opponents like Chambers, Byrd, Chagaev and Haye is painfully clear…. Its time to let this guy go back to beating on C and D level fighters and stop trying to paint him as a potential Champ who was cruelly turned back by Wlad Klits… Wlad has fought MUCH better comp than this guy and prevailed…

Posted November 13, 2012 10:25 am 


SREDMOND

Wach missed his chance because he should have had a German Luger or a Colt 45 in his waist and blasted Wlad in the first round…Wach did NOT throw punches because he was not in the ring with the terrible opponents he has faced while padding his record.. He is NOT a World Class fighter, his prior opponents were NOT World Class fighters yet he is gonna go in there and outbox the best HW of the past 7 years?? Wach is not a savant, he is 32 and he has never beaten a well ranked fighter and GOD he is SLOW… Wlad did his job, but he did it against a NO HOPER and saying a guy has a punchers chance does not make the term “No Hoper” a misnomer..

Posted November 13, 2012 10:16 am 


theyiddo

Wach did not blow his chance by not throwing enough punches….he blew his chance by not being able to throw punches. He is a truly terrible boxer, and does not even have the ability to throw a jab properly.

Posted November 13, 2012 9:57 am 


Matador

Yep, another one of those “all you have to do to beat Wlad is punch” article. Very astute. Did you watch the fight? Wach did go crazy when he had Wlad stunned. And he didn’t “allow” Wlad to clinch. Wlad just covered up extremely well. He’s that good. And now you can’t say all he has is heaight because he used superior boxing skills to beat a taller guy. Deal with it.

Posted November 13, 2012 9:03 am 


rod

Wach did his best. Wlad is simply a much better athelet with much more advanced boxing skills. It was a good fight, we got to see Wlad chop down a taller guy who can punch. If Wlad faces Fury or Helenius he will have a slightly harder time. If he faces Price he might even lose. Wach would give 95% of heavies trouble………but not Wlad

Posted November 13, 2012 8:43 am 


Swedish Boxing Fan

This is just filled with unjust and ignorance in my oppinion. Mariusz Watch did the best he could end took the champion by huge suprise with his iron chin. Watch sure haves good power in his right hand and that is his best weapon, but don’t you think Wladimir Klitschko knowes that? Seriusly now, if it is something Wladimir have learned now in his pro career is this of many things – NEVER UNDERESTIMATE AN OPPONENT! He knew from the start what Watch game plan would be like and Wladimir is now an expearenced champion and knew exacly what to do to defeat Watch and Wladimir pulled of it all right with style, skills and power. Watch did alot better in the title fight then millions of people expected him to be and he made all 12 rounds, took over 460 punches and still was dangerous to tangle with in the 12th and final round so no, don’t criticise him like this, he did the best he could but Wladimir is the best heavyweight in the world and Watch can’t compete with him, but belive me, Watch will now get more lucrative fights then before becouse now he have made a name for himself as an decent contender and have won new fans and critics respect for his hearth and determination to fight hard.

Posted November 13, 2012 7:40 am 


John Melendez

Hats off to Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay LeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeenOOO for his toughness in this fight. Haye would have never taken a beating like that and took the easy way out and flopped and ran and got paid more than Wach will ever see. Sad.

Posted November 13, 2012 5:38 am 


the voice of reason

this guy wach must have one of the strongest chins in heavyweight history – the pounding he took was unbelievable. Klitschko looked truly awesome to me – but the guy wouldnt go. As for wach not letting his hands go – i totally disagree – he tried his best, but wladimir was simply too good. But man, hats off to his courage

Posted November 13, 2012 5:24 am 


nemo

so many ifs…. what a crap.

Posted November 13, 2012 4:54 am 


Op Amp

I blew my chances by not driving to Hollywood last weekend and asking out Angelina Jolie! Lol

Posted November 13, 2012 4:08 am 


huckster

Iron Chin’s chance with Wlad is gone. Leave it at that. He was outboxed and outgunned, and even blind man could have seen that.

Posted November 13, 2012 3:38 am 


TARK

Wladimir was a study in steely eyed concentration, without a lapse.

Posted November 13, 2012 1:47 am 


TARK

I felt this fight would go 12.. I assumed Wach would wait all night for one good opportunity—and probably land at least one good shot.. He even waved a few punches at Wladimir to get him thinking, “This Pole has nothing.” … Like Clottey vs Pacquiao, or Foreman vs Moorer, that was his only chance and he tried hard.. Wach was aware every second, just in case, but Wladimir was a study in steely eyed with concentration, without a lapse.

Posted November 13, 2012 1:44 am 


Anonymous

Wach looked just the way he was suppose to look.A guy who never fought anyone in the top 50 is 32yrs. old never stepped-up and looked just like a club fighter.World class dosent happen overnight and it dosent happen when your 32 and never fought a guy in the top 50.I wonder if Wach power was even overrated he landed one good shot on W.K. in the 5th(and W.K. dosent have a iron chin0and yet W.K. took it pretty good overall.

Posted November 13, 2012 12:51 am 


Adrian

Writer I agre with you that wach had a chance if hd went all out and let his hands go but not in the first thre rounds but right after the round 8 when wlad fail to finish him he was winded in the 9th round so wach chance and the only one was right there at the round 9, but he did the contrary stayed away from klitchko and blew his only chance and that’s why the 9 th round was with no action !!

Posted November 13, 2012 12:41 am 


TARK

Alonzo…., It’s not speed so much as knowledge, form, skill, and highly developed instincts refined through 63 pro fights.. Wladimir was with Manny Steward for 10 years—so check out his stance, footwork, feinting, jabs, right leads, 1-2’s, and left hooks from his Monte Barrett fight—and compare them to the Wach fight.. WK’s stance is a lot more agile, relaxed, and fluid. His footwork and weapons are many times better … He just made an undefeated 8-year pro look like a sub-novice amateur who couldn’t buy a round. Even in the 5th he took many more hard shots so he didn’t even win that round.

Posted November 13, 2012 12:38 am 


Alonzo

Tark’s right. Wach has the handspeed–we saw it for most of the rounds against Tye Fields and briefly at the end of the fifth against Klit. The problem was that the Klits have their range and distance so perfected that it nullifies most any chance their opponents have.

Posted November 12, 2012 10:45 pm 


It’s me, Ernie

Reem-lmao

Posted November 12, 2012 10:43 pm 


TARK

Do you just like to hang out all day so you can read and comment on my posts douchenozzle jiz sucking scum bag?? … Or as you’re also know as, Klitschko Sisters?

Posted November 12, 2012 8:54 pm 


It’s me, Ernie

Do you just like to hear yourself talk douchenozzle?

Posted November 12, 2012 8:12 pm 


TARK

Wach’s best chance was to do EXACTLY as he did… He was getting out-boxed by a million miles and was barely able to land anything… Your best chance in that situation is DON’T GO CRAZY, just wait for your shot.. Don’t flail away, giving Wladimir wide open shots to put you away. Wach kept trying and landed a real good hard right in the 5th. A moment, but no cigar. He followed up as well as he could. He did some illegal pushing, grabbing, grappling, and shoving at times, trying to get a clean shot at Wladimir but with no success. He was facing incredibly long odds, but he stayed true to his chances and stayed alert as he possibly could clear through to the end of the 12th.. Wach was looking for that tiny George Foreman vs Michael Moorer moment that never came.. and believe me if George had gone crazy he wouldn’t have been gone 7.. Foreman didn’t have the youthfulness, skill, or speed, but he had the experience and savvy.. Moorer got caught napping and that’s what you’re looking for … It’s a veteran strategy that produced many a stunning upset.

Posted November 12, 2012 7:49 pm 


Swedish Boxing Fan

This is just filled with unjust and ignorance in my oppinion. Mariusz Watch did the best he could end took the champion by huge suprise with his iron chin. Watch sure haves good power in his right hand and that is his best weapon, but don’t you think Wladimir Klitschko knowes that? Seriusly now, if it is something Wladimir have learned now in his pro career is this of many things – NEVER UNDERESTIMATE AN OPPONENT! He knew from the start what Watch game plan would be like and Wladimir is now an expearenced champion and knew exacly what to do to defeat Watch and Wladimir pulled of it all right with style, skills and power. Watch did alot better in the title fight then millions of people expected him to be and he made all 12 rounds, took over 460 punches and still was dangerous to tangle with in the 12th and final round so no, don’t criticise him like this, he did the best he could but Wladimir is the best heavyweight in the world and Watch can’t compete with him, but belive me, Watch will now get more lucrative fights then before becouse now he have made a name for himself as an decent contender and have won new fans and critics respect for his hearth and determination to fight hard.

Posted November 12, 2012 7:19 pm 


Aurelio

It’s a British writer, no question. Most bitter K Bro haters around.

Posted November 12, 2012 7:09 pm 


Anonymous

this writer must be a Wlach tip rider … what CHANCE?

Posted November 12, 2012 6:38 pm 


Robot

The title makes it sound like Wlad was standing there waiting for Wach to “let his hands go”… Funny. Scroll down a bit and another article gives stats for the fight. It appears Wlad connected something like 500 times…quite hard too. Clearly Wach was dominated by a supreme fighter. He could not possibly let his hands go.

Posted November 12, 2012 6:20 pm 


Anonymous

Errr… You must have the technical ability to let your hands go… Wach does not.

Posted November 12, 2012 6:11 pm 


Anonymous

Wach trained 3 times a day,lived with cutouts of wlad all around hime when he ate,trained and lived all day and his intent was to trounce wlad. He tried but was rendered helpless like all others. Its that simple.

Posted November 12, 2012 5:17 pm 


boxingnut76

Every time Wach was in firing range he was eating power shots. Hard to punch when someone is punching you. And when Wach did hurt Wlad, he went after him like a madman, I don’t know what fight this author was watching. Wlad slipped and took some punches than tied him up. Wach had his best chance to tire out Wlad in the later rounds, but Wlad smartly conserved is energy. Great fight by Wlad, lots of heart shown by Wach.

Posted November 12, 2012 4:46 pm 


Anonymous

every one fighter can do as mutch as your opponent lets it no moore no less

Posted November 12, 2012 4:29 pm 


Anonymous

I think Wach did a good job. There was at least a hint of danger comming from throughout most of the fight.

Posted November 12, 2012 4:02 pm 


knowall

Yep but he was never in the world title league not his fault

Posted November 12, 2012 4:02 pm 


Yves

If he had thrown much more hands Wlad had KOd him.

Posted November 12, 2012 3:58 pm 



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