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Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

this 2slick guy is just an another bs writer from fantasy mickey mouse world. All you have written slick is a baseless bs opinion of yours. I bet you still think that Clay (a featherfisted punchbag with real HW record of 28-4 (9 ko’s)) knocks Vladimir KlichKO (The best ever REAL HW boxer with 58-3 (51 KTFO) record).

Posted August 24, 2012 4:09 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

So TONY and RICH you DIDN’T REFUTE NOT A SINGLE CLAIM THAT I HAVE MADE. I am right, you are pathetic KlichKO haters aka Nazi btches. All you wanted is just to dispute with me. But you are unable to take over in this battle and you have surrendered.

Posted August 24, 2012 3:54 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Whaaat?????

Posted August 23, 2012 4:29 pm 


Tony1244

2slick is totally right. Shannon Briggs and George Foreman are perfect examples. They both got bigger without getting better. Foreman won his first title at 217, his 2nd title at 250-something. Lyle, Bugner, Wepner, Mac Foster, Norton are no smaller as a group than Adamek, Haye, Chambers, Huck, and Mormeck. Cruiserweight Huck beat the hell out of the much bigger Povetkin and got robbed. As a matter of fact, as a group the guys from the 1970s were often bigger than the guys are now.

Posted August 23, 2012 1:22 pm 


K2Fan

2 slick ; ” on the whole the heavy’s of today are no bigger than
those of 90 s, 80s, and 70 , – just in worse shape ” . Are you f&%#$k serious ? The Klitchkos , Dmitrenko ,
McCall , Austin , Fury , Briggs , Ustinov,Helenius , Wach , Price ….
Here are just ten . Aside of Briggs , tell me which one is NOT bigger , or so ” out of shape “. ” Going back further what is important , is relative size in their own era ” . Can’t you see how you contradict yourself ? They were THEN ,
this is NOW ! Joe Louis was a big man in his time ( that’s just IT , in HIS time ! ) , ” if he was born in the K’s time, chances are , he’d be closer to them in size “…. Chances are if you were born with a brain , you could probably make a comment that makes sense ….

Posted August 23, 2012 12:02 pm 


2slick

Objectively speaking, if a legacy based on dominance over a division by one man (i.e Larry Holmes) gets a score of 10 out of 10, then a legacy based on shared dominance by TWO men in tandem can only be 5 out of 10. It’s simple maths, even for those with simple minds. That’s before we even go into detail about quality of opponent/era.

Posted August 23, 2012 11:13 am 


Tony1244

Bill, with all due respect, you really don’t read or write English well enough to debate with. That’s not an insult; your English is much better than any second language I can communicate in. You don’t even know what a question mark is.

Posted August 23, 2012 9:10 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Another TROLL…The only problem in the division is TOP CONTENDERS ARE NOT FIGHTING EACH OTHER. That’s about it. Nazi btch.

Posted August 23, 2012 5:49 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

All of these KlichKO haters aka Nazi btches dont have no valid Arguments, I mean, NO FACTS, at all. All you losers can is just: “Blah blah Klichko suck, blah blah Clay was the greatest”…This BS doesn’t work in real world. In real facts-based world it’s Clay sucks and it’s KlichKO bros who are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS (THE STRONGEST) EVER.

Posted August 23, 2012 2:31 am 


Perdun

Heavyweight division is a snooze fest. wish Sanders could jump in a time machine and fight again.

Posted August 22, 2012 10:19 pm 


Tony1244

I think it’s quite clear Americans aren’t dominating the HW division. Only 1 country is dominating the division (Ukraine). The question is who will dominate after the Klitschkos? There are a couple good Polish fighters, a couple good Americans and a whole bunch from Britain. Britain seems to have the best HW prospects.

Posted August 22, 2012 7:30 pm 


Beer Party Movement

tony: Adamek is still listed as polish, enyway the debate was about eastern europeans contra americans, so if the Klitschko´s and all the other topranked fighters from eastern europe and former ussr. moved to usa, it wont change the fact that americans arent dominating the hw division.

Posted August 22, 2012 7:19 pm 


boxingfanman

Bill lad, It looks like everyone else agrees with me too lol . What one poster says is very true, You should try act with decency like your heros. I have just one question, If Ali was so poor as you keep saying then why is he widely known as the Greatest ? Im sure people wouldnt call him that even your heros if there wasnt some truth in it hmm lol . My time on here is done you keep up the good work lol .

Posted August 22, 2012 12:29 pm 


Tony1244

Bill, I Ask AGAIN: Was Carnera @ 260 vs Sharkey @ 202 a heavyweight fight? Answer me that.

Posted August 22, 2012 10:49 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

So KlichKO haters aka Nazi btches aka Clayfanboys as usual you don’t have no facts behind your silly criticism. You just hate them. Admit it asap. I don’t have time for you…I have wrote and said it many times – EVERYTHING I AM WRITING IS BASED ON REAL FACTS AND REAL STATISTICS, YOU CANNOT REFUTE REAL FACTS. ALL YOU WROTE IS JUST A CHILDISH MEANING BASELESS BS. GROW UP KLICHKO HATERS AKA NAZI BTCHES…Ok my time is off…P.S. If you don’t have facts in your sleeve, don’t even try to play in “boxing expert” game with me, you are losing all the time.

Posted August 22, 2012 10:30 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

See boys, you don’t know what to answer, you do not know any valid counter argument. All you write is a meaningless baseless BS. You don’t have the facts behind you…I won’t even bother myself to explain you what kind of opponents foreman has been beating. The Bums beater.

Posted August 22, 2012 10:20 am 


Tony1244

Bill, you clearly aren’t bright enough to lie. George Foreman’s KO ratio is much higher than Wlad’s. I think Tyson, Marciano, and others also have a higher KO ratio. Why are you so angry? Don’t blame me that virtually no one in North or South America know who the Klits are. That’s not my fault. Was Carnera @ 260 vs Sharkey @ 202 a heavyweight fight? Answer me that.

Posted August 22, 2012 9:59 am 


Tony1244

Beer Party, you say you worked in Norway, but Adamek, I believe, has moved to the US and become a citizen. If this is the case he is as American as I am.

Posted August 22, 2012 9:55 am 


Tony1244

Bill, Wlad was getting knocked out by garbage until Manny Stewart taught Wlad had to fight. You are obsessed with size even though Heavyweight history is replete with guys 190 knocking out fighters over 200. The best fighters Wlad has beaten are true garbage compared to the champions Ali and Foreman beat. First off, if guys like Sam Peter and Arreola weren’t such fat pigs they’d hardly weigh over 200 in the first place.

Posted August 22, 2012 9:28 am 


Rich

You wouldn’t know a real fact if it bit you on your arse…

Posted August 22, 2012 7:24 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

NOBODY NEVER HAS HAD 61 FIGHT IN 200+LBS DIVISION (BOTH OPPONENTS, REAL HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION) WITH ONLY THREE DEFEATS AS VLADIMIR KLICHKO HAS. IT IS A STATISTICAL FACT. Rich and Tiny, can you say I’m a liar??? You CANNOT. Next. Vladimir KlichKO IS the BEST KTFO ARTIST EVER. 58 WINS AND 51 KTFO IS A UNIQUE ACHIEVEMENT IN REAL HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION. Not Lena Lewis, nor Tyson, nor the bums beater Foreman had achieved such a unique achievement in real HW division against the highest class opponents. ONLY VLADIMIR KLICHKO BEAT 19 UNBEATEN OR ONLY ONCE BEATEN REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS. LENA LEWIS HAS BEATEN ONLY 9!!! It’s STATISTICAL FACT – VLADIMIR KLICHKO HAS FOUGHT AND BEATEN THE BEST REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS EVER. Tiny and Rich, try to refute this using REAL FACTS, not your typical meaningless nostalgic BS. You guys cannot refute NOTHING OF WHAT I WROTE. Give up Clayfanboys! :)

Posted August 22, 2012 6:51 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

@ Rich and Tiny. Boys, you wrote NOTHING to refute my claims. NIL..You know, I know, that you are blind silly and oldfashioned nostalgists…Now You have already accepted (and you cannot refute it with real facts, because there is nothing) that UNTIL THE MILLENNIUM IT WAS A LOCAL CHAMPIONSHIP OF THE UNITED STATES.

Posted August 22, 2012 6:32 am 


Torgo

Why don’t they like the Klitschkos? Because Vladimir fights like the boring Lennox Lewis, he even has LL’s old trainer. He was much more exciting when he fought under Sdunek and had Vladimir stayed with Sdunek he would not have lost to Sanders or Brewster. Back then Vladimir wasn’t opposed to in-fighting with opponents by establishing an overhook and colar tie, then working them over with left uppercuts and left hooks. The jab and distancing stuff isn’t close to what you want to do when you get your bell rung. You really want something that gets you ready for clinching in that case. A second reason the Klitschkos are unpopular is—the misconception that they are unpopular. This article’s amount of replies indicate that.

Posted August 21, 2012 9:57 pm 


Torgo

Tark, I think a lot of Klitschko’s victims would have beaten the daylights out of Marciano.

Posted August 21, 2012 9:49 pm 


Beer Party Movement

Well im sure Adamek see him self as a Pole :smile: . I worked 1½ year in Norway, and of course it didnt make me Norwegian.
Boxing of today is more of a worldsport than it ever was before. And if you look at hw the americans arent doing very well at all. Isnt Mitchell the most promising you have at the moment ?.

Posted August 21, 2012 7:26 pm 


K2Fan

Tony 1234 , Can’t comprehend ” local championship ” concept ? How about this ; How many other nationalities competed in professional boxing during
the good old days of the ” golden era ” , time of Dempsey , Louis ,Marciano etc ., ? You mentioned ; Carnera and Schmelling , and….? How many different nationalities competed in the Olympics? Where a lot of pros got their start . How many Mexican , Philipino , Asian , Central Asian , East
European , Hindi , etc fighters were
even heard of in those ” glorious golden days ” ? Is the concept of ” local championship ” becomming a little clearer ? There are professional boxers now coming from countries not only like Ukraine , whose name the Klitchkos made well known throughout the world , but also ; Kazakhstan , Uzbekistan , Inghushetia , Daghestan ,
just to name a few . And despite the
ridiculous claim of a mostly incompetent, myopic , biased media trying to convince American
fans that boxing is dying , it is very much alive and has actualy become a truly global sport ! In just this past Olympics , there were BOXING medals
awarded to 20, ( TWENTY ) different
nationalities ! Care to comment on how many medals the US got ? When did THIS ever happen before ? The
HOF and ATG , ratings of the present
and of the future , will be quite different then those, when boxing was contained mostly in the US , yet PROMOTED as global . NOW it IS global,
so the US , has to get in gear and catch up with the rest of the world .
And it AIN’T GONNA happen by day
dreaming about which past great could
” whup ” a Klitchko , or listening to ” experts ” like Kenny Weldon telling you that he knows 10 fighters from
the ” past ” that would knock out the
Klitchkos ” in five rounds ” ! Or that boxing now , is no where near as good as it was THEN ! Or , this is the WEAKEST era ever, and the boxers
now , are not nearly as good as they were THEN ! Compared to NOW , ” the
golden era ” , was indeed a local championship .

Posted August 21, 2012 5:37 pm 


Tony1244

Bill, If you’re so fond of the Klitschkos why don’t you act like them? The Klitschkos talk about Ali, Louis, and all the great past champions with great admiration. Why won’t you do the same?

Posted August 21, 2012 8:06 am 


Tony1244

There are 4 Eastern Europeans and 17 Americans in the boxrec’s P4P top 50. So your revolution is in slow motion. The USA has Adamek now, he moved here. That’s how it works in the USA. We took Einstein from you and now we have Adamek. :evil: BTW I like the Klitschkos too, it’s just their Borat-like fans that are annoying.

Posted August 21, 2012 7:58 am 


Rich

Bill lad…I also think that the Klits are fine examples of boxing sportsmen…but what I find odious are people like you, who take every opportunity to denigrate other illustrious champions to push there hero to the front,because of this you open their achievements up to ridicule and other poster on here(like me) expose there flaws.You make it even more unpalatable with your exaggerations and lies…Did you for one minute think any of your statements would be taken seriously …It must be hard living in darkness,thinking you are the light..

Posted August 21, 2012 7:51 am 


Tony1244

“Local Championship of the United States?” Carnera was Italian and he got his butt kicked by American Max Baer. Schmeling was German and got his butt kicked by American Joe Louis. Doesn’t sound very “local” to me. Regarding this great Russian Revolution, Soviet whatever, I enjoyed the alliteration, name a top Eastern European pro fighter, other than the Klits, that is Eastern European. Don’t feel bad I can’t name one either.

Posted August 21, 2012 7:44 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

UP UNTIL THE MILLENNIUM IT WAS JUST A LOCAL CHAMPIONSHIP OF THE UNITED STATES. IT TOOK ABOUT 10 YEARS AFTER THE COLLAPSE OF THE SOVIET UNION FOR THOSE RUSSIANS, UKRAINIANS, POLES AND OTHER EASTERN EUROPEANS TO GET TO THE COMPETITION. ONLY THEN, THIS BECAME REALLY – CHAMPIONSHIP OF THE WORLD…NOT JUST CHAMPIONSHIP OF THE UNITED STATES, CANADA AND UNITED KINGDOM…It is a statistical FACT. Now Rich and Tony, try to refute something of it. But I’m begging you :) don’t play fools and write this “how dare you!!!” BS, use some real facts and arguments, not your biased stubborn OPINION. Facts boys facts :mrgreen:

Posted August 21, 2012 1:16 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

@Rich and Tony. See guys, you don’t even have a solid counter-arguments. Actually I’m laughing at YOU! :mrgreen: All you can is just “I can’t believe it! it’s unheard of!!! How dare you!!!…” And all that baseless BS. You are unable to operate facts, because real facts don’t suit your silly old-fashioned BS you are writing…Look guys, HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION TODAY IS A 200+ LBS DIVISION. THOSE BOXERS THAT DO NOT MATCH THIS RULE ARE NOT ALLOWED TO COMPETE IN HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION. I didn’t think there are some silly stubborn lads that don’t even understand such an easy thing. Looks like a rocket science for you boys.

Posted August 21, 2012 12:57 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Being the most feared local boxer does NOT refute the fact he was even shorter than Mormek and De La Hoya, hence a small heavyweight.

Posted August 21, 2012 12:43 am 


PigMan

Ray Gordon Reid, where you been dude. Out hunting Gators??
We been huntin Hogs with Dogs.

Posted August 20, 2012 9:52 pm 


Tony1244

Rich, according to our buddy Bill, Louis-Schmeling was not a heavyweight title fight because they were both under 200 LBS, but Carnera-Sharkey was a heavyweight title fight because they were both over 200 LBS. Never mind that Joe Louis KO’d both Carnera and Sharkey.

Posted August 20, 2012 7:31 pm 


Rich

Yes TONY….Keep repeating it,it my help dull the pain of hearing from a big no-nothing woozier,who makes up things about the love that bares no name just to big himself up….How does it go again…Fairness lad fairness,,,,,Do you tell this to a lot of lads,,,Billy Boy…..

Posted August 20, 2012 7:01 pm 


Tony1244

Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever) says: On August 19, 2012 at 10:00 pm

And NO, Louis vs Shmelling was NOT a heavyweight fight, BOTH boxers weighed less than 200 lbs.

I have no comment on this, I just think it bears repeating.

Posted August 20, 2012 4:50 pm 


Tony1244

Bill, my Aug 19th 8:50PM post corrected 3-4 mistakes you made in one post specifically and politely.

Posted August 20, 2012 12:35 pm 


Rich

Bill..lad..Why is it you are the only one in boxing that believes If you weigh under this mythical 200 lbs(and why does it keep changing from 200 to195) it is not a heavyweight fight…..go to box rec they are all listed there…you are getting more laughable by each post….show us somewhere this is written O wise one of boxing knowledge,then maybe I will stop laughing at you…

Posted August 20, 2012 11:32 am 


Tony1244

Tark, regarding your last missive, you alluded to David Haye as possibly ruling the division. Of course he is a former cruiserweight who fights now at or under 220 I believe. Adamek and Chambers had a close fight and also are not big men. Denis Boystov is one of the top prospects and he fights also at about 220. So these super big, super great HWs taking over the division may or may not happen, but it certainly hasn’t happened yet long term.

Posted August 20, 2012 10:18 am 


Hidalgo

You know less about the sport and past champions that Ernie does. Much less.
“Tyson is a midget heavyweight?” In his prime he was the most feared fighter in boxing. Bill, go back to watching badmington tournaments.

Posted August 20, 2012 9:51 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

@Ernie. The weakest in thirty years?!!Go sell this sht to somebody else! Clay was one of the weakest HW champions ever. Frazier was a bum, Holmes was a featherfist, Holyfield is a heavyweight bum, Tyson is a midget heavyweight with 45-6 real record, Lena Lewis is very good, but a btch as a person…So Ernie, current division is THE BEST HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION EVER, until 2000 it was a LOCAL AMERICAN CHAMPIONSHIP.

Posted August 20, 2012 2:18 am 


It’s Me, Ernie…

Tark I thought you disappeared?

Posted August 20, 2012 1:41 am 


It’s Me, Ernie…

The Klits are the best out there at present, unfortunately it’s the weakest field in thirty years. :roll:

Posted August 20, 2012 1:38 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

I want some of that stuff you smoke

Posted August 19, 2012 10:57 pm 


Smokey

The only real HW fighter is Michael Grant. He could destroy both Klits in the same night.

Posted August 19, 2012 10:08 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

And NO, Louis vs Shmelling was NOT a heavyweight fight, BOTH boxers weighed less than 200 lbs.

Posted August 19, 2012 10:00 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Ok Tony, your answer is – “Your comments are silly”. Pretty damn decent answer I should say! No explanations WHY, just “that one was silly, and that one…wait…and that one was silly too”…Use some valuable and undeniable facts that we can dispute lad. I doubt you are able to do it…

Posted August 19, 2012 9:38 pm 


TARK

Tony1244… You want me to name great fighters over 240 besides Lewis and the Klitschko bros??? That’s like somebody being asked to name great basketball players over 7 feet tall back in 1960.. Outside of Wilt Chamberlain there weren’t ANY 7 foot basketball players who were very fast, coordinated, and skillful. That changed. Lewis fashioned his legacy in the 1990′s and 2000′s and Vitali and Vlad have dominated since Lewis retired … Talented big men are just getting started in this sport. There are many big and tall heavyweights coming up who will sort out the next great Heavyweight Champion. There are few smaller guys to challenge them. David Haye, with his speed power and skill, could possibly rule the division for several years — but although he’s always in perfect condition when he fights he never seemed massively driven except for his last fight.. So there will be several more big guys to add to your “big greats” list in 20 to 50 years, giving that question a lot more answers.

Posted August 19, 2012 8:49 pm 


KnucKled Eye

I don’t like the Klits style and it’s a shame they came along and dominated in such a weak era. I would have like to see them in an era with a bit more compitition. That being said, nobody can argue , not even the K-bros haters, that either one of these guys would have given hell to any of the top heavies throughout the history of the sport. These guys are very large, pretty agile for their size, strong and punch very hard. They also know how to use their size and reach very well. No cake walk for any heavy in history.

Posted August 19, 2012 8:30 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

@Rich and Tony. You are arguing a lot. But about What? Let’s get straight to the point, ok. Tell me where I was wrong in my posts. Where did I lie?..AND Give me please your understanding of the term HEAVYWEIGHT in the year of 2012.

Posted August 19, 2012 7:58 pm 


JuanBaldez

I AGREE WITH RAYGORDONREID !!!!!!!!!

Posted August 19, 2012 6:34 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Rich and Tony, what are you arguing about? Everything I wrote before is based on REAL FACTS. Nobody can change statistics…To be considered as a heavyweight fight BOTH opponents have to be above 200 limit. End of story. Louis vs Schmelling was NOT a heavyweight fight (for example). It’s not a rocket science to understand. Weight is the most important thing in boxing, it is common knowledge, bigger weight in most cases IS advantage. It’s a fact that HALF of Clay’s opponents had their weight below 200 limit, hence, Clay had advantage against weak light and small lightheavyweights and cruiserweights. What will YOU guys say if HALF of Vladimir’s opponents were small fattened lightheavyweights and featherfisted cruiserweights?..And again, Rich and Tony, when arguing, you have to use real stats and facts, don’t spill the water.

Posted August 19, 2012 6:25 pm 


Beer Party Movement

Tom Davies:’ Legacy? You have got to be kidding me. The only lasting legacy they leave is the memory of one fight, where Lennox was starting to tee off on Vitali, whose face was falling off. Seriously, the shortest book ever written is ‘great moments of the Klitschko brothers’. Outside of Germany and the Ukraine, and their own families, these guys will be almost totally forgotten in 10 years.’ The Klitschko´s will be remembered like eny other hw champ before them, Wlad will when he retire likely have the second most title defenses ever. And one of the highest ko % ever.
I think you really ment that you cant stand the Klitschkos, because they dominate your country´s boxers, and that you wish that no one will mention them after they have retired. Real boxingfans arent burdened by national bias like this. By the way im not ukrainian or german.

Posted August 19, 2012 5:13 pm 


Rich

Bill…..Missing you already..come back soon…If only to clear up your announcement that you have “Tons of real counter-arguments against our pathetic ones”…..Are you saying all your other counter-arguments were not real……

Posted August 19, 2012 11:09 am 


Rich

Bill,I have deciphered your question …”what would I say about Vlad defending his titles against a 190lb unknown guy”….Well according to you he would not be able to,….as both have to be over 200lbs before it is considered a legit heavyweight fight…Bill don’t drink and post at the same time……

Posted August 19, 2012 10:58 am 


Tony1244

Regarding this weight obsession, you are always allowed to come in under a weight limit, you just aren’t allowed to come in above a weight limit. If Huck fought Vit at 198, it’s still a title fight. If Billy Conn was 174 against Louis, it’s still a title fight. Coming in under, NEVER illegitimizes a fight. I hope I cleared this up for you.

Posted August 19, 2012 10:55 am 


Rich

Fairness and objectivity, noble and wise words Bill,fully agree and there is no need to put them in capitals…..unless you are trying to dodge the answer to your own statements…which is, as you know, is that nonsense about the 200lb limit….But being as you put it a lad, perhaps you can show me where this is written,O old and wise sage….I found those words so profound Bill, I intend to have a bumper sticker made saying…….FAIRNESS LAD FAIRNESS……But I won’t..cruse Harlem…

Posted August 19, 2012 10:27 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Hah, I have tons of REAL counter-arguments against your weak pathetic attempts to belittle KlichKO achievements. I just don’t have time for these conversations…I’m a working man and got to go. P.S. Cassy Clay and Lena Lewis agendas suck, fk all the Nazi btches aka KlichKO haters. “Too white and too soviet to be respected by Nazi btches”

Posted August 19, 2012 10:12 am 


Tony1244

Tom Davies writes, “Outside of Germany and The Ukraine, and their own families, these guys will almost be forgotten in 10 years.” That sounds a little harsh but there is some truth to it. Then again you can say the same thing about Henry Armstrong and Willie Pep. Those names don’t come up much in casual conversation either and all 4 names here, both Klits, and the guys I mentioned are all great fighters.

Posted August 19, 2012 9:27 am 


Tony1244

Bill, please talk to others and tell them Louis-Conn, Dempsey-Willard, and Marciano-Walcott were not Heavyweight fights. If a Cruiserweight such as Mormeck or Huck fought Klitschko and weighed in at 198 everyone would still see it as a HW title match except you.

Posted August 19, 2012 9:14 am 


RAY GORDON REID

VITALI OVER CHARR

Posted August 19, 2012 9:02 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

STATISTICAL FACT – THERE IS/WAS NO MAN IN 200+LBS DIVISION (BOTH OPPONENTS) WHO HAS/HAD PERFORMED 61 FIGHT WITH ONLY THREE DEFEATS…It’s Statistical Fact – Vladimir KlichKO is the best (super)heavyweight ever, already being 58-3 (51 ko’s). VLADIMIR KLICHKO IS A UNIQUE HEAVYWEIGHT BOXER. I’m glad that I’m living in the time the living Legend Vladimir KlichKO has been reigning in heavyweight division.

Posted August 19, 2012 8:32 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Rich. FAIRNESS AND OBJECTIVITY ARE THE KEY WORDS. If we dare to compare, say, KlichKO to Clay, we have to have a fair comparison. If KlichKO has never fought a under-200 lbs boxer, than why we should give an unfair advantage of fighting those small weak guys to Clay?..FAIRNESS lad, fairness.

Posted August 19, 2012 8:14 am 


Tom Davies

Legacy? You have got to be kidding me. The only lasting legacy they leave is the memory of one fight, where Lennox was starting to tee off on Vitali, whose face was falling off. Seriously, the shortest book ever written is ‘great moments of the Klitschko brothers’. Outside of Germany and the Ukraine, and their own families, these guys will be almost totally forgotten in 10 years.

Posted August 19, 2012 7:57 am 


scottyboy

Shut up you goon, go and learn a bit about boxing before you even consider posting on these boards again. If you think George Foreman was at his best when he was 46 then you’ve just shown every single reader how stupid you actually are. If you can’t get your head around the fact that boxers lose their fitness, speed, strength, punch resistance and stamina the older they get then I feel really, really sorry for you. You are obviously a complete and utter moron. Just as I thought I had seen the absolute worst that ESB posters could offer, you come alongn and claim George was better at 46 years old than in his prime when he was smashing HOFers like Frazier and Norton. Stupid moron!!

Posted August 19, 2012 7:54 am 


Rich

Bill, I wonder too,but I do not see that as relevant to your grand statement that both fighters have to weigh over 200 lbs for it to be a heavyweight fight….Perhaps you could reiterate and explain and then we could both stop wondering…I am surprised you said you have never heard of Bob Foster, one of the finest fighters to dip under the ropes and better than most.Also that was not a life saving operation Vit had,he just up and ran,his brother didn’t try and avenge his loss to Purritty and Sanders either….Must run in the family…Pardon the pun…Lewis had said well before his last fight he would retire..no big news there…Unlike Vit who “retired” rather than get it on with Byrd…

Posted August 19, 2012 7:48 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

@rich. I wonder, what would say if Vladimir KlichKO would be about to defend his titles against 190 lbs guys nobody heard of???

Posted August 19, 2012 7:18 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

rich. Vitaliy WAS SERIOUSLY INJURED, and he had a surgery afterwards. So unlike Lewis, Vitaliy had a possible career ending trauma. Lewis on contrary was healthy and he just cowardly retired, literally Lena said, “fk you boxing fans, I don’t want no rematch with this dude, fk you, I’m out”…Lewis said fk you to his own loyal fans.

Posted August 19, 2012 7:13 am 


Rich

Bob Foster fought Joe Frazier for the heavyweight title and only weighed 188.lbs…..and he fought Ali for the heavyweight NABF title and weighed 188lbs…….guess they hadn’t heard about that over 200lb rule…

Posted August 19, 2012 6:25 am 


UbeReem

George at 46 was better than when young. Get your facts straight!

Posted August 19, 2012 5:38 am 


UbeReem

Damn right!

Posted August 19, 2012 5:36 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

I do agree with one statement KlichKO bros and Lena Lewis are the strongest and the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHT BOXERS EVER…Vladimir KlichKO clearly is #1
with 58-3 (51 KTFO) record, Vitaliy is second (44-2), Lena “Retired like a cowardly btch” Lewis is 3rd with 39-2 record…Clays, Fraziers, Foremans, Holyfields and Tysons suck in comparison with KlichKO bros and Lena Lew.

Posted August 18, 2012 8:17 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Unlike Lena Lewis 39-2.

Posted August 18, 2012 8:10 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Tony, you don’t know what are you talking about. Very poor informed…Listen, HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION MEANS BOTH OPPONENTS AT THE OFFICIAL WEIGH-IN ARE HAVIER THAN 200 LBS. If fighters do not match this rule, it’s not a heavyweight fight. IN FACT HALF OF CASSY CLAY’S FIGHTS WERE NOT HEAVYWEIGHT FIGHTS. CLAY WAS A FEATHERFISTED PUNCHBAG WITH PATHETIC REAL RECORD IN REAL HW DIVISION 28-4 (9 KO’S), statistical fact…And nope, Eddie Chambers, JM Mormek, Davey Ga ye and Tomasz Adamek all were above 200 lbs limit, hence these fights were REAL heavyweight fights. In FACT, Vladimir KlichKO has never officially fought a boxer lighter than 200 lbs.

Posted August 18, 2012 7:54 pm 


Tony1244

Tark, welcome back. You say, “For guys over 7′ feet tall and 300 LBS Valuev is the best ever.” Very interesting statement and I guess true. As bad as Valuev was, I can’t think of anyone better that fits that description. Let me aks you to name GREAT fighters over 240 LBS. I can only think of 3. LL and the Klits. Can you think of anyone else? Some of the top 10 today such as Adamek are not big guys. I always thought Dempsey was overrated. But he is a good example of a fighter who beat people bigger than he was. Styles make fights and Foreman had Frazier’s number. But Foreman would have had problems with Bugner, maybe even losing to him as he did to Young and Ali.

Posted August 18, 2012 5:29 pm 


TARK

Tony1244 says, “I’ve watched Dempsey-Willard, Haye-Valuev, Frazier-Mathis etc.” … Willard was 37 and hadn’t fought in 4 years when he faced Dempsey. He was 20 pounds overweight due to a slothful training camp and didn’t have a chance. Buster Mathis was an inconsistent tub of lard. His fighting weight varied from 226 for Jim Beattie to 290 for Ali. Occasionally he controlled his appetite but not for long. Valuev refused to fight the K Bros. Valuev’s head is as big as a Volkswagen so it’s difficult to defend. For guys over 7 feet tall and 300 pounds, Valuev was the best ever. Frazier did poorly vs Foreman and Haye did poorly vs Wladimir. Dempsey only beat 3 real “heavyweight” challengers in 7 years as heavyweight champion. There was little heavyweight talent in the 1920’s. Things were so bad Dempsey took 3 years off without a title defense at one point—much less finding a talented big guy to fight.

Posted August 18, 2012 5:19 pm 


Tony1244

Very true Goosey on both counts. Don King has prevented more good fights than he has ever dreamt of promoting.

Posted August 18, 2012 4:57 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Tony you don’t know what are you writing about. Heavyweight division means BOTH BOXERS ARE HAVIER THAN 200. Any fight that doesn’t match this term is NOT a heavyweight fight.

Posted August 18, 2012 4:29 pm 


Goosey

Evening Tony.. I agree.. As long as King is losing out, we are winning… This new format stinks..

Posted August 18, 2012 1:44 pm 


Tony1244

That is another good thing about the Klitschkos. Don King lost some of his power.

Posted August 18, 2012 1:30 pm 


Goosey

I know we argue on here a lot but, Ukraine did very well at these Olympics.. Picking up a total of 20 medals. Well done team Ukraine

Posted August 18, 2012 12:49 pm 


K2Fan

meh ; The first rule of learning to
debate your point , or dispute someone else’s, is to understand WHAT the argument IS ! If you check my post , you will find that my statement about Ukraine being the country with most boxing medsals , qualifies it by saying ” in MEN’S ” boxing . That means only medals won
by MEN . If you care to investigate
any further , you will find that both
GB and Russia’s medal count INCLUDE
medals won by women . Therefore my
original claim STILL stands , Ukraine ,
won MORE medals in MEN’S boxing
than ANY other country ! Oh yeah, and the Klitchko Brothers are STILL the greatest ever !

Posted August 18, 2012 12:10 pm 


Ron

One other thing they did do is get Don King out of the road.
King was a huge road block. King knew if these guys get in
control they will seize power and take it to Germany and control
all HW fights and contention. I bet King was pissed when he
lost his HW power grab.

Posted August 18, 2012 11:33 am 


Bontar

bahuma ma jahupa. Moopa jahooma, moopa jahooma.

Posted August 18, 2012 11:29 am 


Tony1244

I don’t put so much emphasis on size. I’ve watched Dempsey-Willard, Haye-Valuev, Frazier-Mathis etc. Some of this “size” is just added FAT. Shannon Briggs and Foreman went from 220 LBS HWs to 250 LBS HWs. The Klits are svelte and in great shape, I was talking about the division at large; pun intended.

Posted August 18, 2012 10:41 am 


Tony1244

Frankly, if we’re talking about All Time Greats, I’ve always believed Vit is a much easier sell than Wlad. Wlad got stopped by 3 mediocrities, while Vit’s 2 losses were on a cut he couldn’t control, and a bad decision he made to quit against Byrd, a decision I believe he deeply regrets.

Posted August 18, 2012 10:01 am 


Goosey

Lol.. You are mental.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:56 am 


meh

Also Ukraine did not win more medals UK was top of the medal table. 5 is equal to 5 not more than and silver is not better than gold.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:37 am 


Tony1244

Bill, of course than you don’t add Adamek, Chambers, and Mormeck to the Klitschko resume either then. Ali and Frazier were much bigger than many Klitschko opponents. Ali and Frazier were never knocked out by nonentities like Sanders, Purrity, and Brewster.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:35 am 


meh

how can two people be “the greatest” ktard?

Posted August 18, 2012 9:34 am 


meh

how the fk can two people be “the greatest” ktard?

Posted August 18, 2012 9:33 am 


scottyboy

Why the pathetic sucking up to Wlad? I just don’t get it. He hasnt even been the best in his division at any point in his career yet people still drool over him. Vitali knocks his block off everytime and is the far better of the brothers.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:24 am 


scottyboy

Sorry guys but it’s clear I’m dealing with a moron here. Big George was 46 when he fought Schultz and if you think that was the biggest win on his record then I feel really sorry for you. Big George anywhere near his best would crush every single person that either klit has beaten and if you don’t realise that then boxing is clearly not for you.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:20 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

NO tony, there is no mistake. I’m writing about Cassius Clay and Joe Frazier. The Local US champions with pathetic records in REAL heavyweight division (where BOTH OPPONENTS ARE HAVIER THAN 200 LBS). Cassy Clay’s REAL resume in our current HW division is 28-4 (9 ko’s). Frazier’s REAL heavyweight resume is 13-4 (5 ko’s). Both these boxers are FEATHERFISTED PUNCHBAGS…They do not even close to the KlichKO league. Cassy Clay was a fattened LIGHTHEAVYWEIGHT with no defense and no power. Compare these punchbags to Vladimir KlichKO who has 61 REAL HW Fight Professional experience on the HIGHEST LEVEL. In fact Vladimir KlichKO is THE MOST EXPERIENCED REAL HEAVYWEIGHT EVER. Cassy Clay btw had performed a good half of his fights not in heavyweight division…All the best…My free time is OFF, got to work.

Posted August 18, 2012 9:06 am 


Tony1244

You also are confusing Joe Frazier with Stacey Frazier.

Posted August 18, 2012 8:51 am 


Tony1244

Bill, what “Clay” was 28-4 with 9 KOs? Are you talking about Vernon Clay? You are confusing HWs.

Posted August 18, 2012 8:50 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Vladimir KlichKO’s legacy – the best heavyweight ever. The best Knockout artist ever. The most dominant heavyweight ever. The most educated heavyweight ever. VLADIMIR KLICHKO IS A ROLE MODEL FOR THE YOUNG GUYS. AND FOR THE YOUNG BOXERS AS WELL. All the best.

Posted August 18, 2012 7:46 am 


UbeReem

scottyboy says:
’I’m saying (quite rightfully) that any top HW since Ali beats every single fighter either klit has beaten with ease. You name Ali as being in a weak era but he has wins over foreman, frazier and norton. All of these would terrorise any opponent either klit has beaten.’

YOU MEAN LIKE FOREMAN TERRORISED THE GREAT AXEL SCHULZ? HAHA

Posted August 18, 2012 6:54 am 


UbeReem

Yup, just like Foreman has terrorised Axel Schulz haha

Posted August 18, 2012 6:49 am 


scottyboy

You can strike Peter, Arreola, Thompson, McCline, Ibragimov, Byrd and Rahman off that list for starters and should feel thoroughly ashamed of yourself for evening mentioning those people as potential struggles for any HW great. Rahman’s fluke over lewis aside, none of them have done a darn thing in the sport. A prime Mercer (not the 42 yr old version wlad fought), a motivated Sanders (decent handspeed) and Haye (would be difficult for anyone to pin down and stop, yet carries decent power throughout) may present potential banana skins but I still cant think of a HW great that would lose to them. The fact that Sanders overpowered and humiliated Wlad by knocking him over 4 times and outboxing him for the entire fight before brutally stopping him, merely substantiates this theory.

Posted August 18, 2012 6:12 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

VLADIMIR KLICHKO IS THE BEST AND THE STRONGEST REAL HEAVYWEIGHT EVER. 58-3 (51 KO) IS THE BEST RECORD EVER IN THE REAL HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION. Compare Vladimir’s 58-3 (51 KTFO) to Clay’s 28-4 (9 ko’s!!!), or to Frazier’s 13-4, or to Foremans 59-5, to Holmes 60-5, to Tyson 45-6, to Holyfield 27-10, to Lewis 39-2…NOBODY HAS EVER HAD PERFORMED 61 FIGHT IN 200+LBS DIVISION WITH ONLY 3 DEFEATS. SO…THIS IS VLADIMIR KLICHKO’S LEGACY – THE BEST AND THE MOST DOMINANT (SUPER)HEAVYWEIGHT BOXER EVER.

Posted August 18, 2012 5:16 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Agree all the way

Posted August 18, 2012 5:04 am 


AD

Amen – whatever I think of their opposition, and some of it I respect, some of it I really really don`t, I don`t have a bad word for them as champions or their larger legacy. Absolutely classy people, and with great strength of character to come back from their defeats and retool. If forced to bet $1000 on Vitali vs any single heavy from history, I think with the exception of prime Lewis I`d probably go with Vitali, but I still have to hold off stamping him on above all the other greats for the reasons of opposition and style. There is a good bit of truth iin the accusation that the British and Americans have a problem with the brothers as a nationalism issue, but it isn`t the whole reason. Consistency, technical excellence, and the standup/tall fighting style just aren`t as popular outside of mainland Europe as a touch of slickness, risk-taking, and ding-dong battles. It isn`t the brothers fault, or their problem, it`s just the way it is.

Posted August 18, 2012 4:34 am 


bikermike

giancini…….do a synopsis

Posted August 18, 2012 4:00 am 


bikermike

so long as the amateur program is successful…….the Professional program will be excellant

Posted August 18, 2012 3:56 am 


bikermike

when it comes to Boxing….truth is like a virgin ..,,,,,,

Posted August 18, 2012 3:53 am 


bikermike

UK has had a very active amateur program for ab0ut tw0 decades…..aaand it shows

Posted August 18, 2012 3:51 am 


bikermike

do you guys think this site is contolled by promoters

Posted August 18, 2012 3:48 am 


bikermike

tell me I’m lyn………far more energy is spent in amateur /////////about who is fighting for who…..instead of who is the king of rock and rolll

Posted August 18, 2012 3:44 am 


bikermike

u wanna win medals…..it costs time and travel… north america lost this concept…..and amateur boxing was only too happy to screw the rest u[p

Posted August 18, 2012 3:41 am 


bikermike

north america has so many flaws in their amateur system…..It’s a wonder they got to the quater finals at alllll…men or women

Posted August 18, 2012 3:37 am 


bikermike

fk ….most of us thought this was a slater article

Posted August 18, 2012 3:34 am 


h8er

THE TRUTH IS THIS:

AMERIKA LOST ITS HOLD ON THE HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION AS A RESULT OF THE FALL OF THE SOVIET UNION.

ONCE RUSSIAN AND EAST EURO FIGHTERS KNEW THEY COULD COMPETE PROFESSIONALLY, IT WAS JUST A MATTER OF TIME.

AMERIKANS LIKE CLAY AND THE REST WERE MERELY LOCAL CHAMPIONS.

LENNOX LEWIS (CANADIAN/BRIT) BROKE THAT STRANGLEHOLD OF THE AMERICANS, AND NOW THE EUROMEN HAVE FOLLOWED IN HIS FOOTSTEPS.

AMERIKA HAS LOST ITS GRIP ON THE HW DIVISION AS IT LOSES ITS IMPORTANCE IN WORLD AFFAIRS.

THE LOSS OF AMERIKA’S HOLD ON THE HW DIVISION MIRRORS ITS DECLINE AS A NATION.

Posted August 18, 2012 3:25 am 


luke

happy boy how can you say ll not a top 10? put him just below holmes at#2 please. just cos he didn’t engage like some foolish heavies shouldn’t change his legacy, when he wound that right after softening his opponent with his jab it was awe inspiring! i believe his problem was his loss to oliver scarred him that his chin couldn’t cope yet any heavy can knock out another if they bang right. he actually had a great chin but the ko to hasim was due to not training. his last fight with vitali was a joke really cos lennox was in terrible shape. both kilt bros are fantastic in this era, at least vital had his rep enhanced in his losing effort to lennox even if lewis was way past it!

Posted August 18, 2012 3:24 am 


h8er

I’D RATHER WATCH *ANY* KLITSCHKO FIGHT THAN THOSE OF YOUR GHETTO TRASH STUPORSTARZ FROM AMERIKA.

WHY? BECAUSE THE KLITSCHKOS ARE SUPERIOR — THEY WALK THROUGH ANY ERA OF BOXING LIKE A HOT KNIFE THROUGH BUTTER.

THERE ARE PLENTY OF HEAVYWEIGHTS AROUND TODAY WHO WOULD HAVE DESTROYED ALL OF THE GHETTO TRASH AMERICAN BUMS LIKE CLAY AND FOREMAN THE WIDE PUNCHING BURGER MUNCHER. AND YET NONE OF THEM CAN BEAT THE KLITSCHKOS.

THE KLITSCHKOS ARE THE ZENITH OF THE NEW HEAVYWEIGHT, THE SUPERIOR HEAVYWEIGHT OF THE PRESENT AND PROTOTYPE FOR THE FUTURE.

Posted August 18, 2012 3:10 am 


h8er

HE COULDN’T EVEN BEAT ADAMEK — WHAT DID VITALI DO TO ADAMEK, IDIOT?

Posted August 18, 2012 12:34 am 


h8er

CLAY AND ALL OF THOSE OLD BUMS ARE A JOKE COMPARED TO THE SUPERIOR EUROMEN.

BOW DOWN YOU INFERIOR AMERICANS WORSHIPPING YOUR GHETTO TRASH LIKE CLAY AND TYSON.

THE FALL OF THE SOVIET UNION MEANT THE FALL OF THE UNITED STATES IN HEAVYWEIGHT BOXING.

NEVER AGAIN WILL GHETTO TRASH FROM THE USA RULE THE GREATEST OF ALL BOXING DIVISIONS.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Posted August 18, 2012 12:33 am 


h8er

Right on — CLAY is an overrated clown. Vitali KO 1 >>> CLAY

Posted August 18, 2012 12:30 am 


Adrian

Yep I remember when they were praising Byrd so much even though they robed golota against him by giving him a draw and they were still in love with Byrd !

Posted August 18, 2012 12:18 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

This Cassy Clay agenda sucks. PAST LOCAL US CHAMPS LIKE CLAY, FRAZIER, MARCIANO, FOREMAN AND HOLMES WOULD HAVE BEEN A CANNON FODDER NOT ONLY FOR LENA LEWIS AND KLICHKOS BUT EVEN FOR DAVEY GA Y, SAM PETER, CHRIS ARREOLA, ROBERT HELENIUS ETC. Speaking about legacy – KlichKO brothers are THE STRONGEST REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS EVER. Vladimir KlichKO, having 61!!! fight in 200+lbs division, won 58 of it, 51 ko’s, make him the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHT BOXER EVER in real heavyweight fights (200+lbs BOTH BOXERS)…This is KLICHKO LEGACY – THE BEST REAL HEAVYWEIGHT BOXERS EVER LIVED.

Posted August 18, 2012 12:16 am 


Adrian

That’s exactly right and how it is!!

Posted August 18, 2012 12:11 am 


rod

TOTAL RESPECT TO BOTH BROTHERS. And just when I thought they were getting soft Wlad takes on an unbeaten giant-Wach. Charr is a joke but looking at these guys and the careers they are freaks of nature than come along once every 100 years. We had the pleasure of watching them then and will belts together. It will never happen again

Posted August 17, 2012 10:51 pm 


Smokey

Michael Grant would destroy both robots in the same night.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:13 pm 


Miller

I do not think we americans are jealous, we are just not able tro see the majority of the heavy wieght challangers fight. Most of the fights happen over seas and are not on tv here. So ignorant people assume because they never saw I guy fight he must be a bum. As I said earlier I think the devision is as good if not better now then ever. Over here in the states the people want fast pace violace so they tellevise this mixed martial arts crap and the public loves it. As for the golden era Chris Bird was as big as Ali just as fast and he was junk by todays standard.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:45 pm 


Alonzo

Yeah I’ll never forget the way Bowe slammed Pierre Coetzers nuts several times in their fight.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:41 pm 


Alonzo

Hear Hear on Holmes! I sometimes liken the Klit’s jab and stand-up, European style to Holmes. Plus Holmes was so darn accurate.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:38 pm 


HHLondon

Ademek and Haye are gonna hang with Norton and Frazier?

Are you serious?

LOL!

This the difference between the modern fan that has been fed BS fights promoted by crooks and aold skool fighters and fans that were men!

Poeople like Frazier and Norton would have fought Haye and Ademek in the morning and made short work of both and fought the likes of each other and Ali and Foreman in the afternoon!

Stop this nonsense!

The HW scene today is a joke and has been for almost a decade now!

Posted August 17, 2012 9:37 pm 


HHLondon

Which of the Klitschko’s competition wouldn’t the past greats get by?

Will you name them and what greats you’re talking about?

Posted August 17, 2012 9:28 pm 


TARK

Versatility, and the progression of boxing science and sports science are important considerations in picking lists of all-time-greats… There are more heavyweights from more countries of the world now than there ever were. The Klitschkos have fought more southpaw challengers than ALL other heavyweight champions in history combined. Years ago you almost couldn’t get a fight if you were a southpaw heavyweight. Ali fought only one southpaw, in fact the first southpaw challenger ANY heavyweight champion ever faced was Karl Mildenberger.. Lewis fought no southpaws in his entire career. But that prejudice is a long gone relic of past generations … thank goodness.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:08 pm 


TARK

@Bears…. Based on what he’s accomplished. The fact that he came back from a 4-year layoff and won the Heavyweight Championship in his very first fight back, in extremely decisive fashion. The fact that he’s never been knocked down and has never been behind on points at 41 years of age. Based on his KO record and having beaten 6 world champions and 5 undefeated challengers, I rate Vitali at number one.. Lewis would be number 2 because Lewis beat every man he’s ever fought (officially). Holmes would be number 3 because he fought to age 53 and wiped the floor with Ray Mercer at age 43. Holmes had the best jab ever, and may have been the best pure heavyweight boxer ever.. Wladimir may be number 4, and after that its something of a grab bag …. For all fighters in all weight divisions I’d say Floyd Mayweather Jr is the best ever.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:45 pm 


BEARS

Tark-go ahead and answer me now

Posted August 17, 2012 8:26 pm 


TARK

Most people who talk down the K Bros are jealous Americans. Ali was whipped by Frazier, Norton, and Leon Spinks by the time he was Wladimir’s age, 36.. Wladimir also has 3 defeats but he’s going to be around for a lot longer because his defense is much harder to solve and he stays in much better condition.. Vitali is 41 and has never been knocked down. He’s never even been behind on points in any fight. Pretty remarkable, but I wish Vitali would fight Haye, who is much better than the guy who showed up for the Wladimir fight. Dereck Chisora still doesn’t know what hit him. Ray Leonard was sitting ringside and said, “You don’t see that kind of speed and power combinaton in a heavyweight. David Haye is amazing.”

Posted August 17, 2012 8:26 pm 


TARK

Russian…. You’re a moron… Everything I said was true. Foreman frequently called Lewis the “Greatest Heavyweight Champion of all time” but was very critical of Lewis’s fouling in the Vitali fight. Moorer was KO’d a lot faster by Tua and Holyfield 2 — because Moorer was a light heavyweight for most of his fights to the time he fought Foreman and he had no chin. That was the ONLY KO Foreman scored in his last 7 fights.. George couldn’t even stop Tommy Morrison, who couldn’t get through the 1st round against Michael Bentt.. Shannon Briggs couldn’t win a round off of Vitali, Lewis, Wilson, McCline, or Ibragimov, but beat Foreman … who never did learn how to box.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:05 pm 


Peej

I remember some of his early fights, and I’m not saying the way he is fighting is not the smart way of fighting but I just don’t like it. For me I like Floyd, he doesn’t run around, doesn’t have great power but to me it is not boring to watch him box. With Wlad it is just so robotic that it is very boring for me.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:31 pm 


BEARS

Tark- are the klitschkos top 10 in your book? What did u think of that top 10 list?

Posted August 17, 2012 7:26 pm 


Tony Bachagaluppi

Peej……in Wladimirs early career prior to Corrie Sanders, Wlad was a balls to the wall fighter
with devastating Knock Outs with exciting TKO’s. Manny got him smart about defense, which
included a boring safety first objective. Win by being safe. Check out some of his early KO’s
on youtube. Asta Lumbago.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:22 pm 


TARK

@Bear…. I had other things to do.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:20 pm 


TARK

Supreme Court… Both David Haye and Tomaz Adamek will be in the HOF. Both are 2-division world champions. Ingemar Johansson made the HOF and he never made one successful title defense of the only title he won. These guys are still active. You don’t make the Hall while you’re still fighting.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:17 pm 


Peej

They are boring fighters. That is there problem. No denying that they are great fighters but they are boring.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:13 pm 


BEARS

Tark!!! Where have you been? You haven’t been around for a year or more!

Posted August 17, 2012 7:10 pm 


Tony Bachagaluppi

Tark, you are soooooo correct. I saw Lewis rip Vitali with what thought were lacing rips. Vitali was caught in the corner and Lewis ‘Laced’ him.
That is what I saw. Lewis did what he had to to win, knowing Vitali was laying down some heavy leather. Hey, Lewis won, but I think he used
dirty tricks.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:08 pm 


Supreme Court

Which legacy are you talking about?
In the combined records of both Klitchko, there is not a single Hal-of-famer!!!
I repeat: NOT A SINGLE HALL OF FAMER!!! What a shame!!!! Theonly time they faced a HOF, they were TKOed!!!!
Nuff’ said!!!

Posted August 17, 2012 6:42 pm 


BEARS

People wanna talk ring accomplishments and its vitaly all day with his stats and wlad with his records and vitaly has his records too. Plus minus ratio says vitalys the most dominant heavyweight in history. The ko % record is astonishing. I think even adamek and haye are gona hang with guys like norton and frazier and potentally beat them. Saying past fighters are comp was better is subjective. To say they would walk through all the klitschkos comp I whole heartidly believe some of the past guys would not get by some of the klitschkos comp. Some of the “greats” if were calling frazier and norton “greats” I don’t see them making it past

Posted August 17, 2012 6:18 pm 


Migraine Elliott

Wlad could face Vitali for a unification bout, and alas, Vitali pulls a Sonny Liston after being tapped on the head by Wlad., and lays down.
Counted out as he shades his eyes from the lights, and Wlad now has the WBC BELT!!!!!!!

Posted August 17, 2012 6:02 pm 


BEARS

Past greats could potentially strugge or have interesting matchups with david haye, sam peter, cris arreola, lennox lewis, tony thompson, jameel mccline, ray mercer, ibragimov, byrd, rahman (who gave lewis trouble so he already gave a past great trouble), the way lyle and foreman started off and foreman faceplanting I think even sanders could trouble some past greats, ya never know son. Styles make fights. :roll: :twisted:

Posted August 17, 2012 5:20 pm 


cBob

Well written. Keep up the good work!

Posted August 17, 2012 5:15 pm 


Shane

When Vitali retires I wish the WBC would force a Wlad vs thier #1 for the belt. Otherwise I fear some chump like Haye will get it and run denying complete unification. The WBC is going to change “champions” twice a year if Wlad doesn’t get it. :evil:

Posted August 17, 2012 5:06 pm 


Miatesvallenverga

The Klitschko brother are the best Heavywieght boxers of all time they punk all the brothers

Posted August 17, 2012 5:02 pm 


The Kingslayer

To quote Mike Tyson they will fade into Bolivia.

Posted August 17, 2012 4:53 pm 


scottyboy

Not really sure what you’re saying. I’m saying (quite rightfully) that any top HW since Ali beats every single fighter either klit has beaten with ease. You name Ali as being in a weak era but he has wins over foreman, frazier and norton. All of these would terrorise any opponent either klit has beaten.

Posted August 17, 2012 4:47 pm 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Clay 28-4 (9 ko’s), Frazier 13-4 (5 ko’s), Foreman 59-5 bums beater, Holmes 60-5 (featherfisted bums beater). ALL OF THESE GUYS ARE IN FACT LOCAL US CHAMPS.

Posted August 17, 2012 4:33 pm 


Anonymous

@ Dara well said brother!!!!!!

Posted August 17, 2012 4:25 pm 


Beer Party Movement

philly shell: was Foremans footwork great ? better than Wlads ? Foreman went life and death with a very limited Ron Lyle, and he was beaten by Jimmy Young, did Young have something that Wlad doesnt have ? hmmmm… i dont think so. And how many time did Foreman who you think is so great that he can beat the Klitschko´s defend his title ? I like Foreman a lot but all sports develops, try to deal with it. And yes Wlad was beaten by Sanders, who happends to be a lot faster than Foreman.

Posted August 17, 2012 4:19 pm 


Dara

Ok sleep well

Posted August 17, 2012 3:31 pm 


philly shell

Calling either Klit the best heavyweight ever is absurd in the extreme. I’d put money on a prime Larry Holmes to make them look like amateurs. Young George Foreman would KO Wlad easy. The older version probably would too. If Corrie Sanders could do it you better believe Foreman would do it better. Rocky Marciano, Joe Louis, Jack Johnson, Ali, Frazier – I could read off a bunch of names of fighters who have done more in their careers and will leave a more lasting legacy.

Posted August 17, 2012 3:22 pm 


Box Smart

The Klitschko legacy will be smashed to pieces when they get in the ring with my bro Tyson Fury, it will be the end of an era and a beginning of another!!!!!!

Posted August 17, 2012 3:17 pm 


Dara

Vitali goes down as the greatest heavyweight in history. This guy is a F beast. I hope he knocks out Charr and then retires. He was properly beaten in a fight. He retired L Lewis. Lewis thought the cut would get him out of a rematch and he was looking to get a rematch with Tyson were they could both make 20 odd mill each. Instead Vitali came back and ripped Kirk Johnson a new one. Lewis had to fight him next but he made the very sensible decision and let Vitali retire him. Everyone loves Ali but Vitali would had hurt him so bad and got him out of there within 8 rds.

Posted August 17, 2012 2:53 pm 


Bonzai

I’m not really getting where all the “clumsy” and “uncoordintated” comments are coming from. Robotic and stiff, sure, but I have never seen them really off balance or swinging wildly. On the contrary, I see them as extremely measured and highly accurate punchers with a connect percent above 40% in many fights. I can understand the hate. We were spoiled by an amazing era. Starting with Tyson and ending with Lewis. It was an exciting era in boxing. One to rival the 60′s-70′s, and even the turn of the century “golden era”. As for their places in History… I’ve said before that Vitali has the physical gifts, and technical skills to give any heavy weight of any era a rough night. I’m not saying he would beat them all, but it would be a real long night for them. However you have to rate them on accomplishments in the ring, and aside from Lewis, there were not any real “greats” on the resume. (and Ironically, of all the all time great heavy weights, Lewis was the one most qualified to beat him on a size and skill level. That and a prime George Forman would be a great fight).

Posted August 17, 2012 2:40 pm 


Rich

Strange he never tried to avenge that loss to Byrd…..

Posted August 17, 2012 2:35 pm 


UbeReem

Are you kidding, just look at the guys Tyson or Ali fought. Ali struggled with guys that were on the level of a Fabio Moli. If the K-bros fought in the Ali era, they would be as dominant as today and people would be saying its the worst era. People call the Ali era the golden era simply because there wasnt anyone with head and shoulders above the rest, but more guys on the same level who were losing to each other giving people exciting fights. Just watch this so called golden era, they were all so easily hitable, so you got Gatti-Ward type of wars and thats pretty much about it.

Posted August 17, 2012 2:12 pm 


BEARS

I think some of the namer fights since the 60s may struggle with haye. Angelo dundee thought so too

Posted August 17, 2012 2:02 pm 


UbeReem

Outside of Holyfield there are hardy any leftovers that got a title shot

Posted August 17, 2012 2:00 pm 


scottyboy

I think the main reason to be people not appreciating the klits is that they simply have not beaten anyone worth anything at all. Look at all the HW greats since around the time of Ali…do you really see any of them struggling with anyone at all that either klit has beaten? Remaining dominant for so long is a good feat but in this division, I’m afraid it doesnt count for much at all. Doing something that stands out as being unique is what captures the boxing fans. This doesnt include beating sub-par opposition that would lose to every single one of the top HWs in history.

Posted August 17, 2012 1:56 pm 


K2Fan

Since everyone has an opinion , and is entitled to it , here is mine . Without a
doubt , the Klitchko Brothers are the GREATEST heavyweight fighters ever !
Maybe not the quickest , perhaps not the
most fluid , possibly not the fastest ,
may not be the best boxers , but without a doubt in my mind , they ARE the Greatest ! Not only have they achieved
unprecendented success in the ring , but
by their behavior and bearing outside the ring , their generosity , their concern
for others , they are exemplary role models for young people all over the world . Too many people , especially
those of limited intellect and vision , rate
greatness only one dimensionaly . Like
the guy that calls them ” very good ” . Or
thinks that ” the best ” has to ” excite
the public ” . I always felt that excitment
is quite personal ; what excites you , may
not neccesarily excite me . Also how does ones ability to excite someone , translate into having say , the best K.O. ratio in history ? There is a guy here , who , judging from the limited intelligence betrayed by his posts , has
probably never seen more of the world
than he could walk , claiming that the
Klitchkos are virtually unknown , except ; ” in Germany and Eastern Europe ” . But he’s also entitled to his opinion…. Back to the original issue ;
Greatness is to a great extent , also measured by the impact , the greats make on other people . And here, only a really disfunctional human being would
argue with that . Aside from their donations to all sorts of charitable
causes in Ukraine , Africa , Japan, actually
all over the world , they have created sports centers , boxing schools , orphanages etc . Their influence and their heritage is already evident as shown
in the Olympics , where Ukraine won
more medals in MEN’S boxing , than any other country ! This kind of influence
and this kind of leadership is what makes the Klitchkos really the GREATEST !

Posted August 17, 2012 1:31 pm 


Cary Simmons

The Klit Bros suck! Two mediocre heavyweight champions with several losses, a weak division, and they can’t fight one another because they are brothers. a nightmare scenario.

Posted August 17, 2012 1:11 pm 


Miller

The reason they are not respected in the U.S. is that all of the top rated fighters are from Europe. They are not televised here so people here say that they are fighting bums because we do not know who they are. I happen to think the division looks stronger now then it was in the 70s and 80s. Anyone who really believes Ali and Foreman would have done well now are just telling lies to them selves. Tyson time was total crap has any actually gone back and looked at the fat out of shape clowns he was fighting ?

Posted August 17, 2012 12:15 pm 


Neil Groid

Matador made some decent points in his last post.

Posted August 17, 2012 11:03 am 


FoxBox

Imagine if Wlad had Steward as his trainer from the start…

Posted August 17, 2012 10:34 am 


Roswitha Baltes

Wladimir improves as a boxer and Champion with Emanuel Steward. Unfortunaly he did not work from the beginning of his career with Steward. But Wlad shows great heart and he works hard since 2004 to become Champ again. Today he is the No. 1 Heavyweight Champion and he will be an ATG when he retired.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:32 am 


FoxBox

The annoying thing about wladmir is that in his physical prime he was less technically skilled than he became inlater years with Steward.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:27 am 


Neil (pomy)

… but there is a huge difference from being “the best in the world” and being able to excite to public. Being the best doesnt make you popular, entertaining the fans makes you popular. The K-brothers will never be huge in the states, the UK or anywhere outside of Germany and Eastern Europe becuase they dont generate excitement. Both brothers will be appreciated more when they retire just like Lennox Lewis has. America could get over the fact they are foreign, if the division gave them something to be excited about. This is hard to do becuase the division has been very poor for years. Just like the 80′s appeared rubbish after the 70′s ….. so do the 2000′s after the 90′s. No Holyfield, no Lewis, no Mercer, no Bowe, not even a faded Tyson or a fat Forman …… instead, in the modern era, we have 2 brothers (who are top quality) but no one else. This is evident in the fact that all these left-over faded fighters from the 90′s are still getting title shots.

I think things will get better though, we have some good prospects coming through …… finally!!!!

Posted August 17, 2012 10:27 am 


Brazilian Boxing Fan

Wlad is the best Heavyweight today. Top 5 of All-Time.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:25 am 


FoxBox

The younger vitali who fought lewis would beat lewis 7 times out of 10 IMO. Simply on the basis that cuts aren’t commonplace and it was vitali’s bad luck on the night. Lewis made the right decision to avoid the rematch and keep his health, Vitali is possibly the biggest puncher the heavyweight division has seen!

Posted August 17, 2012 10:24 am 


FoxBox

Lewis had the option of a rematch with vitali that would bring millions of profit, fame, and the possibility of asserting his dominance once and for all. But lewis turned down the rematch which says it all.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:18 am 


matthews

VK lost to Bryd, who Wlad destroyed twice. VK quit, so he lost. WK’s resume far exceeds VK’s.

Posted August 17, 2012 10:03 am 


amanda

Nonsense, half of Klitschkos’ opponents would steamroll over Ali, let alone Klitschko himself.

Ali never ever faced such high quality opposition like Klitschkos’ opponents. Instead Ali had to fight featherfists like Frazier and chinachins like Ken Norton.

Frazier and Norton would be B-level comp nowadays.

The best win of Ali is against Foreman, but Foreman is a head shorter than the Klitschkos and is 2-3 KO leagues below Wlad.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:58 am 


Curtley

Bill you keep going on about real heavyweights etc etc but never address the fact that Wlad lost to Purity, Brewster and Sanders only avenging the Brewster loss, this is what will always hurt his legacy and for me keep him behind his less talented brother who has only really lost to Lewis. Also regardless of speculation you cannot put either brother above Lewis as Wlads resume is inferior and Vitali lost to him. They are cracking heavies but to me sit just outside the best ever.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:35 am 


terror tim

Ignorance plain and simple. It was the Golden Era of boxing because there was a lot of great boxers not just two like there is now. You can’t sit there and say that there is the same level of competition. Outside the K bros there is no one. To say this era even compares shows you are simply bias.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:34 am 


Curtley

Come on whilst Floyd is seen as boring his skill set and natural gifts are far beyond the Klitschkos and even Lennox Lewis P4P there is no comparison Floyd is a Bugatti Veyron whilst the brothers are BMW’s top notch but not a super car.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:32 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

My free time is off, got to work. All the best!

Posted August 17, 2012 9:23 am 


Matador

Another thing….%$#@ this Muhammad Ali “Golden Age of Heavyweights” bull$#!#. You know why Americans call it the “Golden Age?” Because it was only American boxers, and that’s because the Soviet Union was kicking and Eastern fighters WEREN’T ALLOWED TO FIGHT AS PROS!!! Now the Iron Curtain is down and everyone can compete. Wlad is the literal world champion in a way Ali simply was not.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:22 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

VLADIMIR KLICHKO IS THE BEST REAL (200+LBS) HEAVYWEIGHT BOXER EVER. 61 REAL HEAVYWEIGHT FIGHTS AND ONLY THREE DEFEATS…NOBODY…EVER…HAS HAD THIS KIND OF SUCCESS IN 200+LBS DIVISION. Plus, he is the best KO artist ever, 51 KO out of 58 wins – this is UNIQUE ACHIEVEMENT. Plus, his level of dominance over every possible top contender…It’s unbelievable actually, Vladimir KlichKO is not a usual heavyweight, in fact he is a UNIQUE HEAVYWEIGHT…Lewis had only 42 REAL HW FIGHTS 39-2-1, Vladimir KlichKO already has 61 real heavyweight fight 58-3 (51 KO). Feel the difference…Vladimir KlichKO has beaten 19 unbeaten or only once beaten REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS (will have 20 after the Wach fight) whereas Lewis has only 9!!! Just think about it…IN FACT, VLADIMIR HAS BEATEN THE STRONGEST OPPOSITION OF REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS EVER. Just Imagine if Vladimir KlichKO would be fighting for the Star spangled banner…He would be a bigger star than Bill Clinton…

Posted August 17, 2012 9:20 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Lewis opponents were not very strong heavyweight boxers. His best wins are Golota, Tua, Holyfield, Tyson, Rahman, Grant and Mercer. Are this guys world beaters? Of course they are not. HOLYFIELD 27-10 AND TYSON 45-6 WERE THE MOST HYPED AND ADVERTISED BOXERS IN THE STATES, BUT THEY WERE CHAMPIONS OF THE UNITED STATES IN FACT. And they are Americans. In fact, LEWIS’ MOST DANGEROUS AND THE ONLY ONE REALLY GREAT OPPONENT IS VITALIY KLICHKO.

Posted August 17, 2012 9:01 am 


Jimmy

LMAO! This comment is laughable. The current era of heavyweight boxing is easily the WORST in history. The K-Bros are fantastic boxers BUT this era is brutally bad. To argue this is ridiculous. It’s unfortunate for them, but it is what it is.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:51 am 


Michael Katac

If Vitali did not get injured before the Rahamn fights I think he would ahve a huge following here in the US. He was a fan favorite in LA after his fights with LEwis and Sanders and was becoming a star here in the US. But after the retirement and fighting most of his fights in Europe after he came back he had lost that momentum that he had here.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:42 am 


Michael Katac

Geoff this was a great article. I have to say though I Vitali had been allowed to continue against Lennox I think Lewis would have stopped him. Vitali was in control early but as Lennox settled in to the fight he was connecting at a higher percentage and was much more accurate. Vitali was tiring and Lewis would have got him. I wish there could have been a rematch. Wlad has retooled and is much better now but he does not like getting hit. I remeber in the fight with Sultan every time a punch was coming towards his head he looked like a deer in the headlights. There is no one out there right now that can beat these guys except for FAther Time and with the way these guys stay in shape and live well I think they can hold FAther Time off for a little while longer. Once there is nothing left to prove they should make sure they do not stay too long. They both have money and their marbles and can do other things outside of boxing to make a living and a contribution to the world. They are good ambassadors to the sport.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:40 am 


Bill (KlichKO brothers are the best REAL HEAVYWEIGHTS ever)

Hah our American patriotic media made a star out of BLOODY BORING FLOYD MAYWEATHER. They don’t even call him boring while his fights are borefests. KLICHKO BROS ARE NOT AMERICANS – IT IS THEIR BIGGEST ISSUE. Ask Evander Holyfield (27-10 Real HW RESUME). He said exactly the same. Americans love their own because Americans are PATRIOTS.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:28 am 


Matador

Before Wlad won the belt we had 4 American champions (Byrd, Ruiz, Rahman, Brewster). All of the them sucked, all of them fought 3rd raters, and none of them (aside from Brewster) could knock anyone out. But…I don’t recall American fans — or any toher fans — giving them NEARLY the kind of crap they give to the K Brothers.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:21 am 


UbeReem

That the K-bros fought in a weak era is a myth, Byrd, Haye, Chambers, Solis and Peter would all do great in the past eras and I would take any of those guys over a faded Holyfield and Tyson.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:12 am 


Matador

Why are the K Brothers “boring?” It’s because they’re not Americans! Period.

Bernard Hopkins hasn’t knocked someone out in 9 years and every fight’s been boring, but the boxing press practically masturbates to his fights. Floyd Mayweather’s fights are usually boring, and he’s the “savior of the sport.” It’s just hypocrisy, plain and simple. They’d be more popular if they fought like Arturo Gatti, but they’d be WAAAAY more popular if they were Americans.

Posted August 17, 2012 8:06 am 


Geoff

i totally agree witht he above poster…they are very talented and what they do, they do very well, but they have not excited the division. Sadly watching Wlad is VERY frustrating as his style just isnt pleasing…always safety first…some of his opponents you feel he could of blown away inside a few rounds but nope…he pokes out the jab, fannys about and hugs, holds out the jab, puts it in their face…just bloody boring stuff.

Posted August 17, 2012 7:02 am 


Neil (pomy)

I think people generally respect the K-boys – its just that they have so far failed to capture peoples imagination (outside Germany and Eastern Europe). To get people talking, you need to excite people … and this is something the K-boys have failed to do. Some of that can be blamed on the poor state of the division. The K-brothers are obviously very good but they have not had any competition to look exciting against ….. instead we have left-overs from the Lewis-and-Holyfield era or blown-up cruiserweights. No one can seriously get excited over opponents like an ancient Shannon Briggs, or an inept Mormeck, or pedestrian boxer like Thompson. SAdly Haye flopped against Wladimir and Ademek was embarassingly useless against Vitali. Now we get Char!!!!!!!!! Come on!!!! At least Chisora gave Vitali a tough fight.

Posted August 17, 2012 5:16 am 



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The Klitschko Dream & The Klitschko Legacy









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