Prime for Prime: Mike Tyson .Vs. Joe Louis

[la-califa]

Who would win this battle between "Iron " Mike Tyson and "The Brown Bomber" Joe Louis? Prime for Prime 15 Rounds. The Peak Tyson who just destroyed Michael Spinks & the Louis who just decimated Max Schmelling.

[Quickhands21]

Mike Tyson by early knockout..

[Loewe]

Louis comes of the canvas to KO Tyson in the 5th in one of the greatest hw fights ever.

[Quickhands21]

Tyson was way to fast.hit way to hard .had a better defense and was all around just a better fighter

[rydersonthestorm]

Tyson was way to fast.hit way to hard .had a better defense and was all around just a better fighter:rofl :rofl
i think tyson would beat louis but in no way is he a better fighter

[BlackWater]

Tyson tko mid rounds

[Russell]

No idea. I think Louis just might be too easy to hit to survive a early Tyson barrage.

[Loewe]

Tyson was way to fast.hit way to hard .had a better defense and was all around just a better fighter

with that you disqualified yourself completly from that discussion. Ner saw that one coming. I´m a bit shocked :admin

[ChrisPontius]

50/50 fight to me. Tyson with the somewhat better chin (in taking bombs, not accumulative punishment) and perhaps defense early on, but Louis is a machine who doesn't slow down, never gets dis encouraged and always keep coming.

[TommyV]

Tyson TKO 6/7.

Too much speed & power, Louis had it aswell, but not on the level of Tyson. I don't think he would survive the Tyson onslaught.

[Mega Lamps]

Louis has his shaky moments in the beginning but comes back to knock Tyson out sometime in the mid to late rounds.
Louis KO9 Tyson

[Sweet Pea]

Tyson by early KO. Louis lacked the defense needed to stand up to Tyson's early barrage.

[Bokaj]

Tyson by early KO. Louis lacked the defense needed to stand up to Tyson's early barrage.

I'm leaning this way, as well.

[janitor]

I would pick Louis here because on paper he has the ideal style to beat Tyson with the right fight plan.

Honestly though this would be a nightmare fight to predict if it were happening tomorrow. We are matching perhaps the two most devastating punchers of all time and they are both going to have to stand in harms way to get the job done.

While I rate the punch resistance of both men verry highly I wouldnt bet on anybodys chin holding up against either of them. One well placed combination could turn the fight either way or end it.

Honestly anything could happen.

[rydersonthestorm]

I would pick Louis here because on paper he has the ideal style to beat Tyson with the right fight plan.

Honestly though this would be a nightmare fight to predict if it were happening tomorrow. We are matching perhaps the two most devastating punchers of all time and they are both going to have to stand in harms way to get the job done.

While I rate the punch resistance of both men verry highly I wouldnt bet on anybodys chin holding up against either of them. One well placed combination could turn the fight either way or end it.

Honestly anything could happen.
wouldn't agree on the chins i would say tyson is a few levels above louis when it comes to chin. Tyson isn't a guy to be dropped by a one of shot or even a combo he needs to be beaten down before it starts to crack.

[Bokaj]

wouldn't agree on the chins i would say tyson is a few levels above louis when it comes to chin. Tyson isn't a guy to be dropped by a one of shot or even a combo he needs to be beaten down before it starts to crack.

Yeah, can't really see Tyson being floored by Braddock or rocked by Conn. The guys that KO'd or hurt him (Douglas, Ruddock, Bruno, Holyfield, Lewis etc) were in another division when it comes to punching power.

[Ramon Rojo]

Tyson by KO

[janitor]

wouldn't agree on the chins i would say tyson is a few levels above louis when it comes to chin. Tyson isn't a guy to be dropped by a one of shot or even a combo he needs to be beaten down before it starts to crack.

I am in no doubt that Tyson had a much better chin but that is not everything.

Some "durable" fighters have unexceptional chins but outstanding recuperative abilities and ability to fight while hurt. Louis is verry much an example of this.

At the end of the day it is not their chins but their punching ability that is the issue.

I would be confident that both Louis and Tyson could eat a few George Foreman right hands as part of a fight plan if they had to. I would bet nothing about how Louis would take Tysons shots or Tyson would take Louis's shots.

[Quickhands21]

:rofl :rofl
i think tyson would beat louis but in no way is he a better fighter
I think he's a far superior fighter..I don't usually talk about all that advanced shit,but Tyson is really in a different league when it comes to talent..Just watch Film of both.Yeah and Tyson beat better opponents. Joe would end up in the Hospital.and I love the brown bomber

[rydersonthestorm]

I think he's a far superior fighter..I don't usually talk about all that advanced shit,but Tyson is really in a different league when it comes to talent..Just watch Film of both.Yeah and Tyson beat better opponents. He'd destroy joe..
your probably one of only 3 people in the world that think that and mike tyson isn't one of them

[Jbuz]

This is no doubt a fight that could go either way. Tyson is extremely overrated by his fanatics in head to head matchups, but quite often underrated by the casual fan - probably a subconscious attempt to offset the fanatics.

Mike would be a bad matchup of Louis because I feel that such explosive speed and power, in addition to pressure would really trouble his relatively stationary style. I have no doubt that if Tyson is wreckless in his attack that Louis will make him pay, and make him pay big. His power is up there with the best at heavyweight, including Tyson, and his handspeed isn't too far behind. Nonetheless, I think Tyson takes this by stoppage in around the 8th round. I know it wouldn't be an overly popular opinion, but Tyson is one of only 3 fighters I would pick against Louis. But once again, Louis could knock Tyson if he got wreckless.

[Quickhands21]

your probably one of only 3 people in the world that think that and mike tyson isn't one of them
Ok..I guess im one of the 3 then..Ali said he couldnt beat mike.what does that mean? nothing..Fighters are humble..

[El Puma]

I cannot see either not taking the other seriously so.....a tremendous and explosive fight when they open up. Not entirely sure Blackburn could come up with a game plan(based on Joe's physical ability) that negates a motivated and advancing Mega-Tyson.

[rydersonthestorm]

Ok..I guess im one of the 3 then..Ali said he couldnt beat mike.what does that mean? nothing..Fighters are humble..
if you read what i have put i think tyson beats louis but in no way is he a betetr fighter, i am pretty shocked you even think this but than again thats upto you.

[jonesjrp4p1]

Tyson by early KO. Louis lacked the defense needed to stand up to Tyson's early barrage.

:good

[McGrain]

50/50 fight to me. Tyson with the somewhat better chin (in taking bombs, not accumulative punishment) and perhaps defense early on, but Louis is a machine who doesn't slow down, never gets dis encouraged and always keep coming.

Pretty much how I see it.

I think the defining factor would be strength. Mike is only better at one range, just shy of chest to chest, mid-range, I suppose, is how we describe it. Louis can shorten the gap to close range easily unless Mike can bull him about.

This is a fight I would never lay money on before the fight, but would be confident of my pick after one round. Push me, I'll pick Louis by KO.

[McGrain]

I am in no doubt that Tyson had a much better chin but that is not everything.

Some "durable" fighters have unexceptional chins but outstanding recuperative abilities and ability to fight while hurt. Louis is verry much an example of this

Yeah.

I've heard My Dinner WIth Conteh describe it as "tide-turning" chin. Tyson does not have that type of chin, he is not the type of fighter that gets a hiding and turns the tide at the back of it.

Louis can get hurt and win, maybe if Tyson is being battered, he can't.

[Nick Balsamo]

No idea. I think Louis just might be too easy to hit to survive a early Tyson barrage.

I agree. Louis ranks 2nd all-time behind the great Ali and Tyson is about somewhere from 7 to 12... But considering potential advantages for Tyson, it's hard to pick against him here.

He's as fast and powerful than Louis, he should be stronger and he's not a candidate to flash KD's like Louis is. His movement and defense in his prime is better. He moves his head allright, he's a fast starter too. Louis could be in trouble here.

[janitor]

I think he's a far superior fighter..I don't usually talk about all that advanced shit,but Tyson is really in a different league when it comes to talent..Just watch Film of both.Yeah and Tyson beat better opponents. Joe would end up in the Hospital.and I love the brown bomber

How can you possibly argue that Tyson beat better oponents than Louis?

On that score at least Louis has a substantial advantage.

I would also question how you could conclude that Tyson was more talented. Tyson is basicaly only good at fighting one way while Louis has many more layers to his game.

[TIGEREDGE]

to beat a prime tyson with a style like JL's, you must have a really good chin. louis chin was far from the best

he never had the speed to avoid mikes 100 mph barrage. tyson ko in 7

i fancy louis to beat the tyson of 89 onwards. louis would be able to time the more predictable tyson

[TIGEREDGE]

to beat a prime tyson with a style like JL's, you must have a really good chin. louis chin was far from the best

he never had the speed to avoid mikes 100 mph barrage. tyson ko in 7

i fancy louis to beat the tyson of 89 onwards. louis would be able to time the more predictable tyson

a lot of people make there judgements on tyson based on his exploits after his very short prime. tyson was a different animal from 85-88 to the one of 89 onwards.

we will never know how great he really was

[Stonehands89]

a lot of people make there judgements on tyson based on his exploits after his very short prime. tyson was a different animal from 85-88 to the one of 89 onwards.

we will never know how great he really was
Neither Tyson's style nor his character allowed for a prime that was much longer than it was. It was a high-energy burn-out style and his intense training would only accelerate that rapid deterioration. Rooney or no Rooney. Without Rooney, the thin veil covering Tyson's inner adolescent was removed. And adolescents aren't exactly known for their character and resilience and grace -"days of grace" tattoos notwithstanding.

There are two windows here that Tyson would need to win. If both were apparant, I'd favor Tyson- and an early KO would not be out of the question. The first is it would have to be the 1987-1988 version of Tyson. Rooney must be present. Tyson must be at his actual peak. The second window is roughly the first 6 rounds. After that, Joe is going to come on and Tyson will be substantially less dangerous and substantially less confident.

Many believe that Louis relied too much on Blackburn for answers -that Blackburn was the brains behind the Joe Louis operation. This became less true with experience and Louis' performances at an advanced age prove it. He became almost wily. Tyson was no strategist and never showed much strategic or even tactical prowess. As he aged he became far less than his experience should have dictated. Tyson was more of a machine than Louis in the derogatory sense. His style was formed and adapted to deal with larger men who had a jab... but he never became a thinker in the ring. He was always emotional however. Louis was anything but that. Louis saw what there was to do and did it. That deadpan expression was real. Louis was more of a machine in the better sense... he never lost control of himself or his objective, even in the losses. As the "character rounds" come on, Louis should be favored, especially considering that Tyson will be getting hit with several short explosive shots throughout the bout.

Tyson must dispatch Joe early.... or else. The probability here is that he wouldn't.

[Bad_Intentions]

Tyson TKO.

i love joe louis as well, but tyson was just too aggressive and his power/speed was far more superior than louis's.

[Bokaj]

I would also question how you could conclude that Tyson was more talented. Tyson is basicaly only good at fighting one way while Louis has many more layers to his game.

I very much agree. Without their punching power Louis still would be a very good fighter while Tyson wouldn't to the same degree.

[Bokaj]

to beat a prime tyson with a style like JL's, you must have a really good chin. louis chin was far from the best

he never had the speed to avoid mikes 100 mph barrage. tyson ko in 7

i fancy louis to beat the tyson of 89 onwards. louis would be able to time the more predictable tyson

I think Tyson always was quite predictable and only really hard to hit in the first round or so. As early as the fight against Pinklon Thomas you can see how Thomas gradually gets the measure of Tyson and starts to take the fight to him before tiring and being overpowered. The commentators say after 5 rounds that Thomas makes Tyson fight his fight. Of course, since he was tiring it was only a matter of time anyway...

But he didn't seem impossible to deal with to any extent in that fight. For me, Douglas confirmed this against a less focussed, but basically the same, Tyson.

[Minotauro]

I would pick Louis to get of the canvas and stop Tyson in the 9th.

[Quickhands21]

I very much agree. Without their punching power Louis still would be a very good fighter while Tyson wouldn't to the same degree.
If Louis didnt have his power he becomes even more oridinary than Tyson..Joes conterpunching was really effective cause he had the great power behind those shots. Mike was faster on his feet,and had better handspeed and body movement..Louis had stamina and accuracy on mike..Thats about it

[Bokaj]

If Louis didnt have his power he becomes even more oridinary than Tyson..His conterpunching was really effective cause he had the great power behind those shots. Mike was faster on his feet,and had better handspeed and body movement..Louis had stamina and accuracy on mike..Thats about it

That's pretty much if you take away the power. If Tyson had been that agressive against those big guys without the power to back it up he would have been less succesful to say the least. And that was the only way he knew how to fight. Louis could adapt his style to a higher degree, and his skill and accuracy would still make him a successfull counter puncher.

Stamina also becomes more important in the absence of power, since you need it to grind your opponent down over a longer stretch. This becomes even more true if your opponents are bigger than you. Name me one succesful swarmer that didn't have either great stamina (mental and physical) or great power.

[janitor]

If Louis didnt have his power he becomes even more oridinary than Tyson..His conterpunching was really effective cause he had the great power behind those shots. Mike was faster on his feet,and had better handspeed and body movement..Louis had stamina and accuracy on mike..Thats about it

If you take away Louis's power he would still be able to outpoint most fighters.

Tyson wouldnt.

[Holmes' Jab]

Louis survives a few early hairy moments to stop Tyson late, in a barnstorming matchup between the two best composite punchers in the divisions history.


Louis TKO11 Tyson. :good

[Holmes' Jab]

[quote]How can you possibly argue that Tyson beat better oponents than Louis?


I honestly don't think there's a case there. Louis' best couple of opponents of whom he beat are better than anyone s prime Tyson defeated. Tysons title opp in the 80's was good on the whole, but it doesn't match Louis' overall. No way.


On that score at least Louis has a substantial advantage.

Whilst I think Louis holds an advantage in that regard I don't for one minute think anyone in terms of talent is clearly better than a peak Tyson.

I would also question how you could conclude that Tyson was more talented. Tyson is basicaly only good at fighting one way while Louis has many more layers to his game.

Louis had more strings to his bow of that I agree, however at his best Tyson was so good at his 'one way of fighting' that it always worked for him, devestatingly so alot of the time. In terms of getting up from the floor to win, changing strategy in the middle of the fight to turn the tide in his favour as well as adapting in there against great fighters Louis was more proven over the course of his career.

[Holmes' Jab]

I do think more stylistic aces are held by Louis here were they tp square off. In essence he would make Tyson come to him, Tyson would initiate the exchanges, but Louis would pick his shots in the usual economically devestating fashion. Short, quick and devestating combinations, that you caould barely see coming much of the time and with with leverage and power will seal the deal for Louis late on. Barely anyone in heavyweight history fought of the backfoot as effectively as Louis did.

[LennoxGOAT]

Louis.

There isn't an ATG that I would favor Tyson against. He is by far the worst of the bunch.

[Holmes' Jab]

There isn't an ATG that I would favor Tyson against. He is by far the worst of the bunch.


What? As an ATG surely if a fighter is seen as being top 10 or so that term applies. If you're top 20 you're still a very good-great heavyweight too. So you can't see Tyson beating Patterson, Marciano, Schmeling, Frazier, Foreman* amongst a few others then?:huh




*I realize that I'm likely in the minority with that one.

[werety]

Neither Tyson's style nor his character allowed for a prime that was much longer than it was. It was a high-energy burn-out style and his intense training would only accelerate that rapid deterioration. Rooney or no Rooney. Without Rooney, the thin veil covering Tyson's inner adolescent was removed. And adolescents aren't exactly known for their character and resilience and grace -"days of grace" tattoos notwithstanding.

There are two windows here that Tyson would need to win. If both were apparant, I'd favor Tyson- and an early KO would not be out of the question. The first is it would have to be the 1987-1988 version of Tyson. Rooney must be present. Tyson must be at his actual peak. The second window is roughly the first 6 rounds. After that, Joe is going to come on and Tyson will be substantially less dangerous and substantially less confident.

Many believe that Louis relied too much on Blackburn for answers -that Blackburn was the brains behind the Joe Louis operation. This became less true with experience and Louis' performances at an advanced age prove it. He became almost wily. Tyson was no strategist and never showed much strategic or even tactical prowess. As he aged he became far less than his experience should have dictated. Tyson was more of a machine than Louis in the derogatory sense. His style was formed and adapted to deal with larger men who had a jab... but he never became a thinker in the ring. He was always emotional however. Louis was anything but that. Louis saw what there was to do and did it. That deadpan expression was real. Louis was more of a machine in the better sense... he never lost control of himself or his objective, even in the losses. As the "character rounds" come on, Louis should be favored, especially considering that Tyson will be getting hit with several short explosive shots throughout the bout.

Tyson must dispatch Joe early.... or else. The probability here is that he wouldn't.

You explained perfectly why Louis should be favored if the fight goes past the mid rounds, but how do you see Louis surviving early? The way I see it he doesn't have the best mobility, defense, or chin for surviving the first few rounds with Tyson.

[fists of fury]

Neither Tyson's style nor his character allowed for a prime that was much longer than it was. It was a high-energy burn-out style and his intense training would only accelerate that rapid deterioration. Rooney or no Rooney. Without Rooney, the thin veil covering Tyson's inner adolescent was removed. And adolescents aren't exactly known for their character and resilience and grace -"days of grace" tattoos notwithstanding.

There are two windows here that Tyson would need to win. If both were apparant, I'd favor Tyson- and an early KO would not be out of the question. The first is it would have to be the 1987-1988 version of Tyson. Rooney must be present. Tyson must be at his actual peak. The second window is roughly the first 6 rounds. After that, Joe is going to come on and Tyson will be substantially less dangerous and substantially less confident.

Many believe that Louis relied too much on Blackburn for answers -that Blackburn was the brains behind the Joe Louis operation. This became less true with experience and Louis' performances at an advanced age prove it. He became almost wily. Tyson was no strategist and never showed much strategic or even tactical prowess. As he aged he became far less than his experience should have dictated. Tyson was more of a machine than Louis in the derogatory sense. His style was formed and adapted to deal with larger men who had a jab... but he never became a thinker in the ring. He was always emotional however. Louis was anything but that. Louis saw what there was to do and did it. That deadpan expression was real. Louis was more of a machine in the better sense... he never lost control of himself or his objective, even in the losses. As the "character rounds" come on, Louis should be favored, especially considering that Tyson will be getting hit with several short explosive shots throughout the bout.

Tyson must dispatch Joe early.... or else. The probability here is that he wouldn't.

Good post.

It can be argued that Louis' greatest strength was his temprament. It is also quite possibly Tyson's biggest weakness.
Louis simply never got flustered, even when losing. He'd stoicly stalk his foe and catch him eventually. He never got wild or sloppy, never got over-excited, never got anxious...Louis was a stone-cold assassin. It's a remarkable trait actually and one that's all too rare among fighters. Will it make a difference? I don't know, but it's good to see Louis' 'unfazeability' being noted.

I'll not make predictions and all that, but suffice to say it's a tough match to call, provided Louis can survive Tyson's initial (and very formidable) early rounds assault.

[fists of fury]

Yeah.

I've heard My Dinner WIth Conteh describe it as "tide-turning" chin. Tyson does not have that type of chin, he is not the type of fighter that gets a hiding and turns the tide at the back of it.

Louis can get hurt and win, maybe if Tyson is being battered, he can't.

It's tough to say though.

He took a pounding agsinst Ruddock in round 6 of the first fight (some of those shots were huge) but stopped him in the next round. He didn't seem at all discouraged at being hit hard.

Against the likes of Douglas and Lewis, Tyson took a shellacking and yes, didn't come back to win, but other factors played a stronger part in those defeats, imo.

Had Louis been on the end of those punches instead of Tyson, would he be able to turn the tide? In my mind it's doubtful. Very few fighters who absorb a steady pounding over the course of a fight come back to win it, unless it's by virtue of a sudden and dramatic knockout.

[Stonehands89]

You explained perfectly why Louis should be favored if the fight goes past the mid rounds, but how do you see Louis surviving early? The way I see it he doesn't have the best mobility, defense, or chin for surviving the first few rounds with Tyson.
Mobility isn't necessarily going to make a difference with Tyson. Tyson could close the distance very well. Louis' defense wasn't exactly porous. He was fairly deliberate in his approach -some would say "static", but it wasn't like he was dropping his hands or leaning back. He had a tight formation but could get caught. Louis suffered flash knockdowns but was only stopped by Schmeling, who chopped him down over 12 rounds after putting Louis on a steady diet of counter rights, and of course, Marciano, who stopped in his last fight. Louis demonstrated both heart and resilience. He got off the canvas to win at least 4 times in his career. Tyson, who fought bigger punchers, never demonstrated much resilience and had undeniable heart problems. He was a front-runner.

Tyson experienced problems with strong guys -strong of body and will. Guys who would punch and punch him hard. Active counterpunchers. Louis could be counted on to land explosive short shots on Tyson and I believe that Louis had the kind of precision that would allow him to land on the bobbing and weaving Tyson. Tyson's shots will stun Joe, but I'm not so sure that Tyson will respond very well to Joe's shots. Tyson has more endurance, but Joe compensates for that with heart and resilience... and probably a superior corner as well. Blackburn was a genious. I think that he'd have Joe stepping in and throwing a hard jab to move Tyson back or at least off balance.

I can also see Tyson landing serious shots to the side and shooting uppercuts and hooks on Joe... and I'm not so sure that the 200 lb frame of Joe will hold up under a full-blown Tyson barrage.. if enough connect.

[Stonehands89]

Good post.

It can be argued that Louis' greatest strength was his temprament. It is also quite possibly Tyson's biggest weakness.
Louis simply never got flustered, even when losing. He'd stoicly stalk his foe and catch him eventually. He never got wild or sloppy, never got over-excited, never got anxious...Louis was a stone-cold assassin. It's a remarkable trait actually and one that's all too rare among fighters. Will it make a difference? I don't know, but it's good to see Louis' 'unfazeability' being noted.

I'll not make predictions and all that, but suffice to say it's a tough match to call, provided Louis can survive Tyson's initial (and very formidable) early rounds assault.
Stone-cold stoicism. Unfazeability. Apt descriptions for Joe Louis.

[rusty nails]

if conn had tysons power he would have knocked joe cold..
conn is no tyson.. the result speaks for itself imo

[Bokaj]

if conn had tysons power he would have knocked joe cold..
conn is no tyson.. the result speaks for itself imo

Well, Douglas certainly was no Louis. You can't use one fight like that.

[Quickhands21]

Well, Douglas certainly was no Louis. You can't use one fight like that.
He sure wasnt,He was taller,faster that night,placed his shots better..And also yeeeears more advanced..Buster would have beat 2 shades of shit out of any Louis that night also

[Bokaj]

He sure wasnt,He was taller,faster that night,placed his shots better..And also yeeeears more advanced..Buster would have beat 2 shades of shit out of any Louis that night also

I can see that we disagree somewhat (even if I agree that Douglas was great that night).

I also like to claim that boxing has evolved, but there's not much you can better with Louis in terms of technique. Perhaps his defence, and especially his head movement, but his punching is still unsurpassed I would say.

[janitor]

He sure wasnt,He was taller,faster that night,placed his shots better..And also yeeeears more advanced..Buster would have beat 2 shades of shit out of any Louis that night also

Preposterous.

Douglas was a second rater who put together one superior performence against an unfocused Tyson.

Who was the second best fighter Douglas ever beat?

[janitor]

if conn had tysons power he would have knocked joe cold..
conn is no tyson.. the result speaks for itself imo

If Conn had Tysons power hge would have beaten any heavyweight that ever lived including Tyson.

Laws of physics being what they are he didnt.

Of course if Conn had Tysons elusivness he wouldnt have made it out of the first half of the first round.

[clark]

Remember Berbick and Spinks made Tyson look better than what he was. It took a Buster Douglas to show Tyson's flaws. Louis wouldn't be intimidated and he'd pull this one out.

[marciano1952]

He sure wasnt,He was taller,faster that night,placed his shots better..And also yeeeears more advanced..Buster would have beat 2 shades of shit out of any Louis that night also

I hate tyson Fanboys they just make themselves look stupid on countless occasions

[Quickhands21]

I hate tyson Fanboys they just make themselves look stupid on countless occasions
not a huge tyson fan dumass..i hate oldhead fanboys who think there fighters always beat way more advanced boxers..the games changed,get over it..

[Stonehands89]

He sure wasnt,He was taller,faster that night,placed his shots better..And also yeeeears more advanced..Buster would have beat 2 shades of shit out of any Louis that night also
Douglas placed his shots better than Louis...? And was yeeeears more advanced? This is crazy talk. Boxing has not evolved since the Golden Era. On the contrary, it has slowly been devolving. Less clubs, less fighters, skimpy records, less trainers, but more trainers who have only a basic knowledge of technique. Half of them haven't the faintest idea of how to execute the Fitzsimmons Shift.

[janitor]

not a huge tyson fan dumass..i hate oldhead fanboys who think there fighters always beat way more advanced boxers..the games changed,get over it..

You call us ohead fanboys as if to imply that we are somehow delusional, yet you are arguing that James Douglas changed from being a second rater to an all time great overnight, when he fought Tyson, and then back again overnight.

The game has changed and it is mainly for the worse.

[Bokaj]

You call us ohead fanboys as if to imply that we are somehow delusional, yet you are arguing that James Douglas changed from being a second rater to an all time great overnight, when he fought Tyson, and then back again overnight.

No idea to waste ink on this. Not even the virtual kind.

[rydersonthestorm]

You call us ohead fanboys as if to imply that we are somehow delusional, yet you are arguing that James Douglas changed from being a second rater to an all time great overnight, when he fought Tyson, and then back again overnight.

The game has changed and it is mainly for the worse.
funny how everyone apart from him is a delusional fanboy yet we all seem to agree and he is the one with the strnage ideas.

[marciano1952]

not a huge tyson fan dumass..i hate oldhead fanboys who think there fighters always beat way more advanced boxers..the games changed,get over it..

LOL the Dumbass that thanks Dougless is better than Louis Called me a Dumbass :lol:

Seriously dude Dougless pulled it together for one night but still average amoung the Greats in the HW division

[Quickhands21]

LOL the Dumbass that thanks Dougless is better than Louis Called me a Dumbass :lol:

Seriously dude Dougless pulled it together for one night but still average amoung the Greats in the HW division
That NIGHT he was better than Louis ya.he wasnt a great like Joe fuck no..
I have Joe Number 2 all time..H2H I rank him about 8..

[rusty nails]

Of course if Conn had Tysons elusivness he wouldnt have made it out of the first half of the first round.

if your saying that a prime tyson wasnt elusive then your kidding yourself.. he was one of the most elusive fighters ever..
you want proof? watch tyson vs furguson..
he was virtually untouched until well after he won the title

[sitiyzal]

Mikey probably gets the early knockout .

[Mike T]

Tyson...early KO 1 or 2.

[Jersey Joe]

These "historical match-ups" always have some questionable assumptions, and no better are they illustrated than in this thread.

Louis getting bombed out early just because Tyson has power and a good offense? That's one hell of a leap of faith there.

Bonecrusher Smith went 12 rounds with prime Tyson, so did Tony Tucker.
James Tillis and Jose Ribalta (who?) lasted 10 each. Thomas went 6, Bruno went 5. It's quite frankly an insult to suggest that Joe Louis, a guy who made 25 championship title defences, couldn't last as long or longer than these journeymen.

Yet according to most here, Louis is a cert to get knocked out - not just knocked down, but counted out - in 3-4 rounds? The ONLY times Louis ever got KOd was after repeated punishment, round after round. He never got KOd by a single shot. Louis had a solid chin, even at 38 he went 8 rounds with Marciano, which is more than most lasted whilst in their prime.

I can accept someone thinking Tyson is slight favourite here, even though I don't agree, it is at least a defensible position. But to say that Louis is just going to crash out like some tomato can is an absolute joke and just marks you down as a boxing ignoramus.

Let's not forget also that it's Tyson who is going to be put to the sword just as much as Louis. Joe was after all one of the most fearsome combination punchers in the heavyweight division, and known as a deadly finisher once he had his man hurt. If there's an early KO it's just as likely to be Tyson as Louis IMO, and in the later rounds - well, Tyson wasn't exactly known as a 12 round fighter, let alone good for a full 15.

[Jersey Joe]

Tyson...early KO 1 or 2.

Perfect example of what I'm talking about. I guess you think Frank Bruno or Frans Botha has far superior defence and chin compared to Joe Louis?

[rydersonthestorm]

That NIGHT he was better than Louis ya.he wasnt a great like Joe fuck no..
I have Joe Number 2 all time..H2H I rank him about 8..
so you have tyson number one as you have already said he is pretty much betetr than louis in ebery way with betetr opponents.

[The Phenom]

Louis ko in a fight with multiple knockdowns.

[marciano1952]

That NIGHT he was better than Louis ya.he wasnt a great like Joe fuck no..
I have Joe Number 2 all time..H2H I rank him about 8..

H2H Louis beats more fighters than than tyson would

tyson looses to everyone with a Chin that isnt Scared Shitless while in the ring with him

Tyson Brokedown Mentaly Way to Often for him to be a Heavy Favroit over many of the HW Champs in the past

tyson also Faced Soft Opponents most of his Career in the 80's

[doug.ie]

I do think more stylistic aces are held by Louis here were they tp square off. In essence he would make Tyson come to him, Tyson would initiate the exchanges, but Louis would pick his shots in the usual economically devestating fashion. Short, quick and devestating combinations, that you caould barely see coming much of the time and with with leverage and power will seal the deal for Louis late on. Barely anyone in heavyweight history fought of the backfoot as effectively as Louis did.


agree ^^...and impressed with your views in this thread :good

[Quickhands21]

so you have tyson number one as you have already said he is pretty much betetr than louis in ebery way with betetr opponents.
Nah..I rate louis number 2 based on his number of defences..The Walcott win was big..I have Tyson on any given day from 8 to 10..I Think PEAK Tyson had a lot on Louis and im referring to natural talent so dont lose your panties..Its all about debating..But Mikes opposition is really ignored..he gets put down when in reality his opponents were better than or just as good as most in the top 10 or 15...I just dont think some fighters would fit in well in this era..Louis who i love happens to be one of them..Heavies have gotten so big and fast for their weight

[melhear]

Tyson by devastating knockout in round 1

[Mendoza]

Who would win this battle between "Iron " Mike Tyson and "The Brown Bomber" Joe Louis? Prime for Prime 15 Rounds. The Peak Tyson who just destroyed Michael Spinks & the Louis who just decimated Max Schmelling.

Louis himself said he did not like to be crowded and would not have beaten Rocky even if he were younger. Louis also had problems initially solving the shorter crouching style of Godoy. Tyson is far more explosive and dynamic than Rocky was.


Tyson was not a mentally strong fighter, and was a classic front-runner. Tyson's steam and vigor tended to diminish in the mid rounds.

Psychically, I like Tyson. Mentally and heart wise, I like Louis.

The question here is can Louis make it into the later rounds, and survive the initial attack? If he can, I think Louis wins. However, I just do not like Louis defense, slow feet and stylistic problems in this fight. I think Tyson early speed and power would win.