Did Evander "Evan Fields" Holyfield juice up?

[Slothrop]

Thoughts?

[MagnificentMatt]

I dont think so...Hes always been a gymrat, just like Mosley, or Bhop..

If i was looking for someone who roided id say Vargas in his last couple fights, cause there was no reason for him to be out of shape like he was..

[ChampionsForever]

Definatly, he has ever since he moved up to heavyweight.

[Slothrop]

I dont think so...Hes always been a gymrat, just like Mosley, or Bhop..

If i was looking for someone who roided id say Vargas in his last couple fights, cause there was no reason for him to be out of shape like he was..

Remember this?

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[MagnificentMatt]

Remember this?

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Holy shit....

Holyfield is still my boy :-)

[Thread Stealer]

No, but he heard that Mike Tyson did.

[Slothrop]

No, but he heard that Mike Tyson did.

I've heard of Mike Tyson doing a lot of things.

[Guru_Too_You]

No, but he heard that Mike Tyson did.

Tyson looked like he did as a grown man when he was 16 and I saw it in person.

Tryon Correctional Shout Out.

[Heavyrighthand]

I bet many of them are on steriods, its just that most know how to mask it, and when to do it and when not to, so they never get caught.

[Thread Stealer]

I've heard of Mike Tyson doing a lot of things.

That was Holyfield's response to some accusations.

"I didn't use roids. People told me that Mike Tyson used them, but I still didn't want to do it".

[Slothrop]

Yes i think he uses roids and so does lots of other fighters :-
Toney
Jones jr.
Tyson
Lewis
Vitali Klitschko
Vargas
Wlad Klitschko
Botha
Ibeabuchi
Jombo` Cummings
Rahman
Sly Stallone

You think the Klits are on the juice? I know Vitali did, but you think Wlad is currently?

[ChampionsForever]

You think the Klits are on the juice? I know Vitali did, but you think Wlad is currently?

YES.

To be honest I think most guys are on the stuff, or big guys atleast, to stay 220lbs+ and still be in tha kind of condition is un natural, when Tommy Morrison was banned from boxing he confessed to using steriods and said that pretty much every heavyweight did for the reasons I just said......

[Slothrop]

YES.

To be honest I think most guys are on the stuff, or big guys atleast, to stay 220lbs+ and still be in tha kind of condition is un natural, when Tommy Morrison was banned from boxing he confessed to using steriods and said that pretty much every heavyweight did for the reasons I just said......

It wouldn't surprise me at all. Neither Klit looks natural. I've never heard of any evidence against Wlad though.

[surreal deal]

Holy shit....

Holyfield is still my boy :-)
no i dont care either.better than putting booze,fags and recreational drugs etc into his system and wrecking his career.
but i cant believe this is still a debate,course he has.

[Slothrop]

no i dont care either.better than putting booze,fags and recreational drugs etc into his system and wrecking his career.
but i cant believe this is still a debate,course he has.

Wait until Zakman gets in here. He'd suck Holyfield's dick until Holy's eyes shriveled up and he doesn't think there is a shred of evidence against Bonds. :rofl

[Thread Stealer]

Tyson looked like he did as a grown man when he was 16 and I saw it in person.

Tryon Correctional Shout Out.

I've never thought Tyson used them either.

Holyfield just probably said that since Tyson is his most high-profile win, so it's like "well who cares if I used roids? So did Tyson".

[Shpion]

There is a high probability he has, especially considering the latest steroid incident involving him covered in the press.

[Jinx]

no proof...speculation don't count...

[sst]

Holyfeld is a poster boy for HGH.

[Rock0052]

I'd say just about every HW from the 90's did it- it was an arms race, and I don't know if any of the top guys could afford not to (in their minds). It was pretty obvious to look at how guys like Holy and Tommy looked early in their career, compared to how they bulked up.

The plus side of that is, matches between juiced up fighters should still count just the same if both parties were in on it. The only guy on that list I haven't heard serious rumblings about is Wlad, but just because I didn't hear it obviously doesn't mean he didn't.

Also, it raises another philosophical question: Does boxing really want to stay clean? The steroid era of heavyweights is generally regarded as one of, if not the, best, and most exciting era in heavyweight history. Is that purely coincedence?

[Rock0052]

The 90's definetly wasn't the best in heavyweight history :verysad

That's the only thing you got from that post? :verysad

[Zakman]

Show me a positive test, and I'll believe it.

[istmeno]

he strength trained with former mr. universe lee haney. does anyone think that haney did not teach him ALL of his personal training methods.

[skier47]

Wlad's not on roids. The guy is 6 foot 7 inches tall and weighs 241lbs.
He has an aesthetically pleasing build, kind of like Adonis of Greek
mythology. The perfect male physique. And no I'm not gay but he
does have a build we would all die for. Huge muscles, huge heads,
Barry Bonds, Shannon Briggs come to mind have obviously juiced.
Holyfield is a juicer or was but he also possessed phenomenal heart,
desire and considerable boxing ability. He was a small guy who wanted
the big money offered to heavyweights and did what he felt he had to
do. I make no judgements. We all make compromises.

[Slothrop]

44-5. Not much faith in Mr. Evan Fields, eh?

[smokey]

I too think that it doesn't make much sense to pick on one particular athelete about steroid use. Most sports insiders who have actually come clean say that almost everyone they knew was on some sort of performance enhancer. There is tons of money in it, and the tech stays far ahead of the testers. The guys who get busted are either a fluke or just had poor dopers who didn't know how to beat tests.

The Balco stuff wasn't even being tested for. They came up with new types of roids that wouldn't show up on a test. Also, there are ways to beat tests. When I was younger, I smoked a pretty good bit of weed and passed every drug test I was given on probation. If someone like me could afford to beat a drug test with a drug like marijuanna that stays in the system for extended periods, I'm sure a multimillion dollar athelete can cheat the system easily. If you had millions riding on a sport and you KNEW that people were on enhancements throughout the sport, wouldn't you be a fool not to be on an even footing?

[Slothrop]

I too think that it doesn't make much sense to pick on one particular athelete about steroid use. Most sports insiders who have actually come clean say that almost everyone they knew was on some sort of performance enhancer. There is tons of money in it, and the tech stays far ahead of the testers. The guys who get busted are either a fluke or just had poor dopers who didn't know how to beat tests.

The Balco stuff wasn't even being tested for. They came up with new types of roids that wouldn't show up on a test. Also, there are ways to beat tests. When I was younger, I smoked a pretty good bit of weed and passed every drug test I was given on probation. If someone like me could afford to beat a drug test with a drug like marijuanna that stays in the system for extended periods, I'm sure a multimillion dollar athelete can cheat the system easily. If you had millions riding on a sport and you KNEW that people were on enhancements throughout the sport, wouldn't you be a fool not to be on an even footing?

It's called integrity and honor. Some people have them, some don't.

[Rock0052]

I too think that it doesn't make much sense to pick on one particular athelete about steroid use. Most sports insiders who have actually come clean say that almost everyone they knew was on some sort of performance enhancer. There is tons of money in it, and the tech stays far ahead of the testers. The guys who get busted are either a fluke or just had poor dopers who didn't know how to beat tests.

The Balco stuff wasn't even being tested for. They came up with new types of roids that wouldn't show up on a test. Also, there are ways to beat tests. When I was younger, I smoked a pretty good bit of weed and passed every drug test I was given on probation. If someone like me could afford to beat a drug test with a drug like marijuanna that stays in the system for extended periods, I'm sure a multimillion dollar athelete can cheat the system easily. If you had millions riding on a sport and you KNEW that people were on enhancements throughout the sport, wouldn't you be a fool not to be on an even footing?

That's the same logic I use- I'm not condoning the steroid use by any means, but the elite HW boxers from that generation that were clean are in the minority to me. I don't look at them negatively for that, I view it as an arms race. Basically, either nobody roids up or everyone does (relatively speaking).

I still love to watch Evander and Morrison fights, it just is what it is. I don't like bringing morals in to it because at the end of the day, Evander or Tommy (or any of the other big hitting HW's of the 90's) could end your career if you stepped in the ring with them. If you're Joe Clubfighter with a 24-3 record and kids to raise going up against a pissed off Morrison with a left hook that could decapitate you, what are you going to do? Or in Evander's case, if you're going 3 fights against Riddick Bowe even though he's clearly the bigger man and likely juicing himself, what are you going to do?

I guess the point I'm trying to make is when you're in those guys' shoes, the decision's alot harder to make sometimes. It's easy to say I wouldn't do it, but then again, I'm not the guy who could get brain damaged or killed in any given fight if the guy juicing is still throwing bombs after 11 rounds.

It doesn't make them any less of a fighter- I'm guessing the gladiators 2000 years ago would've taken anything they could've for an edge, too.

[DamonD]

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[Grabonator]

Wlad's not on roids. The guy is 6 foot 7 inches tall and weighs 241lbs.
He has an aesthetically pleasing build, kind of like Adonis of Greek
mythology. The perfect male physique. And no I'm not gay but he
does have a build we would all die for. Huge muscles, huge heads,
Barry Bonds, Shannon Briggs come to mind have obviously juiced.
Holyfield is a juicer or was but he also possessed phenomenal heart,
desire and considerable boxing ability. He was a small guy who wanted
the big money offered to heavyweights and did what he felt he had to
do. I make no judgements. We all make compromises.

I would prefer a Tyson physique over an Wlad physique.

[Grabonator]

I think they should be tested more often! i think every fighter has to tested immediately after a fight is signed and then again after the fight, at least for championship bouts! BTW Tyson, Wlad, Holyfield asn manny other look better than Adonis, adonis is crap.

[Dostoevsky]

Tyson was like 200lbs at age 14.
He was a monster naturally.

Lennox Lewis looked natural. Just because you have tall men and men over 220lbs who are muscular, that doesn't mean they take steroids.
Primo Carnera was very big and muscular and that was before steroids had even been invented.

Evan Fiel.....opps, Evander Holyfield on the other hand is very suspicious.

[Shake]

I think most fighters at heavyweight and even at lighter weights when moving up use steroids or HGH. There is simply too much money to be made in boxing.

Don't worry, though -- it's everywhere. Soccer, football, tennis, cycling, heck professional darts players even take drugs to steady their hands.

It's a sign of the times, and I rpopose we don't do a damn thing about it, because you can't stop it. Look at what happened to cycling -- every year the winner of the race is declared a cheater and given a 2-year suspension, it hurts the credibility of the sport.

Boxing can't take that kind of blow right now. Just cover this with a warm blanket and pretend it isn't there.

[ripcity]

Like Bonds you can't convict on speculation.

[2smart4u]

Show me a positive test, and I'll believe it.:patsch Do you need a breathilizer test before you except a man is DRUNK ? The man juices ZAK ! live with it !:hi:

[2smart4u]

Like Bonds you can't convict on speculation.:yep He trained with MR OLYMPIA gained a ton of muscle and had ROIDS sent to his house ! Thats a tad more evidence then just speculation !:deal

[Stickandmove]

I would prefer a Tyson physique over an Wlad physique.

I think women would generally prefer Wlad's physique (and face). Plus, he's 6'6'' and Tyson is 5'11''.

[Stickandmove]

:yep[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Stickandmove]

Until reading this I assumed most heavyweights were clean. Maybe I was naive.

Upon reflection, Holyfield almost certainly 'juiced'. This could explain the 'heart problems' he suffered during his loss to Michael Moorer.

But, hey, I want a physique like Holyfields - where can I get me some 'juice'?

[Stickandmove]

no i dont care either.better than putting booze,fags and recreational drugs etc into his system and wrecking his career.
but i cant believe this is still a debate,course he has.

I agree - better than smoking, drinking and using recreational drugs.

What are your thoughts on a non-athlete using 'juice' to improve physique? Would you do it?

[MrSmall]

Where does Asterix come into this equation?

[skellington]

Even taking out the moral aspect of using steroids, there are serious health risks associated with them - [Only registered and activated users can see links]

There are mental health side affects as well as physical.

[DamonD]

Where does Asterix come into this equation?
Well, Kute suggested we might need to put an asterisk next to all of Holyfield's victories... :D

[Dostoevsky]

Steroids can also give you are a heart problem and turn you bald prematurely.......:think


Yup...

[EpsilonAxis]

I don't think there's sufficient proof. Nor do i think that "Evan Fields" story is really legit...that sounds like a fucking joke.

And i dont think Wlad uses roids. He is a PhD in Physical Education...

[Shake]

I've been around a lot of bodybuilders, and there are various risks, some long-term, some short-term, some physical, some mental. I can give plenty of examples later in the post for the curious, but I'll first get to my point.

Steroids are performance-enhancing, but they can be counter-productive in boxing. Weight-training using steroids shortens the muscles which leads to a fighter that is musclebound. Special training excersizes can temper this, but whatever you do, you're gonna gain. So I imagine it's only useful when trying to move up in weight or if you're a heavyweight in need of more power. Heck, just look at Briggs. He's juiced up from the arse to the neck.

I also believe there are various other drugs used in boxing. EPO, for one. If you're familiar with cycling, you know EPO gives you nearly limitless energy by increasing the amount of oxygen your blood can carry, and there are a lot of masking drugs if you know the right doctors. Furthermore, these masking drugs can only be found if you test while the fighter is training -- it will be completely undetectable come fight-night.

My point is -- any sport where there's millions to be made is doped up. How could it not be?

Short-term physical risks -- you can easily damage your own body because you're not feeling the damage you're doing to it in training. There is also the matter of cystes -- and these are very, very icky. Imagine a pimple where the gooey stuff is about six inches wide.
Long-term physical risks -- Vascular degeneration (heart failure), sterility, impotence, liver failure, ulcers.
Mental risks: You develope a hellacious temper that can seem completely out of character. I've seen my mild-mannered cousin swinging a tv-set over his head by the cord during a temper-tantrum. And it was his tv-set.

Anyway, drugs are bad, mmkay?

[Shake]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Roids. ^^^^

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

No roids. ^^^^

[Darthmage]

Tyson always refused to be tested and just paid the $50,000 fine ... i say that 99% of todays top 50 heavyweights all use gear .... same as in pro football 99% of premier league players are on gear ... no doubt about it

are you an alias of Scurlaruntings(spellling?).. You are the only other person I've seen on this site that uses the word "gear" when refering to roids.

[papaspank]

Allright, all you short sticked losers, Holyfield has NEVER (do you know what that means), tested positive for steroids or any other drugs PERIOD. Even in that BULLSHIT S.I. article it says he has NEVER tested positive. Until proven otherwise, all you penis envy Holyfield haters should shut the hell up! I know the average IQ of a lot of you barely matchs your shoe size, so you can't help it that your a little dee dee (see Carlos Mancia).:lol: :D :lol: :D :lol:

This forum should require an asterisk next you special ed. posters, aka Holyfield haters!:nut :lol: :nut :lol: :nut

[Dostoevsky]

Allright, all you short sticked losers, Holyfield has NEVER (do you know what that means), tested positive for steroids or any other drugs PERIOD. Even in that BULLSHIT S.I. article it says he has NEVER tested positive. Until proven otherwise, all you penis envy Holyfield haters should shut the hell up! I know the average IQ of a lot you matchs your shoe size, so you can help it that your a little dee dee dee (see Carlos Mancia).:lol: :D :lol: :D :lol:

You don't need a positive test to come to the fair conclusion that someone is on steroids. Sometimes it is just blaringly obvious.

Holyfield was anonymously linked to a pharmacy in Alabama that is currently under investigation for steroid use. He denies ever using performance enhancers. Ironically, Holyfield's name does not appear in the law enforcement documents reviewed. However, a patient by the name of "Evan Fields" caught investigators' attention. "Fields" shares the same birth date as Holyfield -- Oct. 19, 1962. The listed address for "Fields" was 794 Evander, Fairfield, Ga. 30213. Holyfield has a very similar address. When the phone number that, according to the documents, was associated with the "Fields" prescription, was dialed, Holyfield answered.

Damning evidence....

[aramini]

I really wanted to believe Holyfield was not, because some guys are naturally ripped and muscular with the proper training techniques. The article was damning in a few ways but I would still want a positive result before condemning Holyfield.

I like BJ Penns response to Sherk's steroid test: For all you guys out there using steroids ... F*** you.

[2ironmt]

The SI article proves what appeared obvious since the early 90's. Holy was going seriously bald at age 30. He showed amazing recouperative abilities and strength in the Tyson fights. Although I'm a Tyson fan (and I like Holy), I like other posters doubt he doped at least not for any long periods -- he's been built basically the same since 18 years of age. Also when he might have watned to use them (after prison) he probably lacked the discipline to follow whatever regimen you need to and again his body never changed.

[2smart4u]

Allright, all you short sticked losers, Holyfield has NEVER (do you know what that means), tested positive for steroids or any other drugs PERIOD. Even in that BULLSHIT S.I. article it says he has NEVER tested positive. Until proven otherwise, all you penis envy Holyfield haters should shut the hell up! I know the average IQ of a lot of you barely matchs your shoe size, so you can't help it that your a little dee dee (see Carlos Mancia).:lol: :D :lol: :D :lol:

This forum should require an asterisk next you special ed. posters, aka Holyfield haters!:nut :lol: :nut :lol: :nut:lol: I love when people who dont know what they are talking about call the people that do STUPID ! HOLY was juiced and your stupid to think otherwise !:deal

[Thread Stealer]

Until reading this I assumed most heavyweights were clean. Maybe I was naive.

Upon reflection, Holyfield almost certainly 'juiced'. This could explain the 'heart problems' he suffered during his loss to Michael Moorer.

But, hey, I want a physique like Holyfields - where can I get me some 'juice'?

The Nevada State Athletic Commission said his problems after the Moorer fight were consistent with too much HGH use.

Holyfield's health problems in the Bowe rubber match might've also been a case of HGH-itis.

[ripcity]

:yep He trained with MR OLYMPIA gained a ton of muscle and had ROIDS sent to his house ! Thats a tad more evidence then just speculation !:deal
I won't lie I'm a bit supisious but intell there is a blood or urin test that comes back postive I will have an incoent intill proven gulity view on Holyfield and Bonds, as well as anyone else who is supected of jucing.

[Zakman]

:patsch Do you need a breathilizer test before you except a man is DRUNK ? The man juices ZAK ! live with it !:hi:

Yeah, call me old fashioned, but yeah, I need EVIDENCE before I consider someone guilty.:patsch

There is a mentality among sports fans that tends to "convict" anyone who is simply ACCUSED of something. The only PROVEN juicers in boxing that I'm aware of are James Toney and Roy Jones, who actually FAILED tests. In baseball, it's Raphael Palmeiro and an assortment of nobodies.

Yet fans inappropriately assume many other athletes are "gulty," when there's no concrete evidence to support such a conclusion. It's wrong, and it's unfair to the athletes.

Of course, there are probably underlying agendas for this.......:yep

[Shake]

I'm convinced a lot of athletes are juiced up but it's not that big a deal to me. Take Holyfield, a tremendous cruiserweight, but the real money being made at heavyweight. Who can blame him for wanting to move up?

[2smart4u]

Yeah, call me old fashioned, but yeah, I need EVIDENCE before I consider someone guilty.:patsch

There is a mentality among sports fans that tends to "convict" anyone who is simply ACCUSED of something. The only PROVEN juicers in boxing that I'm aware of are James Toney and Roy Jones, who actually FAILED tests. In baseball, it's Raphael Palmeiro and an assortment of nobodies.

Yet fans inappropriately assume many other athletes are "gulty," when there's no concrete evidence to support such a conclusion. It's wrong, and it's unfair to the athletes.

Of course, there are probably underlying agendas for this.......:yep:patsch But there is plenty of evidence ! You seem to ignore it !:deal

[2smart4u]

I won't lie I'm a bit supisious but intell there is a blood or urin test that comes back postive I will have an incoent intill proven gulity view on Holyfield and Bonds, as well as anyone else who is supected of jucing.:lol: So your not convinced pro bodybuilders JUICE ? :yep

[Zakman]

:patsch But there is plenty of evidence ! You seem to ignore it !:deal

You got a positive test?? Oh, and IF you do you, you got evidence that shows that Holyfield WOULDN'T have won his fights if he didn't do it?

[psychopath]

Thoughts?

Nah defintely not. He has never been tested positive right? :D

And if he did before . . . he could have been "destroyed" like RJJ long time ago.

[2smart4u]

You got a positive test?? Oh, and IF you do you, you got evidence that shows that Holyfield WOULDN'T have won his fights if he didn't do it?:rofl He was on them ZAK ! And they are PERFORMENCE INHANCERS ! They make you faster and stronger which equals MORE POWER ! He wouldnt have been as good without them ! However he isnt the only one quilty !:deal

[getup]

holy turned pro at 177.5 it took him a couple of years to get to 190.from there he went to heavy and reached a highest weight of 221.5.hasnt anyone here gained that much muscle over time???

well i have.i gratuated high school at 140lbs in 86.in 2006 i topped out at a high of 262.YEAH NO JUICE OR GEAR!!!!!!!!i stopped boxing in 01 but did help get devin vargas in top shpe for the 04 greek games.so dont fuckin tell me its not possible i still run and hit the bag pump the iron and bounce between 225 and 260 routinely...,so go fuck off.not everybody juices...,

holy said he did like to eat and still can take it or leave it when it comes to chowing down.typical response fron a ectomorph.doesnt everbody remember that HOLY was the first guy to have a personal weight trainer lee haney..,and to balance that off he had a conditioning expert in tim hallmark..,alotta guys just devour the calories to put on weight HOLY pumped the weights like a mad man according to lee haney.and lee said that if evander would of choose body building he would of done well in that as well!

ALL YOU ACCUSERS ARE JUST NON DOERS..,alll the tests this man has had and never failed one part of any test!!!!!!!

KEEP TAKEN THIS SHORT CUT TO THINKING IM SURE IT WILL SERVE YOU WELL..,EVER HEAR OF McCARHTY????

Zack im with you i know HOLY has never juiced!!!!if he was less ripped people wouldnt have even brought this up..,micheal moorer anyone..,yeah thought not!!!!!

[Zakman]

alll the tests this man has had and never failed one part of any test!!!!!!!

KEEP TAKEN THIS SHORT CUT TO THINKING IM SURE IT WILL SERVE YOU WELL..,EVER HEAR OF McCARTY????

Zack im with you i know HOLY has never juiced!!!!if he was less ripped people wouldnt have even brought this up..,micheal moorer anyone..,yeah thought not!!!!!

Exactly. When these haters can produce a POSITIVE test, then reasonable people might take their accusations seriously. I just love how sports fans just ASSUME that athletes are guilty based on rumors and unsubstantiate allegations - which often come from people with the same sorts of axes to grind as these people.

[Relentless]

vitlay definatly juices.

[Boinko]

Exactly. When these haters can produce a POSITIVE test, then reasonable people might take their accusations seriously. I just love how sports fans just ASSUME that athletes are guilty based on rumors and unsubstantiate allegations - which often come from people with the same sorts of axes to grind as these people.

You may want to apply this diligent policy the next time you accuse HBO of conspiring to deny Hopkins two decision wins over Jermain Taylor.
You bring it up in every thread involving Taylor without a bit of actual evidence, yet you speak of it like it is a proven fact.
If I didn't know better I'd say you have an axe to grind.

And if you can't provide solid evidence to back up your claims, yet you keep repeating those claims ad nauseum, then don't be put off any time a Holyfield thread appears on this board and people refer to him as a juiced up muscle head who wouldn't have won without cheating.
Such tactics differ very little from yours.

Or is it only acceptable to perform hatchet jobs on fighters you dislike?

[Lampley]

I wouldn't say for sure Evander has, but chances are he did. You guys can reserve judgment based on a lack of a positive test -- keeping in mind how easy it is to beat the tests -- but it's not like Evander was accused of shoplifting.

The thing about enhancers is that they show outwardly, either in terms of performance (more difficult to know) or appearance (obviously much easier).

I can't believe anyone believes Bonds is natural. The growth in head size and overall bulk, along with various testimonies, is too much to take. And we know that elite boxers have done it as well, some dumb enough to get popped for it.

I loved Roy Jones but also accept that he probably was juicing around 2000, when he really started to focus on his non-boxing career, yet became even more shredded for fights. And anyone whose legs remain that spry in their 30s after so much use over the years is a rarity.

He clearly possessed amazing talent at a very early age that was not drug-induced, and I doubt he juiced during his days at 168, but toward the end, I definitely believe so.

And it's cheating, no matter whether you suspect others of doing it. You guys would all rail on a fighter for tampering with his gloves, but for whatever reason you feel it's OK for him to unnaturally and illegally tamper with his body. Doesn't make sense.

[Thread Stealer]

*Evander Holyfield W 12 Riddick Bowe
*Evander Holyfield TKO 11 Mike Tyson


* denotes steroid-aided

Holyfield can have the Larry Holmes win though, with no asterisk, because I dislike Holmes.

[2smart4u]

Exactly. When these haters can produce a POSITIVE test, then reasonable people might take their accusations seriously. I just love how sports fans just ASSUME that athletes are guilty based on rumors and unsubstantiate allegations - which often come from people with the same sorts of axes to grind as these people.:lol: Reasonable people ZAK take an enormous amount of circumstancial evidence and consider the way its pointing ! And in this case the enormous amount of evidence points towards HOLY being juiced to the max !:hi:

[Slothrop]

Allright, all you short sticked losers, Holyfield has NEVER (do you know what that means), tested positive for steroids or any other drugs PERIOD. Even in that BULLSHIT S.I. article it says he has NEVER tested positive. Until proven otherwise, all you penis envy Holyfield haters should shut the hell up! I know the average IQ of a lot of you barely matchs your shoe size, so you can't help it that your a little dee dee (see Carlos Mancia).:lol: :D :lol: :D :lol:

This forum should require an asterisk next you special ed. posters, aka Holyfield haters!:nut :lol: :nut :lol: :nut

Hi Zakman! :hi:

[paulfv]

No doubt in my mind he used, and it likely still using today.

[Slothrop]

No doubt in my mind he used, and it likely still using today.

Oh! You must be a hater!:yep

[paulfv]

Oh! You must be a hater!:yep

Ha, ha.

The funny thing is, I LOVE Evander. I am hoping like hell he wins against Sultan and gets the belt. I'm just being honest. :)

[Slothrop]

Ha, ha.

The funny thing is, I LOVE Evander. I am hoping like hell he wins against Sultan and gets the belt. I'm just being honest. :)

No doubt. Seems like a couple folks on here are in denial about Mr. "Fields" though...

[Zakman]

No doubt in my mind he used, and it likely still using today.

He hasn't failed ONE test. ANd they test boxers after every fight!

[Slothrop]

He hasn't failed ONE test. ANd they test boxers after every fight!

Oh well then, Christ, he must be clean as a whistle...

[Shake]

A lot of illegal medical enhancers can be masked as long as you're not tested within three days of using it. The chemicals in your body will be indistinguishable from the ones your body naturally produces. Medical science has come a long way, and the best and the brightest aren't the ones doing the testing...they're the ones supplying the athletes, such as doctor Fuentes and doctor Ferrari.

[Stickandmove]

I've been around a lot of bodybuilders, and there are various risks, some long-term, some short-term, some physical, some mental. I can give plenty of examples later in the post for the curious, but I'll first get to my point.

Steroids are performance-enhancing, but they can be counter-productive in boxing. Weight-training using steroids shortens the muscles which leads to a fighter that is musclebound. Special training excersizes can temper this, but whatever you do, you're gonna gain. So I imagine it's only useful when trying to move up in weight or if you're a heavyweight in need of more power. Heck, just look at Briggs. He's juiced up from the arse to the neck.

I also believe there are various other drugs used in boxing. EPO, for one. If you're familiar with cycling, you know EPO gives you nearly limitless energy by increasing the amount of oxygen your blood can carry, and there are a lot of masking drugs if you know the right doctors. Furthermore, these masking drugs can only be found if you test while the fighter is training -- it will be completely undetectable come fight-night.

My point is -- any sport where there's millions to be made is doped up. How could it not be?

Short-term physical risks -- you can easily damage your own body because you're not feeling the damage you're doing to it in training. There is also the matter of cystes -- and these are very, very icky. Imagine a pimple where the gooey stuff is about six inches wide.
Long-term physical risks -- Vascular degeneration (heart failure), sterility, impotence, liver failure, ulcers.
Mental risks: You develope a hellacious temper that can seem completely out of character. I've seen my mild-mannered cousin swinging a tv-set over his head by the cord during a temper-tantrum. And it was his tv-set.

Anyway, drugs are bad, mmkay?


Great post - very imformative. Everything in moderation though - I'm sure you could use low doses of performance enhancing drugs without any major side effects? Of course, it's easy to slide from 'use' to 'abuse' so perhaps just best to stay away altogether.

[2smart4u]

He hasn't failed ONE test. ANd they test boxers after every fight!:yep You actually are EVAN arnt you ! Oh I mean HOLY !

[papaspank]

2smart4u, dude you are sooooo special ed., $50 says you rode the short bus to school. I bet if you looked up stupid in the dictionary there would be a picture of you. Dude what's with hate for Holyfield?? No arrest, no investigation (involving Holy), no proof SFB! Also, not another word has been spoken about it in the media since it first came out months ago?? You got nothing but a pencil dick in your hands, so you and all the punk ass bee-atchs quick acusing Holyfield of something you can't prove! But like I said earlier you can't help it your a little slow.

[2smart4u]

2smart4u, dude you are sooooo special ed., $50 says you rode the short bus to school. I bet if you looked up stupid in the dictionary there would be a picture of you. Dude what's with hate for Holyfield?? No arrest, no investigation (involving Holy), no proof SFB! Also, not another word has been spoken about it in the media since it first came out months ago?? You got nothing but a pencil dick in your hands, so you and all the punk ass bee-atchs quick acusing Holyfield of something you can't prove! But like I said earlier you can't help it your a little slow.:lol: Its great when MORONS like this accuse other people of being stupid ! listen pal if it quacks like a duck and looks like a DUCK while floating around the local pond its MOST LIKELY A DUCK ! In this case HOLY is the DUCK ! a DUCK on STEROIDS ! :deal :yep

[Jennifer Love Hewitt]

I would not be shocked if positive proof came out about Holyfield using roids.
I would also not be shcoked if positive proof came out about Shannon Briggs using the juice. Of course, niether man has failed a drug test yet.

Personally, I'm inclined to think that Holyfield did and does use some sort of steroids and or HGH. The man is in his 40's and he still looks as good as he did when he was in his 20's. He always looks tight and ripped, and his waist is so tiny. Usually a thin person with that small of a waist has to "bulk up" to keep their muscles. When they are bulking up they also gain some fat. I've never seen Holyfield look anything but shredded, big and muscular. Of course that is all meer speculation. Holyfield has had many years of training and it is entirley possible that he has naturally grown into that muscular frame. There is also the fact that we are talking about an exceptional case. The man was heavyweight champion of the world, he's an outlier. He's not the random kid we see at the gym who is trying to build mass. Perhaps he simply has the genes to pack on and keep that muscle very easily.

I think he desreves the benefit of the doubt. He has never failed a drug test, so we should not condemn the man as a roid cheater.
We should condemn him as a cronic headbutter, but not as a roid abuser unless some proof comes in.

[Vanboxingfan]

Yeah, call me old fashioned, but yeah, I need EVIDENCE before I consider someone guilty.:patsch

There is a mentality among sports fans that tends to "convict" anyone who is simply ACCUSED of something. The only PROVEN juicers in boxing that I'm aware of are James Toney and Roy Jones, who actually FAILED tests. In baseball, it's Raphael Palmeiro and an assortment of nobodies.

Yet fans inappropriately assume many other athletes are "gulty," when there's no concrete evidence to support such a conclusion. It's wrong, and it's unfair to the athletes.

Of course, there are probably underlying agendas for this.......:yep

Zak if you've ever been near a gym, or done any amount of bodybuilding you would know that Holyfield juices. It's that simple. And testing boxers after a fight doesn't mean dick, because the main benefits are recouperative with respect to training. He just stops taking them long enough before the fight to make sure they are out. Either that or he takes types of steriods they can't test. But hey, this isn't a hate post about Holyfield, I like the guy, but like a couple of people pointed out, the big money is in heavy and that's where he wanted to be. I don't blame him for that, neither do I think it helped him win fights, outside of him being able to train a lot harder for the fight. It didn't give him additional skills or a bigger heart he possessed those qualities with or without steriods. Next you'll be saying Bonds never done them, even though he's 30-40lbs of muscle, heavier now then he was when he was younger. Past 30 people don't add that kind of muscle naturally. As for Briggs, that's a no brainer. I'd bet my house on him having used steriods.

[joe namath's gin]

If God could heal Holyfield's heart, how can you doubt that he could make him bigger too?

[Slothrop]

If God could heal Holyfield's heart, how can you doubt that he could make him bigger too?

Holyfield should have put Benny in his corner.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[2smart4u]

Holyfield should have put Benny in his corner.

[Only registered and activated users can see links] He was ! In spirit !:deal

[brooklyn1550]

Yes

[2smart4u]

If God could heal Holyfield's heart, how can you doubt that he could make him bigger too?:deal :good :yep

[jecxbox]

all i know is that when Roy Jones went up to 200+ out of fucking no where to fight John Ruiz...he had to have used something..that shit was INSANE the kind of muscle mass he put on.

[2smart4u]

:lol: I just got in contact with Mr FIELDS ! He confirmed HOLY was and is ON THE JUICE !:deal :yep

[Slothrop]

all i know is that when Roy Jones went up to 200+ out of fucking no where to fight John Ruiz...he had to have used something..that shit was INSANE the kind of muscle mass he put on.

Jones juiced. That was confirmed.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

But if we're going to talk about Roy Jones hitting the gear, we should start a "Roy Jones hitting the gear" thread. This one is about Mr. Evan Fields.

[BeReal]

I think so, but, the steroid users will get there punishment in the end, when their bodies start rapidly breaking down and failing on them.

[Slothrop]

I think so, but, the steroid users will get there punishment in the end, when their bodies start rapidly breaking down and failing on them.

All you got to do is go to a Benny Hinn faith healing convention....

[jopez707]

I am surprised there is not more fallout from this investigation. I mean "Evan Fields" lives at 794 Evander? Couldnt Holyfield have thought of a better alias? This is almost as bad as "Ron Mexico"...lol.

[Slothrop]

I am surprised there is not more fallout from this investigation. I mean "Evan Fields" lives at 794 Evander? Couldnt Holyfield have thought of a better alias? This is almost as bad as "Ron Mexico"...lol.

Evander is one of the best heavyweight boxers who ever lived. But he is not an intelligent man.

[2smart4u]

Evander is one of the best heavyweight boxers who ever lived. But he is not an intelligent man.:D He is brilliant ! :deal

[Slothrop]

:D He is brilliant ! :deal

No. :-(

[BeReal]

I am surprised there is not more fallout from this investigation. I mean "Evan Fields" lives at 794 Evander? Couldnt Holyfield have thought of a better alias? This is almost as bad as "Ron Mexico"...lol.

When investigators called "Evan Fields", Evander holyfield answered the phone:patsch

[Slothrop]

When investigators called "Evan Fields", Evander holyfield answered the phone:patsch

SHOW ME THE POSITIVE TEST!!!!

[DamonD]

Look, he just happens to have a friend called Evan Fields, okay?

Holyfield was kind enough to answer his mobile phone for him when he was out of the room. Just ask Holyfield's other friends there at the time, Van der Holy and Dleifyolh Rednave.

[Motor City Sam]

Look, he just happens to have a friend called Evan Fields, okay?

Holyfield was kind enough to answer his mobile phone for him when he was out of the room. Just ask Holyfield's other friends there at the time, Van der Holy and Dleifyolh Rednave.

THAT was funny. :lol:

[papaspank]

Centuries ago some douche bags thought the earth was flat, they had no proof but they were certain.

[Kolya]

Look, he just happens to have a friend called Evan Fields, okay?

Holyfield was kind enough to answer his mobile phone for him when he was out of the room. Just ask Holyfield's other friends there at the time, Van der Holy and Dleifyolh Rednave.


:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl Commander Cranium is obviously the epitome of a gentleman.

[tays001]

nah holyfield is natural

[Zakman]

Oh well then, Christ, he must be clean as a whistle...

Well, you have NO concrete evidence against him - just rumor and inuendo. You people seem to believe that accusations equal guilt. Some of us require actual PROOF.

[Motor City Sam]

I wonder if people who believe Holy didn't use steroids believe Bonds did? There seems to be as much, if not more, evidence against Holyfield as there is against Bonds.

[Zakman]

I wonder if people who believe Holy didn't use steroids believe Bonds did? There seems to be as much, if not more, evidence against Holyfield as there is against Bonds.

Actually, the "evidence" against Bonds is every bit as flimsy as against Holyfield. It consists SOLELY of unsubstantiated accusations, rumor, and inuendo - just as with Holyfield.

It's gotten so bad in this coutnry where people simply assume someone is guilty of something just because they are accused. That is wrong.

[jopez707]

Whether or not Holyfield took steroids and I am leaning more towards the idea that he did; boxers need to be randomly tested. A lot of boxers in the past year or so have failed post fight drug tests, this hurts boxing. IF there were more random testing, than we could catch some of these cheaters earlier.

[Toopretty]

Hell yeah he did. Get a grip. Holyfield is a pro juicer and never gets caught. I dont know what system he uses but thats for real. You can tell how he fights. One night he looks gassed out like for no reason and on another night he looks like superman. You can tell by his build and how he looks in the ring that he juiced. I dont think he juiced like Toney. Toney didnt juice while training. He juiced the damn night or two before the fight like an idiot. Holyfield juices in camp. Fuck yeah he juices. I dont care how much you work out you dont go from being a natural cruiser to heavy and add all that muscle without performance enhancing drugs..Look at the damn guy.

[Kolya]

Actually, the "evidence" against Bonds is every bit as flimsy as against Holyfield. It consists SOLELY of unsubstantiated accusations, rumor, and inuendo - just as with Holyfield.

It's gotten so bad in this coutnry where people simply assume someone is guilty of something just because they are accused. That is wrong.

I know that you're not an athlete and all, but are you familiar at all with steroids or what they do; or what the telltale signs of them are? Besides what Sports Illustrated tells you?

[Toopretty]

Also I dont need a boxing gun to see the obvious. The evan fields shit is truth. Ordering roids. Get a clue. SHANE GOT CAUGHT JUICING TOO. SO NO HARDCORE SHANE FANS SEEM TO BRING THAT UP. He was part of the BALCO scandal like all athletes.

[Zakman]

I know that you're not an athlete and all, but are you familiar at all with steroids or what they do; or what the telltale signs of them are? Besides what Sports Illustrated tells you?

All of that is SUBJECTIVE. Show me some OBJECTIVE, verifiable evidence like a POSITIVE TEST, and I'll believe Holyfield's guilty. Until then, he's entitled to the presumption of innocence.

[Toopretty]

All of that is SUBJECTIVE. Show me some OBJECTIVE, verifiable evidence like a POSITIVE TEST, and I'll believe Holyfield's guilty. Until then, he's entitled to the presumption of innocence.

Nevada tests for steroids by a piss test..HOW MANY PEOPLE HERE HAS BEATEN A PISS TEST?:rofl BOXING IS JUST RECENTLY STEPPING ITS GAME UP SINCE THE BALCO SCANDAL AND A FEW BOXERS NAMES CAME UP? :yep

[Toopretty]

Jeez, some people are fucking retarded. Do you have positive results proving Evander has taken steroids? if not, fuck off.
I took drugs(weed) and still beat a drug test countless times. The shit is a art. :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl Fucking naive ass people. Like you cant beat a piss test. Get the fuck out of here.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

[Zakman]

I took drugs(weed) and still beat a drug test countless times. The shit is a art. :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl Fucking naive ass people. Like you cant beat a piss test. Get the fuck out of here.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Maybe so. But until you have a positive test, you don't have hard evidence and concrete proof against Holyfield or anyone else. Besides, Holyfield's been tested in many jurisdictions besides Nevada - including NY, which I believe is one of the more rigorous states. And still, there's no positive test.

[Motor City Sam]

Actually, the "evidence" against Bonds is every bit as flimsy as against Holyfield. It consists SOLELY of unsubstantiated accusations, rumor, and inuendo - just as with Holyfield.

It's gotten so bad in this coutnry where people simply assume someone is guilty of something just because they are accused. That is wrong.

There is a lot I don't agree with you about Zakman, but I am with you 100% on that last statement. :good

[Thread Stealer]

no i dont care either.better than putting booze,fags and recreational drugs etc into his system and wrecking his career.
but i cant believe this is still a debate,course he has.

I agree - better than smoking, drinking and using recreational drugs.


No, it's worse to me, in terms of the integrity of the game.

Drinking and using recreational drugs does not affect the level playing field of professional sports.

Taking steroids does.

[papaspank]

Isn't this RETARDED post dead?

THE NEXT GUY WHO MAKES A POST ON THIS THREAD WILL CERTIFY THAT HE IS THE BIGGEST UNDISPUTED "PETER PUFFER" ON THIS FORUM!

[bachatu]

I like how some people here say "I need actual evidence otherwise, they aren't guilty". "I dont think they are juicing".

Ok so that means that all the evidence found is fabricated? OK, so you are stating that it is not possible to mask a drug test? There have been pro bodybuilders (Lee Priest & Greg Valentino) who have come out and admitted to using them and stated that it is used by every high rated professional that competes.

Also, think about Baseball. Many guys werent being tested enough, so guess what? They were not being caught like they are now with random testing. So does that mean that before they weren't using steroids, even those that Jose Canseco named out?

[Boinko]

Look, ultimately a positive test is important if any action was to be taken following any of Holyfield's fights. No governing body is going to suspend a fighter without a positive test, unless it became absolutely clear that Evander bought steroids. Even then he'd had a pretty good defense by claiming he never tested positive.

However, this idea that only a positive test would indicate guilt is silly. It's an established fact that there have been ways to beat steroid testing. So, it's totally possible that a guy could still be doing steroids and never test positive.
If there was enough circumstantial evidence that pointed to Holyfield using steroids, it wouldn't be unreasonable to conclude that he did.
It's like saying that no murder case could ever secure a conviction unless the suspect's DNA is found at the scene. Well, of course finding a suspect's DNA at the scene of a crime is a huge, huge bonus for the prosecution, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be convicted on other evidence.

To cover one's ears and close one's eyes and scream "No, no, no I will not even consider that Holyfield use steroids until there is a postitive test" is rather silly.

I certainly give Holyfield the benefit of the doubt since I believe someone should be proven guilty, and not labelled guilty until all the evidence has been thoroughly investigated.
If nothing more ever happens in this matter, Evander should not be branded as a steroid user.
But, let's not kid ourselves. Almost everyone will carry suspicions.

[Bigcat]

Golota ...
Tyson...
Moorer...

definites... Holyfield allegedly..


The name Duva is associated to the trainers of each of the list..
The Tyson link was a trainer who helped supply Mike with a male growth hormone after prison.. Tommy Brooks.. Brooks is married to a Duva family member..

Duva is the word.... So then did Tua use ever...???

He did go from small squat heavyweight to a quite enormous specemine.. look at his legs next time you see him..

Another Duva boxer who went from surviving a terrible road crash to muscular specemine.. Vinnie Paz... Makes one think...

[scurlaruntings]

Everyone that has muscles MUST have juiced. No one can looked ripped withoiut steroids.Steroids are wonder drugs that grow mucsles. Tyson Holy and anyone else with any muscle hardness is definitly on them..

[Bigcat]

Everyone that has muscles MUST have juiced. No one can looked ripped withoiut steroids.Steroids are wonder drugs that grow mucsles. Tyson Holy and anyone else with any muscle hardness is definitly on them..

Disagree...

In many cases you are right..

But there is a Mister Olympia each year which feature some of the most fantastic specemines , that have never touched anything short of a protein shake..

[2smart4u]

:lol: Its hard to beleive people dont think he did dispite the evidence ! BIZZAR !

[2smart4u]

:D HOLY didnt JUICE ! VIC didnt hurt no dogs ! OJAY never killed anyone ! The KENNEDYS money is all legit and there is no MAFIA ! :hi: PS and the government never lies !:rasta

[Bigcat]

Holyfield never used drugs when he moved from 190 to 210.. But in order to compete with the more established giants (Bowe, Lewis, Tyson) He then appeared a whole lot more ripped up.. i noticed that from close proxy..

I used to watch him spar regularly , he started to get a lot larger around 1995.. Before his first fight with Tyson he was very wide in the shoulders..

[scurlaruntings]

Disagree...

In many cases you are right..

But there is a Mister Olympia each year which feature some of the most fantastic specemines , that have never touched anything short of a protein shake..I was being sarcastic. As for Mr Olympia thats more BS. Arnie and Jackson got up themselves at the Arnold Classic 2005 and had the brazen audacity to delcare "lets kick drugs out of the sport" when its clear as day to see that these men are on a massive host of diffrent hormones. Hard work is also a key factor to Ronnie winning 8 consective Mr O`s but its an indisputable fact that his body is awash with all manner of "illegal" supplements. (note i put illegal in comma`s)

Seemingly by default now ANYONE and EVERYONE by this same token is now guilty and this is what rankles me badly. There are many guys that give there lives to there trades/sports and are some of the hardest workers in the game. May be Shane did get some supplements from Balco may be he didnt. But the bottom line is NO ONE has any concrete proof to prove without a shadow of a doubt he took EPO or any other form of hormone.

These days anyone who works hard enough to have a good physique is labelled as being on steroids unless the media warms to them and there seen as a media darling. This kind of attitude is annoying and completely poposterous. Coupled with the complete lack of knowledge displayed by most that have ZERO knowledge on diets/supplements/work out regimes let alone steroids and hormones this further excascerbates the situation as again and again these debates are raised with spurious information as the proof and every twat who`s heard of steroids wants to give his 2 pennys worth.

[scurlaruntings]

Holyfield never used drugs when he moved from 190 to 210.. But in order to compete with the more established giants (Bowe, Lewis, Tyson) He then appeared a whole lot more ripped up.. i noticed that from close proxy..

I used to watch him spar regularly , he started to get a lot larger around 1995.. Before his first fight with Tyson he was very wide in the shoulders..Considering Holys weight has always remained between 215lbs and 220 i fail to see your point.Holy turned pro as a heavy at around the 200lb mark. His now 44 years old. In over 20 years this man has gained (wait for the drum roll) a whopping lb a year. Just because he used Haney for conditioning doesnt mean his guilty by association.Just because his delts looked bigger from one fight to the next doesnt mean he was on gear.His physical stats certainly dont indicate this. Bearing in mind ANY form of physcial work with a high aerobic activity will make his muscles look pumped because of increased vascularity/volume and blood flow.Seeing as his weight in the last 11 or so years has NEVER been greater than 5lbs i highly doubt his on any performance enhancers.

[Zakman]

Considering Holys weight has always remained between 215lbs and 220 i fail to see your point.Holy turned pro as a heavy at around the 200lb mark. His now 44 years old. In over 20 years this man has gained (wait for the drum roll) a whopping lb a year. Just because he used Haney for conditioning doesnt mean his guilty by association.Just because his delts looked bigger from one fight to the next doesnt mean he was on gear.His physical stats certainly dont indicate this. Bearing in mind ANY form of physcial work with a high aerobic activity will make his muscles look pumped because of increased vascularity/volume and blood flow.Seeing as his weight in the last 11 or so years has NEVER been greater than 5lbs i highly doubt his on any performance enhancers.

Exactly. People seem to believe ANY allegation against ANY athelete, regardless of whether there is ANY proof for it or not. In Holyfield's case they have no positive tests, nothing - the allegations against him are therefore nothing more than unsubtantiated charges that, even if they were able to be proven true, would not establish that he had taken them before any fight - and therefore they have no bearing whatsoever on his career accomplishments.:-(

[box03]

I believe Holyfield definitely juiced, personally who really cares he just had to even the playing field in the Steroid era I dont blame him. During his career he has worked with Lee Haney who was a what 7 or 8 time Mr. Olympia the man is jacked and an obvious steroid user, Holyfield always strived to be bigger yet had a hard time gaining wieght in the early and mid 90s thats when probably started taking them.

[scurlaruntings]

Exactly. People seem to believe ANY allegation against ANY athelete, regardless of whether there is ANY proof for it or not. In Holyfield's case they have no positive tests, nothing - the allegations against him are therefore nothing more than unsubtantiated charges that, even if they were able to be proven true, would not establish that he had taken them before any fight - and therefore they have no bearing whatsoever on his career accomplishments.:-(Dude iv gone from a 169lbs to 225lbs. I work out like a dog and have done so for the past 5 years. I box i play basketball and i lift weights. I get guys joking around all the time asking me what supplements/gear im on and iv never taken a baked bean. I dont even take protein shakes or any form of supplement other than Glucosamine when i can remember to take it because i have bad knee`s from nagging basketball injuries. This kind of shit piss`s me off because credibility is the only currency that matters. Because of peoples ignorance your hardwork is never rewarded because some idiot thinks you took a shortcut.

[istmeno]

Considering Holys weight has always remained between 215lbs and 220 i fail to see your point.Holy turned pro as a heavy at around the 200lb mark. His now 44 years old. In over 20 years this man has gained (wait for the drum roll) a whopping lb a year. Just because he used Haney for conditioning doesnt mean his guilty by association.Just because his delts looked bigger from one fight to the next doesnt mean he was on gear.His physical stats certainly dont indicate this. Bearing in mind ANY form of physcial work with a high aerobic activity will make his muscles look pumped because of increased vascularity/volume and blood flow.Seeing as his weight in the last 11 or so years has NEVER been greater than 5lbs i highly doubt his on any performance enhancers.

if you are going to defend holyfield, at least use facts. he did not turn pro at 200lbs heavyweight. he turned pro as a 177 lb cruiser. don't distort the facts in order to substantiate your argument.

[scurlaruntings]

I believe Holyfield definitely juiced, personally who really cares he just had to even the playing field in the Steroid era I dont blame him. During his career he has worked with Lee Haney who was a what 7 or 8 time Mr. Olympia the man is jacked and an obvious steroid user, Holyfield always strived to be bigger yet had a hard time gaining wieght in the early and mid 90s thats when probably started taking them.Had a hard time gaining weight? WTF are you talking about? Holy boxed as an am at LHW.He turned pro as a cruiser walked around at about 200 and then went to heavy and 20 years later still weighs no more than 220lbs. Your post is completely indicative of the BS that plagues this forum in terms of attitudes to steroids. Holy trained with Haney to help him adjust to being a heavyweight thus on this premise he must have taken steroids. Yes i can see it now makes perfect sense..:patsch

[scurlaruntings]

if you are going to defend holyfield, at least use facts. he did not turn pro at 200lbs heavyweight. he turned pro as a 177 lb cruiser. don't distort the facts in order to substantiate your argument.Dont harp on semantics. When i said he turned pro as a heavy my reference was to when his CAREER STARTED AS A HEAVY.

[Boinko]

Exactly. People seem to believe ANY allegation against ANY athelete, regardless of whether there is ANY proof for it or not. In Holyfield's case they have no positive tests, nothing - the allegations against him are therefore nothing more than unsubtantiated charges that, even if they were able to be proven true, would not establish that he had taken them before any fight - and therefore they have no bearing whatsoever on his career accomplishments.:-(

Actually, there is evidence. At this point it's just not the kind of evidence that would label Evander as a definitive steroid user. But, it's certainly enough to arouse suspicion and warrant further investigation.

The case against Holyfield at this point in time is certainly stronger than evidence such as "I know a guy who knows a guy who said Evander did steroids." Now, that would be the equivalent of having no evidence.

But, when I read the Sports Illustrated story, it sure got me curious and wanting to know more. If it's true, Evander has some explaining to do. Interesting that he never called the reporters back when he said he would.
Why hasn't he addressed the claims directly, point for point. If he's innocent, why would he let those accusations slide?

Instead, he issues his own statement saying he's never done steroids and he's going to launch his own investigation. Hmmm, I wonder when we'll get the results of his sleuthing!

Again, I'll reiterate, at this point based on the available evidence, I'm not going to label him a steroid user.
But, c'mon Evander, clear it all up for us. Why was suspicious evidence found with details eeriely similar to your own found in connection with HGH purchases. Why did you pick up the phone when investigators phoned the number linked to these sales?
These should be easy things to clear up since you've never purchased steroids.
Instead he releases a statement featuring a vague denial, and promises of an investigation that we know will never happen.

It's all got me scratching my head a little bit.

[istmeno]

Dont harp on semantics. When i said he turned pro as a heavy my reference was to when his CAREER STARTED AS A HEAVY.

it is not semantics. you harp on the 1lb a year theory. the flip side of that is 25 lbs of muscle in 4 years 84-88.

whether he juiced or not i don't know nor do i care. but just like those who are qick to incriminate, some are quick to blindly defend.

there is a shitload of circumstantial evidence against him. and with the allegation of the telephone number which he allegedly answered, the address, evan fields.

if it looks lik a duck, walks like a duck quacks like a duck, it ain't a cat

[Axe]

I was always a Holyfield fan but have to admit he did probably (99%) use them.

There is no test for HGH Zakman, you just have to trust the federal authorities on this one. I'll take their word over Evander's anyday. :-(

[box03]

Had a hard time gaining weight? WTF are you talking about? Holy boxed as an am at LHW.He turned pro as a cruiser walked around at about 200 and then went to heavy and 20 years later still weighs no more than 220lbs. Your post is completely indicative of the BS that plagues this forum in terms of attitudes to steroids. Holy trained with Haney to help him adjust to being a heavyweight thus on this premise he must have taken steroids. Yes i can see it now makes perfect sense..:patsch If you dont think Holyfield took Steroids you must be born under a rock, and what does bodybuilding have to with boxing anyway. I personally dont care if he took them or not, and yes he was a fighter that had to maintain wieght most of his career. It seems you have some Roid rage yourself responding to peoples post, let me guess your a huge fan of Shane Mosely that kinda says it all doesnt it.:yep

[Axe]

it is not semantics. you harp on the 1lb a year theory. the flip side of that is 25 lbs of muscle in 4 years 84-88.

whether he juiced or not i don't know nor do i care. but just like those who are qick to incriminate, some are quick to blindly defend.

there is a shitload of circumstantial evidence against him. and with the allegation of the telephone number which he allegedly answered, the address, evan fields.

if it looks lik a duck, walks like a duck quacks like a duck, it ain't a cat

Indeed. And the investigation was never out to prove that Holyfield did in fact use roids, it was against the company that sold them. So the fact that Holy's name came up and they found out that he did in fact purchase all this sh*t, proves that he took (or at least bought...which means took :-() HGH.

The only point of debate I see is whether or not "Evan Fields" was Holyfield...and if you read Slothrop's article, I'd say there's a 99% chance that this was so, and therefore, that Holyfield used.

This would definitely be "beyond reasonable doubt" in a courtroom, however as I said the investigation was never against Holyfield himself, so nobody pressed the issue.

[scurlaruntings]

If you dont think Holyfield took Steroids you must be born under a rock, and what does bodybuilding have to with boxing anyway. I personally dont care if he took them or not, and yes he was a fighter that had to maintain wieght most of his career. It seems you have some Roid rage yourself responding to peoples post, let me guess your a huge fan of Shane Mosely that kinda says it all doesnt it.:yepHow old are you?:huh:good

[box03]

How old are you?:huh:good 22, Like I said I could care less who uses steroids and now its become a big part of every sport. I know you like Holyfield but theres more evidence against him using steroids than not, its time you take off the blinders and realize most top athletes do probably use some form of a steroid to increase there performance level in some way or another.

[sir axeman]

Reading that Sports Illustrated article I would say definately he took HGH! In fact i always thought he had juiced up anyway as he did seem to bulk up to heavyweight with pure ripped muscle. Not merely a fat crusierweight was Holy! Still, i dont really care as I think in the heavyweight division they're all on it. Tyson certainly was. Lennox seemed to put on some weight under manny...maybe he was just getting older hey? :yep I'm not so sure. Tommy Morrison? The Klitschkos? James fat Tony?:lol: Defo!!! C'mon heavyweights are all juiced up.

[2smart4u]

Actually, there is evidence. At this point it's just not the kind of evidence that would label Evander as a definitive steroid user. But, it's certainly enough to arouse suspicion and warrant further investigation.

The case against Holyfield at this point in time is certainly stronger than evidence such as "I know a guy who knows a guy who said Evander did steroids." Now, that would be the equivalent of having no evidence.

But, when I read the Sports Illustrated story, it sure got me curious and wanting to know more. If it's true, Evander has some explaining to do. Interesting that he never called the reporters back when he said he would.
Why hasn't he addressed the claims directly, point for point. If he's innocent, why would he let those accusations slide?

Instead, he issues his own statement saying he's never done steroids and he's going to launch his own investigation. Hmmm, I wonder when we'll get the results of his sleuthing!

Again, I'll reiterate, at this point based on the available evidence, I'm not going to label him a steroid user.
But, c'mon Evander, clear it all up for us. Why was suspicious evidence found with details eeriely similar to your own found in connection with HGH purchases. Why did you pick up the phone when investigators phoned the number linked to these sales?
These should be easy things to clear up since you've never purchased steroids.
Instead he releases a statement featuring a vague denial, and promises of an investigation that we know will never happen.

It's all got me scratching my head a little bit.:smoke Dont scratch your head ! Use your head ! HOLY juiced and so did plenty of others ! :deal

[scurlaruntings]

Reading that Sports Illustrated article I would say definately he took HGH! In fact i always thought he had juiced up anyway as he did seem to bulk up to heavyweight with pure ripped muscle. Not merely a fat crusierweight was Holy! Still, i dont really care as I think in the heavyweight division they're all on it. Tyson certainly was. Lennox seemed to put on some weight under manny...maybe he was just getting older hey? :yep I'm not so sure. Tommy Morrison? The Klitschkos? James fat Tony?:lol: Defo!!! C'mon heavyweights are all juiced up.The jury rests:patsch

[istmeno]

The jury rests:patsch

nice to see you pick and choose the part of posts to prove your points. why not address the points made in the s i article.

[scurlaruntings]

nice to see you pick and choose the part of posts to prove your points. why not address the points made in the s i article.You need to learn to read.

[scurlaruntings]

Holy benches 365lb for 10 reps at 220lbs, no way can someone do that cleanWell im 225 and i can do it and im not on gear. Oh well there goes your theory..

[rydersonthestorm]

365 for a guy of 220 is not that great or difficult to do without steriods, however i do think evander juiced to bulk up against the bigger heavyweights. The guy saying lewis was on the juice is just stupid, of course he got bigger as time went on, he was 6'5 and very lean at the start of his career, most people of that build do not fully fill out till there late 20's and early 30's.

[2smart4u]

365 for a guy of 220 is not that great or difficult to do without steriods, however i do think evander juiced to bulk up against the bigger heavyweights. The guy saying lewis was on the juice is just stupid, of course he got bigger as time went on, he was 6'5 and very lean at the start of his career, most people of that build do not fully fill out till there late 20's and early 30's.:patsch For 10 reps its alot ! In fact I dought HOLY is even close to that !

[rydersonthestorm]

It isn't a small amount but there are people that weigh alot less than 220 than post post 10 reps of 365 so i don't think it's unrealistic.

[rodney]

Doubt it.
His appearance has been very consistent for years and as well as his weight.
He works out.
Lifts weights.
Maintains his physique.

[scurlaruntings]

You can bench 365 lbs for 10 reps?! You re single must be 475lb?Bench is overrated anyway. Its not often you find people who can bench twice there bodyweight unless they`ve been working out for a long while. Even benching my own weight can be a struggle on a bad day. But its not often if at all that i lift that heavy anymore.Its simply not worth the time or the strain on your joints.

[DamonD]

Out of respect for Holyfield, I prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt unless I'm 100% certain of his guilt.

[enquirer]

How can anyone say holy hasnt failed a drugs test when there is no test in boxing for growth hormone,and there are many compounds that mask drug use? And many many drugs users have either passed years of tests before making a mistake/being caught...You think ben johnson and linford christie didnt beat countless drugs tests before getting caught?
Also,in the seventies the east germans by their own admission gave steroids to their female track competitiors yet not many if any got caught...
I believe folks are far too naive and clingy to their heroes when it comes to drugs......
None of the mr olympia champions has ever tested positive for drugs or been disgraced for drug use yet its common knowledge that ALL of them used steroids,especially after the eighties....At least pro bodybuilding is truthful about its drug use rather than sticking its head in the sand....
ps; if mosleys blood count was 52 as opposed to a previous reading of 44 then he definatley used EPO,scientifically you cant go up like that without chemical assistance.....

[Webbiano]

Out of respect for Holyfield, I prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt unless I'm 100% certain of his guilt.

:deal

[sbbigmike]

-Move up in weight and retain speed, and gain power.
-Blading
-Heart issues
-Heptatis(Intravenous needles)
-Evan Fields
-Tyson requesting extra drug testing(those within the sport hear rumors on whos taking what)

All signs lead to Holyfeild being a dirty roider

[KINGOFTHE1ROUND]

Holyfield was at the big end of CW and because he debuted at 210 for HW everyone assumes he juiced. Haye did the same thing. It's called hard work and adding mass. Adamek,Haye and Holyfield. It is very possible to add muscle mass. The heaviest Holyfield ever was was 225. Not overly big. If he juiced,he would look like the Hulk.
He never failed 1 test unlike Roidtali or Lamont Cheaterson who were actually proven to use. It's all speculation and rumor and the media's penchant for tearing down heroes. They always dig up dirt on guys who are good. It's all lies and jealousy.

[JMP]

Holyfield was OBVIOUSLY on the gear. I don't need the Evan Fields thing to know that.

[Dorfmeister]

Slothrop, just let me say that from now on we are the opposite of fellow members, not blocking you or anyone else, but be prepared to get hit low when you least expect it to. This is another low blow to my feelings as a Holyfield fan.

[Montero]

Its pretty well known/accepted in the biz that he juiced.

[macp1]

Lee Haney introduced him to them most likely. But who cares? The muscles and strength isn't fake, like say fake tits and make-up on Beauty Contest contestants. No one has ever said "She shouldn't win, shes wearing make-up". The gains are real. The work you need to put in for those gains is real. Every smart athlete should be juicing properly anyway. I bet they all try and eat protein.

[StillWill]

anyone who doesnt believe that evander is a juiced pig also probably still believes in santa claus

[markclow]

Of course he was on the juice, its a known fact.

[chitownfightfan]

I always knew he was juicing since the Evan Fields allegations came about. But I've also always subscribe to the Low T argument put forth by guys who were caught. I bought Griffys excuses, Sosas and even though Mac never got caught, I knew he was using if not just to rehab after injury.

I always tried to beleive the athletes were one time users or were regulated to NORMAL levels, but after reading Caelums posts about the BS levels these tests are calibrated too:-( I think Ive change my mind.

Yeah, one of my fav fighters, Peterson was just caught, but it's BS, his excuse I mean. And that goes for Toneys as well.

Injuries with full discloure is one thing, but this whole thing about being a weaker man in their old age is squat.

PPL get old. Deal with it. Not everyone can be George Foreman. Hell, BHOP and Holy and maybe even Vitali(STILL) may be using. MOF.....as if it were possible to prove, I'd bet my 50K that both Holy and BHOP and Tarver, and RJJ and any top fighter over 40 are all juicing.:-(:-(:-(

[Rock0052]

Yeah, Holy's a juicer. It wouldn't really surprise me to hear any full time professional fighter was on something, but there's more evidence for Holyfield than there is for most.

[Azzer85]

I dont think Tyson ever took any of that shit, if he did, he most likely would have admitted it by now.

Tysons physique has always been pretty much the same, he was naturally a big fat kid when he was 16, even Rooney didnt believe Mikes age when he first saw him.

Ive heard the stories about someone ringing Evan Fields, only for Holyfield to answer. You also cant ignore Holyfields going bald very quickly and his 'heart problems'

Also look at his physique from 91 when he was in his prime, to 96 when he was though of as old and shot.....

Holyfield def juiced

[KINGOFTHE1ROUND]

Innocent until PROVEN guilty. Without actual proof,all you have is rumor,hearsay and bullshit.
They thought Holyfield was too amazing and squeaky clean so they had to invent these steroids rumors and allegations to tarnish him.

[Abdullah]

I believe Holyfield was a juicer, but that is just my opinion. I have always liked Holyfield too, but the Evan Fields thing is pretty damning.

[JaimeHuesos]

How do u think he got that heart damage?

[Vysotsky]

Holyfield was at the big end of CW and because he debuted at 210 for HW everyone assumes he juiced. Haye did the same thing. It's called hard work and adding mass. Adamek,Haye and Holyfield. It is very possible to add muscle mass. The heaviest Holyfield ever was was 225. Not overly big. If he juiced,he would look like the Hulk.
He never failed 1 test unlike Roidtali or Lamont Cheaterson who were actually proven to use. It's all speculation and rumor and the media's penchant for tearing down heroes. They always dig up dirt on guys who are good. It's all lies and jealousy.

CW was 190lbs until 2004 and he started as a LHW. Evander fought at 205 for his early HW career and even when he was only 205 had a huge amount of muscle mass on what looked like a pretty small natural frame. Just look at his traps. Everything on him looked like bulked up unnatural muscle.

[JC2006]

I believe he started using to move up to HW. He was also training with Lee Haney at the time so I'm sure Lee helped him out.

[Dorfmeister]

Slothrop, who r you? Why r you bothering and tryin to damage a legend's career? Why don't you pick someone else like Mike Tyson who used to take drugs, he admitted himself or anyone else? Please reply in all honesty...

[Blackness]

For a cruiserweight like Holyfield... to be able to out muscle natural beasts like Tyson etc... Yeah, I think slim Holyfield was def juicing. Those kinny ass legs of his tell you he was born to be a 175lb fighter tops.

[Absolutely!]

There's only one reason you work out with Lee Haney and it ain't to learn fitness plans.

[Absolutely!]

I dont think Tyson ever took any of that shit, if he did, he most likely would have admitted it by now.

Tysons physique has always been pretty much the same, he was naturally a big fat kid when he was 16, even Rooney didnt believe Mikes age when he first saw him.

Ive heard the stories about someone ringing Evan Fields, only for Holyfield to answer. You also cant ignore Holyfields going bald very quickly and his 'heart problems'

Also look at his physique from 91 when he was in his prime, to 96 when he was though of as old and shot.....

Holyfield def juiced

Why would he admit it?

[Imperial1]

Did he get caught seems a simple urine tests exposes any PED's so unless he was caught no he didn't juice up !

[Absolutely!]

Slothrop, who r you? Why r you bothering and tryin to damage a legend's career? Why don't you pick someone else like Mike Tyson who used to take drugs, he admitted himself or anyone else? Please reply in all honesty...

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Absolutely!]

Did he get caught seems a simple urine tests exposes any PED's so unless he was caught no he didn't juice up !

Massively suspicious until proven guilty.

[Imperial1]

Massively suspicious until proven guilty.


Can make him guilty on a hunch !There needs to be proof ..

[Boxed Ears]

Of course. And it didn't change him from an A-class fighter to a god anymore than it changed Vargas from a B-class fighter to an A-class fighter like ODLH, just like a C-class fighter can't turn themselves into a B-class fighter with any of this shit that's probably being done by the majority of big name fighters anyway.

[Slothrop]

Did Holyfield juice? lmfao. Is the Pope Catholic?

[Slothrop]

Of course. And it didn't change him from an A-class fighter to a god anymore than it changed Vargas from a B-class fighter to an A-class fighter like ODLH, just like a C-class fighter can't turn themselves into a B-class fighter with any of this shit that's probably being done by the majority of big name fighters anyway.

You don't understand how this shit works.

[king khan]

If I had to make a guess, I would say yes, he did indeed use PEDS. . .

[Slothrop]

If I had to make a guess, I would say yes, he did indeed use PEDS. . .

He had Lee fucking Haney bulk him up for Christ sake.

[iceman71]

Definatly, he has ever since he moved up to heavyweight.
you mean how he went from a walking around weight of 195 and bulked up to 202 pounds for his heavyweight debut? fuck off. you dont know shit, you didnt see shit, so shut up

[iceman71]

Did Holyfield juice? lmfao. Is the Pope Catholic?

did bill clinton fuck women in the whie house?

whose to blame trayvin or zimmerman?

did tyson rape d washington?

did holyfield juice?

you werent there for any of them.....so shut the fuck up hater

[king khan]

did bill clinton fuck women in the whie house?

whose to blame trayvin or zimmerman?

did tyson rape d washington?

did holyfield juice?

you werent there for any of them.....so shut the fuck up hater



LOL. . . I also wasn't there when OJ killed those two people, but I'm pretty fuggen sure he did. . .

Travon/Zimmerman is an analogy fail, because that's a situation where both could have, and probably were at fault to an extent. . .

Did Holyfield take steroids? I mean. . Lets review the evidence. . Do we have direct evidence? No. . But sometimes Circumstantial evidence is just as convincing.

- Evan Fields
- Similar Address to Holyfield's
- Phone number called, and Holyfield answers :lol: Something about this just cracks me up. . .
- 4 years later, his name is found in documents following a raid of a pharmacy in Orlando known for illegally supplying athletes with PEDS.


Him, Barry Bonds, etc. . never officially "caught". . But. . yeah. . .

[tezel8764]

I wouldn't be surprised if he did use in the past, bloody warrior though. :good

[Wass1985]

Did Holyfield juice? lmfao. Is the Pope Catholic?

Now that shit is crazy, i was just about to say thoses exact words hahahah

[Fighting Pride]

Holyfield had to have juiced, look at the transformation of his body at heavyweight, and it's almost certain he was that Evans Field alias. He accused Tyson aswell, and I believe that too, post-prison Mike anyway.

[ElCep]

I'm staring to think doping in boxing is widespread and actually as common as not. We'll never know the full extent and scale of it, but someone needs to take control of testing properly and routinely.

[iceman71]

LOL. . . I also wasn't there when OJ killed those two people, but I'm pretty fuggen sure he did. . .

Travon/Zimmerman is an analogy fail, because that's a situation where both could have, and probably were at fault to an extent. . .

Did Holyfield take steroids? I mean. . Lets review the evidence. . Do we have direct evidence? No. . But sometimes Circumstantial evidence is just as convincing.

- Evan Fields
- Similar Address to Holyfield's
- Phone number called, and Holyfield answers :lol: Something about this just cracks me up. . .
- 4 years later, his name is found in documents following a raid of a pharmacy in Orlando known for illegally supplying athletes with PEDS.


Him, Barry Bonds, etc. . never officially "caught". . But. . yeah. . .


OJ ? BAD EXAMPLE!! :lol:

point is...if he was....then it should be assumed 90% of the elite guys from that era did them.... they just like to call out holyfields name because hes a freak of nature with his body, with or without roids.... similar to david haye.... everyone talks shit about someone who is in excellent shape , must be steroids since everyone else looks like povetkin or chagaev, owen beck, or solis..... its just pointless to keep speculating these idiots are doing...you got pople that will find holyfield guilty by looking at him, other people will find peterson not gulity and say the tests were fucked up...people have nothing else to do but try and take away from ones career at this point...

[pirao666]

He did, for sure.

[Slothrop]

did bill clinton fuck women in the whie house?

whose to blame trayvin or zimmerman?

did tyson rape d washington?

did holyfield juice?

you werent there for any of them.....so shut the fuck up hater

:lol:

Holyfield juiced. So sorry.

[Vidic]

That was Holyfield's response to some accusations.

"I didn't use roids. People told me that Mike Tyson used them, but I still didn't want to do it".

:lol::lol:

[dmaq]

all i know is.. I've chilled with his son a few times and he deff doesn't juice

dude is skinny as fuck lol

cool kid tho

[benner]

Remember this?

[Only registered and activated users can see links]
At 44, Evander Holyfield hopes to unify the heavyweight titles and retire in 2008.
Damn...

[WildStyle]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Yes