As we approach Joe Calzaghe's 10th anniversary as World Champion

[PrideOfWales]

Let's take a look back at all of his title fights. 8 weeks from today will mark the day in which he won the belt against Chris Eubank. Unfortunately, we don't have 21 weeks in which to debate each fight for a reasonable period so we'll have to make do with two and a half days for each challenge.

So that magical fight in Sheffield first up...

Joe Calzaghe vs Chris Eubank

NolIcZPL4p8

[Dr Gonzo]

JC is going to have his ass handed to him on a plate

[China_hand_Joe]

JC is going to have his ass handed to him on a plateMany people did infact say that in the build up to the Eubanks fight.

[PrideOfWales]

Every question asked of Joe was answered this night. He proved he could go 12 rounds, he could take a shot and he didn't get stagefright.

Great fast start from Calzaghe, he looks so sharp in this fight. Eubank WAS in shape, he was supposed to be fighting on the same bill anyway but his preparation wasn't brilliant losing so much weight quite late. Joe got caught with some good shots and towards the end was very tired just about managed to hang in there. It was a brilliant fight.

Joe's ability to fight on the inside against Eubank was massive here. He really worked Chris over there.

[China_hand_Joe]

As Calzaghe moved into the top 5 P4P fighters in the world.

[ChuckYoungblood]

Constant pressure on the aging Eubanks proved to be the key. Good chin on both of them. Great fight.

[PrideOfWales]

Great fight!. Did Eubank came into this fight with out having a fight for 2 years and with out a manager and trainer? Told on YouTube comming into the fight.

Yes, Eubank trained himself a la Clubber Lang. This certainly wasn't prime Eubank but a very good version of him nonetheless. The fight was very entertaining. Lots of heavy punches landed from both sides that night.

[Amsterdam]

Yes, Eubank trained himself a la Clubber Lang. This certainly wasn't prime Eubank but a very good version of him nonetheless. The fight was very entertaining. Lots of heavy punches landed from both sides that night.

Detractors promote that Eubank was 'shot', I'd agree that he was past his best, maybe at 70%, but these detractors forget how green JC was and how big of a step up it was...

Most people around the time, save for the bookie odds, were picking Eubank to KO him if I remember correctly, most of the 'experts' in fact, the type that picked Lacy and are picking Kessler now.

How they think Kessler KO's him when he's eaten bigger shots from bigger punchers flush and didn't even blink is beyond me, Eubank, Lacy and others hit him with their best right hands and the Mitchell KD was a temple shot that was brutal, he was up in 3 at that. I do however think it's likely Calzaghe stops Kessler providing his hands can hold up like against Lacy.

[ThePlugInBabies]

:huh i swear calzaghe said in the ringside interview after the lacy fight that one of his hands got damaged in about the 7th.

[Sizzle]

Sad to think its taken ten years as "WBO Champion", the organisation which we all know has zero credibility, to fight TWO legitimate contenders to his crown.

The first was one of the biggest hypejobs in the history of boxing, and the second is a lot better (Kessler) but I still think Calzaghe will win a decision over him.

[PrideOfWales]

:huh i swear calzaghe said in the ringside interview after the lacy fight that one of his hands got damaged in about the 7th.

That's boxing, you can expect wear and tear. If his hands hold up like in the Lacy bout there won't be any problems.

Going back to the Eubank fight, it's great to see Joe going about his business in his good old raw style. His hands were fine, he was young and thought he could walk through anything to win. He's a better more mature boxer these days with much better footwork but that Calzaghe of old was great to watch.

[Amsterdam]

:huh i swear calzaghe said in the ringside interview after the lacy fight that one of his hands got damaged in about the 7th.

Which is bad news for Kessler, because Joe kept busting Lacy up well into the last round and was still throwing bombs that were having effect. If that also does not show will and heart, in the sense that he hurt his left in the 7th or 8th, had pitched a shutout and then went into the final not being careful, but going right at Lacy to give him some more of that finely tuned thrashing, what does?

It's really amazing.

[Korn_06]

I totally agree with the intension of this thread.

It is time to start writing the history books.

[Amsterdam]

He certainly wouldn't have lain on Eubank against the ropes - that was many a fighter's downfall. He'd have stayed centre of the ring and broken Chris down. it would never have been a stoppage, but it would have most likely been thrilling.

And that version of Eubank would have proven rather tough for Kessler in my opinion, a prime Eubank takes him. To be fair however, Kessler has an easier time with James Toney than Calzaghe does, it all works it's way around.

[Astola]

For fucks sake! Will it ever end!?!?! Calzaghe wasn't HALF as sharp when he fought Eubank as he is now - JUST LOOK AT SPEED / COORDINATION COMPARISONS! - shot or not Cal's 10x better now than when he whooped Eubank.

Prime Eubank (which aint that much diff) vs Calzaghe of today = Calzaghe Lacy's his noob ass.

Calzaghe is THAT bloody good - now give him so bloody respect for fucks sake people!!!!!!!!!!!


Hell yeah - all u dumBfuckers can watch the bika fight for proof...

[BigEars]

Calfaggis first title fight was against Lacy the WBO belt was not even recognised back then, like the WBU right now

The 3 previous WBO champions before Calzaghe were Tommy Hearns , Chris Eubank and Steve Collins .

The WBO has always been seen as a legitimate belt at Super Middleweight because the division itself is so new .

Anyway , it's the champion that makes the belt . Were Thulani Malinga , Vicenzo Nardiello , Eric Lucas and Marcus Beyer more of a champion than Calzaghe was ?

[Amsterdam]

I've not seen enough of Toney to comment, really. I saw the fight with Littles a few days ago, which was quite entertaining - especially seeing an in-shape Toney break his sparky, eager opponent.

Any other fights of his worth watching?

Any you can find. Nunn-Toney was solid.

[Fab2333]

I will give Calzaghe props if he beats Kessler, but he is still relativelty un-proven to me. He needs to fightelite fighters. His title defenses have been against no name bums. With the exception of Eubank.
Lacy was overrated to me. ANd Other than that, he never really faced any decent competition. I for one am not a big fan of his as evry1 kinda knows already. BUt A win against Kessler he will get my props for beating him seeing as how he is a fellow title holder, and the #2 supermiddleweight in the world.
But Joe needs to fight some elite fighters (Bhop, Jermain Taylor, RJJ,CHad Dawson) Just to name a few.

[PrideOfWales]

But Joe needs to fight some elite fighters (Bhop, Jermain Taylor, RJJ,CHad Dawson) Just to name a few.

The people you name are only considered "elite" by people like you because they are hyped. Calzaghe's not hyped in the States because he's not American and has no interest fighting there. If you're not impressed by Calzaghe, you won't even have heard much at all about Kessler so why will that impress you?

How many "elite" fighters has Chad Dawson faced to be considered "elite"? BHop is old, Taylor's a good fight though. RJJ means nothing anymore and Dawson is severely unproven.

[BigEars]

I will give Calzaghe props if he beats Kessler, but he is still relativelty un-proven to me. He needs to fightelite fighters. His title defenses have been against no name bums. With the exception of Eubank.
Lacy was overrated to me. ANd Other than that, he never really faced any decent competition. I for one am not a big fan of his as evry1 kinda knows already. BUt A win against Kessler he will get my props for beating him seeing as how he is a fellow title holder, and the #2 supermiddleweight in the world.
But Joe needs to fight some elite fighters (Bhop, Jermain Taylor, RJJ,CHad Dawson) Just to name a few.

I think you're being a bit unfair , Robin Reid , Richie Woodhall , Charles Brewer and Byron Mitchell were all top Super Middleweights . Omar Sheika was highly thought of and coming off a win against Glen Johnson when Calzaghe beat him too .

Other guys Calzaghe beat were solid if unspectacular opponents . Yes there has been a lack of elite opponents , but Calzaghe has a much better resume up to the point he fought Lacy than Hopkins did up to the point he fought Trinidad . Yet Hopkins is praised(rightfully so) for his reign .

[Fab2333]

The people you name are only considered "elite" by people like you because they are hyped. Calzaghe's not hyped in the States because he's not American and has no interest fighting there. If you're not impressed by Calzaghe, you won't even have heard much at all about Kessler so why will that impress you?

How many "elite" fighters has Chad Dawson faced to be considered "elite"? BHop is old, Taylor's a good fight though. RJJ means nothing anymore and Dawson is severely unproven.

SO bernard i hyped? RJ is hyped? Jermain Taylor is hyped?
Chad Dawson mayb cuz he is still kind of unproven
How are all the people I listed hyped, these are all proven fighters.
And I wonder why he doesnt fight in the states?:huh All his fights have been in the confort of his backyard, against bums. And I kno about kessler b/ simply I watch boxing :rofl:rofl. So WTF are you talkin about, yeah I dont like Calzaghe all that much, but if a fight is on I watch it. SO wata re you talkin about young grasshopper

[Fab2333]

I think you're being a bit unfair , Robin Reid , Richie Woodhall , Charles Brewer and Byron Mitchell were all top Super Middleweights . Omar Sheika was highly thought of and coming off a win against Glen Johnson when Calzaghe beat him too .

Other guys Calzaghe beat were solid if unspectacular opponents . Yes there has been a lack of elite opponents , but Calzaghe has a much better resume up to the point he fought Lacy than Hopkins did up to the point he fought Trinidad . Yet Hopkins is praised(rightfully so) for his reign .

DOnt get me wrong, I have my faults with Hopkins 2. He stayed at middleweigth and milked it for all It had. As oppose to coming up in weight to get real challenges. So I wont do the double standard thing. B-Hop did the same thign 2, he beat up on a lot of Jr Middleweights.

[PrideOfWales]

SO bernard i hyped? RJ is hyped? Jermain Taylor is hyped?
Chad Dawson mayb cuz he is still kind of unproven
How are all the people I listed hyped, these are all proven fighters.
And I wonder why he doesnt fight in the states?:huh All his fights have been in the confort of his backyard, against bums. And I kno about kessler b/ simply I watch boxing :rofl:rofl. So WTF are you talkin about, yeah I dont like Calzaghe all that much, but if a fight is on I watch it. SO wata re you talkin about young grasshopper

Yes, everyone is hyped to fuck in the States. That's a fact nobody with a brain will deny. I'm not saying any of the boxers mentioned are a piece of poo but... actually it is pointless starting this with you, you wouldn't be able to understand.

[ThePlugInBabies]

SO bernard i hyped? RJ is hyped? Jermain Taylor is hyped?
Chad Dawson mayb cuz he is still kind of unproven
How are all the people I listed hyped, these are all proven fighters.
And I wonder why he doesnt fight in the states?:huh All his fights have been in the confort of his backyard, against bums. And I kno about kessler b/ simply I watch boxing :rofl:rofl. So WTF are you talkin about, yeah I dont like Calzaghe all that much, but if a fight is on I watch it. SO wata re you talkin about young grasshopper

number of times calzaghe has fought outside the uk - 2
number of times hopkins has fought outside the us - 2
taylor outside the us - 0
rjj outside the us - 0

your point is lame and proves nothing.

[henrik]

For fucks sake! Will it ever end!?!?! Calzaghe wasn't HALF as sharp when he fought Eubank as he is now - JUST LOOK AT SPEED / COORDINATION COMPARISONS! - shot or not Cal's 10x better now than when he whooped Eubank.

Prime Eubank (which aint that much diff) vs Calzaghe of today = Calzaghe Lacy's his noob ass.

Calzaghe is THAT bloody good - now give him so bloody respect for fucks sake people!!!!!!!!!!!

And maybe you should come down bro....:-(

[Fab2333]

Yes, everyone is hyped to fuck in the States. That's a fact nobody with a brain will deny. I'm not saying any of the boxers mentioned are a piece of poo but... actually it is pointless starting this with you, you wouldn't be able to understand.

no xplain it 2 me, im listenin. I wont b bias 2wards him. Explain wat your saying

[Fab2333]

number of times calzaghe has fought outside the uk - 2
number of times hopkins has fought outside the us - 2
taylor outside the us - 0
rjj outside the us - 0

your point is lame and proves nothing.

UHm the difference is, when your british and you fight in britain all the time.
Referee is british, Judges are british. Evry1 is british. And lets b real here in boxing there is a lot of politics. So if a international fighter comes in and challenges Joe on his home soil and the fight mayb close they will most likely lean 2wrds the hometown favorite.
As oppose to the US at least its a mixture. And i kno that aint to much of an xcuse. But it is wat it is. And as a matter of fact 4get where he fights at ima leave that one out. Its the people who he fighting is wat I have an issue with

[Fab2333]

Number of P4P World Champons from all over the world that fight in the states including brits: All of them

Top P4P that refuse: Just Joe

proves a lot.:good

[PrideOfWales]

A New York fighter fighting in Vegas is a f*cking world apart...

Takes longer to fly from NY to Vegas than EEngland to NY FFS

Bottom line the best in the world fight in Vegas except Joe, then he says next fight America

A Welsh fighter fighting in England can also be a world apart.

London to New York 3471 miles
New York to Las Vegas 2453 miles

Am I missing something here? Yes, you're a complete retard.

[PrideOfWales]

UHm the difference is, when your british and you fight in britain all the time.
Referee is british, Judges are british. Evry1 is british.

This shows a severe lack of research (which is fairly easy to achieve should you look at something as easy to understand as boxrec) which is why arguing with you is pointless.

[PrideOfWales]

Takes longer to fly from NY to Vegas than EEngland to NY FFS

:rofl

[PrideOfWales]

Arguing a point with blind, ignorant monkeys is funny.

[Fab2333]

Arguing a point with blind, ignorant monkeys is funny.
ok mister man, if you think we live in a perfect world and the mother f***ers judgin joe calzaghe fights wont put a win in his favor you must b crazy. A hometown fighter who is undefeated and tryin do somethin as far as title defenses that has never been done be4. You think the judges no matter of nationality or race isnt going to protect that. Get real. The british want somethin 2 else to throw in the face of the US and this can b it. SO why not protect it. SO you need to wake up, and realize wtf is going on

[PrideOfWales]

ok mister man, if you think we live in a perfect world and the mother f***ers jusgin joe calzaghe fights wont put a win in his favor you must b crazy. A hometown fighter who is undefeated and tryin do somethin as far as title defenses that has never been done be4. You think the judgs no matter of nationality or race isnt going to protext that. Get real. The british want somethin 2 else to throw in the face of the US and this can b it. SO why not protect it. SO you need to wake up, and realize wtf is going on

I just tried to get a bunch of schoolkids to decipher what you tried to say here but they were unable to make any sense of these ramblings either.

[Fab2333]

I just tried to get a bunch of schoolkids to decipher what you tried to say here but they were unable to make any sense of these ramblings either.

wateva dude. you must kno, but wat im sayin is truth so wateva

[PrideOfWales]

"Takes longer"


Flying to TO NY can take only 5.5 hours , going back can take 7 hours , maybe its the flight paths or what not, I NEVER said it was a further distance:yep

This is complete horse-shit. You are getting confused by flying via Chicago or something! I work in the industry dear fellow so I know my shit here. A direct flight from NY to Vegas takes 5 and a half hours; the other way around is about 20 minutes faster due to the wind direction at high altitudes.

London to New York: Just under 8 hours
New York to London: Just over 7 hours

[PrideOfWales]

Number of P4P World Champons from all over the world that fight in the states including brits: All of them

Top P4P that refuse: Just Joe

proves a lot.

Proves that you don't have to fight in the States to be considered p4p?

[China_hand_Joe]

The only P4P fighter in the history of the sport not to have fought in America. An amazing achievement.

[0-1]

Perhaps he would have gotten his Hopkins fight he talked about, maybe James Toney or Roys Jones, Maccallum, maybe by now he would have a massive legacy and be P4P no1 ???


I was just thinking how much I would have loved to see a Calzaghe-Toney fight.... That would've been class. I'd pick Toney by SD.

And to the debate above; Calzaghe would've gotten bigger fights, but with more risk, had he gone to the states. Super-middle hasn't been chock-full of talent, but his legacy will always be hurt by missing out on what top talent there was to fight, such as RJJ and Toney. Those matches might have been hard to make, but Joe shares the blame for not making them, and the majority of that blame if he refused to leave these shores. Add in the fighters that he could have tempted up or down: Glen Johnson, Bernard Hopkins, Trinidad, Tarver, etc. etc. Joe has fought a lot of average fighters in his career, and he could've fought people who were a lot better. Great as he is, that has kept him below the historical level he perhaps could've reached.

[China_hand_Joe]

Add in the fighters that he could have tempted up or down: Glen Johnson, Bernard Hopkins, Trinidad, Tarver, etc. etc. Joe has fought a lot of average fighters in his career, and he could've fought people who were a lot better. Great as he is, that has kept him below the historical level he perhaps could've reached.Hopkins could not be tempted.

It is a shame the Johnson fight didn't happen in the end (twice).

Beating up and murdering Tarver and Trinidad would prove nothing.

I could beat Trinidad up at 168.

[Thom]

"Takes longer"


Flying to TO NY can take only 5.5 hours , going back can take 7 hours , maybe its the flight paths or what not, I NEVER said it was a further distance:yep Flight time can be affected by strong headwinds or tailwinds; however, I've flown between NYC and Vegas and NYC and London and they'd have to have a pretty fucked up flight plan for a New York/Vegas flight to take longer than any transatlantic flight.


Anyway, on topic. I recognize Calzaghe without question as the man at 168, but do Calzaghe supporters actually believe he's been a LEGIT champ for ten years. Do you people count Hide, Damiani, Akinwande, Bentt and Morrison as legit HW champs? I don't think the WBO became recognized as the fourth major title until around 2001/2002, and even then they were still ranking dead fighters in the top ten. And honestly, the alphabet titles mean almost nothing at this point. C'mon guys, Joe's a great fighter, but let's not rewrite history.

[UndisputedUK]

Calfaggis first title fight was against Lacy the WBO belt was not even recognised back then, like the WBU right now

Crap!

[UndisputedUK]

Flight time can be affected by strong headwinds or tailwinds; however, I've flown between NYC and Vegas and NYC and London and they'd have to have a pretty fucked up flight plan for a New York/Vegas flight to take longer than any transatlantic flight.


Anyway, on topic. I recognize Calzaghe without question as the man at 168, but do Calzaghe supporters actually believe he's been a LEGIT champ for ten years. Do you people count Hide, Damiani, Akinwande, Bentt and Morrison as legit HW champs? I don't think the WBO became recognized as the fourth major title until around 2001/2002, and even then they were still ranking dead fighters in the top ten. And honestly, the alphabet titles mean almost nothing at this point. C'mon guys, Joe's a great fighter, but let's not rewrite history.

Rubbish! Beyer and Ottke were the proper world champions then?

The WBO is now the best, get over it.

[Taffyy]

Lads dont get into it with the americans ........... They rule the world , They are the chosen ones , You have to fight & prove yourself there or else you are a nothing fighter..........blah fuckin blah fuckin blah.....!!!!!!!!
The reality is that they are so far up their own arses they dont see anything else apart from the interior of their star spangled fuckin rectums ....... !!!!!!

[PrideOfWales]

So let's now discuss the Omar Sheika fight...

[Claypole]

So let's now discuss the Omar Sheika fight...Omar was brave and he came to fight. I thought the stoppage was premature, but to be honest the fight was never going to end any other way. Omar may have been trying to fight back, but all he was doing was flailing his arms around a bit.

[PrideOfWales]

Omar was brave and he came to fight. I thought the stoppage was premature, but to be honest the fight was never going to end any other way. Omar may have been trying to fight back, but all he was doing was flailing his arms around a bit.

I also think the fight was stopped too early. Omar landed a couple of good shots on Joe in this fight. The early stoppage, though an inevitable outcome, only served to give Sheika and his team cause to complain.

[Brickhaus]

Yes, who exactly has Dawson beat to be considered elite? Last I checked he won his title from a fringe contender.


A fringe contender who was Ring's #2 when Dawson beat him, ahead of 'fringe contenders' like Clinton Woods, Julio Gonzalez, Antonio Tarver and Glenn Johnson, and behind only Ring champ Hopkins and lineal champ Erdei.

I'll grant you that Dawson's reputation has been built a lot more on how good he's looked and that he's the best defensive big fighter we've seen since Royboy faded out a lot more than beating solid opponents, but calling Adamek a fringe contender when he was at LHW is selling him short. He's a fringe contender at CW because there's a 25 lb difference and he probably won't have the chin to stand up to the bigger punching cruisers.