Who are the best fighters?

[Bad_Intentions]

discuss and name the best fighters who dominated these eras.

1880's
1890's
1900's
1910's
20's
30's
40's
50's
60's
70's

and so on..

[Bill1234]

Well, 00's and 10's, Johnson. 20's Dempsey, 30's Louis, 40's Louis, 50's Marciano, 60's Clay (Ali), 70's a mix of people. 80's Holmes. 90's, much like the 70's, a mix.

[Robbi]

Its sometimes hard to put fighters into certain decades anyway. Leonard fought between the late 1910's and early 1920's. Pep was featherweight champion between 1946 and 1952. What happens for example a fighters reign is split in half between two decades. Example: Champion from 1968-1972.

[TBooze]

Top 10 fighters from 1891-1900

10 Pedlar Palmer
9 Jack Dempsey
8 James J Corbett
7 Peter Jackson
6 Young Griffo
5 Terry McGovern
4 James J Jeffries
3 Jack McAuliffe
2 Bob Fitzsimmons
1 George Dixon

Mentions:

Billy Plimmer, , Billy Murphy, Ben Jordan, George Lavigne, Joe Walcott, Tommy Ryan, Mysterious Billy Smith, Kid McCoy and John L Sullivan

Top 10 fighters from 1901 to 1910

10 Tommy Ryan
9 Jim Driscoll
8 James J Jeffries
7 Joe Walcott
6 Stanley Ketchel
5 Terry McGovern
4 Jack Johnson
3 Sammy Langford
2 Abe Attell
1 Joe Gans

Mentions:

Owen Moran, Jimmy Walsh, Ben Jordan, Young CorbettII, Battling Nelson, Jack Sullivan, Billy Papke, Bob Fitzsimmons, Jack O’Brien and Tommy Burns

Top 10 fighters 1911 to 1920

10 Jim Driscoll
9 Harry Wills
8 Jack Johnson
7 Benny Leonard
6 Freddie Welsh
5 Jack Britton
4 Ted Lewis
3 Georges Carpentier
2 Johnny Kilbane
1 Jimmy Wilde

Mentions:

Kid Williams, Pete Herman, Abe Attell, Ad Wolgast, Dixie Kid, Mike Gibbons, Les Darcy, Mike O’Dowd, Sammy Langford, Jack Dillon, Battling Levinsky, Sam McVey, Joe Jeanette and Jack Dempsey


Top 10 fighters 1921 to 1930

10 Sammy Mandell
9 Harry Wills
8 Jack Dempsey
7 Al Brown
6 Tommy Loughran
5 Gene Tunney
4 Pancho Villa
3 Harry Greb
2 Mickey Walker
1 Benny Leonard

Mentions:

Jimmy Wilde, Fidel la Barba, Johnny Kilbane, Johnny Dundee, Kid Kaplan, Benny Bass, Tony Canzoneri, Bat Battalino, Pinkey Mitchell, Jackie Berg, Jack Britton, Joe Dundee, Jackie Fields, Tiger Flowers, Georges Carpentier, Jack Delaney and Maxie Rosenbloom

Top 10 fighters 1931 to 1940

10 Jimmy McLarnin
9 Jackie Berg
8 Benny Lynch
7 Billy Conn
6 Tony Canzoneri
5 Mickey Walker
4 Barney Ross
3 Maxie Rosenbloom
2 Joe Louis
1 Henry Armstrong

Mentions:

Midget Wolgast, Jackie Brown, Little Dado, Al Brown, Kid Chocolate, Baby Arizmendi, Freddie Miller, Joey Archibald, Jackie Fields, Lou Ambers, Fritzie Zivic, Charley Burley, Gorilla Jones, Marcel Thil, Freddie Steele, John Henry Lewis, Max Schmeling, Max Baer and James J Braddock

Top 10 fighters 1941 to 1950

10 Jake LaMotta
9 Rinty Monaghan
8 Sandy Saddler
7 Manuel Ortiz
6 Joe Louis
5 Ezzard Charles
4 Ike Williams
3 Charley Burley
2 Willie Pep
1 Ray Robinson

Mentions:

Jackie Paterson, Vic Toweel, Sammy Angott, Beau Jack, Bob Montgomery, Tippy Larkin, Fritzie Zivic, Red Cochrane, Tommy Bell, Tony Zale, Rocky Graziano, Marcel Cerdan, Gus Lesnevich, Freddie Mills, Archie Moore and Billy Conn

Top 10 fighters 1951 to 1960

10 Floyd Patterson
9 Carmen Bassilio
8 Jimmy Curruthers
7 Kid Gavilan
6 Rocky Marciano
5 Pascual Perez
4 Joe Brown
3 Sandy Saddler
2 Archie Moore
1 Ray Robinson

Mentions:

Dado Marino, Alphonse Halimi, Willie Pep, Hogan Kid Bassey, Davey Moore, Carlos Ortiz, Don Jordan, Bobo Olson, Gene Fullmer, Joey Maxim, Harold Johnson, Jersey Joe Walcott and Ingemar Johansson

Top 10 fighters 1961 to 1970

10 Dick Tiger
9 Nicolino Loche
8 Bob Foster
7 Jose Napoles
6 Vincente Saldivar
5 Muhammad Ali
4 Nino Benvenuti
3 Carlos Ortiz
2 Eder Jofre
1 Emile Griffith

Mentions:

Pone Kingpetch, Fighting Harada, Lionel Rose, Ruben Olivares, Davey Moore, Sugar Ramos, Flash Elorde, Ismael Laguna, Duilio Loi, Benny Paret, Luis Rodriguez, Curtis Cokes, Ki-Soo Kim, Joey Giardello, Carlos Monzon, Willie Pastrano, Floyd Patterson, Sonny Liston and Joe Frazier

Top 10 fighters 1971 to 1979

10 Eder Jofre
9 Ruben Olivares
8 Alexis Arguello
7 Antonio Cervantes
6 Bob Foster
5 Jose Napoles
4 Carlos Zarate
3 Muhammad Ali
2 Carlos Monzon
1 Roberto Duran


Mentions:

Yuko Gushiken, Alfonso Zamora, Lupe Pintor, Wilfredo Gomez, Ernesto Marcel, Danny Lopez, Ken Buchanan, Esteban DeJesus, Guts Ishimatsu (Suzuki), Nicolino Loche, Wilfred Benitez, Pipino Cuevas, Carlos Palomino, Ray Leonard, Rodrigo Valdez, John Conteh, Victor Galindez, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Larry Holmes and Ken Norton

Top 10 fighters 1980 to 1989

10 Roberto Duran
9 Aaron Pryor
8 Eusebio Pedroza
7 Julio Cesar Chavez
6 Larry Holmes
5 Michael Spinks
4 Tommy Hearns
3 Mike Tyson
2 Marvin Hagler
1 Ray Leonard

Mentions:

Alexis Arguello, Hector Camacho, Lupe Pintor, Sot Chitalada, Michael Nunn, Jeff Fenech, Myung Woo Yuh, Jung Koo Chang, Mike McCallum, Evander Holyfield, Pernell Whitaker, Jeff Chandler, Khoasio Galaxy, Salvador Sanchez and Azumah Nelson

Top 10 fighters 1990 to 1999

10 Julio Cesar Chavez
9 James Toney
8 Felix Trinidad
7 Naseem Hamed
6 Terry Norris
5 Pernell Whitaker
4 Evander Holyfield
3 Ricardo Lopez
2 Roy Jones Jr
1 Oscar de la Hoya

Mentions:

Virgil Hill, Nigel Benn, Saman Sorjaturong, Kostya Tszyu, Azumah Nelson, Floyd Mayweather Jr, Marco Antonio Barrera, Bernard Hopkins, Shane Mosley, Riddick Bowe, Brian Mitchell, Dariusz Michalczewski, Kaosai Galaxy, Orlando Canizales and Lennox Lewis

[Manassa]

Did I miss where he said Heavyweights?

No, you just saw the bit where he didn't say 'pound-for-pound' ;)

[Manassa]

He said fighters, so I assumed he meant all weights when he didn't specify Heavyweights. Try to keep up. ;)

'Try to keep up' :huh

You're the one who made an error.

[Manassa]

What error did I make? He said "fighters" not Heavyweights. He didn't specify pound for pound either, but when you say which fighters are the most dominant, it means which fighters, normally meaning any weight class. I think you're the one making the error.

So you want to get trivial about it? We can get trivial. You are assuming he meant all fighters - that is the fact, because he never specified. Bill1234 infact answered the question more accurately than you because he never based his post on assumption, just on what the author wrote.

Now, I wouldn't have a problem with you making your own rules up, but when you try to pick up Bill1234 for writing something that is entirely within reason, you start to irritate me.

Trying to make me look like the errorneous one by using patronizing phrases such as 'try to keep up' will not work. You can try to argue with me all you want but the fact is, Bill's answer was perfectly reasonable and you shouldn't have picked him up on it. Again, the author never specified 'pound-for-pound' so Bill, quite rightly, would have assumed he meant just the sheer best in a direct (and not relative) sense - which would naturally be a heavyweight. He didn't have to specify 'heavyweights' - heavyweights are just better than all the lower weights; they're bigger. Ray Robinson is not beating Joe Louis.

Now let that be the end of it, it's hardly a big deal. Just don't pick up other people when you yourself are not untouchable.

[Manassa]

He didn't ask who was the best in a head to head sense, he asked who was the most dominant, and no, heavyweights are not often the most dominant. Benny Leonard and Harry Greb were more dominant against better competition than Dempsey, so they would be the better answers. If he asked simply who was the best fighter at the time, you may be right, but not as far as who was more dominant against their comp.

You're making up your own rules again. The author never asked 'who was the most dominant?'

No, he titled the thread 'best fighters', then asked; 'the best fighters' - then he happened to add 'who dominated these eras' afterwards, which doesn't mean 'who was the most dominant?' Ray Robinson was surely more dominant over his own opposition than Joe Louis was over his, however he wasn't the dominant figurehead of the decade like Joe. If you asked me, in a direct sense, who dominated the '40s - I'd say 'Joe Louis' without a shadow of thought.

[doublesuited]

Manassa is delivering Sweet Pea a bitching like the UPS man.

[Robbi]

"discuss and name the best fighters who dominated these eras". Fighters obviously means in general, thus from all weight classes. Thats the way 99% of the population would interpret such a phrase.

"Heavyweights are just better than the lower weights; they're just better". Robinson sure aint beating Louis, but when the question is asked "the best fighters who dominated eras" Someone is quite entitled to rank Robinson over Louis.

Only a heavyweight nuthugger would come to the conclusion to view heavyweights as the best fighters to dominate eras in each seperate decade.

[Manassa]

"discuss and name the best fighters who dominated these eras". Fighters obviously means in general, thus from all weight classes. Thats the way 99% of the population would interpret such a phrase.

"Heavyweights are just better than the lower weights; they're just better". Robinson sure aint beating Louis, but when the question is asked "the best fighters who dominated eras" Someone is quite entitled to rank Robinson over Louis.

Only a heavyweight nuthugger would see heavyweights as the best fighters to dominate eras in each seperate decade.

You don't know me as a poster then. I very rarely talk about heavyweights. But this is how it is - Joe Louis would likely smash every fighter below his weight division. Even Ezzard Charles at his light heavyweight peak.

[Manassa]

What did you mean by the thread title Bad_Intentions? Did you mean who were the best fighters period, as in who would've beaten everyone else? Or who were the most dominant, for any weight class? You may be right Manassa, let's see that he meant.

What he meant matters little - what bothers me is the fact you picked up Bill1234 for something he was well within his rights to say. There was no reason to harrass him, he merely stuck to the written agenda.

[doublesuited]

What he meant matters little - what bothers me is the fact you picked up Bill1234 for something he was well within his rights to say. There was no reason to harrass him, he merely stuck to the written agenda.:yep

Sweet Pea needs to make stupid remarks due to a lack of self-confidence. Probably from all the family "loving" down in the "dirty" South.

:hi:

[Manassa]

But what then does it mean "the best fighters who dominated these eras?". Galento would probably beat Leonard, but does that make him "a better fighter who dominated his era?". No, he may be better head to head in a one on one sense, but not in a sense as to who was more dominant. That's why I thought it was pretty obvious he was talking pound for pound.

Tony Galento to one of the famous Leonards (Benny or Ray?) is a poor comparison. I can just as easily turn around and compare Dave Green to Rocky Marciano.

However you interpreted the question isn't what my gripe is about - you must understand this. Otherwise, I would have picked up TBooze as well. Infact, I would have responded to the thread just like him. It was your uncalled-for hounding of Bill1234.

[Robbi]

You're making up your own rules again. The author never asked 'who was the most dominant?'

No, he titled the thread 'best fighters', then asked; 'the best fighters' - then he happened to add 'who dominated these eras' afterwards, which doesn't mean 'who was the most dominant?' Ray Robinson was surely more dominant over his own opposition than Joe Louis was over his, however he wasn't the dominant figurehead of the decade like Joe. If you asked me, in a direct sense, who dominated the '40s - I'd say 'Joe Louis' without a shadow of thought.

He's asking the question in a boxing sense, well I think so, not dominating outside the ring as a figurehead. Who dominated the 40's, overall as an icon out of the ring, combined with domination inside the ropes, Louis. He was a bigger iconic figure to the general public, and was probably the most well known fighter in the world during the 40's. But a case could be made to rank Robinson over Louis in strictly in a boxing sense inside the ropes.

The question could have been asked in more detail, so it depends on how each on of us interprets the question.

[doublesuited]

Bill1234 has more boxing knowledge in his left buttcheek than Sweet Pea will ever manage to learn.

[Manassa]

He's asking the question in a boxing sense, well I think so, not dominating outside the ring as a figurehead. Who dominated the 40's, overall as an icon out of the ring, combined with domination inside the ropes, Louis. He was a bigger iconic figure to the general public, and was probably the most well known fighter in the world during the 40's. But a case could be made to rank Robinson over Louis in strictly in a boxing sense inside the ropes.

The question could have been asked in more detail, so it depends on how each on of us interprets the question.

Indeed it does. But that's not what bothered me (for a few seconds before it all escalated, now I'm bored - drop it).

[Robbi]

You don't know me as a poster then. I very rarely talk about heavyweights. But this is how it is - Joe Louis would likely smash every fighter below his weight division. Even Ezzard Charles at his light heavyweight peak.

I never mention you as a heavyweight nuthugger. I said that in general to seperate our different views on the question.

[Manassa]

Again, the thread was asking about who was the best fighter who dominated their era, and just because someone is better in a head to head sense due to size doesn't make them a better fighter who dominated their era. It's in fact obvious he was talking pound for pound.

And I didn't hound Bill at all, I questioned how he answered it, I think you're getting too worked up over me questioning him, you're making it seem like I insulted him, which I didn't.

It's in fact obvious he was talking pound for pound.

It is? Could've fooled me. But I already said, I would have interpreted it in the same way! I'm merely arguing in favour of Bill - it was fine for him to answer the way he did. Certainly not worth a sarcastic nudge ;)

[Robbi]

Bill1234 has more boxing knowledge in his left buttcheek than Sweet Pea will ever manage to learn.

Your a shit stirrer. And your knowledge lacks in a serious way. Go on another thread and chat about boxing instead of getting caught up in others differences of opinion.

[doublesuited]

Your a shit stirrer. And your knowledge lacks in a serious way. Go on another thread and chat about boxing instead of getting caught up in others differences of opinion.:bart

I'm defending my good friend Bill1234, who was being insulted by Sweet Pea without any warrant. If helping out a friend is a crime, then I'm guilty as charged.

[Robbi]

:bart

I'm defending my good friend Bill1234, who was being insulted by Sweet Pea without any warrant. If helping out a friend is a crime, then I'm guilty as charged.

Lets hear your view on the question then, instead of having a pop at Sweet Pea.

[Manassa]

Point me to where I insulted him please.

You called him an 'anal whore' who 'reeks of the sweat of a hundred gays.' Conveniently, you edited your post soon after...

[Robbi]

Anyway afterall that, who wants a cuppa. Im going to put the kettle on.

[doublesuited]

Point me to where I insulted him please. If I were in the shoes of Bill1234 and someone responded with "Did I miss where he said Heavyweights?", I'd be pretty insulted.

Whereas any normal person would say something along the lines of "Why is your selection full of heavyweights?" or "I think some of the fighters in the lower weights, such as Greb in the 20's, were better fighters than their heavyweight contemporaries."

Instead, you have to make your usual dickhead remark, which I'm pretty sure most people here are sick of.

[doublesuited]

But everyone likes it when you chime in with your childish insults and trolling that is meant solely to stir shit up, and has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I've quite honestly never seen you make a post that wasn't trolling or insulting, and you're talking down my posting quality? So now instead of refuting the fact that you did insult Bill1234, you resort to the "pot calling the kettle black" argument.

Brilliant. :good