Why is Pac rated higher than JMM at 130lbs???

[Biggame]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

[Stinky gloves]

Cause his fans intimidiate everybody, you will see in a few minutes:bbb

[Biggame]

Cause his fans intimidiate everybody, you will see in a few minutes:bbb

:rofl :rofl

I'm waiting for them!! :bbb

[acb]

Cause his fans intimidiate everybody, you will see in a few minutes:bbb

You mean with this?

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :patsch :smoke :good :good :good :good :deal :deal :hat :good

[LogDog69]

I think Pac is ranked higher because he already had a knockout win over MAB before JMM beat him. Even though it happened at 126 and not 130 I figure this is probably the reason. When PAC and JMM rematch we'll find out who is #1 for sure :good

[H .]

Cause his fans intimidiate everybody, you will see in a few minutes:bbb

:lol:

[Quick Cash]

Well, if you're basing it on the Barrera-Morales trilogy, then technically it breaks down to MAB eking out the decision in the rematch, losing by TKO to Manny Pacquiao shortly after, who, in turn, lost it to Erik. In Morales' next fight in 130, he lost to Pacquiao and Pacquiao hasn't lost since. Chronologically, that's what happened, but a lot of the fights above didn't occur at super featherweight. Basically, Pacquiao is rated higher because he is a much more proven commodity in the division than JMM, who has had one good performance. It boils down to dominance more than anything else, really.

[theHawtness]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!
1.pac has no belt so it means he shouldn't be no.1?:-( get outta here. those belts are worth nothing. boxing has no objective ranking regarding these belts. anyone can get them.

2. there's no way JMM could have won that.:verysad the "JMM schooled pac after round 1" is the greatest myth in modern boxing. get outta here.

3. he's done nothing in his weightclass to warrant his ranking?:-( for christ sake, he annahilated the 2 greatest mexican jr. lightweights of all time! he Knocked out (twice!) the guy who everybody thought can never be KOed! he pummeled barrera, humiliated him. and lastly, he always gives us one hell of a fight.

get outta here!

[Stewbear]

well what has JMM done fought a fight with barrera that couldhave gone either way, while Pacman hasalready brutally destroyed a beter version of barrera

[King Dan]

1.pac has no belt so it means he shouldn't be no.1?:-( get outta here. those belts are worth nothing. boxing has no objective ranking regarding these belts. anyone can get them.

2. there's no way JMM could have won that.:verysad the "JMM schooled pac after round 1" is the greatest myth in modern boxing. get outta here.

3. he's done nothing in his weightclass to warrant his ranking?:-( for christ sake, he annahilated the 2 greatest mexican jr. lightweights of all time! he Knocked out (twice!) the guy who everybody thought can never be KOed! he pummeled barrera, humiliated him. and lastly, he always gives us one hell of a fight.

get outta here!

I guess this thread is over.

[PH|LLA]

JMM won 116-112 against a shot MAB while Pac dominated the entire fight and KOed MAB 4 years earlier. Until now this is JMM's 1 and only fight at 130.

at 130 Pac lost 115-113 once and KO'd Morales twice, something even David Diaz at 135 wasn't able to come close to doing. He also demolised Solis, Larios and Valasquez easily

JMM's only fight at 130 is a close UD win over a shot Barrera

[brooklyn1550]

I think it's because he got to MAB first... but I don't think he should be rated as high as Marquez at 130. Morales was shot and Solis was moving up and his competition prior to the Pac fight wasn't great at all.

[acb]

Delete

[acb]

he pummeled barrera, humiliated him.


The question was about 130lbs.

[theHawtness]

The question was about 130lbs.
ok, i stand corrected. :bbb

[Chert]

JMM won 116-112 against a shot MAB while Pac dominated the entire fight and KOed MAB 4 years earlier. Until now this is JMM's 1 and only fight at 130.

at 130 Pac lost 115-113 once and KO'd Morales twice, something even David Diaz at 135 wasn't able to come close to doing. He also demolised Solis, Larios and Valasquez easily

JMM's only fight at 130 is a close UD win over a shot Barrera
yep. no question that pac has the better resume at 130 compared to jmm. that's why he's rated #1 at 130. a fight between the two will determine the SFW lineal champ.

[kg0208]

He currently has a better resume than JMM there.

[theHawtness]

i guess the question is not why pac is ranked higher, but why should JMM be ranked higher than pac.

ok, why should JMM be ranked higher than pac?

a win over a shot barrera? (which doesn't prove anything) lame argument

conclusion: therefore, JMM cannot be ranked higher than pac.

[kg0208]

i guess the question is not why pac is ranked higher, but why should JMM be ranked higher than pac.

ok, why should JMM be ranked higher than pac?

a win over a shot barrera? (which doesn't prove anything) lame argument

conclusion: therefore, JMM cannot be ranked higher than pac.

Well ok...thats a whole new can of worms. Shot Barrera means no credit to Pac for fighting him now.

[PATSYS]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

Rated higher by who?

JMM is WBC champ so he is rated higher by the WBC.

But people who knows that Pac beat EM and also demolished MAB when MAB was 4 years younger than when JMM closely beat him just rightfully ranks Pac higher.

Add to that Pac's much much better list of opponents at 130, whereas JMM only has 1 fight.

[Chert]

Well ok...thats a whole new can of worms. Shot Barrera means no credit to Pac for fighting him now.
i wouldn't exactly call barrera shot... maybe way past-prime when he fought jmm. if he was really shot, then jmm should've laid him out and not win via only a close decision.

[kg0208]

i wouldn't exactly call barrera shot... maybe way past-prime when he fought jmm. if he was really shot, then jmm should've laid him out and not win via only a close decision.

Hey...I didn't say it. Hawtness did.

[Quick Cash]

I had JMM up 8 rounds to 4 in their bout. Technically, if we follow the ten-point must, that should translate to a points win for Pacquiao given the three knockdowns early in the fight. However, for Marquez to get dropped thrice and then go on to outbox and out-maneuver his opponent tells me something about that version of Pacquiao. JMM was the better fighter and the true victor that night.

[BewareofDawg]

ok, i stand corrected. :bbb
Ok.....now "Get OUTTA Here!" :nut :patsch

[Biggame]

As I read on, you have folks here acting like because Pac beat MAB at 126lbs he therefore should be ranked automatically higher:huh Personally I don't think beating a shot EM 2X's, actually losing to him once, beating an unproven Solis, beating a guy who moved up to weightclasses in Larios, and Valazquez is that great of a resume. EM who stands out the most has now lost his last 4 fights(5 out of last 6). Larios has been on the down slide and was Ko'd in his fight leading up to there fight. A majority of his opponents at 130lbs are coming off of losses, while none of them play any significant role at the weight. JMM fought and beat the most significant guy at that weight, and look who's fighting him next! What's so great about his resume now? I'm lost here!!

If you look hard his resume there ain't shit:nono 126lbs don't have shit to do w/130lbs. MAB's resume is way better than Pac's at that weight and JMM just beat him.

For those who call MAB shot you need to erase, and not count a victory by PAC IF he wins in there upcoming fight, and then take away the EM wins, and now what do you have for PAC at 130lbs:huh JMM may only have one fight at the weight, but he beat the man there! He should rightfully take that spot, and it should be given to someone else off of speculation, or because of what happened at 126lbs between MAB and Pac!!

[Biggame]

i guess the question is not why pac is ranked higher, but why should JMM be ranked higher than pac.

ok, why should JMM be ranked higher than pac?

a win over a shot barrera? (which doesn't prove anything) lame argument

conclusion: therefore, JMM cannot be ranked higher than pac.

:-(

The same so called Shot guy JMM just beat Pac is fighting next, and like a majority of Pac's last opponents he coming off of a loss!! You will see it as a great win, and reason to crown Pac Champ will pretending like JMM did it against a weaker version, while still trying to discredit him!!

Pathetic!!

Now what's your point:think

[maciek4]

well after beating Barrera and drawing with Marquez he had solid performances and won his fights in sensational fashion, he lost to Morales but he beat him twice brutally to prove it was an off night. JMM on the other hand since drawing with Pacquaio lost a match with Chris John. No matter if it was or wasnt a robbery it was a set back for Marquez. This happened at the same time Pacquaio knocked out Morales for the second time and his stock highrocketed again. Since then JMM had beaten Barrera and his stock rose by a mile , however because of the loss to John and PAc's both wins over Morales, Pac is still ranked higher because he has got a momentum going on. In my opinion their stocks are equal and only a fight will determine who is the best at 130.

[maciek4]

As I read on, you have folks here acting like because Pac beat MAB at 126lbs he therefore should be ranked automatically higher:huh Personally I don't think beating a shot EM 2X's, actually losing to him once, beating an unproven Solis, beating a guy who moved up to weightclasses in Larios, and Valazquez is that great of a resume. EM who stands out the most has now lost his last 4 fights(5 out of last 6). Larios has been on the down slide and was Ko'd in his fight leading up to there fight. A majority of his opponents at 130lbs are coming off of losses, while none of them play any significant role at the weight. JMM fought and beat the most significant guy at that weight, and look who's fighting him next! What's so great about his resume now? I'm lost here!!

If you look hard his resume there ain't shit:nono 126lbs don't have shit to do w/130lbs. MAB's resume is way better than Pac's at that weight and JMM just beat him.

For those who call MAB shot you need to erase, and not count a victory by PAC IF he wins in there upcoming fight, and then take away the EM wins, and now what do you have for PAC at 130lbs:huh JMM may only have one fight at the weight, but he beat the man there! He should rightfully take that spot, and it should be given to someone else off of speculation, or because of what happened at 126lbs between MAB and Pac!!

Pac is fighting Barrera again a guy who JMM just beat but who is JMM fighting? A guy who Barrera already beat TWICE, a guy who is no match for him. They need to fight again to settle who is better but Pac ranks higher because of the momentum that he has, at the time he knocked Morales out in the 3rd fight, JMM lost a points decision to Chris John, so PAc's status skyrocketed and JMM almost dissapeared, he had to beat Barrera to come back on top but Pac hasnt lost since then and he is fighting a better opponent now, so JMM needs to fight either Pac or Guzman to prove he should be ranked higher.

[psychopath]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

Reason?

Very short . . . because the belts doesn't mean shit.

Who is the more proven fighter and established at 130 at this point?

A fight between these two will show us who really is the top guy at the division. :yep

[PacDbest]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

Coz MAB ducks Pacquiao's rematch. Coz JMM ducks Pac's rematch. As simple as that.

[Biggame]

Whom did JMM beat at 130? A shot Barrera who knocked him down on the 6th round. Pac beat prime Barrera w/ a brutal KO. All wins of Pac except that of Larios are via KO/TKO. Therefore, Pac should come first over JMM.

MAB is shot?

So how much credit will you give Pac when he beats, and how much more will you give JMM if MAB beats Pac?

[Biggame]

Reason?

Very short . . . because the belts doesn't mean shit.

Who is the more proven fighter and established at 130 at this point?

A fight between these two will show us who really is the top guy at the division. :yep

We aren't talking about an up and coming fighter in JMM,..he's an established fighter who's rebounded from that BS shit lost to John, and has now beat the #1 guy at 130lbs in MAB!! Pac lost to EM who before hand had lost his title at 130lbs to MAB, and because he's beaten a shot, EM, Larios, and 2 other unproven fighters he resume is better. I know it's hard to compare 1 fight to 5, but when you're establashed like JMM, and you beat the #1 guy you don't just bump someone in front of them. Belts don't mean nothing, and we're not talking about JMM jumping Pac on the P4P list, but in the division it should be JMM!!

That's all I'm saying. JMM beat the man and PAC has beaten the guy who used to be the man, a couple other guys not worthy of mentioning!!

Fighting will ultimately decide, but as of now it should be JMM!!

[Biggame]

:piss
Coz MAB ducks Pacquiao's rematch. Coz JMM ducks Pac's rematch. As simple as that.

[psychopath]

We aren't talking about an up and coming fighter in JMM,..he's an established fighter who's rebounded from that BS shit lost to John, and has now beat the #1 guy at 130lbs in MAB!! Pac lost to EM who before hand had lost his title at 130lbs to MAB, and because he's beaten a shot, EM, Larios, and 2 other unproven fighters he resume is better. I know it's hard to compare 1 fight to 5, but when you're establashed like JMM, and you beat the #1 guy you don't just bump someone in front of them. Belts don't mean nothing, and we're not talking about JMM jumping Pac on the P4P list, but in the division it should be JMM!!

That's all I'm saying. JMM beat the man and PAC has beaten the guy who used to be the man, a couple other guys not worthy of mentioning!!

Fighting will ultimately decide, but as of now it should be JMM!!

Buddy Pac was already the number 1 guy at 130 even when MAB is holding the WBC belt. :D Don't get confused. We are talking of the P4P ring rating. Of course when we talk of the WBC rating JMM is #1 because he is the belt holder. :lol:

As I said it is more on who's more established . . . . as in the quality of oppositions.

[theunderdog]

so jmm beat mab once at 130. fine. if you consider this a big win then you should also consider pac's 2 wins over em as big wins so pac should be number one. he's been around much longer asn has a better record at 130.

pac is 5-1 with 4 ko's at 130
jmm is 1-0 with 0 ko's at 130

the belt makes jmm number 1?


please.

[Biggame]

Buddy Pac was already the number 1 guy at 130 even when MAB is holding the WBC belt. :D Don't get confused. We are talking of the P4P ring rating. Of course when we talk of the WBC rating JMM is #1 because he is the belt holder. :lol:

As I said it is more on who's more established . . . . as in the quality of oppositions.

Quality of opposition:rofl What opposition???

Yes Pac beat EM, but MAB beat him at 130lbs also, and he beat him while he was he was champ!! Beating MAB at 126lbs doesn't mean shit at 130lbs:nono

I still don't see what's so quality about Pac's 130lbs opposition!! He's had more fights, but that's about it, and certainly not enough! EM was long gone when he beat him, and Larios was coming from 2 weightclasses up, Valasquez???, Solis???? I rate that as fair opposition, not good:nono

How will you rank JMM if MAB beats PAC?

[Biggame]

so jmm beat mab once at 130. fine. if you consider this a big win then you should also consider pac's 2 wins over em as big wins so pac should be number one. he's been around much longer asn has a better record at 130.

pac is 5-1 with 4 ko's at 130
jmm is 1-0 with 0 ko's at 130

the belt makes jmm number 1?


please.

JMM one opponent is better than all of Pac's combined especially when you consider that 2 were unproven, 2 wins against a shot fighter who has lost 5 of his last 6 fights, and 1 coming up 2 weightclasses!

[sues2nd]

Cause his fans intimidiate everybody, you will see in a few minutes:bbb

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Sweet Pea Pacquiao]

JMM one opponent is better than all of Pac's combined especially when you consider that 2 were unproven, 2 wins against a shot fighter who has lost 5 of his last 6 fights, and 1 coming up 2 weightclasses!

That one opponent was already TKO'd by Pacquiao in a fight he was winning 10 rounds to 1 before the stoppage.

Sure, JMM beat MAB when he was holding the belt, but by then MAB was not coming off of a Morales UD or a Fana KO or even a Peden UD. He was coming off of two very unflattering bouts with Rocky Juarez, who himself was MOVING UP from 126 for his very first fight.

Then MAB picked JMM who was MOVING UP from 126 for his very first fight. Pacquiao's two wins over Morales, combined with his earlier dominant TKO of Barrera beat Marquez's lone win at 130 over an even less prime (but not shot) Barrera.

[Biggame]

Doesnt matter p4p#1 at years end:happy :happy ..whatta you gonna do?:rofl :rofl :rofl

Your arguments are so whack...you're getting killed in every post :lol: :lol:

When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging!:rofl :rofl :rofl

You my friend are corny, and who will be P4P #1 at the end of the year:huh

[Biggame]

I don't agree but I can live w/it!! Pac's when over MAB at 126lbs means nothing at 130lbs, and Pac resume is less than stellar at the weight! Ppl take and overrate the EM wins regardless of tha fact that the only guy EM managed to beat in his last 6 fights is Pac which doesn't say much about Pac!!

I think JMM beats Pac next time around baring Pac gets past MAB this time around!!

[Biggame]

PAC or Floyd but Pretty Boy has to be very impressive..

You know what PAc will do to MAB...

Editor at Ring Mag already hinted at this

So what do you think??:good

It will be Floyd, and no I don't know what Pac will do so tell me what this editor says!!

[psychopath]

Quality of opposition:rofl What opposition???

Yes Pac beat EM, but MAB beat him at 130lbs also, and he beat him while he was he was champ!! Beating MAB at 126lbs doesn't mean shit at 130lbs:nono

I still don't see what's so quality about Pac's 130lbs opposition!! He's had more fights, but that's about it, and certainly not enough! EM was long gone when he beat him, and Larios was coming from 2 weightclasses up, Valasquez???, Solis???? I rate that as fair opposition, not good:nono

How will you rank JMM if MAB beats PAC?

You should be asking that for JMM? :lol:

What quality oppositions? The MAB who was already pummeled to submission by Pac 3 years ago and who barely survived Juarez? :huh

Manuel Medina
Marcos Lincona
Derrick Gainer
Orlando Salido
Victor Polo
Terdsack Jandaeng
Lost to Cris John
Terdsack Jandaeng
Jim Rex Jaca

. . . are these the quality opponents that will put JMM up to a NO 1 P4P position? :roll:

I was trying to give you a logical explanation but you're just too dumb to understand.

So just get the fuck out here . . . shithead. :yep :hi:

[theunderdog]

JMM one opponent is better than all of Pac's combined especially when you consider that 2 were unproven, 2 wins against a shot fighter who has lost 5 of his last 6 fights, and 1 coming up 2 weightclasses!

this has got to be one of the most stupid things i've ever seen. mab was blown out by pac. sure it was at 126 but still he got beaten to a bloody pulp until his corner can take no more. jmm chewed up what pac spat out.

and what did mab do to deserve to be better than 3 matches against morales? a win over fana or a contested win over juarez? or maybe you think mab is so great at 130 because he beat morales? well, you just said that morales was long shot before pac fought him.

so mab wins by decision and he gets all the credit in the world, pac ko's him twice and loses to him one and he gets nothing because EM is shot?

so tell me, if both pac and jmm win their next matches, pac will surely be over jmm in your rankings right?

because he beat mab who is better that pac's last five fights combined and jmm beat juarez who was beaten by mab twice.

do you agree with this biggame?

[psychopath]

It will be Floyd, and no I don't know what Pac will do so tell me what this editor says!!

So how sure are you shithead? :D :lol:

You already know what's gong to happen at the end of this year?
:rasta

[Biggame]

If Pac is impressive against MAB, you know...he might be numero uno.

Hey if not this year next year..PAC have great fighters lined up...JMM, Soto, Guzman... (Im taking bets:yep :yep :yep )

Who is PBF going to fight thats the same caliber??

Welter weights pretty packed, and the best division in boxing right now!!

[Biggame]

So how sure are you shithead? :D :lol:

You already know what's gong to happen at the end of this year?
:rasta

Shithead?:-( How corny!!

Who do you think wins between Pac v. MAB, and Mayweather v. Hatton

[Biggame]

this has got to be one of the most stupid things i've ever seen. mab was blown out by pac. sure it was at 126 but still he got beaten to a bloody pulp until his corner can take no more. jmm chewed up what pac spat out.

and what did mab do to deserve to be better than 3 matches against morales? a win over fana or a contested win over juarez? or maybe you think mab is so great at 130 because he beat morales? well, you just said that morales was long shot before pac fought him.

so mab wins by decision and he gets all the credit in the world, pac ko's him twice and loses to him one and he gets nothing because EM is shot?

so tell me, if both pac and jmm win their next matches, pac will surely be over jmm in your rankings right?

because he beat mab who is better that pac's last five fights combined and jmm beat juarez who was beaten by mab twice.

do you agree with this biggame?

You guys are going off of what happened a few yrs ago, and an shot EM!! Who can't beat EM at this stage, or should I ask who could EM beat at this stage? EM was no longer a force or even a live body so beating guys like Juarez, and Fana are certainly better than beating EM! And yes MAB beat a better version of EM than Pac, and EM wasn't losing to anyone who would pick up a pair of gloves then either.

Both Pac and Mab are 2-1 against EM, Pac and Jmm both beat MAB and they drew with eachother. Jmm beat the Champ at 130lbs, Pac has been fighting guys coming off of losing streaks, and guys who are unproven. Yeah it's one fight, but it was a champion during his reign at the weightclass we are speaking about!

Stop acting as if beating MAB at 126lbs yrs ago holds as much weight 2day as it did then!! And stop pretending that EM was some monster, or even a big rat over the past couple yrs!!

Stop overrating those wins!

[Biggame]

You should be asking that for JMM? :lol:

What quality oppositions? The MAB who was already pummeled to submission by Pac 3 years ago and who barely survived Juarez? :huh

Manuel Medina
Marcos Lincona
Derrick Gainer
Orlando Salido
Victor Polo
Terdsack Jandaeng
Lost to Cris John
Terdsack Jandaeng
Jim Rex Jaca

. . . are these the quality opponents that will put JMM up to a NO 1 P4P position? :roll:

I was trying to give you a logical explanation but you're just too dumb to understand.

So just get the fuck out here . . . shithead. :yep :hi:

Who's talking P4P dumbfuck!!

[PATSYS]

As I read on, you have folks here acting like because Pac beat MAB at 126lbs he therefore should be ranked automatically higher:huh Personally I don't think beating a shot EM 2X's, actually losing to him once, beating an unproven Solis, beating a guy who moved up to weightclasses in Larios, and Valazquez is that great of a resume. EM who stands out the most has now lost his last 4 fights(5 out of last 6). Larios has been on the down slide and was Ko'd in his fight leading up to there fight. A majority of his opponents at 130lbs are coming off of losses, while none of them play any significant role at the weight. JMM fought and beat the most significant guy at that weight, and look who's fighting him next! What's so great about his resume now? I'm lost here!!

If you look hard his resume there ain't shit:nono 126lbs don't have shit to do w/130lbs. MAB's resume is way better than Pac's at that weight and JMM just beat him.

For those who call MAB shot you need to erase, and not count a victory by PAC IF he wins in there upcoming fight, and then take away the EM wins, and now what do you have for PAC at 130lbs:huh JMM may only have one fight at the weight, but he beat the man there! He should rightfully take that spot, and it should be given to someone else off of speculation, or because of what happened at 126lbs between MAB and Pac!!

First of all, beating MAB at 126 counts because MAB moved up to 130 within a year after Pac beat him.

If MAB at 126 do not count at 130, why the hell was MAB fighting for the title in his first fight at 130 lbs?

2nd, Pac losing to EM in the first fight DID not decrease his stock. He hang in there, gave the boxing world a great fight and lose by a close decision despite suffering a nasty cut in round 5 and having to wear the pillow gloves. If you just look at the record book, then you can :huh your head all day. But if you know the substance behind the record, you would not doubt why Pac is rated hghly at 130, even though losing to EM in his first fight at 130 lbs.

3rdly, EM is not shot when Pac fought him. He may be on the slide, but no way he was shot.

4th, Solis, Larios, Velasquez, are decent level opposition, and are definitely better than no opposition at all (in JMM's case).

[theunderdog]

You guys are going off of what happened a few yrs ago, and an shot EM!! Who can't beat EM at this stage, or should I ask who could EM beat at this stage? EM was no longer a force or even a live body so beating guys like Juarez, and Fana are certainly better than beating EM! And yes MAB beat a better version of EM than Pac, and EM wasn't losing to anyone who would pick up a pair of gloves then either.

Both Pac and Mab are 2-1 against EM, Pac and Jmm both beat MAB and they drew with eachother. Jmm beat the Champ at 130lbs, Pac has been fighting guys coming off of losing streaks, and guys who are unproven. Yeah it's one fight, but it was a champion during his reign at the weightclass we are speaking about!

Stop acting as if beating MAB at 126lbs yrs ago holds as much weight 2day as it did then!! And stop pretending that EM was some monster, or even a big rat over the past couple yrs!!

Stop overrating those wins!

i'll ask you again, if both pac and jmm win their next matches, pac will surely be over jmm in your book right??? i am overrating wins? dude, you are gravely overrating mab's win over fana and jmm's wiv over mab. you were saying that 1 win is better than pac's 5 wins so who's overrating?

if you say yes, to the question above, then i'll consider this discussion done as pac will claim the number one spot in your book by october. well, you should say yes. if pac beats mab, jmm could go beat three super feathers outside soto, guzman and valero and beat and morales twice and it would not even matter right? because a win over mab is better than all thise right? i'm using all you logic so pardon me if it's flawed, i want to prove you wrong by your own statements.


and you are claiming that is fana better than EM, you want me to make a whole thread to prove that you are wrong? fana ain't worth shit. this won all these gift decisions in his hometown. he was ktfo by mab and he didn't even deserve to be the number one contender because he stole it from another the filipino who eventually lost to juan diaz. you grossly undersetimate el terrible boy. you saying that fana will beat morales if they met now? please.

[psychopath]

Who's talking P4P dumbfuck!!

Oh fuck you . . . you're not talking P4P? Then you must really be a moron or stupid. Manny is rated higher than JMM being a P4P . . . IF you're talking about the ABC governing bodies Pac doesn't have any . . . so what is your problem shithead?

Now if you're talking of why Pac is getting higher respect from fans it is because the guy is a lot more an exciting fighter than your fucki'n JMM.

Now what . . . dumbfuck?

I can make bitchslapping you my new hobby here in ESB.:yep

[hellblazer]

Eventhough Pac only holds the WBC 130 Int'l belt, he's also the mandatory challenger @ WBA & WBO 130 crowns. Even Fightnews ranked him # 1 Super Featherweight fighter in the world.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[psychopath]

Eventhough Pac only holds the WBC 130 Int'l belt, he's also the mandatory challenger @ WBA & WBO 130 crowns. Even Fightnews ranked him # 1 Super Featherweight fighter in the world.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]


Yeah . . . good post.

Where's JMM's name in the other 3 governing bodies' list?

None . . . because his first and only fight at 130 is MAB. :D

And this fucki'n idiot thinks he knows better than all these governing bodies . . . and he thinks JMM should get a higher rating only after one fight.

Stupid!!!:yep

[psychopath]

Hey big dumbass . . . where the fuck are you? :roll:

I'll give you what you're looking for. :yep :bbb

[theunderdog]

Eventhough Pac only holds the WBC 130 Int'l belt, he's also the mandatory challenger @ WBA & WBO 130 crowns. Even Fightnews ranked him # 1 Super Featherweight fighter in the world.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]



for pete's sake. we all know governing bodies ain't worth shit. some of you argued in this very thread that the belt should not put jmm in front of pac now you use their rankings? come one. this is an incredibly lame. if you base your rankings from the abs boys then explain to my why the hell is old man medina in front of pac? seriously bro, you don't need these flimsy ass arguements

[KO Boxing]

Governing bodies? :lol:

FIGHTNEWS? :lol:

To me, JMM is no. 1 at 130lbs.

But Pac is still no. 2 p4p.

So there. :tong

[psychopath]

for pete's sake. we all know governing bodies ain't worth shit. some of you argued in this very thread that the belt should not put jmm in front of pac now you use their rankings? come one. this is an incredibly lame. if you base your rankings from the abs boys then explain to my why the hell is old man medina in front of pac? seriously bro, you don't need these flimsy ass arguements

Well the thread starter said he's not talking of P4P . . . therefore he is talking of the ABC rankings.

So the guy posted this to show why Pac is rated higher even by the ABC governing bodies.

[psychopath]

Governing bodies? :lol:

FIGHTNEWS? :lol:

To me, JMM is no. 1 at 130lbs.

But Pac is still no. 2 p4p.

So there. :tong

:lol: :D Yeah governing bodies . . . without the WBC belt who is the fuck is JMM at 130? :deal

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

:blah :blah :blah

[KO Boxing]

:lol: :D Yeah governing bodies . . . without the WBC belt who is the fuck is JMM at 130? :deal

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

:blah :blah :blah
:lol: nice one!

Look Pac creamed Barrera at 126... AFTER THAT, Barrera beat Morales and became THE champ at 130...

So why does Pac become champ at 130 for beating Morales, AFTER he lost to Barrera, for an international title? What, cause he had beaten Barrera before? At a division lower? When does boxing EVER work like that?

Know Eddie Murphy? ... What have you done for me lately?

Barrera was champ, Pac (who beat him at 126) was "p4p champ" (p4p no. 2)... So by beating Barrera, JMM becomes champ at 130.... And Pac remains p4p champ.

So as I said. JMM is no. 1 at 130, and Pac is p4p no. 2.

[psychopath]

:lol: nice one!

Look Pac creamed Barrera at 126... AFTER THAT, Barrera beat Morales and became THE champ at 130...

So why does Pac become champ at 130 for beating Morales, AFTER he lost to Barrera, for an international title? What, cause he had beaten Barrera before? At a division lower? When does boxing EVER work like that?

Know Eddie Murphy? ... What have you done for me lately?

Barrera was champ, Pac (who beat him at 126) was "p4p champ" (p4p no. 2)... So by beating Barrera, JMM becomes champ at 130.... And Pac remains p4p champ.

So as I said. JMM is no. 1 at 130, and Pac is p4p no. 2.

No problem with that. :yep That's how it really is.

[Morrissey]

1.pac has no belt so it means he shouldn't be no.1?:-( get outta here. those belts are worth nothing. boxing has no objective ranking regarding these belts. anyone can get them.

2. there's no way JMM could have won that.:verysad the "JMM schooled pac after round 1" is the greatest myth in modern boxing. get outta here.

3. he's done nothing in his weightclass to warrant his ranking?:-( for christ sake, he annahilated the 2 greatest mexican jr. lightweights of all time! he Knocked out (twice!) the guy who everybody thought can never be KOed! he pummeled barrera, humiliated him. and lastly, he always gives us one hell of a fight.

get outta here!:deal

[hellblazer]

if you base your rankings from the abs boys then explain to my why the hell is old man medina in front of pac? seriously bro, you don't need these flimsy ass arguements
because IBF is full of sh!t they removed Pac from being the mandatory challenger for the IBF 130 belt because of Murad Muhammad (former promoter of Pac) boxing politics is the reason. Marian Muhammad the president of IBF and she is a relative of Murad (daughter or wife of Murad,i'm not sure)

Manuel Medina on the other hand is perhaps active in fighting ranked fighters at IBF that's why he's ahead of Pac in IBF's rankings or simply because of politics.

And the obvious reason why Manny Pacquiao is ahead of Juan Manuel Marquez is because Pac has a lot of fights @ 130 than JMM. Pac beaten Morales twice, won against the tough hombre Hector Velasquez, the undefeated Jorge Solis and Oscar Larios.

While JMM only win is against the former WBC 130 champ Barrera, who is obviously shot and robbed in their fight. Even when Barrera was still the WBC 130 champ, Pac has always been the # 1 Jr. Lightweight fighter in the world in almost every rankings you see on the net and boxing magazines.

[theunderdog]

this thread's getting way out of hand

[hellblazer]

:lol: :D Yeah governing bodies . . . without the WBC belt who is the fuck is JMM at 130? :deal

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

:blah :blah :blah

Ditto :D

[KO Boxing]

No problem with that. :yep That's how it really is.
:good

[theunderdog]

because IBF is full of sh!t they removed Pac from being the mandatory challenger for the IBF 130 belt because of Murad Muhammad (former promoter of Pac) boxing politics is the reason. Marian Muhammad the president of IBF and she is a relative of Murad (daughter or wife of Murad,i'm not sure)

Manuel Medina on the other hand is perhaps active in fighting ranked fighters at IBF that's why he's ahead of Pac in IBF's rankings or simply because of politics.

And the obvious reason why Manny Pacquiao is ahead of Juan Manuel Marquez is because Pac has a lot of fights @ 130 than JMM. Pac beaten Morales twice, won against the tough hombre Hector Velasquez, the undefeated Jorge Solis and Oscar Larios.

While JMM only win is against the former WBC 130 champ Barrera, who is obviously shot and robbed in their fight. Even when Barrera was still the WBC 130 champ, Pac has always been the # 1 Jr. Lightweight fighter in the world in almost every rankings you see on the net and boxing magazines.

i know that pac is rightfully number 1 at 130. all i was saying is that if you don't believe in the abc belts, don't believe in their rankings either. all this shit about jmm being nothing without the wbc belt is bullshit and all yall know it. you quoted the ABC boxing rankings to bring pac up but the you said the ABC belts ain't worth shit to bring jmm down. that's double standards

[hellblazer]

i know that pac is rightfully number 1 at 130. all i was saying is that if you don't believe in the abc belts, don't believe in their rankings either. all this shit about jmm being nothing without the wbc belt is bullshit and all yall know it. you quoted the ABC boxing rankings to bring pac up but the you said the ABC belts ain't worth shit to bring jmm down. that's double standards

Without these boxing alphabets we won't know who will be the mandatory challenger or who are the top fighters inside, let's say top 15. This boxing alphabets serves as gauge on how boxers climbing the lists to earn a title shot. I'm not the one who said these boxing alphabets don't mean shit, even if if i did....Pac will still be ahead of JMM @ 130 based on their performance and number of fights at Jr.Lightweight division.

[Morrissey]

Quality of opposition:rofl What opposition???

Yes Pac beat EM, but MAB beat him at 130lbs also, and he beat him while he was he was champ!! Beating MAB at 126lbs doesn't mean shit at 130lbs:nono

I still don't see what's so quality about Pac's 130lbs opposition!! He's had more fights, but that's about it, and certainly not enough! EM was long gone when he beat him, and Larios was coming from 2 weightclasses up, Valasquez???, Solis???? I rate that as fair opposition, not good:nono

How will you rank JMM if MAB beats PAC?

Pac catapulted to No. 2 ranking in P4P after he beat EM twice. That's all you need.

And you don't simply supplant the No. 2 ranked P4P in the world in the division where he is by beating one of the champs who was already beaten by that guy before?

How can you be the no. 1 in your division when the concensus no. 2 ranked P4P boxer in the world is also there?

[theunderdog]

Without these boxing alphabets we won't know who will be the mandatory challenger or who are the top fighters inside, let's say top 15. This boxing alphabets serves as gauge on how boxers climbing the lists to earn a title shot. I'm not the one who said these boxing alphabets don't mean shit, even if if i did....Pac will still be ahead of JMM @ 130 based on their performance and number of fights at Jr.Lightweight division.


who cares about mandatories? they never occur anyway. how about humberto soto? mandatory to jmm after beating bobby pac right? where the hell is he now? he on the side contemplating if guzman will be his next opponent or not.

the abc boys are what's wrong in the boxing world

[hellblazer]

who cares about mandatories? they never occur anyway. how about humberto soto? mandatory to jmm after beating bobby pac right? where the hell is he now? he on the side contemplating if guzman will be his next opponent or not.

the abc boys are what's wrong in the boxing world

Who cares about mandatories?
All of the mandatory challengers who are working so hard to get this far, trying to win a championship belt and the boxing fans who are rooting for their fighters to win another title or their first ever world title.

Humberto Soto on the other hand is just a victim of business in boxing...he can't get a title shot eventhough he's a mandatory challenger before. Perhaps these boxing promoters don't find Soto a PPV material or a sell out (eventhough he's great fighter) or these camps or team Marquez or Guzman are ducking Soto because they find him a threat to their fighter. High risk, Low reward b.s :yep

[KO Boxing]

Boxing alphabets are a joke

[theunderdog]

Who cares about mandatories?
All of the mandatory challengers who are working so hard to get this far, trying to win a championship belt and the boxing fans who are rooting for their fighters to win another title or their first ever world title.

Humberto Soto on the other hand is just a victim of business in boxing...he can't get a title shot eventhough he's a mandatory challenger before. Perhaps these boxing promoters don't find Soto a PPV material or a sell out (eventhough he's great fighter) or these camps or team Marquez or Guzman are ducking Soto because they find him a threat to their fighter. High risk, Low reward b.s :yep

exactly, so why the hell should we care about mandatories when we all know that even if you earn your time in the spotlight, it still is not sure if it will be given to you. that's why nobody cares about mandatories. fighters should just win their way up the ranks and soon enough, the true boxing fans will start making noise for them and this will earn them a shot a the title faster than waiting for a mandatory fight

[PacDbest]

You guys are just wasting time debating Biggame, you can't convinced him. He's born stupid.

[hellblazer]

exactly, so why the hell should we care about mandatories when we all know that even if you earn your time in the spotlight, it still is not sure if it will be given to you. that's why nobody cares about mandatories. fighters should just win their way up the ranks and soon enough, the true boxing fans will start making noise for them and this will earn them a shot a the title faster than waiting for a mandatory fight
But still, some mandatories get their shot right away after they made some noise after their impressive victories, especially in the lower weight divisions.
Boxing is business, it's not about pride and honor anymore :D
That's why boxing is dying sport lol :lol:

Nice chatting with ya theunderdog :good

[pejevan]

has now beat the #1 guy at 130lbs in MAB!!

Obviously your premise is a bit eschewed. JMM did not beat the number 1 at 130, because Pac is the number 1 at 130 even before the JMM-MAB fight. Now if you are referring to the Alphabet title, then MAB is the number 1 at WBC, but not universally ranked as number 1.

[theunderdog]

So, how do you rank them then, underdog? Have you formulated your Underdog Ranking System? :lol::lol::lol: I guess in your system, JMM will always be #1 no matter what. :lol::lol::lol:

your ignorace never ceases to amaze. you didn't read the thread and you go quoting me like that. you're one of the most stupid people here domngo

i know that pac is rightfully number 1 at 130. all i was saying is that if you don't believe in the abc belts, don't believe in their rankings either. all this shit about jmm being nothing without the wbc belt is bullshit and all yall know it. you quoted the ABC boxing rankings to bring pac up but the you said the ABC belts ain't worth shit to bring jmm down. that's double standards


so jmm beat mab once at 130. fine. if you consider this a big win then you should also consider pac's 2 wins over em as big wins so pac should be number one. he's been around much longer asn has a better record at 130.

pac is 5-1 with 4 ko's at 130
jmm is 1-0 with 0 ko's at 130

the belt makes jmm number 1?


please.


you domngo are rightfully owned. next time read the thread boy

[reed_man02]

Yeah . . . good post.

Where's JMM's name in the other 3 governing bodies' list?

None . . . because his first and only fight at 130 is MAB. :D

And this fucki'n idiot thinks he knows better than all these governing bodies . . . and he thinks JMM should get a higher rating only after one fight.

Stupid!!!:yep

:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Youre so FUCKING STUPID!!! HAHAHAHAHAH

Wheres valeros and fanas name on the other lists? Notice a trend between the three fighters?:patsch

[Chert]

how can jmm be rated higher than pac at 130 when he has only one fight at this weight (close decision vs. barrera)? pac on the other hand has already 6 fights at 130 against morales (3x), larios, velasquez and solis with a 5-1, 4KO record.

[1punch1nder]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

that's a tough one... maybe because he lost to a gatekeeper in indonesia?:deal

[mad_takamura]

jmm beat jimrex jaca and mab; on the latter my opinion was that mab did a lot to win that fight and for me jmm had a gift decision..on the jaca fight jmm did'nt show up what he was expected to deliver...
pac beat larios and em twice..larios was a former bantam champ and compare with him with jimrex, larios's resume is a lot better...pac beats em twice and ktfo em when em did not even tasted a ko ever in his entire career!
assessing everything above we come to a conclusion that pac will and must be rated higher than jmm.. and i stated the facts don't just judge me as a pac nuthugger...

[Biggame]

Like I stated and I still stand behind what I say. Beating MAB at 126lbs means nothing at 130lbs. Pac fans will comtinue to try and live off of that win, but this is a new Weight Class were MAB has reigned! MAB moved there and Beat the Champ in EM, and has defended his title successfully til he fought JMM.

Pac moved up to 130lbs and fought EM losing his 1st fight there. He later revenges that loss to EM who's only win in his last 6 fights is against Pac, and EM was coming off of a loss. Pac hasn't attempted to fight any title holders yet he gets a #1 rating:huh EM(sry fellas) isn't shit anymore, Valasquez isn't, Solis is nothing so far, and Larios shouldn't have been there. Remember he(Pac) also fought EM after MAB had already beaten him twice!

Now I understand those trying to make a case because Pac has more fights than JMM at the weight, but none of them have been significant:nono MAB has been there since 04, he's been the reigning Champ since then. He also beat Peden for his IBF belt so MAB has held 2 of the 3 belts at one point, but some of you guys feel PAC should be legitimently ranked higher than even MAB for beating who? Oh that's right...Pac beat MAB in 03 so he'll forever be ranked higher no matter what weightclass right?

I see Pac being rated higher on the P4P list, but not at 130lbs.

I know some of you Pac fans can't handle it, and hey it's all up for debate, Pac's rated higher at 130lbs, and I don't agree, some of you do. Those who don't agree w/me have that right, but how about being a little more mature about it, and rational! Some of you can't even be taken serious as you guys honestly think Pac beats Mayweather at 130lbs, or at a catch weight, even think he would beat Hatton at 140lbs or a catch weight.

To each his own, but IMO Pac hasn't done anything to warrant a #1 ranking at 130lbs!!

[Biggame]

You guys are just wasting time debating Biggame, you can't convinced him. He's born stupid.

And you were born swimming in Pac's sperm cumbreath!! You came out and immediately latched onto his Nuts, and been there since!! How does it feel when Pac wears his protector cup??

[PacDbest]

And you were born swimming in Pac's sperm cumbreath!! You came out and immediately latched onto his Nuts, and been there since!! How does it feel when Pac wears his protector cup??

It feels GOOD!!! CoZ We have the bragging rights!!!!

[Biggame]

It feels GOOD!!! CoZ We have the bragging rights!!!!

I bet you enjoy the taste too!!

[Morrissey]

Like I stated and I still stand behind what I say. Beating MAB at 126lbs means nothing at 130lbs. Pac fans will comtinue to try and live off of that win, but this is a new Weight Class were MAB has reigned! MAB moved there and Beat the Champ in EM, and has defended his title successfully til he fought JMM.

Pac moved up to 130lbs and fought EM losing his 1st fight there. He later revenges that loss to EM who's only win in his last 6 fights is against Pac, and EM was coming off of a loss. Pac hasn't attempted to fight any title holders yet he gets a #1 rating:huh EM(sry fellas) isn't shit anymore, Valasquez isn't, Solis is nothing so far, and Larios shouldn't have been there. Remember he(Pac) also fought EM after MAB had already beaten him twice!

Now I understand those trying to make a case because Pac has more fights than JMM at the weight, but none of them have been significant:nono MAB has been there since 04, he's been the reigning Champ since then. He also beat Peden for his IBF belt so MAB has held 2 of the 3 belts at one point, but some of you guys feel PAC should be legitimently ranked higher than even MAB for beating who? Oh that's right...Pac beat MAB in 03 so he'll forever be ranked higher no matter what weightclass right?

I see Pac being rated higher on the P4P list, but not at 130lbs.

I know some of you Pac fans can't handle it, and hey it's all up for debate, Pac's rated higher at 130lbs, and I don't agree, some of you do. Those who don't agree w/me have that right, but how about being a little more mature about it, and rational! Some of you can't even be taken serious as you guys honestly think Pac beats Mayweather at 130lbs, or at a catch weight, even think he would beat Hatton at 140lbs or a catch weight.

To each his own, but IMO Pac hasn't done anything to warrant a #1 ranking at 130lbs!!
Do you honestly feel JMM is the man to beat at 130 right now? I mean is he the favorite against anyone in that division?

Because he beat MAB at 130?

Would have you considered Pac to be the man at 130 if he had fought MAB FIRST at 130 before JMM fought MAB?

[Biggame]

Do you honestly feel JMM is the man to beat at 130 right now? I mean is he the favorite against anyone in that division?

Because he beat MAB at 130?

Would have you considered Pac to be the man at 130 if he had fought MAB FIRST at 130 before JMM fought MAB?

Why wouldn't I? And right now I don't favor anyone over JMM at 130lbs not even Pac!!

[Morrissey]

Why wouldn't I? And right now I don't favor anyone over JMM at 130lbs not even Pac!!

So, for you, it's only a matter of who beat MAB first at 130, right?

But then, everyone in the boxing world already knows the outcome if MAB fights Pac at 130, and that is even before JMM fought MAB last March.

I think it is not a matter of holding the belts, it is a matter of perception, and the concensus among the boxing media, where ranking is made, and fans, is that Pac is no. 1 in 130 becasue he had already beaten the champ before. And in a dominating fashion. And he had beaten also the former champ there (EM). And he had been there longer than JMM.

And please don't say Pac beat an aging Morales, becasue no one in the earth below 130 could have done what Pac had done to him: win via TKO. He did it empathically!

And remember, JMM beat also an aging MAB for the title. And how did he do it? In a dominating fashion like Pac did to EM? Nope! He was even KDed there (though officially, it was not). And because of that, you think he is already the man at 130? Even if it was his 1st fight there?

You know what, you are basing your No. 1 ranking of JMM on his previous records at 126, yet you don't admit it to show you are not biased. But is shows, pal. Obviously.

How would you favor him over all other fighters there at 130? Becasue of his past fights. yet, you tell us, we should forget the 126 all together and just move on to 130 because JMM won one of the belts from a man who was already humiliated by Pac? Well, if it makes sense to you, I am afraid you are the only there in that kind of reasoning.

[Biggame]

So, for you, it's only a matter of who beat MAB first at 130, right?

But then, everyone in the boxing world already knows the outcome if MAB fights Pac at 130, and that is even before JMM fought MAB last March.

I think it is not a matter of holding the belts, it is a matter of perception, and the concensus among the boxing media, where ranking is made, and fans, is that Pac is no. 1 in 130 becasue he had already beaten the champ before. And in a dominating fashion. And he had beaten also the former champ there (EM). And he had been there longer than JMM.

And please don't say Pac beat an aging Morales, becasue no one in the earth below 130 could have done what Pac had done to him: win via TKO. He did it empathically!

And remember, JMM beat also an aging MAB for the title. And how did he do it? In a dominating fashion like Pac did to EM? Nope! He was even KDed there (though officially, it was not). And because of that, you think he is already the man at 130? Even if it was his 1st fight there?

You know what, you are basing your No. 1 ranking of JMM on his previous records at 126, yet you don't admit it to show you are not biased. But is shows, pal. Obviously.

How would you favor him over all other fighters there at 130? Becasue of his past fights. yet, you tell us, we should forget the 126 all together and just move on to 130 because JMM won one of the belts from a man who was already humiliated by Pac? Well, if it makes sense to you, I am afraid you are the only there in that kind of reasoning.

You are basing yours on the fact that Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago, and no I'm not basing mines on that. You guys still off of 4yrs ago. MAB's only lost since then is to JMM at 130lbs. He beat the guy you guys are boasting Pac 130lbs resume at 130lbs for the title might I add. So in your Eyes because Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago he should automatically be regarded higher than him no matte what weight correct? MAB should no longer be regarded as a fighter if Pac comes along correct? His accomplishments mean nothing at 130lbs if Pac comes along right although he already beat the guy Pac best win at the weight is against.

If JMM beat an aging MAB, and Pac's fighting that same guy next how much credit will you give him IF he wins, and how much credit will you give JMM if MAB wins?

You guys just assume PAC is going to win because he's beaten MAB at 126lbs 4yrs ago, and a shot EM twice, but he also lost to a shot EM! Assumption is a bad thing!!

BTW...MAB and EM are worlds apart as fighters right now. MAB still has it, while EM has lost it yrs ago!!

[Morrissey]

You are basing yours on the fact that Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago, and no I'm not basing mines on that. You guys still off of 4yrs ago. MAB's only lost since then is to JMM at 130lbs. He beat the guy you guys are boasting Pac 130lbs resume at 130lbs for the title might I add. So in your Eyes because Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago he should automatically be regarded higher than him no matte what weight correct? MAB should no longer be regarded as a fighter if Pac comes along correct? His accomplishments mean nothing at 130lbs if Pac comes along right although he already beat the guy Pac best win at the weight is against.

If JMM beat an aging MAB, and Pac's fighting that same guy next how much credit will you give him IF he wins, and how much credit will you give JMM if MAB wins?

You guys just assume PAC is going to win because he's beaten MAB at 126lbs 4yrs ago, and a shot EM twice, but he also lost to a shot EM! Assumption is a bad thing!!

BTW...MAB and EM are worlds apart as fighters right now. MAB still has it, while EM has lost it yrs ago!!

Funny, but I remember you as one of the posters here who picked EM over Pac in their rematch, yet now, you would discredit Pac's win as a victory against a SHOT Morales? :blood

A question: who do you think would win if MAB fought Pac last January instead of him facing JMM (who came in as a replacement, btw, and I think you also know)?

[Morrissey]

You are basing yours on the fact that Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago, and no I'm not basing mines on that. You guys still off of 4yrs ago. MAB's only lost since then is to JMM at 130lbs. He beat the guy you guys are boasting Pac 130lbs resume at 130lbs for the title might I add. So in your Eyes because Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago he should automatically be regarded higher than him no matte what weight correct? MAB should no longer be regarded as a fighter if Pac comes along correct? His accomplishments mean nothing at 130lbs if Pac comes along right although he already beat the guy Pac best win at the weight is against.

If JMM beat an aging MAB, and Pac's fighting that same guy next how much credit will you give him IF he wins, and how much credit will you give JMM if MAB wins?

You guys just assume PAC is going to win because he's beaten MAB at 126lbs 4yrs ago, and a shot EM twice, but he also lost to a shot EM! Assumption is a bad thing!!

BTW...MAB and EM are worlds apart as fighters right now. MAB still has it, while EM has lost it yrs ago!!

If Pac wins over MAB, that is expected. He would still ranked #2 on my p4p list. No changes. Unless, you still regard MAB that high at this point, which I believe you do, since you just say JMM should be the man at 130 becasue of his accomplishment of dethroning MAB this year. So, how would you rank Pac if he wins over MAB?

You're basing your whole argument of having JMM at No. 1 in 130 on the fact that he beat MAB. Nothing else. I think that is correct, right?

[Biggame]

Funny, but I remember you as one of the posters here who picked EM over Pac in their rematch, yet now, you would discredit Pac's win as a victory against a SHOT Morales? :blood

A question: who do you think would win if MAB fought Pac last January instead of him facing JMM (who came in as a replacement, btw, and I think you also know)?

I did pick EM, but I also stated that EM could be shot!!

I don't know who would win, but I wouldn't assume PAC like you guys do:nono I also don't know who will win this fall, but again I'm not going to assume like you!!

Ans my question now...how much credit will you give PAC for beating the same aging MAB this fall since you seem to give none to JMM, and how much more credit will you give JMM if MAB wins?

[4Rounder]

I must agree with you Biggame, Pacquiao's rank must be questioned.

Morales had already been dethroned by Barrera and beats Pacquiao in his first match at 130lbs. Then Pac beats a nobody in Velasquez. Gets the TKO over a Morales coming down from a loss. Gets his win over a guy moving up 2 divisions in Larios, then beats a shot Morales again. And his last fight was against the featherweight moving up unknown Solis.

Clearly he hasn't beaten top 10 ranked fighters (except for the declining Morales, who might have not been top 10 in the rematch) to deserve the #1 spot.

What gives?????

[Biggame]

I must agree with you Biggame, Pacquiao's rank must be questioned.

Morales had already been dethroned by Barrera and beats Pacquiao in his first match at 130lbs. Then Pac beats a nobody in Velasquez. Gets the TKO over a Morales coming down from a loss. Gets his win over a guy moving up 2 divisions in Larios, then beats a shot Morales again. And his last fight was against the featherweight moving up Solis.

Clearly he hasn't beaten top 10 ranked fighters (except for the declining Morales) to deserve the #1 spot.

What gives?????

I don't get it at all!!

What's so impressive about his fights at 130lbs:huh oh yeah, it's his win over MAB 4yrs ago at 126lbs that's so impressive at 130lbs! Ppl bring up the EM wins, but really now...who has EM beaten since "05" except PAC which doesn't bold to well for PAC as it is. Basically all of his wins at 130lbs are questionable win it coms to rankings, because besides a nobody in Valasquez everyone he's fought and beaten has either came off of a loss(bad loss no less), or was moving up in weight!

I still can't get an ans outta these guys about how much credit they will give Pac if he beats the so called aging MAB this fall and how much more credit will they give JMM if MAB wins!!

[Morrissey]

I did pick EM, but I also stated that EM could be shot!!

I don't know who would win, but I wouldn't assume PAC like you guys do:nono I also don't know who will win this fall, but again I'm not going to assume like you!!

Ans my question now...how much credit will you give PAC for beating the same aging MAB this fall since you seem to give none to JMM, and how much more credit will you give JMM if MAB wins?

You are playing safe there in all acount.

First, you pick a "could-be-shot" EM to beat Pac. In short, you already have a ready-made excuse for EM if ever he loses on that one. In addition, it only goes to show how much you underrate Pac. Since even after Pac convincingly punished and beat MAB in 2003 (a long time ago indeed), and after his string of impressive victories since that loss to Morales, and considering MAB's 2 fights with Rocky Juarez, YET you are still massively undecided on whom to pick a winner between them, at this point?:yikes That is clear bogus.

Bonus information to help you decide in picking the winner: Pac was ranked #2 P4P at that time (and still now) against someone who used to be there and whose ring age was somehow showing. Who will you choose?

It would not have been a pick-em fight, btw.

I assume/predict/feel/think Pac will win because everything favors him. Unless you are someone who won't give him his proper credit as the #2 p2p boxer. Or who thinks highly of MAB up to now.

As for your question, I have already answered that.

[Biggame]

You are playing safe there in all acount.

First, you pick a "could-be-shot" EM to beat Pac. In short, you already have a ready-made excuse for EM if ever he loses on that one. In addition, it only goes to show how much you underrate Pac. Since even after Pac convincingly punished and beat MAB in 2003 (a long time ago indeed), and after his string of impressive victories since that loss to Morales, and considering MAB's 2 fights with Rocky Juarez, YET you are still massively undecided on whom to pick a winner between them, at this point?:yikes That is clear bogus.

Bonus information to help you decide in picking the winner: Pac was ranked #2 P4P at that time (and still now) against someone who used to be there and whose ring age was somehow showing. Who will you choose?

It would not have been a pick-em fight, btw.

I assume/predict/feel/think Pac will win because everything favors him. Unless you are someone who won't give him his proper credit as the #2 p2p boxer. Or who thinks highly of MAB up to now.

As for your question, I have already answered that.

1- You didn't ans the question, and the question is simple...how much credit will you give Pac for a victory, and how much more will you give JMM if MAB wins? Ans the question!!

2- I don't have to pick a winner of the fight, and it's obvious that I think MAB has more than a shot at winning. 4yrs ago doesn't dictate today for me like it does you!!

3- this isn't about who I pick because I'm not assuming anything,.. you are!! So... while you're assuming PAC wins, yet discrediting JMM win to it being because of an aging MAB so part 1-How much credit can you give PAC who's supposedly the better fight of the 3 if he wins, and how much credit will you give JMM if MAB wins. Should I ask it again???

If you want a prediction I predict/feel/think JMM will beat PAC next time the meet!!

[Morrissey]

I don't get it at all!!

What's so impressive about his fights at 130lbs:huh oh yeah, it's his win over MAB 4yrs ago at 126lbs that's so impressive at 130lbs! Ppl bring up the EM wins, but really now...who has EM beaten since "05" except PAC which doesn't bold to well for PAC as it is. Basically all of his wins at 130lbs are questionable win it coms to rankings, because besides a nobody in Valasquez everyone he's fought and beaten has either came off of a loss(bad loss no less), or was moving up in weight!

I still can't get an ans outta these guys about how much credit they will give Pac if he beats the so called aging MAB this fall and how much more credit will they give JMM if MAB wins!!

Already answered that in my other previous post.

And if MAB wins, then JMM should be given a just credit.

[Biggame]

Already answered that in my other previous post.

And if MAB wins, then JMM should be given a just credit.

How much will you give PAC...the same as JMM, or more??

[Morrissey]

1- You didn't ans the question, and the question is simple...how much credit will you give Pac for a victory, and how much more will you give JMM if MAB wins? Ans the question!!

This was my answer I posted in my previous posts, if you failed to read it:

If Pac wins over MAB, that is expected. He would still ranked #2 on my p4p list. No changes. Unless, you still regard MAB that high at this point, which I believe you do, since you just say JMM should be the man at 130 becasue of his accomplishment of dethroning MAB this year. So, how would you rank Pac if he wins over MAB?

Credit for Pac? He stays at No.2 in the P2P. That's it. and if MAB wins, well, it would mean MAB is the best fighter among his contemporaries (Morales and JMM). Credit for JMM? He beat a great fighter! Would it mean he would leapfrogged past Pacquaio becasue of MAB victory? Notsure about that idea, eh.


2- I don't have to pick a winner of the fight, and it's obvious that I think MAB has more than a shot at winning. 4yrs ago doesn't dictate today for me like it does you!!

WHy don't you? I mean you are so sure of JMM beating Pac, yet for this fight, you can't predict? Well, it is obvious you really underrate Pac, which I have already noticed even before. After all these years, you still believe MAB can have a better chance of beating Pac. I don't have any problem with you thinking that MAB can still win, but it only reflects your bias against Pac. Or you just hate to pick Pac to win over MAB?

Factoring their last fight to predict the outcome of their rematch is not bad, is it? But it seems for you, it is a sign of studipidity to even consider that. How in the hell can you predict a JMM win over Pac? You based it on their last fight, is that correct? And now, for this rematch, you would not allow that 2003 fight to help you decide who will win? You will just totally ignore that? Let me know why and I will be more glad to hear it.

3- this isn't about who I pick because I'm not assuming anything,.. you are!! So... while you're assuming PAC wins, yet discrediting JMM win to it being because of an aging MAB so part 1-How much credit can you give PAC who's supposedly the better fight of the 3 if he wins, and how much credit will you give JMM if MAB wins. Should I ask it again???

You don't need top ask it again: I will just post (again) my reply:

If Pac wins over MAB, that is expected. He would still ranked #2 on my p4p list. No changes. Unless, you still regard MAB that high at this point, which I believe you do, since you just say JMM should be the man at 130 becasue of his accomplishment of dethroning MAB this year. So, how would you rank Pac if he wins over MAB?

Credit for Pac? He stays at No.2 in the P2P. That's it. and if MAB wins, well, it would mean MAB is the best fighter among his contemporaries (Morales and JMM). Credit for JMM? He beat a great fighter! Would it mean he would leapfrog past Pacquaio becasue of MAB victory? Notsure about that idea, eh.


If you want a prediction I predict/feel/think JMM will beat PAC next time the meet!!
And where did you base your prediction, if I may ask?:deal

[Biggame]

And where did you base your prediction, if I may ask?:deal

1st I don't see you picking PAC over MAB as stupidity at all!! And if I missed you response my apologies...I'm at work!!

Now I pick JMM because he's the better overall fighter IMO, and he's proved himself solid and durable in the 1st fight. He has the speed, skillset, desire, and will to undo PAC so I pick him. He also proved he could hurt PAC!! I'm not in a rush to pick PAC over MAB because although older MAB has begin to box more, and counter better. His jab is beautiful so if he can implement this during the fight he wins IMO. At the same time PAC can overwhelm MAB, but that's not something he can do against JMM!

Now elaberate for me...you say if MAB beats Pac you rank him higher than his contemporaries(JMM and EM) Why is that? And in PAC losing you don't think JMM would leapfrog him(PAC) There both P4P, and in the top 5 for most so it's almost a guarantee JMM leapfrogs him!! He hold nothing over JMM that could stop that!!

[reed_man02]

1st I don't see you picking PAC over MAB as stupidity at all!! And if I missed you response my apologies...I'm at work!!

Now I pick JMM because he's the better overall fighter IMO, and he's proved himself solid and durable in the 1st fight. He has the speed, skillset, desire, and will to undo PAC so I pick him. He also proved he could hurt PAC!! I'm not in a rush to pick PAC over MAB because although older MAB has begin to box more, and counter better. His jab is beautiful so if he can implement this during the fight he wins IMO. At the same time PAC can overwhelm MAB, but that's not something he can do against JMM!

Now elaberate for me...you say if MAB beats Pac you rank him higher than his contemporaries(JMM and EM) Why is that? And in PAC losing you don't think JMM would leapfrog him(PAC) There both P4P, and in the top 5 for most so it's almost a guarantee JMM leapfrogs him!! He hold nothing over JMM that could stop that!!





I am wondering myself!:yep

Did MAB ever beat JMM and I am not aware of it, because I remember seeing JMM clearly beating MAB not to long ago!:deal

[Biggame]

I am wondering myself!:yep

Did MAB ever beat JMM and I am not aware of it, because I remember seeing JMM clearly beating MAB not to long ago!:deal

I'm still trying to sort some of the things that they come up with!!

:think

[Biggame]

Wow! That really shows your bias against Pac. Pac's beating a younger Barrera in his prime in a brutal fashion means nothing to you? Are you saying that the majority decision win of Barrera over EM in 130 negates Pac's win over him in 126? Are you saying that Pac's two KO wins of Pac over EM rated less than Barrera's win over EM via UD/MD?


Won't you give Pac credit for avenging his loss in a decisive fashion by KO/TKO? But you give extra credit for Barrera beating EM by UD/MD?


Fortunately for Marquez and Barrera, and Barrera and Morales, they were able to fight each other in a title fight whereas Pacman has not been lucky enough to fight them in a title fight. But Pac has beaten all of them including Marquez (if you take into consideration the judge's admission to his scoring error).



It's Pac's greater number of fights and the quality results of those fights that turn to Pac's favor against Marquez. Pac fought 6 times in 130. He lost 1 by UD and won 5 via KO/TKO as compared to Marquez's 1 win over Barrera who's not in his prime anymore after his brutal loss from Pac.

I think the question should be as posed by another poster: Why should Marquez be considered higher in ranking than Pac in 130 considering that he fought only once in that division?

Why not? He has been fighting in 130 since 2005 and he hasn't gone down ever since.


Stop whining, bro. It's the decision of boxing bodies and publications like Ring Magazine, the bible of boxing, that counts not yours. Don't flatter yourself too much. We are just fans who happen to agree w/ them. If these bodies recognize Marquez as higher than Pac, we can readily accept it. Meanwhile, Pac rules!!!

I didn't even read your post:nono You have no credibity here bro,..and this is the only repsone you'll get from me...

Move on!!!

[Biggame]

I can understand. Your ass has been owned here. BIG TIME!!! :rofl:hi:

If you'll leave I can except that!!!

:hi:

[Biggame]

Watch your English, bro? :rofl
Asking me to leave? Why? You can't accept trashing from a guy who has no credibility? :D:lol::lol::lol::rofl

Got me there..."Accept"

Now...If I was being trashed that would be one thing, but it's just you being here in general that I can't accept!! Now pls leave!!!

:hi:

[Morrissey]

1st I don't see you picking PAC over MAB as stupidity at all!! And if I missed you response my apologies...I'm at work!!

Now I pick JMM because he's the better overall fighter IMO, and he's proved himself solid and durable in the 1st fight. He has the speed, skillset, desire, and will to undo PAC so I pick him. He also proved he could hurt PAC!! I'm not in a rush to pick PAC over MAB because although older MAB has begin to box more, and counter better. His jab is beautiful so if he can implement this during the fight he wins IMO. At the same time PAC can overwhelm MAB, but that's not something he can do against JMM!

Now elaberate for me...you say if MAB beats Pac you rank him higher than his contemporaries(JMM and EM) Why is that? And in PAC losing you don't think JMM would leapfrog him(PAC) There both P4P, and in the top 5 for most so it's almost a guarantee JMM leapfrogs him!! He hold nothing over JMM that could stop that!!



Fair enough if you think both of the Mexicans stand a batter than good chances against Pac. That is how you see the fight, but it also shows how you see Pac in general.

As for MAB to be ranked high in the ATG list than both JMM and Erik Morales if he beats Pac this October. It is one of the easiest thing to do, IMO. I mean, do you rank JMM hgher than MAB right now in terms of ATG status. YOu can have a case with Morales, but with JMM, well, hhmmmm.... I hope you are not making a joke, or just being sarcastic, because it is not even funny.

Of course, I am not saying he would be ranked higher than JMM in the P4P list though he may climb back to top 7 or 5, but the credit I would give him is in terms of ATG standing, and that is something everyone would agree with me, except you and Reed_manm and for reasons I can't comprehend. :huh Not a fan of Pac? I see..:yep

You notice I included comtemporaries there, becasue I was talking about ATG status.:deal

[Morrissey]

I am wondering myself!:yep

Did MAB ever beat JMM and I am not aware of it, because I remember seeing JMM clearly beating MAB not to long ago!:deal

No need to wander pal, since even if JMM beat MAB, in terms of ATG, JMM is nowhere near MAB's status.:yep

And the gap will be more enormous if MAB steals a awin over Pac this October.. Not to say, MAB's purse will be thicker..

[Biggame]

Fair enough if you think both of the Mexicans stand a batter than good chances against Pac. That is how you see the fight, but it also shows how you see Pac in general.

As for MAB to be ranked high in the ATG list than both JMM and Erik Morales if he beats Pac this October. It is one of the easiest thing to do, IMO. I mean, do you rank JMM hgher than MAB right now in terms of ATG status. YOu can have a case with Morales, but with JMM, well, hhmmmm.... I hope you are not making a joke, or just being sarcastic, because it is not even funny.

Of course, I am not saying he would be ranked higher than JMM in the P4P list though he may climb back to top 7 or 5, but the credit I would give him is in terms of ATG standing, and that is something everyone would agree with me, except you and Reed_manm and for reasons I can't comprehend. :huh Not a fan of Pac? I see..:yep

You notice I included comtemporaries there, becasue I was talking about ATG status.:deal

I wasn't talking ATG status either I was talking P4P and since all three are still fightingA(well EM might just be odne for good) trhat's why I didn't look at it as ATG status. I already hold MAB higher than both of them, and I'm not sure JMM could catch him, time and the right opponents will tell!!

As far as I see PAC...you're right, I don't see him as highly as you do, and when I look at his opponents and timing I only consider MAB a good win. This is just my opinion. That win was 4yrs ago, so until they meet again it means nothing except that PAC won thje 1st match. MAB is a different fighter now. Older, but smarter, a better technician and a better counter puncher.

[Morrissey]

1st I don't see you picking PAC over MAB as stupidity at all!! And if I missed you response my apologies...I'm at work!!

Now I pick JMM because he's the better overall fighter IMO, and he's proved himself solid and durable in the 1st fight. He has the speed, skillset, desire, and will to undo PAC so I pick him. He also proved he could hurt PAC!! I'm not in a rush to pick PAC over MAB because although older MAB has begin to box more, and counter better. His jab is beautiful so if he can implement this during the fight he wins IMO. At the same time PAC can overwhelm MAB, but that's not something he can do against JMM!

Now elaberate for me...you say if MAB beats Pac you rank him higher than his contemporaries(JMM and EM) Why is that? And in PAC losing you don't think JMM would leapfrog him(PAC) There both P4P, and in the top 5 for most so it's almost a guarantee JMM leapfrogs him!! He hold nothing over JMM that could stop that!!



OK. Your whole argument on why JMM should be the man at 130 is becasue he beat MAB, who at that time, was one of the champs.:deal

In stating that, you ignore JMM's past record at 130, which is nimcoompoop in the first place. Also his previous three fights prior to that.

To summarize it, you believe JMM is No. 1 at 13 becasue of either of the following reasons:
a) you put a lot of premium on the title which MAB held,
b) or you just still regard MAB that highly.

So, which of the two do you base your argument?

Either way, if it is A, then it means you will make Rocky Juarez the man at 130 if he beats JMM later this year. No ifs and buts, though only showing your strictness in picking who is the best superfeatherweight fighter, which is based in having one of the belts, btw.

Or if its B, then you will have to put a lot of credit as well to Pac if he wins over MAB. WOuld you make him the number 1 p4p after that? I don't think you have answered this question before.

And in totally questioning Pac's ranking as the man to beat at 130, you mentioned and discredit his competition at 130. Which compare to JMM's opposition (never mind the weight division), is still equally or more credible.

A 5-1 record (mostly KO wins) against a 1-0 (with a decision) record. And you see the latter as more credible?:-(

See the standard you used there?

Last question, do you think Pac deserved to be the Number 2 p4p fighter right now? If not, where do you rank him? How about JMM? And MAB, if ever you still rank him?:thumbsup

Your ranking would show how you really view PAc in the first place.

[Morrissey]

I wasn't talking ATG status either I was talking P4P and since all three are still fightingA(well EM might just be odne for good) trhat's why I didn't look at it as ATG status. I already hold MAB higher than both of them, and I'm not sure JMM could catch him, time and the right opponents will tell!!

As far as I see PAC...you're right, I don't see him as highly as you do, and when I look at his opponents and timing I only consider MAB a good win. This is just my opinion. That win was 4yrs ago, so until they meet again it means nothing except that PAC won thje 1st match. MAB is a different fighter now. Older, but smarter, a better technician and a better counter puncher.


It's only now I read your post. ANyway, i just think we have differing view on this. Fair enough then.

[reed_man02]

No need to wander pal, since even if JMM beat MAB, in terms of ATG, JMM is nowhere near MAB's status.:yep

And the gap will be more enormous if MAB steals a awin over Pac this October.. Not to say, MAB's purse will be thicker..

Well I agree with you that MAB's resume would outshine JMM's. However, head 2 head, thats a different story.:yep

[reed_man02]

.
Look at their respective performances at 130 lbs. and judge it yourself ...

PACQUIAO:

vs. Jorge Solis W KO 8
vs. Erik Morales (3) W KO 3
vs. Oscar Larios W UD
vs. Erik Morales (2) W TKO 10
vs. Hector Velazquez W TKO 6
vs. Erik Morales (1) L UD


MARQUEZ:

vs. Marco Antonio Barrera W UD


Now tell me who's to be rated higher than the other ???

How can you count the larios and solis victories when theya arent 130lbers? They only fought at that weight because of the payday.

So really, pacman beat morales and lost to him. Aside from that, he beat a journymen. JMM beat the man who beat morales and JMM would crush velasquez. Now tell me, who should be rated higher?:yep

[reed_man02]

You don't really know your boxing, do you? Don't expose your ignorance here. :lol::lol::lol:

oh the irony.:patsch:rofl:-(

[Biggame]

.
Look at their respective performances at 130 lbs. and judge it yourself ...

PACQUIAO:

vs. Jorge Solis W KO 8
vs. Erik Morales (3) W KO 3
vs. Oscar Larios W UD
vs. Erik Morales (2) W TKO 10
vs. Hector Velazquez W TKO 6
vs. Erik Morales (1) L UD


MARQUEZ:

vs. Marco Antonio Barrera W UD


Now tell me who's to be rated higher than the other ???

His resume consist of two guys moving up, a shot EM 3x's, and a bum in Valazquez...not impressive at all. Not to mention his only notable opponent(EM) was previously beaten by MAB at 130lbs for the belt, and twice in total!!

[puga_ni_nana]

His resume consist of two guys moving up, a shot EM 3x's, and a bum in Valazquez...not impressive at all. Not to mention his only notable opponent(EM) was previously beaten by MAB at 130lbs for the belt, and twice in total!!

well if that's the way you are biased against manny's accomplishment at 130, maybe a lone win by jmm over barrera is enough for you to put jmm at no.1 at 130. everyone else will have a different opinion from yours.

[Biggame]

well if that's the way you are biased against manny's accomplishment at 130, maybe a lone win by jmm over barrera is enough for you to put jmm at no.1 at 130. everyone else will have a different opinion from yours.

My point is when you break it down Pac has fought more fights but his opposition is very questionable. His biggest win is EM, and EM had already been dethroned by MAB. Two of his opponents were coming up in weight and Valazques is a bum.

You tell me what would warrant Pac being #1 at 130lbs?

[Boom_Boom]

I can see a case for either on both sides, I just dont think its that much of a big deal, for me I would rate them both equally at this weight class.

Lucky for us we will get some answers Oct.6.

[Biggame]

I can see a case for either on both sides, I just dont think its that much of a big deal, for me I would rate them both equally at this weight class.

Lucky for us we will get some answers Oct.6.

:good

[puga_ni_nana]

My point is when you break it down Pac has fought more fights but his opposition is very questionable. His biggest win is EM, and EM had already been dethroned by MAB. Two of his opponents were coming up in weight and Valazques is a bum.

You tell me what would warrant Pac being #1 at 130lbs?

Now it's better than telling morales was shot 3x. i understand your point and you could be correct. since barrera is the champ and marquez beating barrera. your logic says that morales was no.1 when he is the champ. he beats pac and remains no.1. mab beats morales and mab is the new 130 no.1.

so all the while you are saying that barrera is the no.1 guy at 130 and not pac?

since then, barrera struggled to keep his title against juarez but pac blitzed his way through former 130 no.1 morales. now do still rank barrera at no.1?

at this point, eventhough barrera has the belt, many people are now considering pac their no.1 at 130 because of the way he demolished morales.

and this is without considering, pac's demolition of barrera at 126.

[Biggame]

Now it's better than telling morales was shot 3x. i understand your point and you could be correct. since barrera is the champ and marquez beating barrera. your logic says that morales was no.1 when he is the champ. he beats pac and remains no.1. mab beats morales and mab is the new 130 no.1.

so all the while you are saying that barrera is the no.1 guy at 130 and not pac?

since then, barrera struggled to keep his title against juarez but pac blitzed his way through former 130 no.1 morales. now do still rank barrera at no.1?

at this point, eventhough barrera has the belt, many people are now considering pac their no.1 at 130 because of the way he demolished morales.

and this is without considering, pac's demolition of barrera at 126.

This isn't about MAB, and by the way... who hasn't beaten EM lately, or should I say who has EM beaten lately. Basically Pac has beaten a guy in EM who MAB dethroned, and everyone of late has beaten. EM has lost 5 of his last 6 fights, but this is Pac's biggest accomplishment at 130lbs...you do realize that don't you? MAB hadn't lost since his loss to PAC in 2003, and held two belts(WBC, IBF) at 130lbs at one time being stripped of the IBF! Now again...what has PAC done that warrants a #1 ranking at 130lbs!!

I'd give PAC more credit if he accomplished something there. You know maybe a top 10 guy, a champion, or someone proven w/a nice winning streak. Just being there don't cut it, and neither does his overrated resume there:nono

[puga_ni_nana]

This isn't about MAB, and by the way... who hasn't beaten EM lately, or should I say who has EM beaten lately. Basically Pac has beaten a guy in EM who MAB dethroned, and everyone of late has beaten. EM has lost 5 of his last 6 fights, but this is Pac's biggest accomplishment at 130lbs...you do realize that don't you? MAB hadn't lost since his loss to PAC in 2003, and held two belts(WBC, IBF) at 130lbs at one time being stripped of the IBF! Now again...what has PAC done that warrants a #1 ranking at 130lbs!!

I'd give PAC more credit if he accomplished something there. You know maybe a top 10 guy, a champion, or someone proven w/a nice winning streak. Just being there don't cut it, and neither does his overrated resume there:nono

so basically you are saying that jmm is the no.1 at 130 because pac's wins are overrated. if this have nothing to do with barrera, then jmm should not be no.1 because he became the 130 wbc champ because of a solitary win over barrera. you could put guzman, valero or maybe fana :lol: at no.1 above pac if you put too much regard on the belt.

again if that is your view about pac's accomplishment, you will have a hard time putting him at the top of 130. let a rematch next year see if you are right or wrong after all.

[Biggame]

so basically you are saying that jmm is the no.1 at 130 because pac's wins are overrated. if this have nothing to do with barrera, then jmm should not be no.1 because he became the 130 wbc champ because of a solitary win over barrera. you could put guzman, valero or maybe fana :lol: at no.1 above pac if you put too much regard on the belt.

again if that is your view about pac's accomplishment, you will have a hard time putting him at the top of 130. let a rematch next year see if you are right or wrong after all.

No matter how you slice it PAC has accomplished nothing at 130lbs. I said this has nothing to do w/MAB because basically your whole post was about him and you kept pointing out him as the #1 guy there when clearly he isn't anymore. Why you keep talking like that I don't know!

Now in response of your oh so funny remarks about Valero, Guzman, and even Fana...don't play village Idiot! We all know at the end of the day it's going to be JMM, and PAC, but I can see Guzman there soon if not now!!

[johnco]

why is pac higher than jmm ? very simple.. just look at the picture and see what jmm is doing in that picture!! :good:good

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Biggame]

why is pac higher than jmm ? very simple.. just look at the picture and see what jmm is doing in that picture!! :good:good

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Oh,...now I get it!!:patsch

Now I'll assume,..nope I'll bet the guy saying loser is you!!
:rofl :rofl :rofl

[Ridah]

MAB beat at 130lbs Erik Morales who was the #1 fighter at that time. then went on to defeat Fana, Peden, Juarez 2X then lost to JMM.

Manny first fight at 130lbs, he lost against Morales, he then went on to defeat morales twice, velazquez, larios, and solis.

so the #1 fighter in 130lbs is JMM

[Biggame]

MAB beat at 130lbs Erik Morales who was the #1 fighter at that time. then went on to defeat Fana, Peden, Juarez 2X then lost to JMM.

Manny first fight at 130lbs, he lost against Morales, he then went on to defeat morales twice, velazquez, larios, and solis.

so the #1 fighter in 130lbs is JMM

:good :happy

[maciek4]

You are not taking into the account the momentum that Pac built after the Morales win. 2 moths after his destruction of Morales, JMM fought Chris John in Indonesia and lost a decision. Pac was at the top, JMM was at the bottom, since then Pac beat Larios, Morales and Solis and JMM struggled to beat his opponents only to reemerge after his win over Barrera. Because of this momentum Pac is #1. Now Pac is fighting Barrera and JMM is fighting Barrera's victim Juarez.

[Biggame]

You are not taking into the account the momentum that Pac built after the Morales win. 2 moths after his destruction of Morales, JMM fought Chris John in Indonesia and lost a decision. Pac was at the top, JMM was at the bottom, since then Pac beat Larios, Morales and Solis and JMM struggled to beat his opponents only to reemerge after his win over Barrera. Because of this momentum Pac is #1. Now Pac is fighting Barrera and JMM is fighting Barrera's victim Juarez.

LOL...you're saying "Pac is fighting Barrera and JMM is fighting Barrera's victim Juarez" but at that same time forgetting that Barrera is JMM's victim!!:rofl :rofl

I'm not as impressed w/Pac beating a shot EM, or Larios coming up 2 weightclasses, or Solis coming up in weight as you, and I wouldn't call that momentum at all! It's pn paper, but we all know JMM didn't lose to John!! Oh yeah and again Pac is fighting a guy at 130lbs who's coming off of a loss!! Impressive!!!:-(

[retriever]

1. Pacquiao
2. Sotto
3. JMM
4. Guzman
5. MAB
6. Valero

[supercali]

At 130 lbs., Pac has done more than JMM, let JMM prove himself first at that weight, before this question can be answered objectively. Although Juarez fight won't raise his stock more as it is, assuming jmm gets past him. Same case with Pac-Mab, since he has beaten him prior, but IF Pac beats him in impressive fashion, then it will solidify his 130, P4P, etc. status more than a JMM win even if impressively.

[Biggame]

At 130 lbs., Pac has done more than JMM, let JMM prove himself first at that weight, before this question can be answered objectively. Although Juarez fight won't raise his stock more as it is, assuming jmm gets past him. Same case with Pac-Mab, since he has beaten him prior, but IF Pac beats him in impressive fashion, then it will solidify his 130, P4P, etc. status more than a JMM win even if impressively.

I think JMM has proved he's ellite at the weight. You don't come in and beat the Champ, if you're not a proven fighter:nono And again IMO Pac hasn't proven much at 130lbs by beating a shot EM, two guys moving up in weight, guys coming off losses, and a nobody in Valazquez! More doesn't always equate to better. That's not impressive when you break it down and really look at it!

Think about it...MAB dethrones EM who was the #1 guy at 130lbs, and later Pac moves up and loses to EM. Pac revenges that lost, but how in the world would MAB all the sudden lose his #1 ranking? Did he lose or something?? To my recollection he hadn't lost til he ran into JMM. It almost like all Pac had to do was win a fight to get that ranking. He loses to a guy MAB beats so where was he ranked then, and what did do to propell him over MAB? How does beating EM after losing to him, after he(EM) already lost to MAB warrant him a #1 ranking:huh What has he accomplished there?

[maciek4]

[/size]

LOL...you're saying "Pac is fighting Barrera and JMM is fighting Barrera's victim Juarez" but at that same time forgetting that Barrera is JMM's victim!!:rofl :rofl

I'm not as impressed w/Pac beating a shot EM, or Larios coming up 2 weightclasses, or Solis coming up in weight as you, and I wouldn't call that momentum at all! It's pn paper, but we all know JMM didn't lose to John!! Oh yeah and again Pac is fighting a guy at 130lbs who's coming off of a loss!! Impressive!!!:-(




Yes I'm saying that Pac is fighting Barrera who is not only a victim of JMM but Pac himself, however JMM is fighting an opponent who is a victim of Barrera twice and is moving up, definitly worse opponent then Barrera, so if both PAc and JMM win their bouts, Pac will gain more then JMM and his stock will rise even more. JMM beat John IMO as well but a loss is a loss even when you are robbed, your stock will drop as a result of it.

[ko factor]

why is pac higher than jmm ? very simple.. just look at the picture and see what jmm is doing in that picture!! :good:good

[Only registered and activated users can see links] :good :yep :deal

[Biggame]

Yes I'm saying that Pac is fighting Barrera who is not only a victim of JMM but Pac himself, however JMM is fighting an opponent who is a victim of Barrera twice and is moving up, definitly worse opponent then Barrera, so if both PAc and JMM win their bouts, Pac will gain more then JMM and his stock will rise even more. JMM beat John IMO as well but a loss is a loss even when you are robbed, your stock will drop as a result of it.

I guess beating guys coming off a losses does gain you more credit than anyone else when your name is Pac!! Now since all you guys are assuming PAC will win again against MAB so easily how is he to get more credit? I mean he's fighting a guy coming off of a loss, and someone the whole world thinks he could beat!! What's so big about it??

[mad_takamura]

I guess beating guys coming off a losses does gain you more credit than anyone else when your name is Pac!! Now since all you guys are assuming PAC will win again against MAB so easily how is he to get more credit? I mean he's fighting a guy coming off of a loss, and someone the whole world thinks he could beat!! What's so big about it??

so does jmm vs mab everybody in the world thought jmm would come off that fight guns_a_blazing.. yet he almost lost and many people think that mab did a lot to win that fight! the win of jmm isn't convincing enough! compare that to pac's win over barrera and you know what happened there! his brother cried like they lost a lollipop! now jmm's win over mab? what's so big about it?:huh pac's win over mab what so big about it? :catapulted pac to stardom! jmm's win over jaca.. what's so big about it? jmm would surely beat jaca! everyone knows it!(not that i'm underestimating my pinoy bro's) pac's win over larios? what's so big about it? though larios came up he and lost his previous fight, larios name is recognizable in the bantam's with his fights with mccullogh, vasquez,and hussein.. compare larios to jaca :-( or to john who jmm shamefully fought for peanuts.. or compare both jaca and john to em alone: a future atg..now compare this pac ko's 2 future atg's or p4p's '2 renowned mexicans, a draw to marques( though pac could have won by judge's mistake,)ud over a renowned bantam in larios(if you don't then youre ignorant),ko velas(though i'm not really crediting velasques cos his name is not that bloomy though at the time facing pac was never down in 5 yrs), k.o. against undefeated solis to any opponent marques fought? your only right to argue is mab and john: are they legit to brag about against pac's opponents?!!wtf!! you really are stupid! biggame loser just accept it and don't be sour about it! you're not as big as the ring mag. afterall!!! stfu!

[boxbox]

I guess beating guys coming off a losses does gain you more credit than anyone else when your name is Pac!! Now since all you guys are assuming PAC will win again against MAB so easily how is he to get more credit? I mean he's fighting a guy coming off of a loss, and someone the whole world thinks he could beat!! What's so big about it??



hey you're the one who made a big deal out of it, Pac beating this guy is no big deal and thats exactly why he's rated higher..and while JMM struggled to beat Marco..well, just accept it..Pac will always be rated higher than these 2 now until he losses to any of them..

[mad_takamura]

those wins featherweight to lw did enough to put pac above jmm weather pac's first lw is against em you must look at the bigger resume wtf! jmm just went in the 130pnds and you credit him that fast? what a lucky son of a gun jmm is!

[maciek4]

I guess beating guys coming off a losses does gain you more credit than anyone else when your name is Pac!! Now since all you guys are assuming PAC will win again against MAB so easily how is he to get more credit? I mean he's fighting a guy coming off of a loss, and someone the whole world thinks he could beat!! What's so big about it??



Not much and he shouldnt be fighting Barrera, he should be fighting JMM or Guzman or Soto. Whats so big about fighting Rocky Juarez? He is 5'3 tall, he stands no chance against the great counterpuncher in JMM.

[runnynose]

Not much and he shouldnt be fighting Barrera, he should be fighting JMM or Guzman or Soto.

The revenge/grudge angle is what's being played up by the promoters and that always sells, that's why. No matter what we say about belts and ABC rankings, pitting Pac and MAB again is a very bankable event. Logic may dictate differently but that fight is what will sell, so it will happen, and it has to happen now before another event of any kind intervenes.

Now as to the topic of this thread. Pac isn't exactly without a belt. He has only a regional belt at the moment but he's a de facto or some kind of people's world champ. Popularity is still a factor. It's hard to explain heh heh. JMM is great and a veritable future ATG too. Both he and Pac deserve the highest rankings @ 130lbs, and to settle the question of who should rank higher than the other, thanks to the revenge/grudge factor, they will likely face each other next, granting they both win their respective assignments for now. :good

[Biggame]

Not much and he shouldnt be fighting Barrera, he should be fighting JMM or Guzman or Soto. Whats so big about fighting Rocky Juarez? He is 5'3 tall, he stands no chance against the great counterpuncher in JMM.

I agree w/you 100% here!!

[Biggame]

hey you're the one who made a big deal out of it, Pac beating this guy is no big deal and thats exactly why he's rated higher..and while JMM struggled to beat Marco..well, just accept it..Pac will always be rated higher than these 2 now until he losses to any of them..

JMM has lost to either of them either...and if this didn't go over your head you would gotten what I meant like Maciek4. He shouldn't be fighting MAB, he should be fighting someone like JMM, or Soto, or Guzman, but instead. Same w/JMM...he shouldn't be fighting Juarez:nono Now my point about PAC is what has he done at 130lbs? What has he accomplished, and pls don't bring up that International belt or whatever it is! He's really done nothing special. He's fought smaller guys,,and guys coming off of losses. Surely not special and once again what is he doing...he's fighting a guy fresh off of a loss! I guess that's all you have to do to be #1 at 130lbs. Not fight anyone of note although amazingly fighting MAB is a start, but like EM before him MAB was just dethroned, and who wants him next?... PAC ofcourse!! It's a money thing and an opportunity for MAB to revenge himself, but it still doesn't warrant Pac being #1 at the weight, and again he's still fighting a guy coming off of a loss, and again he accomplishes nothing!!

He's done nothing impressive there, and w/his superman status that you guys give him, he should have atleast fought a champ, or try and challenge one. He's content earning money fighting meaningless fights while you guys make him out to be the best in a division he's fought no-one in!

[puga_ni_nana]

It's not only based on the number of wins but also on how you win it ... PAC won his fights by knocking out guys (some never suffered a KO loss before) ... Very impressive wins ...

Now JMM's lone performance at 130 is a controversial decision win ... Up to this day Barrera still thinks he won that fight ... :lol:

yep. that's why most unbiased observers put pac on the top of 130 and not influenced by who's got those alphabet belts.

[PH|LLA]

For those who call MAB shot you need to erase, and not count a victory by PAC IF he wins in there upcoming fight, and then take away the EM wins, and now what do you have for PAC at 130lbs:huh
If you take away his upcoming fight against a shot Barrera and his 2 ko's of Morales and you take away JMM's win over a shot Barrera.

Then at 130 their resumes look like this

PAcquiao : Solis, Velasquez, Larios

JMM : Noone

[puga_ni_nana]

If you take away his upcoming fight against a shot Barrera and his 2 ko's of Morales and you take away JMM's win over a shot Barrera.

Then at 130 their resumes look like this

PAcquiao : Solis, Velasquez, Larios

JMM : Noone


:lol: i bet the threadstarter is still not convinced with that explanation.

[Biggame]

If you take away his upcoming fight against a shot Barrera and his 2 ko's of Morales and you take away JMM's win over a shot Barrera.

Then at 130 their resumes look like this

PAcquiao : Solis, Velasquez, Larios

JMM : Noone

1st off I never said MAB is shot so there goes most of your point right there. it's these other clowns taking away credit from JMM I'm addressing. they say he's shot or aging yet they're are ready to give PAC all the credit in the world if he beats MAB w/the exception of Maciek4! I said EM is/was shot! If you have been keeping up you would see that I posed a question to all of them about it! Why don't you ans that question!!

2nd if we go by your theory about taking bouts away depending on who's what than all you have for Pac is a bum/journeyman in Valazquez.

Larios- moved up 2 weight classes for there fight

Solis- moved up in weight for there fight

I guess this would mean that neither would have proven anything at 130lbs now wouldn't it!!

I'll be waiting for ans to that question!!

[ravtrav]

When It Comes Down To It, Pac Knocks Manuela The Fuck Out!

[Biggame]

When It Comes Down To It, Pac Knocks Manuela The Fuck Out!

assumption, assumptiom, assumption!!:nono

Jmm takes the rematch!!

[boxing_report]

:good

[mad_takamura]

assumption, assumptiom, assumption!!:nono

Jmm takes the rematch!!

another asumption

[Biggame]

another asumption

Very true, but more likely to happen!!

[mad_takamura]

Very true, but more likely to happen!!

wanna bet?

[boxbox]

to some extent, yes we can say that Pac has been fighting for money, but to be able to earn BIG, you must have done something "meaningful" not only thru the eyes of opinionated fans like you but also experts, organizations, casual fans..etc..And when that's the case, why wouldn't you grab the opportunity?? there's a reason why this is happening and that's money!, and while Pac is one if not the hottest commodity in the division, questioning his ratings will be useless.

[Biggame]

wanna bet?

I'd love to!!!

[Biggame]

After October 6 another question will be asked here ... "Why is PAC now declared the no. 1 P4P boxer???" :lol:

Errrrrr..............not quite:nono

[theunderdog]

We'll see ... IMO, if PAC will look good against Barrera on October 6, he'll take Ring Mag's no. 1 P4P ranking ... :D

And some peeps here will still ask "Why is Pac rated higher than JMM at 130lbs???" :D

i disagree. pbf won't go anywhere until he loses a match

[mad_takamura]

i read on the papers pac's rematch with jmm is bound to happen in feb.2008 if ever both parties win their respective bouts..let's just wait and see if they win their respective bouts then their rematch will happen then we shall see the results! if pac beats jmm then there's no more problem! we shall see indeed who will be the number 1 in the 130pnd division weather it's pac or jmm!!

[theunderdog]

pac doesn't deserve the number 1 spot even if he beats the hell out of mab. because pbf is still standing dude

[theunderdog]

if you're standing still at no. 1 doing nothing, there's a chance that an active boxer at no. 2 might pass you eventually ... that's why i've said that there's a chance that PAC might occupy the no. 1 P4P spot for at least 2 months from October 7 to December 8 if PAC will look good against Barrera ... ;)

but pbf is not standing still.

[roadrunner]

This still baffles me!!

Pac who has no belts, and has only fought a shell of EM at the weight is ranked higher? He's actually done nothing at the weight to warrant his ranking:nono Beating Em who was already dethroned by MAB means......

MAB was the #1 130lber, he was dethroned by JMM therefore JMM should hold that spot! It's not Pac holds a win over him. They fought to a draw in a fight alot of Ppl feel JMM won!

Pls anyone w/Reason explain why Pac should be ranked higher!

Fana has a belt too, so does it mean that you have to rank him higher than Pac too? EM had 1 fight at 130, a hard fought battle with Barrera, whom Pac demolished. EM must first beat big names at 130 before he gets the credit of being the top guy at 130.

[nighthunter]

You guys are just wasting time debating Biggame, you can't convinced him. He's born stupid.

:good

[Biggame]

:good

:finger

We'll see if Pac wins if he's willing to fight JMM next!

BTW,...if you agree I'm born stupid, you must agree that you and Pac "I love Pac's salty nuts" Dbest are born w/roach brains!!

:hi:

[Biggame]

PAC will become Ring Mag's no. 1 P4P if he will look good against Barrera on October 6 ... PAC will occupy the no. 1 spot from October 7 to December 8 (2 months baby) IF PBF wins against Hatton ... but if PBF loses then PAC's stay at no. 1 P4P will be longer than 2 months ... hehe ... :D

LOL,...you really think he'll jump over Mayweather after beating MAB when Mayweathjer has a fight coming up? P4P for 2months:rofl He'll only take over that spot if Floyd loses!!

[Biggame]

PAC will be P4P no. 1 for at least 2 months... And why not possible? Ring Magazine rankings is updated from time to time ... ;)

Why can't you accept that there's that possibility that PAC will occupy that No. 1 P4P throne? ... :lol:

1st off instead of me accepting something that won't happen you should just realize it won't happen. He's not going to surpass Mayweather off of one win over MAB! No not at all, and not for 2 months!!:rofl

We can bet on this one!:deal

[PacDbest]

:finger

We'll see if Pac wins if he's willing to fight JMM next!

BTW,...if you agree I'm born stupid, you must agree that you and Pac "I love Pac's salty nuts" Dbest are born w/roach brains!!

:hi:




Yes I have the Freddie Roach's Brain:good

[theunderdog]

whatever dude ... we'll just wait for October 6 ... ;) btw, i bet my vcash on Kendall Holt ... :D

bad idea. i told you to stick it all on cintron-feliciano not going the distance bud

[Biggame]

But you can now accept that Pac should ranked higher than JMM. :good

No!!

P4P? yeah for the moment, but not at 130lbs!!

[Biggame]

Yes I have the Freddie Roach's Brain:good

Do you have your own life outside of Pac's nuts, and the ppl around him:huh

[Biggame]

Tell me, really, what kind of a question is this? :patsch

Apparently one you can't comprehend, or respond to!!

[charlievint]

:-(

The same so called Shot guy JMM just beat Pac is fighting next, and like a majority of Pac's last opponents he coming off of a loss!! You will see it as a great win, and reason to crown Pac Champ will pretending like JMM did it against a weaker version, while still trying to discredit him!!

Pathetic!!

Now what's your point:think

Well....Actually I don't even think JMM won that fight against a past his prime MAB. He had a struggle with Marco and got a "W" that IMO should have gone MAB's way....but it was a close fight non the less. Point being....JMM hasn't done ANYTHING at 130 either, but given the common opponents and the way they preform....PAC has done far better in both areas...hence...a better rating.

[Biggame]

Well....Actually I don't even think JMM won that fight against a past his prime MAB. He had a struggle with Marco and got a "W" that IMO should have gone MAB's way....but it was a close fight non the less. Point being....JMM hasn't done ANYTHING at 130 either, but given the common opponents and the way they preform....PAC has done far better in both areas...hence...a better rating.

If you say so. I don't think the fight was that close, and ppl have to stop living off of a fight that was 4yrs ago. That was then, and since then MAB has moved up, won the title, and was the man at 130lbs. Pac has lost to the man MAB dethroned at 130lbs. Yeah he's revenged that loss but we all know EM is shot to pieces. Pac has done nothing at 130lbs. He's accomplished nithing there so far. He resume at 130 sucks! It consist of fighting guys coming off loses, a shot fighter, a bum, and guys moving up in weight! He's yet to fight a champion or anyone of note there yet he's has a claim at #1:huh

On a side note he's finally fighting a guy of substance, and I'm not sure he wins that fight like you guys believe!!

[ironchamp]

Well, if you're basing it on the Barrera-Morales trilogy, then technically it breaks down to MAB eking out the decision in the rematch, losing by TKO to Manny Pacquiao shortly after, who, in turn, lost it to Erik. In Morales' next fight in 130, he lost to Pacquiao and Pacquiao hasn't lost since. Chronologically, that's what happened, but a lot of the fights above didn't occur at super featherweight. Basically, Pacquiao is rated higher because he is a much more proven commodity in the division than JMM, who has had one good performance. It boils down to dominance more than anything else, really.

I second that.

[boxbox]

third!

[Luzon]

As I read on, you have folks here acting like because Pac beat MAB at 126lbs he therefore should be ranked automatically higher:huh Personally I don't think beating a shot EM 2X's, actually losing to him once, beating an unproven Solis, beating a guy who moved up to weightclasses in Larios, and Valazquez is that great of a resume. EM who stands out the most has now lost his last 4 fights(5 out of last 6). Larios has been on the down slide and was Ko'd in his fight leading up to there fight. A majority of his opponents at 130lbs are coming off of losses, while none of them play any significant role at the weight. JMM fought and beat the most significant guy at that weight, and look who's fighting him next! What's so great about his resume now? I'm lost here!!

If you look hard his resume there ain't shit:nono 126lbs don't have shit to do w/130lbs. MAB's resume is way better than Pac's at that weight and JMM just beat him.

For those who call MAB shot you need to erase, and not count a victory by PAC IF he wins in there upcoming fight, and then take away the EM wins, and now what do you have for PAC at 130lbs:huh JMM may only have one fight at the weight, but he beat the man there! He should rightfully take that spot, and it should be given to someone else off of speculation, or because of what happened at 126lbs between MAB and Pac!!

If this aint biased thinking, I don't know what is. He just said Marquez beat Pac at 126.... We all know his line of thinking...Pac will never get credit from dudes like this.

[Biggame]

If this aint biased thinking, I don't know what is. He just said Marquez beat Pac at 126.... We all know his line of thinking...Pac will never get credit from dudes like this.

I give him credit, but at 130lbs he's done nothing, and it's there for you to see plain and simple!!

BTW...WTF are you talking about??????

RIF my man!!!!

[charlievint]

If you say so. I don't think the fight was that close, and ppl have to stop living off of a fight that was 4yrs ago. That was then, and since then MAB has moved up, won the title, and was the man at 130lbs. Pac has lost to the man MAB dethroned at 130lbs. Yeah he's revenged that loss but we all know EM is shot to pieces. Pac has done nothing at 130lbs. He's accomplished nithing there so far. He resume at 130 sucks! It consist of fighting guys coming off loses, a shot fighter, a bum, and guys moving up in weight! He's yet to fight a champion or anyone of note there yet he's has a claim at #1:huh

On a side note he's finally fighting a guy of substance, and I'm not sure he wins that fight like you guys believe!!

I see you have some valid points...PAC really hasn't faced the kind of opposition at 130 to warrant him being the top dog...which he's not...but with that said JMM has not either. Both havn't done much of anything at 130 but I believe that PAC has done better with the oppostiion he has faced...whether or not his comp consisted of "Bums", "Guys comming off of losses" or "guys moving up in weight" is not the point...how he preformed is.

And he dominated every fight at 130. JMM can't say that and he hasn't faught any legitimate contenders at 130 unless you include MAB whom agian,.....Juan had a REALLY hard struggle with. That fight wasn't 4 yrs ago...I think you are thinking of the JMM vs PAC fight which was around 4 yrs ago. That was a close fight IMO as well but I felt PAC did enough to win comfortably.

[reed_man02]

I see you have some valid points...PAC really hasn't faced the kind of opposition at 130 to warrant him being the top dog...which he's not...but with that said JMM has not either. Both havn't done much of anything at 130 but I believe that PAC has done better with the oppostiion he has faced...whether or not his comp consisted of "Bums", "Guys comming off of losses" or "guys moving up in weight" is not the point...how he preformed is.

And he dominated every fight at 130. JMM can't say that and he hasn't faught any legitimate contenders at 130 unless you include MAB whom agian,.....Juan had a REALLY hard struggle with. That fight wasn't 4 yrs ago...I think you are thinking of the JMM vs PAC fight which was around 4 yrs ago. That was a close fight IMO as well but I felt PAC did enough to win comfortably.

First off, PAC didnt domintate the first two fights agaisnt Morales.:nono

Second, regarding the rest of his comp, PAC was expected to dominate them. None of those guys were contenders at 130 so I dunno why pac fought them in the first place.:huh

Also, I felt JMM won their fight but there were a few close round towards the end where I felt could have gone to PAC although I thought JMM landed the harder, more accurate shots in just about every round after the second.

[reed_man02]

Again, you haven't answered the question : What has Marquez done in 130 that deserves him to rated higher than Pac? Beating Barrera in a match which can go either way? You must be kidding, BigLoser! :lol::lol::lol:

I dont think JMM is #1 at 130 although I feel he is the best fighters, but biggame logic probably consist of beating the top fighter(MAB) at 130 will then make you the top fighter at 130.(JMM)

[Biggame]

Yep we saw their accomplishments at 130 lbs. In fact I posted it below so that you can see it also ... clearly ... :D

PACQUIAO:
vs. Solis won by KO8
vs. Morales won by KO3
vs. Larios won by UD12
vs. Morales won by TKO10
vs. Velazquez won by TKO6
vs. Morales lost by UD12

MARQUEZ:
vs. Barrera won by UD12 (controversial decision?)

Now, which performance at 130 lbs. merit a higher ranking? :lol:

You call that accomplishments:rofl

Why is he foghting guys like that, and why isn't even trying to fight a Champion, or top guy?

JMM won the fight against MAB and controversial or not he actually fought someone of substance, and someone who happened to be the Division Champ! That's considered a much bigger deal than the list of opponents you list!!

[Biggame]

I see you have some valid points...PAC really hasn't faced the kind of opposition at 130 to warrant him being the top dog...which he's not...but with that said JMM has not either. Both havn't done much of anything at 130 but I believe that PAC has done better with the oppostiion he has faced...whether or not his comp consisted of "Bums", "Guys comming off of losses" or "guys moving up in weight" is not the point...how he preformed is.

And he dominated every fight at 130. JMM can't say that and he hasn't faught any legitimate contenders at 130 unless you include MAB whom agian,.....Juan had a REALLY hard struggle with. That fight wasn't 4 yrs ago...I think you are thinking of the JMM vs PAC fight which was around 4 yrs ago. That was a close fight IMO as well but I felt PAC did enough to win comfortably.

1. I was talking about the fight between MAB and Pac! Some poster pretend that because Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago at 126lbs he automatically moves above him at a new weight. 2. I can understand Quantity, but you have to throw in quality, and I think one quality win against the reigning Champ is much more definative than 5 against guys coming off loses(EM, Larios), moving up in weight(Solis, Larios), 1 bum(Velazquez), and a loss to a fighter coming off a loss(EM) I personally don't see much there to claim anything at 130lbs:nono Look what he has spent his time doing. He's dominated his opponents, but look at them. He has yet to go after a Champion during his reign. Now he's fought a Champion(EM) right after he lost his belt, and again w/MAB he'll be fighting a former Champ after losing his belt! My point is he's not doing anything there to merit #1 status!

3. I think JMM did more than enough to win the fight, and it's not like he was fighting a bum. MAB was the man and to beat him no matter who you are you have to be able to fight. IMO JMM is the best fighter there, and base on the fact that he moved up and dethroned the Champion, and the fact that indeed he probably is the best fighter there he should be #1. Pac shouldn't be that guy by default. There are other Champions there, and I don't see how Pac can leapfrog any of them w/having atleast fought a top guy, and even then he should have to prove he's willing to fight and then beat one of the reigning Champions!

By no means should he have to start from scratch, but c'mon...beat somebody there. I think that he's going to be in a dogfight w/MAB and it's a fight I believe is very winnable for MAB.

[johnco]

i couldnt believe bigame is stille riding jmms dick after all these weeks in this thread :lol::lol::lol::lol::patsch:patsch:patsch
get over it, jmm is nothing at 130 yet. read the discussions and dont be blinded by your hatred. the manner of pac winning at 130 is kneeling in front of him :hey get the logic please :good

[Biggame]

i couldnt believe bigame is stille riding jmms dick after all these weeks in this thread :lol::lol::lol::lol::patsch:patsch:patsch
get over it, jmm is nothing at 130 yet. read the discussions and dont be blinded by your hatred. the manner of pac winning at 130 is kneeling in front of him :hey get the logic please :good

WOW...you're talking about someone riding someone else dick??:rofl

JMM is something that your hero isn't....a Champion, and if your boy would actually fight one he'd be one too. You Pac sperm swallowers have little credability! You're a used whore, and service Pac at will!!

Go away cumbreath!!

[juancho214]

so what im reading is that the barrera fight will do nothing for pac since he is shot

[Biggame]

so what im reading is that the barrera fight will do nothing for pac since he is shot

PAC fans want it both ways!!

If you leave it up to them JMM wins isn't a big, or a good win because MAB is old, and Shot, but when, and if Pac beats this so called old, shot fighter it will be a massive win!

Now I asked them a question in which most won't dear to ans....

How much credit will they give PAC if he wins this fall against MAB, and how much more credit will they give JMM if MAB wins!!

[charlievint]

1. I was talking about the fight between MAB and Pac! Some poster pretend that because Pac beat MAB 4yrs ago at 126lbs he automatically moves above him at a new weight. 2. I can understand Quantity, but you have to throw in quality, and I think one quality win against the reigning Champ is much more definative than 5 against guys coming off loses(EM, Larios), moving up in weight(Solis, Larios), 1 bum(Velazquez), and a loss to a fighter coming off a loss(EM) I personally don't see much there to claim anything at 130lbs:nono Look what he has spent his time doing. He's dominated his opponents, but look at them. He has yet to go after a Champion during his reign. Now he's fought a Champion(EM) right after he lost his belt, and again w/MAB he'll be fighting a former Champ after losing his belt! My point is he's not doing anything there to merit #1 status!

3. I think JMM did more than enough to win the fight, and it's not like he was fighting a bum. MAB was the man and to beat him no matter who you are you have to be able to fight. IMO JMM is the best fighter there, and base on the fact that he moved up and dethroned the Champion, and the fact that indeed he probably is the best fighter there he should be #1. Pac shouldn't be that guy by default. There are other Champions there, and I don't see how Pac can leapfrog any of them w/having atleast fought a top guy, and even then he should have to prove he's willing to fight and then beat one of the reigning Champions!

By no means should he have to start from scratch, but c'mon...beat somebody there. I think that he's going to be in a dogfight w/MAB and it's a fight I believe is very winnable for MAB.

Ok....:roll: But what has JMM done at 130 besides have a close fight with a past his prime MAB who was moving up as well? At least PAC was fighting SOLID fighters at 130 and dominating them like they were club fighters.

Remember...these guys that PAC dominated have NEVER been dominated in that kind of fashion. At 130 PAC hasn't etched his name in stone yet b/c he hasn't beaten the legitimate champions at 130, but he's beating most of the contenders with names at that weight.

When PAC beats MAB you'll still say that JMM should be ranked higher than PAC. Even if PAC KO's MAB. Why? I have no clue, it just seems like you won't give an ounce of credit to PAC when it's clearly deserved.

Regardless of how dominant of a preformance PAC has over MAB...you're right..it was 4 yrs ago, but this is 130 and PAC has more fights at this wieght...has been far more dominant and is a solidified champion moving up in wieght as are MAB and JMM! Rankings are jacked up anyway but they have this situation right on the money.

[charlievint]

WOW...you're talking about someone riding someone else dick??:rofl

JMM is something that your hero isn't....a Champion, and if your boy would actually fight one he'd be one too. You Pac sperm swallowers have little credability! You're a used whore, and service Pac at will!!

Go away cumbreath!!

Damn Homie! Be easy. Jeez.....you sound like a salty broad who just walked in to see her husband of 20 yrs fucking her younger sister! Get the sand out of your vagina partner. JMM is champ....but PAC is as well. If you want to say that PAC nut huggers are "Over the top" and "Riding Dick" then you got put yourself in to perspective as well....you sound just as bad as any "nuthgger or Fanatic" with SOME of your posts. Lets keep it about boxing and on topic.

[Biggame]

HoDamn mie! Be easy. Jeez.....you sound like a salty broad who just walked in to see her husband of 20 yrs fucking her younger sister! Get the sand out of your vagina partner. JMM is champ....but PAC is as well. If you want to say that PAC nut huggers are "Over the top" and "Riding Dick" then you got put yourself in to perspective as well....you sound just as bad as any "nuthgger or Fanatic" with SOME of your posts. Lets keep it about boxing and on topic.

Let's keep it about boxing, but this is the start of your post:huh I have reasoning for coming at him like that. This isn't our 1st time at this about Pac and the whole world of boxing who he'd KO if you ask em! What's your reason for coming at me like that? You don't have one you thought that if you put that other shit in it would look as if you're coming to defuse something like a middle man!! I sound nothing like a nuthugger!!

That was pretty cornballish!!:-(

[puga_ni_nana]

Pac doesn't gain anything if he wins against a shot Barrera especially if the result is a replay of the 1st fight.

if you will not count the $5M he will receive for this fight. :hey

[ravtrav]

:patsch

Pac KTFOd a prime MAB. JMM barely won (I thought he lost) against a shot MAB.I didn't know Domngo had a brother:hi:

[Biggame]

JMM won his championship crown against Barrera whom Pac demolished. That belt is nothing. Pac is still the biggest draw in the superfeatherweight division.

Get over it, JMM fuckboy!

That was 4yrs ago at a different weightclass.

You do realize that after MAB beat EM for the belt at 130lbs, EM turned around and beat PAC in that same weightclass! Pac couldn't beat EM til he was totally shot, and done! Stop bringing the business of 126lbs into 130lbs. We don't know what will happen when they fight again. IMO if MAB wins PAC gets no credit for anything he's done at 130lbs. This will be his 1st real fight against a fighter who actually means something in the division. I do agree that PAC is the biggest draw, but it doesn't necessarily equate to #1, or being the best:nono


Another thing....I wouldn't call MAB shot, and niether should you because they man is fighting your guy next, and if he wins what does that say about PAC?

[Biggame]

I didn't know Domngo had a brother:hi:

Me either!!!:rofl :rofl :rofl

[charlievint]

Let's keep it about boxing, but this is the start of your post:huh I have reasoning for coming at him like that. This isn't our 1st time at this about Pac and the whole world of boxing who he'd KO if you ask em! What's your reason for coming at me like that? You don't have one you thought that if you put that other shit in it would look as if you're coming to defuse something like a middle man!! I sound nothing like a nuthugger!!

That was pretty cornballish!!:-(

:D BIG...I was stating the obvious homie...you got your panties all in a bunch and began to respond "LIKE A SALTY BROAD" I know you've dealt with a salty bitch in the past....Almost every man has.

I wasn't trying to disrespect...just give you a different angle from my perspective...Of course that is just that.."MY PERSPECTIVE" and it means absolutly shit! So really it shouldn't bother you much, but I know you probably took it the wrong way.

I'm not trying to be a middle man, but did want to get the name calling and all that garbage scratched but I know how "NUT HUGGERS" can get! This is ESB after all....but to be completely honest it seemed as if this was battle between a PAC nuthugger against a JMM Nuthugger.

"Cornballish" or not.... perception IS Reality in most cases.

[Biggame]

:D BIG...I was stating the obvious homie...you got your panties all in a bunch and began to respond "LIKE A SALTY BROAD" I know you've dealt with a salty bitch in the past....Almost every man has.

I wasn't trying to disrespect...just give you a different angle from my perspective...Of course that is just that.."MY PERSPECTIVE" and it means absolutly shit! So really it shouldn't bother you much, but I know you probably took it the wrong way.

I'm not trying to be a middle man, but did want to get the name calling and all that garbage scratched but I know how "NUT HUGGERS" can get! This is ESB after all....but to be completely honest it seemed as if this was battle between a PAC nuthugger against a JMM Nuthugger.

"Cornballish" or not.... perception IS Reality in most cases.

Perception is in most cases reality, and my perception is that if your posting to me about all name calling, but at the same time doing your own naming calling towards me you're trying to be slick. Now I haven't said shit about except that I think that was pretty corny. I told you the whole deal w/him, and you still try and sneak your corny shit in.

I don't think I took it the wrong way at all because you didn't come off like a middle man, or someone trying to defuse a situation. That's done w/out the BULLSHIT side comments! You haven't yet made that attempt. You're not slick at all, but it's all good. I don't veiw you like I do domngo or Jhonco or whatever his name is so I won't stoop to trying to sneak little sly comments in like you! That perception in most cases is reality is another slick one!! That was pretty corny and still is!!

[charlievint]

Perception is in most cases reality, and my perception is that if your posting to me about all name calling, but at the same time doing your own naming calling towards me you're trying to be slick. Now I haven't said shit about except that I think that was pretty corny. I told you the whole deal w/him, and you still try and sneak your corny shit in.

I don't think I took it the wrong way at all because you didn't come off like a middle man, or someone trying to defuse a situation. That's done w/out the BULLSHIT side comments! You haven't yet made that attempt. You're not slick at all, but it's all good. I don't veiw you like I do domngo or Jhonco or whatever his name is so I won't stoop to trying to sneak little sly comments in like you! That perception in most cases is reality is another slick one!! That was pretty corny and still is!!

Nah my man.....I'm not trying to be slick! No need for that. I simply stated that you were ACTING like a salty broad. I have no idea if you are in fact a female, salty or both. But I was only projecting my thoughts.

I heard your deal about the other poster and understand, but be that as it may, your response seemed a bit emotionally attached for some reason. Usually responses like yours comes in relatiation. I didn't see a direct insult casted your way, but you then explained to me that you were just fed up with the "Nutthugitry" ...:roll: if that's a word!

What you considered "Corny" or a BS Side comments is why you took my comments as you did. I understand that, but I wasn't trying to throw you a curve ball and be slick with my statment. What was said came from how I felt at the time after reading your post.

Middle man??? Nah, just putting my 2 cents in as everyone does on a message board. Did I want to difuse the situation?? Yes! I thought it was a bit overboard and off topic.

How I went about difusing the situation can be debated on if it was right or wrong, but I honestly don't think it was that serious, but obviously it stung you a bit....In which I say..."My Bad Homie":D

I have no problems with your POV about my comments being corny! Hey...eveyone has an opinion right? Afterall my intial reaction after reading your post was that I dealing with a Cornball. All preception right? lol....You're alright by me BIG. And I wasn't calling you a cornball.

[Biggame]

Nah my man.....I'm not trying to be slick! No need for that. I simply stated that you were ACTING like a salty broad. I have no idea if you are in fact a female, salty or both. But I was only projecting my thoughts.

I heard your deal about the other poster and understand, but be that as it may, your response seemed a bit emotionally attached for some reason. Usually responses like yours comes in relatiation. I didn't see a direct insult casted your way, but you then explained to me that you were just fed up with the "Nutthugitry" ...:roll: if that's a word!

What you considered "Corny" or a BS Side comments is why you took my comments as you did. I understand that, but I wasn't trying to throw you a curve ball and be slick with my statment. What was said came from how I felt at the time after reading your post.

Middle man??? Nah, just putting my 2 cents in as everyone does on a message board. Did I want to difuse the situation?? Yes! I thought it was a bit overboard and off topic.

How I went about difusing the situation can be debated on if it was right or wrong, but I honestly don't think it was that serious, but obviously it stung you a bit....In which I say..."My Bad Homie":D

I have no problems with your POV about my comments being corny! Hey...eveyone has an opinion right? Afterall my intial reaction after reading your post was that I dealing with a Cornball. All preception right? lol....You're alright by me BIG. And I wasn't calling you a cornball.

Like I said before, that's how I deal w/him, and the other Nuhugger. No emotions at all. That's just the way I come at them individually!!

You I have no problem with, and wouldn't come at you like that, nor would I use your choice of words to try and defuse a situation. You're cool in my book whether we agree on things or not,.. I just didn't appreciate that style or approach! You say you weren't trying to throw a curve ball at me or trying to be slick and hey... I can accept that!

[charlievint]

Like I said before, that's how I deal w/him, and the other Nuhugger. No emotions at all. That's just the way I come at them individually!!

You I have no problem with, and wouldn't come at you like that, nor would I use your choice of words to try and defuse a situation. You're cool in my book whether we agree on things or not,.. I just didn't appreciate that style or approach! You say you weren't trying to throw a curve ball at me or trying to be slick and hey... I can accept that!

I'm cool with that and I know I'm a bit abbrasive....that's my style! One thing you do know is boxing....whether we agree or not. That I can respect!

[Biggame]

I'm cool with that and I know I'm a bit abbrasive....that's my style! One thing you do know is boxing....whether we agree or not. That I can respect!

As do you, and that's what I respect about you!!!:good