Would Pac be an ATG if retires after....

[ko factor]

Beating Barrera, Marquez, whoever wins between Soto vs. Guzman, Valero & Juan Diaz?

[jecxbox]

I think Pac is definitely going down as one of the most ruthless little demons at those lower weight classes...And he still has some more in the tank to go even farther into the history books. I still can't find a reason why Pac isn't lb 4 lb number 1 and Floyd is.

[compukiller]

Beating Barrera, Marquez, whoever wins between Soto vs. Guzman, Valero & Juan Diaz?

That would be truly amazing, and yes he would be an ATG.

[compukiller]

NO, not top 15, top 50 for sure, probably higher, in the 30's somewhere, but top 15 for beating Diaz? I don't think so.

It would have more meaning if Diaz beat Julio Diaz and Joel Casamayor before facing PAC.

[kg0208]

He would be a top 50 ATG if he did that.

[ko factor]

But can he beat all of those fighters mentioned w/o losing one fight to any one of them?

[Thread Stealer]

Beating Barrera, Marquez, whoever wins between Soto vs. Guzman, Valero & Juan Diaz?

Yes

[ko factor]

You're kidding right?:?I mean he could but it would be a monumental task to achieve.:hey

[kg0208]

Youre insane...MAB is already top 50...but anyway whether you like it or not thats how he'll place...

I swear beating MAB will put him in top 50 now
Because MAB is not top 50. When Ring did there Top 80 only 5 years ago, Barrera was not even on it. Neither was Morales. The guys ahead of them that have done more than them, such as Ricardo Lopez and Oscar De La Hoya, who were in the 70's.

So you may place Pacman in the top 25, but I don't think anyone else besides his fans will place him that high.

[tays001]

he aready is an atg at 126

[kg0208]

he aready is an atg at 126

Not sure about that. One win over MAB and a draw vs JMM...he also didn't win a title there. Just stating the facts. That are ALOT of great FW.

[kg0208]

He meant number 126 in the list of GOAT:rofl :rofl :rofl

:deal:fire

[Thread Stealer]

he aready is an atg at 126

No he's not.

[tays001]

i meant over all he's done enough to be an ATG with all his wins and the way he's gotten thoughs wins he's an atg no doubt

[psychopath]

Beating Barrera, Marquez, whoever wins between Soto vs. Guzman, Valero & Juan Diaz?

If he does beat all those names up there . . . he'll most probably be an ATG.

[brooklyn1550]

He would be top 40 in my opinion - maybe top 35

[theunderdog]

well, it all depends on what those opponents will do while waiting for a match with pac. if guzman takes on katsidis and beats him then get beaten by pac, that will be big or if soto beats jmm and pac beats them both. or something like that. and valero should fight a true contender at 130 before there will be anything to gain in defeating him

if pac beats valero now, people will just say that valero was one dimensional to begin with and was just fighting tomato cans.

[etong_08]

I guess he's already one of the all time greats, though I still think a fight with Guzman and JMM will still be two tough matches in order for him to seal his legacy. ;)

[pejevan]

Only time can tell. How many people thought that Duran is an ATG after SRL-Duran 2 debacle? None. Yet look at where he is ranked now. Many are putting him ahead of SRL. History has a habit of looking things in a different perspective. I am sure that ODLH will be considered an ATG despite always failing to win when the opposition is grade A.

Maybe, years after Mp retires, his victories over MAB, EM, and probably JMM (a draw courtesy of the idiotic judge) would be given more credit than what many pundits gives him today when the three mexicans will be in the HOF.

[PacDbest]

Only time can tell. How many people thought that Duran is an ATG after SRL-Duran 2 debacle? None. Yet look at where he is ranked now. Many are putting him ahead of SRL. History has a habit of looking things in a different perspective. I am sure that ODLH will be considered an ATG despite always failing to win when the opposition is grade A.

Maybe, years after Mp retires, his victories over MAB, EM, and probably JMM (a draw courtesy of the idiotic judge) would be given more credit than what many pundits gives him today when the three mexicans will be in the HOF.

That's true. If DLH & Leonard will be there on the top 25s Then Pac defenitely belongs in their league. Maybe higher once he achieve to win those mentioned Titles from 130-135. The WOW KO factor of every Pac wins also Counts more than DLH & SRL close & Favorable DEsicion wins against Elite fighters. years After Pac retires & we reminice How Greats He is & How we miss his fights, You guys will look it differently from now.

[PacDbest]

Only time can tell. How many people thought that Duran is an ATG after SRL-Duran 2 debacle? None. Yet look at where he is ranked now. Many are putting him ahead of SRL. History has a habit of looking things in a different perspective. I am sure that ODLH will be considered an ATG despite always failing to win when the opposition is grade A.

Maybe, years after Mp retires, his victories over MAB, EM, and probably JMM (a draw courtesy of the idiotic judge) would be given more credit than what many pundits gives him today when the three mexicans will be in the HOF.

That's true. If DLH & Leonard will be there on the top 25s Then Pac defenitely belongs in their league. Maybe higher once he achieve to win those mentioned Titles from 130-135. The WOW KO factor of every Pac wins also Counts more than DLH & SRL close & Favorable DEsicion wins against Elite fighters. years After Pac retires & we reminice How Greats He is & How we miss his fights, You guys will look it differently from now.

[mad_takamura]

300% sure! :good :good :good

[PacDbest]

Pac already a Lineal title Holder at 112 & 126. If he beat Diaz/Casamayor winner, He'll be in the league of Henry Armstrong, winning 3 Original lineal weight class titles. Pac will definitely top 10 ATG if he Dominates at 130-135.

[hooligan]

if he beats floyd, cotto and calzaghe will he be NUMBER ONE ATG???

[koko of phil]

We still don't know, It's too early to say ATG for Pac. Even if he fights Marquez, Soto, Guzman, Valero or whoever in the near future, I know there would still be more bullshit or excuses coming from haters or critics if Pac beats them all. It's just depends on how Pacquiao could put color on his career, let's just wait and see.

[PacDbest]

We still don't know, It's too early to say ATG for Pac. Even if he fights Marquez, Soto, Guzman, Valero or whoever in the near future, I know there would still be more bullshit or excuses coming from haters or critics if Pac beats them all. It's just depends on how Pacquiao could put color on his career, let's just wait and see.

The Haters & Critics here in ESB are not the one who will put Pac in that Pedestal. It will be the Boxing writers, Media, HOF members & Fighters themselves are the ones who will vote for Pac in ATgreatness. we knew they all love Pac. Even the Arrogant Bastard & self Proclaimed #1 Greatest of all time Floyd Mayweather, who did not give Props to SRR & Ali was a Fan of Pacquiao. You can see him jumping for Joy when Pac Koed Morales the 1st time.

[retriever]

yes. top 40

[ko factor]

I think he can beat those guys, & after he does that & retire....definitely there is no doubt he will be an ATG.... & then we can debate again where to place him all time.:good

[Amsterdam]

Because MAB is not top 50. When Ring did there Top 80 only 5 years ago, Barrera was not even on it. Neither was Morales. The guys ahead of them that have done more than them, such as Ricardo Lopez and Oscar De La Hoya, who were in the 70's.

So you may place Pacman in the top 25, but I don't think anyone else besides his fans will place him that high.

DLH over Barrera would be an awful theory. The Ring is trash these days.

Lopez over Barrera is fair, but even then he never had Barrera's opposition.

[reed_man02]

But can he beat all of those fighters mentioned w/o losing one fight to any one of them?

No way, especially Diaz, who I see destroying pacman. He can beat all those fighters including diaz, but the odds are against him. I think Soto, JMM, and Guzman all have a 50/50 chance at beating him. This is what pac fans dont understand, he can lose. There are a lot of variables to consider and seeing as how pacman isnt as dedicated to boxing as he used to be, I think there is a great chance he loses one of his next to fights if those fights are agasint any of the before mentioned fighters.

[reed_man02]

Of course, they have a chance. Even lowly rated Juarez has a chance to beat Marquez. Penaloza was dismissed as an aging fighter but knocked out and dethroned Gonzales that surprised many fans. If you are taking about chances of beating any fighter, everyone has a chance.

With regard to Pac, he has greater chances of beating them, Barrera most especially.

50/50 with JMM, Soto, and Guzman. Diaz destroyes him.:deal

[tays001]

Pac already a Lineal title Holder at 112 & 126. If he beat Diaz/Casamayor winner, He'll be in the league of Henry Armstrong, winning 3 Original lineal weight class titles. Pac will definitely top 10 ATG if he Dominates at 130-135.

no he won't Armstrong held on lineal title an the same time and defened:good

[tays001]

man, you do know a little:good
:rofl :rofl :D

[tays001]

I tell you all these Diazes can be had by PAC...If I were to be afraid for PAC against someone at 135..Its Cassamayor

:happy :happy :happy

[nighthunter]

I guess he's already one of the all time greats, though I still think a fight with Guzman and JMM will still be two tough matches in order for him to seal his legacy. ;)
:good
very well said :happy :happy :happy :happy

[Imperial1]

Even if this fight wasn't taking place I think he is an atg !Considering where he started and where he is now ..