Tiny wee Holyfield-Tyson story I read, but kind of interesting I think

[McGrain]

The pair were in try outs for the 1984 Olympic team, different weights, so no rivalry, in fact the story goes that the two formed a bond. Tyson would later deny this, however, saying that they "just hung out one evening". Holyfield is sketchy on the details, too, but he says that Tyson, like Evander himself, was a bit of a loner within the group, they were both outcasts. Tyson for the same reasons he was always an outcast, the confused identity, the shyness, the lisp, and Holyfield supposedly due to his country origins, they say that was his nickname, "Country".

Holyfield: "They were cruel to Tyson. But he was just a kid that worked harder than everybody else. He just wanted to talk to somebody. He always listened to what I said."

So the little story is this. The two were put together in sparring, Holyfield older but smaller. The two really got into it and a coach had to step in before two rounds was sung. Later in the week the two were in the rec room, Tyson playing pool, Holyfield waiting his turn. He lost, but refused to take his seat, and began to re-rack them. Immediatly Holyfield jumped up. "It's my turn." The two squared off for 2-10 seconds. It was Tyson who stepped outside for some fresh air, whilst Evander played pool.

Not earth-shattering, but I hadn't heard it before. Just thought I would pass it on. Sometimes little things like this matter in fights. I wonder if Mike remembered Evander's fearlessness in Vegas all those years later?


This was supposed to have happened in a training camp in Colorado Springs, by the way.

[CottoDaBodykill]

very cool story man thanks

[lefthook31]

Holyfield told this story to anyone who would listen before the first fight, he wanted it to get back to Tyson. Psychological warfare.

[turpinr]

Holyfield told this story to anyone who would listen before the first fight, he wanted it to get back to Tyson. Psychological warfare.

it worked then

[Rico Spadafora]

The pair were in try outs for the 1984 Olympic team, different weights, so no rivalry, in fact the story goes that the two formed a bond. Tyson would later deny this, however, saying that they "just hung out one evening". Holyfield is sketchy on the details, too, but he says that Tyson, like Evander himself, was a bit of a loner within the group, they were both outcasts. Tyson for the same reasons he was always an outcast, the confused identity, the shyness, the lisp, and Holyfield supposedly due to his country origins, they say that was his nickname, "Country".

Holyfield: "They were cruel to Tyson. But he was just a kid that worked harder than everybody else. He just wanted to talk to somebody. He always listened to what I said."

So the little story is this. The two were put together in sparring, Holyfield older but smaller. The two really got into it and a coach had to step in before two rounds was sung. Later in the week the two were in the rec room, Tyson playing pool, Holyfield waiting his turn. He lost, but refused to take his seat, and began to re-rack them. Immediatly Holyfield jumped up. "It's my turn." The two squared off for 2-10 seconds. It was Tyson who stepped outside for some fresh air, whilst Evander played pool.

Not earth-shattering, but I hadn't heard it before. Just thought I would pass it on. Sometimes little things like this matter in fights. I wonder if Mike remembered Evander's fearlessness in Vegas all those years later?


This was supposed to have happened in a training camp in Colorado Springs, by the way.

This story is true. I went to High School with Evander's nephews and he would come and give a 'motivational' type speech every year and he told this story.

Before that he came and spoke to us when we were in Middle School this was about 1993 when Tyson was still in prison. Someone asked him "will you ever fight Mike Tyson?"

Evander looked at us and told us not only would he fight Mike Tyson but he would knock him out. He went into the whole thing about Tyson being a bully and when you punched or pushed him back he folded etc. I don't think one person there believed him besides his nephew Henry. Remember, this was still when Buster Douglas was his only loss and it was considered a fluke and Tyson was still basically considered to be unstoppable.

Fast forward about 3 years to 1996 and I remember sitting there watching the first Holyfield vs Tyson fight in shock as Evander pretty much won every round but 2 or 3 until the stoppage. It was almost surreal in a way.

[McGrain]

They say Holyfield has a near obsession with bullies.

[Rico Spadafora]

They say Holyfield has a near obsession with bullies.


He really made it a point to say that he thought Tyson was nothing but a bully and was in reality mentally weak. When Evander said he was not scared of Tyson he really meant it. By the second fight Mike would not even look Evander in the eye at press conferences and at the staredown before the fight it was the only time I have ever seen Tyson not look at his opponent in the eye he looked off to the side a little. We all know what happened after that.

[Primadonna Kool]

Yes i have heard of this..

Evander Holyfield said that Mike Tyson, was bullied.

[My dinner with Conteh]

Good story. What probably really happened is that Evander said "it's my turn" and Tyson said "shit, sorry mate. I didn't realise it was 'name your pocket on the black'".

[lefthook31]

He really made it a point to say that he thought Tyson was nothing but a bully and was in reality mentally weak. When Evander said he was not scared of Tyson he really meant it. By the second fight Mike would not even look Evander in the eye at press conferences and at the staredown before the fight it was the only time I have ever seen Tyson not look at his opponent in the eye he looked off to the side a little. We all know what happened after that.
Tyson actually was doing well in the second fight. He rocked Holyfield in the 3rd round, but he was already cut on both eyes. Would have been interesting to see if Tyson could have beaten Evander had he hung in there, he seemed quicker and more focused with Giachetti back in his corner. The first fight was a lot of holding and grappling, and I remember Evander coming back to his corner in the late rounds and he had this look on his face like he was totally spent. Tommy Brooks told him "go to the well baby you got this", it was an awesome point that seemed to get through to Evander. Brooks always had a great way with his words.

[SuzieQ49]

Ive read this story in the book "punch lines" by mitch berger. Nice story and all, but lets be realistic.....had a prime holyfield fought a 1986-1988 version of Mike Tyson he would have been knocked out inside of 5 rounds, he simply loved to brawl too much. Tyson may have been a bully back in 86-88, but he was a CONTROLLED bully who was kept clean and focused by good influence around him, and i have no doubt a match between him and holyfield prime for prime would have never got to the point where you would need to test your will, because holy would already be knocked out.

[Rico Spadafora]

Ive read this story in the book "punch lines" by mitch berger. Nice story and all, but lets be realistic.....had a prime holyfield fought a 1986-1988 version of Mike Tyson he would have been knocked out inside of 5 rounds, he simply loved to brawl too much. Tyson may have been a bully back in 86-88, but he was a CONTROLLED bully who was kept clean and focused by good influence around him, and i have no doubt a match between him and holyfield prime for prime would have never got to the point where you would need to test your will, because holy would already be knocked out.


Hoilyfield has too good of a Chin for that.

Mike Tyson would NEVER beat Evander Holyfield. Ever. Evander had his number, was not scared or intimidated by Tyson etc.

Tyson was mentally fragile and it was his downfall when things were not going his way in a fight.

[lefthook31]

Hoilyfield has too good of a Chin for that.

Mike Tyson would NEVER beat Evander Holyfield. Ever. Evander had his number, was not scared or intimidated by Tyson etc.

Tyson was mentally fragile and it was his downfall when things were not going his way in a fight.

I agree with Suzie Q. Based on what guys like Cooper and Bowe were able to do once they were in a slug match with Holy, I think Holy would have had his hands full with a prime Tyson. I dont buy this bull that Holy had his number. Maybe the fight in 90 Holyfield would have been more competitive but a prime Tyson is probably too much for a younger lighter not smart fighting, Holy.
Holy was an incredibly accurate puncher though, and thats why it looked so one sided against the less defensive minded Tyson of 96-on.

[Russell]

Interesting story, thanks.

[OBCboxer]

Great story.

Prime for Prime Tyson beats Holyfield. Like Suzie Q said, he likes to brawl. Holyfield's chin might be great but any chin can be broken and Tyson would be the man to do it. Look what Cooper did to Evander.

[Blacc Jesus]

This story is true. I went to High School with Evander's nephews and he would come and give a 'motivational' type speech every year and he told this story.

Before that he came and spoke to us when we were in Middle School this was about 1993 when Tyson was still in prison. Someone asked him "will you ever fight Mike Tyson?"

Evander looked at us and told us not only would he fight Mike Tyson but he would knock him out. He went into the whole thing about Tyson being a bully and when you punched or pushed him back he folded etc. I don't think one person there believed him besides his nephew Henry. Remember, this was still when Buster Douglas was his only loss and it was considered a fluke and Tyson was still basically considered to be unstoppable.

Fast forward about 3 years to 1996 and I remember sitting there watching the first Holyfield vs Tyson fight in shock as Evander pretty much won every round but 2 or 3 until the stoppage. It was almost surreal in a way.
What school?

[Rico Spadafora]

What school?

Sandy Creek High School. It is in South Atlanta in Fayette County. Evander's nephews Henry (who was my age) and Reiko went there as did Marvin Hagler's son Champ and his daughter who was my brothers age but I can't remember her name.

Reiko used to walk Holyfield into the ring he was a big tall guy that wore a derby hat most of the time and a suit you can't miss him.

[Blacc Jesus]

Thought so. Some of my cousins that went to Fayette County were friends with his kids.

[Bill Butcher]

The pair were in try outs for the 1984 Olympic team, different weights, so no rivalry, in fact the story goes that the two formed a bond. Tyson would later deny this, however, saying that they "just hung out one evening". Holyfield is sketchy on the details, too, but he says that Tyson, like Evander himself, was a bit of a loner within the group, they were both outcasts. Tyson for the same reasons he was always an outcast, the confused identity, the shyness, the lisp, and Holyfield supposedly due to his country origins, they say that was his nickname, "Country".

Holyfield: "They were cruel to Tyson. But he was just a kid that worked harder than everybody else. He just wanted to talk to somebody. He always listened to what I said."

So the little story is this. The two were put together in sparring, Holyfield older but smaller. The two really got into it and a coach had to step in before two rounds was sung. Later in the week the two were in the rec room, Tyson playing pool, Holyfield waiting his turn. He lost, but refused to take his seat, and began to re-rack them. Immediatly Holyfield jumped up. "It's my turn." The two squared off for 2-10 seconds. It was Tyson who stepped outside for some fresh air, whilst Evander played pool.

Not earth-shattering, but I hadn't heard it before. Just thought I would pass it on. Sometimes little things like this matter in fights. I wonder if Mike remembered Evander's fearlessness in Vegas all those years later?


This was supposed to have happened in a training camp in Colorado Springs, by the way.

Good story, I doubt Tyson thought much about that tho, it was ring rust that caused that loss.

Mike would win pre 90s.

[McGrain]

Ive read this story in the book "punch lines" by mitch berger. Nice story and all, but lets be realistic.....had a prime holyfield fought a 1986-1988 version of Mike Tyson he would have been knocked out inside of 5 rounds, he simply loved to brawl too much. Tyson may have been a bully back in 86-88, but he was a CONTROLLED bully who was kept clean and focused by good influence around him, and i have no doubt a match between him and holyfield prime for prime would have never got to the point where you would need to test your will, because holy would already be knocked out.

I think prime Holyfield would outbrawl any version of mike Tyson.

I also think that Holyfield was further removed from his prime than Tyson was for their fight.

[Primadonna Kool]

He really made it a point to say that he thought Tyson was nothing but a bully and was in reality mentally weak. When Evander said he was not scared of Tyson he really meant it. By the second fight Mike would not even look Evander in the eye at press conferences and at the staredown before the fight it was the only time I have ever seen Tyson not look at his opponent in the eye he looked off to the side a little. We all know what happened after that.

vbMjgDVwTV0

Mike Tyson respected Evander Holyfield big time, you can tell by the way. He did'nt want to stare down Evander Holyfield in the rematch...............

[Bill Butcher]

Hoilyfield has too good of a Chin for that.

Mike Tyson would NEVER beat Evander Holyfield. Ever. Evander had his number, was not scared or intimidated by Tyson etc.

Tyson was mentally fragile and it was his downfall when things were not going his way in a fight.

Tyson wasnt ALWAYS mentally weak, when his life was good & things were going smooth & he was training right, he was awesome.
Things happened in life later on that took his edge & then bit by bit he faded.

Was he as strong minded as say an Ali... probably not, but you can bet that in his prime he was at peace enough with himself to have come thru the war type battles vs guys like Holyfield, no doubt.

Different times = different man.

80s Tyson >>> 90s Tyson - both physically & mentally.

[Primadonna Kool]

Tyson wasnt ALWAYS mentally weak, when his life was good & things were going smooth & he was training right, he was awesome.
Things happened in life later on that took his edge & then bit by bit he faded.

Was he as strong minded as say an Ali... probably not, but you can bet that in his prime he was at peace enough with himself to have come thru the war type battles vs guys like Holyfield, no doubt.

Different times = different man.

80s Tyson >>> 90s Tyson - both physically & mentally.

Was Tyson really that weak..?

Against Buster Douglas he kept coming all night, even when he was taking a real bad bad beating.

But after the Lennox Lewis fight, he was really weak and a different person.

The medication and life, did that to him.

[Rico Spadafora]

Tyson wasnt ALWAYS mentally weak, when his life was good & things were going smooth & he was training right, he was awesome.
Things happened in life later on that took his edge & then bit by bit he faded.

Was he as strong minded as say an Ali... probably not, but you can bet that in his prime he was at peace enough with himself to have come thru the war type battles vs guys like Holyfield, no doubt.

Different times = different man.

80s Tyson >>> 90s Tyson - both physically & mentally.

Who on earth did 80's Tyson beat that makes you think he would beat Holyfield? Old Holmes? Spinks?

Mike came around at the right time his era was very weak.

I don't buy into this whole Tyson was unbeatable BS he struggled with guys that were not near as good as Holyfield. Hell Tillis had him frustrated and so did Smith and a few others.

[MagnaNasakki]

Who on earth did 80's Tyson beat that makes you think he would beat Holyfield? Old Holmes? Spinks?

Mike came around at the right time his era was very weak.

I don't buy into this whole Tyson was unbeatable BS he struggled with guys that were not near as good as Holyfield. Hell Tillis had him frustrated and so did Smith and a few others.

I tend to agree. Tyson had a great prime, but the mediocre fighters who pushed him to his limit are performances of his that are often ignored.

[lefthook31]

Who on earth did 80's Tyson beat that makes you think he would beat Holyfield? Old Holmes? Spinks?

Mike came around at the right time his era was very weak.

I don't buy into this whole Tyson was unbeatable BS he struggled with guys that were not near as good as Holyfield. Hell Tillis had him frustrated and so did Smith and a few others.
This is crap. Struggled is a strong word for those fights. You cant demolish everyone, and yes the fact that he did to Holmes and Spinks what noone else was able to do including Holy, says a lot for Tyson. Tyson beat a lot of really solid fighters, maybe didnt have the all time great in his prime to compete against, but overall his prime era was pretty strong, and Tyson didnt just beat guys, he blew them out in spectacular fashion.

[Muchmoore]

I tend to agree. Tyson had a great prime, but the mediocre fighters who pushed him to his limit are performances of his that are often ignored.

What mediocre fighters pushed him to the limit :lol:?

Winning shut outs is not getting pushed to the limit.

[Silver]

agree with some of u guys. all that bully stuff isnt exaclty accurate. tyson lost to holyfield becasue holyfield was a more skilled fighter and had a better gameplan. he outmaneuverd and out thought a head hunting tyson . a prime, skilled tyson had what it took to ko holyfield

[OBCboxer]

Who on earth did 80's Tyson beat that makes you think he would beat Holyfield? Old Holmes? Spinks?

Mike came around at the right time his era was very weak.

I don't buy into this whole Tyson was unbeatable BS he struggled with guys that were not near as good as Holyfield. Hell Tillis had him frustrated and so did Smith and a few others.

Tillis and Smith didn't frustrate him. He shut them out because they weren't trying to win, they were looking to survive and literally hold on.

[AnthonyJ74]

Tillis and Smith didn't frustrate him. He shut them out because they weren't trying to win, they were looking to survive and literally hold on.

Yeah, just like Larry Holmes did to Evander Holyfield in their fight.

[My dinner with Conteh]

I think prime Holyfield would outbrawl any version of mike Tyson.

I also think that Holyfield was further removed from his prime than Tyson was for their fight.


The past-prime version has more chance of beating Tyson for me, the 1990 model was too gung-ho, willing to trade and easy to hit. The 96 version, boxed sensibly and held when necessary, stifling his attack, peak Holy wouldn't do that, and it could spell doom. Mentally he was more ready than ever when they finally fought.

[SuzieQ49]

Mike came around at the right time his era was very weak.

.

Pinklon Thomas Tony Tubbs Trevor Berbick Razor Ruddock Michael Spinks Tony Tucker Larry Holmes carl williams frank bruno ....Weak? ARE U KIDDING ME? these guys were the most talented most powerful big men of all time

he struggled with guys that were not near as good as Holyfield

What? Tyson dominated Ring Magazine top 10 more convinsingly and cleanly than ANY other champion in history....I mean NO ONE gave him a close fight. Hell he was hardly even HIT cleanly at all in most of his fights. Tyson knocked out top rated Alpha Champs/former champs that had NEVER been down or stopped before



Holyfield on the otherhand, struggled more with his competition than any champion i have ever seen. Alex Stewart who lasted 1 round vs tyson, took holyfield 12 hard rounds...44 year old larry holmes made holy look very bad, younger holmes knocked out cold by tyson.....42 year old foreman hurt holyfield and went the distance winning rounds, late double substititute journeyman bert cooper nearly knocked the fuck out of holyfield, HOW EMBARRASING.....and Aging Michael Dokes gave holyfield hell....not to mention he lost his title to a former lightheavyweight who would be knocked out by a 45 year old man.

[SuzieQ49]

Mcgrain,


Holyfield could not outbrawl double substitute bert cooper, riddick bowe, and struggled to outbrawl aging michael dokes.....no way will he be able to slug it out with a prime mike tyson who actually worked combinations to the head and body....and no way could evander take mikes shots...no one could take mikes shots mike had the finishing ability to kayo anyone in history....

as for evander being more past his prime, thats laughable. were comparing a world class fighter who fought at the top level the past 4 years vs a man who did nothing but rot in prison cell for 4 years and not only get more mentally screwed up but get horribly rusty and lose something physically too.

[ChrisPontius]

as for evander being more past his prime, thats laughable. were comparing a world class fighter who fought at the top level the past 4 years vs a man who did nothing but rot in prison cell for 4 years and not only get more mentally screwed up but get horribly rusty and lose something physically too.

Holyfield was 34 and had been in a lot of wars. His recent showings against Bowe III, Moorer and Zcyc all had "Tyson by KO" written all over them. In hindsight it was more of a temporary setback, and i agreed with MDWC that Holyfield was a wiser fighter when he got to Tyson. Still, there's a reason they made him the 26 to 1 underdog, and even in the rematch he was slighty the underdog, 8 to 5 or so.

I think Tyson looks very sharp against Holyfield, in fact much sharper and faster than he did against Douglas .... he was more active too - and this a fact - roughly 20 punches a round vs Douglas where he threw 38 per round against Holyfield.

[McGrain]

The past-prime version has more chance of beating Tyson for me, the 1990 model was too gung-ho, willing to trade and easy to hit. The 96 version, boxed sensibly and held when necessary, stifling his attack, peak Holy wouldn't do that, and it could spell doom. Mentally he was more ready than ever when they finally fought.

Interesting stuff.

[McGrain]

Mcgrain,


Holyfield could not outbrawl double substitute bert cooper, riddick bowe, and struggled to outbrawl aging michael dokes.....no way will he be able to slug it out with a prime mike tyson who actually worked combinations to the head and body....and no way could evander take mikes shots...no one could take mikes shots mike had the finishing ability to kayo anyone in history....

Tyson crumpled in part because Holyfield could take his punches and continue coming. I don't see an early KO, and I don't see the mental impact of this fact being any different. Holyfield was able to man-handle Tyson. I don't see this being any different, and I don't see the tactical impact/mental impact of this fact being any different

You're talking about his brawling with againg Dokes and with Bowe. Why? I have footage of him out-brawling Mike Tyson. Certainly a better fighter than an ageing Dokes.

Holyfield always felt he had the beating of Tyson. He had been noting tactical details about him for years, including how to time his left hook. He was absolutley convinced that standing up to him was key to beating him (a cliche with a kernel of truth, like all cliches). For me, this has the ring of Louis-Schmeling and Tunney-Demsey, the brave tactician plotting to take down a brilliant fighter but one who's plan was a matter of public record before the fact.

as for evander being more past his prime, thats laughable. were comparing a world class fighter who fought at the top level the past 4 years vs a man who did nothing but rot in prison cell for 4 years and not only get more mentally screwed up but get horribly rusty and lose something physically too.

Coming to Tyson, Holyfield had won 2 in 4. One of those victories was over Czyz, and his performance was awful. In his own words he "got overexcited and fought like an amature". According to Atlas in commentary, "he looked almost talentless. I have a lot of wonder about what he didn't do in that fight." (that quote is an aproxomation, i can't remember if it is exactly right).

In short, he looked AWFUL.

Aside from Czyz, he had not stopped anyone in FIVE YEARS. He would stop ONE additional fighter between Tyson and 2002. Holyfield beat Tyson because he owned him tactically and physically, not because he was primed.


You've said that Tyson was a man who had "rotted in prison for for years...was rusty". That's hardly true. In great contrast to Holyfield's horrible form Tyson had knocked out the heavyweight champions of the world, mostly in quick smart time. Belt holders were falling around him like wheat to the blade. He showed MUCH better form than Holyfield. Not better, MUCH better, vastly superior.

[McGrain]

Still, there's a reason they made him the 26 to 1 underdog, and even in the rematch he was slighty the underdog, 8 to 5 or so.


The first fight was the worst weekend in Vegas for any single event up until that point.

Didn't the MGM Grand pass on their remaining Tyson fight and step out of the game all together after II? There is something like that.

[My dinner with Conteh]

The 'best bet to beat peak Tyson' version of Holy i'd say would be 1993, after he learnt from the Bowe defeat that trading with every top heavyweight will eventually spell disaster. He's my man to take on the 1987 version of Mad Mike.

[My dinner with Conteh]

You've said that Tyson was a man who had "rotted in prison for for years...was rusty". That's hardly true. In great contrast to Holyfield's horrible form Tyson had knocked out the heavyweight champions of the world, mostly in quick smart time. Belt holders were falling around him like wheat to the blade. He showed MUCH better form than Holyfield. Not better, MUCH better, vastly superior.


True.

[Flea Man]

The 'best bet to beat peak Tyson' version of Holy i'd say would be 1993, after he learnt from the Bowe defeat that trading with every top heavyweight will eventually spell disaster. He's my man to take on the 1987 version of Mad Mike.

I agree 100%

The Holyfield that fought Bowe the first time was only about 15 stone, and had too much heart for his own good.

I don't see him lasting past two rounds with Kid Dynamite, though he'd certainly fight back until his iron chin and will gave up, which wouldn't be long.

[Primadonna Kool]

I agree 100%

The Holyfield that fought Bowe the first time was only about 15 stone, and had too much heart for his own good.

I don't see him lasting past two rounds with Kid Dynamite, though he'd certainly fight back until his iron chin and will gave up, which wouldn't be long.

Evander Holyfield that fought Riddick Bowe first time was 14 stone 8 POUNDS.