Cuevas & Pintor

[robert ungurean]

Where would these two fit in today at 147 & 118 respectivley.

[Longhhorn71]

I think both would win some form of a title.....Pintor might unify.

[teeto]

Pintor would do very well indeed, very nice operator. Pintor could possibly the best in fact. Cuevas, well he could be beaten by some of today's guys, but he has a chance of stopping the most of them also

[My2Sense]

Pintor would do very well indeed, very nice operator. Pintor could possibly the best in fact. Cuevas, well he could be beaten by some of today's guys, but he has a chance of stopping the most of them also

Pretty much the way I see it.

[la-califa]

Pintor-Rafael Marquez, Israel Vazquez, Juanma, or Darchinyan. would be wars. Cuevas against Margarito, or Paul Williams would be great. Williams would see how Pipino would do against a tall fighter, without the devistating power.

[anarci]

Pintor would do very well indeed, very nice operator. Pintor could possibly the best in fact. Cuevas, well he could be beaten by some of today's guys, but he has a chance of stopping the most of them also I agree that Pintor would be the best Bantam,although this division has become one of boxings best and is going to get better in the near future Hasegawal,Perez,Agbeko,Mares,Montiel,Moreno,Ceremano,Sidorenko and a whole lot of other solid guys not to mention Darchinyan and Nonito moving up soon might be boxings deepest division.
I agree Cuevas would beat some of the best WElters but would also Pick up a loss also. Style wise Mayweather would be the worst opponent for him. Hed ko Cotto,Clottey,Berto though and probably beat Margo. Mosley would probably beat him. A fight with Pac would be very intresting.

[Flea Man]

Pintor-Rafael Marquez, Israel Vazquez, Juanma, or Darchinyan. would be wars. Cuevas against Margarito, or Paul Williams would be great. Williams would see how Pipino would do against a tall fighter, without the devistating power.

Pintor is a class above IMo.

[anarci]

Pintor is a class above IMo. Id take Pintor above Juanama and Darchinyan he would knock out bot of them.

However I dont think he is a class above a prime Vasquez and Marquez. I think a Prime Pintor would be favored but they are in the same league If he had trilogy with either of them he would pick up a loss somewhere in there.

[Flea Man]

Id take Pintor above Juanama and Darchinyan he would knock out bot of them.

However I dont think he is a class above a prime Vasquez and Marquez. I think a Prime Pintor would be favored but they are in the same league If he had trilogy with either of them he would pick up a loss somewhere in there.

Well, 4 lbs north he didn't look as effective. So yeah I see what you mean:good JuanMa just isn't great IMO.

[GPater11093]

Well, 4 lbs north he didn't look as effective. So yeah I see what you mean:good JuanMa just isn't great IMO.

He was still a top class operater at SBW, giving the consensus number 1 at SBW a very rough time indeed.

[Flea Man]

He was still a top class operater at SBW, giving the consensus number 1 at SBW a very rough time indeed.

No doubt. To be fair I feel THAT Pintor would get to both Vaquez and Marquez, who aren't any more defensively inclined than Gomez was in that fight. I just fel his shots had more effect at 118, though bar Gomez I've never seen Pintor at 122, and he gave Gomez an awesome fight (post-Sanchez or not, Gomez was still a beast, in evidence in that fight.)

Over 15 I think Pintor gets to them. Like Marquez he throws his punches very, very accurately. I'm not too much on the Vasquez hype anymore. As great as those fights are (and as good as the two fighters are) I don't think they'd do too well against the 'best' 122lbers ever.

At 118 I see Pintor beating Marquez. At 122 I can see him beating Vasquez, however, comparing him to Gomez isn't fair. Different stylistically, super tough, can bang...........it would be an all-action fight no doubt. Just judging by film however I see Pintor as a cut above.

JuanMa is bloody good, but hasn't yet shown anything other than a Plan A. Pintor isn't going to roll over, and unlike Mtagwa he can find the punch to finish JuanMa off.

[GPater11093]

No doubt. To be fair I feel THAT Pintor would get to both Vaquez and Marquez, who aren't any more defensively inclined than Gomez was in that fight. I just fel his shots had more effect at 118, though bar Gomez I've never seen Pintor at 122, and he gave Gomez an awesome fight (post-Sanchez or not, Gomez was still a beast, in evidence in that fight.)

Over 15 I think Pintor gets to them. Like Marquez he throws his punches very, very accurately. I'm not too much on the Vasquez hype anymore. As great as those fights are (and as good as the two fighters are) I don't think they'd do too well against the 'best' 122lbers ever.

At 118 I see Pintor beating Marquez. At 122 I can see him beating Vasquez, however, comparing him to Gomez isn't fair. Different stylistically, super tough, can bang...........it would be an all-action fight no doubt. Just judging by film however I see Pintor as a cut above.

JuanMa is bloody good, but hasn't yet shown anything other than a Plan A. Pintor isn't going to roll over, and unlike Mtagwa he can find the punch to finish JuanMa off.

Fair enough.

Over 12 i just see Pintor being the class above and winning a good fight from them but if he had an off day I could see an upset for Marquez or Vasquez. Juanma Lopez is not refined enough at the moment and I think Pintor would stop him late.

I do see Pintor reigning supreme at Super Bantam but I think if he fought all the best he would pick up a loss from someone. Also I think Hasegawa would give him a good challenge at Bantamweight.

[Flea Man]

Fair enough.

Over 12 i just see Pintor being the class above and winning a good fight from them but if he had an off day I could see an upset for Marquez or Vasquez. Juanma Lopez is not refined enough at the moment and I think Pintor would stop him late.

I do see Pintor reigning supreme at Super Bantam but I think if he fought all the best he would pick up a loss from someone. Also I think Hasegawa would give him a good challenge at Bantamweight.

yeah, that#'s what I'm saying (I think) :lol:

Hasegawa would yea. However, though I don't recall seeing Pintor in his prime against a southpaw, I could imagine his right hand down the pipe smashing through Hasegawa (who isn't amazingly defensive, though he can move around fairly well) and I believe Pintor to be the sharper puncher.

One thing I will say for Hasegawa is; the way he shifts from awkward southpaw to demonic sharp shooter is awesome to watch. I'd like to see him take on a real good challenge at 118 before he leaves. He has the potential to clean house there and put him alongside the likes of Canizales in the 11-20 bracket.

[The Morlocks]

Where would these two fit in today at 147 & 118 respectivley.
My 2 fav, Mex. fighters back in the day and even now their career sets are great to watch. Cuevas would be a force to be reckoned w/ at anytime and Pintor i think would be champ.:rasta

[The Morlocks]

My 2 fav, Mex. fighters back in the day and even now their career sets are great to watch. Cuevas would be a force to be reckoned w/ at anytime and Pintor i think would be champ.:rasta
Another fav. of mine from that era who was exciting and I got to see live against Arguello was Limon. Most philly guys were for Chandler, but I was Pintor all the way and thought the pride of Caijamalpa would have talen him in 10. :rasta

[anarci]

Fair enough.

Over 12 i just see Pintor being the class above and winning a good fight from them but if he had an off day I could see an upset for Marquez or Vasquez. Juanma Lopez is not refined enough at the moment and I think Pintor would stop him late.

I do see Pintor reigning supreme at Super Bantam but I think if he fought all the best he would pick up a loss from someone. Also I think Hasegawa would give him a good challenge at Bantamweight. You are right about Pintor he was kind of hot and cold at 122. I used to train with Adrian Arreola when i was a teenager and he pulled of a big upset ko over Pintor, then Pintor came back with an impressive win over Meza, then got kod by Payakarun shortly after, But the Pintor that Gave Gomez hell would have whipped anyone at jf of BT today. I agree that Pintor was to inconsistent at 122 to have reigned a long time though

[GPater11093]

You are right about Pintor he was kind of hot and cold at 122. I used to train with Adrian Arreola when i was a teenager and he pulled of a big upset ko over Pintor, then Pintor came back with an impressive win over Meza, then got kod by Payakarun shortly after, But the Pintor that Gave Gomez hell would have whipped anyone at jf of BT today. I agree that Pintor was to inconsistent at 122 to have reigned a long time though

I think he would have been consistent enough to have a good reign as after the top names, it is quite bear but a name like Daniel Ponce De Leon could get a big upset if a rubbish Pintor turned up..

[Mantequilla]

I don't think Pintor had too much left after losing to Gomez.

[anarci]

I don't think Pintor had too much left after losing to Gomez.
He did have a good win over a good fighter in Juan Meza though,after losing to Gomez.

[Boxed Ears]

I just watched the six-part YT upload of Pintor VS Zarate in 79 tonight. If you can give Zarate a fight, you're a potential champ in any era.

[The Morlocks]

I just watched the six-part YT upload of Pintor VS Zarate in 79 tonight. If you can give Zarate a fight, you're a potential champ in any era.
Pintor still detests Zarate. In the book "The Big If" about Johnny Owens, they go all thru Pintor's career and talk to him throughout. It is a great read and terrific for finding out about Pintor's life. But he has no pity whatsoever for Zarate's circumstances now.:viking

[anarci]

Pintor still detests Zarate. In the book "The Big If" about Johnny Owens, they go all thru Pintor's career and talk to him throughout. It is a great read and terrific for finding out about Pintor's life. But he has no pity whatsoever for Zarate's circumstances now.:viking What did Pintor have to say, and what are Zarates circumstances?

[Flea Man]

Anarci, I 2nd that; very interested to hear :good

[The Morlocks]

What did Pintor have to say, and what are Zarates circumstances?
in the book on page 174 it says, "I've heard Zarate is in the street now," Pintor said. "He is into alco. and drugs and that will finish anyone. Being a world champion opens many ddors, some good, many more bad. People talk about you all over the world and it brings money, but you have to know how to deal w/ it. It is a starting point, but it depends on you as to where you go from there. I heard Zarate is dying from hunger. It is sad but he got what was coming to him. Carlos Zarate was a nasty person. There are many sayings in Mexico and one of them is that everyone is the architect of their own destiny. Do I have any sympathy? None whatsoever. If you live badly, you end up badly. If he came here and said,"I'm hungry" , I'd say, "Take whatever you want."If he asks me for a peso, I nwill give it.But I am not going to go out and find himand give him help. I don'y owe him anything.When he was World Champion he had everything. The world was at his fingertips, but he threw it all away. ' Interestingly, in the book it says Pintor never made wait for the Meza fight. He sweated it out and did everything but coulkdn't make weight. So they begged Montoya (meza manager) to let the fight go on for the title, ansd Montoyab did. A great read, by Rick Broadbent published by MacMillen in 2006. In my career dvd set of Piuntor, they show him going to John Owens hometown and Owen's dad (who is now dead2009), coming to Mexico. Great stuff.

[The Morlocks]

Pintor still trains fighters today.