Name the worst champions..

[ricardinho]

Lets see if we can agree which champions simply sucked. I think this will be just as hard as who the atg fighters are.

This if for fun..,

[KOTF]

Luis Santana

[PbP Bacon]

Buster Douglas,

He is the boxing version of "Queen for one Day" .... errhh "Champion for a Night"

Don't get me wrong. I liked Douglas and I was joyful when he defeated Tyson, but it was like his only good fight ever. It sucked that he lost his crown in his first defense and was unable to regain it, or at least to stay as a contender.

So, for me Buster is the example of a champion that sucked

[WhataRock]

Buster Douglas on his best day was not the worst champion ever..he wouldnt even be the worst HW champ ever. He was actually not bad.

He just threw away his title after he beat Tyson by not training and generally just not having the mental strength to deal with being champion.

[TBooze]

A fair Journeyman and test for anyone wanting to be a early/mid 70s Welterweight Contender, but Billy Backus as Welterweight Champion of the World?:oops:

[WhataRock]

Carlos Maussa would probably get my vote..from fighters around today.

[dezbeast]

H2H it would probably be guys like Sullivan, Corbett or Burns. I saw footage of Corbett sparring with someone, and his technique was so primitive it looked just awful.

[GPater11093]

A fair Journeyman and test for anyone wanting to be a early/mid 70s Welterweight Contender, but Billy Backus as Welterweight Champion of the World?:oops:

Billy was a good fighter gave Napoles some trouble before winning on cuts then gave Napoles abit of trouble before losing on cuts.

Like you say a gatekeeper really.

Was the nephew of Basilio and tried to fight like him but southpaw

[teeto]

I don't like this thread, but i can't resist.

Carlos Baldomir,

[WhataRock]

I don't like this thread, but i can't resist.

Carlos Baldomir,


True true...I got nothing against Carlos, he was one tough cookie and I really love fighters who take their talent as far as they possibly can...But man he was average.

[teeto]

You were as nice as you could be there WhataRock

[Boro chris]

Rodolpho Blanco. Beat Dave 'Boy' Mcauley and then barely won another fight for the rest of his career.

[vorapsak2002]

I don't like this thread, but i can't resist.

Carlos Baldomir,

bingo!

[PbP Bacon]

Buster Douglas on his best day was not the worst champion ever..he wouldnt even be the worst HW champ ever. He was actually not bad.

He just threw away his title after he beat Tyson by not training and generally just not having the mental strength to deal with being champion.


I understand your point, and certainly a case can be made that Douglas was not a bad boxer. But I still feel that he sucked because it seems that the Tyson fight was the only time he fully used his tools.

As you said, after the Tyson fight he just gave up, physically and mentally.... and that sucked :nono

[TommyV]

Buster Douglas,

He is the boxing version of "Queen for one Day" .... errhh "Champion for a Night"

Don't get me wrong. I liked Douglas and I was joyful when he defeated Tyson, but it was like his only good fight ever. It sucked that he lost his crown in his first defense and was unable to regain it, or at least to stay as a contender.

So, for me Buster is the example of a champion that sucked

'Buster' Douglas was far from the worst champion of all-time. Not even the worst heavyweight champion. I honestly feel he has one of the most under-rated HW jabs of all-time, he had the tools and when he put them together and mentally he was in the right place, he could produce performances ala Tyson 1990.

H2H it would probably be guys like Sullivan, Corbett or Burns. I saw footage of Corbett sparring with someone, and his technique was so primitive it looked just awful.

Their technique for the time was fine. In fact, Corbett at the time was probably one of the most advanced technical fighters around for his era. How you can names guys like him and Sullivan as the 'worst' champions ever is laughable.

[Mantequilla]

Ivan Calderon.

[dezbeast]

Their technique for the time was fine. In fact, Corbett at the time was probably one of the most advanced technical fighters around for his era.

Their technique being fine for its time does not equate to being fine period. I can't think of one champion I would favor them to beat H2H.

[TommyV]

Their technique being fine for its time does not equate to being fine period. I can't think of one champion I would favor them to beat H2H.

That's because it's different era's, therefore different techniques. You take the physical and mental mindset of a James Corbett and chuck him in this HW era, he learns and develops the proper technique, and he becomes a force if he wasn't so small, though he'd probably be a 6'1" light-heavy nowadays, not a heavy.

[Sweet Pea]

Their technique being fine for its time does not equate to being fine period. I can't think of one champion I would favor them to beat H2H.

I actually agree, but it would be flat out unfair to classify them as the worst boxers, as you can only work with what you have, and that era of fighters were in the experimental and developmental stages of boxing technique. I consider boxing to have begun modernization around the late 20's and throughout the 30's and to have peaked a bit later on, perhaps the 40's is the best decade to use as a general cut-off point. On an era by era basis though, (which is the only way to compare pre and post-modern era fighters IMO) all of the champions you mentioned rate highly.

[Dempsey1238]

Carlos Baldomir was better than 1980's Davy Moore imo.

Baldomir is FAR from the worse champ ever. Hell I put him over L Spinks.

Not saying he is great, or a legend, but he is a good fighter. And should not have the title of worse champ ever. He was a underdog vs both Zab and Gatti, and won both matchs. Yeah we all knew Mayweather would beat him but Baldomir was not that bad of a champ. A great underdog story imo.

[Vantage_West]

i would go with santana as well...while most champs in this list are rough, decent contenders who beat a champ. santana did nothing and still won a title

[Robbi]

Sven Ottke

[janitor]

H2H it would probably be guys like Sullivan, Corbett or Burns. I saw footage of Corbett sparring with someone, and his technique was so primitive it looked just awful.

Dont you believe it.

These guys were phenomena in their day and under that rule set a modern fighter would have virtualy no chance against them.

[Drew101]

Aquilies Guzman
Luis Santana

[Mantequilla]

Carlos Baldomir was better than 1980's Davy Moore imo.

Baldomir is FAR from the worse champ ever. Hell I put him over L Spinks.

Not saying he is great, or a legend, but he is a good fighter. And should not have the title of worse champ ever. He was a underdog vs both Zab and Gatti, and won both matchs. Yeah we all knew Mayweather would beat him but Baldomir was not that bad of a champ. A great underdog story imo.

Don't agree with that at all.The eighties Davey Moore had a helluva lot of offensive talent and power, more than most fighters of comparable experience...beatiful lead right hand and terrific combinations.He was one of the best prospects in boxing at the time.


Had he been given more time improve his defence he could have become a helluva boxer-puncher.Hell, even if Duran hadn't thumbed him or the incompetent corner \ ref had stopped the fight earlier then that could have just been a good learning defeat rather than a brutal beating.

Moore still had some work to do for sure, but i tend to think he's slowly become one of the most underrated fighters of his generation as years have gone by.

[Dempsey1238]

Davey came, won a title in his 8th pro fight, got beat and went off the map.

Carlos is still there at the movement, like his fight with Clottery.

[djanders]

Dont you believe it.

These guys were phenomena in their day and under that rule set a modern fighter would have virtualy no chance against them.

^^^ What he said!

[Mantequilla]

Davey came, won a title in his 8th pro fight, got beat and went off the map.

Carlos is still there at the movement, like his fight with Clottery.

Moore was around for years after the Duran fight, it isn't like Baldomir's not getting whipped or just brought in as an opponenet against the more high profile fighters.

[OLD FOGEY]

Leon Spinks deserves a mention.

So does Al McCoy.

[ricardinho]

What I mean by worst is a champion that went one and done. Like the guy who took the dive after an illegal punch from Roy Jones and then got destroyed cant remember his name right now.

[Sweet Pea]

What I mean by worst is a champion that went one and done. Like the guy who took the dive after an illegal punch from Roy Jones and then got destroyed cant remember his name right now.

Montell Griffin? Not a good choice for the thread, IMO. He was actually quite a skilled boxer, an excellent spoiler type for Jones. Aside from the first Jones fight (which was very close through 7 rounds, as Montell made Roy look worse than he ever had before), he also fought Toney in two close, competitive bouts, though the decisions are disputed.

[My2Sense]

Guys like Douglas, Baldomir, even Al McCoy won their titles with legit wins over well-respected fighters. They shouldn't be the first picks for this list IMO.

Guys like Luis Santana (DQ over Norris) and Julio Cesar Green (gift over Joppy) would be my first picks.

[chelmark17]

calderon...

[hhascup]

Here's some of the Champions with the worse career records:

Eddie Connolly was 25-21-17
Steve (Kid) Sullivan was 30-26-4
Mike Ballerino was 43-37-17
Johnny Jadick was 85-57-8
Saoul Mamby was 45-33-6
Wallace (Bud) Smith was 31-23-6
Joey Archibald was 61-42-5
Ricky Parkey was 22-20
Nico Thomas was 29-23
Manny Melchor was 38-35-6
JB Williamson was 26-16
Leon Spinks was 26-17-3.
Tommy (Spider) Kelly was 5-9-4 by boxrec and 24-11-4 (1 NC) by Ring Record Book.
Frankie Neil was 29-17-5
Monte Attell was 27-29-21 by boxrec and 46-38-21 (1 NC) by Ring Record Book.
Harold Dade was 43-30-6
Eleoncio Mercedes was 14-12-2

Fritzie Zivic had the most losses with 65
Johnny Dundee lost 62 bouts

[spion]

Jermain Taylor isn't making to good a showing of himself.

[My2Sense]

Here's some of the Champions with the worse career records:

Eddie Connolly was 25-21-17
Steve (Kid) Sullivan was 30-26-4
Mike Ballerino was 43-37-17
Johnny Jadick was 85-57-8
Saoul Mamby was 45-33-6
Wallace (Bud) Smith was 31-23-6
Joey Archibald was 61-42-5
Ricky Parkey was 22-20
Nico Thomas was 29-23
Manny Melchor was 38-35-6
JB Williamson was 26-16
Leon Spinks was 26-17-3.
Tommy (Spider) Kelly was 5-9-4 by boxrec and 24-11-4 (1 NC) by Ring Record Book.
Frankie Neil was 29-17-5
Monte Attell was 27-29-21 by boxrec and 46-38-21 (1 NC) by Ring Record Book.
Harold Dade was 43-30-6
Eleoncio Mercedes was 14-12-2

Fritzie Zivic had the most losses with 65
Johnny Dundee lost 62 bouts

Guys like Zivic, Dundee, Mamby, etc. might have the worst records, but they're far from the worst champions.

[WhataRock]

Nico Thomas was pretty piss poor.

[klompton]

Al McCoy and Mike McTigue

[dmt]

neon leon spinks

[JohnThomas1]

Don't agree with that at all.The eighties Davey Moore had a helluva lot of offensive talent and power, more than most fighters of comparable experience...beatiful lead right hand and terrific combinations.He was one of the best prospects in boxing at the time.


Had he been given more time improve his defence he could have become a helluva boxer-puncher.Hell, even if Duran hadn't thumbed him or the incompetent corner \ ref had stopped the fight earlier then that could have just been a good learning defeat rather than a brutal beating.

Moore still had some work to do for sure, but i tend to think he's slowly become one of the most underrated fighters of his generation as years have gone by.

Nicely put. Moore actually beat a few awkward and dangerous fighters.

[WhataRock]

People put a lot of emphasis on the fact Moore had so little experience when he faced Duran.

But I dont see the point in padding up a record to make it look prettier...He had more experience then probably most of the prospects floating around with twice as many fights on their ledger.

He had a stellar Amateur career...Prevented from going to the Olympics only by Don Curry it seems (even though they would end up boycotting it)..Being a Golden gloves champ in New York is more impressive then winning the national title in my country Id say. And this kid did it 4 times in a row.

He had been champ for 18 months and had traveled to fight in Japan, Italy and South Africa since he turned pro.
Beating the very talented Kalule certainly warrants praise.

He probably wasnt ready for Duran..with his style he probably would have never been..But he is a good fighter, who wasnt near as green as people seem to think.

[janitor]

For my money the weakest of all the heavyweight champions was Paddy Ryan.

I think that he would barely have been a second rater in either the previous era or the subsequent era.

When he was matched with John L Sullivan he was lucky not to get himself killed.

[janitor]

Al McCoy and Mike McTigue

I casn understand your choice of McCoy but McTigure has some decent names on his resume.

[My dinner with Conteh]

I think there's just too many contenders if we're talking alphabet champs of the past 25 years or so, from Shinji Takehara to Six Heads Lewis, Michael Bennt to Glenn Catley. If undisputed world champs are just to be considered Backus and Leon Spinks were good choices.

[ricardinho]

Thanks for your comments I thought it would be hard for us to agree.

[EireFightFan]

I casn understand your choice of McCoy but McTigure has some decent names on his resume.


I agree, McTigue earned the title with a victory over Siki who had anihilated Carpentier and also holds a win over Tommy Loughran.

Admittedly he wasn't great but to put him amongst the worst is unfair IMO.

[Beatle]

Jack Sharkey. Look at his fight record on boxrec before you yell at me.

[GPater11093]

Ivan Calderon.

abit outlandish IMO

i think Claderon is a quality operater and a top fighter P4P today.

I actually agree, but it would be flat out unfair to classify them as the worst boxers, as you can only work with what you have, and that era of fighters were in the experimental and developmental stages of boxing technique. I consider boxing to have begun modernization around the late 20's and throughout the 30's and to have peaked a bit later on, perhaps the 40's is the best decade to use as a general cut-off point. On an era by era basis though, (which is the only way to compare pre and post-modern era fighters IMO) all of the champions you mentioned rate highly.

i agree i say boxing as we know it started in the 20s i only rank fighters from the 20s onwards in top 100 lists.

Carlos Baldomir was better than 1980's Davy Moore imo.

Baldomir is FAR from the worse champ ever. Hell I put him over L Spinks.

Not saying he is great, or a legend, but he is a good fighter. And should not have the title of worse champ ever. He was a underdog vs both Zab and Gatti, and won both matchs. Yeah we all knew Mayweather would beat him but Baldomir was not that bad of a champ. A great underdog story imo.

In all fairness he wasnt a world champ he just held a world title.

someone like Leon Spinks was a world champ

Sven Ottke

:good



I think there's just too many contenders if we're talking alphabet champs of the past 25 years or so, from Shinji Takehara to Six Heads Lewis, Michael Bennt to Glenn Catley. If undisputed world champs are just to be considered Backus and Leon Spinks were good choices.

as it should be

[GPater11093]

Jack Sharkey. Look at his fight record on boxrec before you yell at me.

redcords mean jack shit if you dont know about opponents and the fighter himself.

Sharkey was a good fihgt

[kosaros]

Cannot believe Gavin Rees hasn't had a mention yet...

[janitor]

Jack Sharkey. Look at his fight record on boxrec before you yell at me.

Sharkeys record on boxrec tells two stories.

One that he was verry inconsistant but another in that he fought and indeed beat more ranked contenders than just about any other heavyweight champion.

You can't hold his inconsistancy agaionst him without giving him some credit for hios level of opposition.

[GPater11093]

Cannot believe Gavin Rees hasn't had a mention yet...

why hes an ATG in taht deep LWW division

[round15]

John Ruiz.

Everything that was wrong with this guy holding a championship belt, is even worse for the sport now, especially with him pathetically and feebly calling out other heavyweight fighters. He's like a broken record that can't be broken for good. Someone please bust the stereo with this guys tune on it and retire him forever.

John Ruiz is worse than the blackest of black eyes for heavyweight boxing.

[GPater11093]

John Ruiz.

Everything that was wrong with this guy holding a championship belt, is even worse for the sport now, especially with him pathetically and feebly calling out other heavyweight fighters. He's like a broken record that can't be broken for good. Someone please bust the stereo with this guys tune on it and retire him forever.

John Ruiz is worse than the blackest of black eyes for heavyweight boxing.

he holds eveything else

[teeto]

why hes an ATG in taht deep LWW division
Funniest fighter just to sit and watch.........EVER.

[GPater11093]

Funniest fighter just to sit and watch.........EVER.

abit harsh on him he fouhgt good against was it N'Dou for the vacant title that was his only half decent perforamce

he looks odd aswell he looks like a tattie

[teeto]

abit harsh on him he fouhgt good against was it N'Dou for the vacant title that was his only half decent perforamce

he looks odd aswell he looks like a tattie
Haha, i don't mean that in any disrespectful way towards his boxing ability, i mean i genuinely just finf him funny to watch fighting (call me strange), and i mean the N'Dou fight, i was just laughing my ass off at him running in getting shots off and getting back out, what a legend, credit to him.

[GPater11093]

Haha, i don't mean that in any disrespectful way towards his boxing ability, i mean i genuinely just finf him funny to watch fighting (call me strange), and i mean the N'Dou fight, i was just laughing my ass off at him running in getting shots off and getting back out, what a legend, credit to him.

hes one tough cookie

one fighter who makes me laugh is Bobby Chacon one minute hes hurt the next minute his opponent is hurt its madness

[teeto]

hes one tough cookie

one fighter who makes me laugh is Bobby Chacon one minute hes hurt the next minute his opponent is hurt its madness
Madness, haha. Yeah Rees just makes me laugh so much it's weird, he was uneatable when he win that alphabet title, all time great performance.

[GPater11093]

Madness, haha. Yeah Rees just makes me laugh so much it's weird, he was uneatable when he win that alphabet title, all time great performance.

i know he looked like a tattie but come on

[teeto]

i know he looked like a tattie but come on
Haha, what a legend.

[GPater11093]

Haha, what a legend.

He is a touhg fighter though a handful for anyone on his day

[My2Sense]

Jack Sharkey. Look at his fight record on boxrec before you yell at me.

W-10 George Godfrey (HOFer)
WDQ-13 Harry Wills (HOFer)
TKO-12 Mike McTigue
KO-1 Jack Delaney (HOFer)
KO-3 Tommy Loughran (HOFer)
W-15 Primo Carnera
W-15 Max Schmeling (HOFer)

Looks like a pretty damn good record to me.

[kolcade4]

The Klitfuck brothers. They need to fight each. Pussies!

[KOTF]

Yeah Santana still tops this list

[Jadickkin]

The fact that Jadick WHOOPED Canzoneri, one of the greatest Jr. Welterweight boxers of all-time, not once, but TWICE, PROVES that Jadick does not belong on the list. Canzoneri participated in 259 title-bout rounds and became boxing's third three-division champion.

Also, the fact that Jadick fought an INCREDIBLE 162 fights (96 wins, 57 losses and 9 draws) based on Boxrec.com, clearly proves that he was a warrior who does not deserve to be placed on the list.

Moreover, besides defeating Canzoneri (141-24-10) TWICE, Jadick defeated Zivic (158-65-10) , Al Foreman (64-20-10), fought ten round battles with Benny Bass (191-41-8) and Izzy Jannazzo (96-57-9) , defeated Lew Massey (69-41-8), Tony Herrera (81-26-4), King Tut (89-28-3), Dick Finnegan (58-12-2), Tony Falco (91-31-8)...

[ricardinho]

Montell Griffin? Not a good choice for the thread, IMO. He was actually quite a skilled boxer, an excellent spoiler type for Jones. Aside from the first Jones fight (which was very close through 7 rounds, as Montell made Roy look worse than he ever had before), he also fought Toney in two close, competitive bouts, though the decisions are disputed.

Then in the last round Roy floored him and was on the way to putting him out. The late blow cost him the title and the rematch he clearly was beaten.

[Duodenum]

Who was worse than Leon Spinks? He was the least skilled member of the 1976 U.S.A. Olympic Boxing Team, yet somehow won a Gold Medal with guts and determination.

Alfio Righetti was his only truly significant professional win before dethroning Ali, Bernado Mercado being his best win post Ali.

Yes, Leon knocked out Evangelista with the most impressive combination of his career, but the Tomato nearly took him out in round two of that one. An aging and significantly smaller Jesse Burnett was so flagrantly robbed of the decision against Leon that it was Burnett who got awarded with a CW title shot at S.T. Gordon (in a rare and uplifting instance of boxing justice).

Leon was a hell of a natural athlete, endowed with gifts of speed, power and endurance. Given the work ethic of a Marciano (or even brother Mike), he might actually have been able to hold the HW title through a few defenses.

The win over a peaking Mercado was huge (especially with Bernado coming off a 12th round stoppage), and it proved that Leon was a very legitimate heavyweight who could stand up to a big punch with the proper conditioning and preparation.

Ultimately though, it's about achievement, not potential. Until the Ali rematch, Primo Carnera was in the Guinness Book of World Records as having the shortest HW Title reign in history. But Primo successfully defended it twice, demonstrating himself to be a good fighting champion. Da Preem would have been willing to face Norton before rematching Ali in less total time than Leon sat on the championship. (Uzcudun and Loughran were certainly worthy challengers.)

Once somebody becomes a champion, the confidence and sense of pride derived from summiting that mountain frequently results in a quantum improvement from that point forth. In Leon's case, this didn't happen. Having been a champion, I think I'd rather die than allow the humiliation he sustained at the hands of John Carlos.

Rene Jacquot sticks out in my mind.