View Full Version : Kevin Mitchell article on Boxing & MMA
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Thoughts? :think
GazOC
07-04-2009, 09:22 AM
Too long.
Mandanda
07-04-2009, 10:43 AM
Agreed the article's a long one.
He puts up some valid points but UFC pays well for the top guys not for the lower guys. Bisping is a great position because White's going to use him to break the U.K market. So that's why he's earned so much.
I watch UFC but for me it's legalized street fighting...they say it is so skillful and i admit i seen some great skilled fights in UFC but i see skilled fights in boxing and when you get a bad UFC fight it's a shocker. Whites done well with UFC brand and there very commercial i notice the annoying twitter blog ad during the fights they keep pushing.
UFC get good pay per views because they have one at a time and have stacked cards normally. Boxing's spread out and when i look at it the boxer's in the main event of a pay per view earn more then the UFC main eventers...maybe im wrong.
Boxing will go on i'm sure of that and i think the sport needs to learn a little from UFC in certain areas and Boxing will be back like it was in 80's and 90's.
Floyd Mayweather said this and i agree ''boxing it takes true skills to be a champion you can't just walk in off the streets and win a world title'' That's where UFC loses a certain amount of creditability with me.
Agreed the article's a long one.
He puts up some valid points but UFC pays well for the top guys not for the lower guys. Bisping is a great position because White's going to use him to break the U.K market. So that's why he's earned so much.
I watch UFC but for me it's legalized street fighting...they say it is so skillful and i admit i seen some great skilled fights in UFC but i see skilled fights in boxing and when you get a bad UFC fight it's a shocker. Whites done well with UFC brand and there very commercial i notice the annoying twitter blog ad during the fights they keep pushing.
UFC get good pay per views because they have one at a time and have stacked cards normally. Boxing's spread out and when i look at it the boxer's in the main event of a pay per view earn more then the UFC main eventers...maybe im wrong.
Boxing will go on i'm sure of that and i think the sport needs to learn a little from UFC in certain areas and Boxing will be back like it was in 80's and 90's.
Floyd Mayweather said this and i agree ''boxing it takes true skills to be a champion you can't just walk in off the streets and win a world title'' That's where UFC loses a certain amount of creditability with me.
No one is walking off the street and and winning a world title in the UFC. That is complete rubbish. If it so easy, then why doesn't a gate keeper boxer go and win one? They would make more money as a top guy in UFC than as an average boxer.
It's hard to say what UFC main eventers are paid because you don't know how big a % of the PPV buy rate they get but the money isn't bad for a developing sport despite what some people might say. Affliction have tried paying huge money to guys and as a result they aren't going to be around long.
I'm never going to say boxing is going to die because MMA is going to have a lot of the same problems as boxing eventually but why people comment on something they are clearly ignorant about is beyond me
Mandanda
07-04-2009, 04:39 PM
No one is walking off the street and and winning a world title in the UFC. That is complete rubbish. If it so easy, then why doesn't a gate keeper boxer go and win one? They would make more money as a top guy in UFC than as an average boxer.
It's hard to say what UFC main eventers are paid because you don't know how big a % of the PPV buy rate they get but the money isn't bad for a developing sport despite what some people might say. Affliction have tried paying huge money to guys and as a result they aren't going to be around long.
I'm never going to say boxing is going to die because MMA is going to have a lot of the same problems as boxing eventually but why people comment on something they are clearly ignorant about is beyond me
Go and win what?? if you mean why doesn't gatekeeper go into MMA and win a UFC title..that's up to them that question to me is like asking a mma figher to go win a title in boxing. When i see a wrestler from wwe win a UFC title within a year i have to be honest..yes he has a extensive amateur wrestling background but to win a version of a world title in a year shows that the sports has it's on flaws in that the competition to get to a title isn't strong and also fact that Brock is a effective with his size and strikes and seems that the long term mma fighters like Hering even Mir and Coture have struggled with him.
Yes mma is skilled but it's up to people what they like i actually hate way that people go on like both sports can't work side by side and get on with there own business to me people can like both or one of the two.
I agree on the money front and affliction point and your right mma will have problems soon as at the moment the sports fresh new and exciting but with success comes problems and fighters will become harder to negotiate with and so on so forth.
I'm hardly ignorant just gave a honest and fair assessment from my view point my argument isn't saying is one is better then other i feel boxing is and that's my opinion but my view is boxing's doing ok and just feel that that article is misleading in the money front and i voiced my opinion. It's beyond me why people get annoyed on a forum it really does.....lol
Go and win what?? if you mean why doesn't gatekeeper go into MMA and win a UFC title..that's up to them that question to me is like asking a mma figher to go win a title in boxing. When i see a wrestler from wwe win a UFC title within a year i have to be honest..yes he has a extensive amateur wrestling background but to win a version of a world title in a year shows that the sports has it's on flaws.
Yes mma is skilled but it's up to people what they like i actually hate way that people go on like both sports can't work side by side and get on with there own business to me people can like both or one of the two.
I agree on the money front and affliction point and your right mma will have problems soon as at the moment the sports fresh new and exciting but with success comes problems and fighters will become harder to negotiate with and so on so forth.
I'm hardly ignorant just gave a honest and fair assessment from my view point.
To say someone can walk off the street and win a UFC title is ignorant. Brock Lesnar didn't just walk off the street. He is a freak athlete with an excellent amateur wrestling background who had got into world class training and has also been given opportunities based on business as opposed to pure sport. He is a complete one off in a young sport.
The fact that no boxer has gone into MMA and made a major impact tells you all you need to know. If it was so easy to win a UFC title, a gate keeper boxer would be doing it because they would be getting more money.
Mandanda
07-04-2009, 05:06 PM
To say someone can walk off the street and win a UFC title is ignorant. Brock Lesnar didn't just walk off the street. He is a freak athlete with an excellent amateur wrestling background who had got into world class training and has also been given opportunities based on business as opposed to pure sport. He is a complete one off in a young sport.
The fact that no boxer has gone into MMA and made a major impact tells you all you need to know. If it was so easy to win a UFC title, a gate keeper boxer would be doing it because they would be getting more money.
Floyd Mayweathers comments not mine i agreed with what he said although he rather crude with it in way of putting it.
Well same could be said for MMA guy coming into boxing then????
As for getting more money that remains to be seen as there's varying stories of pay. I'd have no doubts a boxer could win a mma belt with good match ups and training but why should a fighter do it when as ken shamrock said they ''need to embrace a fighter such as mayweather and not put him in with a top guy straight away'' a boxer could go in and lose but and it's a big BUT look at ray mercer and that says that the sports wide open and Ray's not freak athlete. Yes Sylvia is past it and never a great but one punch and we all know if a proper boxers gets that chance a mma fighter is in trouble so now your being ignorrant by saying boxers should go into mma because of one fighters comments when he does have a certain logic.
we aint going to agree on this i can tell by both sets of comments.
I say this though a boxer has more chance of winning a mma title in a year then a mma fighter has of winning a boxing title in a year. That takes nothing away from mma as a sport but boxing is a hard sport to crack and is a hard art to master when you have limted punching ability.
Floyd Mayweathers comments not mine i agreed with what he said although he rather crude with it in way of putting it.
Well same could be said for MMA guy coming into boxing then????
As for getting more money that remains to be seen as there's varying stories of pay. I'd have no doubts a boxer could win a mma belt with good match ups and training but why should a fighter do it when as ken shamrock said they ''need to embrace a fighter such as mayweather and not put him in with a top guy straight away'' a boxer could go in and lose but and it's a big BUT look at ray mercer and that says that the sports wide open and Ray's not freak athlete. Yes Sylvia is past it and never a great but one punch and we all know if a proper boxers gets that chance a mma fighter is in trouble so now your being ignorrant by saying boxers should go into mma because of one fighters comments when he does have a certain logic.
we aint going to agree on this i can tell by both sets of comments.
I never said an MMA guy could go into boxing and do well. A boxer would always do better in MMA than the other way around. Ray Mercer gets beat by any decent MMA guy that isn't stupid enough to come in over weight and stand with him. He lost to Kimbo Slice for crying out loud.
MMA is obviously more unpredictacble than boxing because there is so much more to it and especially as it is only 15 years old. That shouldn't be a criticism of it.
If as you say a boxer would win a UFC title, then why don't they? For example, Kermit Cintron and Enzo Maccarinelli have talked about doing MMA. They would make more as a UFC champion than they do at the moment in boxing so why don't they?
Mandanda
07-04-2009, 05:20 PM
Because there comfortable imo and have futures in boxing it's to big a risk to give up and leave being a contender at world title boxing level and go into mma. They play with idea they know how dangerous mma is and how difficult it is and probably play safe and i don't blame them.
It's a dangerous move because in one punch like Matt Serra you can become a champion and in one armbar become a chump in two sports.
Because there comfortable imo and have futures in boxing it's to big a risk to give up and leave being a contender at world title boxing level and go into mma. They play with idea they know how dangerous mma is and how difficult it is and probably play safe and i don't blame them.
Well that's basically my point. But there isn't anyone who is taking the chance which speaks volumes. Anyway, I don't think we're actually of that different opinion. Good argument sir :happy
Broxi
07-04-2009, 05:30 PM
It's a good article, maybe we're the problem, the traditional boxing fan that can't accept this new popular sport. I sometimes feel like some stuffy old skier that can't accept this loud and brash new snowboarding "fad" that's all around them.
But the sport, if that's what you want to call it, isn't for me ... I don't see the skill or the artistry in it, two big guys wrestle about until one gets the other in a choke hold or smashes his elbow off his dish a couple of times. :tired
Mitchell (and Dana White) make some good points about boxings failings too and that can't be ignored, too many sanctioning bodies, not enough competitive fights being made, stagnant HW division ... we've discussed all these points plenty in the past but I think a big part of boxing losing popularity is that the average guy on the street has got no clue about the basics of boxing so they can't see the art in it.
(And maybe that's my problem with MMA too.)
All they want to see is 2 guys having a scrap, preferably both of them bleeding like stuck pigs and the thing to be over as quickly and brutally as possible to satisfy their 3 minute fast food attention span. UFC / MMA gives them that.
One thing I've noticed, any time I start a conversation with somebody about boxing, they look like rabbits caught in the headlights and will try to turn the convo to UFC as soon as possible, cos they know themselves that they know jack-shit about boxing and you get man points deducted for that in my book.
Mandanda
07-04-2009, 05:30 PM
Well that's basically my point. But there isn't anyone who is taking the chance which speaks volumes. Anyway, I don't think we're actually of that different opinion. Good argument sir :happy
Yeah i get what your saying now mate :lol: and yep good argument from both sides :happy
And to anyone reading i do like mma although boxing is my number one and will always will be but don't think im a hater :bbb
It's a good article, maybe we're the problem, the traditional boxing fan that can't accept this new popular sport. I sometimes feel like some stuffy old skier that can't accept this loud and brash new snowboarding "fad" that's all around them.
But the sport, if that's what you want to call it, isn't for me ... I don't see the skill or the artistry in it, two big guys wrestle about until one gets the other in a choke hold or smashes his elbow off his dish a couple of times. :tired
Mitchell (and Dana White) make some good points about boxings failings too and that can't be ignored, too many sanctioning bodies, not enough competitive fights being made, stagnant HW division ... we've discussed all these points plenty in the past but I think a big part of boxing losing popularity is that the average guy on the street has got no clue about the basics of boxing so they can't see the art in it.
(And maybe that's my problem with MMA too.)
All they want to see is 2 guys having a scrap, preferably both of them bleeding like stuck pigs and the thing to be over as quickly and brutally as possible to satisfy their 3 minute fast food attention span. UFC / MMA gives them that.
One thing I've noticed, any time I start a conversation with somebody about boxing, they look like rabbits caught in the headlights and will try to turn the convo to UFC as soon as possible, cos they know themselves that they know jack-shit about boxing and you get man points deducted for that in my book.
In all fairness, they don't sell many DVDs of boxing's greatest 12 decisions.
I promise you there is absolutely a skill and artistry to the ground work but I understand that it isn't for everybody.
Promise you that it isn't a fad either
Broxi
07-04-2009, 05:51 PM
No, I know it's definately not, that's why I choose that analogy in particular. I guess the thing isn't for me, when it first came around I was interested in the spectacle of the thing but when that wore off there was nothing left for me.
The 12 rounder thing is a good point, to me (and many boxing fans) a close 12 rounder is a great thing but to a lot of my mates, if a boxing match goes past the 5th round and there's no KO, you can see their interest wane.
No, I know it's definately not, that's why I choose that analogy in particular. I guess the thing isn't for me, when it first came around I was interested in the spectacle of the thing but when that wore off there was nothing left for me.
The 12 rounder thing is a good point, to me (and many boxing fans) a close 12 rounder is a great thing but to a lot of my mates, if a boxing match goes past the 5th round and there's no KO, you can see their interest wane.
Absolutely and it is the same with MMA. For everyone of the hardcore fans who appreciate the nuances of the ground work there is someone screaming for blood and wanting to see someone unconscious.
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