Marvelous Marvin Hagler Vs Roy Jones jr

[Bill Butcher]

Im going with Roy Jones, I honestly think he would be too fast for Hagler & with his slight size advantage, would not get bulled by Hagler either.
I feel Roy has the movement, smarts & speed to get a close but clear verdict, about 8-4/7-5.

Thoughts ? :think

[jc]

I think Roy could use his speed to out point Hagler. Marvin always has a chance for the KO. But prime Jones rarely got hit and he wont take any chances with Marv.


RJ UD.

[PowerPuncher]

Similar to the Leonard fight but Jones could do this to a prime Hagler and his punches and strength would be more effective at keeping Hagler off than the welterweight Leonard. Jones would sweep the early rounds, Hagler would start to have successes at pressuring Jones as the fight went on but not enough of them. Jones would tee off on Hagler throughout the fight with lead left hooks, lead rights and those flashy combinations he threw in his prime. For the most part Jones would be looking to get in and out and counter Hagler, not being too aggressive. Hagler would look to time and get to mid range to pressure Jones but would be largely frustrated by Jones beating him to the punch and moving back out of range

Jones UD 10-5

[ironchamp]

I think Roy could use his speed to out point Hagler. Marvin always has a chance for the KO. But prime Jones rarely got hit and he wont take any chances with Marv.


RJ UD.

At 160?

I don't see anyone stopping Jones. Not even Monzon.
Jones had a pretty decent beard.

RJ UD.

[Bill Butcher]

After much thought, years of thought actually, Im pretty sure Roy Jones had the fastest hands in history (filmed history), Mel Taylor & prime Ali ran him close but Roy had tremendous power also in a p4p sense also.
I think even a prime Hagler fighting the perfect fight is gonna find it incredibly hard to stay with Jones on a good Jones night.
Hagler wasnt no slouch in his prime but the speed difference is a major key here & its a key that is held firmly by Roy Jones jr.

[jc]

At 160?

I don't see anyone stopping Jones. Not even Monzon.
Jones had a pretty decent beard.

RJ UD.

I was commenting on Marvins ability to get KOs rather than Jones' chin.

RJ UD.

[Manassa]

Has everybody forgotten what Hagler looked like in his prime?

Leonard fight my arse. It was like Holmes-Spinks, but worse.

Now, Jones was very, very good. Blazing speed, stinging power and feline athleticism, but come on. There are certain technical aspects of his game that were lacking and Hagler would crack him one right on the jaw as punishment.

Hagler was quick back in the day and worked extremely hard. If he fought like he did against Fulgencio Obelmejias, which is likely, then Hagler would get Jones out by about round ten.

Of course, he'd get hit a few times and be made to look slow in comparison, but it's the kind of grinding assault that Hagler brought to the table which is needed to beat Jones.

[lefthook31]

Has everybody forgotten what Hagler looked like in his prime?

Leonard fight my arse. It was like Holmes-Spinks, but worse.

Now, Jones was very, very good. Blazing speed, stinging power and feline athleticism, but come on. There are certain technical aspects of his game that were lacking and Hagler would crack him one right on the jaw as punishment.

Hagler was quick back in the day and worked extremely hard. If he fought like he did against Fulgencio Obelmejias, which is likely, then Hagler would get Jones out by about round ten.

Of course, he'd get hit a few times and be made to look slow in comparison, but it's the kind of grinding assault that Hagler brought to the table which is needed to beat Jones.
What about Jones in his? Hagler would have a really hard time chasing down Jones at middleweight. Just too fast, and punched pretty good as well. He wasnt a combination slapper.

[Boro chris]

Hagler would grind out a contraversial sd.

[DINAMITA]

Hagler would take a decision about 8-4/10-5.

Jones had the speed, but when Hagler was prime he was no slouch. If he used his jab effectively and aggressively, I think he would definitely pound out a points win. Hagler was just a better middleweight all in all. I don't think Jones peaked until he was at supermiddle.

[Manassa]

What about Jones in his? Hagler would have a really hard time chasing down Jones at middleweight. Just too fast, and punched pretty good as well. He wasnt a combination slapper.

Who said he was?

Everybody knows what Jones was like in his prime, you can't escape it.

Too many people remember Hagler for the last two years of his career.

[junior-soprano]

i will go with hagler. i like jones a lot. but i think a prime hagler isn't all that slower then jones, a bit but not much. and marvin had much more power in his punches

[Bill Butcher]

i will go with hagler. i like jones a lot. but i think a prime hagler isn't all that slower then jones, a bit but not much. and marvin had much more power in his punches

I dont hink Marv`s speed was close to Jones speed & Im sure Jones had more power too.

[Blood Green]

Rj ud

[lefthook31]

Who said he was?

Everybody knows what Jones was like in his prime, you can't escape it.

Too many people remember Hagler for the last two years of his career.
Well Ray kind of blinded guys with speedy little combinations but they werent that effective. Jones usually picked his spots and loaded up on really nice uppercuts or straight rights. This usually kept his opponents from setting a fast pressured pace because they were getting nailed really good coming in. Once Jones established the pace he could move forward a little more.
I always felt that the way to beat Jones was to make him lead from the start and try and counter him, because anyone who came forward would get picked apart. Thats exactly what Montell Griffen and Tarver (two decent counterpunchers) did to Jones to have a little success.

[Manassa]

Well Ray kind of blinded guys with speedy little combinations but they werent that effective. Jones usually picked his spots and loaded up on really nice uppercuts or straight rights. This usually kept his opponents from setting a fast pressured pace because they were getting nailed really good coming in. Once Jones established the pace he could move forward a little more.
I always felt that the way to beat Jones was to make him lead from the start and try and counter him, because anyone who came forward would get picked apart. Thats exactly what Montell Griffen and Tarver (two decent counterpunchers) did to Jones to have a little success.

Hagler had taken the punches of Eugene Hart, I'm fairly positive he could deal with Jones' power. And the very fact that Jones threw more meaningful shots than Leonard (when on the back foot) is a factor in his downfall. It's hard to counter a flurry, but not potshots. I can see Hagler just tucking up and jabbing at the same time Jones punches, obviously it wouldn't work all the time, but it'd soften him up for later.

[mightyd40]

roy jones decision....fairly comftorable

[redrooster]

Well Ray kind of blinded guys with speedy little combinations but they werent that effective. Jones usually picked his spots and loaded up on really nice uppercuts or straight rights. This usually kept his opponents from setting a fast pressured pace because they were getting nailed really good coming in. Once Jones established the pace he could move forward a little more.
I always felt that the way to beat Jones was to make him lead from the start and try and counter him, because anyone who came forward would get picked apart. Thats exactly what Montell Griffen and Tarver (two decent counterpunchers) did to Jones to have a little success.

No, boxing Roy isnt the answer. I've always said that based on the track record. How can you say that countering Roy is the answer? For 12 rounds??

You have to take it to him with strong a commitment to do or die and very few could ever do that with Roy. I first noticed this in the Pazienza fight but Vinnie didnt have the size. Otherwise, he would have been more successful. Griffin also was actually ahead but starting wearing down around 7th round and Roy took over like the master that he is.

marvin - early 80s version, would not wear out and wouldnt get hit nearly as much. Even if Marvin does fall behind, he has the uncanny ability to rev up his attack to unbelievable levels and almost immediately stop his man. It's happened in the Colbert fight, the Finnegan fight, I've seen it in the Scypion fight, the Hearns fight, the Obel fight and the second Hamsho fight when he began butting Marvin.

I like Marvin by tko for the ultimate victory

[lefthook31]

No, boxing Roy isnt the answer. I've always said that based on the track record. How can you say that countering Roy is the answer? For 12 rounds??

You have to take it to him with strong a commitment to do or die and very few could ever do that with Roy. I first noticed this in the Pazienza fight but Vinnie didnt have the size. Otherwise, he would have been more successful. Griffin also was actually ahead but starting wearing down around 7th round and Roy took over like the master that he is.

marvin - early 80s version, would not wear out and wouldnt get hit nearly as much. Even if Marvin does fall behind, he has the uncanny ability to rev up his attack to unbelievable levels and almost immediately stop his man. It's happened in the Colbert fight, the Finnegan fight, I've seen it in the Scypion fight, the Hearns fight, the Obel fight and the second Hamsho fight when he began butting Marvin.

I like Marvin by tko for the ultimate victory
Maybe the old Jones that worked, but not the best Jones. Look how he lost to Tarver, and look how he was befuddled by Griffen. Griffen didnt take it to Roy, he counterpunched. Roy let Pazienza get close and flurry on him because Paz couldnt crack an egg, and then he opened up a can of whoop ass on him and knocked him out. He could have KO'd Paz whenever he wanted. That fight was a total joke. Roy would let opponents get close to him if they couldnt hit hard. If they did, he stayed in the middle of the ring and let them lead.
Look how Tarver knocked him out and beat him in the third fight. It was almost a complete joke at times as Tarver just waited and waited for Roy to lead as he stood there and just flicked a lazy jab. Who said anything about boxing him? I said wait for him to come to you and try and counter him. That was his style. Lou Del Valle did the same thing. He waited for Jones to lead and threw that straight punch right down the middle. That was the only way a fighter could catch Jones. Make him lead, pick up a rhythem in his punches, and try and punch in between them to try and catch him coming in. Jones was just too quick going backwards and too quick in the clinches.

[PowerPuncher]

Hagler had taken the punches of Eugene Hart, I'm fairly positive he could deal with Jones' power. And the very fact that Jones threw more meaningful shots than Leonard (when on the back foot) is a factor in his downfall. It's hard to counter a flurry, but not potshots. I can see Hagler just tucking up and jabbing at the same time Jones punches, obviously it wouldn't work all the time, but it'd soften him up for later.

Jones flurries too, especially in his prime, but actually I think its easier to counter a flurry, you only have to slip and counter 1 shot

[lefthook31]

Hagler had taken the punches of Eugene Hart, I'm fairly positive he could deal with Jones' power. And the very fact that Jones threw more meaningful shots than Leonard (when on the back foot) is a factor in his downfall. It's hard to counter a flurry, but not potshots. I can see Hagler just tucking up and jabbing at the same time Jones punches, obviously it wouldn't work all the time, but it'd soften him up for later.
Potshotting is a form of counterpunching. Jones reaction time was so quick, he could land much harder on a fighter coming forward that he was countering. He could counter over a jab or a power punch. Jones was knocking out guys that were walking around at heavyweight and fighting at LH. He would have had a big advantage over Hagler in the power department, not to mention the speed at which he was delivering those shots.

[redrooster]

Maybe the old Jones that worked, but not the best Jones. Look how he lost to Tarver, and look how he was befuddled by Griffen. Griffen didnt take it to Roy, he counterpunched. Roy let Pazienza get close and flurry on him because Paz couldnt crack an egg, and then he opened up a can of whoop ass on him and knocked him out. He could have KO'd Paz whenever he wanted. That fight was a total joke. Roy would let opponents get close to him if they couldnt hit hard. If they did, he stayed in the middle of the ring and let them lead.
Look how Tarver knocked him out and beat him in the third fight. It was almost a complete joke at times as Tarver just waited and waited for Roy to lead as he stood there and just flicked a lazy jab. Who said anything about boxing him? I said wait for him to come to you and try and counter him. That was his style. Lou Del Valle did the same thing. He waited for Jones to lead and threw that straight punch right down the middle. That was the only way a fighter could catch Jones. Make him lead, pick up a rhythem in his punches, and try and punch in between them to try and catch him coming in. Jones was just too quick going backwards and too quick in the clinches.

actually, Tarver also had great success in the first bout with Roy by pressing him. The only problem is that he let up too often and Roy being the true great that he is, even in a weakened state, pulled it out. Roy showed increible heart.

But I fear that marvin was just too much warrior with too much skill, and too powerful for even Roy. He just doesnt let up and the fact is, no one else can fight like Marvin but Marvin himself

Griffin did pretty well by taking it to him and bulling him which surprised me. But he didnt have that do or die commitment and just wore out. Once he wore out, Roy dismantled him. and in the rematch, Montell was already so psyched out, he wasnt mentally tough enough to compete.

You used the Del Valle fight to prove your point, pointing out the KD but using the tactics you mentioned, he still failed to win the fight. I gave Roy 11 rounds

[lefthook31]

actually, Tarver also had great success in the first bout with Roy by pressing him. The only problem is that he let up too often and Roy being the true great that he is, even in a weakened state, pulled it out. Roy showed increible heart.

But I fear that marvin was just too much warrior with too much skill, and too powerful for even Roy. He just doesnt let up and the fact is, no one else can fight like Marvin but Marvin himself

Griffin did pretty well by taking it to him and bulling him which surprised me. But he didnt have that do or die commitment and just wore out. Once he wore out, Roy dismantled him. and in the rematch, Montell was already so psyched out, he wasnt mentally tough enough to compete.

You used the Del Valle fight to prove your point, pointing out the KD but using the tactics you mentioned, he still failed to win the fight. I gave Roy 11 rounds

I used that example of how to actually land on him, because he was almost never hit cleanly. Both Tarver and Griffen were counterpunchers. Of course they press forward behind their jabs, but ultimately liked to land their big shots off of counters or in between their opponents shots, same as Jones Jr, only difference is Jones was so quick he could counter a step rather than a punch.

[DRmullen2]

Can't hurt what you can't hit. Jones is leonard with more speed and pop.

[Manassa]

What the fuck are 'some' people on about in this thread? Honestly.

I think its easier to counter a flurry, you only have to slip and counter 1 shot

What? No, that would be countering one punch. Unless you think it's easy to counter the first shot of a shoeshine flurry without having the rest bop you on the nose? Flurries are hard to counter because there isn't a lot of weight being thrown into them; there's less for the defender to manipulate with his counter. Imagine it; the flurry starts with a straight right, you try to parry it with your left hand. There's not a lot behind it so it's not like you're going to throw him off balance and leave him open, not to mention he's throwing several more at you in the meantime.

Potshotting is a form of counterpunching.

No, not always. Plenty of times I saw Jones just hitting at will without the other fighter throwing a punch - not countering. In the boxing section of the Oxford dictionary, under 'counter' it does not say 'pot shot.' Pot shots are neat & tidy punches thrown usually not as counters, infact, but more as a prevention, i.e., a circling fighter may 'pot shot' a more stationary fighter and not allow him to get going.

[laxpdx]

I feel Jones is ahead on points early on, due to his speed. Over the course of the fight, however, Marvin digs in, and his tenacity begins to even out the bout. Over 12, I feel Marvin wins by a slim decision. In a 15 round bout, I think Marvin's constant pressure finally wears Jones down, somewhere between rounds 13-15.

[Manassa]

I feel Jones is ahead on points early on, due to his speed. Over the course of the fight, however, Marvin digs in, and his tenacity begins to even out the bout. Over 12, I feel Marvin wins by a slim decision. In a 15 round bout, I think Marvin's constant pressure finally wears Jones down, somewhere between rounds 13-15.

Another point raised; it definitely needs to be a fifteen round fight because otherwise Hagler does lose. Championship rounds he'd (hopefully) step it up.

[Beeston Brawler]

Hagler by stoppage late.

Jones was a little tight at middle, certainly as he approached his peak.

[Murali]

These are two of my three all-time favourite boxers, the other being Ray Robinson. And I hated seeing either of these guys lose. But Roy would have too much for Marvin, even the special version of Hagler that beat Minter and others up so convincingly.

Roy just had a combination of speed, power and elusiveness that is unmatched in boxing history. And to those who say Roy peaked at 168... maybe. But I always thought Roy was consistently brilliant from 160 to 175 in almost every fight (Griffin I is an exception). Roy has enough on his punches to keep Hagler away from him for 12 rounds - definitely - and very possibly for 15 too.

Roy UD Marvin

[Stonehands89]

The contingent of the Jones' H2H Fantasy Brigade is getting worse. Just last month they had Jones beating Monzon. And now it's Hagler. They watch and rewatch their Jones' Greatest Hits DVD against a parade of day-jobbers and recall "Hagler-Leonard" and think they're on to something.

Reality-check:

Roy Jones had about 26 fights as a MW. He was 25 years old when he stepped up to the Super middles after making one defense of his IBF title. That is not enough of a pedigree for him to even dare to step in the ring against Hagler and I'm not altogether convinced that he would if he could find a way to avoid facing 1980-1982 beastly Hagler.

Hagler has the chin to take Jones' potshots. He has the power to hurt him and keep him modest. The pressure Hagler brings is precisely what Jones would not want and would not cope with well. Jones is not the supreme counterpuncher that he is being made out to be here. He relies on fast-twitch fibers, speed and good legs, but is not about capitalizing on mistakes. He overwhelms most guys with his athletic talent, not his mediocre technique --that ain't enough against elites like Hagler or Monzon or Robinson.

Jones doesn't have the disposition to withstand what these three will bring. They are tried-and-true, highly experienced heavy-hitters who have magnificent chins as insurance to diminish Jones' chances.

[round15]

Wow, lots in this thread not giving Hagler a punchers chance? I'll give Hagler the benefit of being one of the greatest middleweights ever and he stops Jones late. RJJ is one of the greatest of all time, but I don't think he touches Hagler prime for prime at middleweight. Jones probablly takes a few of the early rounds, but Hagler closes the gap, hurts him to the body and stops him unless Jones lasts the 12 round distance.

[lefthook31]

What the fuck are 'some' people on about in this thread? Honestly.



What? No, that would be countering one punch. Unless you think it's easy to counter the first shot of a shoeshine flurry without having the rest bop you on the nose? Flurries are hard to counter because there isn't a lot of weight being thrown into them; there's less for the defender to manipulate with his counter. Imagine it; the flurry starts with a straight right, you try to parry it with your left hand. There's not a lot behind it so it's not like you're going to throw him off balance and leave him open, not to mention he's throwing several more at you in the meantime.



No, not always. Plenty of times I saw Jones just hitting at will without the other fighter throwing a punch - not countering. In the boxing section of the Oxford dictionary, under 'counter' it does not say 'pot shot.' Pot shots are neat & tidy punches thrown usually not as counters, infact, but more as a prevention, i.e., a circling fighter may 'pot shot' a more stationary fighter and not allow him to get going.
Or its used as a single shot when a fighter moves into range, thus my classification of a "counter" to your opponents move. Pot shots are also used in close as single shots off of an opponents punches or movements. Hopkins and Mayweather are great at it as well. Jones used these to keep fighters at range and it close to slip away, but it was also all part of the game plan of getting his opponent to lead to setup the bombs.

[McGrain]

Hagler by knockout.

[Manassa]

Or its used as a single shot when a fighter moves into range, thus my classification of a "counter" to your opponents move. Pot shots are also used in close as single shots off of an opponents punches or movements. Hopkins and Mayweather are great at it as well. Jones used these to keep fighters at range and it close to slip away, but it was also all part of the game plan of getting his opponent to lead to setup the bombs.

No, a counter attack is a retaliation. You are talking about prevention or just well timed shots.

[BUDW]

Hagler attacks rjj body slows roy down then clips him on the chin and takes him out with a KO.

[lefthook31]

No, a counter attack is a retaliation. You are talking about prevention or just well timed shots.
Thats what a pot shot is with not a lot of power behind it. If you stepped forward and threw a righthand and missed and I threw a short straight right and nailed you and took off wouldnt you call that a pot shot? If you stepped in to throw another punch and before you could deliver I steppe in off to the side and hit you with a short check hook, wouldnt that be a pot shot?

[Manassa]

Thats what a pot shot is with not a lot of power behind it. If you stepped forward and threw a righthand and missed and I threw a short straight right and nailed you and took off wouldnt you call that a pot shot? If you stepped in to throw another punch and before you could deliver I steppe in off to the side and hit you with a short check hook, wouldnt that be a pot shot?

Nope. If I were 5ft 7in and you were 6ft 3in and I just couldn't get near you, and you were motoring around the ring and stopping every other second to spear me accurately with long straights, that's what I'd call pot shotting.

[lefthook31]

Nope. If I were 5ft 7in and you were 6ft 3in and I just couldn't get near you, and you were motoring around the ring and stopping every other second to spear me accurately with long straights, that's what I'd call pot shotting.
So how did Roy do it when he was almost always at a height disadvantage? Maybe because he used his opponents misses and forward momentum to land little check shots?

[Manassa]

So how did Roy do it when he was almost always at a height disadvantage? Maybe because he used his opponents misses and forward momentum to land little check shots?

Just really quick and athletic; featherweight speed at middleweight. He was a master at hitting and then getting out of range; the same basic style as Willie Pep I suppose, except trading the more bouncy footwork for a stronger base for powerful punches.

[keith]

Hagler is my favorite fighter EVER.

But Jones is the wrong matchup.

Jones wins a UD, but probably with some uncomfortable moments. He was just too hard to hit at that weight, and had enough power to make Hagler but a litller worried to go all out.

Keith

[Wu-Gambino]

Hagler dismantles him by the later rounds after a few adjustments and some early troubles. Regardless to what some may believe, Hagler was very quick and athletic in his prime as well and would not be outgunned. I think Hagler would systematically break Jones down using the jab to keep Roy off balance and get inside. However, I truly believe Jones is a live threat to pretty much any middleweight who ever lived. The man's athleticism and natural talent was immense, and anyone writing him off simply as an 'all flash no substance' fighter who would get eaten by the past greats is not giving the man a fair shake.

[JohnThomas1]

Jones decision via sheer speed, elusiveness and athleticism for mine.

[Boilermaker]

Jones decision via sheer speed, elusiveness and athleticism for mine.

Would Jones be noticeably faster than the Sugar Ray Leonard that Hagler fought? I think that this is a very comparable fight, even though Jones and Ray were different in styles. Hagler did lose to Ray, but it was a very even fight that could have gone either way.

This is a good close fight also, but i think that Hagler might just finish the stronger and produce a KO punch late in the fight.

[Mr Butt]

hagler wins stopping jones late on

[Bill Butcher]

Would Jones be noticeably faster than the Sugar Ray Leonard that Hagler fought? I think that this is a very comparable fight, even though Jones and Ray were different in styles.

I think Ray is likely a more complete fighter & a little tougher & grittier than Roy but Roy was faster & hit harder & its these qualities as well as his ability to get out of range fast as lightning that would see him thru vs the slower, smaller Hagler IMO.

Jones UD Hagler

[GPater11093]

i like Hagler UD over 15 in this

[JohnThomas1]

Would Jones be noticeably faster than the Sugar Ray Leonard that Hagler fought? I think that this is a very comparable fight, even though Jones and Ray were different in styles. Hagler did lose to Ray, but it was a very even fight that could have gone either way.

This is a good close fight also, but i think that Hagler might just finish the stronger and produce a KO punch late in the fight.

Bill said it all but Jones would be faster, sharper and more powerful.

[lefthook31]

Would Jones be noticeably faster than the Sugar Ray Leonard that Hagler fought? I think that this is a very comparable fight, even though Jones and Ray were different in styles. Hagler did lose to Ray, but it was a very even fight that could have gone either way.

This is a good close fight also, but i think that Hagler might just finish the stronger and produce a KO punch late in the fight.
Hes different. He is faster than Ray, and he uses his speed for power punches, not flashy little combinations that have little effect. If you watch Jones, he often fought guys much bigger than him, but he used single power shots to keep them at distance. Jones handled himself very well against bigger men that put pressure on him and I just dont see Hagler having much success making Jones stop and fight. Jones had problems with guys who had a similar style to his, slick counterpunchers. He ate up pressure fighters like a buzz saw no matter what size they were.

[la-califa]

Eerily simular to the Hearns fight. For all of Jones' speed, power, height & Boxing ability do him when a rampaging Hagler comes in, willing to take hard punches to land his own. like Hearns, Marvin WILL eventually get the slugging match he is looking for. Jones' chin holds up for a few rounds, then Hagler will take over. Hagler kayo in about four or five rounds.

[Bill Butcher]

Eerily simular to the Hearns fight. For all of Jones' speed, power, height & Boxing ability do him when a rampaging Hagler comes in, willing to take hard punches to land his own. like Hearns, Marvin WILL eventually get the slugging match he is looking for. Jones' chin holds up for a few rounds, then Hagler will take over. Hagler kayo in about four or five rounds.

I dont understand this thing with Jones getting KO`d in mythical fights all the time... the guy never realistically lost a fight in 50 pro fights, he was barely even run close until the first Tarver fight at age 34/35, then he fell away, just like 95% of fighters that ever lived have fallen away... its called `past prime.`
I dont see how a guy that never even fought above MWT that was taken 15 rds by a past prime former LWT in Duran & beaten by a past prime former WWT in Leonard (albeit past his own prime also) is knocking out a bigger, faster, harder punching guy that looked unbeatable for about a decade.

Jones by UD.

[lefthook31]

I dont understand this thing with Jones getting KO`d in mythical fights all the time... the guy never realistically lost a fight in 50 pro fights, he was barely even run close until the first Tarver fight at age 34/35, then he fell away, just like 95% of fighters that ever lived have fallen away... its called `past prime.`
I dont see how a guy that never even fought above MWT that was taken 15 rds by a past prime former LWT in Duran & beaten by a past prime former WWT in Leonard (albeit past his own prime also) is knocking out a bigger, faster, harder punching guy that looked unbeatable for about a decade.

Jones by UD.

Nice post agree 100% :good

[mcvey]

Eerily simular to the Hearns fight. For all of Jones' speed, power, height & Boxing ability do him when a rampaging Hagler comes in, willing to take hard punches to land his own. like Hearns, Marvin WILL eventually get the slugging match he is looking for. Jones' chin holds up for a few rounds, then Hagler will take over. Hagler kayo in about four or five rounds.

While Jones middle weight record has only two real names on it a still improving Hopkins and Castro,he was a real talent ,I dont see why people expect Hagler to stop him.Im talking about the Hagler that was in his prime and drew with Antuofermo and took a dec from Duran,the man was a ring mechanic of the first order ,but he wasnt a terrifically concussive puncher ,% stats notwithstanding .Hagler maybe the best 160 pounder of all time, but Jones ,at his best doesnt get kod by him .
Because Jones best victories were at higher weights, I give Marvin a slight edge,but this goes all the way ,and Jones has a real shot at a decision,if Hagler is anything less than 100% intense and motivated.
I was ringside when Hagler overwhelmed Minter,but before he did Minter rattled him with a couple of shots,and Jones was twice the boxer Minter was ,with far greater handspeed,and more power imo.
Jones' chin ,wasnt a problem when he was prime.I really dont see a stoppage .

[Murali]

Some good posts on here regarding this match-up. I don't think Jones would be drawn into a dogfight by Hagler simply because Roy would potshot Hagler and move away, always staying just out of range of Marvin's punches. It doesn't always make for exciting fights but it is tremendously difficult to beat Roy's reflexes, timing and accuracy. Roy keeps Marvin at bay with his super-sharp punches and wins a clear UD.

[PetethePrince]

I voted for Jones but having second thoughts. At 160... I might have to go with Hagler. Anything with Jones being more than that I go with him. Tough one to call. My instincts say Jones but I don't want to doubt Hagler's capabilities at 160.

[Longhhorn71]

Prime Jones at MW vs prime Hagler at MW?

Was a young Hopkins Roy's best win at MW?

I remember a trail of "destruct & destroy" by Hagler at MW.

Hagler by k.o. in 10.

[Dave's Top Ten]

I think it's instinctive to think of Hagler v Leonard when matching Hagler up to a speedster. But that just isn't fair to Marv. People forget how fluent and quick he was in 82 / 83 (peak). Apart from beating a young Hopkins in pretty pedestrian fashion, Jones didn't really achieve much in his short time at middle. If you're matching Hagler against a middleweight Jones, then you really have to take the Hagler, let's say who fought Scypion, against the Jones who fought Hopkins. It's Hagler pretty clearly for me. Above 160 is something else.

[Dave's Top Ten]

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Peak Hagler. It's a beautiful thing people !

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Peak Hagler. It's a beautiful thing people !

Vs a Prime Jones (1. Mallinga who beat Benn, also arguably robbed against Benn/Eubank, 2. Wolfe that went 12 with Toney in his prior fight, 3. Tate who went 12 with Julian Jackson)

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[lefthook31]

I think it's instinctive to think of Hagler v Leonard when matching Hagler up to a speedster. But that just isn't fair to Marv. People forget how fluent and quick he was in 82 / 83 (peak). Apart from beating a young Hopkins in pretty pedestrian fashion, Jones didn't really achieve much in his short time at middle. If you're matching Hagler against a middleweight Jones, then you really have to take the Hagler, let's say who fought Scypion, against the Jones who fought Hopkins. It's Hagler pretty clearly for me. Above 160 is something else.
I understand that people think Hopkins was green at that time, but what about Roy? They both were fairly green as professional fighters with Roy having a better amatuer background. Hopkins certainly improved over the course of his career, but I would say Jones did as well. I think the thread said prime for prime, which really would put Jones as a super middle and Marv as a middleweight.