What former middleweight champion could of went up to lighheavy and heavyweight

[cotto20]

And won titles? the only man to do it was bob fitzimons. Name the champion you think they could of beat around that time

Gerald mccellan could of beat virgil hill at lightheavyweight and then frank bruno at heavyweight

Carlos monzon could of beat john conteh at lightheayweight and joe frazier at heavyweight(also heard monzon punched a past his prime fraizer all over the ring when they sparred when monzon was in new york)

Any others?

[bxrfan]

This man. . . . . .

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[Bad_Intentions]

This man. . . . . .

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[GPater11093]

And won titles? the only man to do it was bob fitzimons. Name the champion you think they could of beat around that time

Gerald mccellan could of beat virgil hill at lightheavyweight and then frank bruno at heavyweight

Carlos monzon could of beat john conteh at lightheayweight and joe frazier at heavyweight(also heard monzon punched a past his prime fraizer all over the ring when they sparred when monzon was in new york)

Any others?

Bruno could have KOd McLellan

Monzon would have difficulty with Conteh its not a dead certainty he would beat him and then saying Monzon would beat Frazier :patsch

[OBCboxer]

"Monzon would beat Frazier." You're a moron.

[Minotauro]

And won titles? the only man to do it was bob fitzimons. Name the champion you think they could of beat around that time

Gerald mccellan could of beat virgil hill at lightheavyweight and then frank bruno at heavyweight

Carlos monzon could of beat john conteh at lightheayweight and joe frazier at heavyweight(also heard monzon punched a past his prime fraizer all over the ring when they sparred when monzon was in new york)

Any others?

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[PowerPuncher]

Bruno could have KOd McLellan

Monzon would have difficulty with Conteh its not a dead certainty he would beat him and then saying Monzon would beat Frazier :patsch

ESB rumour has it Monzon handled Frazier in sparring but it is sparring the land where Tony Ayala and Howard Eastmen are the greatest fighters ever and yes it is an ESB rumour

[cotto20]

"Monzon would beat Frazier." You're a moron.
Fraizer was made for monzon he would be walking on to that right hand all night long

[PowerPuncher]

If Charles got a shot at the MW and LHW titles he would have done it. Greb may have been able to do it against Dempsey (Maybe). Moore could have been a MW champ and reckoned the ref robbed him against Marciano in the first

[janitor]

Realisticaly?

Lineal titles?

Bob Fitzsimmons did it.

Some earlier fighters could have done it if those divisions had existed Jem Mace held the British middleweight title (basicaly world title back then) and the British and world heavyweight titles.

Tommy Burns could conceivably have done it. He was training for a fight for the middleweight title when he was offered the fight against Marvian Hart for the heavyweight title. He could also easily have claimed the light heavyweight title after he beat Philadelphia Jack O'Brien. He was basicaly three quaters of the way there.

Sam Langford was scheduled to fight Stanley Ketchel for the middleweight title when the latter was murdered. He also beat Philadelphia Jack O'Brien in a catchweight fight while O'Brien was the light heavyweight champion.

Harry Greb could have prety much helped himself to the lightheavyweight title if Carpintier had been stupid enough to give him a title shot. Beating Dempsey would have been a taller order but you never know.

Mickey Walker might have done it if he had caught the right fighters on an off night at light heavyweight and heavyweight. He did hold Jack Sharkey to a draw.

Ezzard Charles could virtualy helped himself to the light heavyweight title at his peak and it is not implausible that he could have won the middleweight title given the right oportunity at the right time.

Roy Jones could and should have established lineage at middleweight and light heavyweight. If Jones had only dared to clock up a few losses he could have been rewarded with some legend making wins at heavyweight. Give him the right champion at the right time and who knows.

In summary:
Bob Fitzsimmons acomplishment probably never will be repeated now but it could and perhaps should have been repeated in the first half of the 20th century if certain champions had been forced to fight the best challengers available.

[GPater11093]

Fraizer was made for monzon he would be walking on to that right hand all night long

Stilistically, George Foreman is made for Willie Pep

there is a huge size difference in both cases

[MRBILL]

Only the great Jim Toney really can do it............. Roy Jones was a "One Fight" wonder against Ruiz................. No other solid 160 pounder from before would have success at 200 or more pounds against stern opposition........... NO!!! Please don't spoon feed me all that horseshit about "Greb or Walker" from the 1920's............
:bbb:deal

MR.BILL

[GPater11093]

It would be harder now IMO t establish a lineage at all 3 weights as the Heavyweight champions are so much bigger than before where some Heavyweights were 180lbs so tahts only 20lbs a difference. Now Middleweights would be fighting guys about 250lbs-300lbs thats about 100lbs a difference in weight.

[cotto20]

Stilistically, George Foreman is made for Willie Pep

there is a huge size difference in both cases
Also they have sparred when monzon was in new york getting ready for tony licata, he gave fraizer a bit of a beating, but joe was past his prime

[GPater11093]

Also they have sparred when monzon was in new york getting ready for tony licata, he gave fraizer a bit of a beating, but joe was past his prime

any proof on this

[TheGreatA]

Stilistically, George Foreman is made for Willie Pep

there is a huge size difference in both cases

It's not like Monzon had it easy with Briscoe who was basically a poor man's 40 lbs smaller Joe Frazier.

It would have been a mismatch.

[GPater11093]

It's not like Monzon had it easy with Briscoe who was basically a poor man's 40 lbs smaller Joe Frazier.

It would have been a mismatch.

yeh great point forgot about Bennie :patsch

Monzon would struggle at LHW let alone HW

[MRBILL]

No freaking way Monzon beats on Frazier without Frazier allowing it to happen for publicity reasons, ect..................... Frazier could and would steamroll Monzon rather quickly and rapidly............... Even an aging Frazier (Frazier is 2 yrs younger than Monzon) in 1976 would ice Monzon.............

MR.BILL

[janitor]

Frazier is getting sold verry far short on this site these days.

People can't look beyond his loss to Foreman and assume that any big fighter with a punch copuld take him.

Personaly I don't think that Monzon matches up well with bigger fighters. He relied on his physical advantages to win fights and when you take those away what exactly is left?

Perhaps there is a good reason why he never stepped up to light heavyweight.

[AlFrancis]

Anyone remember what Frazier did to Foster.

[janitor]

Anyone remember what Frazier did to Foster.

No.

They just remember what Foreman did to Frazier.

[MRBILL]

Monzon was great but OVERRATED as all hell........... Ol' Carlito was HUGE at 160 pounds.......... Christ, even 'til this day rumors surface that he had members of his team tamper with the scales so he could weigh 160.......... He also hammered several dudes who were naturally smaller than him as well......... Monzon was great, but he really needed a 168 pound division back in the 70s........ I think he'd get KO'd by 175 pounders like Bob Foster or a young Victor Galindez.......... Cheers..........

MR.BILL

[D-MAC]

Could Ray Robinson have done it?:think










PS: Just asking. Don't actually know. Just thinking that he could have beat Maxim at LHW under the right conditions. Would HW have been too far though?

[GPater11093]

D-MAC i dont think he could of, but he did have talks with Floyd Patterson at 1 point

[KOTF]

If only Archie Moore won the MW title

[MRBILL]

NO!!! Robinson was fit at 157 to 160 pounds at roughly ages 29 to 37..... After age 37, SRR went downhill, but hung on for several yrs to come...... At best, Ray Robinson would've bulked up to 165 to 168 pounds.... I believe SRR was 164 for Joseph Maxim in 100 degree heat.......... Ray Robinson was the greatest P-4-P fighter in my book, but dudes like "Moore and Patterson" were just too big for SRR........ I cannot see Robinson handling 180+ dudes with skills very well.......

MR.BILL

[D-MAC]

D-MAC i dont think he could of, but he did have talks with Floyd Patterson at 1 point

NO!!! Robinson was fit at 157 to 160 pounds at roughly ages 29 to 37..... After age 37, SRR went downhill, but hung on for several yrs to come...... At best, Ray Robinson would've bulked up to 165 to 168 pounds.... I believe SRR was 164 for Joseph Maxim in 100 degree heat.......... Ray Robinson was the greatest P-4-P fighter in my book, but dudes like "Moore and Patterson" were just too big for SRR........ I cannot see Robinson handling 180+ dudes with skills very well.......

MR.BILL

Cheers boys.:good

I didn't think so, but thought I'd ask anyway.

[Russell]

And won titles? the only man to do it was bob fitzimons. Name the champion you think they could of beat around that time

Gerald mccellan could of beat virgil hill at lightheavyweight and then frank bruno at heavyweight

Carlos monzon could of beat john conteh at lightheayweight and joe frazier at heavyweight(also heard monzon punched a past his prime fraizer all over the ring when they sparred when monzon was in new york)

Any others?

You need to go drown yourself and stop ruining boards like this one.

[OBCboxer]

Fraizer was made for monzon he would be walking on to that right hand all night long

Even if he was tailor made, the size difference and power would allow Frazier to easily KO Monzon. I am pretty sure Monzon's power isn't going to mean much at HW against Frazier. It's not even debateable, just stop.

[albinored]

..when there was talk...mostly by dumb sportswriters...of matching sugar ray robinson against ezzard charles, srr scotched it by saying 'hey...you want to get me killed?"

[shommel]

jake lamotta would have beat joey maxim for the light heavy crown as he beat several notable light heavies in his day, and was a natural super middle/light heavy as he always had trouble getting to the 160 lb limit for middle.

[Minotauro]

If Frazier could walk through Foster's punches how will Monzon's have any effect.

[mcvey]

You need to go drown yourself and stop ruining boards like this one.

Its the unsubstantiated assertions that really get you isnt it Russ?:lol:


Only joking!

[albinored]

...i'm not so sure lamotta would beat joey maxim. maxim tangled with a lot of heavyweights and actually came down from that division to win he light heavy crown. he had a great chin...kayoed once in his career when the murderous punching hatchetman shepard caught him cold inthe first round. maxim came back to outpoint him i a few weeks later. he was hard to knockdown and virtually impossible to knock out. his physical strength was underrated because his boxing skill was so obvious.
lamota didn't have the punching power to stop him.

on the other hand maxim was a very light puncher. maybe jake could get inside and bull him around and start those punches in bunches he did so well,and, as stated , he wouldn't be weakend by making weight. he did fight some heavies though, but none of the quality that maxim tangled with.

i see it as a great fantasy fight, one to mull around in our minds and making good arguments for both. as for me, i'm inclined to go with maxim, but not as a sure thing.

[zadfrak]

Jimmy Ellis.

He just didn't benefit from a world of 4 titles is all. That changes a lot of things. Ellis could go and do like recent guys and fight the easiest champ at a given weight as opposed to the tough hombres holding titles when he was at those weights. And that tough level of opposition Jimmy fought at those weights. And Angie Dundee could get his guy ready for a mr softie type titleholder.