KO12 Kostya Tszyu, KO4 Jose Luis Castillo

[brown bomber]

What other fighters can claim 2 victories of this magnitude in the history of british boxing? I've listned to the Hatton haters long enough- hit me with your best shot tell me which fighter you think surpasses this collective achievement. Eubank beating Benn and Watson is the closest I can think of. Collins' wins over Benn and Eubank came too late in their careers, the same with Lewis' victories over Holyfield or Tyson.

[brown_bomber]

all he has to do is beat cotto and mayweather :D and it is completed

[China_hand_Joe]

If he beat Cotto and Mayweather, his resume would be that of the GOAT any nationality. The yanks would deny it though and claim Sugar Ray Robinson KO's him in 3.

[achillesthegreat]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.

[stake501]

I like hatton...he has balls....Calzaghe has more talent though.....but both have a way to go befor they are in Lewis's class

Castillo was a good boxer but not elite especially at 140. This was to put him on the US map not to secure his legacy. To do this he HAS to move up to 147 to see what he has got. One bad performance against Collazo (an awkward southpaw) does not mean he can't handle it at 147, especially witht he right weight gain and a good training camp behimd him. After that I will elevate him into Lennox's class

We will see if he comes back afterwards.

After Lewis was done with Tyson and holyfield, they both continued to box

[China_hand_Joe]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.The only real good news is Mayweather and to a lesser extent Cotto, aren't massive WWs. Though Cotto is still as strong as hell.

[Nemesis]

Lewis still has the depth of competition to be top and I'd say Buchanan's record is on a par with Ricky's

[achillesthegreat]

The only real good news is Mayweather and to a lesser extent Cotto, aren't massive WWs. Though Cotto is still as strong as hell.
It is true of Mayweather and Hatton says he would go up to 147 for it because of this reason.

Cotto, I'm not so sure. Hatton has been a career 140 and yesterday weighed 149 on fight night! Cotto was weighing this and more when he turned pro.

[Nemesis]

Single win wise, I'd still say Turpin beating (as close to peak as your going to get) Robinson, still the greatest single victory, bearing in mind Robinson at the time was something like, 129-1-1 with his only defeat coming against Lamotta (who had something like a 17lb weight advantage)

[China_hand_Joe]

Cotto, I'm not so sure. Hatton has been a career 140 and yesterday weighed 149 on fight night! Cotto was weighing this and more when he turned pro.Oh, there is no doubt he is bigger than Hatton, and he does weigh a lot come fight night. But his frame isn't as big as say Collazo. He is slightly stronger than he looks though as Judah found out. [Only registered and activated users can see links]

[brown bomber]

After Lewis was done with Tyson and holyfield, they both continued to box with virtually zero success.

[brown bomber]

Single win wise, I'd still say Turpin beating (as close to peak as your going to get) Robinson, still the greatest single victory, bearing in mind Robinson at the time was something like, 129-1-1 with his only defeat coming against Lamotta (who had something like a 17lb weight advantage) No question.

[Charles187]

Casamayor Fight would be the best option for me. Dont think stepping up is the best idea at the minute. He still has plenty of options without. Casamayor, Diaz, Malignaggi, witter/harris. Would also love to see one of those super featherweights step up - Pacquiao or Marquez maybe?

[brown bomber]

I really hope the Mallignaggi fight doesn't happen how fucking pointless.

[China_hand_Joe]

I really hope the Mallignaggi fight doesn't happen how fucking pointless.Can you support me on that in the general forum! I have pointed out his loss, his wider reputation and even how his image make him a pointless opponent. They won't take the hint though.

[brown bomber]

Can you support me on that in the general forum! I have pointed out his loss, his wider reputation and even how his image make him a pointless opponent. They won't take the hint though. if you change your avatar :good

[achillesthegreat]

with virtually zero success.
That isn't true at all.

[China_hand_Joe]

If you do so, I give you my word, I will change my avatar.

[achillesthegreat]

In what universe would a fighter beat Tszyu and Castillo but still be hated on so venomously?

[BoppaZoo]

In what universe would a fighter beat Tszyu and Castillo but still be hated on so venomously?a fighter that uses UFC fighting tactics in a boxing ring.

[brown bomber]

That isn't true at all. how not?

[brown bomber]

a fighter that uses UFC fighting tactics in a boxing ring. A fighter who makes any accomplishment by any of your countries best fighters adopted or otherwise, look very insignificant you inbred.

[brown bomber]

If you do so, I give you my word, I will change my avatar.done- short but sweet.

[BoppaZoo]

A fighter who makes any accomplishment by any of your countries best fighters adopted or otherwise, look very insignificant you inbred.oh poor Hatton fans subjected to paying $50 to see another Hatton Farce.

Jeff dont start with me and your stupid insults. yeah we may be convicts of a nation wear people have bad teeth and shit weather but hey theres no need to get narcky.

just because your ancestors wer'nt on the boats mate dont blame me.:lol:

[Max Molyneux]

We don't pay anything close to 50$ like the Americans.

$50 Is 27 UK pounds and at most our PPV's cost 15 pounds.

[BoppaZoo]

We don't pay anything close to 50$ like the Americans.

$50 Is 27 UK pounds and at most our PPV's cost 15 pounds.still 15 pounds to much to watch some B Grade wrestling.

[China_hand_Joe]

done- short but sweet.
:lol: If this fight happens then I will kill myself.I'll get on it right away.

[achillesthegreat]

a fighter that uses UFC fighting tactics in a boxing ring.
You don't know what you are on about. Shut up and stop hating.

[achillesthegreat]

how not?
Holy fought Lewis the first time and got dominated. Supposedly he is shot but posts a better performance the second time round. He loses but then goes 1-1-1 with a titlist. A fighter who managed to stay a top 10 contender for more than ten years. Then he beats a past and future world champ in Rahman. The Rahman win was three years after having lost to Lewis the second time.

Tyson came back eight months after losing to Lewis and registered a first round ko against a contender. By the time he lost to Williams that was more than two years later so not indictive of him as a fighter.

Holyfield was coming off his career defining run as he headed into the Lewis bout.

Tyson was admittingly past his best but he had been for about ten years. The fact remains he was still winning and beating a shitload of contenders.

[Expert]

done- short but sweet.

your learning from me Jeff Thomas

[BoppaZoo]

You don't know what you are on about. Shut up and stop hating.so what your going to sit there and tell me that guys like Taylor,Spinks,PBF and Hatton are'nt pushing casual fans away from this sport.

Common mate i wasnt born yesterday.

all the great fighters have retired bring back the 80's i say.

[Amsterdam]

I've always said that Hatton is a great fighter. I recall Jeff Thomas saying that Juan Diaz could possibly beat Hatton, don't understand where he gets that logic when Diaz was hurt by Freitas' body shots.:lol:

[Nemesis]

logic says that the 'baby bulls' paunch wouldnt last long against Hatton, I tend to agree

[Cobra33]

KEN BUCHANAN was a much better fighter then Rickey Hatton.

Llyod Honeyghan beat Don Curry,former champ Gene Hatcher,future champ Rosi,Future champ Maurice Blocker,former champ Johnny Bumphus.Honeyghan's resume is more impressive then Hattons.

[brown bomber]

Holy fought Lewis the first time and got dominated. Supposedly he is shot but posts a better performance the second time round. He loses but then goes 1-1-1 with a titlist. A fighter who managed to stay a top 10 contender for more than ten years. Then he beats a past and future world champ in Rahman. The Rahman win was three years after having lost to Lewis the second time.

Tyson came back eight months after losing to Lewis and registered a first round ko against a contender. By the time he lost to Williams that was more than two years later so not indictive of him as a fighter.

Holyfield was coming off his career defining run as he headed into the Lewis bout.

Tyson was admittingly past his best but he had been for about ten years. The fact remains he was still winning and beating a shitload of contenders. I'm aware of that Achilles but just feel they really dropped in the quality of their performances after the Lewis fights.... I'm a big lewis fan so i'm not knocking him.:D

[brown bomber]

your learning from me Jeff Thomas lol

[brown bomber]

I've always said that Hatton is a great fighter. I recall Jeff Thomas saying that Juan Diaz could possibly beat Hatton, don't understand where he gets that logic when Diaz was hurt by Freitas' body shots.:lol: Diaz is the bomb. Don't make the mistake of underating the guy I really think he's impressive and the Hatton who fought Urango would come up short against baby bull no doubt about it!!

[brown bomber]

so what your going to sit there and tell me that guys like Taylor,Spinks,PBF and Hatton are'nt pushing casual fans away from this sport.

Common mate i wasnt born yesterday.

all the great fighters have retired bring back the 80's i say. maybe you should retire with them- or at least fuck off back to your own forum where you can talk about mundine.

[brown bomber]

KEN BUCHANAN was a much better fighter then Rickey Hatton.

Llyod Honeyghan beat Don Curry,former champ Gene Hatcher,future champ Rosi,Future champ Maurice Blocker,former champ Johnny Bumphus.Honeyghan's resume is more impressive then Hattons. Thats your opinion re buchanan but I don't agree. As for Honeygunn I'd have Castillo and Tszyu over any of those guys including Curry.

[Cobra33]

Curry was regard as pound for pound the best boxer when Lyodd beat him.
KT was OLD when he met up with Hatton.
ISMAEL LAUGUNA would have outboxed Hatton.Ken Buchanan beat him 2.

THERE IS NOWAY THAT HATTON IS BETTER OR SHOULD BE RATED HIGHER THEN BUCHANAN>Buchanan fought the much better boxers.


Look.Hatton could have faced Witter.He Didn't.
Hatton could have challenged Mayweather.he didn't.
How about Cotto?
You have to fight and beat the best to be consider the best.
Hatton didn't even fight ZAB JUDHA.:hey

[brown bomber]

Curry may have been considered p4p the best at the time Honeygunn beat him but his results after that defeat make it very hard to make a case for him been an ATG despite his extremely watchable style.

And as for Buchanan and Laguana I've watched there fights and there is not a chance either would have beat Hatton. Its never going to be proven or disproven either way but for me Hatton is the better fighter.

[hitman_hatton1]

I really hope the Mallignaggi fight doesn't happen how fucking pointless.

yeah i ain't too keen on the fight either.

hatton beats him pretty easy i think.

cotto is my top choice.

but will arum wanna risk it after seeing that. :yep

[hitman_hatton1]

Curry was regard as pound for pound the best boxer when Lyodd beat him.
KT was OLD when he met up with Hatton.
ISMAEL LAUGUNA would have outboxed Hatton.Ken Buchanan beat him 2.

THERE IS NOWAY THAT HATTON IS BETTER OR SHOULD BE RATED HIGHER THEN BUCHANAN>Buchanan fought the much better boxers.


Look.Hatton could have faced Witter.He Didn't.
Hatton could have challenged Mayweather.he didn't.
How about Cotto?
You have to fight and beat the best to be consider the best.
Hatton didn't even fight ZAB JUDHA.:hey

buchanan's record ain't that amazing in my opinion.

won the lightweight title and made 2 defences.

quite a few non title fights.

beat laguna twice, jim watt, carlos ortiz (when ortiz was old), ruben navarro.

beat laguna in close fights and was losing wide to duran before the low blow finish.

hatton was better than buchanan i think. :bbb

[Expert]

lol

You think Hatton license should be revoked 4 his fighting style? ([Only registered and activated users can see links])

[brown bomber]

You think Hatton license should be revoked 4 his fighting style? ([Only registered and activated users can see links]) yes immediately

[brown bomber]

hatton was better than buchanan i think. :bbb but he would have struggled with Fighting John Smith of Clapham street IBU world champion 1913-1916 record 4 wins 2 losses 178 no descisions

[hitman_hatton1]

but he would have struggled with Fighting John Smith of Clapham street IBU world champion 1913-1916 record 4 wins 2 losses 178 no descisions

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Expert]

yes immediately

can happen

[Mantequilla]

Conteh
Buchanan
Minter
Finnegan(both of them)
Graham
Benn
Eubank
Watson
Lewis
Honeyghan
Colin Jones

Those are the british fighters of recent years that i would take over Ricky head to head as his career stands right now.Some are arguable of course and Hatton already has accomplished more than some.

[Cobra33]

Ken Buchanan beat Carlos Hernandez who was a former Jr.welter champ.

Ken Buchanan beat.......AL Ford who was 40-1
Andries Steyn .....25-2
Chang Kil Lee............19-0
Jim Watt..................15-2(future Champ)
Donato Paduan0.........22-0 was a welter and
Buchanan still beat him.
Chris Fernandez.................20-2-4
Maurice Cullen.................. 40-5
Rene Roque........................21-2-4
Carlos Ortiz.......................61-6-1
Frankie Otero....................40-2-2
Antonio Puddu...................52-2-2
Chu Chu Malave................20-4-2

Notice how Buchanan's opponents have winning records.I bet you Buchanans comptetion has a better win/loss ratio then Hattons.
Hell Duran would crush Hatton inside of 9 rounds.
Without the foul Buchanan more then likely lasts the distance with a man considered by most to be the greatest lightweight EVER.And Buchanan didn't run or hold to survive those 13 rounds.He fought back as best he could.

And how the hell would you see Hatton beating Lauguna who is considerd to be one of the fastest lightweights ever?WHO HAS HATTON EVER FOUGHT WHO COMES CLOSE TO THE SPEED OF LAGUNA???:deal

PS
I respect everyone's opinion.This is just my opinion/arguement for Buchanan/Hatton.

[hitman_hatton1]

Conteh
Buchanan
Minter
Finnegan(both of them)
Graham
Benn
Eubank
Watson
Lewis
Honeyghan
Colin Jones

Those are the british fighters of recent years that i would take over Ricky head to head as his career stands right now.Some are arguable of course and Hatton already has accomplished more than some.

let's go thru that list shall we. :yep

colin jones - fell short against mccrory and curry in world title fights. terrific puncher, but achieved more than hatton. :roll:

lloyd honeyghan - great win over curry. but he misfired badly after that and got whipped by starling and breland. not to mention that cock up against vaca. :patsch

lennox lewis - obviously achieved more than ricky. :good he still got ktfo twice by bottom half of the top 10 fighters though. :yep if that had happened to hatton, he'd be laughed out of town round here. :hi:

michael watson - great win over a raw nigel benn. but fell short against mccallum and lost to eubank.

chris eubank - probably still a little ahead of hatton at this stage. although some would argue hatton's 15 wbu defences was no worse than some of eubank's wbo defences. :yep

nigel benn - another one ahead of hatton at the moment. shook off early career losses and had some quality wins along the way and made 9 title defences at super middle. :bbb

herol graham - great talent who would have certainly won a world title today. but the facts are that he still fell short. :-(

finneghan bros - who???? :lol:

alan minter - good win over in the states to win the title. made a couple of defences and got whipped by hagler. :bbb all those losses he had doesn't help his case of topping hatton. :nono

buchanan - read previous posts on this one.

conteh - won a title after foster had gone and a few decent tough cases were around. career went a bit flat though and didn't have hatton's longevity to be ahead of ricky. :bart

[hitman_hatton1]

Ken Buchanan beat Carlos Hernandez who was a former Jr.welter champ.

Ken Buchanan beat.......AL Ford who was 40-1
Andries Steyn .....25-2
Chang Kil Lee............19-0
Jim Watt..................15-2(future Champ)
Donato Paduan0.........22-0 was a welter and
Buchanan still beat him.
Chris Fernandez.................20-2-4
Maurice Cullen.................. 40-5
Rene Roque........................21-2-4
Carlos Ortiz.......................61-6-1
Frankie Otero....................40-2-2
Antonio Puddu...................52-2-2
Chu Chu Malave................20-4-2

Notice how Buchanan's opponents have winning records.I bet you Buchanans comptetion has a better win/loss ratio then Hattons.
Hell Duran would crush Hatton inside of 9 rounds.
Without the foul Buchanan more then likely lasts the distance with a man considered by most to be the greatest lightweight EVER.And Buchanan didn't run or hold to survive those 13 rounds.He fought back as best he could.

And how the hell would you see Hatton beating Lauguna who is considerd to be one of the fastest lightweights ever?WHO HAS HATTON EVER FOUGHT WHO COMES CLOSE TO THE SPEED OF LAGUNA???:deal

PS
I respect everyone's opinion.This is just my opinion/arguement for Buchanan/Hatton.

i'm still not buying it. :nono

he beat some good fighters.

but no one particularly special.

so al ford was 40-1. :yep but look at his record ffs. :patsch first time he fought outside canada for a meaningful title and he lost. :lol:

so chang kil lee was 19-0. :yep but look at his record ffs. :patsch first time outside of seoul, korea and he loses. he fights outside korea in another meaningful fight and loses. :lol:

i'm sensing a pattern here. :yep

[China_hand_Joe]

Calzaghe's opponents have a good win ratio...but it falls apart when you analyze a little deep and see who they beat to built their records. Then if you look at the records of the fighters who were beaten by the fighters who were beaten by the fighters who were beaten by Joe it gets even worse.

[Cobra33]

VINCE PHILLIPS-wasn't he like 40 years old when Hatton fought him.
Ray Olivera- Wasn't he basically done BEFORE HE FOUGHT HATTON.
Carlos Wilfredo Vilche-Didn't SHARMBA MITCHELL BOUNCE HIM OFF THE CANVAS FOR A 4 round stoppage.Hatton went the distance.


I want you to tell me who you think is the fastest fighter Hatton has ever fought?

[hitman_hatton1]

VINCE PHILLIPS-wasn't he like 40 years old when Hatton fought him.
Ray Olivera- Wasn't he basically done BEFORE HE FOUGHT HATTON.
Carlos Wilfredo Vilche-Didn't SHARMBA MITCHELL BOUNCE HIM OFF THE CANVAS FOR A 4 round stoppage.Hatton went the distance.


I want you to tell me who you think is the fastest fighter Hatton has ever fought?

i'd still argue oliveira and phillips are better than a lot of guys in that list there. :yep

i'm not saying buchanan didn't fight some good fighters. :nono cos he did. :yep

but hatton has whipped virtually every guy he's fought and hasn't been beaten in the 10 yrs since he turned pro.

buchanan doesn't have a win as good as tszyu. :nono i'd also argue he doesn't have a win as good as castillo.

laguna largely fell short in his biggest fights. he had that 1 great win over ortiz. but then lost to ortiz twice and also lost against flash elorde, vincente saldivar and drew with nicolino locche.

castillo has good wins in his career over some of the top fighters he has fought.

[Cobra33]

remember Vince Phillips was WAY past his prime when he fought Hatton.

KT's best years were behind him when he fought Hatton.

You still didn't answer my question:Who do you think is the fastest fighter Hatton has ever faced?

And don't forget Laguna cut up Mando Ramos!

[Dekkers]

VINCE PHILLIPS-wasn't he like 40 years old when Hatton fought him.
Ray Olivera- Wasn't he basically done BEFORE HE FOUGHT HATTON.
Carlos Wilfredo Vilche-Didn't SHARMBA MITCHELL BOUNCE HIM OFF THE CANVAS FOR A 4 round stoppage.Hatton went the distance.


I want you to tell me who you think is the fastest fighter Hatton has ever fought?
I'm pretty sure Hatton never fought a fighter in Rings top 10 before his fight with Tszyu so the resume is pretty thin up to that point, but credit to him he undoubtedly showed he deserved to be in the same ring.

[hitman_hatton1]

collazo is probably the quickest fighter hatton has fought.

and oh yeah he won that to.

up a weight as well. :yep

[Cobra33]

Collazo is kinda of quick but is more awkward then quick.And Collazo is NOWHERE NEAR LAUGUNA IN HANSPEED.

[brown bomber]

Collazo is kinda of quick but is more awkward then quick.And Collazo is NOWHERE NEAR LAUGUNA IN HANSPEED. Laguna was very quick and threw a great array of punches but just don't see him been big enough to match Hatton. But I respect your opinion and know I sound a bit like a newb comparing Hatton to these great fighters but thats just the way I feel, maybe its time to accept him as an ATG- a Britsh ATG at the very least.

[PowerPuncher]

How can Lewis beating Holyfield/Tyson be too late in their careers compared to Hatton beating Tyszu/Castillo?

[stake501]

I dont understand why we have to rank Hatton before he retires.

Surely once he has retired, then we can rank him in the pantheon of british greats.

[brown bomber]

How can Lewis beating Holyfield/Tyson be too late in their careers compared to Hatton beating Tyszu/Castillo? Its hard to make a comparison because they are heavyweights and in history will always be revered.... hoewever p4p I feel Tszyu and Castillo at the time Hatton beat them were better. Its a bit of a sketchy thread actually but the point I was trying to make was Hattons 2 victories set him apart from the guys who earned their rep off one.

[David UK]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.

I'd leave Casamayor well alone. Hatton has never looked impressive against southpaws,Magee,Collazo,Urango

[achillesthegreat]

I'd leave Casamayor well alone. Hatton has never looked impressive against southpaws,Magee,Collazo,Urango
I never bought into the Magee thing. Two bad rounds then he sailed the rest of the way. Urango was dominated. He just happened to be FUCKING strong and could let some disgusting uppercuts off to the body. Collazo was a bitch but he was a good fighter and a good 10-15 pounds naturally bigger than Casa.

Ultimately yes they were tricky lefties, as is Casa, but look for Hatton to implement his size advantage. He'd be stronger and more powerful. I think it would be telling.

Casa said it - I'm the best at 135, he is the best at 140. Let's make it happen. I agree 100%.

If Hatton wants to keep it exciting then choose Diaz who is also an impressive fighter.

[achillesthegreat]

so what your going to sit there and tell me that guys like Taylor,Spinks,PBF and Hatton are'nt pushing casual fans away from this sport.

Common mate i wasnt born yesterday.

all the great fighters have retired bring back the 80's i say.
Generally I do agree. Our P4P number 1 hasn't posted an exiciting performance in a while. We have no heavies who could build any sort of great legacy. Fighters aren't hungry etc

You are nuts to put Hatton in that list.

Hatton is a mauler and brawler. That's what he does. That's his style. It's won him two GREAT fights.

99.9% of you didn't know Hatton was this good. Some of us always have. Instead of admitting 'he is fucking good', you all find excuses and hate.

[brown bomber]

Bump, discuss

["TKO"]

Bump, discuss

Methinks Jeff is a little bored ;)

[GPater11093]

Ken Buchanan - Laguna x2, Ruben Navvaro
Jimmy Wilde - Joe Symonds, Tancy Lee
Jackie 'Kid' Berg - Kid Chocolate x2, Tony Canzoneri quite possibly the best ever brit win
Benny Lynch - Peter Kane, Small Montana

[El Cepillo]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.

I don't think Hatton is/was a great fighter. 'Great' to me means the likes of Mayweather, Jones, Hopkins... in his prime Hatton was probably a very good 140 pounder.

I don't agree with the logic behind 'greatness is about taking risks' either, despite it being an admirable trait. Especially if those risks (Pacquaio & Mayweather) susbsequently end up exposing the level at which a fighter is capable of performing. Kevin Lueshing took a risk fighting Tito Trinidad, that doesn't make him a great fighter.

I personally think Hatton fighting at 140lbs is nonsense at this stage in his career. Boiling down to that weight isn't doing him any favours, its certainly not going to increase his level of performance, he'd be better off and more comfortable making 147, given that he his boiling down from super-middleweight :roll:.

He can't perform at the higest level at either weight anymore, so best to choose the weight that takes the least toll on his fragile and abused body.

That said, fighting Casamayor wouldn't be a bad idea for Hatton at this stage. He's made a career of fighting the right opponents at the most opportune times, may as well continue that trend with a farewell fight against a shot lightweight.

[Beeston Brawler]

I wouldn't say Hatton was a great fighter, full stop.

The word 'great' is seriously overused. Very good is more appropriate in his case, as proven by his resume of solid wins, vs the two losses against great fighters at their peak.

The win over Castillo can obviously be nitpicked, bearing in mind he did little, well nothing, of note following the fight, which was fairly one sided.

There is a lot of revisionist history regarding the Tszyu victory, which annoys me. He was expected to give Hatton a pretty quick beating, whilst the fight panned out as a nip and tuck affair with Hatton having too much in the end. It certainly wasn't the performance of a 'shot' fighter.

[El Cepillo]

I wouldn't say Hatton was a great fighter, full stop.

The word 'great' is seriously overused. Very good is more appropriate in his case, as proven by his resume of solid wins, vs the two losses against great fighters at their peak.

The win over Castillo can obviously be nitpicked, bearing in mind he did little, well nothing, of note following the fight, which was fairly one sided.

There is a lot of revisionist history regarding the Tszyu victory, which annoys me. He was expected to give Hatton a pretty quick beating, whilst the fight panned out as a nip and tuck affair with Hatton having too much in the end. It certainly wasn't the performance of a 'shot' fighter.

Yeah, I agree with what you say about the Tszyu fight, a great win however you look at it. Just unfortunate it came when it did, because it leaves it open to unwarranted criticism that Kostya was 'shot'.

Although for me, Castillo was certainly shot and that isn't a great win. The JLC that fought Corrales would never have given that kind of performance.

[Mandanda]

I wouldn't say Hatton was a great fighter, full stop.

The word 'great' is seriously overused. Very good is more appropriate in his case, as proven by his resume of solid wins, vs the two losses against great fighters at their peak.

The win over Castillo can obviously be nitpicked, bearing in mind he did little, well nothing, of note following the fight, which was fairly one sided.

There is a lot of revisionist history regarding the Tszyu victory, which annoys me. He was expected to give Hatton a pretty quick beating, whilst the fight panned out as a nip and tuck affair with Hatton having too much in the end. It certainly wasn't the performance of a 'shot' fighter.

:deal. Imo Ricky was a very solid two weight world champion who was at his level till he started getting ahead of himself and went looking for the bigboys. He didn't have the tactical brain or skills to win against the elite fighters but against other world class opponents he could more then hold his own and even out box some fighters. He falls way short imo of being a elite world class fighter...he's more in the second tier of world boxing which is till pretty good.

[Beeston Brawler]

I think you can give a pass for a bit of revisionist on the Castillo fight - he wasn't on top form in the Ngoudjo fight, though that may have been due to lack of motivation in part.

Either way, Hatton shredded him like you would expect a pretty much prime guy to beat a faded, above their weight fighter.

I think Hatton slipped a great deal after the Floyd fight, not so much physically but mentally. Perhaps when you get pretty much to the pinnacle of boxing before being taken apart would affect him. I haven't been there so don't know!

He slipped physically after ditching Kerry Kayes, a seriously dumb move - Paulie was never going to be a threat stylewise, a hittable boxer type with no power is meat and drink to any version of Hatton. I'd say the Hatton of 2000 would have easily beaten that Paulie.

[yesihavearm2]

What other fighters can claim 2 victories of this magnitude in the history of british boxing? I've listned to the Hatton haters long enough- hit me with your best shot tell me which fighter you think surpasses this collective achievement. Eubank beating Benn and Watson is the closest I can think of. Collins' wins over Benn and Eubank came too late in their careers, the same with Lewis' victories over Holyfield or Tyson.

What magnitude ?

Hatton cheated his way to victory in one of the worst refereeing performances I've seen outside of Joe Cortez and then Kosta went and retired, which shows you how much he had left and how much he wanted to be in the game !


Jose Luis Castillo ? Who then went and lost a SHUTOUT decision against Sebastian Lujan ?



You've obviously been fooled by Ricky Hatton's career, and im glad he the truth was brought out where he was EMBARRESSED by Mayweather and Pac.

What a disgrace, and to think I actually thought he had decent chances of winning those fights. Never again.

[Mandanda]

I never take the Castillo victory that seriously because i feel Castillo lost to Ngudjo the night Hatton fought Urango. Castillo was piss poor against Ngudjo and already had a hard career so i never thought of his win over Castillo as anything special...although on paper it looks a great win.

[brown bomber]

Looks like you were fooled to then?

[PrideOfWales]

I like hatton...he has balls....Calzaghe has more talent though.....but both have a way to go befor they are in Lewis's class

Castillo was a good boxer but not elite especially at 140. This was to put him on the US map not to secure his legacy. To do this he HAS to move up to 147 to see what he has got. One bad performance against Collazo (an awkward southpaw) does not mean he can't handle it at 147, especially witht he right weight gain and a good training camp behimd him. After that I will elevate him into Lennox's class

We will see if he comes back afterwards.

After Lewis was done with Tyson and holyfield, they both continued to box

with virtually zero success.

Tszyu & Castillo went on to achieve......... what after Hatton?

[El Cepillo]

Tszyu & Castillo went on to achieve......... what after Hatton?

Slightly less than Jones and Lacy.

[Utter1]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.


Hatton is not a great fighter mannnnnnn.......why do people keep saying this.

A world level champion who was able to give any fighter trouble when at his best but certainly not great.

I dont know why we keep harping on about greatness.

For me the only true greats from British boxing in the last 50 years are Lennox and Naz.

[El Cepillo]

Hatton is not a great fighter mannnnnnn.......why do people keep saying this.

A world level champion who was able to give any fighter trouble when at his best but certainly not great.

I dont know why we keep harping on about greatness.

For me the only true greats from British boxing in the last 50 years are Lennox and Naz.

Naz did nothing to suggest he was a 'great' fighter. He was better than Hatton, but he certainly wasn't great, or at least, he didn't prove he was.

[Betty Swollocks]

What magnitude ?

Hatton cheated his way to victory in one of the worst refereeing performances I've seen outside of Joe Cortez and then Kosta went and retired, which shows you how much he had left and how much he wanted to be in the game !


Jose Luis Castillo ? Who then went and lost a SHUTOUT decision against Sebastian Lujan ?



You've obviously been fooled by Ricky Hatton's career, and im glad he the truth was brought out where he was EMBARRESSED by Mayweather and Pac.

What a disgrace, and to think I actually thought he had decent chances of winning those fights. Never again.

good post but why would you give him a chance against Pac or PBF? You knew he was a fraud so why think he could hang with elite fighters who weren't done?

lets face it....Hatton's 2 supposed big wins are a home-cooking helped win over a faded Tszyu who announced his retirement after the Mitchell rematch and has not been close to fighting since the Hatton farce (he already had more than a foot in retirement) and a shell of a smaller Castillo was was never an elite fighter and wanted his payday and out.

["TKO"]

good post but why would you give him a chance against Pac or PBF? You knew he was a fraud so why think he could hang with elite fighters who weren't done?

lets face it....Hatton's 2 supposed big wins are a home-cooking helped win over a faded Tszyu who announced his retirement after the Mitchell rematch and has not been close to fighting since the Hatton farce (he already had more than a foot in retirement) and a shell of a smaller Castillo was was never an elite fighter and wanted his payday and out.

Is it not time for the nurse to wipe your bottom again? (makes virtual "wanker" sign)

["TKO"]

I wouldn't say Hatton was a great fighter, full stop.

The word 'great' is seriously overused. Very good is more appropriate in his case, as proven by his resume of solid wins, vs the two losses against great fighters at their peak.

The win over Castillo can obviously be nitpicked, bearing in mind he did little, well nothing, of note following the fight, which was fairly one sided.

There is a lot of revisionist history regarding the Tszyu victory, which annoys me. He was expected to give Hatton a pretty quick beating, whilst the fight panned out as a nip and tuck affair with Hatton having too much in the end. It certainly wasn't the performance of a 'shot' fighter.

Hmmm... this is about right methinks. :good

["TKO"]

What magnitude ?

Hatton cheated his way to victory in one of the worst refereeing performances I've seen outside of Joe Cortez and then Kosta went and retired, which shows you how much he had left and how much he wanted to be in the game !


Jose Luis Castillo ? Who then went and lost a SHUTOUT decision against Sebastian Lujan ?



You've obviously been fooled by Ricky Hatton's career, and im glad he the truth was brought out where he was EMBARRESSED by Mayweather and Pac.

What a disgrace, and to think I actually thought he had decent chances of winning those fights. Never again.

normally I hate liars, but I just find this hilarious/embarrassing.

[Utter1]

Naz did nothing to suggest he was a 'great' fighter. He was better than Hatton, but he certainly wasn't great, or at least, he didn't prove he was.


Well when Naz was at his best he was very good, it took a legend in the same weight category to beat Naz when Naz himself was past it.

[Utter1]

Hmmm... this is about right methinks. :good


Kosta was meant to beat Hattonw as he? Bollocks......that fight was taken cuz ****** knew it was the best chance to take on Kosta and at one point they had to take the risk..........becuase if they lost he could he lost to the best.......which is a very good trick that hatton has learnt.

Wont fight witter because if he did lose.....then he would look a right mug.......but if he loses to mayweather and pacman then he lost to legends or as ricky says top pound for pounders.

Very smart moves............watch Amir Khan do this.........milk the train by fighting Morales, Casaymayour etc.....legends from lower weights.

[GazOC]

Of course Zoo was supposed to beat Hatton...and quickly! That fight was made because Hatton put his foot down and wanted it, ****** was quite happy to carry on filling the MEN with WBU title defences.

It comes to something when a fighter gets shit for wanting to fight the best....

[Utter1]

mate i bloody remember it myself...........course Hatton himself at THE TIME wanted the champ..........any fighter has to delude himself somewhat..........But ****** only said yes when the TIME was right.

Besides that Hatton left old ****** and took some of the tricks of the trade with him.

Pick and choose, pick anc choose.......pull wool over the masses.

Both times ive been right about Hatton.......said he would get knocked out late by mayweather and lose on points by pacman.......yet he got worse results.

Also remember thinking he would be Kosta and Castillo his signature wins.

If he fights the Katsis bloke he will win and claim to be the best 140 pounder again............and WILL DEFO fight Khan but i predict next summer...

[Utter1]

fuck sake why do people have to protect the fucking pleb...........he is not the only fighter who has done it.

Mayweather guilty
Bowe guilty
Holmes Guilty

I mean in fact i can think of many more..........BUT these fighters were far better Head to head and accomplishments.........but why do we have legions and legions of hatton fanclubs boys saying he was a great champ when he wasnt.........that he dominated the 140 division which shud not really exist anyhow.

If the average world level operator retires.........at this very second he would have failed to faced Cotto, Mosley, Marquez, P. Williams, Margarito, Casamayour, bradley, witter, z. judah, c. baldomir, alexander just to name a few that surround the little wool over the people eyes fighter weight class.

I cant wait to hear it.........BUT but but margs and williams are to big, but but alexander and has just come on the scene but but witter cant draw a crowd, but but but cotto was in this weight and hatton was in the wieght and blah bloody blah.

Hatton fans repeat after me -
'Ricky was a very popular, cleverly marketed fighter who wisely attached himself to a football club that was popular enough to attach themselves to a succesful fighter with exciting style to the casual observer. He took 3 risks in his life and failed badly on two. He won the main championship in the a division of the 140 pounders (which boxing promotors invented to create more business) that was only taken seriouly when mr Pryor won his ibf crown in 1984. Ricky was and is an average world level operator who is the equivelent of what Everton currently are in the premier league and european standings.

thankyou bye bye

[Beeston Brawler]

Stfu & gtfo.

[GazOC]

Both times ive been right about Hatton.......said he would get knocked out late by mayweather and lose on points by pacman.......yet he got worse results.

Also remember thinking he would be Kosta and Castillo his signature wins.




LOL!! You picked Hatton to beat Zoo eh? Was that pick made BEFORE the fight or after??:huh


BTW how is getting KO'd in the 10th a "worse result" than getting knocked out late FFS?

You can put all the twisted, negative spin you like on Hattons career but most fair minded people can see it for what it is. A decent, but not great, world class career (Beeston summed up it up fairly on the last page).

["TKO"]

Kosta was meant to beat Hattonw as he? Bollocks......that fight was taken cuz ****** knew it was the best chance to take on Kosta and at one point they had to take the risk..........becuase if they lost he could he lost to the best.......which is a very good trick that hatton has learnt.

Wont fight witter because if he did lose.....then he would look a right mug.......but if he loses to mayweather and pacman then he lost to legends or as ricky says top pound for pounders.

Very smart moves............watch Amir Khan do this.........milk the train by fighting Morales, Casaymayour etc.....legends from lower weights.

Bearing in mind that he was a 1-3 favourite I'd say yeah he was and a lot of people picked him to do it early. ****** didn't want the fight, Hatton had to pull rank and say I want it or I'm leaving you.

There is only Hatton who could get stick for wanting to fight the very best, creme de la creme fighters out there and have people saying he should have fought a solid, b-level fighter instead (on the Malignaggi/Collazo level) solely due to the fact that he is British. Bottom line Hatton shot for the absolute elite. Anyone attempting to criticise him for that is Betty Swollocks intellect in my book. Why don't we have all the best British fighters in a round-robin tournament with each other, okay so none of them would test themselves at top level but at least they'd satisfy some muppet haters. Or not, as true boxing fans know the haters would soon find another shitty stick to beat the fighter with.

[Betty Swollocks]

fuck sake why do people have to protect the fucking pleb...........he is not the only fighter who has done it.

Mayweather guilty
Bowe guilty
Holmes Guilty

I mean in fact i can think of many more..........BUT these fighters were far better Head to head and accomplishments.........but why do we have legions and legions of hatton fanclubs boys saying he was a great champ when he wasnt.........that he dominated the 140 division which shud not really exist anyhow.

If the average world level operator retires.........at this very second he would have failed to faced Cotto, Mosley, Marquez, P. Williams, Margarito, Casamayour, bradley, witter, z. judah, c. baldomir, alexander just to name a few that surround the little wool over the people eyes fighter weight class.

I cant wait to hear it.........BUT but but margs and williams are to big, but but alexander and has just come on the scene but but witter cant draw a crowd, but but but cotto was in this weight and hatton was in the wieght and blah bloody blah.

Hatton fans repeat after me -
'Ricky was a very popular, cleverly marketed fighter who wisely attached himself to a football club that was popular enough to attach themselves to a succesful fighter with exciting style to the casual observer. He took 3 risks in his life and failed badly on two. He won the main championship in the a division of the 140 pounders (which boxing promotors invented to create more business) that was only taken seriouly when mr Pryor won his ibf crown in 1984. Ricky was and is an average world level operator who is the equivelent of what Everton currently are in the premier league and european standings.

thankyou bye bye


that's right.
he was basically overrrated as fuck by most Brits...fooled by the charade.

[TheUzi]

fuck sake why do people have to protect the fucking pleb...........he is not the only fighter who has done it.

Mayweather guilty
Bowe guilty
Holmes Guilty

I mean in fact i can think of many more..........BUT these fighters were far better Head to head and accomplishments.........but why do we have legions and legions of hatton fanclubs boys saying he was a great champ when he wasnt.........that he dominated the 140 division which shud not really exist anyhow.

If the average world level operator retires.........at this very second he would have failed to faced Cotto, Mosley, Marquez, P. Williams, Margarito, Casamayour, bradley, witter, z. judah, c. baldomir, alexander just to name a few that surround the little wool over the people eyes fighter weight class.

I cant wait to hear it.........BUT but but margs and williams are to big, but but alexander and has just come on the scene but but witter cant draw a crowd, but but but cotto was in this weight and hatton was in the wieght and blah bloody blah.

Hatton fans repeat after me -
'Ricky was a very popular, cleverly marketed fighter who wisely attached himself to a football club that was popular enough to attach themselves to a succesful fighter with exciting style to the casual observer. He took 3 risks in his life and failed badly on two. He won the main championship in the a division of the 140 pounders (which boxing promotors invented to create more business) that was only taken seriouly when mr Pryor won his ibf crown in 1984. Ricky was and is an average world level operator who is the equivelent of what Everton currently are in the premier league and european standings.

thankyou bye bye

Ok listen mate.

You hate him....very good,we all have our opinions but to mention 'avoiding' Carlos Baldomir in attempt to write off his career is just plain silly and retarded.

Most Hatton fans who post here are very realistic and honest when discussing Hatton.

Good World Operator who relied on stength and heart to grind down opponents. He could box at times but not to the level required to make him elite.
As far as British fighters go...he IS a modern day great

[TheUzi]

nearly forgot,

thankyou bye bye

["TKO"]

Ok listen mate.

You hate him....very good,we all have our opinions but to mention 'avoiding' Carlos Baldomir in attempt to write off his career is just plain silly and retarded.

Most Hatton fans who post here are very realistic and honest when discussing Hatton.

Good World Operator who relied on stength and heart to grind down opponents. He could box at times but not to the level required to make him elite.
As far as British fighters go...he IS a modern day great

Indeed. I think whatever Betty's got must be catching like swine flu. Either that or he's smoking something he shouldn't be :rasta

It is interesting that this list of fighters Hatton "failed to fail" includes only 3 who have been in his weight class for any period of time whilst he was world rated. Of those, one of them (Bradley) has only been a factor for the last 12 months and another (Alexander) has only been a factor for 4 days (arguably if that as the circumstances of Witter quitting meant it was not the most satisfactory of endings).

[Beeston Brawler]

I am sure the guy who has accused Hatton of ducking Casamayor would accuse him of beating up on an old, shot fighter, had they met at any time in the past two years..... exposed by Santa Cruz, beaten by Corrales..... :-(

["TKO"]

I am sure the guy who has accused Hatton of ducking Casamayor would accuse him of beating up on an old, shot fighter, had they met at any time in the past two years..... exposed by Santa Cruz, beaten by Corrales..... :-(

Indeed. Let's do a similar list for, say, Roy Jones and Floyd Mayweather, two of the greatest fighters of the modern era.

Fighters Jones never faced (off the top of my head): Gerald McClellan, Michael Nunn, Steve Collins, Frankie Liles, Chris Eubank, Nigel Benn, Steve Collins, Julian Jackson, Dariusz Michalczewski, Vassiliy Jirov, Juan Carlos Gomez, Lennox Lewis (after all he dipped his toe into heavyweight once).

Fighters Mayweather never faced:(again off the top of my head) Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas, Juan Diaz, JM Marquez, Kostya Tszyu, Miguel Cotto, Shane Mosley, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Daniel Santos, Cory Spinks, Joshua Clottey.

This is just off the top of my head, I'm sure I could come up with double that for each if I actually took more than 30 seconds to think about it. What a pair of good for nothing duckers hey?

Hmmm.... actually... maybe not!

Bottom line there are about 15 fighters in each weight class at any one time who are reasonably considered world class by one ranking body or other. Add the weight classes above and below and that's 45. Over a 4-5 year period fighting at world level bearing in mind the rate fighters come and go from the rankings, that's circa 90 world class fighters who will have been in the rankings at some point. And some idiots think picking 10 or so out of that list proves something? World class fighters these days fight 3 times a year at most. I could play down any single fighter's record in this manner if I put my mind to it. I don't because I'm not a jealous, bitter hater looking to twist facts to suit my irrational preconceived agenda.

[NO MAS]

Fuck em all. No matter what happens now Hatton has proven he is no fluke. Greatness is about risks. Hatton was the underdog v Tszyu and 50-50 with Castillo. He spanked both.

Hatton in my eyes is a great fighter. Even if he loses to Cotto or Floyd he has a legacy now. A legacy with substance. Not one where he may scrape into the HOF from one big win ala McGuigan.

I'd like to see him fight Casamayor. Joel is the best 135 pounder in the world at the moment. Hatton just can't handle 147. He could fight there but it makes it unnecessarily difficult on himself. I say he should look to Casa and Diaz.

I agree that he spanked and made very light work of JLC, buthe certainly didn't spank Tyszu... I don't think that Hatton started to pull away in that contest until the 8th round....

I think that Ricky was very busy and for me that is where Ricky Hatton peaked......Kostya Tyszu was very conservative but highly accurate with his punches....:bbb

Hatton has not performed or will perform like that again IMHO......what made that win even more of an achievement was to retire Tyszu on his stool.......:yep

I want Ricky Hatton to retire...:good

[Utter1]

LOL!! You picked Hatton to beat Zoo eh? Was that pick made BEFORE the fight or after??:huh


BTW how is getting KO'd in the 10th a "worse result" than getting knocked out late FFS?

You can put all the twisted, negative spin you like on Hattons career but most fair minded people can see it for what it is. A decent, but not great, world class career (Beeston summed up it up fairly on the last page).


Ive said it many a time that he was a world average operator.........I wasnt on the board when Hatton defeated Kostya..........the mayweather result was worse than id imagine it to be i actually thought hatton could at least get to more than did and eventually the ref would stop it late.......not knocked out cold in the 10th after being tagged all night long.

Im not biased against his carrer at all.......i actually think he is on the same level as Calzaghe but had to go up against fighters who were really top notch and in there prime whereas Joe faced one top level potential great fighter in Kessler in his prime.

[Utter1]

Indeed. Let's do a similar list for, say, Roy Jones and Floyd Mayweather, two of the greatest fighters of the modern era.

Fighters Jones never faced (off the top of my head): Gerald McClellan, Michael Nunn, Steve Collins, Frankie Liles, Chris Eubank, Nigel Benn, Steve Collins, Julian Jackson, Dariusz Michalczewski, Vassiliy Jirov, Juan Carlos Gomez, Lennox Lewis (after all he dipped his toe into heavyweight once).

Fighters Mayweather never faced:(again off the top of my head) Joel Casamayor, Acelino Freitas, Juan Diaz, JM Marquez, Kostya Tszyu, Miguel Cotto, Shane Mosley, Paul Williams, Antonio Margarito, Daniel Santos, Cory Spinks, Joshua Clottey.

This is just off the top of my head, I'm sure I could come up with double that for each if I actually took more than 30 seconds to think about it. What a pair of good for nothing duckers hey?

Hmmm.... actually... maybe not!

Bottom line there are about 15 fighters in each weight class at any one time who are reasonably considered world class by one ranking body or other. Add the weight classes above and below and that's 45. Over a 4-5 year period fighting at world level bearing in mind the rate fighters come and go from the rankings, that's circa 90 world class fighters who will have been in the rankings at some point. And some idiots think picking 10 or so out of that list proves something? World class fighters these days fight 3 times a year at most. I could play down any single fighter's record in this manner if I put my mind to it. I don't because I'm not a jealous, bitter hater looking to twist facts to suit my irrational preconceived agenda.


Who said Jones and Mayweather are the greatest? lol to funnyyyyyyy..........ive siad in previous posts that mayweather is just as guilty of picking and choosing u plank. Also Ive said previously that Pacman is making Mayweather look very ordinary considering the guy fighting far above his natural weight.

Lets get right down to it........greatness should be only for the very very elite...........fighters that are literally in the top 50 etc.

Jones was a very good fighter but deffo ducked so many guys...........its not even funny.......BUT he is still far better head to head, pound for pound, and accomplishments than mr hatton ever is.

True greats - L.Lewis, Ali, SRRobinson, SRLeonard, P. Whitaker, Hagler, J. Louis, Monzon, Duran, Hears, Pryor, Tyson etc etc

[Utter1]

rumour has it that Hatton might fight Humberto Soto as he is a reigining world champ right guys? Come on a peak fighter who happens to be a champ......yeah thats it.........we can advertise as Hatton beating his 330th champion..........yeah brilliant isnt it

["TKO"]

Who said Jones and Mayweather are the greatest? lol to funnyyyyyyy..........ive siad in previous posts that mayweather is just as guilty of picking and choosing u plank. Also Ive said previously that Pacman is making Mayweather look very ordinary considering the guy fighting far above his natural weight.

Lets get right down to it........greatness should be only for the very very elite...........fighters that are literally in the top 50 etc.

Jones was a very good fighter but deffo ducked so many guys...........its not even funny.......BUT he is still far better head to head, pound for pound, and accomplishments than mr hatton ever is.

True greats - L.Lewis, Ali, SRRobinson, SRLeonard, P. Whitaker, Hagler, J. Louis, Monzon, Duran, Hears, Pryor, Tyson etc etc

Nobody said they were the greatest but I doubt you would get too much resistance to the idea of them both as all-time greats and two of the best of the last 15-20 years. And yet you can make a list exactly the same of the fighters they never fought. This is simply an example, I guarantee you I can do it for pretty well any fighter of the same period. The point, which seems to have escaped your intellect is that bearing in mind (as per my post above) the number of world class fighters in and around a fighter's weight class, picking out the ones they didn't fight is not exactly a difficult task. You could quite easily do it for Pacman as well (Soto, Guzman, Valero, Casamayor, Campbell, Juan Diaz, Bradley, Witter etc... just as a basic starting point sure there are far more from his flyweight/super bantam days).

Your comments re: Jones having a far better career than Hatton and re: greatness being only for the true cream of the crop are accurate, but they are also completely irrelevant to this discussion. And for all your meaningless analogies about charades or smoke and mirrors (which are straight out of the Betty school), I would rather stick to the hard truth.

Which is that Ricky Hatton has had a good career in which he has beaten two p4p ranked fighters, a number of other good beltholder/top ten level fighters, been widely accepted as the top guy in his division for 4 years and lost only to two bona fide all-time greats. That, in my view, means he has had a very good career. Better than all British fighters of my generation with the exceptions of Lennox Lewis, Joe Calzaghe, Naseem Hamed and Nigel Benn (possibly Eubank as well but his top performances on some good nights were interspersed with far too many sleepwalking shows against average fighters).

This means he has had a career which he can be proud of. He has been a better fighter and fought better opposition than 99% of British fighters of the same era. He is one of the greatest British fighters of the last 20 years and has had a pretty good record by anyone's standards. Of course he's not going to go down as a legend or an all time great but he was far better than your run-of-the-mill beltholder type and I wouldn't be amazed if he managed to sneak into the hall of fame.

That is all.

["TKO"]

rumour has it that Hatton might fight Humberto Soto as he is a reigining world champ right guys? Come on a peak fighter who happens to be a champ......yeah thats it.........we can advertise as Hatton beating his 330th champion..........yeah brilliant isnt it

You say you are not biased against his career and then come out with something like this? You then wonder why you lack credibility on this board? Utter tripe I would say. Nice avatar and that's about it.

[Utter1]

Nobody said they were the greatest but I doubt you would get too much resistance to the idea of them both as all-time greats and two of the best of the last 15-20 years. And yet you can make a list exactly the same of the fighters they never fought. This is simply an example, I guarantee you I can do it for pretty well any fighter of the same period. The point, which seems to have escaped your intellect is that bearing in mind (as per my post above) the number of world class fighters in and around a fighter's weight class, picking out the ones they didn't fight is not exactly a difficult task. You could quite easily do it for Pacman as well (Soto, Guzman, Valero, Casamayor, Campbell, Juan Diaz, Bradley, Witter etc... just as a basic starting point sure there are far more from his flyweight/super bantam days).

Your comments re: Jones having a far better career than Hatton and re: greatness being only for the true cream of the crop are accurate, but they are also completely irrelevant to this discussion. And for all your meaningless analogies about charades or smoke and mirrors (which are straight out of the Betty school), I would rather stick to the hard truth.

Which is that Ricky Hatton has had a good career in which he has beaten two p4p ranked fighters, a number of other good beltholder/top ten level fighters, been widely accepted as the top guy in his division for 4 years and lost only to two bona fide all-time greats. That, in my view, means he has had a very good career. Better than all British fighters of my generation with the exceptions of Lennox Lewis, Joe Calzaghe, Naseem Hamed and Nigel Benn (possibly Eubank as well but his top performances on some good nights were interspersed with far too many sleepwalking shows against average fighters).

This means he has had a career which he can be proud of. He has been a better fighter and fought better opposition than 99% of British fighters of the same era. He is one of the greatest British fighters of the last 20 years and has had a pretty good record by anyone's standards. Of course he's not going to go down as a legend or an all time great but he was far better than your run-of-the-mill beltholder type and I wouldn't be amazed if he managed to sneak into the hall of fame.

That is all.

blah blah blah...........the main point is this.........Hatton when he became champ of 140 pound division could have faced better opponents than he did.........hence me naming so many other fighters he COULD have fought of course you can list such and such not facing such and such. Your not getting the point.........Pacman went after the best AVAILBLE fighters he could fight.........so its no good saying he didnt fight such and such as if to make some sort of valid point which in essence is void in its very base. In fact the fact that you mentiond the fighters pacman didnt face is incredibly funny..........and if no one else sees that then it shows so much for each and every individual.

Pacman faced Barrera, Morales, Marquez, Diaz, Oscar De La Hoya and now facing Cotto. I bet you any money that if he defeats cotto he will go after mawyweather or the likes of P. Williams.......the guy will try anything to test himself.

Il say it again average world class fighter............popularity clouded real sound judgement.

In fact Hatton is on the same level as carl froch is on the world stage along with Calzaghe.

Froch is also making Joe im gonna take 10 years to do something look somewhat silly.

[Utter1]

You say you are not biased against his career and then come out with something like this? You then wonder why you lack credibility on this board? Utter tripe I would say. Nice avatar and that's about it.


Im not biased at all you foollllll........who do u think i supported wen he fought pacman and Mayweather? fucking the manchester brawler....Exactly u aint got a clue......what i dont like is the fact that people try to make out he is an all time great which suggests he is on par with other greats.

Skill, technique, etc etc is severly lacking for Mr Hatton.

The fact that i spoke of him fighting his 330th champion from 130 pound division was to make several points.........A. taking the piss out of Hatton talking to the casual observer of our sport and media about how he is a 5 time champ etc and 8 weight champion and the fact that people will sit in all day and harp on about his win over fucking castillo who fought most of his carrer a division lower.

The guy never took flat out risks or did anything to suggest he was trying some great...............of course taking on mayweather and pacman was a risk but one that came with him being able to say he lost to the very best in his weight.

I have no doubt that hatton himself actually thought he cud beat them hence the reason he fought then and for huge amount of cash.

[GazOC]

So you don't think asking why Hatton didn't fight Devon Alexander and bunch of welterweights is just a little bit biased? Whoever Hatton fought inbetween 2005-2008 at 140 you'd just say they wern't as good as the guys he didn't fight. If he hadn't have fought them fighters like Urango and Mallinaggi would become world beaters that Hatton ducked.

And how about then saying that 140lb division shouldn't even exist? The same division thats been around for 50+ years and has thrown up champions like Pryor, Zoo, Cervantes etc? Is that the lengths you're willing to go to discredit Hatton, abolish an entire weight class??

[JIM KELLY]

when he stopped castillo, people gave hatton the nod of being elite! Ok he gota gift against that latino kat, forgot his name, that was at 147..

Hatton got caught up in his celebrations, eating and drinking. But he his victories over those two, will hold him high in British Boxing!

[JohnAkiBoa]

That Bum would never won Tzsyu in a boxing match foolish Brits:lol:

[TheUzi]

That Bum would never won Tzsyu in a boxing match foolish Brits:lol:


Nice point buddy.

[Utter1]

My point Gaz, is that Hatton has so many fighters left off his ledger that to call him great signifies that he some sort of god like boxer when he has failed to meet at least half of the other top boxers around.

Me throwing in Alexander is showing yet another top fighter around his weight that Hatton will not risk it with.

If Hatton really wanted to........becuase of fame and popular support could makes so many fights before next summers its unreal......if he keeps harping about being a legend.....why cant he take on his old rival and shut the likes of me or any other critic of his carrer up......wouldnt it be brill if Hatton smashed him up? but he wont......why cant he take on Bradley or Alexander the new guns on the block.

Why cant he take on Mosley or P. Williams and take proper risks?

Are we really gonna sit back and let him tell us that he took risks by fighting Mayweather and Pacman?

there was no risk......Hatton thought he could beat them becuase he believed he was bigger, and deluded himself. He also deep down knew and his handlers that the reward was far to good to turn down and he could come out with the old 'well i lost to the pound for pound best'........he lost nothing in the true sense of the word.

If Hatton went on took on Bradley who is on his way up and has two belts or fucking takes a huge gamble and takes on mosley (bigger than him) or witter (stock has gone down) then do you really think people are gonna moan that much?

I reckon he would win a few of them..........but we will never know......as he hand picks.

Im not biased towards this guy carrer...........Floyd is just as bad......if Floyd leaves his own era without fighting Cotto, Mosley, Margarito and P. Williams then you cant put him a true all time great simple.

As ive said before Pacman was a legend before he starting taking on the 140 pounders and 147 pounders.......by taking on pound for pound legends in Morales, Barrera and top fighters like Marquez et al.

The fact he went on to beat Oscar and Hatton so easily shows up Floyd badly.

Hatton average world champ RIP

[TheUzi]

My point Gaz, is that Hatton has so many fighters left off his ledger that to call him great signifies that he some sort of god like boxer when he has failed to meet at least half of the other top boxers around.

Me throwing in Alexander is showing yet another top fighter around his weight that Hatton will not risk it with.

If Hatton really wanted to........becuase of fame and popular support could makes so many fights before next summers its unreal......if he keeps harping about being a legend.....why cant he take on his old rival and shut the likes of me or any other critic of his carrer up......wouldnt it be brill if Hatton smashed him up? but he wont......why cant he take on Bradley or Alexander the new guns on the block.

Why cant he take on Mosley or P. Williams and take proper risks?

Are we really gonna sit back and let him tell us that he took risks by fighting Mayweather and Pacman?

there was no risk......Hatton thought he could beat them becuase he believed he was bigger, and deluded himself. He also deep down knew and his handlers that the reward was far to good to turn down and he could come out with the old 'well i lost to the pound for pound best'........he lost nothing in the true sense of the word.

If Hatton went on took on Bradley who is on his way up and has two belts or fucking takes a huge gamble and takes on mosley (bigger than him) or witter (stock has gone down) then do you really think people are gonna moan that much?

I reckon he would win a few of them..........but we will never know......as he hand picks.

Im not biased towards this guy carrer...........Floyd is just as bad......if Floyd leaves his own era without fighting Cotto, Mosley, Margarito and P. Williams then you cant put him a true all time great simple.

As ive said before Pacman was a legend before he starting taking on the 140 pounders and 147 pounders.......by taking on pound for pound legends in Morales, Barrera and top fighters like Marquez et al.

The fact he went on to beat Oscar and Hatton so easily shows up Floyd badly.

Hatton average world champ RIP


Do you think he could beat Paul Williams?


Im a Hatton fan and of course he cant. You not think Hatton knows this?
So why the fuck would he take a fight he has no chance of winning?

To prove something to hateful pricks like you?

Your arguements make ZERO sense,WHATS YOUR ACTUAL POINT ANYWAY?

["TKO"]

My point Gaz, is that Hatton has so many fighters left off his ledger that to call him great signifies that he some sort of god like boxer when he has failed to meet at least half of the other top boxers around.

Me throwing in Alexander is showing yet another top fighter around his weight that Hatton will not risk it with.

If Hatton really wanted to........becuase of fame and popular support could makes so many fights before next summers its unreal......if he keeps harping about being a legend.....why cant he take on his old rival and shut the likes of me or any other critic of his carrer up......wouldnt it be brill if Hatton smashed him up? but he wont......why cant he take on Bradley or Alexander the new guns on the block.

Why cant he take on Mosley or P. Williams and take proper risks?

Are we really gonna sit back and let him tell us that he took risks by fighting Mayweather and Pacman?

there was no risk......Hatton thought he could beat them becuase he believed he was bigger, and deluded himself. He also deep down knew and his handlers that the reward was far to good to turn down and he could come out with the old 'well i lost to the pound for pound best'........he lost nothing in the true sense of the word.

If Hatton went on took on Bradley who is on his way up and has two belts or fucking takes a huge gamble and takes on mosley (bigger than him) or witter (stock has gone down) then do you really think people are gonna moan that much?

I reckon he would win a few of them..........but we will never know......as he hand picks.

Im not biased towards this guy carrer...........Floyd is just as bad......if Floyd leaves his own era without fighting Cotto, Mosley, Margarito and P. Williams then you cant put him a true all time great simple.

As ive said before Pacman was a legend before he starting taking on the 140 pounders and 147 pounders.......by taking on pound for pound legends in Morales, Barrera and top fighters like Marquez et al.

The fact he went on to beat Oscar and Hatton so easily shows up Floyd badly.

Hatton average world champ RIP

1. Who is calling him great? Very few knowledgeable boxing fans will tell you he's nothing more than a very good world champion who had some notable wins and is one of the top British fighters of his era.

2. As regards Alexander, you have just proven the point I was making yesterday about the huge number of fighters in the ratings and how any idiot can list the fighters a guy didn't take on. Alexander has had one (unsatisfactory but) decent win and you're rabbiting on about Hatton not facing him. This is the whole point, the top ten rankings change continuously, as soon as you beat one guy another takes his place. Look at Calzaghe, as soon as he beat Lacy he's ducking Kessler as soon as he beats Kessler he's ducking Dawson or Froch.

3. Witter (I assume that's who you mean) is Hatton's rival in his own head only. Rivalry has to be two ways and Hatton simply doesn't give a stuff about him. If you think that smashing him up would shut up any critic of Hatton's career then you are deluded, the majority of these people are those who have taken some retarded dislike to him and will criticise ANYTHING he ever does. Hell the moment Witter lost to Bradley and Hatton signed the Malignaggi (the last "new kid on the block") fight, the "Hatton is avoiding Bradley" threads started.

4. He is not a real welterweight and only stepped up there for the lure of getting Mayweather in the ring. Guys like Williams and Mosley would be far too big for him. If you're comfortable at a weight class, there is little point stepping out of it unnecessarily.

5. However, you like to try and twist things, taking on the top two pound for pound fighters in boxing is taking the two biggest risks in boxing, i.e. the two fighters you're most likely to lose to. Plus going to the states to do it as well. I haven't seen a British fighter take that kind of risk since Lennox Lewis (OK maybe Clinton Woods v RJJ). These guys are fighters, they don't think about "what can I say if I lose", they think about the best opponents and the best challenges. No other British fighter of the last 20 years other than Lewis has taken on the kind of challenges Hatton has.

Your posts are not logical. They seem to be nothing more than "why didn't he fight this guy or that guy"? As I have already demonstrated several times, there is nothing easier than to pick out a list of fighters a champ didn't face. Being a fair minded guy I prefer to concentrate on what he DID achieve as I do for all fighters. I think there are only Lewis, Hamed, Benn and (arguably) Calzaghe of the last 20 years who have achieved more for British boxing. But to start from the perspective of "who can I find that he didn't face" simply shows a pre-conceived negative slant which makes your posts lack any kind of credibility.

[GazOC]

My point Gaz, is that Hatton has so many fighters left off his ledger that to call him great signifies that he some sort of god like boxer when he has failed to meet at least half of the other top boxers around.

Me throwing in Alexander is showing yet another top fighter around his weight that Hatton will not risk it with.

If Hatton really wanted to........becuase of fame and popular support could makes so many fights before next summers its unreal......if he keeps harping about being a legend.....why cant he take on his old rival and shut the likes of me or any other critic of his carrer up......wouldnt it be brill if Hatton smashed him up? but he wont......why cant he take on Bradley or Alexander the new guns on the block.

Why cant he take on Mosley or P. Williams and take proper risks?

Are we really gonna sit back and let him tell us that he took risks by fighting Mayweather and Pacman?

there was no risk......Hatton thought he could beat them becuase he believed he was bigger, and deluded himself. He also deep down knew and his handlers that the reward was far to good to turn down and he could come out with the old 'well i lost to the pound for pound best'........he lost nothing in the true sense of the word.

If Hatton went on took on Bradley who is on his way up and has two belts or fucking takes a huge gamble and takes on mosley (bigger than him) or witter (stock has gone down) then do you really think people are gonna moan that much?

I reckon he would win a few of them..........but we will never know......as he hand picks.

Im not biased towards this guy carrer...........Floyd is just as bad......if Floyd leaves his own era without fighting Cotto, Mosley, Margarito and P. Williams then you cant put him a true all time great simple.

As ive said before Pacman was a legend before he starting taking on the 140 pounders and 147 pounders.......by taking on pound for pound legends in Morales, Barrera and top fighters like Marquez et al.

The fact he went on to beat Oscar and Hatton so easily shows up Floyd badly.

Hatton average world champ RIP

I don't see anyone calling him "great" or an ATG? To use your words an "Average world champion" is a fucking good fighter in my book.

Hatton fighting people like Margo and Williams isn't a risk, they are both pretty much unwinnable fights for Hatton IMHO given his style and physical limitations.

He did have a decent set of opponents at 140 from 2005 onwards and deliberately picking out the guys from that weight that he didn't fight as being the best IS being very one-eyed over Hattons career.

Alexander has been on the scene for less than a week and Hatton is avoiding him? If Hatton had of fought Alexander before that you be calling the guy an unproven prospect and slagging off Hatton for not fighting Malinaggii who was a former belt holder and Hattons number 1 contender.

[TheUzi]

Agree with everything you said there TKO but he should've faced Witter you not think?
When they were both coming through,that was a fight that was building up nicely.

[GazOC]

Agree with everything you said there TKO but he should've faced Witter you not think?
When they were both coming through,that was a fight that was building up nicely.

Yep, no argument there, a Hatton-Witter fight from 2003-2005 would have been a great domestic match up but it didn't happen. Life goes on and, given who Hatton went on to fight, its not the big issue that some agenda driven people would like to make it into.

[TFFP]

This thread needs to be deleted promptly.

It started off pretty badly and has descended into muppetry.

[GazOC]

It started off pretty badly and has descended into muppetry.

Was it the "Hatton ducked Alexander" part?;)

[TFFP]

That was a lowlight.

[TheUzi]

Ducked Baldomir apparently

[PowerPuncher]

Anyway I answered this a couple of a years ago, but I'll go with:

Lennox - Holy, Tyson

Arguably:

Benn - McClellan, Barkley (arguable Eubank)
Eubank - Benn, Watson
Buchanon - Laguana (twice), Ortiz
Honeyghan - Curry, Blocker
Calzaghe - Hopkins, Kessler/Eubank/Jones

[Utter1]

Do you think he could beat Paul Williams?


Im a Hatton fan and of course he cant. You not think Hatton knows this?
So why the fuck would he take a fight he has no chance of winning?

To prove something to hateful pricks like you?

Your arguements make ZERO sense,WHATS YOUR ACTUAL POINT ANYWAY?


Point is that the guy was an avaerage world level operator who got hyped up as the second coming, and the way people try to make out he is an all time great.

I dont think Hatton would have a chance with many of the very best fighters on there best nights around 135, 140 and 147.

If boxing was based on the UFC model......only one champion and fewer divisions........do you really think he would have been a champ.......in fact im always saying we should melt the 135, 140 and 147 divisions togeather.......make 3 into 1 and then you get the best of the best vying for the world attention.....

[Utter1]

I don't see anyone calling him "great" or an ATG? To use your words an "Average world champion" is a fucking good fighter in my book.

Hatton fighting people like Margo and Williams isn't a risk, they are both pretty much unwinnable fights for Hatton IMHO given his style and physical limitations.

He did have a decent set of opponents at 140 from 2005 onwards and deliberately picking out the guys from that weight that he didn't fight as being the best IS being very one-eyed over Hattons career.

Alexander has been on the scene for less than a week and Hatton is avoiding him? If Hatton had of fought Alexander before that you be calling the guy an unproven prospect and slagging off Hatton for not fighting Malinaggii who was a former belt holder and Hattons number 1 contender.


NEVER said he was avoiding him, i agree with the first part.........of your post

[essexboy]

Anyway I answered this a couple of a years ago, but I'll go with:

Lennox - Holy, Tyson

Arguably:

Benn - McClellan, Barkley (arguable Eubank)
Eubank - Benn, Watson
Buchanon - Laguana (twice), Ortiz
Honeyghan - Curry, Blocker
Calzaghe - Hopkins, Kessler/Eubank/Jones

Yeah Lennox, Benn, Buchanan and Honeyghan all have more impressive wins. Calzaghe arguably.

Going right back Jack 'Kid' Berg probably has some of the best wins for a British fighter over guys like Billy Petrolle, Mushy Callahan, Tony Canzoneri and Kid Chocolatte.

Still I take nothing away from Hatton hes done his bit for British boxing in his era.

[HeavyT]

Alexander has been on the scene for less than a week and Hatton is avoiding him? If Hatton had of fought Alexander before that you be calling the guy an unproven prospect and slagging off Hatton for not fighting Malinaggii who was a former belt holder and Hattons number 1 contender.

Couldn't agree more