What happened to the British school?

[WhataRock]

Where have all those skillful Brits gone?

The UK is still churning out excellent fighters. Amazing athletes like Calzaghe, Hamed, Hatton, Froch, Eubanks and even Khan...Lewis if you want to count him as British schooled.

But what happened to the skills that so many great Brits had?

Ken Buchanan, Howard Winstone, Al Rudkin, John Conteh, Chris Finnegan, Dave McAuley, Pat Cowdell, Walter McGowen, Dave Green, Johnny Sullivan etc...all these guys were very well schooled for the most part. The jab, the footwork, the bob and weave defensive moves so many used to great effect seem somewhat absent in their modern compatriots.

Im not trying to rubbish this crop of British fighters at all and maybe I got it all wrong anyway. Guys like Graham, Calzaghe and Hamed especially are as good or better then any of these guys and they rely on their awkwardness and unconventional style to succeed.
But I just dont see the same level of technical ability in a lot of the other more classically styled fighters like Woods, Froch, Lockett, Jennings and those kind of guys.

Thoughts? Agree..Disagree, if so what I am missing.

[klompton]

"Where have all those skillful Brits gone?"


They got tired of getting knocked out by Americans.

[TBooze]

"Where have all those skillful Brits gone?"


They got tired of getting knocked out by Americans.

The same Americans who now take the easy option and try their hand at throwing a ball in a bin 10 foot up in the air!

USA and the United Kingdom have the same problem, the sport is not as popular as it once was in either country, and as such the Americans who could of made it, decided to go the American Football or Basketball route, whilst we lose a hell of a lot of potential boxers to Football.

If you make it in all of them three sports you make yourself a fortune and if you lose in Basketball, American Football or Football there is always next week...

Our standards of living are such, we do not need to be as tough as we used to.

[Flea Man]

Maybe Degale and Gavin will change that. Boxing just isn't the sport it used to be over here. Regular tv doesn't screen it.....kids wanna be footballers nowadays.

[Tin_Ribs]

The general level of old school training knowledge has deteriorated too. Fellows like Brian Lawrence are doing their best to keep it going but the mainstream undermines it. Blood like Anthony Farnell and Joe Gallagher might do something to change things hopefully......

It speaks volumes when you've got Barry McGuigan claiming Hatton to be an ATG British fighter of the highest calibre and Oscar De La Hoya a surefire top 10 welterweight of all time. And he's meant to be a top level analyst.

[Mantequilla]

"Where have all those skillful Brits gone?"


They got tired of getting knocked out by Americans.

C'mon Klompton that's an egregious post.Rooster worthy even.;)


I agree with Rock here, the technical quality of British fighters has gone way down since the nineties.I just don't think there is the same level of trainers in the country anymore.Even looking at someone like Sibbo, who was seen as more of a puncher and aggressive left-hooker, than a stylist...compared to someone like Hatton he fights like Napoles or Canizales.

I'd include Eubank as one of the last of the older-school stylists though.He had that '70s Panamanian stylist thing going on a lot of the time.He was invconsistent, but had the technical skills.

[dee-z-r]

Maybe Degale and Gavin will change that. Boxing just isn't the sport it used to be over here. Regular tv doesn't screen it.....kids wanna be footballers nowadays.

yh ive actually been impressed by gavin alot

[Flea Man]

The general level of old school training knowledge has deteriorated too. Fellows like Brian Lawrence are doing their best to keep it going but the mainstream undermines it. Blood like Anthony Farnell and Joe Gallagher might do something to change things hopefully......

It speaks volumes when you've got Barry McGuigan claiming Hatton to be an ATG British fighter of the highest calibre and Oscar De La Hoya a surefire top 10 welterweight of all time. And he's meant to be a top level analyst.

McGuigan thought Akinwande could prove to be one of the greatest heavyweights ever. He knows jack shit.

Rob McCracken is a very good trainer too. I think it's more to do with the fact that there isn't any talent coming through, and when there is they're in the wrong place or don't stumble across the right trainer.

[PowerPuncher]

Knowledge dies with the trainers allot of the time, that and boxers trying to be more unorthodox these days

[PowerPuncher]

McGuigan thought Akinwande could prove to be one of the greatest heavyweights ever. He knows jack shit.

Rob McCracken is a very good trainer too. I think it's more to do with the fact that there isn't any talent coming through, and when there is they're in the wrong place or don't stumble across the right trainer.

To an extent McGuigan tows what his bosses ask him to say, if they say build up Akiwande he will. Barry does spout some crap but still 1 of the most likable men in the sport

[klompton]

C'mon Klompton that's an egregious post.Rooster worthy even.;)


I agree with Rock here, the technical quality of British fighters has gone way down since the nineties.I just don't think there is the same level of trainers in the country anymore.Even looking at someone like Sibbo, who was seen as more of a puncher and aggressive left-hooker, than a stylist...compared to someone like Hatton he fights like Napoles or Canizales.

I'd include Eubank as one of the last of the older-school stylists though.He had that '70s Panamanian stylist thing going on a lot of the time.He was invconsistent, but had the technical skills.


I thought it was kind of funny. For years and years the British themselves would lament the fact that they would get behind a pretty, stylish fighter only to have him knocked out everytime he stepped up at the world level. Now its the Brits who are fighting in a more American, professional style and Americans are the ones suffering for it.

[Mantequilla]

I think the British fighters of most previous decades were generally better right across the board than this past era and mostly had far more adaptable and pro orientated styles.


You could be right as far as comparing how the likes of Froch and Hatton fight to emerging american talent like the inept Dirrell though.

[GPater11093]

i think it starts in the ams now

when you first start the stylists are at a distinct disadvantage. An aggresive brawler beats a stylist early in the amatuers. Cuase the stylists dont have the technical skills yet to deal with aggresive brawlers who dont have to be as skilled.

So these boxers say 'fuck it' i train hard learn the sport but someone not in my class beats me because there big and strong. so they think whats the point and do something else.

In britain were training guys to win but not to box beautifully in doing it. and the skillful guys suffer.

[PowerPuncher]

C'mon Klompton that's an egregious post.Rooster worthy even.;)


I agree with Rock here, the technical quality of British fighters has gone way down since the nineties.I just don't think there is the same level of trainers in the country anymore.Even looking at someone like Sibbo, who was seen as more of a puncher and aggressive left-hooker, than a stylist...compared to someone like Hatton he fights like Napoles or Canizales.

I'd include Eubank as one of the last of the older-school stylists though.He had that '70s Panamanian stylist thing going on a lot of the time.He was invconsistent, but had the technical skills.

Bit of a bad example old Chris, Eubank was trained in the American system and when he came back to Britain he said British trainers and boxers weren't up to much and has less skill, didnt go down too well :lol:

[Casamayor122]

Lewis if you want to count him as British schooled.

Lewis learned his trade in Canada.

[Unforgiven]

The British boxers used to generally follow a similar style of operating mostly from a stand-up stance, straight left, right cross, boxing from a distance, but many try to copy American styles in the last two decades, which is okay if they are copying good American styles. Often not though.

[mcvey]

"Where have all those skillful Brits gone?"


They got tired of getting knocked out by Americans.

I hope your book on Harry Greb is more objective than your post.

Driscoll

Buchanan
Watt
McGowan
Lynch
Calzaghe
Eubanks
Hamed
Benn
No kos by Americans on their records.

[duranimal]

When i was a kid boxing was mainstream, when i was 5 years old one of my 1st teachers had us all with gloves on in the playground, today he'd be jailed, All my school teachers were ex-military so boxing was just always there if yer wanted to get involved & these guys obviously were old school in their styles in as "Hit & don't get hit" milling on the retreat!! but the style was mostly approached in what you today would call fisticly amatuer, to describe this as in Brits went to a boxing match & yanks went to a fight. I recken the new generation approach the game in the american way as it's a businnes after all & the TV marketing boys want to see crash/bang/wallop.

I veiw Dirrel as a fantastic exponent of superier boxing but he'll not get much support or $$$$ earning oportunities in this day & age due to whats viewed as a negative style, times change & what we've got is what we've got, it's all about entertainment & folk now days want to see a fight, toe 2 toe aggression sells & it's all about the PPv numbers so if yer want yer snout in the trough you've got to thug it up IMO.

[WhataRock]

duran..Im fairly certain they have banned any kind of boxing in the Australian Defence Force..even on your own time.

By that I mean organised fights and sparring...How is pussy is that for a military to ban boxing.

[GPater11093]

duran..Im fairly certain they have banned any kind of boxing in the Australian Defence Force..even on your own time.

By that I mean organised fights and sparring...How is pussy is that for a military to ban boxing.

fucking hell :-(

my trainer was a Para in the british army, they had to fight there best mate bare-knuckle for 5 minutes as one of the tests to get in (dont know if it was officail like) was a way of de humanising thme in a way

[PowerPuncher]

When i was a kid boxing was mainstream, when i was 5 years old one of my 1st teachers had us all with gloves on in the playground, today he'd be jailed, All my school teachers were ex-military so boxing was just always there if yer wanted to get involved & these guys obviously were old school in their styles in as "Hit & don't get hit" milling on the retreat!! but the style was mostly approached in what you today would call fisticly amatuer, to describe this as in Brits went to a boxing match & yanks went to a fight. I recken the new generation approach the game in the american way as it's a businnes after all & the TV marketing boys want to see crash/bang/wallop.

I veiw Dirrel as a fantastic exponent of superier boxing but he'll not get much support or $$$$ earning oportunities in this day & age due to whats viewed as a negative style, times change & what we've got is what we've got, it's all about entertainment & folk now days want to see a fight, toe 2 toe aggression sells & it's all about the PPv numbers so if yer want yer snout in the trough you've got to thug it up IMO.

Boxing was actually in Brit schools a couple of years ago

[duranimal]

fucking hell :-(

my trainer was a Para in the british army, they had to fight there best mate bare-knuckle for 5 minutes as one of the tests to get in (dont know if it was officail like) was a way of de humanising thme in a way

I don't think it's bare-knuckle, 16oz jobs & no head shots, or that could be the marines? but my mate was a para & yeh it's still something yer've got to do & do well or you're obviously fucked off out, 5 min non-stop till yer spew. there's only one rule in there & thats win or near on die in the effort.

[duranimal]

Boxing was actually in Brit schools a couple of years ago

Is that state schools? i know that cunt Tony Blair jumped on the bandwagon when Khan won the olympic silver medal & they all jumped on him for the photo shoot & promised this & that about letting boxing back on the cariculum, i thought it was all the usual spin shite + health & safty laws bollocks would kill it. It's always been around private fee paying schools, non-state funded.

[GPater11093]

I don't think it's bare-knuckle, 16oz jobs & no head shots, or that could be the marines? but my mate was a para & yeh it's still something yer've got to do & do well or you're obviously fucked off out, 5 min non-stop till yer spew. there's only one rule in there & thats win or near on die in the effort.

could be whatever it was it wasnae a good thing

[duranimal]

duran..Im fairly certain they have banned any kind of boxing in the Australian Defence Force..even on your own time.

By that I mean organised fights and sparring...How is pussy is that for a military to ban boxing.

That defies belief!!!! fuckin incredible, i'll tell yer what, we've always had & still have the impression that the aussies are yer basic sort of no nonsence, fuck off, crash bang wallop folk, everything thats projected about you lot is positive, can do, shark wrestling, croc fucking, kangeroo fighting, ect & obviously the Aussie army would be the antipodion clone of the British army. What the fuck is the point that there making?? you can't have P.C. soldiers, the army's all about producing licenced killers within the law on behalf of the defence of the state.

I got into boxing in the army cadets & you were just picked & told do yer best & don't embarress the detatchment, no pressure there then.

[duranimal]

could be whatever it was it wasnae a good thing

It's purpose is to strip you down mentally & re-build you into what they want, everything from yer past is shredded as thats viewed as a handicap so yer brutalised into a new family & the NCO is yer new mum/dad, thats why the majority find it hard to assimulate back into civvy street, think/fend for themselves ect, it ai'nt easy.

[GPater11093]

yeh its abitlike that except not quite so extreme

my trainer isnt a mentalist

[TIGEREDGE]

To an extent McGuigan tows what his bosses ask him to say, if they say build up Akiwande he will. Barry does spout some crap but still 1 of the most likable men in the sport

akinwande really had a ability he just never put it all together

but you are right about barry though i like his commentary. he was comparing amir khan to ray leonard when he was on itv