greatest amatuer ever...

[Illmatic]

Tarver had an outstanding amatuer career. Felix Savon, of course, has to be in the discussion.

[Jorodz]

hmmm, off hand mark breland and benvenuti

[jonesjrp4p1]

srr 85-0 with like 69 kos and 40 something in the 1st round

sugar shane won 250 am. fights

[brooklyn1550]

Teofilo Stevenson is up there

[ChampionsForever]

JCC jr, undefeated in every amatuer fight he had.

[Oscar de la Roa]

how many amateur fights milk dud had?

[allenko1]

Yeah thats what a guy at my old gym said...Tarver is actually one the greater amateurs ever.

[BOGART]

Laszlo Papp would rate pretty high as well.

[brooklyn1550]

Leon Spinks had a great amateur career

[alex-boxer42]

I heard about a guy from scotland that was suppose to be the best back in the 60's or soemthing...

[Andrey]

Kostya Tszyu was a pure badass!!

Still is a pure badass.

But other then that I heard every single one of Freitas amateur fights ended in KO.
Don't know much else.


Andrey

[drunkenspaniard]

I've heard Fernando Vargas had a great amateur career. Of course it was Lampley that said that so... lol

[MSTR]

Kostya Tszyu was a pure badass!!

Still is a pure badass.

But other then that I heard every single one of Freitas amateur fights ended in KO.
Don't know much else.


Andrey
Agreed, KT was a phenomanel amatuer. I am sure some of the cubans that I have never heard of though would probably be better from an amatuer perspective.

[rendog67]

who was the worst amatuer to go on to great things?

[IceJohnScully]

You would be hard pressed to find a more complete and devastating machine than the 1983- 1987 version of Cuba's ANGEL ESPINOSA. As far as most dominant for a weight class..NOBODY ran a weight class like Mark Breland did at 147 in the first half of the 1980's

[IceJohnScully]

srr 85-0 with like 70 kos and 40 something in the 1st round.......not sure exact #s right now.......feel free to tell the real #s

i read in a magazine that sugar shane won 250 am. fights

Not true. Sugar Ray himself says in his autobiography that he lost to Billy Graham. Also, SRR fought in an era when there were no international fights, etc etc

[BodyBlaster]

I heard about a guy from scotland that was suppose to be the best back in the 60's or soemthing...

Probably Dick McTaggert.

[Luigi1985]

Felix Savon
Nino Benvenuti
Mark Breland
Jesse Valdez
Teofilo Stevenson
Eric Griffin

[AmazingHook]

Kostya Tszyu was a beast and considered by many to be one of the best amateur boxers of all time. Sugar Shane Mosley was amazing, the same thing with Oscar De La Hoya. Both Sugar Shane and Mosley very impressive amateur records.

Antonio Tarver, Roy Jones jr and of course Felix Savon and the list goes on

[bandeedo]

teofilo was given a good chance against ali by many boxing analysts back when they were both fighting. thats saying a lot about an amateur

[Ted Stickles]

That Courage Shabalaba was like 88 and 0 with like 70 ko's or something ridiculous like that...............Truth be told he never really got hit and we all know what happened when he did in the pro's

[Robbi]

Donald Curry deserves a mention.

[jonesjrp4p1]

Not true. Sugar Ray himself says in his autobiography that he lost to Billy Graham. Also, SRR fought in an era when there were no international fights, etc etc

really? i read the sugar ray robinson book an autobiography about him and thats what he said but maybe:think

[left hook 75]

In recent times Odlanier Solis.Correct me if I'm wrong but he actually beat Savon 2 out of the 3 times they met and didn't he stand down from the Cuban 2000 Olympic team,just so Savon could have a chance to go and win gold in his final Olympics?

[Dr Gonzo]

Kostya had an amazing amateur career - im sure thats why his transition to pro was so smooth and successful

[beatdown]

Kostya Tszyu was a pure badass!!

Still is a pure badass.

But other then that I heard every single one of Freitas amateur fights ended in KO.
Don't know much else.


Andrey


I agree, him and Mark Breland were a class above the rest

[dmille]

Laszlo Papp
1948 olympic middleweight champion
1949 european middleweight champion
1951 european light middleweight champion
1952 olympic light middleweight champion
1956 olympic light middleweight champion

[dmille]

Teofilo Stevenson
1972 olympic heavyweight champion
1972 val barker cup
1974 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1974 world heavyweight champion
1975 pan-american heavyweight champion
1976 olympic heavyweight champion
1978 world heavyweight champion
1979 pan-american heavyweight champion
1980 olympic heavyweight champion
1982 central american & caribbean super heavyweight champion
1986 world super heavyweight champion

[dmille]

Felix Savon
1985 jr world heavyweight champion
1986 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1986 world heavyweight champion
1987 pan-american heavyweight champion
1987 world cup heavyweight champion
1989 world heavyweight champion
1989 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1990 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1990 world cup heavyweight champion
1990 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1990 goodwill heavyweight champion
1991 pan-american heavyweight champion
1991 world heavyweight champion
1992 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1992 olympic heavyweight champion
1993 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1993 world heavyweight champion
1994 world cup heavyweight champion
1994 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1994 goodwill heavyweight champion
1995 pan-american heavyweight champion
1995 world heavyweight champion
1995 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1996 olympic heavyweight champion
1997 world heavyweight champion
1998 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1998 world cup heavyweight champion
1998 goodwill heavyweight champion
2000 olympic heavyweight champion

[dmille]

Probably Dick McTaggert.

Dick McTaggart
1956 olympic lightweight champion
1956 val barker cup
1958 commonwealth lightweight champion
1960 olympic lightweight bronze medalist
1961 european lightweight champion

[Dr Gonzo]

yeah Felix Savon has a great record - i saw him win gold in sydney and it was a truly great moment

[Spartan_Boxer]

Mario Kindelan was very good.

[PATSYS]

Audley has to be up there somewhere.

Matter of fact he is still looks like an amateur today, and he is fighting pros!

He has ups and downs, but who hasn't?

A-force all the way! :happy

[komar]

Felix Savon
Nino Benvenuti
Mark Breland
Jesse Valdez
Teofilo Stevenson
Eric Griffin

Mario Kindelan
Sven Ottke
Victor Ageev
Felix Savon
Nikolai Korolev
Kostya Tszyu

[BoppaZoo]

There is a few great Amatuer careers
here are some.

Kid Chocalate (CUB) 100-0
Nino Benvenuti (ITA) 119-1
Jose Napoles (CUB) 113-1
Marvin Hagler (USA) 55-1
Terry Norris (USA) 291-4
Meldrick Taylor (USA) 99-4
Bernard Hopkins (USA) 95-4
Oscar Dela Hoya (USA) 223-5
Sugar Ray Leonard (USA) 165-5
Vlad Klitschko (UKR) 134-6
Bernard Taylor (USA) 481-8 *not to bad a record
Al Minter (USA) 312-8
Tommie Hearns (USA) 155-8
Kostya Tszyu (RUS) 259-11
Virgil Hill (USA) 250-11
Donald Curry (USA) 400-16 *Not a bad career
Joel Casamayor (CUB) 330-30

there are a few to ponder on.

[BoppaZoo]

Has to be Casamayor, he had at least 330 wins. Imagine what could've been if he came straight to the States. *sighs*Bernard Taylor had 481 wins and Donald Curry had 400 wins and both men had less losses aswell.

[Super_Fly_Sam]

Curtosy of BoppaZoo in the Aus forum

Here some Records of Amatuer Records of some of the stars in Boxing.



Jose Napoles (113-1)

Oscar Dela Hoya (223-5)

Vernon Forest (225-15)

Sugar Ray Leonard (165-5)

Don Curry (400-16)

Al Minter (312-

Shane Mosely (250-16)

Joel Casamayor (330-30)



Kostya Tszyu (259-11)

[Super_Fly_Sam]

Felix Savon
1985 jr world heavyweight champion
1986 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1986 world heavyweight champion
1987 pan-american heavyweight champion
1987 world cup heavyweight champion
1989 world heavyweight champion
1989 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1990 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1990 world cup heavyweight champion
1990 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1990 goodwill heavyweight champion
1991 pan-american heavyweight champion
1991 world heavyweight champion
1992 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1992 olympic heavyweight champion
1993 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1993 world heavyweight champion
1994 world cup heavyweight champion
1994 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1994 goodwill heavyweight champion
1995 pan-american heavyweight champion
1995 world heavyweight champion
1995 world championship challenge heavyweight champion
1996 olympic heavyweight champion
1997 world heavyweight champion
1998 central american & caribbean heavyweight champion
1998 world cup heavyweight champion
1998 goodwill heavyweight champion
2000 olympic heavyweight champion



what was his actual win loss record??

surely he must be fighting pro now??

[Charles187]

what was his actual win loss record??

surely he must be fighting pro now??

362-21 - cant verify for sure though

[AllyT]

Probably Dick McTaggert.

I met an old Guy at a show in Scotland last season who modestly mentioned that he boxed as a youth. It turned out to be the man himself.

of his 634 fights he won 610, he qualified for three Olympics, winning Gold in 1956. In 1960 and 1964 he lost out to the eventual Gold medalists. (He won a bronze in 1960).

He has to be up there

[IceJohnScully]

There is a few great Amatuer careers
here are some.

Kid Chocalate (CUB) 100-0
Nino Benvenuti (ITA) 119-1
Jose Napoles (CUB) 113-1
Marvin Hagler (USA) 55-1
Terry Norris (USA) 291-4
Meldrick Taylor (USA) 99-4
Bernard Hopkins (USA) 95-4
Oscar Dela Hoya (USA) 223-5
Sugar Ray Leonard (USA) 165-5
Vlad Klitschko (UKR) 134-6
Bernard Taylor (USA) 481-8 *not to bad a record
Al Minter (USA) 312-8
Tommie Hearns (USA) 155-8
Kostya Tszyu (RUS) 259-11
Virgil Hill (USA) 250-11
Donald Curry (USA) 400-16 *Not a bad career
Joel Casamayor (CUB) 330-30

there are a few to ponder on.

These records are NOT accurate!!!! Hopkins didnt even fight anything abiut Junior Olympics!! Hagler's record...NOT accurate. Norris..??? Nooooo...I dont know where you guys get these records from but they are NOT accurate

[emanuel_augustus]

Konstantin Tszyu

[ozziebattler]

Joe Calzaghe - 109-2 and the 2 were highly disputed.

Do you wank dogs???

We are talking GREATEST....

Where is his world amateur title?

Where is his Commonwealth games gold medal??

Where is his olympic gold medal??

Oh shit he dont have any of those..

If we are talking amatuer it has to be Savon..

3time olympic gold medallist plus multiple world champ..

What you guys think his chances would of been if he had of turned pro??

Seen him absolutely school Shannon briggs among other furture top line heavyweights..

I

[Sedona]

Teofilo Stevenson is up there

Brooklyn....I scrolled through this thread to make sure Stevenson got a mention! Man, that guy was the original TERMINATOR.

[PATSYS]

Bernard Taylor had 481 wins and Donald Curry had 400 wins and both men had less losses aswell.

I guess in the amateur ranks it is all about numbers...it doesn't matter who they fight.

[Kolya]

In the amateurs in the US at least; what matters is where you place in the ranking tournaments (PAL, US Nationals, and Golden Gloves). Those earn you points depending how you place that add up to your ranking. Fighting on a national team and in international events also gets you more points for a ranking.

[Thread Stealer]

what was his actual win loss record??

surely he must be fighting pro now??

No, he's a Cuban who never defected.

[IceJohnScully]

In the amateurs in the US at least; what matters is where you place in the ranking tournaments (PAL, US Nationals, and Golden Gloves). Those earn you points depending how you place that add up to your ranking. Fighting on a national team and in international events also gets you more points for a ranking.

When I was amateur they didnt have the point ranking system. I won the PAL Nationals and it helped but I didn't get 100 points, etc. credit like I would now in this day and age. Back then I think the ranking were a little bit better reflection of the best. Now u get points for international appearances..but u get CHOSEN for international meets.

[allenko1]

When I was amateur they didnt have the point ranking system. I won the PAL Nationals and it helped but I didn't get 100 points, etc. credit like I would now in this day and age. Back then I think the ranking were a little bit better reflection of the best. Now u get points for international appearances..but u get CHOSEN for international meets.

You gotta get CHOSEN for everything it seems now.

[Hank]

The guy who beat Stevenson twice, at least once by ko. Russian guy, beat him before and after gold medel 2, if I am not mistaken. The ko took place in Cuba. Castro siezed film, never let it be released.

[IceJohnScully]

The guy who beat Stevenson twice, at least once by ko. Russian guy, beat him before and after gold medel 2, if I am not mistaken. The ko took place in Cuba. Castro siezed film, never let it be released.

Not only that but there is a guy in Cuba who stopped Savon at least twice that I know of but they still let Savon go on because he was such a huge rep for the island.

[Orishaman]

Teo Steveson , Mario Kindelan come to mind......Savon....SRR.........Kid Chocolae 100-0-86

master Flyweight Venezuelan Francisco Morochito Rodriguez won 266 lost 4...Mantequilla was 113-1 as an amateur...

how about the great Hilton family:

Ave Hilton Jr - 130-2 ex-wbc champ 168lbs (in jail presently)
Matthew Hilton - 106-0 97KO ex-ibf champ 154lbs
Alex Hilton - 101-1

Dad
Dave Hilton Sr- 72-7 59ko

[jaycuban]

The Best Amature of All time, without a dought...

Guillermo Rigondeaux (CUB) 284W - 4L (148 consecutive wins)

2 Olympic Gold Medals
2 World Championships Gold Medals
1 Pan Amarican Gold Medal
1 Central America and Caribbean Gold Medal

[Orishaman]

The Best Amature of All time, without a dought...

Guillermo Rigondeaux (CUB) 284W - 4L (148 consecutive wins)

2 Olympic Gold Medals
2 World Championships Gold Medals
1 Pan Amarican Gold Medal
1 Central America and Caribbean Gold Medal

not even close.........Kid Chocolate did lose in over 180 fights......I am was not impress wih Rigondeaux.....BTW Kindelan:

Gold on Olympics 2000, 2004
Gold on the World Amateur Champ-99, 01, 03
Gold Pan Am Games-99, 03

[sugarkills]

Sugar Ray Robinson: 85-0

[IceJohnScully]

Sugar Ray Robinson: 85-0

Sugar Ray Robinson was not unbeaten (he lost to Billy Graham) and didnt fight national or international events

[jaycuban]

not even close.........Kid Chocolate did lose in over 180 fights......I am was not impress wih Rigondeaux.....BTW Kindelan:

Gold on Olympics 2000, 2004
Gold on the World Amateur Champ-99, 01, 03
Gold Pan Am Games-99, 03


Believe me bro, Whenever im back in Cuba... they all say that they have never seen a better fighter, that he might be the best Cuban fighter ever.

[Kolya]

When I was amateur they didnt have the point ranking system. I won the PAL Nationals and it helped but I didn't get 100 points, etc. credit like I would now in this day and age. Back then I think the ranking were a little bit better reflection of the best. Now u get points for international appearances..but u get CHOSEN for international meets.

I'm not saying I like the new system; I understand technically it's supposed to be objective; but USA Boxing or at least some of the higher ups in it will have known certain guys for years and seen them grow up and have them as their favorites, I think. How did the old rankings work?

[Orishaman]

Believe me bro, Whenever im back in Cuba... they all say that they have never seen a better fighter, that he might be the best Cuban fighter ever.

Well dude they might be pulling your leg..........Guillermo had flaws...and was not as smooth as Kindelan nor Hurtado....BTW...Kindelan record is more imporessive, 7 golds....

[youthmann]

Joe Calzaghe - 109-2 and the 2 were highly disputed.

This is from JC own homepage:

Amateur Fight Statistics

Titles: 3 times school boy Champion, NABC British school boy Champion, Gaelic Games Champion, 3 times senior ABA Champion
Fights: 120. Wins: 110. (120-110 = 10 !!!!!)

[lenin]

delahoya anyone ?

[Fab2333]

what was Roy Jones amateur record?

[jaycuban]

Well dude they might be pulling your leg..........Guillermo had flaws...and was not as smooth as Kindelan nor Hurtado....BTW...Kindelan record is more imporessive, 7 golds....


what... are you kidding me ? i think you dont know your history of cuban boxing bro, stick to something else

Kindelans record of 358W - 22L is no were close to Rigondeaux's 247W - 4L (mistake on first post sorry)

and Kindelan has 7 gold medals at the age of 33, has no chance of getting another one, on the other hand Rigondeaux got 6 at the age of 24... so imageine how many he will have by time hes 33, he also has the possiblity of being the only fighter to ever capture 4 Olympic Medals, having won 2 at only 23 years old

[Max Molyneux]

Joe Calzaghe - 109-2 and the 2 were highly disputed.
Where did you find that?

Joe's book thinks he lost about 6 fights.

[Kolya]

what... are you kidding me ? i think you dont know your history of cuban boxing bro, stick to something else

Kindelans record of 358W - 22L is no were close to Rigondeaux's 247W - 4L (mistake on first post sorry)

and Kindelan has 7 gold medals at the age of 33, has no chance of getting another one, on the other hand Rigondeaux got 6 at the age of 24... so imageine how many he will have by time hes 33, he also has the possiblity of being the only fighter to ever capture 4 Olympic Medals, having won 2 at only 23 years old


Too bad Rigondeaux will never accomplish any of those feats, because in all likelihood he will never box internationally again.

[Darien]

Laszlo Papp would rate pretty high as well.
Sure! 3 Olympic gold medals must mean something.
By the way:
<-------

[kirk]

I've heard Fernando Vargas had a great amateur career. Of course it was Lampley that said that so... lol he was one of the youngest amature champions in history, was in the olympics, and composed a record of about 110-11... not sure but those are the numbers that i remember.

[TBooze]

Laszlo Papp would rate pretty high as well.

The mother of all understatements, Papp wins this debate fairly easy IMO.

[TBooze]

Probably Dick McTaggert.

Yeah not bad; he had a 610-24 record;)

[dmille]

1 Laszlo Papp
2 Felix Savon
3 Teofilo Stevenson
4 Boris Lagutin
5 Ariel Hernandez
6 Mario Kindelan
7 Hector Vinent
8 Oleg Saitov
9 Guillermo Rigondeaux
10 Jerzy Kulej
11 Harry Mallin

Honorable mention:
Roberto Balado
Edward Eagan
Gyorgy Gedo
Oliver Kirk
Dick McTaggart
Zbigniew Pietrzykowski
Valery Popenchenko
Arnold Van Der Lijde
Philip Waruinge

[dmille]

Boris Lagutin
1960 olympic light middleweight bronze medalist
1961 european light middleweight champion
1963 european light middleweight champion
1964 olympic light middleweight champion
1968 olympic light middleweight champion

[dmille]

Ariel Hernandez
1989 jr world welterweight champion
1990 jr world welterweight champion
1992 olympic middleweight champion
1993 world middleweight champion
1994 goodwill middleweight champion
1994 world championship challenge middleweight champion
1995 pan-american middleweight champion
1995 world middleweight champion
1996 olympic middleweight champion
1998 central american & caribbean middleweight champion
1998 goodwill middleweight champion

[dmille]

Mario Kindelan
1998 central american & caribbean lightweight champion
1998 goodwill lightweight champion
1998 world cup lightweight champion
1999 world lightweight champion
2000 olympic lightweight champion
2001 goodwill lightweight champion
2001 world lightweight champion
2003 world lightweight champion
2003 pan-american lightweight champion
2004 olympic lightweight champion

[left hook 75]

what... are you kidding me ? i think you dont know your history of cuban boxing bro, stick to something else

Kindelans record of 358W - 22L is no were close to Rigondeaux's 247W - 4L (mistake on first post sorry)

and Kindelan has 7 gold medals at the age of 33, has no chance of getting another one, on the other hand Rigondeaux got 6 at the age of 24... so imageine how many he will have by time hes 33, he also has the possiblity of being the only fighter to ever capture 4 Olympic Medals, having won 2 at only 23 years oldHasn't Rigondeaux turned pro now anyway?

[dmille]

Hector Vinent
1990 jr world light welterweight champion
1992 olympic light welterweight champion
1993 world light welterweight champion
1994 world championship challenge light welterweight champion
1994 goodwill light welterweight champion
1995 world light welterweight champion
1995 world championship challenge light welterweight champion
1996 olympic light welterweight champion

[dmille]

Oleg Saitov
1992 jr world light welterweight champion
1996 olympic welterweight champion
1997 world welterweight champion
1998 european welterweight champion
2000 olympic welterweight champion
2000 val barker cup
2004 european welterweight champion
2004 olympic weltweight bronze medalist

[dmille]

Guillermo Rigondeaux Ortiz
2000 olympic bantamweight champion
2001 world bantamweight champion
2001 goodwill bantamweight champion
2002 world cup bantamweight champion
2003 pan-american bantamweight champion
2004 olympic bantamweight champion
2005 world bantamweight champion
2006 world cup bantamweight champion
2006 central american & caribbean bantamweight champion

[dmille]

Hasn't Rigondeaux turned pro now anyway?

He was arrested in Rio and shipped back to Cuba. His career, pro or otherwise, is over. I thought he was a lock for a third gold next year. Now that is never going to happen.

[dmille]

Jerzy Kulej
1963 european light welterweight champion
1964 olympic light welterweight champion
1965 european light welterweight champion
1968 olympic light welterweight champion

[dmille]

Harry Mallin
1919 British ABA middleweight champion
1920 British ABA middleweight champion
1920 Olympic middleweight champion
1921 British ABA middleweight champion
1922 British ABA middleweight champion
1923 British ABA middleweight champion
1924 Olympic middleweight champion

[fadeintobolivia]

What is with Lennox Lewis he said in an interwiev of the german newsmagazin
"Der Spiegel" that he had something like 400 fights as an amateur.
That`s truly impressive.
I also read on wikipedia that tyson had like 200 amateur fights.
I usually knew from him that he had 24 fights is there something like a official and a unofficial amateur list are there on boxrec no amateur fight lists. Perhaps someone of you box scientists can help me out because I think amateur fighting is full of myths and untrue storys.

[TBooze]

I also read on wikipedia that

There is your problem;)

[left hook 75]

He was arrested in Rio and shipped back to Cuba. His career, pro or otherwise, is over. I thought he was a lock for a third gold next year. Now that is never going to happen.Holy shit!What a waste...

[rydersonthestorm]

I don't think savon can really be mentioned as sobis beat him twice and withdrew from the cuban team to let savon get his final medal so it is abit much to call him the best ever.

[grayggr]

I did quite well in the amateurs.

2 and a half rounds of sparring. Retired unbeaten.

[Titan1]

The guy who beat Stevenson twice, at least once by ko. Russian guy, beat him before and after gold medel 2, if I am not mistaken. The ko took place in Cuba. Castro siezed film, never let it be released.

Igor Vysotsky.

[Titan1]

Ray Leonard
Leon Spinks
Clint Jackson
Bernard Taylor
Mark Breland
Tony Tubbs
Greg Page
Howard Davis Jr.

[Orishaman]

As I posted previously, Mario Kindelan IMO was the best amateur boxer,he dominated his weight class like no other even Guillermo

[dmille]

It's funny when people years ago said their favorite war movie was 'Paths of Glory' then they change it to 'Lawrence of Arabia' when you read a particular thread they responded to. These fickle minded people kill me.

It's pathetic when people pm fellow posters to draw attention to threads that no one gave a damn about in the first place. These self-absorbed, head-up-their-ass people kill me.