What's the highest ranking you'd find valid for Luis Manuel Rodriguez?

[Popkins]

The more I look into his career, the more I appreciate him (though his KO at the hands of Benvenuti is one of the best single-shot finishes I've ever seen).

I often see very high rankings given to Emile Griffith (justifiably of course) and Jose Napoles too (to a lesser extent), but Rodriguez does not seem to hold the same sort of status on this forum.

What do you think, is Rodriguez a top 30 guy? Top 40? If not that, then what?

Looking forward to reading your opinions on the great man's career and abilities. :good

[Raging B(_)LL]

The more I look into his career, the more I appreciate him (though his KO at the hands of Benvenuti is one of the best single-shot finishes I've ever seen).

I often see very high rankings given to Emile Griffith (justifiably of course) and Jose Napoles too (to a lesser extent), but Rodriguez does not seem to hold the same sort of status on this forum.

What do you think, is Rodriguez a top 30 guy? Top 40? If not that, then what?

Looking forward to reading your opinions on the great man's career and abilities. :good

Luis is unquestionably a top 30 fighter imo, no doubt about it in my mind. This is a man who while barely weighing in over the welterweight limit fought and defeated countless full fledged and hard hitting middleweights, stopping several of them as well while outboxing the others with ease. And all the while he was still facing the best fighters in his own division at welter, the mans body of work is simply unbelievable and his record against his stellar opposition speaks for itself.

I also had him winning all four bouts vs Griffith rather clearly, and I often wonder to myself how he would be remembered had he been given the decisions in their fights. At the very least he would be remembered as being Griffith`s superior which I believe he was, and that is no knock on Emile who was a great fighter himself, just not as good as Luis.

This is the same Rodriguez who twice easly outpointed the dangerous Rubin Carter who was on a tear at the time and who would go on to stop Emile in a single round, the same Carter who boasted before the fight with Emile that no welterweight belongs in the ring with him yet who had his head handed to him by Luis not once, but twice.

I could go on and on about Luis merits as a fighter but then I would never stop typing, so in a nutshell I`ll only say that on his best day I would give Luis no less than a 50/50 chance against ANY former great welter or middle that ever lived, he was just that good a fighter and truly one of a kind, we likely won`t see the likes of him again alas.

[WhataRock]

I have top 40 alltime and top 5 at welter.

[Popkins]

Luis is unquestionably a top 30 fighter imo, no doubt about it in my mind. This is a man who while barely weighing in over the welterweight limit fought and defeated countless full fledged and hard hitting middleweights, stopping several of them as well while outboxing the others with ease. And all the while he was still facing the best fighters in his own division at welter, the mans body of work is simply unbelievable and his record against his stellar opposition speaks for itself.

I also had him winning all four bouts vs Griffith rather clearly, and I often wonder to myself how he would be remembered had he been given the decisions in their fights. At the very least he would be remembered as being Griffith`s superior which I believe he was, and that is no knock on Emile who was a great fighter himself, just not as good as Luis.

This is the same Rodriguez who twice easly outpointed the dangerous Rubin Carter who was on a tear at the time and who would go on to stop Emile in a single round, the same Carter who boasted before the fight with Emile that no welterweight belongs in the ring with him yet who had his head handed to him by Luis not once, but twice.

I could go on and on about Luis merits as a fighter but then I would never stop typing, so in a nutshell I`ll only say that on his best day I would give Luis no less than a 50/50 chance against ANY former great welter or middle that ever lived, he was just that good a fighter and truly one of a kind, we likely won`t see the likes of him again alas.

Brilliant response, thanks dude :good

[Flea Man]

Haven't seen any of the Griffith fights (though I maye have some) but as most that have seem to think Rodriguez got the better of the series, it's hard not to put him in the top 30.

I'd have him around 30-35. His other achievements are outstanding and from the footage I have seen of him (supplied by his major advocate a few posts up :good) the man was superb.

Haven't brought myself to watch the Benevenuti fight; apparently it's brutal :lol:

[Mantequilla]

top 20.


A truly great fighter.

[WhataRock]

Brutal ending...fairly average fight though Flea.

LMR was doing well but it was a messy fight. Benvenuti looked uninspired and LMR looked a bit past it.

[Flea Man]

Brutal ending...fairly average fight though Flea.

LMR was doing well but it was a messy fight. Benvenuti looked uninspired and LMR looked a bit past it.

Will have to check it out though. At least it's of historical worth, two top names, and as many have said a savage stoppage.

[GPater11093]

I have LMR vs Jesse Smith (or Gene Burton get them 2 micxed up)

Where LMR puts on a clinic in movement and jabbing very interesting to watch. I have also seen 5 rounds of teh 3rd Griffith fight which was very competitive but LMR oozed class and was superb (as was Griffith though)

Really need to see more LMR

[WhataRock]

Love his fight with Moyer.

Bit of a slow start but as soon as he gets going he is magic to watch.

His hands are like magnets, always finding their mark. Such beautiful timing and technical ability.

I think everyone is familiar with the ability of Denny. I believe Luis was the first man to stop him and the last guy to knock him out legit until Monzon years later.

The one thing I gotta say about LMR is you wouldnt know how good he was unless you really looked into him. Ask me 5 years ago who he was and I would have probably said the guy who was the welter champ briefly. I dont think I had seen any film of him or knew much about him at all.

But you dig a little deeper and you see he was jobbed in his series against Griffith, beat a ton of contenders of time including the other top fighter of the time in Cokes. Rightfully should have been the no1 for those years, instead of having to go the hard route to get another shot. You look a little more and you see his non-title record is insane. Especially considering, as Raging B said, he was a welterweight tearing apart fair dinkum middleweights in what was one of the best eras for the weight.

People are so hung up on trinkets and pretty records these days. Ive lost count the amount of people who just judge this guy on what boxrec says, so often does not tell the whole story. You really need to look at the names a guy beat even when it wasnt for a title, and where you can actually see the fights.

Its pays research sometimes and I for one am glad I found out about this man.

[sweet_scientist]

Having just seen the fourth Rodriguez-Griffith fight, which followed pretty much the exact same pattern of the second and third fights, it only reinforces in my mind what a great fighter Rodriguez is. It also goes towards justifying my placing of Rodriguez on a level plain with Sugar Ray Leonard, Mickey Walker and Pernell Whitaker (all around the 20 mark).

Regarded as being just a shade below Griffith by most, I dare anyone to hold that opinion that has seen their fights.

As far as the highest valid ranking goes, I'd say high teens would be the limit.

Just out of interest, my cards in the Griffith-Rodriguez fights:


Luis Rodriguez vs. Emile Griffith II: 147-139 Rodriguez
Griffith: 2,11 and 15.
Rodriguez: 1,3,4,5,6,8,9,10,12,13 and 14.
Round 7 even.

Luis Rodriguez vs. Emile Griffith III: 146-140 Rodriguez
Griffith: 2,3,5 and 9.
Rodriguez: 1,4,6,7,8,10,11,12,13 and 14.
Round 15 even.

Luis Rodriguez vs. Emile Griffith IV: 146-140 Rodriguez
Griffith: 1,3,13 and 14.
Rodriguez: 2,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11 and 15.
Round 12 even.

[Mantequilla]

Rodriguez was Griffith's daddy.Haven't seen the fourth fight unfortunately, put it up on youtube sweet:good.

Griffith has always been in the same category as Azumah Nelson for me.Great fighters that were really, really good for a long period of time, but not quite as impressive as a lot of other greats and even non-greats when looking at performances at their peak.

[sweet_scientist]

Rodriguez was Griffith's daddy.Haven't seen the fourth fight unfortunately, put it up on youtube sweet:good.

I've sworn never to pass the fight on Mante, but I'll see what I can do...

In any case, you can take it from me that if you've seen one of their fights you've pretty much seen them all. Rodriguez putting on a body punching clinic, and Griffith trying to roughouse and use his strength and slightly quicker hands to get to Rodriguez, but not having the faintest idea about how to do it consistently enough to win rounds once Luis gets into a groove.

Griffith has always been in the same category as Azumah Nelson for me.Great fighters that were really, really good for a long period of time, but not quite as impressive as a lot of other greats and even non-greats when looking at performances at their peak.

That's a fair call I think. Griffith was maybe a bit tidier than Azumah, whilst Azumah had a power advantage, but both guys could struggle with some less than stellar foes and got somewhat exposed by those that dwell in the highest echelon.

[bladerunner]

Does anyone know if any of his fights with Bennie Briscoe exist?

[McGrain]

I've sworn never to pass the fight on Mante.

:twisted:

[sweet_scientist]

:twisted:

Gotta respect the wishes of others mate... Sorry bout that. I'll ask if it's ok to up some of it to youtube :good

[McGrain]

Gotta respect the wish of others mate... Sorry bout that. I'll ask if it's ok to up some of it to youtube :good


Yeah, i'm mad at him not you.

[Flea Man]

It must be worth a bit then.

[Raging B(_)LL]

Yeah, i'm mad at him not you.

:lol:

No need to get antsy there McGrain, S_S has my blessing to upload some of the fight onto youtube for you guys. Hell I even included on that dvd for him the 3rd round of the Freddy Dawson/Luther Rawlings bout so that you can all have a look at what kind of fighter Dawson was.

And whatsmore My2Sense still has a lot of clips and select rounds that he has yet to upload that I sent him awhile back and I will be sending him another dvd soon with more HLs and select rounds many of which will be from some of my rare fight films.

So just sit back and enjoy the footage guys, its my pleasure to share some of it with all of you, well except for that fuckwit pink flamengo who will just whine as usual about what a greedy bastard I am for not releasing my entire collection, idiot.

Anyway, carry on guys......

[Raging B(_)LL]

It must be worth a bit then.

Indeed.

[McGrain]

:lol:

No need to get antsy there McGrain....

:bart

Let me ask you, what's your crown jewel?

[Raging B(_)LL]

:bart

Let me ask you, what's your crown jewel?

Can`t really say to be honest, I`d have to think about that one as I have a lot of what I would consider to be very rare footage. Off the top of my head though that 1min of film I have of the 5th LaMotta/Robinson bout is definately up there among others. Sorry for the late reply btw, was just too damn busy over the weekend to get back to you sooner.