Team Pacquiao refuse drug testing. Fight in Jepordy

[robpalmer135]

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

The Manny Pacquiao-Floyd Mayweather welterweight title mega fight, tentatively scheduled for March 13 at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas, is in jeopardy.
According to Golden Boy Promotions, which is representing Mayweather, Pacquiao refused Tuesday to agree to the Olympic-style drug testing procedures the sides had been negotiating.
Mayweather requested that the drug testing for the fight be in compliance with the United States Anti Doping Agency, which handles drug testing for Olympians, "to ensure fair play and sportsmanship by both fighters."
Olympic style testing is more rigorous than the drug testing performed by the Nevada State Athletic Commission and other state commissions. It would involve random blood and urine testing before and after the fight. Nevada commission testing only tests urine for banned substances, once just before the fight and once immediately following the fight.

“ [Only registered and activated users can see links] I understand Pacquiao not liking having his blood taken because, frankly, I don't know anyone who really does. But in a fight of this magnitude, I think it is our responsibility to subject ourselves to sportsmanship at the highest level. I have already agreed to the testing and it is a shame that he is not willing to do the same. It leaves me with great doubt as to the level of fairness I would be facing in the ring that night.
” -- Floyd Mayweather Floyd Mayweather Sr., the fighter's father, has repeatedly accused Pacquiao of taking illegal substances, even though Pacquiao denies it and he has never failed a drug test.
According to Golden Boy CEO Richard Schaefer, who is negotiating the deal with Top Rank president Todd duBoef, Pacquiao refuses to have his blood drawn within 30 days of the bout based on his superstition of testing so close to a fight.
"Todd told me that Pacquiao has difficulty with taking blood and doesn't want to do it so close to the fight," Schaefer said. "He, Pacquiao, would only agree to have blood drawn before the kick-off press conference and after the fight."
Two weeks ago, Pacquiao's trainer, Freddie Roach, told ESPN.com that their side had no problem with Olympic style testing.
"I have no problem with the testing whatsoever," Roach said then. "They can do whatever kind of drug testing they want. They're scared of Manny and scared of his power. He'll pass any test in the world."
Schaefer said he hoped it was simply a "miscommunication" on the Pacquiao side.
"I do hope it is some sort of miscommunication and that Pacquiao is not even aware of what is going on and he will clear this up and say what is good enough for these great Olympic athletes is good enough for him and Floyd, and he agrees to do these drug tests.
"Team Mayweather is very surprised that an elite athlete like Manny Pacquiao would refuse drug testing procedures which Floyd has already agreed to and have been agreed to by many other top athletes. Why would Pacquiao refuse to have the same kind of testing that Lance Armstrong, Michael Phelps, LeBron James and Kobe Bryant have had?"
Told of Pacquiao's reluctance to be tested, Mayweather said he should explain himself.
"I understand Pacquiao not liking having his blood taken because, frankly, I don't know anyone who really does," Mayweather said in a statement. "But in a fight of this magnitude, I think it is our responsibility to subject ourselves to sportsmanship at the highest level. I have already agreed to the testing and it is a shame that he is not willing to do the same. It leaves me with great doubt as to the level of fairness I would be facing in the ring that night.
"I hope that this is either some miscommunication or that Manny will change his mind and step up and allow these tests, which were good enough for all these other great athletes, to be performed by USADA."
Said Leonard Ellerbe, a Mayweather adviser, in a statement, "We hope that Manny will do the right thing and agree to the testing as it is an egregious act to deny the testing and hence, deny the millions of fans the right to see this amazing fight. We just want to make sure there is a level playing field in a sport that is a man-to-man contest that relies on strength and ability.
"I still hope this decision is coming from someone in Pacquiao's camp and not Manny himself as it would be a shame that an athlete of his stature and who represents his whole country would not be able to show the public or his fellow athletes that he agrees to the highest standards in sports competition."
Top Rank spokesman Lee Samuels said the company declined to comment.
Schaefer said he and duBoef had "worked out all other issues related to the fight," disclosing to ESPN.com that the fight would be at the MGM Grand in Las Vegas, if they can work out the drug testing issue.
"We have agreed on all terms, including the site," Schaefer said.
The MGM Grand beat out several other interested venues, including Dallas Cowboys Stadium. Team owner Jerry Jones had offered a $25 million site fee, the largest in boxing history, but the promoters took an offer from the MGM Grand, whose terms have not been disclosed.
In addition, Schaefer told ESPN.com that the sides had agreed on an unprecedented penalty if either fighter weighed in heavier than the contract limit of 147 pounds.
"We agreed to $10 million per pound, or fraction thereof," Schaefer said. "That's what the Pacquiao side wanted and we said OK to that. That's unheard of. We have agreed on everything except for this drug testing issue. I have to think Pacquiao is unaware of this. The drug testing had been part of the contract for a while and then they suddenly said no. I was informed of that [Tuesday] morning. Suddenly they changed course and I don't know why."
Pacquiao wanted a huge monetary penalty if Mayweather was overweight because he ignored the contract limit of 144 pounds for his September fight with Juan Manuel Marquez, coming in at 146 pounds and paying a $600,000 penalty for the extra advantage.

[robpalmer135]

got shot down a few weeks ago for bringing up the Pacquiao on roids thing. taking blood is not that bad and it will happen to both fighters

[ishy]

Chill, it'll be sorted.

[robpalmer135]

According to Golden Boy CEO Richard Schaefer, who is negotiating the deal with Top Rank president Todd duBoef, Pacquiao refuses to have his blood drawn within 30 days of the bout based on his superstition of testing so close to a fight.
"Todd told me that Pacquiao has difficulty with taking blood and doesn't want to do it so close to the fight," Schaefer said. "He, Pacquiao, would only agree to have blood drawn before the kick-off press conference and after the fight."

If i told a police officer i couldnt take a breathaliser because of a superstition i would get banged up.

before the press confrence and after the fight you could get drugs out of the system. the press confrence is 10 weeks before the fight

[GazOC]

First it was going to be held in Vegas, then they tried to move to Dallas and now they are saying its going to be in Jeopardy instead?

[TFFP]

^^:lol::roll::verysad

I wouldn't get too involved in the whole negotiations. You know boxing, these things go back and forth and back and forth on all types of issues.

[ishy]

Get your coat Gaz..

[Mandanda]

I think there's an element of suspense being made to build up publicity and tension between fighters which builds the spectacle up even more.

From the blood testing point of view i agree with Mayweather's on wanting it although there reasons look to be just to get in Pacquiao's head but i think saying he has ''difficulty having his blood taken'' and wanting it done 10 weeks before is leaving a lot of suspicion and isn't helping himself. I can totally agree with not wanting blood taken close to a bout as i'm funny bout things like that myself but in reality something like 5-6 weeks before should be no problem as both would be doing it.

[TFFP]

They should be tested a week before the fight as should any professional boxer for banned substances. No roids can exit the body completely in a week, most are detectable for weeks and many months.

Not that I give much of a shit about roids, I don't think it makes much of a difference but if its banned its banned and they should enforce it strictly.

[Mandanda]

They should be tested a week before the fight as should any professional boxer for banned substances. No roids can exit the body completely in a week, most are detectable for weeks and many months.

Not that I give much of a shit about roids, I don't think it makes much of a difference but if its banned its banned and they should enforce it strictly.
Yeah agreed. It's a professional sport and superstition is a big part to many fighters but end of the day so is drug testing and it's not like he be only one taking the tests. I'm not one to read to much into mental warfare ahead of fights but i think Floyds working this well so far.

[Carnage]

Chill, it'll be sorted.
Please, for the love of God!!!!!!!!! Reassure me again, REASSURE ME AGAIN!!!

[TFFP]

I actually just researched my claim (guess). There is one substance that can exit the body in less than a week but seems mostly useless to gain any advantage in boxing. I think a week is fair enough, you don't want to be taking blood out of a guy a day or two before the fight. They are under enough strain making weight.

[GazOC]

Please, for the love of God!!!!!!!!! Reassure me again, REASSURE ME AGAIN!!!


Theres too much money in this fight for it not happen. The 2 camps are just posturing and trying to wind each other up at the moment.

[TFFP]

Its the good old fashioned 'whip the fans into a frenzy' routine as well. Make it seem on-off on-off so we all lap it up and we're always getting sucked in by it.

I dont think they need to do it for this fight...it speaks for itself, but any publicity is good publicity I guess.

[LHL]

Any fight involving Scheffer usually has that on off shit

[robpalmer135]

personally i think these tests should be mandatory for all world title fights.

[Carnage]

Theres too much money in this fight for it not happen. The 2 camps are just posturing and trying to wind each other up at the moment.
Thank you! I can sleep tonight!!

[Mandanda]

personally i think these tests should be mandatory for all world title fights.
:good

[Papa_Bear]

Have to say, I've been quite reassured reading some of the comments in this thread. Rather relieving after having negated the avalanche of nonsense that's being spewed on the gf.

Can't say I'm not still a tad concerned though. As much for all the crap I'll have to put with from the "boxing is dying" brigade as anything.

[Carnage]

Have to say, I've been quite reassured reading some of the comments in this thread. Very relieving after having negated the avalanche of nonsense that's being spewed in the gf thread.
I avoid the general like the plague, actually would rather lick a plague infested rat then look at the general (I wouldn't but it adds to the effect!).

[9Ball]

you don't want to be taking blood out of a guy a day or two before the fight. They are under enough strain making weight.

Do you even know how much blood is needed to do a test?? Answer: a miniscule amount. So small an amount that it would make 0.00001 difference to a fighters strength.

If Pac is refusing any kind of drugs test it puts into question ALL previous performances.

[Havik]

The drug testing in boxing is very very lax, and that ensures that we almost never get doping scandals - except for the occasional idiot who takes anabolic steroids too close to fight time.
The alternative is what we get in the Tour the France, and in the Olympics: very strict testing where a few athletes get caught every time, which leads to scandals that overshadow the entire event. We don't need that in boxing.

As for this thing: I fully expect the fight to go through, it makes too much sense.

[cupid]

First it was going to be held in Vegas, then they tried to move to Dallas and now they are saying its going to be in Jeopardy instead?
:yep

[dan-b]

I think Floyd's trying to bitch out of the fight.

[Flea Man]

Pac does not mind having bit of blood taken, and is up for taking as many urine tests as Floyd wants. The Nevade State Athletic Commission are apparently pissed because their tests are 'the best in the World' (source: 'The Scene Of Boxing') but Pac doesn't want a lot of blood taken because he is scared of needles. Someone has said 'if he's scared of needles why does he have tattoos' but I see that as a different type of queesiness.

Hope it comes off, but I see Floyd taking an easier option, like Bradley.

[Flea Man]

Do you even know how much blood is needed to do a test?? Answer: a miniscule amount. So small an amount that it would make 0.00001 difference to a fighters strength.

If Pac is refusing any kind of drugs test it puts into question ALL previous performances.


He isn't.

He's willing to take urine tests which are apparently the best way to find out if any drugs are in the system anyway. He's had post-fight tests before and nothing has shown up.

[dan-b]

Do you even know how much blood is needed to do a test?? Answer: a miniscule amount. So small an amount that it would make 0.00001 difference to a fighters strength.

If Pac is refusing any kind of drugs test it puts into question ALL previous performances.

Why Pac should be subjected to unprecedented testing simply because that thick, former drug addict, Floyd Senior made a foundless allegation?

[icemax]

....based on his superstition of testing so close to a fight.

:lol::lol::lol: You couldn't make this shit up

[dan-b]

:lol::lol::lol: You couldn't make this shit up

That "quote" came from Richard Schaefer, if we're insistant on analysing all this nonsense.

[icemax]

... but in reality something like 5-6 weeks before should be no problem as both would be doing it.

How is it that every elite athlete in every major sport around the world is subject to random and regular blood testing throughout the year, but when it comes to boxing the same standards do not apply. The cheats in the sport get away with murder...what the hell is wrong with testing someone at the weigh in, they take a teaspoon of blood for fuck sake, not an armful.

The longer that Pac procrastinates over this, the more he looks guilty, and this would only confirm what some of us have thought for a very long time.

[Flea Man]

How is it that every elite athlete in every major sport around the world is subject to random and regular blood testing throughout the year, but when it comes to boxing the same standards do not apply. The cheats in the sport get away with murder...what the hell is wrong with testing someone at the weigh in, they take a teaspoon of blood for fuck sake, not an armful.

The longer that Pac procrastinates over this, the more he looks guilty, and this would only confirm what some of us have thought for a very long time.


You think he's been using for a 'long time'?

He's had post-fight tests and nothing has shown. I personally think people are looking for excuses as to why Floyd is bitching out. He's never fought the best in any division he's been in (and if he has they haven't been anywhere near approaching 'great') and it's obvious why; he's insecure and doubts his defence will hold up against a really good offensive fighter.

[icemax]

He's willing to take urine tests which are apparently the best way to find out if any drugs are in the system anyway.

It depends what type of drug that you are looking for

[Flea Man]

It depends what type of drug that you are looking for

I suppose.

I personally don't feel Pac is roiding. A hunch I guess. He's willing to take a post-fight test, let him take it. I thought Floyd was 'certain' he could beat Pac, he should just take the chance and if he gets battered and the post-fight tests show anything he's in the clear, reputation wise.

Knowing Floyd's history just seems a ploy to avoid a dangerous fighter.

[rusticraver]

Its not like the blood test is giving a pint of yoru blood is it?

surely its only a small sample? dont see what the fuss is about if both fighters do it

[icemax]

You think he's been using for a 'long time'?



To be honest, I really don't know

[Flea Man]

To be honest, I really don't know

Fair enough. Do you understand my view? That Floyd is trying his best to get out of the fight?

[icemax]

Knowing Floyd's history just seems a ploy to avoid a dangerous fighter.

I agree that Floyd has been selective in his career (i'm not a great fan), but how would Pacman not taking a blood test help Floyd avoid him?...its a very high risk strategy. All Pacman would have to do to trump him is take the test.

This "superstition" and "scared of needles" bullshit is precisely that...Pac, please agree to weekly test from now until fight night just to prove Mayweather and everyone else who thinks that you are on HGH or EPO or anabolics wrong.

[icemax]

Fair enough. Do you understand my view? That Floyd is trying his best to get out of the fight?

I do, but I don't agree. All Pac has to do is take the test and Floyd is left having to fight him...if it is an avoidance tactic, its not a very good one.

[safc1990]

I'm a Pac fan but if this is true, something seems very fishy to me. :huh

Wasn't Alex Ariza (Pac's conditioning coach) involved in the BALCO scandal?

[dan-b]

People saying he "needs" to do this and that are misinformed about testing. Testing Pac directly after the fight, as normal, would be no different to testing him just before the fight. Boxing does have a good history of testing fighters, and many have been caught. The ones that are "clever" wouldn't be caught out by the testing Floyd's proposing anyway. It's all just bluster and, in my opinion, an excuse to get out of the fight.

I do find it a touch rum the way some are suggesting we should have testing like this for a one off fight. As if to say that cheating should only be discouraged when there's a lot of money involved.

[dan-b]

I do, but I don't agree. All Pac has to do is take the test and Floyd is left having to fight him...if it is an avoidance tactic, its not a very good one.

You say "the test" as if it's just one blood test. Are you aware, potentially, how many times he could be tested in the run up to the fight should he agree to the Olympic style test?

[icemax]

I do find it a touch rum the way some are suggesting we should have testing like this for a one off fight. As if to say that cheating should only be discouraged when there's a lot of money involved.

I think that a program of year around testing should be implemented, along the lines of those carried out in other major sports

[dan-b]

I think that a program of year around testing should be implemented, along the lines of those carried out in other major sports

And you think that's feasible? Do you realise how many thousands of cards take place, worldwide, every week?

[icemax]

Are you aware, potentially, how many times he could be tested in the run up to the fight should he agree to the Olympic style test?

:huh So its OK for big tough olympic athletes (including amateur boxers), but not OK for fighters like Pac, or Mayweather.

[trotter]

Who here would, in Pac's shoes, hear Floyd and his idiot family make unfounded allegations accusing you of drug cheating, then agree to jump through some unusual hoops at their insistence?

I'd tell them to fuck off.

Roach has said he'll test the day after the fight, Floyd's just playing on Manny's psychological issues with blood tests.


Not to mention this whole thing is mainly just a publicity stunt, they have to keep the thing simmering. It's not JUST publicity though, as accusing Manny of drug cheating is quite serious.

[icemax]

And you think that's feasible? Do you realise how many thousands of cards take place, worldwide, every week?

Its no different to any other major sport....whats the problem

[trotter]

:huh So its OK for big tough olympic athletes (including amateur boxers), but not OK for fighters like Pac, or Mayweather.


I honestly think you are looking at it back to front.

It's not that it's 'not OK' for Pac or Floyd, it's that it never usually happens, it's never usually insisted on, and Floyd is trying to bitch Pacquiao around.

Not to mention he's slandering him left right and centre.

[dan-b]

:huh So its OK for big tough olympic athletes (including amateur boxers), but not OK for fighters like Pac, or Mayweather.

Yes but they're used to it. Why should Pac be the guinea pig for unprecedented testing because of something that scumbag Floyd senior said?

Its no different to any other major sport....whats the problem

If you're suggesting a rigorous testing regimen, from top to bottom, then no sport has that.

[dan-b]

I honestly think you are looking at it back to front.

It's not that it's 'not OK' for Pac or Floyd, it's that it never usually happens, it's never usually insisted on, and Floyd is trying to bitch Pacquiao around.

Not to mention he's slandering him left right and centre.

Icemax just has a problem with Pacquiao, it's obvious. He's been seduced by the foundless allegations of the classless Mayweather punks.

[trotter]

Its no different to any other major sport....whats the problem


Who would pay for it and administer it?

Do you think there is a problem with steroids in boxing to justify it?

[Beeston Brawler]

Why not just agree to do it?

Holyfield did it against Tyson - no doubt there are many other examples.

[dan-b]

Why not just agree to do it?

Holyfield did it against Tyson - no doubt there are many other examples.

Why make the demand in the first place? If we don't trust the testing we have in place, doesn't that bring all boxing results into question? Or is this about Pacquiao? Even though he's passed every previous test and there's no evidence to suggest he's on drugs, are we demanding this because Floyd Senior decided to mouth off and garner himself some attention? Attention he sorely needed after Pacquiao showed him up for being the average trainer he is.

[Beeston Brawler]

I'm not demanding anything, and don't have an issue with Pacquiao - it's just that knob he has in his corner...... but that's a separate thing altogether and isn't relevant in this case.

Maybe he could simply rise above it and do it anyway, hopefully (for him and his fans) give Mayweather a beating and move on.

[icemax]

Yes but they're used to it.
I didn't realise that top flight fighters were so sensitive


If you're suggesting a rigorous testing regimen, from top to bottom, then no sport has that.

The only way to create a level playing field in the sport is to introduce a rigorous drug testing regime. By saying that we can't do anything because it is difficult or impractical then you are in fact saying that cheating is OK.....it isn't. Last year World athletics took over 100,000 samples for testing...it isn't impossible.

The one thing that does worry me is the attitude of some supposed boxing fans...how can proven cheaters like Mosley, Vit Klit and Toney still have fans? Its strange...you wouldn't shout for this man knowing what he did

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[icemax]

Icemax just has a problem with Pacquiao,

:huh

Because I think that there should be a comprehensive drug testing regime in the sport :-(

[dan-b]

I'm not demanding anything, and don't have an issue with Pacquiao - it's just that knob he has in his corner...... but that's a separate thing altogether and isn't relevant in this case.

Maybe he could simply rise above it and do it anyway, hopefully (for him and his fans) give Mayweather a beating and move on.

But it's the bully and victime scenario though isn't it? The Mayweathers make a foundless remark and then demand testing no other boxer has ever been subjected to. If you're a victim, you roll over and agree to the bully's demands.

Part of me suspected wasn't serious about making a proper comeback and this just proves it. If he's demanding this for a Pac fight what kind of demands would he make for a fight with Shane?

I think he knows how hated he is and is scared to lose because people will piss on his legacy. He's trying to find a way to make it look like he wanted to fight the best without having to actually fight.

[Flea Man]

But it's the bully and victime scenario though isn't it? The Mayweathers make a foundless remark and then demand testing no other boxer has ever been subjected to. If you're a victim, you roll over and agree to the bully's demands.

Part of me suspected wasn't serious about making a proper comeback and this just proves it. If he's demanding this for a Pac fight what kind of demands would he make for a fight with Shane?

I think he knows how hated he is and is scared to lose because people will piss on his legacy. He's trying to find a way to make it look like he wanted to fight the best without having to actually fight.

This:deal

[dan-b]

The only way to create a level playing field in the sport is to introduce a rigorous drug testing regime. By saying that we can't do anything because it is difficult or impractical then you are in fact saying that cheating is OK.....it isn't. Last year World athletics took over 100,000 samples for testing...it isn't impossible.

The one thing that does worry me is the attitude of some supposed boxing fans...how can proven cheaters like Mosley, Vit Klit and Toney still have fans? Its strange...you wouldn't shout for this man knowing what he did

This is getting painful, I knew you were going to say that. Are you just being deliberately stubborn or are you a little thick? You said, you think all boxers should be subjected to Olympic style testing. Do you think all athletes from all levels are tested like that? Please think carefully before answering. That was the only point I was making and was not advocating cheating.

Who would pay for all this testing? We don't have a world governing body and most small hall shows operate on a shoe string budget. I think you know all this though and are just looking for a moral platform to sneer at people from because you don't want to see the sense in what people are saying.

And just to preempt what I think you'll say next. Yes there should be a world governing body but, even then, not all boxers at all levels could and would be tested.

[dan-b]

:huh

Because I think that there should be a comprehensive drug testing regime in the sport :-(

Right, so you were shouting from the rooftops about Olympic style testing before Floyd's alcoholic father made his foundless remark?

[icemax]

Who would pay for it and administer it?

Promoters and governing bodies


Do you think there is a problem with steroids in boxing to justify it?

We all know that there is a problem, we just don't know how big a problem

[Dan684]

Why can't dan-b and Fleaman (the 2 biggest Floyd haters on the Brit forum) get a fucking grip.

Look how many high profile boxers have been found to be using illegal substances over the years. Pacquiao's rise through the ranks has been tremendous in such a short space of time. There could be no reason for it and it could very well be down to the fact that he's a freak of nature. But there is also a huge chance he is juicing up.

I wanna know for certain so I could certainly understand Floyd (the man who's gonna be fighting him) wanting to know for sure. Its a fucking blood test, there not taking his arm away with them for a few weeks ffs. Get a grip of yourselves. The biggest show master in boxing at the moment is 'Dr Roach' not Floyd.

Fuck'em. They wanna have these penalties in place for weight gain on the night and such they should allow other fighters the chance to have a few demands of there own.

[Flea Man]

Why can't dan-b and Fleaman (the 2 biggest Floyd haters on the Brit forum) get a fucking grip.

Look how many high profile boxers have been found to be using illegal substances over the years. Pacquiao's rise through the ranks has been tremendous in such a short space of time. There could be no reason for it and it could very well be down to the fact that he's a freak of nature. But there is also a huge chance he is juicing up.

I wanna know for certain so I could certainly understand Floyd (the man who's gonna be fighting him) wanting to know for sure. Its a fucking blood test, there not taking his arm away with them for a few weeks ffs. Get a grip of yourselves. The biggest show master in boxing at the moment is 'Dr Roach' not Floyd.

Fuck'em. They wanna have these penalties in place for weight gain on the night and such they should allow other fighters the chance to have a few demands of there own.

I'm not a hater, I'm a realist:good

[dan-b]

Promoters and governing bodies

What about all the small hall shows? What governing bodies?

We all know that there is a problem, we just don't know how big a problem

Because a few fighters have been caught?

You claim to want this test for the Pac v Floyd fight because you think it should be implemented thoughout the sport, but do you really think that would happen? If anything, this will just lead to the sport becoming more elitist with the grass roots boxers continuing to be treated shabbily.

There are ways to improve the sport but making Pac take a test isn't it.

[dan-b]

Why can't dan-b and Fleaman (the 2 biggest Floyd haters on the Brit forum) get a fucking grip.

Look how many high profile boxers have been found to be using illegal substances over the years. Pacquiao's rise through the ranks has been tremendous in such a short space of time. There could be no reason for it and it could very well be down to the fact that he's a freak of nature. But there is also a huge chance he is juicing up.

I wanna know for certain so I could certainly understand Floyd (the man who's gonna be fighting him) wanting to know for sure. Its a fucking blood test, there not taking his arm away with them for a few weeks ffs. Get a grip of yourselves. The biggest show master in boxing at the moment is 'Dr Roach' not Floyd.

Fuck'em. They wanna have these penalties in place for weight gain on the night and such they should allow other fighters the chance to have a few demands of there own.

This is ridiculous, Floyd's only doing this because he feels he's in a position to make such demands. What about other fighters, who need to pay the bills, and have no such luxury? You can't seem to separate what you think should be happening and what is fair.

[icemax]

Right, so you were shouting from the rooftops about Olympic style testing before Floyd's alcoholic father made his foundless remark?

Check back on my postings :deal

[trotter]

Why can't dan-b and Fleaman (the 2 biggest Floyd haters on the Brit forum) get a fucking grip.

Look how many high profile boxers have been found to be using illegal substances over the years. Pacquiao's rise through the ranks has been tremendous in such a short space of time. There could be no reason for it and it could very well be down to the fact that he's a freak of nature. But there is also a huge chance he is juicing up.

I wanna know for certain so I could certainly understand Floyd (the man who's gonna be fighting him) wanting to know for sure. Its a fucking blood test, there not taking his arm away with them for a few weeks ffs. Get a grip of yourselves. The biggest show master in boxing at the moment is 'Dr Roach' not Floyd.

Fuck'em. They wanna have these penalties in place for weight gain on the night and such they should allow other fighters the chance to have a few demands of there own.

lol, Floyd doesn't make demands eh? Every fucking fight it's the weight, the ring size, the gloves, working the referee over, he's the master of weakening his opponents chances before they even step in the ring.

Pac takes tests, he passes tests. Why the hell should he put up with the Mayweathers slandering him and then jump through some hoops for them?

[dan-b]

Check back on my postings :deal

Regardless of that, you haven't answered my previous question. How Pac v Floyd having these tests would change things for other fighters? Before you say "it has to start somewhere" think again. There's no way most boxing shows could afford to operate if they had to incorporate the costs of that kind of testing into their shows.

Anyway, the fact you're ignoring my other points tells me you're trolling. The stupid emoticon sealed it for me.

[Dan684]

The tests are weak everybody knows this.

Yeah floyd makes demands i'm not saying he doesn't, but Roach has become the worst for it in the sport by far. He actually managed to force a fighter into putting his title on the line 2lbs below the limit :-(

It's a drugs test. He does the tests, passes them, then Floyd has egg on his face. Why won't he do them ??? Dont give me this 'why should he give into Floyds demands' shit either. Both are as bad as each other with their demands. floyd wanted it at a bit of a higher weight. He's gonna get penalised $10m for his troubles. Pac had the same thing going on with Cotto, only Cotto was gonna get fined for coming in INSIDE THE WELTERWEIGHT LIMIT

[Flea Man]

The tests are weak everybody knows this.

Yeah floyd makes demands i'm not saying he doesn't, but Roach has become the worst for it in the sport by far. He actually managed to force a fighter into putting his title on the line 2lbs below the limit :-(

It's a drugs test. He does the tests, passes them, then Floyd has egg on his face. Why won't he do them ??? Dont give me this 'why should he give into Floyds demands' shit either. Both are as bad as each other with their demands. floyd wanted it at a bit of a higher weight. He's gonna get penalised $10m for his troubles. Pac had the same thing going on with Cotto, only Cotto was gonna get fined for coming in INSIDE THE WELTERWEIGHT LIMIT

So did Chavez against Sweet Pea. Not totally unprecedented, and I disagreed with it, especially when you consider how good Pac performed I don't think the 2lbs would make a lot of difference.

[dan-b]

The tests are weak everybody knows this.

Yeah floyd makes demands i'm not saying he doesn't, but Roach has become the worst for it in the sport by far. He actually managed to force a fighter into putting his title on the line 2lbs below the limit :-(

It's a drugs test. He does the tests, passes them, then Floyd has egg on his face. Why won't he do them ??? Dont give me this 'why should he give into Floyds demands' shit either. Both are as bad as each other with their demands. floyd wanted it at a bit of a higher weight. He's gonna get penalised $10m for his troubles. Pac had the same thing going on with Cotto, only Cotto was gonna get fined for coming in INSIDE THE WELTERWEIGHT LIMIT

You're talking as if there's no testing at all currently. Are you aware of what Pac has agreed to?

[Beeston Brawler]

Wouldn't it be great if there was just a standard set of fucking rules?

One ring size
Set sizes of gloves per weight
Mandatory blood testing
Standardised medicals

IMO it would be absolutely right to have blood testing - and Floyd is right to ask for it..... though his reasoning is perhaps wrong.

[Siren1927]

Last year World athletics took over 100,000 samples for testing...it isn't impossible.




70% of Athletics testing is done at Major events and those figures lie they are samples, not individually tested athletes. Usain Bolt has been quoted as saying he was tested 20 times last year alone and that was just for race meetings.

Beijing 2008 - They still havent finished testing all the samples taken there yet. They wont finish for another year or so as they continually test the same samples with new tests to ensure no "new" drugs are found.

Just stop for a second Olympic style testing is something like 18+ tests done over a 10 week period and people here want that for every boxer. Your crazy, seriously your all nuts on a Floyd Snr level :scaredas:

This is nothing bt keeping the fight in the headlines, chill out it will be announced in January

[icemax]

Anyway, the fact you're ignoring my other points tells me you're trolling. The stupid emoticon sealed it for me.

Trying to stifle debate by insult is just a tad juvenile. Whether you like it or not, other sports manage to operate drug testing regimes perfectly well...why can't boxing??

[icemax]

70% of Athletics testing is done at Major events and those figures lie they are samples, not individually tested athletes.

Those figures don't lie...I said "samples"

[Siren1927]

Whether you like it or not, other sports manage to operate drug testing regimes perfectly well...why can't boxing??


Boxing already has a drug testing programm in place, why should it be changed for the demands of one boxer?

[Siren1927]

Those figures don't lie...I said "samples"

Of course they lie, how many of those samples are from the same athlete?

[icemax]

Boxing already has a drug testing programm in place, why should it be changed for the demands of one boxer? Please read my above post, there is no way boxing as a whole can implement such a program

This is truly pathetic, not you, just the whole situation. I just get the impression that the majority of fight fans don't actually give a rats arse whether fighters are drugged or not.

[izmat]

got shot down a few weeks ago for bringing up the Pacquiao on roids thing. taking blood is not that bad and it will happen to both fighters


I don't see how this is proof that Pac is on on roids.
The fight is going to happen next year and this is just a way to hype the fight up

[icemax]

Of course they lie, how many of those samples are from the same athlete?

I said 100,000 samples, how is that a lie?

[dan-b]

Trying to stifle debate by insult is just a tad juvenile. Whether you like it or not, other sports manage to operate drug testing regimes perfectly well...why can't boxing??

You just ignore the points you don't want to answer and try and act like you have the moral high ground. Case in point below.

This is truly pathetic, not you, just the whole situation. I just get the impression that the majority of fight fans don't actually give a rats arse whether fighters are drugged or not.

[noonan]

70% of Athletics testing is done at Major events and those figures lie they are samples, not individually tested athletes. Usain Bolt has been quoted as saying he was tested 20 times last year alone and that was just for race meetings.

Beijing 2008 - They still havent finished testing all the samples taken there yet. They wont finish for another year or so as they continually test the same samples with new tests to ensure no "new" drugs are found.

Just stop for a second Olympic style testing is something like 18+ tests done over a 10 week period and people here want that for every boxer. Your crazy, seriously your all nuts on a Floyd Snr level :scaredas:

This is nothing bt keeping the fight in the headlines, chill out it will be announced in January

This isnt any other fight is it!! possibly the biggest match up of our generation,

Im pretty sure these doping measures dont go on down my local athletics club, same as i wouldnt expect them at a local boxing do, but there needs to ba a possibility of it happening,

Most top Atheletes have this style of testing, , Lance Armstrong was tested 24 times in a year,

I feel better testing should be in place, but as in all sports more rigorous measures ar the higher level of that sport

[icemax]

You just ignore the points you don't want to answer and try and act like you have the moral high ground. Case in point below.

I'm not taking any moral high ground...how can there be one? You either want a drugs free sport or you don't...I do, therefore I want stringent testing.

Do you want a drugs free sport?

[dan-b]

I'm not taking any moral high ground...how can there be one? You either want a drugs free sport or you don't...I do, therefore I want stringent testing.

Do you want a drugs free sport?

You're doing it again there. Trying to render my points invalid by suggesting I condone cheating.

[Siren1927]

I said 100,000 samples, how is that a lie?

Instead of just repeating yourself are you going to ignore the rest of my post?

How many of those samples are from 1 Athlete 100,000 samples does not represent the number of athletes tested now does it?.

[Siren1927]

I'm not taking any moral high ground...how can there be one? You either want a drugs free sport or you don't...I do, therefore I want stringent testing.

Do you want a drugs free sport?


In 10 years how many fighters have been caught cheating through the use of drugs, then compare it to Athletics.

[robpalmer135]

Dan-b actually read back what your saying. you sound like some fool from the general just making up facts you no nothing about and slagging of peoples ideas that are quite good.

In my opinion something fishy is going on. The guy has gone from 122lbs, hes been knocked out in lower weight classes and wasnt able to KO half of his opponents in the lower weight classes, and from the David Diaz fight you see a completley different fighter a massive change in Pacquiao, since the David Diaz fight he has knocked out all 4 opponents. Not just knocked them out but destroyed all the opponents, and these are not bums they were world class fighters. If he had been destroying everyone at the lower weights like Barrera and Marquez then i would understand but he wasnt and now all of a sudden he moves up in weight and just smashes through people.

and its not just the boxing hes physicaly stronger than guys like Hatton and Cotto who are monsters at there weight. hes gone from 130 to 147 in 18 months and looks just as lean as before, he has put on only muscle. and they say that he is eating 7000cals a day, theres no way you could maintain your weight unless you were training for an extremley long time which is made possible by taking steroids. If your doing intense training for 6-7 hours a day which you would need to do to maintain a 7000cal diet you would need to take stuff.

Also the drug testing in boxing is complete crap. If it was good then why wasnt Chavez Jnr caught before the fight. The current Nevada test they take blood 2 weeks before the fight but its to check for disease not for drugs. Its just nuts that he was allowed in the ring people can die in a boxing ring and if someone goes in there jacked up its even worse. Theres plenty of ways to beat the extremly strict blood testing i other sports so theres even more ways to beat the drug tests in Boxing.

When Juan Manuel Marquez went up in weight he looked fat, so did De La Hoya and 160lbs. and sure everyones different but for a 200lbs 6ft4 body builder to gain 15lbs of pure muscle is almost impossible, so how can a guy who is 5ft6 and weights 130lbs do it??? The history of boxing has thousands of fighters moving up in weight and the same thing happens every single time, there body fat goes up, they slow down and the loose power. None of these have happened to Pacquiao infact the opposite has happeend.

Suddenly Pacquiao team have a problem with blood being taken within 10 weeks of the fight, but speak to a fighter in a world title fight in the states and they will tell you they have given blood 2 weeks before most fights. Why is it a problem all of a sudden. If pacquiao has a problem with needles why does he have tatoos, and personally i dont like having blood taken but i just shut my eyes and bare with it for 30 seconds that it takes and then you feel no different. and i work in IT, Pacquiao is a guy who takes part in the hardest sport in the world, grew up in poverty, gets punches in the face all day long but he is scared of a blood test. If the problem is that it weakens the fighter then thats a crap arguement becuase there doing it to both fighters not just Manny, and its a tiny tiny amount of blood thats being taken it really makes no difference.

I beleive that what I have said above are all valid points. You can all come and shut them down but its an opinion and theres only one way to proove me wrong and at the moment Team Pacquiao are not prepared to do so. If you think Mayweather is doing this to get out of the fight, why not just call his bluff.

[Siren1927]

This isnt any other fight is it!! possibly the biggest match up of our generation,

Im pretty sure these doping measures dont go on down my local athletics club, same as i wouldnt expect them at a local boxing do, but there needs to ba a possibility of it happening,

Most top Atheletes have this style of testing, , Lance Armstrong was tested 24 times in a year,

I feel better testing should be in place, but as in all sports more rigorous measures ar the higher level of that sport

I understand your point mate, but surely you must apply a rule to the sport as a whole?

[icemax]

You're doing it again there. Trying to render my points invalid by suggesting I condone cheating.

I asked you a fucking question, get a fucking grip.

[icemax]

Instead of just repeating yourself are you going to ignore the rest of my post?

How many of those samples are from 1 Athlete 100,000 samples does not represent the number of athletes tested now does it?.

The report didn't say. I don't feel that your post required comment from me as it is your opinion, and I don't really want to get into the mechanics of organising a drug testing regime. I was merely responding to you calling the statement i made " a lie" which it clearly wasn't

[Siren1927]

hes gone from 130 to 147 in 18 months and looks just as lean as before, he has put on only muscle.


Excellent post on the whole Rob, didnt Pac weigh 152 or 164 in the ring against JMM the second time. I watched that fight again the idea day and Pac looks massive in that fight compared to when he first fought JMM.

Also Roach and Arum both stated they needed to get him out of 130, he was killing himself to make weight.

I also have to ask, is getting knocked out when your 16 and 17 by body shots of any relevance to him fighting today?

Im not a nuthugger but people do tend to convienently forget certain points when it comes to Pac or Floyd

[Siren1927]

The report didn't say. I don't feel that your post required comment from me as it is your opinion, and I don't really want to get into the mechanics of organising a drug testing regime. I was merely responding to you calling the statement i made " a lie" which it clearly wasn't


I called the statistical representation a lie, which I stand by. When you look at 100,00 samples you think WOW. But in fact it could be no more than 10,000 Athletes.

Thats a bit of an understatement but can you see where im coming from ?

[dan-b]

Dan-b actually read back what your saying. you sound like some fool from the general just making up facts you no nothing about and slagging of peoples ideas that are quite good.

In my opinion something fishy is going on. The guy has gone from 122lbs, hes been knocked out in lower weight classes and wasnt able to KO half of his opponents in the lower weight classes, and from the David Diaz fight you see a completley different fighter a massive change in Pacquiao, since the David Diaz fight he has knocked out all 4 opponents. Not just knocked them out but destroyed all the opponents, and these are not bums they were world class fighters. If he had been destroying everyone at the lower weights like Barrera and Marquez then i would understand but he wasnt and now all of a sudden he moves up in weight and just smashes through people.

and its not just the boxing hes physicaly stronger than guys like Hatton and Cotto who are monsters at there weight. hes gone from 130 to 147 in 18 months and looks just as lean as before, he has put on only muscle. and they say that he is eating 7000cals a day, theres no way you could maintain your weight unless you were training for an extremley long time which is made possible by taking steroids. If your doing intense training for 6-7 hours a day which you would need to do to maintain a 7000cal diet you would need to take stuff.

Also the drug testing in boxing is complete crap. If it was good then why wasnt Chavez Jnr caught before the fight. The current Nevada test they take blood 2 weeks before the fight but its to check for disease not for drugs. Its just nuts that he was allowed in the ring people can die in a boxing ring and if someone goes in there jacked up its even worse. Theres plenty of ways to beat the extremly strict blood testing i other sports so theres even more ways to beat the drug tests in Boxing.

When Juan Manuel Marquez went up in weight he looked fat, so did De La Hoya and 160lbs. and sure everyones different but for a 200lbs 6ft4 body builder to gain 15lbs of pure muscle is almost impossible, so how can a guy who is 5ft6 and weights 130lbs do it??? The history of boxing has thousands of fighters moving up in weight and the same thing happens every single time, there body fat goes up, they slow down and the loose power. None of these have happened to Pacquiao infact the opposite has happeend.

Suddenly Pacquiao team have a problem with blood being taken within 10 weeks of the fight, but speak to a fighter in a world title fight in the states and they will tell you they have given blood 2 weeks before most fights. Why is it a problem all of a sudden. If pacquiao has a problem with needles why does he have tatoos, and personally i dont like having blood taken but i just shut my eyes and bare with it for 30 seconds that it takes and then you feel no different. and i work in IT, Pacquiao is a guy who takes part in the hardest sport in the world, grew up in poverty, gets punches in the face all day long but he is scared of a blood test. If the problem is that it weakens the fighter then thats a crap arguement becuase there doing it to both fighters not just Manny, and its a tiny tiny amount of blood thats being taken it really makes no difference.

I beleive that what I have said above are all valid points. You can all come and shut them down but its an opinion and theres only one way to proove me wrong and at the moment Team Pacquiao are not prepared to do so. If you think Mayweather is doing this to get out of the fight, why not just call his bluff.

Rob, I could say the same to you though. No one has really come up with any ideas, they just want Pac to agree to everything so they can see the big fight. Icemax is turning it into a moral crusade but has yet to explain to me how we would implement the testing for all fighters.

The rest of your post is just a collection of opinions I've heard a thousand times over. Everyone suddenly seems to be an expert on steroid use when no one was really questioning Pac until Floyd senior made his remark.

Rob, do you think having this testing will remove all the doubt anyway?

[dan-b]

I asked you a fucking question, get a fucking grip.

You know my stance though, you're just looking for a way to dodge my questions by asking a dumb question you already know the answer to.

[icemax]

In 10 years how many fighters have been caught cheating through the use of drugs, then compare it to Athletics.

Honestly, i'm not sure what your point is...give me a clue :good

[icemax]

I called the statistical representation a lie, which I stand by. When you look at 100,00 samples you think WOW. But in fact it could be no more than 10,000 Athletes.

Thats a bit of an understatement but can you see where im coming from ?

Of course I can see where you are coming from...I assumed that people would not think that samples = athletes

[icemax]

You know my stance though, you're just looking for a way to dodge my questions by asking a dumb question you already know the answer to.

I haven't a clue what your stance is...if it is anti-doping then instead of being defeatist and saying this won't work and that is impractical make a positive suggestion.

[dan-b]

I haven't a clue what your stance is...if it is anti-doping then instead of being defeatist and saying this won't work and that is impractical make a positive suggestion.

But your suggestions are impractical in every situation other than superfights near enough. Sorry I couldn't be your cheerleader.

[Siren1927]

Honestly, i'm not sure what your point is...give me a clue :good


Im saying that just because they test differently it doesnt mean that their way of testing is better.

I want a drug free sport as much as you do mate, I also want all Fanbois and Haters to be put on an island and left to fight each other to the death on a reality TV for my and your enjoyment. I also want an end to corrupt judging, all alphabet rankings and belts.

I also want Cherryl Cole :good

I hope Santa reads this.

I went way off point here but Ive havent posted a christmas list yet and now seems a good time to spread a little christmas spirit :happy

[Siren1927]

Of course I can see where you are coming from...I assumed that people would not think that samples = athletes


Unfortunatly most people are stupid mate :rofl

[icemax]

But your suggestions are impractical in every situation other than superfights near enough. Sorry I couldn't be your cheerleader.

I haven't made any suggestions other than to call for a strict drug testing regime...I want a clean sport, I always have done and that has got fuck all to do with Pac or Mayweather Sr

[trotter]

In my opinion something fishy is going on. The guy has gone from 122lbs, hes been knocked out in lower weight classes and wasnt able to KO half of his opponents in the lower weight classes, and from the David Diaz fight you see a completley different fighter a massive change in Pacquiao, since the David Diaz fight he has knocked out all 4 opponents. Not just knocked them out but destroyed all the opponents, and these are not bums they were world class fighters. If he had been destroying everyone at the lower weights like Barrera and Marquez then i would understand but he wasnt and now all of a sudden he moves up in weight and just smashes through people.



Floyd started at 130 didn't he? And Floyd outmuscled 'monster at the weight' Hatton, stood in the pocket against Oscar at 154, dwarfed Marquez and couldn't even make 145.

Manny took 9 rounds of solid punishment to stop Diaz, he didn't engage Oscar at all but borke him down from the outside, and Hatton was a reckless, busted flush (who Floyd KOed a year before).

The Cotto win too, we just don't know what Margarito took away from him. And Cotto isn't a big welter.


What Manny's done is remarkable, but IMO it's not beyond the realms of possibility.

[dan-b]

If this isn't just about Floyd Mayweather, I suppose everyone thinks Berto and Mosley should be Olympic tested, and the fight called off if they don't agree to it?

[Siren1927]

And Floyd outmuscled 'monster at the weight' Hatton

that fight was at 147, Collazo proved Hatton didnt belong at 147

[Siren1927]

If this isn't just about Floyd Mayweather, I suppose everyone thinks Berto and Mosley should be Olympic tested, and the fight called off if they don't agree to it?

If its done for one fight it must be done for all fights

[dan-b]

If its done for one fight it must be done for all fights

Which we both know is impossible. People want to see the big fight, I understand that, but let's not pretend this is about people wanting to see every boxer tested more when really it's about Floyd being a prima donna and thinking he controls boxing.

[robpalmer135]

Floyd started at 130 didn't he? And Floyd outmuscled 'monster at the weight' Hatton, stood in the pocket against Oscar at 154, dwarfed Marquez and couldn't even make 145.

Manny took 9 rounds of solid punishment to stop Diaz, he didn't engage Oscar at all but borke him down from the outside, and Hatton was a reckless, busted flush (who Floyd KOed a year before).

The Cotto win too, we just don't know what Margarito took away from him. And Cotto isn't a big welter.


What Manny's done is remarkable, but IMO it's not beyond the realms of possibility.

it was 6 years after being at 130lbs

[dan-b]

it was 6 years after being at 130lbs

What about the rest of his post?

[icemax]

If this isn't just about Floyd Mayweather, I suppose everyone thinks Berto and Mosley should be Olympic tested, and the fight called off if they don't agree to it?

Under olympic testing conditions the Mosley - Berto question would be moot as Sugar Shane wouldn't be able to compete...whats good for Marion Jones has to be good for Shane Mosley

[antcull]

It will all get sorted in the end, just the usual on/off shit to be expected in a fight this big, just builds the hype.

[Siren1927]

Which we both know is impossible. People want to see the big fight, I understand that, but let's not pretend this is about people wanting to see every boxer tested more when really it's about Floyd being a prima donna and thinking he controls boxing.


I agree its impossible, but Floyd has been very clever here, he has opened a can of worms in Boxing with regards to drug testing. He can get 90% of non pac fanbois on his side here for simply stating he wants to leave no doubt in anyone minds about the cleanliness of fighters.

Floyd is also giving Pac the platform to "clear his name" if you will. Floyd has been smart with this one, unless your a hardcore boxing fan and this fight doesnt go ahead because of this issue. Then you will believe that Pac ducked Floyd.

Casual fans only see whats on the news, and all they will see is that Pac refused drug testing, nothing more.

In all fairness to Floyd hes a clever bastard.

Onto your second point, I disagree with you mate, I think most people, myself included want a drug free sport, and anything that can be done to further reduce the cheaters in our sport is only a good thing, however I I agree and dont think that most people in this thread are as concerned about this for the sport as they are for testing Pac.

For the life of me I cant understand why people are so centered on a guy who has never failed a test when a proven user is fighting Berto next month :huh

BTW if Pac did fail a drug test, shouldnt he just get the free pass RJJ fans gave him :rofl

[Siren1927]

Under olympic testing conditions the Mosley - Berto question would be moot as Sugar Shane wouldn't be able to compete...whats good for Marion Jones has to be good for Shane Mosley

Thats a dam good point actually

[robpalmer135]

Rob, I could say the same to you though. No one has really come up with any ideas, they just want Pac to agree to everything so they can see the big fight. Icemax is turning it into a moral crusade but has yet to explain to me how we would implement the testing for all fighters.

The rest of your post is just a collection of opinions I've heard a thousand times over. Everyone suddenly seems to be an expert on steroid use when no one was really questioning Pac until Floyd senior made his remark.

Rob, do you think having this testing will remove all the doubt anyway?

I am not claiming to be an expert but I have read allot about drugs in sport and no that drug testing in boxing is really shit and urine, hair and blood are all needed to get conclusive results as the technoligy of the drugs are ahead of the the testing to they should make the test stricter and happen more frequently.

I dont think anyone has come up with to many ideas because like me there shocked a system is not in place already. Its quite simple. If you are taking part in a world title fight you should have to undergo Olympic level drug testing which includes random blood testing up to 48 hours before a fight. There shouldnt even be a debate about this.


I do think that the Olympic level drug testing would remove doubt as they use the same system more ahtletics and cycling and plenty of people have been getting caught. Infact the testing for boxing should be stricter as people are putting there life on the line.

Ok the accusation first came from Mayweather Snr and people dismiss his opinion because hes not an academicly smart man but he knows boxing like the back of his hand.

If you were about to put your life and career on the line and your own Dad who has a large knowledge of boxing has suspicions that the guy your fighting is taking something that will make him faster and punch harder, you would want to make sure he is not tested.

btw Olympic level drug testing was reported to be part of the agreement made in principle 2 weeks ago so why the sudden change?

[dan-b]

Under olympic testing conditions the Mosley - Berto question would be moot as Sugar Shane wouldn't be able to compete...whats good for Marion Jones has to be good for Shane Mosley

Right but it works for Pacquiao because we know what drugs he's on?

[robpalmer135]

Under olympic testing conditions the Mosley - Berto question would be moot as Sugar Shane wouldn't be able to compete...whats good for Marion Jones has to be good for Shane Mosley

Honestly do not get why Mosley has not got more shit for it.

[dan-b]

I am not claiming to be an expert but I have read allot about drugs in sport and no that drug testing in boxing is really shit and urine, hair and blood are all needed to get conclusive results as the technoligy of the drugs are ahead of the the testing to they should make the test stricter and happen more frequently.

I dont think anyone has come up with to many ideas because like me there shocked a system is not in place already. Its quite simple. If you are taking part in a world title fight you should have to undergo Olympic level drug testing which includes random blood testing up to 48 hours before a fight. There shouldnt even be a debate about this.


I do think that the Olympic level drug testing would remove doubt as they use the same system more ahtletics and cycling and plenty of people have been getting caught. Infact the testing for boxing should be stricter as people are putting there life on the line.

Ok the accusation first came from Mayweather Snr and people dismiss his opinion because hes not an academicly smart man but he knows boxing like the back of his hand.

If you were about to put your life and career on the line and your own Dad who has a large knowledge of boxing has suspicions that the guy your fighting is taking something that will make him faster and punch harder, you would want to make sure he is not tested.

btw Olympic level drug testing was reported to be part of the agreement made in principle 2 weeks ago so why the sudden change?

Reported, but we didn't hear it from the horses mouth. Lots of misinformation flying around about this fight.

I understand what you're saying but you have to see it from the other point of view. No other boxer has been subjected to this, so it's obviously very personal. Why should Pac agree to more than he has already?

As I said earlier, if this was being demanded in a fight no one cared about there would be none of the hoopla. So it's obvious this has more to do with people wanting to see the big fight rather than more testing in boxing.

[icemax]

Honestly do not get why Mosley has not got more shit for it.

You and me together

[brown bomber]

I' be suprised if both are found to be clean.

[kieron]

I appreciate the practical, financial difficulties in applying more rigorous testing across the board but surely having Olympic type testing before any world title fight is better than simply saying it is impractical and won't work and therefore we won't impose these levels of testing at all. As someone pointed out the blood tests that are currently taken in boxing are primarily to ensure guys aren't HIV+ etc. If you're going to be so lax about the issue then we may as well just open the flood gates and remove all drug testing and let guys take what they want. More of a level playing field but imagine the implications!!

[dan-b]

I appreciate the practical, financial difficulties in applying more rigorous testing across the board but surely having Olympic type testing before any world title fight is better than simply saying it is impractical and won't work and therefore we won't impose these levels of testing at all. As someone pointed out the blood tests that are currently taken in boxing are primarily to ensure guys aren't HIV+ etc. If you're going to be so lax about the issue then we may as well just open the flood gates and remove all drug testing and let guys take what they want. More of a level playing field but imagine the implications!!

I don't disagree with you, but that's not what this is about. Floyd's not saying, "I want to revolutionise testing in boxing", he's jsut trying to get one over on Pac. Can't you see that?

[kieron]

I don't disagree with you, but that's not what this is about. Floyd's not saying, "I want to revolutionise testing in boxing", he's jsut trying to get one over on Pac. Can't you see that?

Of course that is the game that Mayweather is playing here but it has raised a bigger question. I was really commenting on the bigger picture. Specifically relating to this fight I tend to feel uneasy about 'special' rules being applied to a fighter because of who they are but on the other hand it is a demand in response to a demand so could be deemed as tit for tat in this case

[icemax]

I appreciate the practical, financial difficulties in applying more rigorous testing across the board but surely having Olympic type testing before any world title fight is better than simply saying it is impractical and won't work and therefore we won't impose these levels of testing at all. As someone pointed out the blood tests that are currently taken in boxing are primarily to ensure guys aren't HIV+ etc. If you're going to be so lax about the issue then we may as well just open the flood gates and remove all drug testing and let guys take what they want. More of a level playing field but imagine the implications!!

Top post

[dan-b]

Top post

It was a top post. But I would only want to see that imposed after a full review of the proposal had been done and the proper way to impliment the testing had been drawn out. Not because one cocky boxer is making the demand.

[icemax]

Not because one cocky boxer is making the demand.

I agree:shock:

[kieron]

Spiffing. It seems all are in agreement then...

[Siren1927]

and it only took 9 pages :rofl

[kerrminator]

Didnt Roach train Toney when he was caught using drugs ?

[icemax]

Trevor Grahams involvement with Roach and Ariza is what raises my eyebrows

[carrotcruncher]

Trevor Grahams involvement with Roach and Ariza is what raises my eyebrows


Pac has no excuse not to be tested. End of. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear. He must do it or his career is tainted, and an explanation of a remarkable progression through the weights will be that it was achieved through the contents of a test tube.
Marion Jones always denied ....... and then.
Now the story is getting hot, the hunt will be on for suppliers if he is not clean. He might deny, but they might not.

[GazOC]

and it only took 9 pages :rofl

To be fair, its been pretty clear the point Dan was making from page 5...;)

[carrotcruncher]

Pac has no excuse not to be tested. End of. Nothing to hide, nothing to fear. He must do it or his career is tainted, and an explanation of a remarkable progression through the weights will be that it was achieved through the contents of a test tube.
Marion Jones always denied ....... and then.
Now the story is getting hot, the hunt will be on for suppliers if he is not clean. He might deny, but they might not.

Having said all that ... it will still happen because of the money involved.
Fighters bulking up ..... now let me think. Who else big in the news might be implicated in that?

[icemax]

To be fair, its been pretty clear the point Dan was making from page 5...;)

Fucking fanboy:deal :hey

[Losfer_Words]

All this over a blood test? I have one regularly and I don't get paid $15 million a crack. These people live in a fantasy world, I swear! Take the test, Pac- it'll also put a stop to all the stupid juicing allegations. I don't see why he shouldn't take it and it amazes me that people are blaming PBF for this hiccup in negotiations!:lol:

[Carnage]

Pacquiao, if your reading this, and I put the chances quite high, get fucking tested.

[Beeston Brawler]

The fact that he barely has to give a teaspoon of blood makes the refusal all the more ridiculous, as does the fact that it will be replenished in about three minutes flat.

This isn't going to weaken him anymore than choosing the wrong style of sparring partner for the fight in Khan.

[Top Dog]

The fact that he barely has to give a teaspoon of blood makes the refusal all the more ridiculous, as does the fact that it will be replenished in about three minutes flat.

This isn't going to weaken him anymore than choosing the wrong style of sparring partner for the fight in Khan.

When they run a huge test it would need to be bigger amounts than that surely, a couple of vials. Fuckin Floyd dont want the fight, and he is just trying to rile Pac into saying "fuck you Gayweather" so he can say he bottled it. Prick Floyd says change the system and we all need to listen, fuck him. What does it tell you about his confidence if he is scared of fighting Pac:tong

[robpalmer135]

When they run a huge test it would need to be bigger amounts than that surely, a couple of vials. Fuckin Floyd dont want the fight, and he is just trying to rile Pac into saying "fuck you Gayweather" so he can say he bottled it. Prick Floyd says change the system and we all need to listen, fuck him. What does it tell you about his confidence if he is scared of fighting Pac:tong

no they really take less than a teaspoon. whatever your feelings are about changing the system you have to admit the system is wrong in the first place.

Travis Tygart, chief executive of the United States Anti-Doping Agency, said a blood test can allow testers to detect use of energy-boosting synthetic EPO, human growth hormone and "a number of potent performance-enhancers not detectable in urine. . . . With a [30-day] window like that, you could dope to the gills and get away with it."

[GazOC]

I'm all for testing before title fights but I'm fucked if I think it should be brought in at Mayweather Snrs say so.

[nulty]

Didnt Roach train Toney when he was caught using drugs ?

Pretty sure toney had moved on from Roach by then.

Edit: I stand corrected it was Roach training him then.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Papa_Bear]

It concerns me greatly how damaging this will all be to the sport of boxing. It will vindicate the naysayers.

[Lee Mc]

Bob Arum has announced that the fight is now off.

[Grievesy]

Amazing that such petty bullshit that can put a fight in jeopardy!:-(

[Anaboilc lion]

no they really take less than a teaspoon. whatever your feelings are about changing the system you have to admit the system is wrong in the first place.

Travis Tygart, chief executive of the United States Anti-Doping Agency, said a blood test can allow testers to detect use of energy-boosting synthetic EPO, human growth hormone and "a number of potent performance-enhancers not detectable in urine. . . . With a [30-day] window like that, you could dope to the gills and get away with it."

BULLSH1T there is NO test for growth hormone (hgh). EPO yes that is easily detected in urine

[Mazallan]

Let them both fight on drugs. They will only get a few thousand dollar fine and a six month ban so it still works out great for both.

[Carnage]

Yup BBC have announced its off as well.

[HONDA2006]

Yup BBC have announced its off as well.

I concur...

[dan-b]

Thank fuck for that, now boxing can move on. All this ugly shit is undoing all the good work that's been done this year.

[rowlesy]

BULLSH1T there is NO test for growth hormone (hgh). EPO yes that is easily detected in urine

Erm yes, yes there is. [Only registered and activated users can see links] Hence why they wanted blood tests, and not just urine.

[HONDA2006]

Erm yes, yes there is. [Only registered and activated users can see links] Hence why they wanted blood tests, and not just urine.

good find...:cool:

[dan-b]

I take it everyone's read this? [Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Siren1927]

I still stand by the fact its just a ploy to keep the fight on mainstream TV before they announce it in January

[dan-b]

I still stand by the fact its just a ploy to keep the fight on mainstream TV before they announce it in January

All very negative though, don't you think?

[trotter]

I'm all for testing before title fights but I'm fucked if I think it should be brought in at Mayweather Snrs say so.

Quite

Allied to the fact that Pac WILL take the blood tests, just not immediately before the fight, and he'll take random urine tests at any time, it's pretty conclusive to me that he has nothing to hide

Does anyone really believe Roach would fight tooth and nail over this just so he can skilfully cycle Pac on /off while avoiding the tests lol, it's utterly ridiculous

Floyd has just cast a filthy big shadow over the sport and over it's biggest star... more people should focus on that than buying into unsubstantiated rumours from crackhead Floyd Sr

[dan-b]

Quite

Allied to the fact that Pac WILL take the blood tests, just not immediately before the fight, and he'll take random urine tests at any time, it's pretty conclusive to me that he has nothing to hide

Does anyone really believe Roach would fight tooth and nail over this just so he can skilfully cycle Pac on /off while avoiding the tests lol, it's utterly ridiculous

Floyd has just cast a filthy big shadow over the sport and over it's biggest star... more people should focus on that than buying into unsubstantiated rumours from crackhead Floyd Sr

Thank you. I know Dan684 is going to crucify me for this but this really is the last I have to say on the matter. I honestly do believe this has been a malicious act from Floyd who is resentful someone else has stolen the limelight. By his own admission he resents the perceived "favouritism" in the sport and people always talk about him being such a shrewd businessman, why is this so unbelievable?

What he's done here is manage to convince the wider public that it's not his fault the fight isn't taking place and also cast a shadow over Pac's recent achievements. I honestly do believe Floyd is spiteful enough to do this, you only have to listen to his interviews to see how bitter he is.

The upshot of all this is that it looks very bad for boxing at a time when progess was being made. Is it a coincidence this has happened upon Floyd's return? I'll let you be the judges.