Asikainen was robbed

[Ramon Rojo]

I just watched the Asikainen - Sylvester fight and it´s true.

Sylvester hit him in the neck.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Toney]

This is no joke. Referee Giuseppe Quartarone did huge mistakes. Asikainen´s camp is considering to make a complain about the referee.

Please, just dont say that this is only crying. Before you say that, please re-watch the fight and these things:

1. Round
Asikainen knocked Sylvester down with a left hook same time bell. I have understood that the fef have two things to do here. 1) count to Sylvester, so Asikainen gets a 10-8 round. 2) If the ref thinks that the punch came too late, then he should had taken a point away from Asikainen and give Sylvester time to recover. Well the punch did not come too late.
What did Quartare do? None of these. He HELPED SYLVESTER UP (What The Fuck) and HELPED SYLVSTER TO HIS CORNER. I can not belive it. This can happend only in Germany.

8. Round
Sylvester took a step to behind of Asikainen and punched a hard punch to the neck of Asikainen. Asikainen wobbled badly and was clearly hurt. What did Giuseppe Quartarone do??? He did not take a point away from Sylvester!! If the referee do not take a point that (ILLEAGAL PUNCH THAT REALLY HURT THE OTHER BOXER). And what was the worse thing to Asikainen that Quartarone did not give the badly shaken Asikainen no time to recover. Right after the foul the ref asked that are you okey and Asikainen said yes, but the referee should has seen that he was not okey. He should had first said to the fouled boxer that he has time to recover if he needed time. A shaken boxer automaticly just answered that yes, yes.

Asikainen told after the fight to Finnish press that he could not feel his legs after the punch to the neck. And even his trainer had to ask him in the round pause that does Asikainen know who he is.

Round 11.
First there was a situation where Sylvester pulled down Asikainen´s head and punched him. The referee did say to Sylvester to not do it again. A minute after it same happened again. Sylvester pushed Asikainen´s head down and punched after it. This time Asikainen went down. What did Quartarone do? He just ruled it a slip. This time he did not say it was a foul and he did not say that it was not. If he would had ruled it a clean punch he should had ruled is a knockdown, what he did not do. If he would had ruled it a foul (what is clearly was) he should had given Asikainen time to recover. Once again Asikainen was badly hurt and the ref just started the fight right after the foul. And when he did that Asikainen had his mouthpeace in his glove! Asikainen had his mouthpeace in his hand and Quartarone allowed Sylvester to go after him!

It was a sad day for boxing. :-( These thing should not happend. I just hope that Giuseppe Quartane did not destroy Asikainen´s career compleatly. I am not sure. Asikainen might never be the same again after this. I really hope that he will be.

I do not belive that Quartane was payd to do everything he can to get the hometown boxer a victory. Of course it is possible, but I do not belive in it. He just made huge mistakes and put a man´s career and healt in danger.

[Flurry]

Stop whining and bitching

Sylvester´s rabbit punch in the 8th admittedly was an illegal shot but it didn´t land that hard and asikainen - seeing the fight was slipping from his fingers - tried to capitalize from it by putting on a B- grade Hollywood play acting show, Im glad the ref didnt take a point from sylvester in this incident.

The right hand he hit him with in the 11th was a legit shot and the ref should have administered a count on Asikainen.

You re wrong about the situation at the end of the 1st as well: Asikainens left hand seemed to connect either right with the sound of the bell or a split second after it, very difficult to tell, the ref obviously was of the opinion it had come after the bell which is why he didnt give sylvester a count. Logically he didnt deduct a point from Asikainen because the intention to throw the shot must still have originated inside the round, while the execution of the shot (in the refs eyes) came slightly after it, so in effect Asikainen didnt intentionally punch him after the round had ended, he had been in a fluent motion with the bell coming in between (or so the ref saw it)

[chliJs]

dariusz asikainen...

[Toney]

It shurely was no clean fight.
Sylvester hit Asikainen in the neck one time. It didn´t look like a hard punch though.
The referee schould have...
In the end I would say, bad referee
but the right winner. Not an hard punch??? I can not belive that people is saying this?
Just, please re-watch it from a tape! About 10 seconds after the intentional foul Asikainen wobbled, when Sylvester did not land a punch! How can people say that Asikainen did lot lose his legs with that punch to the neck? And why do you think that Asikainen´s trainer Pekka Mäki asked of Asikainen "who am I?" in the roundpause? Don´t you think it was becouse the FACT that Asikainen was badly hurt of the intentional neck punch? He was badly hurt by an intentional foul and referee did NOTHING to it. He should had give Asikainen 5 minutes to recover. Now Asikainen got maybe 5 seconds and the ref did not even warn Sylvester, who intentionally hurt his opponent with a illeagal punch. It was no accident, anyone could see it.

Punches to the neck are very dangerous. That punch did not come to the back of the head (that is also dangerous), the punch came straight to the neck what is very weak and sensitive spot in humans body.

That punch took very much out of Asikainen and it put his whole healt in danger. Asikainen had to spend two nights after the bout in German hospital.

I think that Sylvester fought as good fight as he can fight. He does deserwe credit. But what if there would had been at least decent referee, who would had:
1. Counted to Sylvester in round one.
2. Gived Asikainen 2-5 minutes to recover from the intentional, dangerous foul in round 8.
3. Taken a point away from Sylvester the intentional, dangerous foul.

And possibly given Asikainen time to recover in round 11. from the thing when Sylvester pushed Asikainen´s head down and punched him to to canvas. The ref could had also taken a point of him.

Just think about it. With a decent referee:
Asikainen would had won the first round 10-8, that would had meant that he would had not had open up and go so hard for the KO later in the fight.
After the intentional fould he would had got his leags back and he would had most likely won the round 10-8, if the referee would had taken a point away from Sylvester, as he should had.
At this point Asikainen would had lead the fight clearly and he would have had his legs under him. The last 4 rounds would had been totally different. Sylvester would had had to attack, not Asikainen. The result could had been totally different.

[Toney]

Well, the fight was in Germany and the hometown boxer won, so it must be a robbery. Case closed.
Just watch the fight! And you can not think that thinks like these are OK for boxing? We need to get these things away from boxing and it does not happend if we just close the case after fights like this.

[Toney]

I agree that the referee was a bad one but you can´t blame Sylvester or Sauerland for that. The referee did wrong for both sides... I agree. Who knows, maybe Sauerland did pay something to Quartarone or maybe not. I don´t belive in it, I dont want to belive in it. I still hope that the EBU referees and judges are still not corrupted.

But Quartarone is a real bad referee or he had a terrible night. Asikainen had to pay of it with his title, unbeaten record, #4 ranking in the IBF world rankings... upcoming big moneyfights... and almoust with his healt.

The is no doubt about it: EBU should rule an immediate rematch. Thanks to the terrible referee this great fight was VERY doubful.

[seldon71]

He was badly hurt by an intentional foul and referee did NOTHING to it. He should had give Asikainen 5 minutes to recover. Now Asikainen got maybe 5 seconds and the ref did not even warn Sylvester, who intentionally hurt his opponent with a illeagal punch. It was no accident, anyone could see it.


Well, I think that's a bit of exaggaration. Referee did WARN Sylvester (but did not penalize). Plus, he did give Asikainen a little bit of time to get organised (haven't timed it, but maybe about 20 seconds). However, both actions were completely undermeasured.

I was sitting in the 1st row approx. 3 meters away from Asikainen's corner and I can tell that Asikainen was completely out when he returned to the corner after that round. Since that punch to the neck, Asikainen was slipping and stumbling constantly even without being hit. Yes, part of that was probably fatigue etc. but OTOH those signs of fatigue ONLY appeared directly after the illegal punch.

Watched from close-by, I would have actually thrown the towel in during the 10th round as the way Amin's legs acted looked as there was a potential brain haemorrhage. Luckily that was not the case.

Personally, I have no quarrel about the knockdowns in the 11th round. Both were legitimate enough although I have to say I thought (apparently mistakenly) that Amin was given a 8-count on that 1st trip to canvas (as he should have). Still I think there was about 8 seconds period from Asikainen going down 1st time to fight continuing so it did not necessarily mean a thing whether it was counted or not.

[Toney]

Well, I think that's a bit of exaggaration. Referee did WARN Sylvester (but did not penalize). Plus, he did give Asikainen a little bit of time to get organised (haven't timed it, but maybe about 20 seconds). However, both actions were completely undermeasured.

Personally, I have no quarrel about the knockdowns in the 11th round. Both were legitimate enough although I have to say I thought (apparently mistakenly) that Amin was given a 8-count on that 1st trip to canvas (as he should have). Still I think there was about 8 seconds period from Asikainen going down 1st time to fight continuing so it did not necessarily mean a thing whether it was counted or not.

I timed those moments. The rest time in round eight was about 22 seconds and in the 11th after the first "slip" 13 seconds, so more than a normal 8-count :shock:.

[Tom_Tocca]

Sorry guys, I've seen the rerun on MDR the next morning so I can't say anything about the 8th round...the kd in the 1st should have been counted AND the 1st kd in round 11 should have been counted too - it wasn't illegal...

[VHB]

The complaint WILL BE MADE and Asikainen´s manager honestly thinks that 3rd meeting will be mandated! Referee´s RETARDED actions made the fight turn up how it did, otherwise Sylvester might´ve been disqualified before the time it ended now. I sure hope they won´t have to call new purse bids then, ´cause there´s no way Sylvester would have the balls to come to Finland. :D And to Asikainen it does not matter since he knows it´s all his fight, with no crap referee or hasty fighting.

[Tom_Tocca]

The complaint WILL BE MADE and Asikainen´s manager honestly thinks that 3rd meeting will be mandated! Referee´s RETARDED actions made the fight turn up how it did, otherwise Sylvester might´ve been disqualified before the time it ended now. I sure hope they won´t have to call new purse bids then, ´cause there´s no way Sylvester would have the balls to come to Finland. :D And to Asikainen it does not matter since he knows it´s all his fight, with no crap referee or hasty fighting.

...an there is no way that P3 will outbid Sauerland Event...:bbb no way Sylvester would have been DQed by a single punch (was it really thrown with bad intentions?)...

[VHB]

Last time they only lost the bid by few thousands. So I´d say that being the only thing we can relate to - they can win the bid. And okay, let´s say not disqualified, more like DEFEATED.

[MrMagic]

Question is:
Toney do you think Asikainen still stand a chance against Miranda or Taylor?

[MrMagic]

Aavan meren tuolla puolen jossakin on maa
missä onnen kaukorantaan laine liplattaa
missä kukat kauneimmat luo aina loistettaan
siellä huolet huomisen saa jäädä unholaan

[VHB]

Asikainen´s chances against Miranda are pretty much irrelevant since he isn´t moving to super middle but Miranda is almost forced to do so. Miranda has also been exposed as one of the most limited fighters among the ranked ones. And Taylor doesn´t fight anyone who won´t come to US and Asikainen won´t bother, but I don´t think Taylor would take him either. And YES, by using his skills and tactics well, and not getting hasty or being fowl-played by referee or opponent, Asikainen does have a chance against soft Taylor or very rugged Miranda.

[Toney]

Question is:
Toney do you think Asikainen still stand a chance against Miranda or Taylor? Yes, I am will come back as good as he was. Taylor did not look like Mr. Destroyer against a welterweight (spinks) and Miranda would be good fight for Asikainen, becouse he come forward, it suits Asikainen a lot better than a guy that moves.

And Amin had huge pressure in this fight becouse it was in Germany. He thought that he could not get a decision. We went for the KO. He did not belive that the referee would help to hometown boxer getting and help him to get to his corner. :yep This actually sounds already pretty funny! :rofl When Don uses "Only in America", maybe Sauerland should use: "Only in Germany".

Shit... We need to put in in the Internet.A sort tape where the ref first lifts Sylvester from canves and then the part where Sylvester hits in Asikainen in the neck (without point penalty or recovery-time). And a text "ONLY IN GERMANY".

[MrMagic]

I have watched the fight twice on my computer, and all I can say is yes... Amin lost his focus and was obviously disturbed by the german fans screaming each time Sylvester hit him on the gloves.
Nevertheless, Amin has some major flaws and his trainer needs to give him the kind of coaching he needs, look in round 6(?) When he went back to his corner being somewhat stressed, his trainer should've calmed him down.
Amin was in for a test, and he got tricked.
There have to be a rubber match, Amin should easily win.

[Toney]

Well, what are you complaining about?

I would love to see a third match between both, their first two fights were very entertaining.
Just think about it. With a decent referee:
Asikainen would had won the first round 10-8, that would had meant that he would had not had open up and go so hard for the KO later in the fight.
After the intentional fould he would had got his leags back and he would had most likely won the round 10-8, if the referee would had taken a point away from Sylvester, as he should had.
At this point Asikainen would had lead the fight clearly and he would have had his legs under him. The last 4 rounds would had been totally different. Sylvester would had had to attack, not Asikainen. The result could had been totally different.

Anyway:
These two fights have been great. This fight only offered more action to fans than Felix Sturms careers all fights together.

[Flurry]

hahaha what a bunch of sore losers.

Btw as to the scoring, I heard Asikainen was ahead on the cards at the time of the stoppage, pretty incomprehensible to me and just comes to show that this whining about decisions in germany is a pretext.

[Toney]

There have to be a rubber match, Amin should easily win.
I agree that Asikainen did not fight a smart fight. Sylvester was the smarter guy. And I have NEVER seen Asikainen losing his his focus like that. He took too much pressure of the KO.

[MrMagic]

Anyway according to boxrec, Amin has a fight scheduled for September in Stockholm, if this is true I should go there and see him.

[MrMagic]

The fight was quite unique in its way.
In a few series of event Amin lost his focus, the german crowd, the neck blows, the pushing from Sylvester. He had Sylvester on queer street not once but twice, and I think he tried to force the KO but lost everything he usually is. Amin should definitely win a rubber match, there's no doubt in my eyes.
It was quite obvious that Amin could pull a Felix Sturm on Sylvester any day of the week, when Amin jabbed Sylvester, he could not do anything in return, because he was fighting with a tight defence, going backwards.. :-(

[NBT]

Yes, I am will come back as good as he was.
Too bad he isn't that good to begin with...
Seriously guys, that's a lot of whining you do right now, think about it. It took 2 days for you to get out of the shell and I almost thought the fight would fade away fast but now the crying is going strong. :yep
If Asikainen can be hurt that easily by a light puncher like Sylvester the top guys would mutilate him. For health reasons he should stick to European level.

[seldon71]

Sorry guys, I've seen the rerun on MDR the next morning so I can't say anything about the 8th round...the kd in the 1st should have been counted AND the 1st kd in round 11 should have been counted too - it wasn't illegal...

I think the fact that the 8th round was the ONLY round they dropped out of re-run tells you something about how blatant and ugly that foul was :-( :-( :-(

[seldon71]

...an there is no way that P3 will outbid Sauerland Event...:bbb no way Sylvester would have been DQed by a single punch (was it really thrown with bad intentions?)...

Well, last time bids were 254,321 Euros by Sauerland and 240,000 Euros by P3. I'd say that when the sums are that high and difference that small, sheer luck plays a large part in who wins.

No one wants to pay more than necessary so it's about outguessing the other one. That time Sauerland did it.

To your 2nd point : yes, it was thrown with bad intentions and yes, it was very damaging. Additionally, I absolutely agree that the 1st serious foul of otherwise rather clean fight CAN NOT cause a DQ. I can even understand that referee hesitated on penalising Sylvester as there was no previous fouling (at least not serious) in a fight.

So, the point of protesting is IMO very clear and singular. Asikainen's capacity to continue fighting was severely hampered by an obvious foul. Referee failed to give him the proper resting time that the foul would have entitled him to. Thus referee's misaction had direct consequences to the result and ending of the fight.

That does not make Sylvester unworthy winner, that does not make the result itself to be protested against. Just that there is a justifiable claim that the mistake by the referee did indeed was an important factor in the outcome and thus Asikainen deserves to receive either a) an immediate rematch or at minimum b) an immediate mandatory spot.

Petri Paimander

[Toney]

I think the fact that the 8th round was the ONLY round they dropped out of re-run tells you something about how blatant and ugly that foul was :-( :-( :-(
Isn´t it just so German boxing :yep A German fighter makes an intentional, bad foul and that is the only thing that they don´t show in the replay. Everyone must had been wondering that what happened to Asikainen, when he was a different man after they jumped over the intentional foul. It was the turning point of the fight.

[Toney]

Yeah, fuck Germany! :good

You know, i respect that you´re a fan and you want support your man but beeing a bit more objective would help your cause.

Thanks and I know... get get overexchited at times.

Well... I am pretty that EBU will rule a rematch and I can not wait for Asikainen - Sylvester 3! Asikainen is the better man and with a decent referee and decent tactics he will beat Sylvester!

[unitas]

asikainen lost cause he is a bullshit fraud with no chin.

[Axe]

Both guys are solid at EBU level and fringe-world level.

I still think the Fin is the better fighter but hats off to Sylvester for avenging his loss.

[My dinner with Conteh]

hahaha what a bunch of sore losers.

Btw as to the scoring, I heard Asikainen was ahead on the cards at the time of the stoppage, pretty incomprehensible to me and just comes to show that this whining about decisions in germany is a pretext.


I know. How embarrassing is this thread. It amazes me that people can't enjoy a good fight. :huh

[chliJs]

asikainen lost cause he is a bullshit fraud with no chin.

:thumbsup

[sean]

not his chin that is in question but his recuperation powers.

lots of fighters go down, but when askainen got up he was still counting sheep and looked like he had just drunk the whole bar dry .

no powers of recovery at all and once hurt he is a sitting duck.

especially when you think sylvester cannot punch.

[krutov]

You Finns ALWAYS come up with excuses. Even when you are utterly destroyed and crushed, someone comes crawling back with a pathethic excuse. The best excuse i've ever heard was when Sweden completely destroyed and humiliated Finland in a hockey match. A Finnish dude said that there was something wrong with the ice, "if the ice wasn't wet and covered with dirt and soda we would've won"

[krutov]

About the Asikainen - Sylvester fight. I think Asikainen was the better fighter. Sylvester just ran the whole fight and it was a clear knockdown in the second round, the left hook that put Sylvester on the canvas, he should've recieved a count there. In the end it seemed as Asikainen was out of gas and he was out on his feet when the ref stoped the fight. Asikainen should win if they fight again.

[Toney]

P3 Boxing has now left an official complaint to the European Boxing Union. I belive that EBU does the right thing and takes Asikainen´side in this matter. Here is the complaint: [Only registered and activated users can see links]

[Ramon Rojo]

You Finns ALWAYS come up with excuses. Even when you are utterly destroyed and crushed, someone comes crawling back with a pathethic excuse. The best excuse i've ever heard was when Sweden completely destroyed and humiliated Finland in a hockey match. A Finnish dude said that there was something wrong with the ice, "if the ice wasn't wet and covered with dirt and soda we would've won"

Yeah, Finland sucks!

[Toney]

I can not belive how jealous the Swedish people are. I am very sorry that you have no good fighter. I am sorry that Asikainen is way batter than any Swedsh boxer. But I do not know what it has to do with this thing. Everyone know that the referee did huge mistakes in this fight and Asikainen had to pay a high price from it. Ruling an immediate rematch is the very least thing that EBU can do.

[MrMagic]

I can not belive how jealous the Swedish people are. I am very sorry that you have no good fighter. I am sorry that Asikainen is way batter than any Swedsh boxer. But I do not know what it has to do with this thing. Everyone know that the referee did huge mistakes in this fight and Asikainen had to pay a high price from it. Ruling an immediate rematch is the very least thing that EBU can do.
All-time Sweden absolutely obliterates Finland.. no question about it.
Right now you're right there is no main man on the boxing scene, might be because there has been a ban here for a long time dont you think?

[Ramon Rojo]

I can not belive how jealous the Swedish people are. I am very sorry that you have no good fighter. I am sorry that Asikainen is way batter than any Swedsh boxer. But I do not know what it has to do with this thing. Everyone know that the referee did huge mistakes in this fight and Asikainen had to pay a high price from it. Ruling an immediate rematch is the very least thing that EBU can do.

I wouldn´t say that, only when we have our own heavyweight champion of the world we can afford to say that. And i don´t think that´s ever gonna happen.

[Toney]

P3 Boxing has now left an official complaint to the European Boxing Union. I belive that EBU does the right thing and takes Asikainen´side in this matter. Here is the complaint: [Only registered and activated users can see links]








Well, just dont be jealous Swedish boys. Yes, Sweden had that and that... But today Finland is far more succesful in boxing. Amin Asikainen and Juho Tolppola are at totally different level than any Swede and in amateur boxing we have Robert Helenius ([Only registered and activated users can see links]), a super heavyweight who is ranked #6 in the world! :good

[krutov]

Yeah, Finland sucks!No, Finland don't suck. I just think it's pathetic with guys like finnish Toney to dig for excuses when their man or team lose. I think Asikainen deserves a rematch. :good

[Jens S]

It is true. Asikainen was robbed... of his manhood and pride. Exposed!

Jens