Tony Ayala Jr. proving his greatness [Archive]

TBooze

03-04-2010, 05:59 AM

Ayala was a potential genius, but paid the price with huge flaws, that were with hindsight (and probably for some foresight), always going to bring him down.

Like Tyson, if you found a way to get rid of them flaws that held him back, you would of also taken away the potential he had as a fighter, IMO.

TheGreatA

03-04-2010, 06:11 AM

A 19-20 year old Ayala would've given Campas the worst beating he ever had. :!::!::!:

He could have been a Vargas at best.

Titan1

03-04-2010, 03:18 PM

Benitez would've shown him up, unfortunately.

lefthook31

03-04-2010, 03:42 PM

He could have been a Vargas at best.
Maybe Ricardo Mayorga. :yep Vargas had some boxing skills.

anarci

03-04-2010, 03:49 PM

A 19-20 year old Ayala would've given Campas the worst beating he ever had. :!::!::!: :good I totally agree with that, hell the old version after being away from boxing for 20 years was doing very well for most of the fight, this would have been an easy win for a prime Ayala.

lefthook31

03-04-2010, 04:49 PM

:good I totally agree with that, hell the old version after being away from boxing for 20 years was doing very well for most of the fight, this would have been an easy win for a prime Ayala.
Campas was no spring chicken either my man.

anarci

03-04-2010, 04:59 PM

Campas was no spring chicken either my man.
True, but he was still very active and the younger man. You can compare his slide to Ayalas who had been out of boxing for so long, he still had decent hand speed and power but nowhere near as his prime, he was teeing off on Yori early in this fight, in his Ayala would have stopped Yori .

Russell

03-04-2010, 05:20 PM

True, but he was still very active and the younger man. You can compare his slide to Ayalas who had been out of boxing for so long, he still had decent hand speed and power but nowhere near as his prime, he was teeing off on Yori early in this fight, in his Ayala would have stopped Yori .

Yori was in wars prior to the Ayala fight that Tony sure as shit never saw. Not particularly easy to point a finger and go "Yurp, this one was farther past his best".

laxpdx

03-05-2010, 03:24 AM

I don't think so. Ayala overated!:patsch

Were you even born then? :roll:

laxpdx

03-05-2010, 03:26 AM

Yori was in wars prior to the Ayala fight that Tony sure as shit never saw. Not particularly easy to point a finger and go "Yurp, this one was farther past his best".

Plenty easy. Tony was 37 years old and hadn't fought in almost 20 years. Enough said.

laxpdx

03-05-2010, 03:27 AM

Maybe Ricardo Mayorga. :yep Vargas had some boxing skills.

Tony would've shredded both those guys in one night. Simply too much firepower.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 04:57 AM

Son of Gaul

03-05-2010, 04:58 AM

well when the chips are down, we know what ayala does...
lol

anarci

03-05-2010, 05:21 AM

I dont why they let the sick fuck out of jail.
I thought American justice was pretty tough. Obviously not.

He was a hot prospect though. But he was unproven in his youth. Who did he beat before going to jail who was top-flight ? Carlos Herrera(who gave Maurice Hope all he wanted) and Robbie Eppswho beat top contender Dwight Davison before he fought Ayala. Those were probably the two top guys he fought. also kod a few tough journeyman. Also blew out former title challenger Steve Gregory.

mcvey

03-05-2010, 05:22 AM

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Ayala had a big fan club, women were known to scream when he turned up.

Boxed Ears

03-05-2010, 05:23 AM

Tony made Jake LaMotta look like a lifelong feminist.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 05:32 AM

Carlos Herrera(who gave Maurice Hope all he wanted) and Robbie Eppswho beat top contender Dwight Davison before he fought Ayala. Those were probably the two top guys he fought. also kod a few tough journeyman. Also blew out former title challenger Steve Gregory.

Yeah, I've seen the Epps fight.
Ayala took him out in one round and wanted to keep hitting him after the referee stopped it. Was Ayala retarded or what ?

I dont think Epps was much good though.

ricardinho

03-05-2010, 05:41 AM

I dont why they let the sick fuck out of jail.
I thought American justice was pretty tough. Obviously not.

He was a hot prospect though. But he was unproven in his youth. Who did he beat before going to jail who was top-flight ?

As a student of the Law the federal criminal law system in the US is in the stone age it is very archaic and unforgiving. If he was not famous he would have stayed in Jail a lot longer. However, He did go to prison in Texas which is not fun. I personally never liked the guy, but he sure could fight.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 05:49 AM

As a student of the Law the federal criminal law system in the US is in the stone age it is very archaic and unforgiving. If he was not famous he would have stayed in Jail a lot longer. However, He did go to prison in Texas which is not fun. I personally never liked the guy, but he sure could fight.

In my opinion : The nature of his crimes were such that if the system is to make no effort to rehabilitating him or fix him mentally, then it should keep him locked up forever.

He could fight, yeah. But maybe a bit too hyped. He was an aggressive puncher but never came across as much more than that. I think his age, 19, allowed him to be a good bet to hype-up.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 05:50 AM

I found the Epps fight :

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Interesting what Epps is trying to tell us in the post-fight interview 6:00

anarci

03-05-2010, 05:57 AM

Yeah, I've seen the Epps fight.
Ayala took him out in one round and wanted to keep hitting him after the referee stopped it. Was Ayala retarded or what ?

I dont think Epps was much good though. Epps was a good fighter who was real rangy, i had a friend who fought him*Hank Livingstone* he said Epps had a real snappy jab and could hit you from across the ring. Epps beat Davison who was a very good fighter and considered one of the top mws. Ayala just blew out Epps, how can you tell how good Epps was by that? Tony looked awesome in that fight. Ayala was just an angry crazy Mof, and Epps insulted his family thats why he wanted to keep hitting him he also spat on him.

ricardinho

03-05-2010, 06:02 AM

In my opinion : The nature of his crimes were such that if the system is to make no effort to rehabilitating him or fix him mentally, then it should keep him locked up forever.

He could fight, yeah. But maybe a bit too hyped. He was an aggressive puncher but never came across as much more than that. I think his age, 19, allowed him to be a good bet to hype-up.

Rehabilitation is actually only a part of the motives for incarceration in the American Penal System. I am too tired to elaborate but I think he should have been killed. Rapists and pedophiles deserve to be executed...just my opinion.

I agree with your sentiments but the law does not permit that.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 06:10 AM

Epps was a good fighter who was real rangy, i had a friend who fought him*Hank Livingstone* he said Epps had a real snappy jab and could hit you from across the ring. Epps beat Davison who was a very good fighter and considered one of the top mws. Ayala just blew out Epps, how can you tell how good Epps was by that?

Epps was no world-beater, that's what I mean. Ayala probably beat a few guys on his level.

Tony looked awesome in that fight. Ayala was just an angry crazy Mof, and Epps insulted his family thats why he wanted to keep hitting him he also spat on him.

Turns out that Ayala was more than "just an angry crazy Mof" ..... he was a A-1 predatory rapist. I suppose he was a "motherfucker" in the sense that he's likely to break into your home and fuck your mother.

And Epps was right to dislike him. Any decent human being would.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 06:12 AM

I am too tired to elaborate but I think he should have been killed.

It would be no great loss.

anarci

03-05-2010, 06:25 AM

Epps was no world-beater, that's what I mean. Ayala probably beat a few guys on his level.

Turns out that Ayala was more than "just an angry crazy Mof" ..... he was a A-1 predatory rapist. I suppose he was a "motherfucker" in the sense that he's likely to break into your home and fuck my mother.

And Epps was right to dislike him. Any decent human being would.

True :-( and he pulled some shit like this before when he was 16 against a girl in a drive in movie theater bathroom, supposedly they paid the girl off. Dont think he actually raped her but he some how attempted too while he was drunk or high on heroin.

TheGreatA

03-05-2010, 07:02 AM

Charlie Weir beat all the opponents that Ayala Jr. beat and usually did it in more impressive fashion.

lefthook31

03-05-2010, 08:09 AM

I dont know how anyone can be a fan of this guy. Hes a piece of shit that wasnt even proven. He never had the class to compete on the top level, and yes, Epps knew all along he was evil.

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 08:12 AM

I dont know how anyone can be a fan of this guy. Hes a piece of shit that wasnt even proven. He never had the class to compete on the top level, and yes, Epps knew all along he was evil.

As a fighter, at best he should be regarded on a par with a fledgling John Mugabi (1983). And, to be honest, I thought Mugabi a much better prospect.

As a human being, he's beneath all adjectives. Evil will do.

Flea Man

03-05-2010, 08:21 AM

Charlie Weir beat all the opponents that Ayala Jr. beat and usually did it in more impressive fashion.

Interesting, I wasn't aware of him.

I guess he'd beat Hearns, Duran, Hagler and Leonard too:lol:

I can't understand why the Ayala fans A) see something no one else does B) want to fight the corner of such a despicable charcter?

Unforgiven

03-05-2010, 08:29 AM

I can't understand why the Ayala fans A) see something no one else does B) want to fight the corner of such a despicable charcter?

A) Because every hyped undefeated fighter whose career is cut short will get that. They become an enigma. Ayala was very young too, adding to his "aura of potentiality".

B) They are possibly deviants themselves ?

Flea Man

03-05-2010, 08:37 AM

A) Because every hyped undefeated fighter whose career is cut short will get that. They become an enigma. Ayala was very young too, adding to his "aura of potentiality".

B) They are possibly deviants themselves ?

BOLD: Agreed, but at least say, Aaron Pryor (technically not undefeated but in his prime was) proved something whilst they were here.

LINED: :lol:

lora

03-05-2010, 12:35 PM

Davey Moore would have caved Ayala's skull in.

Flea Man

03-05-2010, 12:45 PM

Davey Moore would have caved Ayala's skull in.

I tend to agree with this.

Drew101

03-05-2010, 04:14 PM

Charlie Weir beat all the opponents that Ayala Jr. beat and usually did it in more impressive fashion.

Well, not all, but he took way less time to beat Nicanor Camacho, and took the same about of time to dispense with a version of Gregory that was probably a bit closer to his best.

I think Ayala would have been hard pressed to get by Moore; and even if he had, then would likely have suffered the same type of beating that Duran suffered...only ten times worse because he would likely have done something to piss off the Manos de Piedra

TheGreatA

03-05-2010, 04:19 PM

Well, not all, but he took way less time to beat Nicanor Camacho, and took the same about of time to dispense with a version of Gregory that was probably a bit closer to his best.

I think Ayala would have been hard pressed to get by Moore; and even if he had, then would likely have suffered the same type of beating that Duran suffered...only ten times worse because he would likely have done something to piss off the Manos de Piedra

It also took Weir less time to dispose of Jerry Cheatham.

Saying that Weir beat all of them was an exaggeration on my part but he did beat some of the men Ayala beat and generally did it in more impressive fashion. Overall his record has better names on it. Who is to say that Ayala Jr. would have turned out to be any better than Charlie Weir?

lora

03-05-2010, 04:29 PM

weir was another "angry" fighter marketed on his viscious punching and dirty fighting as well.

Moore wasn't having any of that, and just beat the crap right out of him.

laxpdx

03-06-2010, 12:43 AM

weir was another "angry" fighter marketed on his viscious punching and dirty fighting as well.

Moore wasn't having any of that, and just beat the crap right out of him.

And then Tony Ayala would've beaten the shit out of Davey Moore. He's made for El Torito.

CassiusClayAli

03-06-2010, 01:25 AM

And then Tony Ayala would've beaten the shit out of Davey Moore. He's made for El Torito.:lol::rofl:lol99dude!!!!Davey would have had a nice 3 rounds blitzing of Ayala!!! Ayala was a terrible fighter and I dont even say he is over rated since most people think he was a horrible fighter and a dispicable person to add to that. This thread is a waste of time. The guy never amounted to anything and Tony never could have won a title and never did saying he would beat Moore or anyone good is a :lol:!!!! Mugabi would have knocked Ayala in the air and out of the ring!!!!!!!!! any good fighter would learn boxing!!!!!! :happy to Campas for beating up Tony the way he should have showing ayala what a real fighter with experience does!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

laxpdx

03-06-2010, 01:43 AM

:lol::rofl:lol99dude!!!!Davey would have had a nice 3 rounds blitzing of Ayala!!! Ayala was a terrible fighter and I dont even say he is over rated since most people think he was a horrible fighter and a dispicable person to add to that. This thread is a waste of time. The guy never amounted to anything and Tony never could have won a title and never did saying he would beat Moore or anyone good is a :lol:!!!! Mugabi would have knocked Ayala in the air and out of the ring!!!!!!!!! any good fighter would learn boxing!!!!!! :happy to Campas for beating up Tony the way he should have showing ayala what a real fighter with experience does!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The only fighter you know anything about is Ali :nut :yep

anarci

03-06-2010, 03:34 AM

LOu Duva has really talked high of Ayala, I can see him pumping him alittle but i think he was being honest for the most part in his assessment on Ayala. I mean ive never heard him pump a fighter as much as he did Ayala, and he has had coutless prospects.

zadfrak

03-06-2010, 03:39 AM

But that's Duva.

What guy of his didn't he pump up?

lefthook31

03-06-2010, 08:26 AM

Duva was more of a boxing cheerleading than a trainer. He wasnt the greatest trainer. Even his own people around him will admit to that. He was more a figure head for Main Events with his big mouth, than anything as the rest of his family was pretty laid back.

The Morlocks

03-09-2010, 05:20 PM

well when the chips are down, we know what ayala does...
and when the pants are down:smh

Jorodz

03-09-2010, 06:15 PM

and when the pants are down:smh

:lol: c'mon now

as much scum as ayala is (and he is) i'm gonna give him a look. i've spoken highly of meldrick taylor and ibeabuchi, whose potential exceeds their accomplishments. maybe i'll see something decent

redrooster

03-09-2010, 06:20 PM

It was certainly the best opponent Ayala ever faced.

This was too painful to watch. I didnt even recognize Tony and refused to watch more than a minute as Campos toyed with him. Why was this even put on?