1974 Muhammad Ali vs. 1996 Mike Tyson

[KOTF]

All the Tyson-Ali match-up threads were about prime for prime fights. Time to match-up the "past-prime" iterations. The Ali that KO'ed Foreman vs. the Tyson that TKO'ed Frank Bruno. Who wins and why?

[Xplosive]

Ali TKO 9.

[PhillyPhan69]

Ali TKO 9.

Being a Tyson fan that must be a hard pick??? But R U sure it ends with a stoppage??? I would pick Ali in a prime match up as well as a 71 vs 91 type match...and probably lean towards it here as wll.

Tyson of 96 is clearly not what he once was but he was still a solid HW and a force to worry about and be prepared for. I like the 96 version of Holyfield better than the 74 version of Ali, and it took him 11 hard rds to finnish Tyson. I don't think Ali will hit him as much or as hard (Not that Holy is the the greatest puncher as far as 1 punch power goes) as Holy did. and by Tyson's performance in his 3 bouts leading to Holy he still had a great punch, even if his speed and ability to throw combo's was diminshed. He held his own in the Holyfield fight, and stunned him a few times. I rank Holy's chin not so much different from Ali's (BLASPHEME!), so have no trouble seeing Tyson hurt this Ali and even possible end him .

Ali is not going to rope a dope Tyson...or if he does I don't believe it will be as succesful against tyson, even this version. He would get dropped by Wepner in his very next fight, so I don't have to much trouble envisioning Tyson being able to drop him...and maybe even stop him. Now I like Wepner and Lyle (feel like Lyle gets sold a little short!), but it took Ali 15 and 11 to get stoppages in those fights so don't see why they are any more durable than this version of Tyson.

I would lean towards an Ali decision in the 8-4/7-5 range (I have no clue how Tyson would fare in a 15 rd bout, and would have even more questions about it at this stage of his carear)... I could possibly envision a worn out Mike getting dropped and finished in 10-12 or so, but don't feel comfortable with that pick! I could even envision Tyson finnishing Ali for the reasons I stated earlier...but don't really see him being able to win a decision, unless Ali really did try to rope a dope him!

[heehoo]

Ali stops him. Tyson would wear down late and have difficulty landing cleanly on Ali, who would use his defense to evade Tyson's shots.

[laxpdx]

Tyson comes on strong at first and has Cassius literally against the ropes. But Ali survives, as a result of his defensive abilities, coupled with Mike gradually "punching himself out", so to speak. Ali most likely takes it by UD, but I wouldn't rule out a late TKO either.

[JudgeDredd]

Ali tko 10

[jaffay]

Ali decision

[ChrisPontius]

A better question is: would Ali have an easier time with that version of Tyson or with Foreman? I think Tyson would give him a harder fight..

[duran duran]

ali of 74 would beat the tyson of 96 by a late stoppage mike was basicly shot by 96 he was flat footed and had poor stamina at there prime though i would have backed tyson

[red cobra]

Tyson didn't have the stamina issues of the '70's version of Foreman, so the rope-a-dope would have been somewhat futile as well as foolish against a much different type of puncher than the clubbing blows of Foreman. Also Ali isn't knocking out Mike Tyson...any version of him. Ali, in 41 combined rounds failed to score the 1st knockdown against Joe Frazier..the same Joe Frazier that is generally considered to have an inferior set of whiskers to Mike Tyson, Ali stopped George Foreman largely by virtue of Foreman's exhaustion..both mental and physical exhaustion..Ali didn't have the punching power of either Buster Douglas or Evander Holyfield, who both, as it's been pointed out already in a previous post, landed plenty of flush shots and accumulated punishment on Tyson before he succumbed to them. The more likely scenario is that the wily, resourceful '74 Ali would have found a way to negate Tyson's power by fighting a smart fight featuring much strategic holding and frustrating Mike while scoring with his light but accurate jabs and occasiional lead right hands, very similar to the second fight with Frazier. Ali would get the decision over 15, but Tyson would be less of a struggle than Frazier yet a much tougher ordeal than Foreman was to Ali.

[francis1962]

I think Ali wins by TKO late. When plan A doesn't work for Tyson, there is no plan B. Ali would be to clever, to smart and to good. What a great fight to see though.!!

[Kalasinn]

Ali by UD.
Thought this was Tyson from 'Holyfield I' when I voted, but after reading that it was Tyson from 'Bruno II', my opinion of the outcome remained unchanged.

[Duodenum]

Something which ought to be taken into account when considering this is that Ali originally idolized Patterson while still an amateur, and understood the peek-a-boo style, actually emulating it for a time. (It's why Liston briefly hired young Clay on as a sparring partner before dethroning Floyd, so Sonny could practice swinging downward at a low target. I have a magazine article with a photograph of the two of them sparring together buried somewhere. Surprised I haven't seen it pop up on line through another source yet. Should be just a matter of time though.) Later, Muhammad was prepared for dealing with the nuances of Patterson's approach.

Ali wouldn't be rope a doping here, but he would be clinching liberally as a frustration and neutralizing tactic, yanking down on the shorter man's neck in the process. Tyson would either lose his composure or get discouraged.

[ripcity]

I think an older wiser Ali such as the 1974 version has a better chance to beat a prime 86-89 Tyson than the prime 65-67 version of Ali dose. I think Ali in 1974 would not dance around around like he would in 67. I don't think he would use the rope a dope. Tyson might have not been as good in 96 as he was in 86, but he was not going to waist punches. I think Ali would hit and hold his way to decision victory.

[PowerPuncher]

Ali scores a late KO over this Tyson, 88 Tyson KOs 74 Ali though

[Jaws]

Tyson didn't have the stamina issues of the '70's version of Foreman, so the rope-a-dope would have been somewhat futile as well as foolish against a much different type of puncher than the clubbing blows of Foreman. Also Ali isn't knocking out Mike Tyson...any version of him. Ali, in 41 combined rounds failed to score the 1st knockdown against Joe Frazier..the same Joe Frazier that is generally considered to have an inferior set of whiskers to Mike Tyson, Ali stopped George Foreman largely by virtue of Foreman's exhaustion..both mental and physical exhaustion..Ali didn't have the punching power of either Buster Douglas or Evander Holyfield, who both, as it's been pointed out already in a previous post, landed plenty of flush shots and accumulated punishment on Tyson before he succumbed to them. The more likely scenario is that the wily, resourceful '74 Ali would have found a way to negate Tyson's power by fighting a smart fight featuring much strategic holding and frustrating Mike while scoring with his light but accurate jabs and occasiional lead right hands, very similar to the second fight with Frazier. Ali would get the decision over 15, but Tyson would be less of a struggle than Frazier yet a much tougher ordeal than Foreman was to Ali.

Great post. I too would favor Ali by decision here. I do not see him KOing Tyson late. Tyson's chin is quite underrated. He was never sparked in his entire career, which included some massive punchers. And all of his KO losses came after insane amounts of punishment and fatigue. Can Ali become "the bully" to do that?

[Bummy Davis]

Tyson has a good early shot against Ali, lets face it anyone can get stopped. I think though as the fight goes on Ali the stronger fighter mentally and Tyson will tire...I see Ali coming on after 8-9 rds after Tyson shoots his wad and Ali comes on....Always a tough fight...I like Ali close in 12 and big in 15

[(PimpThaSystem)]

Ali uses his reach and ties Tyson up when he gets close all night for a UD.

[RockysSplitNose]

THis would be a great high tempo fight, but Ali's extra class and skills would discourage Tyson - and the difference in class between the brilliant long range box and hold skills of Ali (and his general confidence and defiance) - compared with the limited self belief and reliance on getting his big punches on (of Tyson) would show in the end - Ali definately wouldn't being using much of the rope-a-dope in this one (but then again - in my opinion he hardly used it a tremendous amount vs Foreman anyway) but Ali did show what genius he had and what he really could do against Foreman whereas Tyson in his 96 matches showed tell tale signs of limited imagination aswell as frustration - Ali pulled off a great against the odds upset which was quintessential Ali whereas Tyson was the victim of one. Psychologically everything would go in Ali's favour over the course of this one. Would expect a stoppage (late) - only because everytime someone beat Tyson he didn't see the final bell.

[My2Sense]

Ali was younger, healthier, and less shopworn than a '96 Holyfield, and arguably was a better fighter to begin with. He would outclass Tyson all the same.

[tommygun711]

74 Ali? This Ali was wiser and hit harder then the 66 Ali. Since Tyson's chin is questionable the punching power would make the difference. Tyson would not slip Ali's jab even at Ali's stage of his career, it was still very accurate and he could double up on it very well.
Ali would definitely get hit more and punished by Tyson, but would Ali take it? Of course. He would hold on to Tyson and the reff would break them up, and then Ali would probably wave him in again and then pretend he's not hurt. Then move off the ropes and throw some steady combos and nail tyson in a late round TKO.

[Quitali Bitchko]

Since Tyson's chin is questionable

:lol:

[Unforgiven]

Ali by TKO

[Stevie G]

A better question is: would Ali have an easier time with that version of Tyson or with Foreman? I think Tyson would give him a harder fight..
A prime version of Tyson may have given Ali stiffer opposition than a prime Foreman did,but the '96 version of Tyson would n't. A 1974 Ali would have quite an easy time of it,using ring centre and avoiding most of Tyson's still dangerous punch power. The few times that Tyson would connect cleanly,Ali would take it without much evidence of being hurt too much. Ali would wear Tyson down and stop him in about ten rounds.

[Stevie G]

Ali was younger, healthier, and less shopworn than a '96 Holyfield, and arguably was a better fighter to begin with. He would outclass Tyson all the same.
Good point. Ali was a lot fresher in 1974 than Holyfield was in '96.