Roberto Duran vs Roy Jones Jr @ MW

[Pachilles]

who takes it?

[Boxed Ears]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

[KOTF]

Duran wins by KO if Jones decided to switch to a goofy southpaw :nonono

[ATP]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam












:lol: :lol: makes my day

[itrymariti]

:lol:

[ChrisPontius]

Someone voted for Duran :lol::patsch

[bodhi]

Duran KO1. Jones isn´t even competing in the same sport as Super-Duran.

[Pachilles]

I just can't see the MW Duran who lost a UD to Hagler, losing against any other middleweight.

[anarci]

Duran would knock him sillier than Tarver and Glenn Johnson did:nut:nut:nut:nut:nut:bbb:bbb:bbb:bbb:bbb

[essexboy]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

wont catch on

[MAG1965]

Roy's style is terrible for Duran. He would do the same thing as Ray did to Duran, although Roy's habit of being on the ropes might get him hit by Duran, Duran would not be fast enough to beat him. Roy would win an easy decision.

[Boxed Ears]

wont catch on

:lol:...It already has. (And if it hasn't done it enough, I've got a backup plan)

[Stevie G]

As much as I liked Duran,and as ambivalent as I feel about Jones,the middleweight Roberto would have been clearly outboxed.

[Pachilles]

As much as I liked Duran,and as ambivalent as I feel about Jones,the middleweight Roberto would have been clearly outboxed.

General forum is one up.

[Son of Gaul]

Someone voted for Duran :lol::patsch
:huh

[Stevie G]

General forum is one up.
What...???? My scenario is quite feasible. Pound for pound,Duran is head and shoulders above Jones,but as a middleweight,he would n't be fast enough to catch his speedy and more mobile opponent.

[laxpdx]

Duran struggles to simply go the distance, if he can.

[essexboy]

:lol:...It already has. (And if it hasn't done it enough, I've got a backup plan)

which is....

[Pachilles]

What...???? My scenario is quite feasible. Pound for pound,Duran is head and shoulders above Jones,but as a middleweight,he would n't be fast enough to catch his speedy and more mobile opponent.

"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is Duran when I lay my vengeance upon thee."

[Lobotomy]

All Duran needs to deliver is a thumb in the eye followed by a shot in the nuts, then everybody can go home happy. (LoBianco's the referee, right?)

[Pachilles]

All Duran needs to deliver is a thumb in the eye followed by a shot in the nuts, then everybody can go home happy. (LoBianco's the referee, right?)

Noooo! to Buchanan no blow blow men!

[Lobotomy]

Noooo! to Buchanan no blow blow men!:lol:

[MAG1965]

I am not sure how people can say Duran would knockout Jones? How? Not with the left. The only thing Duran had to hit Jones with was his right hand, but Jones wouldn't be hit with that. People call me closed minded about Duran not being 5-10 ATG because I say he is 25-30, but his fans are very closed minded to think he would even land against Jones. Duran would have no chance at middleweight against Jones. Bad style for him. Jones is not Barkley.

[rekcutnevets]

I just voted for the wrong guy for the 2nd time today.

Jones is troubled by opponents with a long jab. Duran does not have one, against Jones that is.

Jones would defeat Duran in a fashion similar to Joppy, but Jones could do it against a much younger Duran.

[Cricket]

Much like Grant Morisson's Bat-God on his JLA, Duran with prep time takes down Jones Jr. in less than 6 and tortures him for the full 12 if Duran feels slighted by Roy pre fight.



Nobody beats Super Duran if he has prep time.

[Popkins]

who takes it?

I'm a massive Duran fan, but I don't think he has a prayer at mw vs Jones. An ATG lightweight vs an ATG light-heavyweight just isn't viable.

[Addie]

I'm a massive Duran fan, but I don't think he has a prayer at mw vs Jones. An ATG lightweight vs an ATG light-heavyweight just isn't viable.

What's your criteria for a being an ATG in a weight class, Popkins? Jones makes your LHW top 10?

[Addie]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

:lol: You're fucking relentless.

[Popkins]

What's your criteria for a being an ATG in a weight class, Popkins? Jones makes your LHW top 10?

I think Jones would make a top 10. He'd be there or thereabouts. I'd need to think about it. He gets bonus points for h2h strength. He'd dazzle all but the small core of historys elite level lhw's IMO. Joe Calzaghe didn't beat many (if any) great smws, but he is still a great smw. You get points for dominance and looking good against the best guys you did fight.

[Addie]

I think Jones would make a top 10. He'd be there or thereabouts. I'd need to think about it. He gets bonus points for h2h strength. He'd dazzle all but the small core of historys elite level lhw's IMO. Joe Calzaghe didn't beat many (if any) great smws, but he is still a great smw. You get points for dominance and looking good against the best guys you did fight.

The only problem with the Calzaghe comparison is that 168lbs can't begin to compete with the talent 175lbs has seen through the years. Charles, Moore, Conn, Spinks, Foster, etc. I think Jones could fit in near the bottom of a top 10 list at Light Heavyweight, I was just being difficult.

Duran doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell, either. :verysad

[Stevie G]

"The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. Blessed is he, who in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through the valley of darkness, for he is truly his brother's keeper and the finder of lost children. And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who would attempt to poison and destroy my brothers. And you will know my name is Duran when I lay my vengeance upon thee."
As I walk through the path of Madison Square Garden,I fear no fighter....:good

[teeto]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

[essexboy]

Pongsaklek Wonjongkam

Dont you fucking start. :lol:

[bodhi]

I am not sure how people can say Duran would knockout Jones? How? Not with the left. The only thing Duran had to hit Jones with was his right hand, but Jones wouldn't be hit with that. People call me closed minded about Duran not being 5-10 ATG because I say he is 25-30, but his fans are very closed minded to think he would even land against Jones. Duran would have no chance at middleweight against Jones. Bad style for him. Jones is not Barkley.

I don´t call you close minded, I call you crazy.

[arther1045]

[quote=MAG1965;6451389]Roy's style is terrible for Duran. He would do the same thing as Ray did to Duran,

So if they fought before Duran was in his late 30s they were split, like Leonard and Duran did.

[OBCboxer]

Duran KO. His resume is sparkling.

[MAG1965]

[quote=MAG1965;6451389]Roy's style is terrible for Duran. He would do the same thing as Ray did to Duran,

So if they fought before Duran was in his late 30s they were split, like Leonard and Duran did.Ray easily beat Duran. The first fight was Ray fighting Duran's fight. The fact is that once Ray moved Duran could only hope to land the right hand, and it was almost ineffective. Then Benitez easily beats Duran. Believe me the style of Roy easily beats Duran at middleweight. Roy would probably stop him, I am saying decision since it was hard to stop Duran. Duran would not be able to land anything and would just be walking forward throwing nothing and being countered.

[MAG1965]

I don´t call you close minded, I call you crazy.crazy? I back up all my facts. To call Duran top 5-10 ATG is a big stretch. He didn't fight anyone great at lightweight and could land his punches on the inside. He was quick compared to most and had a great right and great inside punches. But when he moved up the guys moved and he couldn't utilize his good speed but not great, and his foot positining was too wide apart-even at lightweight. How is that crazy? I study fights. I put in the old tapes and play them over and over. I see how Duran fights in old fights and more recent. He looked great when a guy was in front of him, but he never overcame a great style to win who was great. He always won when the style was good for him, but when it wasn't he just didn't come through. He always needed the great style or lesser opponent or something to equalize. But when he fought a great who was exceptional he didn't win, no matter what excuse the fans give me.

Ray Leonard and Thomas Hearns had two ways to fight and were more versatile. And that is overlooked by Duran fans, who tend to overrate him because of his machismo and charisma, and overrated him for that, instead of his wins over fellow greats which there really are none. He acted so confident when he won that fans seem to see that and think, that guy is invincible, and he was not knocked out much except for Hearns, so people bought the excuses.

[NickHudson]

Everyone's entitled to an opinion, and obviously no-one knows for sure with historical matchups.

But... listening to you reminds me of a brain 'short circuit.'

Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Leonard, Hearns....over and over and over again.

We all know your opinions re: Duran. I now understand the following thanks to your penetrating insight and wisdom, and am glad I have now seen the light:

1) Duran never fought anyone good at LW. Buchanan, DeJesus et al were all overrated because of their association with Duran.

2) His 'peak' record of 72-1 (56KO) was padded.

3) His best wins were against fighters where he cheated (Buchanan) or where his opponents were either green (Leonard), weight-drained (DeJesus II), ancient (deJesus III), crap (Moore) or taylor-made for him stylistically (Barkley).

4) His unprecedented win, in moving up an entire division to unequivocally batter an ATG at their best weight when they were unbeaten and at the peak of their confidence and physical powers - was totally overshadowed by Duran spitting at the end of the fight.

5) Duran's appearance on film, an almost perfect blend of controlled savagery, great athleticism and endurance, ring savvy, feinting, head movement, total lack of fear and a full repertoire of offensive and defensive boxing skills - is really just a set of clever camera angles and hyperbolic commentary - if he hadn't benefited from the might of the Panamanian media, he would never have been known wider circles.

6) Being a 4 division champ, and fighting successfully across 5 decades merely reinforces how hand-picked his opponents were.

7) In addition to his opponents being iffy, he also fought them when it was convenient for him, not them - and under carefully constructed stipulations that were patently unfair. One prime example being Leonard I where he insisted on the fight being over 15 rounds and using boxing gloves.

8) While he has glamorous names on his record, they were all green or ancient. Excellent examples, being the 'green' undefeated champion Leonard, the 'past-it' middle-of-middleweight rein Marvin Hagler, and the similarly-sized peak performance of Tommy Hearns.


:tired



crazy? I back up all my facts. To call Duran top 5-10 ATG is a big stretch. He didn't fight anyone great at lightweight and could land his punches on the inside. He was quick compared to most and had a great right and great inside punches. But when he moved up the guys moved and he couldn't utilize his good speed but not great, and his foot positining was too wide apart-even at lightweight. How is that crazy?

[MAG1965]

Everyone's entitled to an opinion, and obviously no-one knows for sure with historical matchups.

But... listening to you reminds me of a brain 'short circuit.'

Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Leonard, Hearns....over and over and over again.

We all know your opinions re: Duran. I now understand the following thanks to your penetrating insight and wisdom, and am glad I have now seen the light:

1) Duran never fought anyone good at LW. Buchanan, DeJesus et al were all overrated because of their association with Duran.

2) His 'peak' record of 72-1 (56KO) was padded.

3) His best wins were against fighters where he cheated (Buchanan) or where his opponents were either green (Leonard), weight-drained (DeJesus II), ancient (deJesus III), crap (Moore) or taylor-made for him stylistically (Barkley).

4) His unprecedented win, in moving up an entire division to unequivocally batter an ATG at their best weight when they were unbeaten and at the peak of their confidence and physical powers - was totally overshadowed by Duran spitting at the end of the fight.

5) Duran's appearance on film, an almost perfect blend of controlled savagery, great athleticism and endurance, ring savvy, feinting, head movement, total lack of fear and a full repertoire of offensive and defensive boxing skills - is really just a set of clever camera angles and hyperbolic commentary - if he hadn't benefited from the might of the Panamanian media, he would never have been known wider circles.

6) Being a 4 division champ, and fighting successfully across 5 decades merely reinforces how hand-picked his opponents were.

7) In addition to his opponents being iffy, he also fought them when it was convenient for him, not them - and under carefully constructed stipulations that were patently unfair. One prime example being Leonard I where he insisted on the fight being over 15 rounds and using boxing gloves.

8) While he has glamorous names on his record, they were all green or ancient. Excellent examples, being the 'green' undefeated champion Leonard, the 'past-it' middle-of-middleweight rein Marvin Hagler, and the similarly-sized peak performance of Tommy Hearns.


:tiredHe was a champion with Hearns at 154. I know we are going over the same arguments and neither of us will change our opinions. You say Duran moved up one whole division to beat Ray and you say Ray was an ATG, in June of 1980 Ray was not the complete ATG he was later. How can that be fact? He had fought 2 title fights. Hearns moved up 2 full divisions if you call welt to mid to light heavyweight and beat Hill, but Hearns did not have the machismo and theatrics of Duran, but his wins were just as good and probably better. Hearns won 3 of his titles from Cuevas,Benitez,Hill, and beat Duran in what should have been a unification? 4-0 in those fights against those guys. Again my point is not that Duran is not an ATG, it is that he is not 25-30 ATG.