My Top 100 of all-time [Archive] - East Side Boxing Forum

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TBooze

10-09-2007, 04:46 PM

Now I know this should be probably left in the classic forum, but I always be criticized for a lack of a Contemporary view, so there is a positive bias here for modern fighters; have I got it right this time? (I think I might know the answer!)

The numbers in brackets were places I placed my top 35 of all-time in April 2005

100 Manny Paciquao
99 Harry Wills
98 Kid McCoy
97 Jeff Fenech
96 Carlos Ortiz
95 Jimmy McLarnin
94 Tony Zale
93 Ted ‘Kid’ Lewis
92 Freddie Welsh
91 Dick Tiger
90 Jeff Chandler
89 James J Corbett
88 Brian Mitchell
87 Wilfredo Gomez
86 Kid Chocolate
85 Marcel Cerdan
84 Joe Frazier
83 Winky Wright
82 Kostya Tszyu
81 Jimmy Carruthers
80 Jack McAuliffe
79 Rinty Monaghan
78 Nicolino Loche
77 Mike Tyson
76 Bob Montgomery
75 Lennox Lewis
74 Young Griffo
73 Aaron Pryor
72 Nino Benvenuti
71 Jim Driscoll
70 Salvador Sanchez
69 Mike McCallum
68 Jack Dempsey
67 Flash Elorde
66 Wilfred Benitez
65 Rocky Marciano
64 Felix Trinidad
63 Abe Attell
62 Antonio Cervantes
61 James J Jeffries
60 Al Brown
59 Eusebio Pedroza
58 Jack Dempsey (The Nonpareil)
57 Evander Holyfield
56 Bob Foster
55 Larry Holmes
54 Stanley Ketchel (19)
53 Michael Spinks
52 Azumah Nelson
51 Ruben Olivares (32)
50 Jose Napoles
49 Pascual Perez
48 Manuel Ortiz
47 Ike Williams
46 Roy Jones Jr (35)
45 Maxie Rosenbloom
44 Jack Johnson
43 Floyd Mayweather Jr
42 Tony Canzoneri
41 George Foreman (34)
40 Eder Jofre (26)
39 Johnny Kilbane
38 Kid Gavilan
37 Tommy Loughran
36 Ricardo Lopez
35 Alexis Arguello (24)
34 Bernard Hopkins
33 Carlos Zarate (25)
32 (Barbados) Joe Walcott
31 Tommy Hearns (31)
30 Marvin Hagler (30)
29 Pancho Villa (21)
28 Emile Griffith
27 Joe Louis (29)
26 Joe Gans (33)
25 Gene Tunney (28.)
24 Terry McGovern
23 George Dixon (27)
22 Georges Carpentier (4)
21 Oscar de la Hoya (22)
20 Pernell Whitaker (23)
19 Julio Cesar Chavez (15)
18 Sammy Langford (9)
17 Barney Ross
16 Ray Leonard (13)
15 Carlos Monzon (12)
14 Ezzard Charles (17)
13 Bob Fitzsimmons (20)
12 Benny Leonard (16)
11 Charley Burley (10)
10 Muhammad Ali (11)
9 Harry Grebb (18.)
8 Jimmy Wilde (7)
7 Sandy Saddler (5)
6 Willie Pep (6)
5 Mickey Walker (14)
4 Archie Moore (8.)
3 Roberto Duran (3)
2 Henry Armstrong (2)
1 Ray Robinson (1)

ChampionsForever

10-09-2007, 04:48 PM

De La Hoya is a tad high is my first impression.

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 04:50 PM

Delahoyas above Hagler and Hearns! :rofl :rofl :rofl

I love it, Jacks gonna fist fuck his computer screen when he sees this :happy :happy :happy

chimba

10-09-2007, 04:51 PM

Not to be Biased PAc should be in the 80's at least ..this man was a Flyweight champ and a destroyer at Super Bantam. Al his fights now are just icin on the cake..Give him credit at the lower weight just like you do Wilde.

Speaking of Wilde, Pancho Villa should be higher dude.( at least top 20 although below Wilde)..He punished Wilde and died at 22 or something and theres a controversy attached to it...Ill expand if you want me to

Ring Master

10-09-2007, 04:51 PM

De La Hoya is a tad high is my first impression.

Like 7 spots ahead of Joe Louis :lol:

Daddy

10-09-2007, 04:51 PM

De La Hoya is a tad high is my first impression.

Totally Agreed!

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 04:52 PM

Having Lennox at 75 is disgraceful.

Mayweather above Jones??? You're sick!

Boom_Boom

10-09-2007, 04:55 PM

Greb is too low imo

fadeintobolivia

10-09-2007, 04:56 PM

Trinidad above Marciano, Lewis,Tyson and Spinks above Holyfield and Holmes
are you crazy.

chimba

10-09-2007, 04:59 PM

Greb is too low imo

The more I think of Greb the more I think hes overrated. Although I think Duran is a bit high...Top 10 for sure but between 5-8

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 04:59 PM

DLH at 21 is the biggest issue, he's not even top 75.

ChampionsForever

10-09-2007, 04:59 PM

IMO id put Trinidad above Floyd Mayweather, Trinidad has done more in hes career than Floyd has up until this point if you ask me, the two losses hurt him bad because of the domination but hey its just my opinion. I think an undefeated Vargas and DLH beat any 2 names on Mayweathers list exculding the promoter he just fought.

chimba

10-09-2007, 05:02 PM

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 05:04 PM

Thread Stealer

10-09-2007, 05:04 PM

Lists like this are extremely hard to make. For the most part it is pretty good. Ones that I take issue with are:

-Pacquiao being so low. He's already won titles in 3 divisions, is the top contender in a 4th, ranging from 112 to 130. He's more accomplished than guys such as Brian Mitchell, Winky Wright, and Aaron Pryor (who wasted too much of his talent)

-De La Hoya being so high. Oscar's a terrific fighter, but #21? Ahead of guys like Joe Louis, Tommy Hearns, and Marvin Hagler? :huh

-Moore being 10 spots ahead of Charles. Moore obviously had more fights and more wins, but Charles went 3-0 against him at LHW (where Charles had a staggering resume in a relatively small # of fights) when they were in/near their primes, and also Charles was a very good HW champion as well.

Now I know this should be probably left in the classic forum, but I always be criticized for a lack of a Contemporary view, so there is a positive bias here for modern fighters; have I got it right this time? (I think I might know the answer!)

The numbers in brackets were places I placed my top 35 of all-time in April 2005

100 Manny Paciquao
99 Harry Wills
98 Kid McCoy
97 Jeff Fenech
96 Carlos Ortiz
95 Jimmy McLarnin
94 Tony Zale
93 Ted ‘Kid’ Lewis
92 Freddie Welsh
91 Dick Tiger
90 Jeff Chandler
89 James J Corbett
88 Brian Mitchell
87 Wilfredo Gomez
86 Kid Chocolate
85 Marcel Cerdan
84 Joe Frazier
83 Winky Wright
82 Kostya Tszyu
81 Jimmy Carruthers
80 Jack McAuliffe
79 Rinty Monaghan
78 Nicolino Loche
77 Mike Tyson
76 Bob Montgomery
75 Lennox Lewis
74 Brian Mitchell
73 Aaron Pryor
72 Nino Benvenuti
71 Jim Driscoll
70 Salvador Sanchez
69 Mike McCallum
68 Jack Dempsey
67 Flash Elorde
66 Wilfred Benitez
65 Rocky Marciano
64 Felix Trinidad
63 Abe Attell
62 Antonio Cervantes
61 James J Jeffries
60 Al Brown
59 Eusebio Pedroza
58 Jack Dempsey (The Nonpareil)
57 Evander Holyfield
56 Bob Foster
55 Larry Holmes
54 Stanley Ketchel (19)
53 Michael Spinks
52 Azumah Nelson
51 Ruben Olivares (32)
50 Jose Napoles
49 Pascual Perez
48 Manuel Ortiz
47 Ike Williams
46 Roy Jones Jr (35)
45 Maxie Rosenbloom
44 Jack Johnson
43 Floyd Mayweather Jr
42 Tony Canzoneri
41 George Foreman (34)
40 Eder Jofre (26)
39 Johnny Kilbane
38 Kid Gavilan
37 Tommy Loughran
36 Ricardo Lopez
35 Alexis Arguello (24)
34 Bernard Hopkins
33 Carlos Zarate (25)
32 (Barbados) Joe Walcott
31 Tommy Hearns (31)
30 Marvin Hagler (30)
29 Pancho Villa (21)
28 Emile Griffith
27 Joe Louis (29)
26 Joe Gans (33)
25 Gene Tunney (28.)
24 Terry McGovern
23 George Dixon (27)
22 Georges Carpentier (4)
21 Oscar de la Hoya (22)
20 Pernell Whitaker (23)
19 Julio Cesar Chavez (15)
18 Sammy Langford (9)
17 Barney Ross
16 Ray Leonard (13)
15 Carlos Monzon (12)
14 Ezzard Charles (17)
13 Bob Fitzsimmons (20)
12 Benny Leonard (16)
11 Charley Burley (10)
10 Muhammad Ali (11)
9 Harry Grebb (18.)
8 Jimmy Wilde (7)
7 Sandy Saddler (5)
6 Willie Pep (6)
5 Mickey Walker (14)
4 Archie Moore (8.)
3 Roberto Duran (3)
2 Henry Armstrong (2)
1 Ray Robinson (1)

ChampionsForever

10-09-2007, 05:04 PM

Agreed but he lost to DLH:good :hi:

I know he did :yep but PBF "lost" to Castillo, but it isnt counted, also I had he's last fight a draw.

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 05:05 PM

You could make a case for Pacquaio to rank over DLH, seriously, DLH is not a top 75 fighter and it is just so fucking sick that he's thought of universally as such.

Thread Stealer

10-09-2007, 05:05 PM

Spinks above Holyfield and Holmes
are you crazy.

Michael Spinks is greater than both of them.

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 05:07 PM

I know he did :yep but PBF "lost" to Castillo, but it isnt counted, also I had he's last fight a draw.

Can definitley say that Castillo won by a point or two, can also make just as good a case for Mayweather by a point or two.

But DLH-Mayweather a draw? Learn how to score a fight mate, that was 8-4 or 9-3 Mayweather all day long.

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 05:08 PM

If anyone thinks he's justified in putting Holmes and Holyfield and Spinks for that matter above Lewis, then please, please explain it to me.

chimba

10-09-2007, 05:13 PM

-Moore being 10 spots ahead of Charles. Moore obviously had more fights and more wins, but Charles went 3-0 against him at LHW (where Charles had a staggering resume in a relatively small # of fights) when they were in/near their primes, and also Charles was a very good HW champion as well.[/quote]

This boggles my mind also there is no way in hell Moore should be higher than ezzard..Ill even take close next to each other !!!hes the greatest LHW of all time

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 05:13 PM

But DLH-Mayweather a draw? Learn how to score a fight mate, that was 8-4 or 9-3 Mayweather all day long.
9-3? Wrong. I had it a draw. I can see 7-5, but 9-3? Jesus Christ.

Thread Stealer

10-09-2007, 05:13 PM

If anyone thinks he's justified in putting Holmes and Holyfield and Spinks for that matter above Lewis, then please, please explain it to me.

Michael Spinks?

He's one of the greatest light-heavyweights ever. He fought in one of the best 175 lb. eras in history and never lost at the weight. He beat the Davis brothers, Dwight Qawi, Yaqui Lopez, Marvin Johnson, Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, Murray Sutherland. And then he jumped to heavyweight and twice beat the real champion in Larry Holmes. The first fight was definitely a fair win for Spinks, the rematch on the other hand was a joke.

The relatively low number of fights works against him, as does his pitiful showing against the larger Mike Tyson, but he did an amazing amount of work in just 32 fights. He was also one of the most adaptable fighters ever.

Bomb out the lesser hitters, or box carefully against the powerful guys and swarmers.

chimba

10-09-2007, 05:13 PM

How is Greb overrated? Do tell.

From what videos Ive seen Im not impressed at all, were you?

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 05:14 PM

Michael Spinks?

He's one of the greatest light-heavyweights ever. He fought in one of the best 175 lb. eras in history and never lost at the weight. He beat the Davis brothers, Dwight Qawi, Yaqui Lopez, Marvin Johnson, Eddie Mustafa Muhammad, Murray Sutherland. And then he jumped to heavyweight and twice beat the real champion in Larry Holmes. The first fight was definitely a fair win for Spinks, the rematch on the other hand was a joke.

The relatively low number of fights works against him, as does his pitiful showing against the larger Mike Tyson, but he did an amazing amount of work in just 32 fights. He was also one of the most adaptable fighters ever.

Bomb out the lesser hitters, or box carefully against the powerful guys and swarmers.
Yeah, my bad...really, I was thinking just Heavy when I typed that. Sorry :oops:

Rickypr18

10-09-2007, 05:14 PM

Holy shit... you have Wilfredo Gomez 80 something or 70 something and Carlos Zarate who got DOMINATED by Gomez at 33. What the hell???

Manjanek

10-09-2007, 05:17 PM

Didn't DLH just lose to Mayweather?

Fedor Em

10-09-2007, 06:37 PM

DLH is not top 40. Mickey Walker was a hell of a fighter, possibly top 25, but 5 is a bit high. Holyfield is way too low as well, he is top 40 easily.

Fedor Em

10-09-2007, 06:40 PM

Also Jofre at 40, and Louis around 30 is far too low as well.

Action

10-09-2007, 06:46 PM

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. George Foreman
4. Rocky Marciano
6. Gene Tunney
7. Jack Dempsey
8. Larry Holmes
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Evander Holyfield

These guys could beat any of the remaining 90 on the list.
These are the top ten boxers of all time

Boro chris

10-09-2007, 06:46 PM

Now I know this should be probably left in the classic forum, but I always be criticized for a lack of a Contemporary view, so there is a positive bias here for modern fighters; have I got it right this time? (I think I might know the answer!)

The numbers in brackets were places I placed my top 35 of all-time in April 2005

100 Manny Paciquao
99 Harry Wills
98 Kid McCoy
97 Jeff Fenech
96 Carlos Ortiz
95 Jimmy McLarnin
94 Tony Zale
93 Ted ‘Kid’ Lewis
92 Freddie Welsh
91 Dick Tiger
90 Jeff Chandler
89 James J Corbett
88 BRIAN MITCHELL
87 Wilfredo Gomez
86 Kid Chocolate
85 Marcel Cerdan
84 Joe Frazier
83 Winky Wright
82 Kostya Tszyu
81 Jimmy Carruthers
80 Jack McAuliffe
79 Rinty Monaghan
78 Nicolino Loche
77 Mike Tyson
76 Bob Montgomery
75 Lennox Lewis
74 BRIAN MITCHELL
73 Aaron Pryor
72 Nino Benvenuti
71 Jim Driscoll
70 Salvador Sanchez
69 Mike McCallum
68 Jack Dempsey
67 Flash Elorde
66 Wilfred Benitez
65 Rocky Marciano
64 Felix Trinidad
63 Abe Attell
62 Antonio Cervantes
61 James J Jeffries
60 Al Brown
59 Eusebio Pedroza
58 Jack Dempsey (The Nonpareil)
57 Evander Holyfield
56 Bob Foster
55 Larry Holmes
54 Stanley Ketchel (19)
53 Michael Spinks
52 Azumah Nelson
51 Ruben Olivares (32)
50 Jose Napoles
49 Pascual Perez
48 Manuel Ortiz
47 Ike Williams
46 Roy Jones Jr (35)
45 Maxie Rosenbloom
44 Jack Johnson
43 Floyd Mayweather Jr
42 Tony Canzoneri
41 George Foreman (34)
40 Eder Jofre (26)
39 Johnny Kilbane
38 Kid Gavilan
37 Tommy Loughran
36 Ricardo Lopez
35 Alexis Arguello (24)
34 Bernard Hopkins
33 Carlos Zarate (25)
32 (Barbados) Joe Walcott
31 Tommy Hearns (31)
30 Marvin Hagler (30)
29 Pancho Villa (21)
28 Emile Griffith
27 Joe Louis (29)
26 Joe Gans (33)
25 Gene Tunney (28.)
24 Terry McGovern
23 George Dixon (27)
22 Georges Carpentier (4)
21 Oscar de la Hoya (22)
20 Pernell Whitaker (23)
19 Julio Cesar Chavez (15)
18 Sammy Langford (9)
17 Barney Ross
16 Ray Leonard (13)
15 Carlos Monzon (12)
14 Ezzard Charles (17)
13 Bob Fitzsimmons (20)
12 Benny Leonard (16)
11 Charley Burley (10)
10 Muhammad Ali (11)
9 Harry Grebb (18.)
8 Jimmy Wilde (7)
7 Sandy Saddler (5)
6 Willie Pep (6)
5 Mickey Walker (14)
4 Archie Moore (8.)
3 Roberto Duran (3)
2 Henry Armstrong (2)
1 Ray Robinson (1)

You got Brian "The Messiah" Mitchell twice.

chimba

10-09-2007, 06:49 PM

Somehow Barrera and Erik needs a place on this list and thats taking everything into consideration...The bggest omission..wheres Kid Panama??

Relentless

10-09-2007, 06:49 PM

you put de la hoya in the right place :good

McGrain

10-09-2007, 06:57 PM

If anyone thinks he's justified in putting Holmes and Holyfield and Spinks for that matter above Lewis, then please, please explain it to me.

IMO Lewis should be above Holmes. But you could make the argument for both Spinks and Hollyfield being p4p better simply because they are two weight world champs who stepped out of their comfort zones to win the additional titles.

The counter argument is that it's not Lewis' fault that he is so big.

It's dependant upon criteria.

There are mistakes here of course (Langford and Tiger are far to low for me) but the guys being critical should perhaps post their own top hundreds so we can get a look.

Seems likely that most don't have one because it would be a tough thing to put together.

Here is my top 3:

#1 Robinson
#2 Langford
#3 Armstrong

And that was a proper hard job.

McGrain

10-09-2007, 06:59 PM

you put de la hoya in the right place :good

Do you really think so? I think he is to high. Let's hear your case for Oscar being above Hearns, including your profection for a dream-match at WW.

TBooze

10-09-2007, 06:59 PM

You got Brian "The Messiah" Mitchell twice.

Yeah he was that he good, he deserved two mentions...

:oops: that should not of been there.

McGrain

10-09-2007, 07:00 PM

wheres Kid Panama??

Fair question. Where is Holman Williams is the one i'd be keener to have answered though.

McGrain

10-09-2007, 07:01 PM

Yeah he was that he could,m he deserved two mentions...

:oops: that should not of been there.

Was bound to happen.

Change it to a top 99.

McGrain

10-09-2007, 07:02 PM

Would you shut your stupid ass up? This agenda you have going on is completely ridiculous and makes you look like a dumb WWE loving hick, which you probably are. Now STFU and leave.

Aside from which, he isn't even right.

chimba

10-09-2007, 07:02 PM

Fair question. Where is Holman Williams is the one i'd be keener to have answered though.

This list is starting to have more holes than Sonny Corleone:rofl :huh :patsch

McGrain

10-09-2007, 07:03 PM

This list is starting to have more holes than Sonny Corleone:rofl :huh :patsch

NICE analogy, but there are bound to be plenty of fighters left of a list like this.

TBooze

10-09-2007, 07:04 PM

Fair question. Where is Holman Williams is the one i'd be keener to have answered though.

His resume is a little weak because he was without doubt avoided.

Druid

10-09-2007, 07:05 PM

DLH at 21 is the biggest issue, he's not even top 75.

Agreed

chimba

10-09-2007, 07:08 PM

NICE analogy, but there are bound to be plenty of fighters left of a list like this.

Not if you take the time..when you make a good list people should scrutinize the rankings but not so much how many got left off and yeah PAc is 100 wheres erik and Mab?

McGrain

10-09-2007, 07:10 PM

His resume is a little weak because he was without doubt avoided.

3 wins over Burley.

Archie Moore

Burt Lytell

Cocoa Kid [lost the series]

Lloyd Marshall x2

Jack Chase x4

Eddie Booker

I beg to differ sir. These are his best wins and they form a core better than most of the other boys on your list.

In Burley and Booker we have two fighters i'd be happy to set against anyone, ever at WW and MW respectively. The split series with Burley is worth more to me than Ali's series with Joe.

I'd put Marshall near the top of any H2H LHW list.

Rollo

10-09-2007, 07:18 PM

21. ODLH/43. PBF

Explain, please.........

hellblazer

10-09-2007, 07:22 PM

where's Rocky Balboa? how come he's not on your list :D

brooklyn1550

10-09-2007, 07:22 PM

Why is Joe Frazier behind Winky Wright?

MSTR

10-09-2007, 08:01 PM

Having Lennox at 75 is disgraceful.

Mayweather above Jones??? You're sick!
Exactly. The whole list is fucked. Respect for putting in the effort, I couldn't be stuffed to be honest, but I don't agree with most of it apart from the practically universally recognised picks (SRR, Armstrong ect).

halfamazin1

10-09-2007, 08:05 PM

I have seen no vids of him in a fight, nor have you, you've seen him messing around in sparring with an old Philly Jack O'Brien, that's it, and possibly the vid of him doing a bit of shadow-boxing, certainly nothing to make a judgement off of.

Look at film of his opponents, listen to written reports, and most importantly, look at his resume, which is definitely the best of all time in the history of boxing. Based on little messing around shadow-boxing and sparring vids, he's not impressive, based on beating fighters who were very impressive, and having an unbelievable resume and amount of fights, he is unbelievably impressive.

Damn...I thought I was the only one who had immortal technique at #1

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 08:20 PM

MrStayman

10-09-2007, 08:22 PM

Shouldn't Ali be better than 10th?

BewareofDawg

10-09-2007, 08:23 PM

Would you shut your stupid ass up? This agenda you have going on is completely ridiculous and makes you look like a dumb WWE loving hick, which you probably are. Now STFU and leave.
Jesus Christ Sweet Pea, what are you PMSing today? This is the second poster you've chastised for making a joke :patsch

brooklyn1550

10-09-2007, 09:23 PM

De La Hoya should be around 80-100

Action

10-09-2007, 09:26 PM

He wasn't making a joke, he makes thread after thread about how the only real fighters are Heavyweights seeing as they would beat any other, he's a fucking retard. And capfunds was not making a joke either, he turned it into one after everyone made him sound foolish, and resorted to trying to bring my name down, as he has always done before with me and the committee. They both deserved it fully.

Well wouldn't the boxers on my list beat the rest of them? That would make them the best. Would Julio Cesar Chavez beat Jack Dempsey? Would Roberto Duran beat Evander Holyfield? If you would think about it logically you would agree and not have to resort to namecalling (which exposes your lack of self control and level of IQ)

Orishaman

10-09-2007, 10:41 PM

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 10:55 PM

9-3? Wrong. I had it a draw. I can see 7-5, but 9-3? Jesus Christ.

Learn how to score you DLH boosting lunatic!

jaycuban

10-09-2007, 11:26 PM

I respect your opinion, but you are way off... Kid Chocolate 88? what... then Tyson at 77 is also ridicualos

Orishaman

10-09-2007, 11:38 PM

Now I will make mym list, but with a different approach:

HW:

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Foreman
5. Marciano
6. Tunney
7. Dempsey
8. Johnson

Cruiser:

1. Evander Holyfiled
2. Sugar De Leon
3. Dwight Quawi

LHW:

1. Bob Foster
2. Archie Moore
3. Michael Spinks
4.Billy Conn
5. Ezzard Charles

SMW:

1. Michael Nunn
2. Frank Liles

MW:

1. Carlos Monzon
2. MMH
3. Tony Zale
4. Henry Grebs
5. Mickey Walker
6. Emil Griffith

JRMW:

1. Tommy Hearns
2. Nino Benvennuti
3. Koichi Wajima

WW:

1. SRR
2. SRL
3. Pernell Whitaker
4. Basilio
5. Ross/McLarnin
6. Mantequilla Napoles
7. Kid Gavilan

JRWW:

1. Aaron Pryor
2. Tony Canzoneri
3. JCC
4. Kid Pambele
5. Nico Loche
6. Benitez

LW:

1. Duran
2. Joe Gans
3. Benny Leonard
4. Lou Ambers
5. Carlos Ortiz
6. Alexis Arguello

JRLW:

1. Sadler
2. Flash Elorde
3. Ben Villaflor
4. Kid Chocolate
5. Kobayashi
6. Samuel Serrano

FW:

1. Armstrong
2. Willie Pep
3. Eder Jofre
4. Sal Sanchez
5. John Kilbane
6. John Dundee
7. Kuniaki Shibata
8. Sugar Ramos
9. Pedroza
10. Esparragoza

JRFW:

1. Wilfredo Gomez

BW:

1. Fighting Harada
2. Jeff Chandler
3. Manuel Ortiz
4. Jimmy Carruthers
5. Ruben Olivarez
6. Sixto Escobar

JRBW:

1. Gerry Penalosa
2. Hirochi Kawashima

FLYW:

1. Jimmy Wilde
2. Pancho Villa
3. Pascual Perez
4. Miguel Canto

JRFLYW:

1. Michael Carbajal

STRW:

1. Ricardo Lopez

brooklyn1550

10-09-2007, 11:40 PM

Good call Orishaman...divisional rankings are easier to do than top 100 P4P lists. Thanks for sharing your lists as well....I will create mine tomorrow.

No Whitaker at 135? No Mayweather at 130?

Amsterdam

10-09-2007, 11:44 PM

Funny, Nunn is the best SMW when Toney KOed him, Barkley took him close and Jones outclassed Toney completely?

Liles is #2 when Mitchell KOed him? Who Calzaghe pasted in 2 rounds.

Please.

brooklyn1550

10-09-2007, 11:46 PM

I don't know about Griffith in the middleweight rankings...I would rank him highly at 147, but not 160.

Orishaman

10-09-2007, 11:47 PM

Good call Orishaman...divisional rankings are easier to do than top 100 P4P lists. Thanks for sharing your lists as well....I will create mine tomorrow.

No Whitaker at 135? No Mayweather at 130?

Well as you weel know, you have a lot of run overs from 126 to 147..so I have Pernell at 147....and just didn't fin a spot for PBF as of yet.....BTW who would you dish at 130 on my list...you see it is hard....just look at what all of them accomplished at that particular weight, and not as you climb in weight...

Now, you have the SRR, SRL , Pernell, Armstrong etc... that won multi-titles in different weight classes....and they are IMO at this point better that PBF due to their competition....

chimba

10-09-2007, 11:48 PM

Now I will make mym list, but with a different approach:

HW:

1. Ali
2. Louis
3. Holmes
4. Foreman
5. Marciano
6. Tunney
7. Dempsey
8. Johnson

Cruiser:

1. Evander Holyfiled
2. Sugar De Leon
3. Dwight Quawi

LHW:

1. Bob Foster
2. Archie Moore
3. Michael Spinks
4.Billy Conn

SMW:

1. Michael Nunn
2. Frank Liles

MW:

1. Carlos Monzon
2. MMH
3. Tony Zale
4. Henry Grebs
5. Mickey Walker
6. Emil Griffith

JRMW:

1. Tommy Hearns
2. Nino Benvennuti
3. Koichi Wajima

WW:

1. SRR
2. SRL
3. Pernell Whitaker
4. Basilio
5. Ross/McLarnin
6. Mantequilla Napoles
7. Kid Gavilan

JRWW:

1. Aaron Pryor
2. Tony Canzoneri
3. JCC
4. Kid Pambele
5. Nico Loche
6. Benitez

LW:

1. Duran
2. Joe Gans
3. Benny Leonard
4. Lou Ambers
5. Carlos Ortiz
6. Alexis Arguello

JRLW:

1. Sadler
2. Flash Elorde
3. Ben Villaflor
4. Kid Chocolate
5. Kobayashi
6. Samuel Serrano

FW:

1. Armstrong
2. Willie Pep
3. Eder Jofre
4. Sal Sanchez
5. John Kilbane
6. John Dundee
7. Kuniaki Shibata
8. Sugar Ramos
9. Pedroza
10. Esparragoza

JRFW:

1. Wilfredo Gomez

BW:

1. Fighting Harada
2. Jeff Chandler
3. Manuel Ortiz
4. Jimmy Carruthers
5. Ruben Olivarez
6. Sixto Escobar

JRBW:

1. Gerry Penalosa
2. Hirochi Kawashima

FLYW:

1. Jimmy Wilde
2. Pancho Villa
3. Pascual Perez
4. Miguel Canto

JRFLYW:

1. Michael Carbajal

STRW:

1. Ricardo Lopez

Good list, Had Pancho Villa lived past 22, hed surely be #1 at FLY.

Good call on Villaflor also again died tragically, could have been the best Filipino ever:good

brooklyn1550

10-09-2007, 11:49 PM

Well as you weel know, you have a lot of run overs from 126 to 147..so I have Pernell at 147....and just didn't fin a spot for PBF as of yet.....BTW who would you dish at 130 on my list...you see it is hard....just look at what all of them accomplished at that particular weight, and not as you climb in weight...

Now, you have the SRR, SRL , Pernell, Armstrong etc... that won multi-titles in different weight classes....and they are IMO at this point better that PBF due to their competition....

It's definitely hard work, and I give you credit for posting it...so many names and so many things to take into consideration:good

As far as 130 goes....good names on there. I would add Julio Cesar Chavez, Alexis Arguello, Floyd Mayweather, and Azumah Nelson.

I agree with Floyd being behind those you listed...he doesn't deserve a place in the top top at 154, 147, 140, or 135 in terms of accomplishments, but I definitely wouldn't pass him up at 130.

Orishaman

10-09-2007, 11:50 PM

Funny, Nunn is the best SMW when Toney KOed him, Barkley took him close and Jones outclassed Toney completely?

Liles is #2 when Mitchell KOed him? Who Calzaghe pasted in 2 rounds.

Please.

ok...once again from 154 to 168 you have alot of runovers....and the facts that you stated are correct but not at SMW....I know you know better than that...but I can see you boy is not included ..then you cry...Well spen the time and make your list and lest compare...and don;t be a blah blah fool....post your list

Nunn lost to Toney at MW not SMW...capice....Barkley fought at 160 also....Jones fought RJJ at SMW and not the Lineal Title....

Orishaman

10-09-2007, 11:56 PM

It's definitely hard work, and I give you credit for posting it...so many names and so many things to take into consideration:good

As far as 130 goes....good names on there. I would add Julio Cesar Chavez, Alexis Arguello, Floyd Mayweather, and Azumah Nelson.

I agree with Floyd being behind those you listed...he doesn't deserve a place in the top top at 154, 147, 140, or 135 in terms of accomplishments, but I definitely wouldn't pass him up at 130.

I had a tought time with JCC but I beleive that 140 by losing and regaining his title at the point of his career you have to put him at 140 IMO

brooklyn1550

10-10-2007, 12:03 AM

I had a tought time with JCC but I beleive that 140 by losing and regaining his title at the point of his career you have to put him at 140 IMO

I would put him at 140 as well...do you rank fighters in several weight classes or limit it to one?

Orishaman

10-10-2007, 12:07 AM

I would put him at 140 as well...do you rank fighters in several weight classes or limit it to one?

I limited to the one they were more effective...I guess...you know I realized talking about multiple weight classes boxer, that I left Ezzard Charles out...I had it on my floating list and I ommitted him, I should ahve him as LHW...since he was a very small HW even on his period....

TBooze

10-10-2007, 03:35 AM

I would put him at 140 as well...do you rank fighters in several weight classes or limit it to one?

These are the lists I used, it might help explain how I came to some of my decisions:

Top 10 fighters from 1891-1900

10 Pedlar Palmer
9 Jack Dempsey
8 James J Corbett
7 Peter Jackson
6 Young Griffo
5 Terry McGovern
4 James J Jeffries
3 Jack McAuliffe
2 Bob Fitzsimmons
1 George Dixon

Mentions:

Billy Plimmer, , Billy Murphy, Ben Jordan, George Lavigne, Joe Walcott, Tommy Ryan, Mysterious Billy Smith, Kid McCoy and John L Sullivan

Top 10 fighters from 1901 to 1910

10 Tommy Ryan
9 Jim Driscoll
8 James J Jeffries
7 Joe Walcott
6 Stanley Ketchel
5 Terry McGovern
4 Jack Johnson
3 Sammy Langford
2 Abe Attell
1 Joe Gans

Mentions:

Owen Moran, Jimmy Walsh, Ben Jordan, Young CorbettII, Battling Nelson, Jack Sullivan, Billy Papke, Bob Fitzsimmons, Jack O’Brien and Tommy Burns

Top 10 fighters 1911 to 1920

10 Jim Driscoll
9 Harry Wills
8 Jack Johnson
7 Benny Leonard
6 Freddie Welsh
5 Jack Britton
4 Ted Lewis
3 Georges Carpentier
2 Johnny Kilbane
1 Jimmy Wilde

Mentions:

Kid Williams, Pete Herman, Abe Attell, Ad Wolgast, Dixie Kid, Mike Gibbons, Les Darcy, Mike O’Dowd, Sammy Langford, Jack Dillon, Battling Levinsky, Sam McVey, Joe Jeanette and Jack Dempsey

Top 10 fighters 1921 to 1930

10 Sammy Mandell
9 Harry Wills
8 Jack Dempsey
7 Al Brown
6 Tommy Loughran
5 Gene Tunney
4 Pancho Villa
3 Harry Greb
2 Mickey Walker
1 Benny Leonard

Mentions:

Jimmy Wilde, Fidel la Barba, Johnny Kilbane, Johnny Dundee, Kid Kaplan, Benny Bass, Tony Canzoneri, Bat Battalino, Pinkey Mitchell, Jackie Berg, Jack Britton, Joe Dundee, Jackie Fields, Tiger Flowers, Georges Carpentier, Jack Delaney and Maxie Rosenbloom

Top 10 fighters 1931 to 1940

10 Jimmy McLarnin
9 Jackie Berg
8 Benny Lynch
7 Billy Conn
6 Tony Canzoneri
5 Mickey Walker
4 Barney Ross
3 Maxie Rosenbloom
2 Joe Louis
1 Henry Armstrong

Mentions:

Midget Wolgast, Jackie Brown, Little Dado, Al Brown, Kid Chocolate, Baby Arizmendi, Freddie Miller, Joey Archibald, Jackie Fields, Lou Ambers, Fritzie Zivic, Charley Burley, Gorilla Jones, Marcel Thil, Freddie Steele, John Henry Lewis, Max Schmeling, Max Baer and James J Braddock

Top 10 fighters 1941 to 1950

10 Jake LaMotta
9 Rinty Monaghan
8 Sandy Saddler
7 Manuel Ortiz
6 Joe Louis
5 Ezzard Charles
4 Ike Williams
3 Charley Burley
2 Willie Pep
1 Ray Robinson

Mentions:

Jackie Paterson, Vic Toweel, Sammy Angott, Beau Jack, Bob Montgomery, Tippy Larkin, Fritzie Zivic, Red Cochrane, Tommy Bell, Tony Zale, Rocky Graziano, Marcel Cerdan, Gus Lesnevich, Freddie Mills, Archie Moore and Billy Conn

Top 10 fighters 1951 to 1960

10 Floyd Patterson
9 Carmen Bassilio
8 Jimmy Curruthers
7 Kid Gavilan
6 Rocky Marciano
5 Pascual Perez
4 Joe Brown
3 Sandy Saddler
2 Archie Moore
1 Ray Robinson

Mentions:

Dado Marino, Alphonse Halimi, Willie Pep, Hogan Kid Bassey, Davey Moore, Carlos Ortiz, Don Jordan, Bobo Olson, Gene Fullmer, Joey Maxim, Harold Johnson, Jersey Joe Walcott and Ingemar Johansson

Top 10 fighters 1961 to 1970

10 Dick Tiger
9 Nicolino Loche
8 Bob Foster
7 Jose Napoles
6 Vincente Saldivar
5 Muhammad Ali
4 Nino Benvenuti
3 Carlos Ortiz
2 Eder Jofre
1 Emile Griffith

Mentions:

Pone Kingpetch, Fighting Harada, Lionel Rose, Ruben Olivares, Davey Moore, Sugar Ramos, Flash Elorde, Ismael Laguna, Duilio Loi, Benny Paret, Luis Rodriguez, Curtis Cokes, Ki-Soo Kim, Joey Giardello, Carlos Monzon, Willie Pastrano, Floyd Patterson, Sonny Liston and Joe Frazier

Top 10 fighters 1971 to 1979

10 Eder Jofre
9 Ruben Olivares
8 Alexis Arguello
7 Antonio Cervantes
6 Bob Foster
5 Jose Napoles
4 Carlos Zarate
3 Muhammad Ali
2 Carlos Monzon
1 Roberto Duran

Mentions:

Yuko Gushiken, Alfonso Zamora, Lupe Pintor, Wilfredo Gomez, Ernesto Marcel, Danny Lopez, Ken Buchanan, Esteban DeJesus, Guts Ishimatsu (Suzuki), Nicolino Loche, Wilfred Benitez, Pipino Cuevas, Carlos Palomino, Ray Leonard, Rodrigo Valdez, John Conteh, Victor Galindez, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Larry Holmes and Ken Norton

Top 10 fighters 1980 to 1989

10 Roberto Duran
9 Aaron Pryor
8 Eusebio Pedroza
7 Julio Cesar Chavez
6 Larry Holmes
5 Michael Spinks
4 Tommy Hearns
3 Mike Tyson
2 Marvin Hagler
1 Ray Leonard

Mentions:

Alexis Arguello, Hector Camacho, Lupe Pintor, Sot Chitalada, Michael Nunn, Jeff Fenech, Myung Woo Yuh, Jung Koo Chang, Mike McCallum, Evander Holyfield, Pernell Whitaker, Jeff Chandler, Khoasio Galaxy, Salvador Sanchez and Azumah Nelson

Top 10 fighters 1990 to 1999

10 Julio Cesar Chavez
9 James Toney
8 Felix Trinidad
7 Naseem Hamed
6 Terry Norris
5 Pernell Whitaker
4 Evander Holyfield
3 Ricardo Lopez
2 Roy Jones Jr
1 Oscar de la Hoya

Mentions:

Virgil Hill, Nigel Benn, Saman Sorjaturong, Kostya Tszyu, Azumah Nelson, Floyd Mayweather Jr, Marco Antonio Barrera, Bernard Hopkins, Shane Mosley, Riddick Bowe, Brian Mitchell, Dariusz Michalczewski, Kaosai Galaxy, Orlando Canizales and Lennox Lewis

TBooze

10-10-2007, 03:36 AM

Top 40 Heavies

40: Cleveland Williams
39: Zora Foley
38: Tommy Burns
37: Michael Spinks
36: James Douglas
35: James Braddock
34: George Godfrey
33: Jimmy Bivens
32: Max Baer
31: Jerry Quarry
30: Tim Whitherspoon
29: Bob Fitzsimmons
28: Jack Sharkey
27: Sam McVey
26: Joe Jeanette
25: Vitali Klitschko
24: Peter Jackson
23: Ken Norton
22: Joe Walcott (Jersey)
21: Gene Tunney
20: Riddick Bowe
19: Floyd Patterson
18: Max Schmeling
17: Ezzard Charles
16: Sammy Langford
15: Harry Wills
14: James Corbett
13: Sonny Liston
12: Joe Frazier
11: Mike Tyson
10: Lennox Lewis
9 James Jeffries
8: Jack Dempsey
7: Rocky Marciano
6: Evander Holyfield
5: Larry Holmes
4: Jack Johnson
3: George Foreman
2: Joe Louis
1: Muhammad Ali

Light Heavies

40 Dick Tiger
39 Thomas Hearns
38 Glen Johnson
37 Jose Torres
36 Fabrice Tiozzo
35 Bob Olin
34 Battling Siki
33 Marvin Johnson
32 Victor Galindez
31 Henry Maske
30 Matt Saad Muhammad (Franklin/Loach)
29 Dennis Andries
28 Antonio Tarver
27 Joey Maxim
26 Bernard Hopkins
25 Freddie Mills
24 Battling Levinsky
23 John Conteh
22 Dwight Muhammad Qawi (Braxton)
21 Billy Conn
20 Willie Pastrano
19 Jack O'Brien
18 Charles Williams
17 Harold Johnson
16 Jack Delaney
15 Virgil Hill
14 John Henry Lewis
13 Gus Lesnevich
12 Bob Fitzsimmons
11 Roy Jones
10 Dariusz Michalczewski
9 Ezzard Charles
8 Georges Carpentier
7 Bob Foster
6 Maxie Rosenbloom
5 Gene Tunney
4 Sammy Langford
3 Tommy Loughran
2 Michael Spinks
1 Archie Moore

All-time Super Middleweights:
1 Joe Calzaghe
2 Chong Pal Park
3 Roy Jones Jr
4 Nigel Benn
5 Chris Eubank
6 Steve Collins
7 Sven Ottke
8 James Toney
9 Frankie Liles
10 Byron Mitchell

Mentions: Ray Leonard, Thomas Hearns, Thulani Malinga, Charles Brewster, Richie Woodhall, Eric Lucas and Mikkel Kessler

Middleweights:

40 Paul Pender
39 Thomas Hearns
38 Rocky Graziano
37 Randy Turpin
36 Mike McCallum
35 Georges Carpentier
34 Les Darcy
33 Al McCoy
32 Fred Apostolio
31 Sambu Kalambay
30 Tiger Flowers
29 Gene Fullmer
28 Rodrigo Valdez
27 Dick Tiger
26 Bob Fitzsimmons
25 James Toney
24 Michael Nunn
23 Jack 'Twin' Sullivan
22 Mike O'Dowd
21 Jake LaMotta
20 Freddie Steele
19 Marcel Thil
18 Gorilla Jones
17 Sammy Langford
16 Emile Griffith
15 Joey Giardello
14 Kid McCoy
13 Nino Benvenuti
12 Tony Zale
11 Marcel Cerdan
10 Roy Jones
9 Jack Dempsey
8 Harry Greb
7 Marvin Hagler
6 Bernard Hopkins
5 Mickey Walker
4 Charley Burley
3 Stanley Ketchel
2 Ray Robinson
1 Carlos Monzon

Mentions:
Young CorbettIII
'Bobo' Olson
Carmen Basilio
Terry Downes
Vito Antuofermo
Alan Minter
Iran Barkley
Julian Jackson
Gerald McClellan
Reggie Johnson
Felix Trinidad

Junior Middleweights

10 Sandro Mazzinghi
9 Gianfranco Rosi
8 Wilfred Benitez
7 Ray Leonard
6 Emile Griffith
5 Terry Norris
4 Felix Trinidad
3 Winky Wright
2 Mike McCallum
1 Tommy Hearns

Mentions: Denny Moyer, Nino Benvenuti, Ki Soo Kim, Koichi Wajima, Ayub Kalule, Maurice Hope, Roberto Duran, Julian Jackson, John David Jackson, Julio Cesar Vazquez, Harry Simon, Oscar de la Hoya and Shane Mosley

Top 10 welters

1 Ray Robinson
2 Ray Leonard
3 Kid Gavilan
4 Emile Griffith
5 Henry Armstrong
6 Jose Napoles
7 Felix Trinidad
8 Oscar De La Hoya
9 Thomas Hearns
10 Carmen Bassillo

Mentions to: Tommy Ryan, 'Mysterious' Billy Smith, 'The original' Joe Walcott, Mike Sullivan, Jack Britton, Ted 'Kid' Lewis, Mickey Walker, Jackie Fields, Barney Ross, Jim McLarnin, Fritzie Zivic, Red Cochrane, Benny 'Kid' Paret, Luis Rodriguez, Carlos Palomino, Pipino Cuevas, Roberto Duran, Don Curry, Marlon Starling, Pernell Whitaker and Shane Mosley

Junior Welterweights:

10 Floyd Mayweather Jr
9 Ricky Hatton
8 Oscar de la Hoya
7 Meldrick Taylor
6 Julio Cesar Chavez
5 Nicolino Loche
4 Kostya Tszyu
3 Aaron Pryor
2 Wilfred Benitez
1 Antonio Cervantes

Mentions: Pinkey Mitchell, Jackie Berg, Mushy Callahan, Tony Canzoneri, Barney Ross, Carlos Ortiz, Duilio Loi, Saoul Mamby, Patrizio Oliva, Roger Mayweather, Buddy McGirt, Pernell Whitaker, Frankie Randall, Juan Martin Coggi, Vince Phillips, Zab Zab Judah and Sharmba Mitchell

TBooze

10-10-2007, 03:37 AM

Lightweight

10 Sammy Angott
9 Julio Cesar Chavez
8 Bob Montgomery
7 Ike Williams
6 Battling Nelson
5 Joe Gans
4 Pernell Whitaker
3 Henry Armstrong
2 Benny Leonard
1 Roberto Duran

Mentions: Jack McAuliffe, George Lavigne, Frank Erne, Tony Canzoneri, Barney Ross, Lou Ambers, Beau Jack, Jimmy Carter, Carlos Ortiz, Ken Buchanan, Esteban DeJesus, Guts Ishimatsu (Ishimatsu Suzuki), Alexis Arguello, Edwin Rosario, Jose Luis Ramirez, Hector Camacho Snr, Oscar de la Hoya, Shane Mosley, Steve Johnson, Jose Luis Castillo and Floyd Mayweather Jr

Junior Lightweights:

10 Manny Paciquao
9 Johnny Dundee
8 Floyd Mayweather Jr
7 Brian Mitchell
6 Sandy Saddler
5 Kid Chocolate
4 Azumah Nelson
3 Alexis Arguello
2 Flash Elorde
1 Julio Cesar Chavez

Mentions: Alfredo Escalera, Sammy Serrano, Bazooka Limon, Cornelius Boza-Edwards, Bobby Chacon, Roger Mayweather, Hector Camacho, Rocky Lockbridge, Tony Lopez, John John Molina, Genaro Hernandez, Oscar de la Hoya, Gabby Ruelas, Arturo Gatti, Acelino Freitas, Diego Corrales, Marco Antonio Barrera, Erik Morales and Manny Paciquao

Top 10 feathers

The Featherweights are an incredibly talented group of fighters; my all-time list goes:

10: Salvador Sanchez
9: Joey Archibald
8: Azumah Nelson
7: Johnny Kilbane
6: George Dixon
5: Henry Armstrong
4; Eusebio Pedroza
3: Abe Attell
2: Willie Pep
1: Sandy Saddler

Honorary mentions: Young Griffo, Terry McGovern, Jim Driscoll, Bat Battalino, Hogan 'Kid' Bassey, Davey Moore, Sugar Ramos, Vicente Saldivar, Eder Jofre, Antonio Esparragoza, Naseem Hamed and Marco Antonio Barrera

Mentions: Ben Jordan, Young Corbett II, Johnny Dundee, Kid Kaplan, Tony Canzoneri, Kid Chocolate, Baby Arizmendi, Chalky Wright, Howard Winstone, Alexis Arguello, Danny Lopez, Juan LaPorte, Jeff Fenech, Marcos Villasana, Tom Johnson, Kevin Kelley, Eloy Rojas, Manuel Medina, Wilfred Vazquez, Erik Morales, and Manny Pacquiao.

Super Bantamweights

10 Kennedy McKinney
9 Seung Hoon Lee
8 Manny Paciquao
7 Junior Jones
6 Vuyani Bungu
5 Marco Antonio Barrera
4 Erik Morales
3 Jeff Fenech
2 Daniel Zaragoza
1 Wilfredo Gomez

Mentions: Welcome Ncita, Paul Banke, Wilfredo Vazquez, Raul Perez, Tracy Harris Patterson, Antonio Cermeno, Lehlohonolo Ledwaba, Bones Adams, Oscar Larios and Israel Vazquez

Bantamweights

10 Kaosai Galaxy
9 Lupe Pintor
8 Jeff Chandler
7 Al Brown
6 Jimmy Carruthers
5 Ruben Olivares
4 Manuel Ortiz
3 Eder Jofre
2 Terry McGovern
1 Carlos Zarate

Mentions: George Dixon, Billy Plimmer, Pedlar Palmer, Jimmy Walsh, Kid Williams, Pete Herman, Sixto Escobar, Vic Toweel, Alphonse Halimi, Lionel Rose, Alfonso Zamora, Jeff Fenech, Gilberto Roman, Miguel Happy Lora, Orlando Canizales, Raul Perez, Sung Il Moon and Rafael Marquez

Flyweight

10 Fidel La Barba
9 Midget Wolgast
8 Little Dado
7 Myung Woo Yuh
6 Jung Koo Chang
5 Pascual Perez
4 Rinty Monaghan
3 Ricardo Lopez
2 Pancho Villa
1 Jimmy Wilde

Mentions: Jackie Brown, Benny Lynch, Small Montana, Jackie Paterson, Pone Kingpetch, Fighting Harada, Miguel Canto, Santos Laciar, Hilario Zapata, Sot Chitalada, Humberto Gonzales, Michael Carbajal, Saman Sorjaturong and Yuri Arbachakov