Marco Huck: What is your opinion of him?

[geppy]

How do you rate Marco Huck?

From what I seen , Huck looked extremely impressive. Huck has alot of natural talent, he is tall, athletic, skilled. Huck has fought and defeated very good fighters at only 22 years old, and 19 fights. I think he will beat either Cunnigham or Adamek.

[limi_7]

I have to agree with u. At his age, he is very talented, and you have to axpect more of him as he hits his prime around 25-38 ahahh quite a range but thats actually quite true in boxing.

[Axe]

I have to agree with u. At his age, he is very talented, and you have to axpect more of him as he hits his prime around 25-38 ahahh quite a range but thats actually quite true in boxing.

25-33 is more like it for Cruiserweight.

22-29 if youre talking under 135 lbs...imo.

[rrezike]

How do you rate Marco Huck?

From what I seen , Huck looked extremely impressive. Huck has alot of natural talent, he is tall, athletic, skilled. Huck has fought and defeated very good fighters at only 22 years old, and 19 fights. I think he will beat either Cunnigham or Adamek.

Good boxer talented he needs to be more tactical and more boxer as you know he has previously been a kick boxer. I think in 2 or 3 years he will go in the heavys

[sean]

he is as thick as shit, but he is a good boxer , very good workrate/stamina/power/size/strength for a cruiserweight and obviously comes with bad intentions in every fight i have seen of him.

big men with that kind of workrate can always beat more talented boxers on sheer willpower and effort, which makes huck a hard man to beat.

[geppy]

he is as thick as shit, but he is a good boxer , very good workrate/stamina/power/size/strength for a cruiserweight and obviously comes with bad intentions in every fight i have seen of him.

big men with that kind of workrate can always beat more talented boxers on sheer willpower and effort, which makes huck a hard man to beat.

Chin as well, Huck took some good shots from Tokarev and was unfazed. He came right back and hurt Tokarev. Huck will be difficult for any cruiserweight to beat .

[Alcaldemb]

Strong, fast, hard hitting, skilled, tall and young. This man has a bright future especially given that his prime is a good six years off and he is still making the transition from kickboxer to boxer.

[geppy]

I think Huck can box nice on the outside, he is very quick ,and has a nice jab. He does have the same trainer and management as Ottke did.

Does he want to though? No, he comes to fight.

[llorca]

Huck is a decent fighter but I wouldn't rank him in the top 5 quite yet. He might pack a punch but he's not explosive enough with it (4 stoppages in his last 10 fights against average opponents indicates too much caution), and too robotic in his movement. Good stamina, but never really been tested yet (hand-picked opponents).

Fighters like Bell, Haye & Maccarinelli are definitely a step too far at the moment.

[Odo]

Huck is a decent fighter but I wouldn't rank him in the top 5 quite yet. He might pack a punch but he's not explosive enough with it (4 stoppages in his last 10 fights against average opponents indicates too much caution), and too robotic in his movement. Good stamina, but never really been tested yet (hand-picked opponents).

Fighters like Bell, Haye & Maccarinelli are definitely a step too far at the moment.

Never really been tested? Hm! I for my part would call Tokarev a very good test as he is one of the best fighters at cruiserweight at present.Huck passed that test quite successfully.
Maccarinelli is defeinitely a step too far at the moment! Hm! I quite disagree with you again.
Macarinelli would lose to Tokarev.The Brit's best skalp is the old Argie vet Dominguez.Huck has already faced much better opposition than Macarinelli.
Furthermore I cant really imagine that Lee Swaby would be able to knock out Huck as he did Macarinelli.
I watched one of Swaby's last fights live-against Alexeev who totally dominated his outclassed and outgunned opponent stopping him in round 5 if I remember correctly.

Anyway! Huck is Cunningham's mandatory.The American is no match for Huck IMO.Cunningham didnt look that convincing against Wlodarczyk who was one of the weakest champs out there anyway.Both Huck and Tokarev would beat both Cunningham and Wlodarcyzk,and ........Macarinelli.

[llorca]

Tokarev is an average plodder (35, on the slide), nowhere near one of the best cruiserweights around! Another overrated Russian fighter. Maccarinelli's loss to Swaby - 7 years ago FYI in his fourth fight - was a one-off, I doubt Tokarev would get close enough to even lay a glove on him. That said, we'll see how good Maccarinelli is next month against Braithwaite.

Will be interesting to see Huck up against someone who can really bang rather than his paperweight opponents so far - Haye would have him for breakfast, you can be assured of that.

Huck for me is just another overhyped German-based robot that will be protected for years to come by Sauerland.

[giggigreto]

Yeah, huck is too clumsy to win outside of germany, he will be kept protected there for as long as they can, possibly ever

[geppy]

Huck is a decent fighter but I wouldn't rank him in the top 5 quite yet. He might pack a punch but he's not explosive enough with it (4 stoppages in his last 10 fights against average opponents indicates too much caution), and too robotic in his movement. Good stamina, but never really been tested yet (hand-picked opponents).

Fighters like Bell, Haye & Maccarinelli are definitely a step too far at the moment.

Get out of here this nonsense, Maccarinelli!! The guy has fought powder puffs.

Bell is good but not that great , he got his butt kicked by Dale Brown but was given a terrible decision.Teddy Atlas straight up told Bell he didnt win the fight. Bell was on the verge of losing to Rothman , but pulled out an 11rd Ko. Two fighter that are no were near as good as Huck. Bell is a good fighter but very beatable.

Haye has fought good opposition , but has not beat anyone as good as Tokarev. Haye was knocked out by one as well, and was rocked bad by another. He beat a shitty polish Hw Bonin that Audley Harrison beat,that dont make him great. I seen Bonin's previous fight he was knocked down by a scrub with no fights in the first round. It looked like an amatuer fight.

[geppy]

Yeah, huck is too clumsy to win outside of germany, he will be kept protected there for as long as they can, possibly ever

Protected, how ? Huck is fighting for the IBF World Title in his 20th fight at only 22 years old, you f#cking nitwit. What do you expect?

Huck fought 40-4-3 Rudiger May is his 11th fight.

[Rick G]

He simply is totally dedicated to boxing. Training hard. His natural aggressiveness is enough for two boxers. He sees the other sportsman as his personal enemy.

He is so young he can afford a loss to a good fighter - very likely by DQ if he does not loose his bad manners in the ring.

[Odo]

Tokarev is an average plodder (35, on the slide), nowhere near one of the best cruiserweights around! Another overrated Russian fighter. Maccarinelli's loss to Swaby - 7 years ago FYI in his fourth fight - was a one-off, I doubt Tokarev would get close enough to even lay a glove on him. That said, we'll see how good Maccarinelli is next month against Braithwaite.

Will be interesting to see Huck up against someone who can really bang rather than his paperweight opponents so far - Haye would have him for breakfast, you can be assured of that.

Huck for me is just another overhyped German-based robot that will be protected for years to come by Sauerland.

Tokarev an average plodder,eh! Nowhere near one of the best cruiserweights around,eh!
Maccarinelli is head and shoulder above Tokarev,eh! Tokarev another(?) overrated Russian fighter,eh?
Haha! You are a jester,llorca!

Maccarinelli just had an off night against Swaby,eh!
Tokarev didnt have an off night against such a limited and harmless opponent,and he has faced much better opposition than Macarinelli so far.
Tokarev would probably stop your hero within the distance.
Huck! Haye would have him for breakfast,eh!Haye is a very good figher,and I have no clue what would be the outcome of a fight between Huck and Haye.Anyway! Huck and Haye play in the same division.Haye and Huck have something in common:both fought Abdoul,and both had to go the full route against that gatekeeper,but unlike Haye Huck is still undefeated.

Huck for you is just another overhyped German robot that will be protected for years to come,eh!
This last statement shows your obvious lack of knowledge,mate!
Huck is Cunningham's mandatory.Of course someone who fights Cunningham and Tokarev must be protected,eh!

Haha! Neither Tokarev nor Cunningham would be a match for the great Bobby Gunn,Macarinelli's last opponent.We all know that Gunn belongs among the top 5 of his weight division.
Haha!
You are a clueless jester,llorca!

[llorca]

It's a shame you have to resort to insults Odo to defend your heroes. FYI I have followed boxing for many years, I also box so think I know enough about boxing to comment and not be regarded as a "clueless jester", lol. Have watched all of Huck's fights so far and can honestly say that he doesn't impress me. It's an opinion, get over it and your love for Captain Marco and Tokarev mate, it's embarrassing.

We'll see how good Huck is when he gets to fight someone decent with half a punch (you can't be serious about Tokarev, unless his display against Huck was a bad day at the office? I saw nothing there to worry anyone in the top 10) - I don't count Cunningham in that league TBH. What he does have on his side is age - I hope he improves in the next 2-3 years, otherwise he'll be treading the same path as a good many German-based fighters.

Haye for me is the man at cruiser, Macca is just a poor man's version (sorry to burst your bubble about my apparent obsession with him).

[Odo]

It's a shame you have to resort to insults Odo to defend your heroes. FYI I have followed boxing for many years, I also box so think I know enough about boxing to comment and not be regarded as a "clueless jester", lol. Have watched all of Huck's fights so far and can honestly say that he doesn't impress me. It's an opinion, get over it and your love for Captain Marco and Tokarev mate, it's embarrassing.

We'll see how good Huck is when he gets to fight someone decent with half a punch (you can't be serious about Tokarev, unless his display against Huck was a bad day at the office? I saw nothing there to worry anyone in the top 10) - I don't count Cunningham in that league TBH. What he does have on his side is age - I hope he improves in the next 2-3 years, otherwise he'll be treading the same path as a good many German-based fighters.

Haye for me is the man at cruiser, Macca is just a poor man's version (sorry to burst your bubble about my apparent obsession with him).

Well,Ilorca,your previous post was so funny that I couldnt hold back and call you what you seem to be when you wrote sentences like:

"Huck has never been really tested"
"Tokaev another overrated Russian fighter"
"We will see how good Huck is when he faces someone who can really bang"
"Fighters like Macarinelli are definitely are a step too far for Huck"
"Haye would have him for breakfast"
"Huck another overhyped robot who will be protected for years to come by Sauerland"
"Tokarev an average plodder"

Go and buy a tape of Tokarev vs Cora,or Tokarev vs Arslan,llorca!
As for Macarinelli in terms of defeated quality opposition he cant hold a candle to Huck.What's more Huch hasnt had an off night against a harmless journeyman like Swaby.
I watched Alexeev vs Swaby live.Alexeev beat up that British journeyman quite badly dominating every second of his encounter with him.
I can imagine a lot,but I really cant see Huck losing against such a limited fighter like Swaby.
Haye is a good fighter,and I am not sure whether I would put my money on him or on Huck if they even met inside a box ring.However,Haye wouldnt eat Huck for breakfast as you put it so nicely.Both Haye and Huck fought Abdoul,and both Huck and Haye had to go the full route with that teak tough Arab gatekeeper from Belgium.
Huck can hold his own against any present rival IMO.He may lose against Haye,but he for sure is no breakfast for the hungry Brit.
Huck will be protected for years to come,eh! Truly laughable statement,isnt it,llorca? Huck has already fought and defeated quite decent opposition in his rather short pro career.In his last fight he convincingly beat an opponent who was among the top fighters of his weight division in all leading box mags and ratings of the best box websites.Huck is Cunningham's mandatory.Nevertheless you call him a protected fighter.

[llorca]

You seem to dwell on the past, Odo - your unhealthy obsession with Macca's fight against Swaby is truly incredible.

WTF has Alekseev's fight with Swaby got to do with it?! The Macca-Swaby fight was SEVEN years ago, early on in his career, I'm sure you'll agree that any fighter can have an off-day and get caught by a lucky punch... The fact of the matter is: Macca is WBO champion, whilst Huck is still a young pretender holding the lightly regarded EBU-EU strap - and will be until he's a world belt holder.

I think you might need to reassess your devotion to Captain Huck when he gets tested - which is a big "if" ((Sauerland are far too sensible to put him in with anyone that might damage his unbeaten record). An ageing Tokarev didn't exactly give him a proper test IMO, but whatever.

I'd be interested to see Huck in with someone who can really punch (let's be honest, Cunningham is more a slickster than puncher), as he hasn't been tested properly yet. Does he have a decent beard? The jury's out I'm afraid... until he gets flattened by a hayemaker :D

[llorca]

Double post!

[Alcaldemb]

llorca I am not sure why you are so down on Huck. Yes he dominated Tokarev, but not because Vadim is bad but because he is a legit talent. Huck keeps his defense tight, is very strong, and has a sometimes wild but very good defense. Haye has many physical tools but has a very open defense and has yet to face the same level of opposition as Huck. His last fights, versus neither Johannson, or the feather fisted Fragomeni, are on the same level as Tokarev. The amount of trouble Haye had with Fragomeni before he stopped him does not inspire confidence, especially since Frago lacks any power. If Huck had been consistently landing on Haye it would have been a different story.

[giggigreto]

It's not that difficult to cover up like Huck does, that's not 'great defence', it's simply the anti-boxe they teach boxers in germany, like Beyer, or even Abraham.
If you defend like that you get stiff and static; Haye prefers to move at the waist, or use footwork to avoid shots.
Arms loose and not strictly guarding the head makes for a better attack and body movement.
It would be not that difficult for Haye to just stand with his arms glued on his head, but it's just that he likes a more dynamic stance. Thank God.

Huck is clumsy with his shots, he is predictable, and he just covers up. And he fights smaller men like 5'10'' Tokarev or washed-up people like Rudiger May, who got KOed by featherfisted Jhonny Nelson, and couldn't win against a journeyman like Rossitto who got starched in 2 rounds by Haye and Gurov
.
Huck looks to me completely ordinary, and would get slaughtered by Maccarinelli or Haye. Hell, even Gurov would make a number on him.

I really can't imagine what can be said to hype a stiff like Huck, he is just a strong fella, but very limited boxing-wise...I don't even think he has some amateur experience, looking at his showings, how poor they are.
I am very surprised by a lot of knowleadgeble posters who think Huck is the next coming of a cruiserweight Jesus!!
Sure german TV has great spin doctors, to make you swallow all this hype!!

[unitas]

It's not that difficult to cover up like Huck does, that's not 'great defence', it's simply the anti-boxe they teach boxers in germany, like Beyer, or even Abraham.
If you defend like that you get stiff and static; Haye prefers to move at the waist, or use footwork to avoid shots.
Arms loose and not strictly guarding the head makes for a better attack and body movement.
It would be not that difficult for Haye to just stand with his arms glued on his head, but it's just that he likes a more dynamic stance. Thank God.

Huck is clumsy with his shots, he is predictable, and he just covers up. And he fights smaller men like 5'10'' Tokarev or washed-up people like Rudiger May, who got KOed by featherfisted Jhonny Nelson, and couldn't win against a journeyman like Rossitto who got starched in 2 rounds by Haye and Gurov
.
Huck looks to me completely ordinary, and would get slaughtered by Maccarinelli or Haye. Hell, even Gurov would make a number on him.

I really can't imagine what can be said to hype a stiff like Huck, he is just a strong fella, but very limited boxing-wise...I don't even think he has some amateur experience, looking at his showings, how poor they are.
I am very surprised by a lot of knowleadgeble posters who think Huck is the next coming of a cruiserweight Jesus!!
Sure german TV has great spin doctors, to make you swallow all this hype!!

faggarinelli dont last two rounds with him:hi:

[Luigi1985]

faggarinelli dont last two rounds with him:hi:


Fragomeni would/ could IMO outpoint Huck, giggigreto is right in his good post, Huck is totally hyped up...

[giggigreto]

thank you for support luigi!, but he probably was referring to maccarinelli..
i don't think fragomeni can win against huck because he is pushing his forties, and is only 5'9''! i don't think he can impose his pressure against the bigger, harder-hitting man..
But macca is even bigger than huck and surely can bang, i don't think huck has too much of a chance when his advanteges are nullified, even if macca isn't a great technical fighter either :)

[Luigi1985]

thank you for support luigi!, but he probably was referring to maccarinelli..
i don't think fragomeni can win against huck because he is pushing his forties, and is only 5'9''! i don't think he can impose his pressure against the bigger, harder-hitting man..
But macca is even bigger than huck and surely can bang, i don't think huck has too much of a chance when his advanteges are nullified, even if macca isn't a great technical fighter either :)


Well, I meant the Fragomeni from the Haye-fight. Against David it were these deadly body shots why "Gabibbo" quit (Oliva). Huck would only try to knock him out, but against Fragomeni these head shots wouldn´t work IMO. Maccarinelli, who I rate as a harder puncher, would be more difficult of course...

[geppy]

Well, I meant the Fragomeni from the Haye-fight. Against David it were these deadly body shots why "Gabibbo" quit (Oliva). Huck would only try to knock him out, but against Fragomeni these head shots wouldn´t work IMO. Maccarinelli, who I rate as a harder puncher, would be more difficult of course...

You two Italians are very bitter. I can remember how pissed off you were at the Huck vs Aurino fight. Huck kicked the idiot , he left the ring and was Dq'd. To bad the thread was deleted , you just dont like Huck do you?

I see how it goes. Enzo Maccernelli is Italian hertiage, so he most be really good and fought tough opposition. David Haye beat the Italian Fragomeni in a tough close fight, so Haye is super. Huck kicked Aurino, so he is an asshole and you dont like him.

[Luigi1985]

You two Italians are very bitter. I can remember how pissed off you were at the Huck vs Aurino fight. Huck kicked the idiot , he left the ring and was Dq'd. To bad the thread was deleted , you just dont like Huck do you?

I see how it goes. Enzo Maccernelli is Italian hertiage, so he most be really good and fought tough opposition. David Haye beat the Italian Fragomeni in a tough close fight, so Haye is super. Huck kicked Aurino, so he is an asshole and you dont like him.


My god are you childish! Boxing is not a teamsport that I help to the Italian fighters. Haye hit Fragomeni with everything he had, but Giacobbe was never hurt. The bodyshots wear him down, and I never saw that Huck is such a technique wizard that he could hurt Fragomeni with such shots. IMO Maccarinelli, a 6´4 CW with more power, would be a worse matchup, won´t you agree?

[geppy]

My god are you childish! Boxing is not a teamsport that I help to the Italian fighters. Haye hit Fragomeni with everything he had, but Giacobbe was never hurt. The bodyshots wear him down, and I never saw that Huck is such a technique wizard that he could hurt Fragomeni with such shots. IMO Maccarinelli, a 6´4 CW with more power, would be a worse matchup, won´t you agree?

Of course I see how you think. The Italian Maccerinelli is an amzaing fighter, who has fought tough oppositon, but Huck is protected. Haye had excellent technique against the incredible great Fragomeni, so Huck could not stand a chance.

I know you hate Huck . I recall the shit you talked during the Aurino vs Huck fight thread. Your judgement is totally biased.

[Luigi1985]

Of course I see how you think. The Italian Maccerinelli is an amzaing fighter, who has fought tough oppositon, but Huck is protected. Haye had excellent technique against the incredible great Fragomeni, so Huck could not stand a chance.

I know you hate Huck . I recall the shit you talked during the Aurino vs Huck fight thread. Your judgement is totally biased.


You can put your irony and sarcasm into the part of your body who´s normally reserved for your boyfriend, don´t get on my nerves, boy. Maccarinelli and Huck are both 2 good CW´s who didn´t fight real good CW´s that we can really judge them, IMO Maccarinelli is the bigger hitter, that´s what I wrote, are I than automatically biased? Perhaps you confound me with someone other, I only wrote one or two posts in the Huck- Aurino thread I think (that this is typical for Germany, 2 fighters were dirty, Huck, who started it and kicked Aurino got nothing and Pietro got 2 points deducted, that were normal arguments who even 99 % of my German fellows agree with me)...

[Alcaldemb]

I think it is fair to rate Macca ahead of Huck, but not Haye. Haye simply hasn't fought as good competition, has shown serious *****s in his armor, and his defense is just too open. One has to figure that Huck, being a tall fast fighter who is quite strong and packs quite a punch, would be able to land pretty frequently on Haye due to his open guard.

Sorry but if Fragomeni could land consistently and make it a tough fight then you have to favor Huck over Haye.

[Pamuk41]

First of all Tokarev has convinced me in all fights i have seen him being in i.e.: vs. Arslan, Cora jr., Huck of being a dangerous and inspired fighter witch quite a good chin but some stamina problems.

According the Huck vs. Haye/Maccarinelli comparisons:

Maccarinelli is a limited boxer to me though with very good power in his right hand. I don`t think he could take on a concentrated Huck because of his effective turtle defense (may it be pretty or not) plus Huck has some firepower himself amd Macca is notz a defensive genius.

Haye could starch anyone at cruiser even a solid chin like Huck. But the longer the figt goes the more i would lean towards Huck.

Pamuk

[geppy]

Huck has done something neither Maccarinelli or Haye has ever done. Huck defeated a legit top 10 World rated Cruiserweight , Tokarev. I beleive Tokarev was Ring magazine top 5 before Huck beat him, now ranked #9 by Ring.

Sorry, I dont think Marcelo Dominguez or Bobby Gunn are top 10 rated World Class fighters. Haye has beaten decent fringe contenders Glenn Kelly and Alexander Gurov, who fight class fighters but are usually dominated.Haye has beat undefeated prospects as Lasse Johansen , and Fragomeni but niether was proven fighters. Haye has good wins but never against a top 10 fighter yet .

[Odo]

Huck has done something neither Maccarinelli or Haye has ever done. Huck defeated a legit top 10 World rated Cruiserweight , Tokarev. I beleive Tokarev was Ring magazine top 5 before Huck beat him, now ranked #9 by Ring.

Sorry, I dont think Marcelo Dominguez or Bobby Gunn are top 10 rated World Class fighters. Haye has beaten decent fringe contenders Glenn Kelly and Alexander Gurov, who fight class fighters but are usually dominated.Haye has beat undefeated prospects as Lasse Johansen , and Fragomeni but niether was proven fighters. Haye has good wins but never against a top 10 fighter yet .

I quite agree with you,geppy!
Tokarev is a top 10 fighter.To tell the truth I for my part thought that Huck would lose against Tokarev.I thought that Tokarev would have had the upper hand in firepower and experience being able to stop his green and relatively inexperienced foe.Huck proved me wrong.He is for real,and can take on any of his better ranked rivals.Both Macca and Haye have a chance to beat the young talent,but Huck wouldnt be the underdog against neither fighter IMO.

[giggigreto]

Please stop it, open your eyes guys!! Don't buy in the germanTV hype!!!

[Rick G]

News: According to boxen.com in his fight against Tokarev Huck suffered a broken right hand in the 5th round. Directly after the fight the hand was put into plaster, a week later he underwent surgery, and currently he has to wear a splint.
So Huck dominated Tokarev mainly with his left!
I broke my right hand, too. I can tell you it causes real pain.

[Luigi1985]

News: According to boxen.com in his fight against Tokarev Huck suffered a broken right hand in the 5th round. Directly after the fight the hand was put into plaster, a week later he underwent surgery, and currently he has to wear a splint.
So Huck dominated Tokarev mainly with his left!
I broke my right hand, too. I can tell you it causes real pain.


That´s just propaganda to hype up Huck, that´s no surprise when you look from where this information came...

[Luigi1985]

And your posting is just "blabala" without anything behind it ;)


What a suprise that some German fellas don´t agree when I write something negative about the "German" Muamer Hukic, aka Marco Huck...


I´m just honest, Huck made some great progress, but he´s far away from that what some here thinks now...

[Luigi1985]

I like Marco Huck, he´s very young and one of the top prospects of the CW division. He didn´t go the usually route, fight 30 journeymen to padd his record or so, he fought very quick some decent names, but now, some here overact with him, he isn´t (right now) the world beater some try to make him now, Tokarev is a solid CW, but I said always he fought almost nobody and that he has a very questionable stamina. The elite is, Mormeck, Bell, Haye, Maccarinelli, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, Arslan, Brudov and some others, Huck, Banks, Godfrey, etc. are the top prospects...

[Odo]

Please stop it, open your eyes guys!! Don't buy in the germanTV hype!!!

German tv hype?? What the hell are you talking about,mate! I for my part dont care a fig for German tv and its commentators.
Huck deserves respect for his impressive victory over top ten figher Tokarev.Who the heck gives a damn whether german tv praises him as well or not?
Tokarev is a legit top 10 world ranked cruiser weight,and Huck showed a great performance against him.
Props to Huck! He deserves respect for his last outing to a box ring.He isnt the most likeable human being out there.Thats for sure! And neither does he seem to be one of the most intelligent human beings.However,he has defeated a legit top 10 fighter+beaten some decent opponents in his short pro career.

[Odo]

I like Marco Huck, he´s very young and one of the top prospects of the CW division. He didn´t go the usually route, fight 30 journeymen to padd his record or so, he fought very quick some decent names, but now, some here overact with him, he isn´t (right now) the world beater some try to make him now, Tokarev is a solid CW, but I said always he fought almost nobody and that he has a very questionable stamina. The elite is, Mormeck, Bell, Haye, Maccarinelli, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, Arslan, Brudov and some others, Huck, Banks, Godfrey, etc. are the top prospects...

Give me a break,luigi!
You call Wlodarczyk,Cunningham,Arslan,Brudov,and Macarinelli the "flor y la nata "of the cruiser weight division,but Vadim Tokarev is merely a solid cruiser weight in your opinion.
As you may know Tokarev fought your top gun Firat Arslan in Arslan's backyard a few years ago.The outcome of that fight was a draw.
Brudov an elite fighter?? He lost almost every round against the old geezer Virgil Hill.
Wlodarczyk? He was one of the weakest champs within the last few years,and his conqueror Cunningham isnt that much better either.
Macarinelli? His resume is full of names like Bobby Gunn.
Tokarev has beaten quite a few good names like Simms,Ismailov,or the highly regarded American Cora.
I would also put my money on Tokarev in a fight against Wlodarczyk,Cunningham,Brudov,or Macarinelli.
I didnt think that Huck would be able to go the full distance with Tokarev.He did,and proved me wrong.On top of that he beat Tokarev quite convincingly.

[geppy]

Tokarev is a solid CW, but I said always he fought almost nobody and that he has a very questionable stamina. The elite is, Mormeck, Bell, Haye, Maccarinelli, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, "Arslan", Brudov and some others, Huck, Banks, Godfrey, etc. are the top prospects...

You post some ignorant stuff Luigi, check your facts.

Arslan is a top notch CW, but Tokarev hasnt fought anyone, Ha, ha. You dont realize they had a draw!

Again Who did Haye or Maccernelli ever beat to be considered "elite"? Enzo was handed a belt when Johnny Nelson retired and hasnt fought anyone yet. Enzo beat Dominguez for the vacant belt, I have never seen an easier title fight, then he fought Bobby Gunn!!

[geppy]

Brudov an elite fighter?? He lost almost every round against the old geezer Virgil Hill.
Wlodarczyk? He was one of the weakest champs within the last few years,and his conqueror Cunningham isnt that much better either.
Macarinelli? His resume is full of names like Bobby Gunn.

Indeed.

[giggigreto]

German tv hype?? What the hell are you talking about,mate! I for my part dont care a fig for German tv and its commentators.
Huck deserves respect for his impressive victory over top ten figher Tokarev.Who the heck gives a damn whether german tv praises him as well or not?
Tokarev is a legit top 10 world ranked cruiser weight,and Huck showed a great performance against him.
Props to Huck! He deserves respect for his last outing to a box ring.He isnt the most likeable human being out there.Thats for sure! And neither does he seem to be one of the most intelligent human beings.However,he has defeated a legit top 10 fighter+beaten some decent opponents in his short pro career.

the fight is on youtube, [Only registered and activated users can see links] and all i see is a slow plodding Tokarev that can't beat a guy in Huck who just covers up and throws 1-2s and 1-1-2s all the time, sometimes leading with his head too. No sign of "top 10 Cruiserweights" there.
I didn't see Tokarev before, but this was a very underpar performance...what can i say?

I still think it was clubfighter boxing.

Haye is on a whole other level: 'he is open, not a good defense';
he just doesn't cover up like Huck. If you cover up like that you are going to shoot out predictable combinations. In germany, that seems to not matter, because you can still score a win against overmatched opponents and the fans incredibly do not get bored by those dull performances.

Oh, and Aurino is one of the best technical fighters in Europe. It just happens that he doesn't train, and he is a bit insane. Now it appears that he is involved in some drug traffic affair, and if the allegations will prove to be true, his boxing career would be over. Huck looked amateurish against him, and it's a shame that the best boxer is threated like an opponent, because the other guy is an hype machine. :deal

I hope he won't be protected for too long, against 'top10 cruiserweights' like this Tokarev:rofl:rofl.. Bring the pain!!!
I want a Haye, a Maccarinelli or a O'neill Bell to land some leather on this *S*uck, and let's really see what he is made of!!! But his promoter will never allow fights Suck is certainly gonna lose:bart:bart

[geppy]

I hope he won't be protected for too long, against 'top10 cruiserweights' like this Tokarev:rofl:rofl.. Bring the pain!!!
I want a Haye, a Maccarinelli or a O'neill Bell to land some leather on this *S*uck, and let's really see what he is made of!!! But his promoter will never allow fights Suck is certainly gonna lose:bart:bart

Huck is fighting for the IBF Cruiserweight title , you idiot. How many times do people have to keep telling you? You have this notion that , Huck is going to avoid real fights. No, he is fighting for a World Title in only his 20th fight! Do I have to tell you again? Huck will be fighting for a world title shortly. What do you expect ?

[giggigreto]

being a fan of such a trash boxer like Suck really qualifies you, geppy !
I hope Cunningham wins. I've never seen him fight, but he seems safer than either Maccarinelli and Mormeck. I mean, he doesn't pack a punch, and probably he is phisically weaker than Huck.
If Suck wins I will be sad, because no way he will square off against credible opponents, I know my Sauerland

[Pamuk41]

Anyone who sees Huck as a clubfighter and Macca as a world class operator can`t be serious.

I don`t say it`s the other way round but there is no big difference
in class to be seen. If it is I would say Huck is the better of the two.

Pamuk

[Odo]

being a fan of such a trash boxer like Suck really qualifies you, geppy !
I hope Cunningham wins. I've never seen him fight, but he seems safer than either Maccarinelli and Mormeck. I mean, he doesn't pack a punch, and probably he is phisically weaker than Huck.
If Suck wins I will be sad, because no way he will square off against credible opponents, I know my Sauerland

Mate,you still keep maitaining that Huck wont face credible opposition despite the fact that quite a bunch of posters here have already pointed out that Huck convincingly defeated a legit top 10 fighter in his last outing to a ring.
Simms,Abdoul,and May are for sure no top guns,but they are decent skalps.
Huck is Cunningham's mandatory.
Do you really dare to claim that both Cunningham and Tokarev are no credible opponents?
I am not that high on Cunningham,but he is the champ and no bum at all.
And Tokarev had beaten some good foes before he met Huck in the ring.
I guess that you are one of those guys who strongly dislike a certain fighter and consequently tend to dismiss him as a fighter ,too.
I,too,dislike Huck.He isnt a very likeable human being.Furthermore he seems to be quite thick,too.
Nevertheless he deserves respect for his last performance against Tokarev,and for his achievements in his rather short pro career.
Huck can punch,has skills,is fast,and seems to posess the fitting mental attitude to go very far.
To call him "Sucks" just shows your obvious ignorance,mate!
I am not one of his nuthuggers,but dont you think that it is that manly to be in the business of namecalling while sitting behind a comp ,and the object of your evilness cant give you a taste of your own medicine?

[giggigreto]

Huck has skills

I don't really treat other people judgement like the holy bible. If 10 million people would tell me that Huck (Suck:lol:) is a boxer who has skills, i would still point out that there are videos out there which shows that Suck has very average ability at best.
Again, Tokarev didn't make for a great showing in that video, as I said in my 3 or 4 precedent posts, but you keep saying that he is top 10 because the people say so, and he beat ismail and felix cora jr. That proves only that he is better than felix cora jr, not that he is better than other 6 hundreds cruiserweight boxers.
As i said, matter of fact he looks rather plodding, he is very short and stocky, and should have been a light heavyweight in his better days. There are surely more than 9 boxers in europe or america who can beat that guy in the video.

I don't speak German and I don't know what personality does he possess. I just hate him because I think he doesn't deserve all the attention he gains here on this board. I see nothing in him yet people here seems really excited about him. He has size and strenght, and that's all. Samuel Peter in comparison is a professor of boxing technique.

And since Suck puts himself on the line and get paid to do so, he is open to be criticized, ripped and even mocked by fans. It's not a personal offence he has to avenge, I'm not 'brave and manly' enough because I talk trash of boxers on the internet. I talk trash because the praise he gets on this thread I find incomprehensible.
Look at what the boxing writers have done to Jhon Ruiz. He became a joke, and he has no credibility now. But he has to blame only himself, because his fightstyle was ugly. If he was good and exciting, boxing writers would have praised him. That's how it goes.
No censorship in the free western world

[Alcaldemb]

Vadim is certainly better than Fragomeni and Haye looked less than stellar against him.

[giggigreto]

Haye won every round and made him quit, a cut notwithstanding

[Alcaldemb]

Haye won every round and made him quit, a cut notwithstanding

If Haye was fighting someone with a punch, ie Tokarev, that face to fist defense wouldn't have worked, and no he didn't win every round. Scores at the time of the stoppage were 77-76, 78-75 and 79-74.

[giggigreto]

against someone as slow and short as Tokarev, Haye would just mantain his distance and use his longer reach. A more elegant and polished, yet effective, defence than having the gloves constantly glued on your face.

[Fitir]

Maccarinelli, Haye and Huck never had a defining fight against a top 5 but it will happen soon for Haye and Huck (I am not so sure about Maccarinelli who could choose to sleep since he has the WBO belt...)
I respect Huck's carrer, he is not too much protected with fights against May (a homer I dislike for some reason...) and recently Tokarev who is a very decent test. I rank G.Jones, Braithwaite, Cunningham, Mormeck, Bell > Tokarev in terms of skills but he is a real test for a prospect. Huck is ready to take someone in the top 5. He would have a real chance against Cunningham in Germany imo. Cunningham could avoid the fight but he cannot choose an easy voluntary defense. If he chose to avoid Huck he would be obliged to take Mormeck who called him out. Their promoter King who has much influence on the IBF wants the fight and the negociations have begun.
Haye is another problem. He didn't prove much against the only top 15 he fought at cruiser : Thompson. But he is something special as he is a big cruiser who hits very very hard and the public likes that. I like his career, he is not protected and I respect him : a loss in a tough domestic fight (Thompson). He came back. Convincing EBU fights (Gurov etc.) and a final eliminatory against an EBU level opponent (Fragomeni). He was stopped against Thompson , I would have prefered the eliminatory to be against another experienced top 15 (G.Jones for example) . But it's not a bad career ! He will have a very tough test soon. He is maybe a bit overconfident as it seems he thinks Mormeck is a complete bum. I read something like "I just need to be 75% to KO him" etc. It's not just talking, it seems he really believes that since he chose to prepare against a limited slow HW. Even if Mormeck is past it Haye could be surprised. Mormeck does not care about him though and he is focused on Cunningham. But Bell is still in the mix for the WBC, he will be hungry, he can take a punch and he can also hit very hard. Haye vs Bell your opinion ?

[giggigreto]

Haye vs Bell your opinion ?

Tough fight to predict!

But perhaps Bell needs to settle the score against Mormeck, they should make a third fight. Then unify (Cunningham) or take on newcomers (HAye, Maccarinelli, Matt Godfrey, or even the boombastic Huck, if they feel sadic ;))

[Alcaldemb]

against someone as slow and short as Tokarev, Haye would just mantain his distance and use his longer reach. A more elegant and polished, yet effective, defence than having the gloves constantly glued on your face.

You are aware that Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni right? Also that Fragomeni is not necessarily anything resembling fast, even with all that Haye was not able to keep him at the end of his jab. As far as elegant and polished are you so critical of Winky Wright too or is this disdain simply held for boxers based in Germany?

[Fitir]

But perhaps Bell needs to settle the score against Mormec
It will never happen. Bell is not very interesting for a big purse and Mormeck won't fight him if he is not obliged to do so. Mormeck and Bell dislike each other. Bell tried his best to avoid the rematch and in the end he took it cause he didn't find any other option. Mormeck hadn't looked for excuses and he had given Bell all the credit after the first fight. After the second fight Bell said he had won every round and he became crasy at the press conference (his team was obliged to calm him etc.). Mormeck is obsessed by the belts and he was unhappy the rematch wasn't for the undisputed title. He was interested in Braithwaite and Bell. He was interested in Diablo. Now he wants Cunningham... He wants to become the undisputed champion and he wants to have the 3 (or 4) major belts. I don't know if he will succeed but his goal has never changed. Tiozzo wanted him but he said he would have been interested in Tiozzo if he could have obtained the WBO belt first (strange opinion since Tiozzo would have been his biggest purse in career with or without the WBO belt !). He also said would have prefered Haye to obtain the WBO belt first etc.

[giggigreto]

You are aware that Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni right? Also that Fragomeni is not necessarily anything resembling fast, even with all that Haye was not able to keep him at the end of his jab. As far as elegant and polished are you so critical of Winky Wright too or is this disdain simply held for boxers based in Germany?

actually, I like Winky!! He was a stick and move fighter once, but now his style isn't buying him big purses or new fans, he is heavily criticized in america for his 'boring' style. At least he threws good combinations and has great timing with the jab. He is no HUck. Huck is crude terchnique-wise. Abraham too is quite stiff, but his combination punching is fluid.

I like some fighters from germany, but they were all good amateurs, and they came from eastern nations. I don't particularly enjoy the style a-la beyer or abraham they adopt in germany. I admit, i'm not particularly fond of it.

Fragomeni is a pressure fighter, he comes forward and takes a lot of punches to land his own, but he is undersize, so his punches don't hurt too much. Haye knew this and accepted the aggressiveness of his foe, as the exchanges were more punishing to Fragomeni, in the long term. It led to his eventual victory.

[geppy]

You are aware that Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni right? Also that Fragomeni is not necessarily anything resembling fast, even with all that Haye was not able to keep him at the end of his jab. As far as elegant and polished are you so critical of Winky Wright too or is this disdain simply held for boxers based in Germany?

LMAO, after all of that shit giggigreto , Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni!!! Haye had a great win against Fragomeni, but Huck just fights much smaller fighters. Ok, that makes great sense, please keep enlighening us.

[geppy]

"Tokarev is a solid CW, but I said always he fought almost nobody and that he has a very questionable stamina. The elite is, Mormeck, Bell, Haye, Maccarinelli, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, "Arslan", Brudov and some others, Huck, Banks, Godfrey, etc. are the top prospects..."

Luigi, you dont even have any idea Tokarev fought one of your "elite" Cruiserweights "Arslan" !! What do you to say after posting something that ignorant ?

Vadim Tokarev 189¼ Firat Arslan 189¾ 18-2-0 Nürburgring Racetrack, Germany D PTS 12

[giggigreto]

Haye just fights better, he throws all the punches perfectly, he is more mobile, more powerful, spectacular while being very good.
H(S)uck is ugly to watch and very predictable.

I'm not basing my preferences on the credentials of their opponents, like you do. I watch the fights, and I see a good fighter in Haye, while In Huck I don't see nothing good. Haye is going to hold his own and potentially dominate when he steps up at world class level ( that means only bell, mormeck, really not tokarev!). Huck is gonna get schooled if he fights any of the three, and if this wasn't cruiserweight but a more deep division Huck just would not be a boxer, he would still be in whatever combat sport he was, because u can't improvise a boxer at welterweight or middlewieght and sell him as a world class prospect!!!

This is grounded on observation on how the guys fight, not who they fight. I don't like to speculate if Fragomeni is different or not to Tokarev, better or not.
Still the better fighter who Haye fought IMO was Gurov, who lasted not even a round against him, while Fragomeni nealry made the distance and ancient Carl Thompson actually beat Haye. What does it prove?? Nothing.
Speculating that Huck is good because he won a MD against 5'10'' bloated Tokarev who won against some american guys with goodlooking records on homesoil, what does it prove?? Does It give legitimity, good fighting credentials to Tokarev or Huck, despite they look awful when actually boxing??

It's your stupid "on paper" comparisons that don't make any sense to me!!!

[Alcaldemb]

LMAO, after all of that shit, Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni!!! Haye had a great win against Fragomeni, but Huck just fights much smaller fighters. Ok, that makes great sense, please keep enlighening us.

Well the hell are you talking about Geppy? I was saying Huck's win over Tokarev is better than Haye's over Fragomeni, or is reading comprehension not one of your strengths?

[Alcaldemb]

Haye just fights better, he throws all the punches perfectly, he is more mobile, more powerful, spectacular while being very good.
H(S)uck is ugly to watch and very predictable.

I'm not basing my preferences on the credentials of their opponents, like you do. I watch the fights, and I see a good fighter in Haye, while In Huck I don't see nothing good. Haye is going to hold his own and potentially dominate when he steps up at world class level ( that means only bell, mormeck, really not tokarev!). Huck is gonna get schooled if he fights any of the three, and if this wasn't cruiserweight but a more deep division Huck just would not be a boxer, he would still be in whatever combat sport he was, because u can't improvise a boxer at welterweight or middlewieght and sell him as a world class prospect!!!

This is grounded on observation on how the guys fight, not who they fight. I don't like to speculate if Fragomeni is different or not to Tokarev, better or not.
Still the better fighter who Haye fought IMO was Gurov, who lasted not even a round against him, while Fragomeni nealry made the distance and ancient Carl Thompson actually beat Haye. What does it prove?? Nothing.
Speculating that Huck is good because he won a MD against 5'10'' bloated Tokarev who won against some american guys with goodlooking records on homesoil, what does it prove?? Does It give legitimity, good fighting credentials to Tokarev or Huck, despite they look awful when actually boxing??

It's your stupid "on paper" comparisons that don't make any sense to me!!!

You don't look at their opponents' credentials? Wow that is some great logic there. So if Haye looks good against worst opposition than Huck he is better just because he looks good, mind you he didn't look good against Fragomeni. As for the MD, that was bull and everyone knows it, Huck clearly won.

By the way Huck has shown better footwork and a better ability to control distance, that is why he didn't have Tokarev on his ass the same way that Haye had Fragomeni breathing down his throat the entire fight.

[geppy]

Speculating that Huck is good because he won a MD against 5'10'' bloated Tokarev who won against some american guys with goodlooking records on homesoil, what does it prove?? Does It give legitimity, good fighting credentials to Tokarev or Huck, despite they look awful when actually boxing??

It's your stupid "on paper" comparisons that don't make any sense to me!!!

Some would say Haye didnt look too good himself against Fragomeni. The guy is only 5'9 lol, Haye fights smaller guys!

You are the one making "stupid on paper" comaprisons that dont make any sense , and it was pointed out to you!!! Remember, and stupid is the right word !

You: "against someone as slow and short as Tokarev, Haye would just mantain his distance and use his longer reach."

Alcaldemb : "You are aware that Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni right? Also that Fragomeni is not necessarily anything resembling fast, even with all that Haye was not able to keep him at the end of his jab." LMAO!!!

[giggigreto]

I didn't say i don't look to the opponents' credentials, you dialectic genious.

Huck at his best doesn't look better than Haye at his worst.

Let's go straight to the point ,do you think Huck got any remote possibility to beat Haye in a boxing match, and not actually get totally schooled??

[geppy]

Well the hell are you talking about Geppy? I was saying Huck's win over Tokarev is better than Haye's over Fragomeni, or is reading comprehension not one of your strengths?

I was refering to giggigreto, you showed him. Good job.

[giggigreto]

Some would say Haye didnt look too good himself against Fragomeni. The guy is only 5'9 lol, Haye fights smaller guys!

You are the one making "stupid on paper" comaprisons that dont make any sense , and it was pointed out to you!!! Remember, and stupid is the right word !

You: "against someone as slow and short as Tokarev, Haye would just mantain his distance and use his longer reach."

Alcaldemb : "You are aware that Tokarev is taller than Fragomeni right? Also that Fragomeni is not necessarily anything resembling fast, even with all that Haye was not able to keep him at the end of his jab." LMAO!!!
Here we go with another stand-out in rethorical excellence!:happy

Take a look at the way Fragomeni fights: he comes forward, even walks forward, he doesn't care to get hit and throws what he has to throw, accepting to take the punishment meanwhile. It isn't possible to not get involved in a fight against a guy like that, if you are not a slickster and a runner, which Haye is not. Haye too comes to fight.
Tokarev is different, and he likes to stalk. He is not a very busy fighter, like fragomeni is.

There are various types of short fighters, it's not that everyone fights the same way, depending on their height.
Please stop trying to look a smart ass, pointing out contradictions that are suspect to even exist :verysad

Oh, and LMAO ROTFL PM PVT and oh yeah WTF

[Alcaldemb]

I was refering to giggigreto, you showed him. Good job.

Ok man, I was like WTF, thanks for fixing that.

[giggigreto]

Let's go straight to the point ,do you think Huck got any remote possibility to beat Haye in a boxing match, and not actually get totally schooled??

Let's make a poll out of this

[Alcaldemb]

I didn't say i don't look to the opponents' credentials, you dialectic genious.

Huck at his best doesn't look better than Haye at his worst.

Let's go straight to the point ,do you think Huck got any remote possibility to beat Haye in a boxing match, and not actually get totally schooled??

Hey if Carl Thompson could, and if Fragomeni and Johansson can land consistently hell yes. Huck is fast, he does hit hard and he is skilled. I think if they were to fight Huck would be a favorite as he is better at covering up and he is quite fast and rangy and does hit quite hard.

[geppy]

Here we go with another stand-out in rethorical excellence!:happy

Take a look at the way Fragomeni fights: he comes forward, even walks forward, he doesn't care to get hit and throws what he has to throw, accepting to take the punishment meanwhile. It isn't possible to not get involved in a fight against a guy like that, if you are not a slickster and a runner, which Haye is not. Haye too comes to fight.
Tokarev is different, and he likes to stalk. He is not a very busy fighter, like fragomeni is.

There are various types of short fighters, it's not that everyone fights the same way, depending on their height.
Please stop trying to look a smart ass, pointing out contradictions that are suspect to even exist :verysad

Oh, and LMAO ROTFL PM PVT and oh yeah WTF

Walking foreward and not caring if he gets hit, is better than stalking an opponent, ok. That just makes great sense. At least Tokarev can punch when he gets close. So, Fragomei is short, doesnt worry about defense, and has no power 22 wins only 10 Ko's. Sounds real impressive.

[Odo]

Haye just fights better, he throws all the punches perfectly, he is more mobile, more powerful, spectacular while being very good.
H(S)uck is ugly to watch and very predictable.

I'm not basing my preferences on the credentials of their opponents, like you do. I watch the fights, and I see a good fighter in Haye, while In Huck I don't see nothing good. Haye is going to hold his own and potentially dominate when he steps up at world class level ( that means only bell, mormeck, really not tokarev!). Huck is gonna get schooled if he fights any of the three, and if this wasn't cruiserweight but a more deep division Huck just would not be a boxer, he would still be in whatever combat sport he was, because u can't improvise a boxer at welterweight or middlewieght and sell him as a world class prospect!!!

This is grounded on observation on how the guys fight, not who they fight. I don't like to speculate if Fragomeni is different or not to Tokarev, better or not.
Still the better fighter who Haye fought IMO was Gurov, who lasted not even a round against him, while Fragomeni nealry made the distance and ancient Carl Thompson actually beat Haye. What does it prove?? Nothing.
Speculating that Huck is good because he won a MD against 5'10'' bloated Tokarev who won against some american guys with goodlooking records on homesoil, what does it prove?? Does It give legitimity, good fighting credentials to Tokarev or Huck, despite they look awful when actually boxing??

It's your stupid "on paper" comparisons that don't make any sense to me!!!

You are entitled to your opinion,giggigreto!
No doubt about that!
"I watch the fights"
Well,I strongly recommend you to watch some of Tokarev's fights!
First of all you would know that the MD victory for Huck was a joke! Huck didnt deserve a MD,but a UD.Anyway!
Go and watch Tokarev vs Cora,or vs Arslan !
Tokarev is head and shoulders above fighters like Fragomeni.
Huck would be schooled by Mormeck,Haye,and Bell,eh! Maybe! Maybe not!
I think that you tend to dismiss Huck because you dont like him very much.
Huck has proved that he can play in the first division by beating Tokarev.
He has passed another test quite successully,too.He beat cruiser weight top gatekeeper Abdoul.Huck also beat Simms,Seferi,and May.No top figher of course,but decent boxers.

[Luigi1985]

Give me a break,luigi!
Brudov an elite fighter?? He lost almost every round against the old geezer Virgil Hill.


So would Huck also. In a neutral country, I would favour Brudov to win against Huck, Arslan, who´s a non-stop pressure fighter, was beaten by Valery, and Firat is better than Huck right now.

[Luigi1985]

Vadim is certainly better than Fragomeni and Haye looked less than stellar against him.


Forget it, Tokarev is/ was a hyped up small CW with the stamina of Sanders at the best, I always said it, not only now. Fragomeni was a great HW amateur with very good skills, an iron chin and with good volume punching. Would he went pro sooner and to a good promoter he could have been world champion easily. You can´t compare Tokarev with Fragomeni, even now Fragomeni would win IMO...

[Luigi1985]

Maccarinelli, Huck and Haye are all ca. on the same level right now. All three aren´t in their primes now, let´s see who will go the furthest, but that Huck is much better than a Haye like some of you say now is just ridiculous. But like I wrote, IMO if a fight will be make in a neutral country, let´s say against Brudov I think Huck would lose...

[Deslizer]

I think that Huck isn't really intelligent and also not really talented. I don't like him because of what he says in interviews and because he often doesn't act like a sportsman in the ring (punches into the "touch gloves").

But he has a good workrate and a good condition ... thats why he won against Tokarev.

[Luigi1985]

I think that Huck isn't really intelligent and also not really talented. I don't like him because of what he says in interviews and because he often doesn't act like a sportsman in the ring (punches into the "touch gloves").

But he has a good workrate and a good condition ... thats why he won against Tokarev.


Yeah, fair evaluation, but how do you see it about Tokarev? Some fellas here try to make Vadim a great fighter at CW, but IMO he beat only some decent fighters, nothing more... what do you think?

[Odo]

Forget it, Tokarev is/ was a hyped up small CW with the stamina of Sanders at the best, I always said it, not only now. Fragomeni was a great HW amateur with very good skills, an iron chin and with good volume punching. Would he went pro sooner and to a good promoter he could have been world champion easily. You can´t compare Tokarev with Fragomeni, even now Fragomeni would win IMO...

You are right,lugii!

You cant compare Fragomeni with Tokarev.Fragomeni is a mediocre boxer-he doesnt play in Tokarev's league.
He lost against Haye,and apart from a bunch of no-hopers,average journeymen,and totally unknown names the only two recognisable boxers are Ismail Abdoul,and Frederic Serrat.
He won a split decision against Serrat who for sure is a very decent fighter,but no top gun at all.Abdoul is a teak tough cruiser weight gatekeeper.Fragomeni won a point decision against him.
The Italian cant hold a candle to Tokarev in terms of quality skalps.
The American based Russian Tokarev has never been hyped much.He has fought in whichever country an opponent was put in front of him.He has travelled to his opponent's backyard,and he doesnt have a padded record.
Tokarev is for real.He is no clubfighter,but a legit top 10 cruiser weight.He lost to Huck who won his encounter with him fair and square.Huck was just the better fighter that night.However,a loss to Huck doesnt turn Tokarev into a clubfighter all of a sudden.

[Luigi1985]

You are right,lugii!

You cant compare Fragomeni with Tokarev.Fragomeni is a mediocre boxer-he doesnt play in Tokarev's league.
He lost against Haye,and apart from a bunch of no-hopers,average journeymen,and totally unknown names the only two recognisable boxers are Ismail Abdoul,and Frederic Serrat.
He won a split decision against Serrat who for sure is a very decent fighter,but no top gun at all.Abdoul is a teak tough cruiser weight gatekeeper.Fragomeni won a point decision against him.
The Italian cant hold a candle to Tokarev in terms of quality skalps.
The American based Russian Tokarev has never been hyped much.He has fought in whichever country an opponent was put in front of him.He has travelled to his opponent's backyard,and he doesnt have a padded record.
Tokarev is for real.He is no clubfighter,but a legit top 10 cruiser weight.He lost to Huck who won his encounter with him fair and square.Huck was just the better fighter that night.However,a loss to Huck doesnt turn Tokarev into a clubfighter all of a sudden.


When you play the smart ass, Odo, do it correctly. Fragomeni won a close fight versus the French viá MD, not SD, and I said he was a great amateur and that with the right managment he could have been something. That´s a big difference. When you want to hype up Huck now and make Tokarev to a world-class fighter, OK, I´m fine with that, but don´t overact. I didn´t write that Vadim is a clubfighter, because he isn´t. He´s a decent fighter, nothing less, nothing more. Haye, Maccarinelli, Arslan, Brudov, Mormeck, Bell, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, Braithwaite, Cantatore, Fragomeni, Godfrey, etc. are all better fighters...

[Odo]

When you play the smart ass, Odo, do it correctly. Fragomeni won a close fight versus the French viá MD, not SD, and I said he was a great amateur and that with the right managment he could have been something. That´s a big difference. When you want to hype up Huck now and make Tokarev to a world-class fighter, OK, I´m fine with that, but don´t overact. I didn´t write that Vadim is a clubfighter, because he isn´t. He´s a decent fighter, nothing less, nothing more. Haye, Maccarinelli, Arslan, Brudov, Mormeck, Bell, Cunningham, Wlodarczyk, Braithwaite, Cantatore, Fragomeni, Godfrey, etc. are all better fighters...

MD,not SD victory for Fragomeni over Serrat,eh! Point taken,luigi!
Hype Huck? Hm! He for sure is not my favourite fighter.
Tokarev? He isnt my favourite fighter either.I have seen some of his fights though,and I dislike when someone tries to belittle him as he has fought whoever was put in front of him and wherever that fight took place.
I dont care whether you rate fighters like Wlodarczyk(you have obviously never seen him fight),Fragomeni(you are Italian,arent you?),Cunningham(you havent seen him either,eh!),Cantatore(you are joking ,arent you?)Arslan(they have already fought each other by the way-in Arslan'a backyard.The official result was a draw.),Maccarinelli(why? because he beat outstanding fighters like Bobby Gunn?),and so on and so on.Dont get me wrong!I dont try to belittle your abovementioned names.However,I for my part think that Tokarev has a decent chance against all your aforementioned boxers.I would dare to call him the favourite against most of your mentioned names.
By the way Tokarev 's fight record is certainly better than most of the fighters you call better than Tokarev.
Well,you probably dont care that much for the opinion of known box mags,internet sites,and box experts anyway!
Accoding to the leading media in our beloved sport Tokarev was a legit top 10 fighter before he faced Huck.

[giggigreto]

When looking to Huck- Tokarev, I got flashes of Paul Williams- Sharmba Mitchell ! and that says it all. The disparity in size was just too much.
Tokarev should get down a division, bercause he is no Qawi. Fragomeni doesn't train full time, otherwise he would be a light heavyweight too, that's why he is featherfisted

[Luigi1985]

MD,not SD victory for Fragomeni over Serrat,eh! Point taken,luigi!
Hype Huck? Hm! He for sure is not my favourite fighter.
Tokarev? He isnt my favourite fighter either.I have seen some of his fights though,and I dislike when someone tries to belittle him as he has fought whoever was put in front of him and wherever that fight took place.
I dont care whether you rate fighters like Wlodarczyk(you have obviously never seen him fight),Fragomeni(you are Italian,arent you?),Cunningham(you havent seen him either,eh!),Cantatore(you are joking ,arent you?)Arslan(they have already fought each other by the way-in Arslan'a backyard.The official result was a draw.),Maccarinelli(why? because he beat outstanding fighters like Bobby Gunn?),and so on and so on.Dont get me wrong!I dont try to belittle your abovementioned names.However,I for my part think that Tokarev has a decent chance against all your aforementioned boxers.I would dare to call him the favourite against most of your mentioned names.
By the way Tokarev 's fight record is certainly better than most of the fighters you call better than Tokarev.
Well,you probably dont care that much for the opinion of known box mags,internet sites,and box experts anyway!
Accoding to the leading media in our beloved sport Tokarev was a legit top 10 fighter before he faced Huck.


The longer the posts- the better the posts? Wrong.

Tokarev was hyped up because he beat some decent Americans CW´s (Cora Jr., Wilson, etc.), when you have a bit knowledge you must agree that his stamina is subterranean for the world class. I believe you that Huck isn´t your favourite fighter, but even though, you try indirectly (but for me a bit to conspicuous) to make Huck and his career so far better than it´s actually is...

[Odo]

The longer the posts- the better the posts? Wrong.

Tokarev was hyped up because he beat some decent Americans CW´s (Cora Jr., Wilson, etc.), when you have a bit knowledge you must agree that his stamina is subterranean for the world class. I believe you that Huck isn´t your favourite fighter, but even though, you try indirectly (but for me a bit to conspicuous) to make Huck and his career so far better than it´s actually is...


"to make Huck and his career so far better than it's actually is.."
Haha! Had a good laugh when I read your daring statement! I havent told you yet that I consider Huck to be an all time great,have I ?
"when you have a bit knowledge you must agree that his stamina is subterranean(???) for the world class"
Haha! Well,since you consider fighters like Cantatore and Fragomeni to be part of that small group of elite fighters I am sorry to say that I strongly disagree with you.I for my part think that Tokarev's stamina is good enough to beat the likes of Cantatore and Fragomeni.
By the way go and buy a tape of Tokarev vs Arslan.It was one of the best cruiser weight fights I have seen within the last couple of years.Brudov vs Arslan was fairly lame compared with that exciting and entertaining fight.

[giggigreto]

I think Fragomeni volume punching and capabilities to take a punch could very well be too much for the plodding Tokarev I have seen vs Huck.
It might have been an off night for Tokarev, but that was supposedly his biggest fight to date

[Fitir]

. Fragomeni won a close fight versus the French viá MD, not SD MD yes. BIG victory for Fragomeni ! The moral winner was Serrat of course. Your fantastic Fragomeni who can destroy Huck, Tokarev etc. proved he was unable to dominate convincigly a fat french natural SMW. The fight showed how limited Fragomeni is and that's all. Serrat had easily controled the first part of the fight. Fragomeni looked better in the very end of the fight (the last 2 rounds) but the lack of conditionning of Serrat vastly helped him (no promoter => no money => no sparring and no serious preparation...) That said Serrat is not as mediocre as you could believe with a quick look at Boxrec. The Fragomeni result is far to be the worst decision against Serrat. Ask Odo about May's victory over Serrat for example. And people who watched the Thompson and Roberge fights would also have something to say about the decisions imo...

[Luigi1985]

MD yes. BIG victory for Fragomeni ! The moral winner was Serrat of course. Your fantastic Fragomeni who can destroy Huck, Tokarev etc. proved he was unable to dominate convincigly a fat french natural SMW. The fight showed how limited Fragomeni is and that's all. Serrat had easily controled the first part of the fight. Fragomeni looked better in the very end of the fight (the last 2 rounds) but the lack of conditionning of Serrat vastly helped him (no promoter => no money => no sparring and no serious preparation...) That said Serrat is not as mediocre as you could believe with a quick look at Boxrec. The Fragomeni result is far to be the worst decision against Serrat. Ask Odo about May's victory over Serrat for example. And people who watched the Thompson and Roberge fights would also have something to say about the decisions imo...


I´ve seen this fight, I don´t need your fight report. Fragomeni isn´t a full-time pro, he´s a hobby-boxer, he trains perhaps 2 times the week, and that´s for his style (high volume punching at the inside) not that good...

[geppy]

Fragomeni isn´t a full-time pro, he´s a hobby-boxer, he trains perhaps 2 times the week, and that´s for his style (high volume punching at the inside) not that good...

Luigi: "Forget it, Tokarev is/ was a hyped up small CW with the stamina of Sanders at the best, I always said it, not only now. Fragomeni was a great HW amateur with very good skills, an iron chin and with good volume punching"


Of my, and you were critisizing Tokarevs stanima, while hailing Fragomeni. Nothing you post makes any sense. You say Tokarev is a small CW and give Huck no credit, but worship Haye for beating Fragomeni who is shorter and in your own words a hobby boxer that only trains two times a week .

[Luigi1985]

Luigi: "Forget it, Tokarev is/ was a hyped up small CW with the stamina of Sanders at the best, I always said it, not only now. Fragomeni was a great HW amateur with very good skills, an iron chin and with good volume punching"


Of my, and you were critisizing Tokarevs stanima, while hailing Fragomeni. Nothing you post makes any sense. You say Tokarev is a small CW and give Huck no credit, but worship Haye for beating Fragomeni who is shorter and in your own words a hobby boxer that only two times a week.


Why did you quote me? Are you that stupid? I wrote that Fragomeni was a great amateur, as a pro it´s another story. Tokarev went pro with the right age, he was lucky to get a good managment who let him get up in the 4 big names in boxing (WBA, WBC, IBF, WBO). Fragomeni showed against Haye, when he´s motivated and well-trained, that he´s/ was a good CW...

[Odo]

MD yes. BIG victory for Fragomeni ! The moral winner was Serrat of course. Your fantastic Fragomeni who can destroy Huck, Tokarev etc. proved he was unable to dominate convincigly a fat french natural SMW. The fight showed how limited Fragomeni is and that's all. Serrat had easily controled the first part of the fight. Fragomeni looked better in the very end of the fight (the last 2 rounds) but the lack of conditionning of Serrat vastly helped him (no promoter => no money => no sparring and no serious preparation...) That said Serrat is not as mediocre as you could believe with a quick look at Boxrec. The Fragomeni result is far to be the worst decision against Serrat. Ask Odo about May's victory over Serrat for example. And people who watched the Thompson and Roberge fights would also have something to say about the decisions imo...

You are right,fitr!
Serrat vs May still makes my blood boil! Blatant robbery in open daylight!
The outcome of that particular fight was a scandal,a true shame!

[Odo]

Why did you quote me? Are you that stupid? I wrote that Fragomeni was a great amateur, as a pro it´s another story. Tokarev went pro with the right age, he was lucky to get a good managment who let him get up in the 4 big names in boxing (WBA, WBC, IBF, WBO). Fragomeni showed against Haye, when he´s motivated and well-trained, that he´s/ was a good CW...

You are the one who claims that Fragomeni and Cantatore are better fighters than Tokarev,and that they would beat him.


Just for you,luigigi:


Cruiser weight rating,boxingtalk

Jean Marc Mormeck (BOXINGTALK CHAMP)
O'Neil Bell
Krzystof Wlodarczyk (IBF)
Steve Cunningham
Vadim Tokarev
David Haye
Enzo Maccarinelli (WBO)
Matt Godfrey
Firat Arslan
Darnell Wilson
Valery Brudov
Vincenzo Cantatore
Marco Huck
Alexander Gourov
Grigory Drozd

The Ring,rating

JEAN-MARC MORMECK
33-3 (22)
1
1
299
O'NEIL BELL
26-2-1 (24)
2
2
157
STEVE CUNNINGHAM
20-1 (10)
3
3
105
KRZYSZTOF WLODARCZYK
37-2 (27)
4
4
79
DAVID HAYE
19-1 (18)
5
5
39
ENZO MACCARINELLI
26-1 (20)
6
6
34
FIRAT ARSLAN
27-3-1 (18)
7
7
29
MARCO HUCK
19-0 (13)
8
8
32
JOHNATHON BANKS
16-0 (12)
9
9
51
VADIM TOKAREV
23-1-1 (16)
10
10
16
DARNELL WILSON
21-5-3 (18)

[Luigi1985]

You are the one who claims that Fragomeni and Cantatore are better fighters than Tokarev,and that they would beat him.


Just for you,luigigi:


Cruiser weight rating,boxingtalk

Jean Marc Mormeck (BOXINGTALK CHAMP)
O'Neil Bell
Krzystof Wlodarczyk (IBF)
Steve Cunningham
Vadim Tokarev
David Haye
Enzo Maccarinelli (WBO)
Matt Godfrey
Firat Arslan
Darnell Wilson
Valery Brudov
Vincenzo Cantatore
Marco Huck
Alexander Gourov
Grigory Drozd
The Ring,rating

JEAN-MARC MORMECK

33-3 (22)


1


1


299


O'NEIL BELL


26-2-1 (24)


2


2


157


STEVE CUNNINGHAM


20-1 (10)


3


3


105


KRZYSZTOF WLODARCZYK


37-2 (27)


4


4


79


DAVID HAYE


19-1 (18)


5


5


39


ENZO MACCARINELLI


26-1 (20)


6


6


34


FIRAT ARSLAN


27-3-1 (18)


7


7


29


MARCO HUCK


19-0 (13)


8


8


32


JOHNATHON BANKS


16-0 (12)


9


9


51


VADIM TOKAREV


23-1-1 (16)


10


10


16


DARNELL WILSON


21-5-3 (18)



:lol:


If we trust now bums magazines like "The Ring", than we wouldn´t need to discuss in boxing forums, because it´s all clear...

[Luigi1985]

Edit

[Odo]

Well,luigi,I am not sold on "The Ring" either,and boxingtalk is one of the most biased websites out there.(according to boxingtalk Pavlik deserves to be rated higher than Abraham)
If you are a non-english speaking foreigner you will never be rated among the top guns -whomever you may have beaten and defeated.
A Russian usually doesnt get a good ranking with either the ring nor with boxingtalk.Nevertheless Tokarev is ranked quite highly by both the ring and boxingtalk.
You got my point then,didnt you!
Tokarev was a legit top fighter.Not only the ring or boxingtalk rate him fairly highly,but other mags and websites as well.
Darnell Wilson,Felix Cora,Firat Arslan,Miachel Simms,and Ali Ismailov are good skalps.
Neither Fragomeni,Cantatore,nor Maccarenlli have better fight records.
And by the way Tokarev looked much better against Arslan than Brudov did,and I for my part had Brudov ahead on points against Arslan.

[Luigi1985]

Well,luigi,I am not sold on "The Ring" either,and boxingtalk is one of the most biased websites out there.(according to boxingtalk Pavlik deserves to be rated higher than Abraham)
If you are a non-english speaking foreigner you will never be rated among the top guns -whomever you may have beaten and defeated.
A Russian usually doesnt get a good ranking with either the ring nor with boxingtalk.Nevertheless Tokarev is ranked quite highly by both the ring and boxingtalk.
You got my point then,didnt you!
Tokarev was a legit top fighter.Not only the ring or boxingtalk rate him fairly highly,but other mags and websites as well.
Darnell Wilson,Felix Cora,Firat Arslan,Miachel Simms,and Ali Ismailov are good skalps.
Neither Fragomeni,Cantatore,nor Maccarenlli have better fight records.
And by the way Tokarev looked much better against Arslan than Brudov did,and I for my part had Brudov ahead on points against Arslan.

We left it now that Huck, Maccarinelli and Haye are the future of the CW division (perhaps with Banks), who´s better now and why, etc. is just speculation and is just stupid, let´s wait and see...

[Odo]

We left it now that Huck, Maccarinelli and Haye are the future of the CW division (perhaps with Banks), who´s better now and why, etc. is just speculation and is just stupid, let´s wait and see...

Banks is an interesting fighter.He will appear on the undercard of Wlad vs Brewster.I very much hope that some minutes of his fight will be shown on german tv.

[Luigi1985]

Banks is an interesting fighter.He will appear on the undercard of Wlad vs Brewster.I very much hope that some minutes of his fight will be shown on german tv.


Yeah, agreed, Banks is the only non- eutopean who could be a threat to our CW young guns at this moment talent-wise...

[Odo]

Yeah, agreed, Banks is the only non- eutopean who could be a threat to our CW young guns at this moment talent-wise...


A pity that he is matched against a true no-hoper on the undercard of Wlad vs Brewster-it would have been a great opportunity to showcase his skills in front of a huge German crowd and some very important people.Germany is one of the most important box markets out there.A victory against a decent foe would have been a noisy statement-a victory against that no-hoper Juric doesnt mean anything at all.

[Luigi1985]

A pity that he is matched against a true no-hoper on the undercard of Wlad vs Brewster-it would have been a great opportunity to showcase his skills in front of a huge German crowd and some very important people.Germany is one of the most important box markets out there.A victory against a decent foe would have been a noisy statement-a victory against that no-hoper Juric doesnt mean anything at all.


I completely agree.

[geppy]

Huck wil beat Cunnigham!

Steve is too inactive and boring to win a decision. I unfortunately watched Cunnigham vs Diablo I. All Cunnigham wanted to do was hold and didnt look anything special. God damn, that was one shitty fight.

[Alcaldemb]

Huck will beat him. Cunningham, even when he is on, relies too heavily on the jab and Huck's is every bit as good plus he is more aggressive. I think he stops Cunningham.

[boxexpert]

hes very strong with lots of power,although his skills arent the best.

but hes young and he will learn that with experience. he will probably beat cunningham,but the against haye or maccarinelli he might lose. his management will take care that this wont happen