Haye vs Skelton ???????

[unitas]

this would be a good idea imo.

skelton would be a decent test. and it would be a big domestic fight.

haye has already knocked out bonin in one, so he doesnt need any other tuneups.

and if he cant beat skelton, he wont go anywhere anyways.

my pick: skelton ko9.

[stuey]

he would beat the granny out of skelton...

skelton is poor.

[Jack Dempsey]

After the Sprott bout I'm not sure I could ever watch Skelton again

[IronBull]

Skelton is too slow.

[robpalmer135]

Haye KO 2

[Max Molyneux]

Skelton's chin would take Haye the distance.

Haye does not hit harder than Williams.

[The Kurgan]

Skelton's chin would take Haye the distance.

Haye does not hit harder than Williams.

True, but unlike Danny "Smokin' Cup-cakes" Williams, Haye is capable of throwing more than 3 power punches in the same round.

[Cobbler]

True, but unlike Danny "Smokin' Cup-cakes" Williams, Haye is capable of throwing more than 3 power punches in the same fight

Fixed

[TBooze]

Horrible match up for Haye; personally I think even if Haye won (which is not a given) he would look terrible doing it; and everyone outside the UK would give it a so what? And if he loses? Well what is left for Haye to do?

If Haye wants to fight at Heavyweight, he needs to find a match up that pays very well, and would give him instant credability if he won. A Skelton match does neither IMO.

[yesihavearm]

According to Frank ****** theres a big Mat Skelton announcement at the beginning of this week.

Lets hope its something good and NOT a match against either harrison/wiliams/sprott.

[Claypole]

According to Frank ****** theres a big Mat Skelton announcement at the beginning of this week.
He's coming out.

[baguettesurgeon]

Yes lets put one of our most exciting fighters in with our most boring fighter and hope things pan out:lol: , if they do fight I think Haye will hit him so hard that the ring will be covered in that revolting body hair of Skeltons afterwards.

[LeedsLad]

This would be horrific to watch, a Vitali/Williams style beatdown and a late stoppage for Haye IMO.

[Betty Swollocks]

Horrible match up for Haye; personally I think even if Haye won (which is not a given) he would look terrible doing it; and everyone outside the UK would give it a so what? And if he loses? Well what is left for Haye to do?

If Haye wants to fight at Heavyweight, he needs to find a match up that pays very well, and would give him instant credability if he won. A Skelton match does neither IMO.

yeah exactly, Skelton would make sure it stayed ugly and Haye is not busy enough to have an easy time. It would be ugly unless Haye got him early, which is very possible.

[Cobbler]

According to Frank ****** theres a big Mat Skelton announcement at the beginning of this week.


Is it that he's going to wrestle a bear and the little known but very prestigious WBJ (World Boxing Junta) has argreed to sanction it as a world title fight?

[unitas]

haye will bomb early. skelton will hang on. by round six haye is gassed, skelton will get closer with his shots.

by round 10 the spectators will be fainting cause haye sucks all the oxygen out of the building.

haye will slow down dramatically. enough for skelton to touch him with a glancing tap on his china chin........and haye will drop unconcious like a ballerina playing the dying swan.

[Haye]

Horrible match up for Haye; personally I think even if Haye won (which is not a given) he would look terrible doing it; and everyone outside the UK would give it a so what? And if he loses? Well what is left for Haye to do?

If Haye wants to fight at Heavyweight, he needs to find a match up that pays very well, and would give him instant credability if he won. A Skelton match does neither IMO.

Yep I have to agree here, Skelton has the chin and ability to stink out the joint to damage Haye's reputation in this fight, whether he wins or not. And people outside the UK would, as you pointed out, discredit the win however impressive.

I think he should fight another bum like Bonin, then Guinn

[Haye]

Is it that he's going to wrestle a bear and the little known but very prestigious WBJ (World Boxing Junta) has argreed to sanction it as a world title fight?

That just made my day:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Sundance]

A whiff of Fraudley about Mr. Haye. Skelton does not deserve to be leap frogged by Haye, yet.

[Claypole]

Skelton does not deserve to be leap frogged by Haye Skelton deserves nothing.

[Cobbler]

A whiff of Fraudley about Mr. Haye

There's still a window of opportunity for you here to claim that you were drunk/on drugs/your account was hacked by a drunk drug-addled half wit.

But it's rapidly closing.

[PrideOfWales]

I couldn't have any less desire too see this fight.

[stake501]

are ppl forgetting that Haye is the man at cruiser.....he is now proven world class, WBC and WBA titlist.

The guys we are mentioning although in the weight division above are domestic guys.

Get a grip ppl.... Fraudley...for fcuk sake

[robpalmer135]

yeh Haye should only fight guys ranked in the top 10 of the WBC or WBA. However i don't think Maloney has the clout to get those guys over here!

[Ilesey]

I think it would be a messy fight that could go either way on points.

[Steve Fox]

Skelton said last year, that Haye should clean up at HW before moving up. I wonder why he said that? The answer being, because he doesn't want to provide batting practice for Haye.

[The Lads]

Skelton hits harder and takes a shot a lot better than JMM. It'd be a good test for Haye at HW, see what he's got at the weight with no weight drain excuses. He'd need to improve his jab at HW, because that little flicking thing wont work against meat heads. It'll also be interesting to see how he does when he faces someone taller. And as for the Skelton test, he may not be the prettiest to watch but he gets the job done, one things for sure, Daves stamina will be tested when he (probably for the first time in his pro career) has someone bigger pushing and pulling him around the ring.

Lets not go overboard on the Haye thing just yet, he's not moving up a division like you do at the lower weights, he's going to be facing guys 40-50 lbs heavier!

[rydersonthestorm]

Who is he going to fight that will be 40-50 pounds heavier ??
Haye has said before he thinks his true weight at heavyweights is 230 pounds so how many top heavyweights weigh in at 270/280??

[The Lads]

Who is he going to fight that will be 40-50 pounds heavier ??
Haye has said before he thinks his true weight at heavyweights is 230 pounds so how many top heavyweights weigh in at 270/280??

He's been fighting at 200lbs, so he'll be facing fighters that are 40-50lbs heavier than the ones he's used to. "He thinks his true weight" - thats like Hatton saying "I'll fight Calzaghe, i think my true weight out of the ring is 168" and everyone saying "oh, okay then"

i understand all the weight issues, drained etc... but your moving up not one weight, but essentially a minimum of 4 (assuming 7-8lbs per weight on average). Its a big difference in so many aspects.

[rydersonthestorm]

He was 217 when he fought bonin at heavyweight and hw would have been heavier if he wasn't coming back down to the 200 limit.
Also your example is poor haye thinks his true fighting weight is 230 pounds not his walk around weight, he is 6'3 ripped as fuck and even at 217 he looked well lean. Even big guys like wlad are only just about 240 so unless your talking about valuev there isn't going to be this massive difference.

[The Lads]

As I said in my last post

He's been fighting at 200lbs, so he'll be facing fighters that are 40-50lbs heavier than the ones he's used to.


These guys have been punching at the weight and taking punches at the weight. The ones that couldnt take them ultimately dropped off over the years. Audley, Olympic gold medalist, shits himself when punches are coming at him, gets knocked out at domestic level. It matters not a jot what Haye says about weight, he needs to be in the ring proving it. He blasted Bonin out of there, but Bonin never landed a shot or got into the contest.

I'd like to see him fight Skelton, Rahman then a title shot. because hayes chin (imo) remains suspect he's only one punch away from hitting the deck.

I'd also like to speak to someone who can explain (idiots guide) how Scott Harrison fights 14lbs heavier than he weighs in, yet has super stamina and chin (as does Hatton), yet Haye adds the same but consistently puts any problems down to the weight. he says his stamina is super, its the weight making issues? Dont get it.

[rydersonthestorm]

I understand what your saying but you don't understand about dropping weight, scott harrison and ricky hatton are fat, they have muscle underneath the fat but they are losing fat when they are training to get down to weight. You wondered why he is called ricky fatton after he fights he goes on a pie and beer diet, david haye weighs about 220+ pounds of solid muscle. The difference is he is losing muscle which is alot harder to do and alot worse for you stamina than losing the beer and junk food fat hatton and harrison put on.

[The Lads]

He's not cutting 20lbs of muscle. I know nothing about it, but he IS NOT cutting muscle! It's fluid, as it is with Hatton and Harriosn - fluid. Do you think harrison is putting on a stone of fat overnight? Fuck me, what would he be doing, whats would he be eating?

[rydersonthestorm]

Yes he is, haye weighs 230 pounds and has to drop 15-20 lbs of muscle, also hatton and harrison are putting on that kind of weight in a couple of weeks becuase they are eating junk food and drinking alot of beer. When hatton is in training he is eating salad and other such foods, when he finish's a fight he goes to massive english breakfast,pie and chips chinese and 10-15 pints of beer a day. Thats how he puts so much weight on in a few weeks, don't say you don't know about something and then make out i am wrong when i actually know.

[The Lads]

You know do you.... Harriosn weighs 126lbs on friday night, when he gets in the ring on Saturday NIGHT he weighs 140lbs +

When hatton weighs in he's 140lbs, when he steps in the ring THE NEXT night he'll be 14 + lbs bigger.

After excess fat Its fluid you lose, you BOIL down.... Im admitting I know nothing about it, but I know the basic physics. Your saying Haye is cutting lean muscle, 20lbs of it? Not fat or fluid but lean solid muscle? Then in the 3 months between fights he's putting 20lbs of muscle back on, then taking it off agian?

So if / when he was fighting every 4 months. he was putting 20lbs of muscle on, taking 20lbs of muscle off. You go down the gym and try and put 20lbs of muscle on without "assistance"

[rydersonthestorm]

Why does david haye weigh 217 pounds and still look as lean at that weight as he does at 200lbs ???
He weighs 230 odd pounds so he has 30 lbs of excess fat and fluid despite being one of the leanest boxers about ??
You seem to forget what your saying, hatton gains back 14 lbs of water weight etc to make him 154, he is 170+ a few weeks after he has fought and looks fat so he is losing 15-20 pounds of fat as well as his water weight.

[dwilson]

Skelton has never been in a exciting fight but it would be a really good test of Haye's credentials at heaveyweight. Skelton is the best of the current British hw scene and although a step below the world champs he would put up he good fight and be a challenge.

Also the fight mighnt get decent exposure for Haye.

[The Lads]

Why does david haye weigh 217 pounds and still look as lean at that weight as he does at 200lbs ???
He weighs 230 odd pounds so he has 30 lbs of excess fat and fluid despite being one of the leanest boxers about ??
You seem to forget what your saying, hatton gains back 14 lbs of water weight etc to make him 154, he is 170+ a few weeks after he has fought and looks fat so he is losing 15-20 pounds of fat as well as his water weight.

The Human body is 65% water and fluid - thats 150lbs of hayes body is fluid. So, out of the remaining organs, tissue etc... there is 80lbs to play with - now youre saying he's losing 20lbs of muscle, a quarter of his remaining body weight??
So, to answer, yes, im saying he's losing water / fluid / fat weight as appose to the muscle weight. I dont understand the science and im hoping someone on here will explain. As I understand its partly down to hydration and diueretics.
I understand what your saying about Hatton, losing fat and water is ten / twenty times easier than losing muscle which is a fucking nightmare, as I understand. As you "know" please explain the science behind gaining and losing 20lbs of muscle.
As I said I know the basics, but I dont know much....

[scurlaruntings]

Why does david haye weigh 217 pounds and still look as lean at that weight as he does at 200lbs ???
He weighs 230 odd pounds so he has 30 lbs of excess fat and fluid despite being one of the leanest boxers about ??
You seem to forget what your saying, hatton gains back 14 lbs of water weight etc to make him 154, he is 170+ a few weeks after he has fought and looks fat so he is losing 15-20 pounds of fat as well as his water weight.Negative.The 30lbs is not excess fats or water.You can make weight correctly by dieting correctly.Essentially what Haye does is to dry out slowly to make weight.His constitution is quite good and he naturally doesnt carry that much excess baggage.But because of the quality of the mass that his affecting IE muscle mass/fast twitch fbres this could hamper his performance when loosing that much weight.To be honest if Haye wanted to make 200 he simply has to not blow up so high inbetween fights.This would be difficult for him though depending on what his natural walking around weight is.

[scurlaruntings]

The Human body is 65% water and fluid - thats 150lbs of hayes body is fluid. So, out of the remaining organs, tissue etc... there is 80lbs to play with - now youre saying he's losing 20lbs of muscle, a quarter of his remaining body weight??
So, to answer, yes, im saying he's losing water / fluid / fat weight as appose to the muscle weight. I dont understand the science and im hoping someone on here will explain. As I understand its partly down to hydration and diueretics.
I understand what your saying about Hatton, losing fat and water is ten / twenty times easier than losing muscle which is a fucking nightmare, as I understand. As you "know" please explain the science behind gaining and losing 20lbs of muscle.
As I said I know the basics, but I dont know much....Hattons case is quite diffrent as he blows up excessively inbetween bouts.He is also a classic Endomorph as opposed to David who is a classic Mesomorph.Hatton has been as high as 180 and he fights at 140.His comfortable walking around weight is probably in the 160lbs region though.Dieting to make 140 from 160 would not affect his peformance unless he lost the weight too quicklly.Which would affect him physically.The remainder of the weight that would be lost closer to fight time would be whatever water is left in the muscle.

[Sundance]

Skelton has never been in a exciting fight but it would be a really good test of Haye's credentials at heaveyweight. Skelton is the best of the current British hw scene and although a step below the world champs he would put up he good fight and be a challenge.

Also the fight mighnt get decent exposure for Haye.


If Haye is as good as he thinks he is then Skelton should be easy meat!


Skelton will be well aware a Fraudley class chin is his achilles.

[TBooze]

If Haye is going to do this, then he needs to look at how Holyfield did it, rather than Spinks.

To start of with a tough journeyman should be his first opponent; Paulo Vidoz would be a good choice. Then perhaps an Oliver McCall should be up. Get though that then perhaps a Rahman or Brewster; this would prepare him for a match with a Ibragimov or Maskaev, which then could lead to Klitschko or who was ever on top at the time.

[rydersonthestorm]

Negative.The 30lbs is not excess fats or water.You can make weight correctly by dieting correctly.Essentially what Haye does is to dry out slowly to make weight.His constitution is quite good and he naturally doesnt carry that much excess baggage.But because of the quality of the mass that his affecting IE muscle mass/fast twitch fbres this could hamper his performance when loosing that much weight.To be honest if Haye wanted to make 200 he simply has to not blow up so high inbetween fights.This would be difficult for him though depending on what his natural walking around weight is.
M8 if you read my posts you will see i was being sarcastic as i told the other poster that he was not losing fat and water as he was lean at 217 pounds, so i was quite correct.

[The Lads]

Virches then Maskaev is doo-able, and possible with WBC backing, and Haye has had their backing big time.

[The Lads]

M8 if you read my posts you will see i was being sarcastic as i told the other poster that he was not losing fat and water as he was lean at 217 pounds, so i was quite correct.

david haye weighs about 220+ pounds of solid muscle. The difference is he is losing muscle which is alot harder to do and alot worse for you stamina

Yes he is, haye weighs 230 pounds and has to drop 15-20 lbs of muscle,


Very sarcastic - least I admit I know nothing about it, and ask for advice. Not say "I KNOW", when clearly I ddnt and cant back it up with science or even facts. What I do know is you DONT lose 20lbs of muscle.

[rydersonthestorm]

Negative.The 30lbs is not excess fats or water..His constitution is quite good and he naturally doesnt carry that much excess baggage.But because of the quality of the mass that his affecting IE muscle mass/fast twitch fbres this could hamper his performance when loosing that much weight.
He weighs 230 odd pounds so he has 30 lbs of excess fat and fluid despite being one of the leanest boxers about ?? called sarcasm

[madpup]

Virches then Maskaev is doo-able, and possible with WBC backing, and Haye has had their backing big time.

Virchis may fight at snale's pace, but the guy has an fantastic chin and massive power. I don't think that is a good match-up for Haye early on.

[The Lads]

Aye, I think haye could maybe keep him at bay for the 12, although I do agree he should look lowe down the ladder first. I'd go lower than Skelton if I were him to be honest. Mcdermott maybe. However Soliman at the WBC thinks a lot of him, he couldnt praise him enough at the convention in Croatia last year, thats when Soliman told the handlers of Bell & Mormeck if they didnt get their rematch sorted by March, Haye would fight Bell or Bell would bebe stripped. If you look at how long it took eastman to get his WBC shot - speaks volumes.

[Sundance]

Virchis may fight at snale's pace, but the guy has an fantastic chin and massive power. I don't think that is a good match-up for Haye early on.


We're hearing Haye is the best thing since sliced bread from his fans, so Virchis would be a logical opponent? If he's going to side step Skelton, then the next fight is against a Virchis, Povetkin, Dimitrenko... All these guys are currently above Haye in the HW food chain and have serious KO power.

Gauranteed Maloney has Haye fight bums of the month in a old style Bruno campaign, that might finish with a Skelton match and a spurious claim on #1 contender status. Maloney can't risk that chin against punchers like Virchis, but hey Haye is another Lewis, right? :huh

[Cobbler]

Gauranteed Maloney has Haye fight bums of the month in a old style Bruno campaign, that might finish with a Skelton match and a spurious claim on #1 contender status. Maloney can't risk that chin against punchers like Virchis, but hey Haye is another Lewis, right? :huh

Yeah, exactly like he did at Cruiserweight. Oh wait....

[Sundance]

Yeah, exactly like he did at Cruiserweight. Oh wait....


Mate, Cruiserweight is a little pussy division with next to no money in it. Always has been! Some of the duds that have had belts at this so called weight...:lol: Holyfield is the only marquee name to ever come out of that division, so be serious. HW is Premier League and Cruiser League 1.:hi:

[Cobbler]

Lucky that no duds have ever won titles in the Premier League Heavyweight Division....

[Sundance]

Lucky that no duds have ever won titles in the Premier League Heavyweight Division....


Yeah, bonkers Bruno and one or two others to forget :oops: Still, made big money for his glass chin and robot dance.

[The Lads]

Bruno would hang with the guys that are around our days. Must admit I didnt feel he would, till I reviewed a lot of his fights following a discussion on here - also read his book, worth a read.

"Bonkers bruno" - very classy towards mental health, lets hope nobody in your family ever suffers from it, even worse if their first name begins with B

[Words]

haye is far too fast and too mobile for Old Man Skelton to catch clean.

[The Lads]

Why bother with Skelton. Haye IS world class. Skelton's a domestic fighter and nothing more

Haye is a world class heavyweight, already?

Took Holy 2 years to fight for a title at the weight, you need to grow into the division. Too much, too soon will spell didaster for the Hayemaker, he has a minimum of 10 years left at heavy if he wants.

[scurlaruntings]

Skelton would maul Haye right now you best believe it.Skelton may be crude and ungamely but his no cabbage and has a solid beard.If he gets close to Haye which he will and Hayes conditioning doesnt improve with the move up in weight he gets demolished.Too many of you rookies are ready to jump on the next big thing.

[The Lads]

Mr Payne pens a good article on his site...


[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[scurlaruntings]

no he fucking wouldn't. Skelton has never been in with anyone as good as Haye. The closest was a seriously diminished Danny Williams.

i am not saying Haye is a world-class HW, I am saying he is world-class in terms of skills.This may be the case but Skelton is a BONAFIDE heavyweight who CAN punch.Haye can punch but currently the jury is out on him as his only had techinically 2 fights at the weight.Neither of which gave us an accurate assesement as to how good he can be at heavy.

[scurlaruntings]

I don't think Skelton does punch particularly hard. I think he wears his opponents down by grappling and leaning on them, before he punches a few times.

Eventually, they get so worn out, they can't stay up. I don't see Skelton having any chance of winning this - he could mix with Danny because Danny was too heavy and didn't have the reach to hold Skelton off. Haye has that, the skill AND the power.

If Skelton's plan is to bully him, well Haye's way too big for that. if it's to outwork him on the inside, it's not gonna happen and if it's to knock him spark out: he doesn't bang hard enough. how many one-punch kos has he ever had?

And, anyway, Haye's only had one fight at the weight.Watch what he did to that human cup cake John McDermott.Once you have watched come back and reply to my post.

[sean]

Skelton would maul Haye right now you best believe it.Skelton may be crude and ungamely but his no cabbage and has a solid beard.If he gets close to Haye which he will and Hayes conditioning doesnt improve with the move up in weight he gets demolished.Too many of you rookies are ready to jump on the next big thing.

i agree

haye would have to land flush and ko skelton to win .


if haye lands flush and skelton walked through it , skelton would proceed to do what he does best and would maul haye and tire him out.

[scurlaruntings]

i watched that fight live. I wouldn't have said that he was any more than pushed. he wasn't hurt or out of it - the ref stopped it really bizarrely.

The fat fucker just couldn't keep his balance. those certainly weren't heavy hits and they don't really prove your point.

All Skelton has going for him is that he's tough and fit. but he has no coordination, a poor jab, no actual skills and almost zero footwork.You sure you watched it? John got creamed and suffered 3 brutal knockdowns in that bout.The 1st punch Skelton landed put Big John on the deck.Everyone is well aware that Skelton is crude even Skelton himself knows this and doesnt deny it.But the bottom line is he can hurt people and he continues to win. 21 wins with 18 by KO is a very nice record for a guy pushing 40.

[The Lads]

I don't think Skelton does punch particularly hard. I think he wears his opponents down by grappling and leaning on them, before he punches a few times.

Eventually, they get so worn out, they can't stay up. I don't see Skelton having any chance of winning this - he could mix with Danny because Danny was too heavy and didn't have the reach to hold Skelton off. Haye has that, the skill AND the power.

If Skelton's plan is to bully him, well Haye's way too big for that. if it's to outwork him on the inside, it's not gonna happen and if it's to knock him spark out: he doesn't bang hard enough. how many one-punch kos has he ever had?

And, anyway, Haye's only had one fight at the weight.

I dont want to sound offensive, but im surprised at how some people on here think moving from cruiser to heavy is the same as moving from feather to super feather.

Lets name the people whove made the transition properly!!!!!

Hayes jab is wank, and his chin is suspect - not ideal for the heavy division, but then the bandwagon has to roll on, doesnt it?

[scurlaruntings]

I dont want to sound offensive, but im surprised at how some people on here think moving from cruiser to heavy is the same as moving from feather to super feather.

Lets name the people whove made the transition properly!!!!!

Hayes jab is wank, and his chin is suspect - not ideal for the heavy division, but then the bandwagon has to roll on, doesnt it?:lol: That about sums it up!:good

[DavidPayne]

Thanks for the link The Lads.

Skelton isn't a puncher. He just suffocates you until the only escape is the canvas. Rare you seem him shake a heavyweight. A fighter with a solid jab and stamina should beat him.

Whether Haye fits that catergory remains to be seen. Mormeck closed the gap effectively and worked Haye on the inside, Haye wont be able to nullify Skelton by pushing him back in the way he did Mormeck.

I'd back Haye's quality over Skelton will, but I wouldn't be looking for SKelton in my next fight at heavyweight.

[Steve Fox]

Haye will be able to land at will against Skelton, and there's no way he will be able to just walk through them. Haye will stop him in four.