The pre-existing cut in Taylor's mouth: did it cost him the fight?

[sweet_scientist]

I know this is an 'if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle' type of thing, but nevertheless:

Did the cut Taylor have in his mouth going into the fight with Chavez cost him the fight?

The cut might have influenced the fight in 3 ways:

1. Making Taylor uncomfortable and distracting him.
2. Causing him to fade down the stretch as he lost so much blood.
3. Making Richard Steele more likely to stop the fight given that he stopped the fight mainly due to Taylor's condition rather than Taylor not responding to Steele (Steele said he stopped it prmarily due to Taylor's condition rather than his failure to answer him).

I know Chavez broke his orbital bone and swelled him up grotesquely regardless, but did the cut mouth factor in to the stoppage? Would have been stopped without it?

[omega dega Doom]

I know this is an 'if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle' type of thing, but nevertheless:

Did the cut Taylor have in his mouth going into the fight with Chavez cost him the fight?

The cut might have influenced the fight in 3 ways:

1. Making Taylor uncomfortable and distracting him.
2. Causing him to fade down the stretch as he lost so much blood.
3. Making Richard Steele more likely to stop the fight given that he stopped the fight mainly due to Taylor's condition rather than Taylor not responding to Steele (Steele said he stopped it prmarily due to Taylor's condition rather than his failure to answer him).

I know Chavez broke his orbital bone and swelled him up grotesquely regardless, but did the cut mouth factor in to the stoppage? Would have been stopped without it?good question? but if Taylor would have taken that in consideration then we might not have seen such a great fight? think like this..... if Taylor would have ran he would have no chance of winning whatsoever! taylor was true warrior and probably the fastest hands Boxer in history but he fought with too much heart sometimes instead of strategy!

[salsanchezfan]

I know this is an 'if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle' type of thing, but nevertheless:

Did the cut Taylor have in his mouth going into the fight with Chavez cost him the fight?

The cut might have influenced the fight in 3 ways:

1. Making Taylor uncomfortable and distracting him.
2. Causing him to fade down the stretch as he lost so much blood.
3. Making Richard Steele more likely to stop the fight given that he stopped the fight mainly due to Taylor's condition rather than Taylor not responding to Steele (Steele said he stopped it prmarily due to Taylor's condition rather than his failure to answer him).

I know Chavez broke his orbital bone and swelled him up grotesquely regardless, but did the cut mouth factor in to the stoppage? Would have been stopped without it?


........Interesting question.

I guess I would have to say "no" to scenario one, as if there was anything to make Taylor uncomfortable, it was hooks to the body, rights to the head, just the stuff all fighters have to endure. For a tough nut like Taylor, such a thing shouldn't have been that much of a worry. That said, what could have made him uncomfortable (i.e., sick) was the pint of blood he supposedly swallowed during the fight. Makes me ill just to think of it.

For scenario number two, reference my last comments above. Very possible. He lost a lot of blood.

I don't think Steele was prompted to stop the fight based on the cut or the appearance it gave Taylor. He'd looked like hell for a few rounds, and it didn't seem a stoppable "offense" if you will.

[sweet_scientist]

........Interesting question.

I guess I would have to say "no" to scenario one, as if there was anything to make Taylor uncomfortable, it was hooks to the body, rights to the head, just the stuff all fighters have to endure. For a tough nut like Taylor, such a thing shouldn't have been that much of a worry. That said, what could have made him uncomfortable (i.e., sick) was the pint of blood he supposedly swallowed during the fight. Makes me ill just to think of it.

For scenario number two, reference my last comments above. Very possible. He lost a lot of blood.

I don't think Steele was prompted to stop the fight based on the cut or the appearance it gave Taylor. He'd looked like hell for a few rounds, and it didn't seem a stoppable "offense" if you will.

Do you think it was a case of Steele stopping the fight because Taylor didn't respond Sal?

A reason why I think he didn't stop it for that reason is because he was just about ready to stop the fight as soon as the second question left his mouth. He didn't exactly wait for an answer. As he said after the fight he was concerned about Taylor's condition mainly. What does condition mean? Is it the swelling, the blood, the punishment he was taking, or is it his unresponsiveness?

[sweet_scientist]

good question? but if Taylor would have taken that in consideration then we might not have seen such a great fight? think like this..... if Taylor would have ran he would have no chance of winning whatsoever! taylor was true warrior and probably the fastest hands Boxer in history but he fought with too much heart sometimes instead of strategy!

I agree with you, Taylor did what he needed to win. He could have perhaps ran the last round or two, but I'm not sure that that doesn't make him more vulnerable to Chavez than standing his ground and keeping him off balance with quick flurries. A case of the best form of defense being offense I think. I don't fancy Taylor's chances of keeping CHavez off him on the back foot without his high output. His defensive technique wasn't good enough for that.

[warchild]

I agree with you, Taylor did what he needed to win. He could have perhaps ran the last round or two, but I'm not sure that that doesn't make him more vulnerable to Chavez than standing his ground and keeping him off balance with quick flurries. A case of the best form of defense being offense I think. I don't fancy Taylor's chances of keeping CHavez off him on the back foot without his high output. His defensive technique wasn't good enough for that.

That's a good point. I too have doubts as to wether Taylor would have had as much success if he had tried to move more....that might have been a problem, as Chavez was very calculated, accurate, and focused that night.

As for the cut....the cut didn't cost Taylor the fight....his leaky defense and lack of upper body movement cost him the fight. Everyone has a theory as to why victory was so unfairly snatched away from Taylor in such a cruel manner, but maybe, just maybe, if he got hit a few less times, he would have arrived at a different outcome.

[TBooze]

Chavez deserved the win, the cut did not help Taylor's cause, but from my little interaction with boxers, I have yet to meet one who has gone into a fight 100% fit.

The truth is if it was a 15 rounder (which it should of been) people would be merely talking about an excellent fight where both fighters gave it their all, Chavez proving himself Mexico's finest ever, Taylor that he had substance to go with his style.

[My dinner with Conteh]

Steele stopped the fight because Taylor wasn't Chavez.

[My dinner with Conteh]

By the way, I've no qualms with the stoppage. :p

[sweet_scientist]

:lol:

[My dinner with Conteh]

;)

[Sizzle]

Steele stopped the fight because he's a fucking dumb cunt.

[My dinner with Conteh]

I've never really gone for this "are you ok?" stuff myself. Many a fighter has said 'yes' when they obviously haven't been able to scratch their arses. If Chvez had been floored (and ahead on points) Steel would have just looked at him without asking him the question I reckon.

[TBooze]

Steele stopped the fight because he's a fucking dumb cunt.

Actually it is because he is a rather good ref, who has got the most important '0' a ref can have... no ring deaths.

Better to stop a fight a dozen punches too early (there can always be a rematch, like Chavez and Taylor did) than one punch too late.

[My dinner with Conteh]

Actually it is because he is a rather good ref, who has got the most important '0' a ref can have... no ring deaths.

Better to stop a fight a dozen punches too early (there can always be a rematch, like Chavez and Taylor did) than one punch too late.


This is fair. He was a very good ref...then he seemed to become King's boy in the 1990s and let himself down.

[salsanchezfan]

Do you think it was a case of Steele stopping the fight because Taylor didn't respond Sal?

A reason why I think he didn't stop it for that reason is because he was just about ready to stop the fight as soon as the second question left his mouth. He didn't exactly wait for an answer. As he said after the fight he was concerned about Taylor's condition mainly. What does condition mean? Is it the swelling, the blood, the punishment he was taking, or is it his unresponsiveness?



.............My honest opinion is that when Steele is on his deathbed, he'll admit to having a bit of a brainfart that night. I think he just felt the excitement and drama of a tense situation in which he had to make a decision, and he slipped. I really don't think there's any more to it than that.

[la-califa]

I think he will be satisfied that out there somewhere Meldrick Taylor is walking around and not in a nearly forgotten twenty year old grave someplace.

[salsanchezfan]

I think he will be satisfied that out there somewhere Meldrick Taylor is walking around and not in a nearly forgotten twenty year old grave someplace.


............Not sure I understand. Is this implying Steele has complicity in Taylor's condition? I can;t see that.

[la-califa]

A referee's job is the well being of a fighter. Taylor's eye's were blank. If Steele sent Taylor out again He could have gotten seriously injured. A little known fact. the referee of the Mancini-Kim fight killed himself not long after the bout... It's an on the spot judgement call which could mean life & death.

[salsanchezfan]

A referee's job is the well being of a fighter. Taylor's eye's were blank. If Steele sent Taylor out again He could have gotten seriously injured. A little known fact. the referee of the Mancini-Kim fight killed himself not long after the bout... It's an on the spot judgement call which could mean life & death.


........Oh, you're saying his actions could have saved Taylor's life. Okay, fair enough.

[quintonjacksonfan]

Duva telling him he had to win the 12th round cost him the fight

[TBooze]

Duva telling him he had to win the 12th round cost him the fight

Lou did his job, I think people forget, that even if that final belt rang Taylor would of only won a split decision.

[Thread Stealer]

Duva telling him he had to win the 12th round cost him the fight

You can never tell with judges, especially in Vegas, however Duva getting on the ring apron is another story.

It seemed as if he distracted Taylor and that Taylor was looking at him while Steele was asking him questions.