View Full Version : What if boxers fought with those 4-ounce MMA gloves?
john garfield
07-03-2007, 10:22 PM
How would it change the pro game?
Most fights would end inside the first 2 rounds. Far more KOs, shorter careers, more upsets, earlier retirements, WAY less pugilistic dementia, more deaths/lifelong vegetables...imo.
ravtrav
07-03-2007, 10:27 PM
everybody would have a glass chin
El Presidente
07-03-2007, 10:46 PM
blocking would be less useful. i think it could only be more exciting.. imagine the body shots!BAAAAAAAAAaM!!!!
twenty1
07-03-2007, 10:48 PM
It Would'nt Be Boxing Then..........stop Trying To Impose Your Mma Fantasies On Us!!!!!
twenty1
07-03-2007, 10:48 PM
It Would'nt Be Boxing Then..........stop Trying To Impose Your Mma Fantasies On Us!!!!!
sues2nd
07-03-2007, 10:48 PM
everybody would have a glass chin
:lol:
Word for word what I was thinking when I read the title of the post....
it would be a lot better,,, bak in the day the gloves were only like 5 ounce or something,,, like look at those little gloves from sugar ray robinson era or joe louis they look way thinner and more flexible like u can actually open ur hand with them,,, also if boxing was fought with those mma gloves i do not think that there would be more death/ serious injury because in MMA there is WAYYYYYYY less injuries / death/ vegetables than in boxing ,, actually just think of how many boxers have died in the last ten years,,,tons,, now think about how many guys from pride and ufc have died in last ten years... none!
its safer to be knocked out quickly than to be constantly jabbed for 12 rounds
just thought again,, it might get a little upseting because all the ppv's would finish too quick and u wouldnt get your moneys worth,, so thats a downside
Nah not true really, as most boxing deaths result as a case of accumulated punishment, and with these gloves there would be no accumulated punishment, more quick KO's though. There have 0 deaths in MMA.
Actually 1 death if I recall, in Ukraine somewhere. Guy apparently didn't have a clean bill of health going in to the fight though.
In MMA a lot of guys get tapped out or mauled, and so we can't really directly compare the results as if it WAS only boxing with little gloves.
Goose
07-03-2007, 11:05 PM
Nah not true really, as most boxing deaths result as a case of accumulated punishment, and with these gloves there would be no accumulated punishment, more quick KO's though. There have 0 deaths in MMA.
bingo
but those MMA gloves do have alot of padding on them around the knuckles area, so its not that of a dramatic change from light boxing gloves
nervousxtian
07-03-2007, 11:28 PM
Not this bullshit about MMA again. MMA isn't safe, either is boxing.. to pretend it is stupid. You sound like the damn cigarette companies.
We don't know the full on long term effects of MMA on fighters.. because there's not as much data as it's became more popular.. we won't know the full picture for awhile.
It's true, boxing has more deaths than MMA. It's something that needs to be worked on, but it's an entertainment sport, and quick stoppages are not popular with fans.
I think one big thing that needs to happen is that corners need to take a better interest in their fighters health... too many aren't willing to thrown in the towel for their fighter.
ibragimovfan
07-03-2007, 11:58 PM
then we'd have three second fights and huge "upsets" where a wild punch lands and its over. its retarded. fuck that.
Beebs
07-04-2007, 12:01 AM
It wouldn't be all that different from boxing a few decades ago, have you people ever seen a glove from the 20s or even 40s?
And a big fucking :lol: at the people who say "it wouldn't be boxing". So, Sullivan etc weren't boxers because they didn't wear 10oz gloves?
would it change the pro game?
No. Because they don't really hit each other. :smoke
Dostoevsky
07-04-2007, 03:55 AM
I think boxing gloves should be downsized to maybe 8oz.
The gloves now are ridiclous, 12oz? who the fuck wants to watch a pillow fight. The excitement of boxing starting to slip due to these massive pillo....oh, gloves.
There would also be far far fewer deaths with smaller gloves.
Krippy
07-04-2007, 04:03 AM
I think boxing gloves should be downsized to maybe 8oz.
The gloves now are ridiclous, 12oz? who the fuck wants to watch a pillow fight. The excitement of boxing starting to slip due to these massive pillo....oh, gloves.
There would also be far far fewer deaths with smaller gloves.
:huh Care to elaborate?
Dostoevsky
07-04-2007, 04:07 AM
Elaborate on what?
The less deaths part?
theunderdog
07-04-2007, 05:01 AM
.....malinaggi would no longer have a jaw, vitali and vargas would no longer have an eye, zab would no longer be able to reproduce... among other things
Shake
07-04-2007, 05:02 AM
Well, a knockout is nothing but a safety mechanism by the body -- you're being hurt too much, stop what you're doing. A knockout usually accomplishes just that in a boxing or MMA-ring.
Prolonged blows cushioned is a far greater health risk.
Shake
07-04-2007, 05:03 AM
That said, I shiver at the thought of Lennox Lewis with 4oz gloves.
Shake
07-04-2007, 05:08 AM
Because... Jack Johnson and co knew how to defend themselves?
Because...they were defending against a single kind of attack, from the hands of their opponent, instead of low kicks/high kicks/punches/takedowns/headbutts/standing chokeholds/leglocks/armlocks/etc?
Because...MMA fighters pretty much suck at boxing?
Shake
07-04-2007, 05:19 AM
Way to try and come off as an intellectual. :roll:
What is your point, exactly?
Shake
07-04-2007, 05:29 AM
I haven't seen anything complex so far. I think one guy tried to bring some kind of philosofical concept into a discussion about boxing, but besides that, pretty straight-forward.
Dostoevsky
07-04-2007, 05:55 AM
rather than assume a bunch of complex notions, we come right back to the simplest conclusion. MMA fighters have glass jaws.
Another simple conclusion would be that your ignorant and a complete fucktard.
Thats a better one.
:good
DonPrestige
07-04-2007, 06:08 AM
Because... Jack Johnson and co knew how to defend themselves?
Because...they were defending against a single kind of attack, from the hands of their opponent, instead of low kicks/high kicks/punches/takedowns/headbutts/standing chokeholds/leglocks/armlocks/etc?
Because...MMA fighters pretty much suck at boxing?
I think this is pretty much spot on, it would still be boxing with a few more knockouts. To be honest I think that for boxing 4 ounce gloves are too small but smewhere in between is better due to the point that there is a reason boxing gloves got bigger in the first place, protection. But the gloves these days are rediculous sometimes.
dwilson
07-04-2007, 06:20 AM
It would be nice to see a reduction on glove size but 4oz would be too big of a step at the moment. It would lead to very exiting and short fights but your technitions and skillfull boxers would lose out big time. Imagine some of the big recent fights if they had been fought with the use of this size glove?
Vantage_West
07-04-2007, 08:49 AM
everybody would have a glass chinnot sure boxers are used to tons of punishment which prepares them for a shot and does train the chin.
but remember why boxing changed to hese gloves is becuase it broke hands easy easy easy...
thats why i feel like it wont be as good becuase combo's will be less useful and will be more of a clinch fest than anything to not get hit
Vantage_West
07-04-2007, 08:52 AM
Nah not true really, as most boxing deaths result as a case of accumulated punishment, and with these gloves there would be no accumulated punishment, more quick KO's though. There have 0 deaths in MMA.true but what killed men earlier was accumilated punishment as well with small gloves smaller gloves just helps the cause bareknuckle would be different as there is a slight rareity to put all your wieght onto the punch
Vantage_West
07-04-2007, 08:59 AM
actually think about the cultural things about this it would do to boxing.
what boxing is famous for is those 12oz leather gloves it's a symbol of boxing. to change them would get rid of it's original gloves there is a reason why bareknuckle fighters arent regarded as boxers becuase it was a different sport think about all this evolution of boxing just to be thrown out becuase peolpe want to see to untrained brawlers go toe to toe.
young kids wouldnt be able to join a gym becuase it's to rough it woulod destroy the basic group/intake/base that would join a gym.
why boxing would only be a tougman contest
Dostoevsky
07-04-2007, 09:19 AM
Well your wrong for a start.....12oz gloves aren't a symbol of boxing in anyway. The 12oz gloves are actually a recent adition
Before it was 10oz gloves in the 80's and before that 8oz gloves.
20's,30's and 40's were 6oz i believe.
the 12oz glove is something recently added, there are even calls to make heavyweight gloves 14oz.
Which is just ridiculous.
Dempsey1238
09-21-2007, 01:38 AM
Boxing would turn skill wise back into the early 1900's imo. Boxers be fighting with the same size gloves that Gans or Dixon fought.
Sizzle
09-21-2007, 01:50 AM
Some factors are being overlooked;
1/ Fighters will be able to throw a lot more punches
2/ Fighters will be able to throw faster punches
3/ Facial mutilation would increase signficantly - Remember how Joe Louis made his opponents look? We'd be seeing that a lot more often.
In terms of overall safety I'm not convinced boxers will be better off with smaller gloves.
I say stick with 8-12oz
Blacc Jesus
09-21-2007, 01:50 AM
everybody would have a glass chin
:lol:
nezy37
09-21-2007, 02:44 AM
Fighters would be breaking their hands all the time
achillesthegreat
09-21-2007, 03:28 AM
Boxers need to not go past 8oz gloves upto 154 and 10 oz up to heavy. If it gets past that boxing will begin to die. Hatton wearing 10oz gloves looked awful.
Gloves need to stop becomign even more protective. Even with not changing weight they are becoming huge i.e. grant, winning and now reyes and everlast have done it too.
jordan230420
09-21-2007, 05:15 AM
naw, they would be dead first. No one would ever get past the jab
yeah, wladimir wouldnt have a glass jaw cuz it wouldve been knocked into the stands in the first brewster fight
BewareofDawg
09-21-2007, 07:34 AM
How would it change the pro game?
There would be a long list of deceased fighters, aka Wlad's resume :deal
BewareofDawg
09-21-2007, 07:35 AM
yeah, wladimir wouldnt have a glass jaw cuz it wouldve been knocked into the stands in the first brewster fight
:lol: Brewster didn't land a punch until the last round! Brewster would have been dead after the first :deal
Wilhelm
09-21-2007, 07:56 AM
How is everybody missing this? The reason there is not brain damage in MMA matches is because of the RULES, not the GLOVES. It's not like people who get knocked own in boxing are somehow "less knocked down" in boxing than in MMA because of the gloves, it's because once they're knocked down they're no longer hit and given around 15 seconds from the time they're knocked down to the time they have to worry about getting hit. They recover, the fight goes on, and they take more punishment and get brain damage. The same thing would happen with smaller gloves if the rules stayed the same. Imagine if the ref had to stop the fight every time someone got knocked down and so hurt just enough to not be able to fend off more punches. Boxers would hardly get knocked down more than once in a fight.
In terms of how fighting would change, I think it would be a lot slower paced and would look more like Cory Spinks or John Ruiz than anything. If individual punches carried so much more power and were so much tougher to see/block then guys would be a lot less willing to take punches to give them and would be a lot more defensive/clinch minded. The boring 150 round style of the olden days would be back again.
I think they should be smaller than they are now, but I don't think they need to get THAT much smaller.
bulakenyo
09-21-2007, 08:51 AM
the preferred boxing stance would return to the old school styles of jack johnson and Co.
the stance would be almost facing completely sideways to your opponent, and with your weight on the back foot, your head and torso slightly tilted backwards and with both arms positioned around the ribs area.
one punch stoppages would be more common. a peek a boo style wouldnt work that well anymore. fights would have a slower, more defensive minded and counterpunching pace. potshotting and 1-2s would be more common, instead of 5-6 punch combinations. and all out slugfests would not be used as a tactic unless absolutely desperate.
it would look a bit like james toney's style.
TheFlyingMan
09-21-2007, 08:55 AM
Some great posts at the end...
bulakenyo, can I ask why the stance would change in that way, especially with the arms around the ribs? Do you mean that fighters would start relying on head movement now that the gloves are not big enough to cover the head?
bulakenyo
09-21-2007, 09:07 AM
absolutely. head and body movement.
PBF and JToney employ this stance (sideview) so they have less areas exposed to be hit. the only areas completely exposed are his shoulders.
his jabbing arm can block the body shots, his shoulder rolls can deflect head shots, and with his weight on his back foot, he can lean his whole upper body backwards, with only his hips and part of his back exposed (below the belt and kidney punches are illegal, right?)
the lead right straight would also have more snap and quickness using this stance. look at PBF and Toney.
TheFlyingMan
09-21-2007, 10:02 AM
beautiful, thanks for that.
Burundanga
09-21-2007, 10:41 AM
the preferred boxing stance would return to the old school styles of jack johnson and Co.
the stance would be almost facing completely sideways to your opponent, and with your weight on the back foot, your head and torso slightly tilted backwards and with both arms positioned around the ribs area.
one punch stoppages would be more common. a peek a boo style wouldnt work that well anymore. fights would have a slower, more defensive minded and counterpunching pace. potshotting and 1-2s would be more common, instead of 5-6 punch combinations. and all out slugfests would not be used as a tactic unless absolutely desperate.
it would look a bit like james toney's style.
Aside from facing almost completely sideways it sure does sound exactly like Chuck Liddell's style....
box03
09-21-2007, 01:55 PM
If boxers started using 4 oz gloves there would be more shattered hands because unlike ufc fighters boxers do punch with a extreme amount of force behind there punches, less padding less protection. I remember about 5 or 6 years ago my dad took me to a gym were Michael Moorer was training in Pittsburgh, I was amazed by how hard he hit the punching bag and when he was sparring the power he had was unbelievable, if any MMA guy seen what I seen that day they would of pissed themselves if someone told them to get in the ring with him. I know its two different sports but to be honest if Moorer hit one them with one punch I really think it would be over, anybody that disagrees go to a good boxers open training session and see for yourself.
Burundanga
09-21-2007, 02:24 PM
If boxers started using 4 oz gloves there would be more shattered hands because unlike ufc fighters boxers do punch with a extreme amount of force behind there punches, less padding less protection. I remember about 5 or 6 years ago my dad took me to a gym were Michael Moorer was training in Pittsburgh, I was amazed by how hard he hit the punching bag and when he was sparring the power he had was unbelievable, if any MMA guy seen what I seen that day they would of pissed themselves if someone told them to get in the ring with him. I know its two different sports but to be honest if Moorer hit one them with one punch I really think it would be over, anybody that disagrees go to a good boxers open training session and see for yourself.
dude. so are you stating with a straight face that "UFC" fighters (surely you mean mma) don't punch with extreme force? what about muay thai fighters? have boxers cornered the market on size, strength, power and technique?
children like yourself who make such foolish statements have lost all credibility when reasonable people are discussing reasonable subjects.
maybe your daddy give you a ride to an mma or muay thai training facility so you can see the heavy bag go boom when it gets hit.
codeman99998
09-21-2007, 02:39 PM
Really? Everyone would get KO'd inside of 2 rounds? Really?
I know fighters in the old days weren't exactly the same near super human athletes that the fighters of today are, but when I look at the boxing gloves that Jack Dempsey used, the boxing gloves that Gene Tunney used, I'm not all too convinced that they were much heavier than MMA gloves.
Jack Johnson was a tough puncher, and he went over 20 rounds with Moran using TINY gloves by today's standards.
Stop overrating these guy's punching power. They aren't GODS, they are human beings, and it's not like they would be KOing each other all the time with one punch if they weren't wearing boxing gloves.
box03
09-21-2007, 02:47 PM
dude. so are you stating with a straight face that "UFC" fighters (surely you mean mma) don't punch with extreme force? what about muay thai fighters? have boxers cornered the market on size, strength, power and technique?
children like yourself who make such foolish statements have lost all credibility when reasonable people are discussing reasonable subjects.
maybe your daddy give you a ride to an mma or muay thai training facility so you can see the heavy bag go boom when it gets hit. I watched my friends hit the bag and they been involved in Mua thai for close to 3 years now and none of them know how to punch with any force, Im 22 and I could say with a straight face I hit harder than most of the guys I seen fight in ufc. I will say the friends I sparred with that are involved in muay thai have amazing stamina, just lack any type of real power in there punches.
codeman99998
09-21-2007, 02:52 PM
I watched my friends hit the bag and they been involved in Mua thai for close to 3 years now and none of them know how to punch with any force, Im 22 and I could say with a straight face I hit harder than most of the guys I seen fight in ufc. I will say the friends I sparred with that are involved in muay thai have amazing stamina, just lack any type of real power in there punches.
Lol.
You could say it with a straight face, sure, but that's only because you are stupid, not because you are right.
Honestly, you do not punch harder than the professional strikers in the UFC. Get real man. If Ding said that I'd take it at face value immediately, because he is a top cruiserweight, of course he does. If Vicious Boxer said that, of course I'd believe him, have you SEEN his right hand? But you?
Who is you?
box03
09-21-2007, 03:03 PM
Lol.
You could say it with a straight face, sure, but that's only because you are stupid, not because you are right.
Honestly, you do not punch harder than the professional strikers in the UFC. Get real man. If Ding said that I'd take it at face value immediately, because he is a top cruiserweight, of course he does. If Vicious Boxer said that, of course I'd believe him, have you SEEN his right hand? But you?
Who is you? Vicious is no joke I seen him hitting bag on u tube. But seriously I been training in boxing for about 9 years now off and on, and while there is a few guys that would give me a hard time in the boxing ring but for the most part these guys lack basic boxing ability, I seen them throw punches I could of countered with my eyes closed. I never said I could get in the octagon and kick there ass, all Im saying is I do have a boxing background and it is doubtful that most of them with limited boxing ability could step in the ring with me and beat me just like it would be very doubtful that I could step in the octagon and beat them.
codeman99998
09-21-2007, 03:13 PM
Chuck Lidell and Anderson Silva and Fedor Emelianenko and George St. Pierre and Mauricio Rua and Rampage Jackson are no Mike Tyson or Lennox Lewis, not by a long shot.
But they can still punch very hard, is all I am saying. Their boxing might suck, seriously, sometimes it is atrocious. In a boxing match, most of the time, I would only give these fighters "a puncher's chance".
But I do give them a puncher's chance, and the reason I do is because they do have very real power.
I wouldn't be surprised if a non-championship caliber fighter could beat them in a boxing match or KO them in a boxing match. But that doesn't mean that they don't generate a lot of power in their punches.
It's very possible, and probably likely, that the hardest puncher in the history of the world never had or had a very unsuccessful boxing career. Lots of punching power does not immediately equal a good boxer. It is not a slight to boxing to admit that the some of the top MMA fighters have powerful punches, it doesn't mean they would stand a chance in a boxing ring.
Look at Sam Peter.
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