Williams really not getting the props he deserves...

[kirk]

For beating margarito...

Margarito was being billed as the most feared man in the division... he fucking LEVELED cintron (you know... the guy everyone was riding even AFTER this happened because he put some nice KO's together against limited opposition)

Paul Williams goes out there and takes Margaritos title in a war...

and yet somehow Cintron, Clottey, Mosley, ect... seem to get more attention then williams.

I have no problem with people ranking mayweather and cotto above williams, (because cotto beat mosley) but unless you have those two above him, williams is the true #1 of the best division in boxing.

If cotto would have done that, judah would have done that, ect, ect... people would be riding them hardcore.

Hell... cotto got more attention and props for beating JUDAH... then williams beating margarito. Both margarito and williams would crush judah in much similar fashion... at 147lbs, beating margarito was a much better task then beating judah.

I dont know.... i know i keep pushing williams, i guess i just wish he would get a little more play from people as far as being one of the best in the division. I cant believe people are picking cintron and clottey to beat him if they ever fought...

Just remember i said this... Paul Williams is the truth, and is #1 at 147 below the champ mayweather... and if mayweather really IS inactive in all of 2008... and williams puts some impressive victories together, maybe beating clottey, cintron, mosley (i dont see that fight happening) or a margarito rematch... he will really cement his place.

[MacManJr.]

I think Williams is overrated because of his size. I don't think he beats Floyd or Cotto.

[fatdrunkenslob]

As far as I am concerned Williams should be ranked on top at 147. Margarito was the true champ at 147 but Judah ducked him after his demolition of Cintron or Margo would have held all the belts up to his defeat at the hands of Williams.
Judah's team knew Margo would have beat the living hell out of him so they avoided unifying with Tony. Cotto has looked pretty impressive as well and has a bigger name so a case can be made that him and Williams reside at the top of the division right now. The only chance Margarito has of getting back into the picture quickly is by taking that belt off Cintron or defeating Cotto next year.

[PH|LLA]

Margo wasn't getting his props and has passed the torch to Williams. That being said both Cotto and Mosley deserve the props they are getting.

I personally don't think Cintron is getting much attention at all.

[kirk]

I think Williams is overrated because of his size. I don't think he beats Floyd or Cotto.

Who really is overating him? im one of the few that i have seen call him the best... or near the best at 147.

He may not beat floyd or cotto (i think he does... though id be rooting for cotto) but how exactly is that overated? losing to two of the best, one being a truly great... i dont see how that makes you overated, especially when nobody is even ranking him where he DOES belong (yes there are a few... but main 147 attention is on mosley, cintron, mayweather, cotto, margarito)

And ill tell you why i rate him as high as i do.... (first id say he should be ranked high by most everyone cuz he just took margaritos title, sorry... but thats a lot more then what cotto had ever done at 147 before he beat mosley recently)

but in terms of why i think hes the best... its not just his size man, its his underated speed, underated power, his high pace, good stamina, mixes his punches up, and hes got good heart and good power.

[KayEpps]

Williams won a good fight against Margarito.

But other than that fight - people will question the level of his competition.

Cotto has fought at a higher level of competition than Williams - so therefore - he's ranked higher.

Let's see how he does in his next two fights - he just may change people's mind - or show that's he's overrated - we'll see!

[thewoo]

As far as I am concerned Williams should be ranked on top at 147. Margarito was the true champ at 147 but Judah ducked him after his demolition of Cintron or Margo would have held all the belts up to his defeat at the hands of Williams.
Judah's team knew Margo would have beat the living hell out of him so they avoided unifying with Tony. Cotto has looked pretty impressive as well and has a bigger name so a case can be made that him and Williams reside at the top of the division right now. The only chance Margarito has of getting back into the picture quickly is by taking that belt off Cintron or defeating Cotto next year.

Please oh please explain to me why Margarito was the true champ at 147?

[Dorfmeister]

I think Williams is overrated because of his size. I don't think he beats Floyd or Cotto.

I also believe Williams is too much taken as the Tommy Hearns of the 21st Century and people wish that there is the same great line-up of fighters in one hot ww division as Duran, Leonard, Hearns and Hagler ( even though Marvin fought em all at 160)... Problem is that Floyd is a proven asset whereas Cotto is proving himself and Paul proved to be very difficult to beat in that performance against Margo ( and since Margo is already taken to be exceptional or something like that). Cintron looked exceptional until he lost to Margarito, again came back great against Estrada, Suarez and Matthysse but then it was the Feliciano thang... Who can guarantee that Williams will not fail? Only a Williams' fan I'm afraid.

[freddy-wak]

honestly kirk, cause he didnt really win that fight in most peoples eyes...of course the floydtoys will tell you that margo got whooped, but in all reality, margo did enough to win, and since he was the champ, he deserved the fight more than williams (who people were impressed just because he didnt get ko'd)

but i'll give him his dues...i've always like the punisher

[kirk]

honestly kirk, cause he didnt really win that fight in most peoples eyes...of course the floydtoys will tell you that margo got whooped, but in all reality, margo did enough to win, and since he was the champ, he deserved the fight more than williams (who people were impressed just because he didnt get ko'd)

but i'll give him his dues...i've always like the punisher you honestly think that freddy? i dont know man.... i think its hard not to give PW that fight... margarito did decently towards the end, seems he had williams hurt to the body, but hardly did enough to say he won.

but it was def close enough to the point where i would love to see a rematch and settle it... im actually surpised there was no rematch.

[lillarry]

honestly kirk, cause he didnt really win that fight in most peoples eyes...of course the floydtoys will tell you that margo got whooped, but in all reality, margo did enough to win, and since he was the champ, he deserved the fight more than williams (who people were impressed just because he didnt get ko'd)

but i'll give him his dues...i've always like the punisher

Who are these "most people" you speak of? The general consensus on this board and by most boxing experts was that Williams clearly won. It was not a beat down but a clear victory

[freddy-wak]

you honestly think that freddy? i dont know man.... i think its hard not to give PW that fight... margarito did decently towards the end, seems he had williams hurt to the body, but hardly did enough to say he won.

but it was def close enough to the point where i would love to see a rematch and settle it... im actually surpised there was no rematch.

man, i've watched that fight so many times and margo did really good defensively...he was blocking most of those shots with his gloves....i know paul started off really good...but he was hurt a couple of times towards the end...and they both tied their balls at the end and slugged it out.....

i really didnt see paul winning that fight....but i can see why some people gave him the fight...

[kirk]

man, i've watched that fight so many times and margo did really good defensively...he was blocking most of those shots with his gloves....i know paul started off really good...but he was hurt a couple of times towards the end...and they both tied their balls at the end and slugged it out.....

i really didnt see paul winning that fight....but i can see why some people gave him the fight... but to me, if your throwing a lot of punches.... even if they arent scoring and the guy is blocking them with his glove the way margarito was.... it still better then being the guy blocking the punch imo. but i see your point.... i want to rewatch the fight pretty bad. ima youtube it.

[thewoo]

honestly kirk, cause he didnt really win that fight in most peoples eyes...of course the floydtoys will tell you that margo got whooped, but in all reality, margo did enough to win, and since he was the champ, he deserved the fight more than williams (who people were impressed just because he didnt get ko'd)

but i'll give him his dues...i've always like the punisher

There was some people that disputed the decision but I think that it is innacurate to say that Margo won the fight in "most" people's eyes. The majority of people agree with the decision.

[fatdrunkenslob]

Williams threw more punches but Margo landed the more effective shots. The judges that night gave it to the fighter who was more active plus Margarito blew it in the last round or he could have pulled out the draw so he has no one to really blame but himself especially with that sluggish start.

[walk with me]

hahaha exactly...been trying to tell people.. now think about this tho

cotto gets sucked off for beating zab
floyd do it and it dont matter
everyone sucks off margarito cause floyd "ducked " him
pw beats marg and nobody cares....

this is why floyd dont fight just anybody

and paul williams is that dude

[freddy-wak]

but to me, if your throwing a lot of punches.... even if they arent scoring and the guy is blocking them with his glove the way margarito was.... it still better then being the guy blocking the punch imo. but i see your point.... i want to rewatch the fight pretty bad. ima youtube it.

so margo dont get credit for defense but paul gets creds for slapping his gloves :huh

[H .]

There was some people that disputed the decision but I think that it is innacurate to say that Margo won the fight in "most" people's eyes. The majority of people agree with the decision.

:yep

[walk with me]

but in terms of why i think hes the best... its not just his size man, its his underated speed, underated power, his high pace, good stamina, mixes his punches up, and hes got good heart and good power.
and he has great work ethic....

its ok....
when its all done just remember kirk and walk with me told yall so


honestly kirk, cause he didnt really win that fight in most peoples eyes...of course the floydtoys will tell you that margo got whooped, but in all reality, margo did enough to win, and since he was the champ, he deserved the fight more than williams (who people were impressed just because he didnt get ko'd)

but i'll give him his dues...i've always like the punisher

no to be a jerk or anything....

but you SERIOUSLY!!! think marg won that fight?

[Dorfmeister]

There was some people that disputed the decision but I think that it is innacurate to say that Margo won the fight in "most" people's eyes. The majority of people agree with the decision.

I agree with the decision cause Tony was never gonna win starting so slow and Williams with that incredible punch output and rangy southpaw stance of his - some 100 punches thrown per round - but it was not that a case of Williams mopping the floor with Margarito. Tony fought nine welterweight title fights with seven kayos ( not including the NC with Santos and the WBO SWW title shot in PR with another suspicious SD after 9 or 10 rounds, a headbut and a cut on Tony's eye)... Williams fought Matthysse, Mitchell and Pakau, won the WBO title - why should he be the man now?

[fatdrunkenslob]

Please oh please explain to me why Margarito was the true champ at 147? I have already explained partially in the post you just referred to. Had Judah fought Margarito after his destruction of Cintron Margo would held all the belts. There's no way Judah the little mental midget would win against someone like Tony and that is why his team avoided him. After Zab beat Spinks for all the belts and Margo demolished the hottest prospect in Cintron this was the perfect time to unify all the belts. Instead Judah fought Cosme then lost an embarassing decision to Baldomir. Baldomir instead of facing the #1 ranked welter chose to defend against either Hatton or Gatti and it ended up being Gatti then proceeded to lose his title to PBF. Had either Judah or Baldomir elected to fight Margarito he would have been the undisputed champ at 147 at least until he faces someone like Williams. Of course I'm making the assumption he would win against people like Judah and Baldomir but it's a pretty reasonable one seeing as how those two performed.

[thewoo]

I have already explained partially in the post you just referred to. Had Judah fought Margarito after his destruction of Cintron Margo would held all the belts. There's no way Judah the little mental midget would win against someone like Tony and that is why his team avoided him. After Zab beat Spinks for all the belts and Margo demolished the hottest prospect in Cintron this was the perfect time to unify all the belts. Instead Judah fought Cosme then lost an embarassing decision to Baldomir. Baldomir instead of facing the #1 ranked welter chose to defend against either Hatton or Gatti and it ended up being Gatti then proceeded to lose his title to PBF. Had either Judah or Baldomir elected to fight Margarito he would have been the undisputed champ at 147 at least until he faces someone like Williams. Of course I'm making the assumption he would win against people like Judah and Baldomir but it's a pretty reasonable one seeing as how those two performed.

You can't say that someone is the champ based on assumptions. I agree with you on Judah ducking margarito. I remember when Margo and Cintron were going to fight Judah said that niether of them was a big enough name and then he goes and fights Rivera. Margarito screwed himself in all of these cases by holding on to that worthless WBO trinket. When you have that piece of shit, the other orginazations will not rank you and thus you will never be a mandatory for the real champion. Looks to me like Paul plans on making the same mistake Margarito did.

[fatdrunkenslob]

You can't say that someone is the champ based on assumptions. I agree with you on Judah ducking margarito. I remember when Margo and Cintron were going to fight Judah said that niether of them was a big enough name and then he goes and fights Rivera. Margarito screwed himself in all of these cases by holding on to that worthless WBO trinket. When you have that piece of shit, the other orginazations will not rank you and thus you will never be a mandatory for the real champion. Looks to me like Paul plans on making the same mistake Margarito did. Yeah his loss to Williams was probably a blessing in disguise I think. That WBO title has really prevented him from forcing people to fight him. I also think his promoter has to share in the blame in not making him a superstar. Margo has the fan pleasing style but his career has not been managed well. He should have gotten rid of that snake Arum and went with GBP instead. The funny thing is even less people want to fight Williams now after seeing his style against Margarito. Williams has now inherited the most avoided fighter title from Margo for better or worse.

[thewoo]

Yeah his loss to Williams was probably a blessing in disguise I think. That WBO title has really prevented him from forcing people to fight him. I also think his promoter has to share in the blame in not making him a superstar. Margo has the fan pleasing style but his career has not been managed well. He should have gotten rid of that snake Arum and went with GBP instead. The funny thing is even less people want to fight Williams now after seeing his style against Margarito. Williams has now inherited the most avoided fighter title from Margo for better or worse.

I think that it is a little premature to call Williams an avoided fighter. For the most part all the other big names at 147 took on legitamilty better fights instead of fighting him. Can you blame Cotto for taking on a future HOFer for big dollars in Mosley instead of Williams? Can you blame Floyd for fighting an unbeaten, current star that gave him his second biggest payday in what official numbers will probably show as the second biggest selling PPV of all time?

In order for me to consider a fighter avoided I think that the people that are "avoiding" him have to be taking on lesser fights instead and I don't think that has been the case with williams yet.

[FlatNose]

Kirk is right on the money with his analysis. NONE of the top Welters mention Paul Williams. Cotto wants Mayweather, Mayweather wants to retire (but won't) DLH wants Hatton, Hatton wants a rematch with Floyd, but nobodys mentioning Williams . Floyd and Miguel would rather pretend Paul doesn't exist. Crazy tall, with an unnatural reach, ackward style , volume punching , ballsy with a solid chin, Paul presents nightmares for Mayweather, and especially all the welterweight contenders.

[freddy-wak]

and he has great work ethic....

its ok....
when its all done just remember kirk and walk with me told yall so




no to be a jerk or anything....

but you SERIOUSLY!!! think marg won that fight?

yes i do....why

i'm not saying margo blew him out, it was a close fight..but cause margo's punches were more effective and he even had paul hurt a couple times, i felt he deserved the fight....people think he was getting tagged alot, but in this fight, he was blocking alot of shots....

[thewoo]

Kirk is right on the money with his analysis. NONE of the top Welters mention Paul Williams. Cotto wants Mayweather, Mayweather wants to retire (but won't) DLH wants Hatton, Hatton wants a rematch with Floyd, but nobodys mentioning Williams . Floyd and Miguel would rather pretend Paul doesn't exist. Crazy tall, with an unnatural reach, ackward style , volume punching , ballsy with a solid chin, Paul presents nightmares for Mayweather, and especially all the welterweight contenders.

Nobody is mentioning Cintron either. You think that means that they are scared of him or that they just don't care about him. Nobody is mentioning Joel Julio or a whole bunch of other guys. You really can not blame Cotto for prefering a fight with Floyd over williams. It is a better fight in every way. Floyd is pretty much unanimously considered p4p #1 in his prime, coming off a huge KO win, and the biggest draw outside of DLH. Cotto would get more credit for the win and way more money and be launched into superstardom.

If he were to fight Williams it would be for a fraction of the money and it would simply be considered a good win not a great one. Just like any time an undefeated guy gets beaten early in his career, people would say that he was simply exposed and never that good to begin with.

[natep]

hahaha exactly...been trying to tell people.. now think about this tho

cotto gets sucked off for beating zab
floyd do it and it dont matter
everyone sucks off margarito cause floyd "ducked " him
pw beats marg and nobody cares....

this is why floyd dont fight just anybody

and paul williams is that dude

Agreed :good