Will Cotto finish his career with a better resume then Mayweather?

[MSTR]

IMO yes if he can keep his current form running, and continue to persue the top guys. He has gradually increased the level of his opponents, and now is looking to make the big fights happen. With so much talent in the welterweight division, Cotto has a golden opportunity to solidify a spot as an ATG, provided he can continue winning obviously. Whilst this may seem obvious, many great fighters have not been able to have a resume to mirror their skills due to a lack of truley elite fighters within their weight division during their time at the top. Cotto has struck a gold mine in this sense, and provided he fights only top comp from here on out, he could "potentially" go down as one of the greats.

[BigReg]

I'll be hard. Floyd is a 5 division champ and did it under 10 years. Cotto clearly won't do this(he would have to win a smw title to be a 5 division champ). Also, Cotto is almost 27, has only 2 paper titles to his name, and his best win was against a guy that Floyd dusted off a year earlier. By the Time Floyd was 27 he had won 2 legit titles, and had beaten Castillo twice, Corrales, Jesus Chavez, and Carlos and Genaro Hernandez. Here is where Cotto has chance though. Since turning 27 Floyd's only good wins were against Judah and De La Hoya. The WW division is loaded right now and Cotto has the chance to add some good names to his resume. Furthermore, it's possible for Cotto to win a title at 154. Being a 3 division champ and beating say.. Margarito, Clotty,Mosely, and Berto(in a year or two when he's ready), and 1 or 2 top tier JMW could put Cotto past Mayweather.

[platnumpapi]

I'll be hard. Floyd is a 5 division champ and did it under 10 years. Cotto clearly won't do this(he would have to win a smw title to be a 5 division champ). Also, Cotto is almost 27, has only 2 paper titles to his name, and his best win was against a guy that Floyd dusted off a year earlier. By the Time Floyd was 27 he had won 2 legit titles, and had beaten Castillo twice, Corrales, Jesus Chavez, and Carlos and Genaro Hernandez. Here is where Cotto has chance though. Since turning 27 Floyd's only good wins were against Judah and De La Hoya. The WW division is loaded right now and Cotto has the chance to add some good names to his resume. Furthermore, it's possible for Cotto to win a title at 154. Being a 3 division champ and beating say.. Margarito, Clotty,Mosely, and Berto(in a year or two when he's ready), and 1 or 2 top tier JMW could put Cotto past Mayweather.


hard my ass its impossible.i dout cotto will go pass 147.and hes not the best in that divsion either.
pbf will ud him
mosley late stop
margo would be a 50 50 fight
the answer is no no no no no no no no.

he dont have a resume close to pbf's and as long as pbf still fights he never will.

pbf is looking to fight mosley or hatton
cotto is looking for the winner of margo and williams.big differ in the whos whos list.

both fighters are still active even mayweather jr, you as question like that when they are both retired but i can answer that one its no.

[compukiller]

Cotto still has a LLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOONNNNNNGGGGGGG way to go, but let's hope he fulfills his potential.

[Tu papa]

I'll be hard. Floyd is a 5 division champ and did it under 10 years. Cotto clearly won't do this(he would have to win a smw title to be a 5 division champ). Also, Cotto is almost 27, has only 2 paper titles to his name, and his best win was against a guy that Floyd dusted off a year earlier. By the Time Floyd was 27 he had won 2 legit titles, and had beaten Castillo twice, Corrales, Jesus Chavez, and Carlos and Genaro Hernandez. Here is where Cotto has chance though. Since turning 27 Floyd's only good wins were against Judah and De La Hoya. The WW division is loaded right now and Cotto has the chance to add some good names to his resume. Furthermore, it's possible for Cotto to win a title at 154. Being a 3 division champ and beating say.. Margarito, Clotty,Mosely, and Berto(in a year or two when he's ready), and 1 or 2 top tier JMW could put Cotto past Mayweather.

that's not being harsh. that's telling it like it is. and I'm a rican in pr btw. but I don't see cotto winning belts above 154. to short. but cotto can surely do a lot in 147, and I mean a lot. I think he can even beat pbf at 147 but that would not mean he was the better fighter when their careers are over, just that he was bigger and stroger. but who knows, it all depends how he beats him.

btw great fucking post. and sory no caps, typing from my cel phone.

[compukiller]

:rofl

EAS-ILY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Its all a matter of getting the fights, which is quite possible.

Why so easy?

[theunderdog]

at the rate cotto's going right now? i won't be surprised if he does. nowhere near pbf's titles. i think cotto will stack up on defenses of a title rather than keep moving up

[brooklyn1550]

Depends on what Mayweather does too...if Cotto beats De La Hoya, Mosley, Mayweather, Hatton, and cleans out 147, and wins a belt or two at 154, he can retire having the better career, but honestly, I think Floyd will go down the greater fighter.

[Asterion]

He needs to start winning Lineal Titles. But I think that he can be an All Time Great, and more respected than PBF.

[Tu papa]

at the rate cotto's going right now? i won't be surprised if he does. nowhere near pbf's titles. i think cotto will stack up on defenses of a title rather than keep moving up

agreed. he could pull a bhop at welter and be great.

[brooklyn1550]

Time will tell if he will be another Fernando Vargas, another Edwin Rosario, or this generation's Chavez or Duran...the sky is the limit for Cotto

[MSTR]

I'll be hard. Floyd is a 5 division champ and did it under 10 years. Cotto clearly won't do this(he would have to win a smw title to be a 5 division champ). Also, Cotto is almost 27, has only 2 paper titles to his name, and his best win was against a guy that Floyd dusted off a year earlier. By the Time Floyd was 27 he had won 2 legit titles, and had beaten Castillo twice, Corrales, Jesus Chavez, and Carlos and Genaro Hernandez. Here is where Cotto has chance though. Since turning 27 Floyd's only good wins were against Judah and De La Hoya. The WW division is loaded right now and Cotto has the chance to add some good names to his resume. Furthermore, it's possible for Cotto to win a title at 154. Being a 3 division champ and beating say.. Margarito, Clotty,Mosely, and Berto(in a year or two when he's ready), and 1 or 2 top tier JMW could put Cotto past Mayweather.
You make so really good points, but IMO being a 5 weight world champion doesn't really enhance legacy, otherwise Oscar would be the best ever. Its who you fight. And Cotto has a great chance to fight some of the best in Floyd, Hatton, Mosley, Marg, Oscar ect. Even if he loses to one of these guys, provided he wins most he could end up being better then floyd. Floyd did start his career stronger, but really wasted most of his prime on Gatti, Brussels, Baldomir, Mitchell ect who didn't do anything for his resume apart from their titles.

[compukiller]

Cause he is already fighting OTHER undefeated prospects and beating them convincingly.

With the body of work regarding tehse guys the chances and probability of them doing something increases.

Case in point:

PBF beat Corrales who's success raised PBF's stock.

Cotto already beat Malignaggi (an HBO hype job) and Maussa who became champ.

Quintana, Pinto, etc. can still do something.

If he continues on this path the probability of them becoming the Corrales and Castillo's for him will go up.

Not including super fights which don't diminish or devalue him like they didn't DLH or Mosley.


I think DLH gets fucked up by Cotto to be honest.


DLH is all wrong for Cotto style wise. And also, Cotto has been bought along very carefully. He's fought decent comp, but no real great fighters (yet).

PBF's resume is too full to even compare to Cotto's, and honestly I think it is unfair to Cotto at this young age. PBF has fought and beaten a few HOF fighters, something Cotto has yet to achieve.

And Malinaggi is no hype job. He took Cotto to the edge with a broken jaw, and did not quit, fold, or get stopped. He has shown, heart, skill, and a chin.

[IsaL]

Cotto might not accomplish 5 divisions but he will win something PBF never did and has long yearned for..A huge FAN BASE that respects and loves him for being a fighter. That is more than medals, that is what fighters fight for after they have the $$$.

[compukiller]

Cotto might not accomplish 5 divisions but he will win something PBF never did and has long yearned for..A huge FAN BASE that respects and loves him for being a fighter. That is more than medals, that is what fighters fight for after they have the $$$.

Maybe, but that's assuming he beats everyone in front of him, which is not guaranteed.

[theunderdog]

i think a better resume will in the end depend on what's more important to the person judging it, some say 5 division world titles are important but the others think that defending a single title and holding it for a long time is more important. it all depends on who's looking at it

[IsaL]

Maybe, but that's assuming he beats everyone in front of him, which is not guaranteed.

PBF lost to the man on your avatar. He too has not won all his battle. Especially the biggest battles he has fought which is actually fighting rather than running.

[compukiller]

carefully?

Bro that is complete bullshit.

He has faced the toughest comp to date of many fighters.
Undefeated prospects with followings, KO rates, and skill.
Those guys are usually hungrier then the old worn down fighters over 30 and with 5-6 losses.

He has IN NO FUCKIN WAY been brought along carefully.
I honestly resent that statement.
He has been brought along very hard and that deserves respect and a superfight.

About Oscar's style.
arguable i guess but that is not the point. I think MC beats him but fine.


Great comp? I beg to differ. But I am not saying he's being protected. Listen, I like Cotto, and I will always watch him fight, and he seems a like a good guy. But he is STILL YOUNG, and I think that he needs to step up his comp a notch for his resume to be rightfully compared to PBF's. The fact that I wasn't always fond of Cotto and that he's turned me around over the years shows me he has something.

But he needs to get those big fights soon in order to be rightfully in this conversation. Margo is a good step in the right direction.:deal

Be he is a contender right now. A damn good one, but a contender nonetheless. While PBF is already a shoe in for the HOF. :good

[compukiller]

PBF lost to the man on your avatar. He too has not won all his battle. Especially the biggest battles he has fought which is actually fighting rather than running.

Look, I think PBF is a bastard, but I don't agree with this running thing. He fights more defensively now because he is fighting guys Much bigger than him. He stands and trades, he will get KO'ed at 154 or even 147, depending on who is doing the punching.

But he is not the 1st fighter to do that as he moved up in weight. I respect the fact that he is a little guy who is fighting the big guys (me being a little guy myself).

I think Castillo beat him the 1st time to, but PBF got his revenge. He is an excellent boxer, and for that I respect him, prick as he is.

And I think he beats Cotto convincingly. :deal

[MSTR]

i think a better resume will in the end depend on what's more important to the person judging it, some say 5 division world titles are important but the others think that defending a single title and holding it for a long time is more important. it all depends on who's looking at it
True boxing fans don't look at titles they look at opponents. However I can see the point that you are making in that its all a matter of perspective.

[carras]

I'll be hard. Floyd is a 5 division champ and did it under 10 years. Cotto clearly won't do this(he would have to win a smw title to be a 5 division champ). Also, Cotto is almost 27, has only 2 paper titles to his name, and his best win was against a guy that Floyd dusted off a year earlier. By the Time Floyd was 27 he had won 2 legit titles, and had beaten Castillo twice, Corrales, Jesus Chavez, and Carlos and Genaro Hernandez. Here is where Cotto has chance though. Since turning 27 Floyd's only good wins were against Judah and De La Hoya. The WW division is loaded right now and Cotto has the chance to add some good names to his resume. Furthermore, it's possible for Cotto to win a title at 154. Being a 3 division champ and beating say.. Margarito, Clotty,Mosely, and Berto(in a year or two when he's ready), and 1 or 2 top tier JMW could put Cotto past Mayweather.

I agree with this.

[MSTR]

Time will tell if he will be another Fernando Vargas, another Edwin Rosario, or this generation's Chavez or Duran...the sky is the limit for Cotto
Good comparison. He fights very similar to all of the above fighters also. I think he has already surpassed Vargas in terms of achievement, and definitely in terms of longevity. I believe he has the ability to be similar to a Chavez or Duran for this generation, although he still has a very long way to go, and some very tough fights ahead of him.

[kg0208]

He certainly could. He is young and hungry and on his way.

[BoxingGuru]

God yes. Are you kidding me. We have one fighter who cares about being the best of the best and one who cares about money.

Who do YOU think will have the better resume.

[kg0208]

God yes. Are you kidding me. We have one fighter who cares about being the best of the best and one who cares about money.

Who do YOU think will have the better resume.

That's now...Cotto could take a turn when he starts seeing more money.

[igotJUIC3]

God yes. Are you kidding me. We have one fighter who cares about being the best of the best and one who cares about money.

Who do YOU think will have the better resume.

when Cotto reaches the p4p #1 status then see if he will take these pay check cuts to fight the up and commers for his thrown.

[KO Boxing]

No he will not

[igotJUIC3]

Yes Great comp.
NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.

Quintana, Pinto, Abdullaev, Malignaggi, and the list goes on.

IF you look at his list of opponents you really start to say to yourself "Fuck this is some list for a guy with 30 fights, who is still undefeated and still winning."

Has he overtaken PBF yet?
No

Does he have a shot? EAS-ILY
IT would depend on him not fuckin around with negotiations but even so the kid is special and once some of these guys he beat start moving forward themselves like Malignaggi more folks will realize it.

What distresses me is his win over Judah is somehow being made out to be his biggest accomplishment :patsch is all i can say to that.

The dominance with which he handled the above means more then the dominance with which he handled a guy who was dominated before.

that is not GREAT comp

[1lehudson]

To put this in a nutshell.......floyd was bashed for fighting and beatting Judah, Cotto is called a hero and the next great thing. And dont give me that crap about OH he stopped Judah and Floyd didnt, different styles of fighters. So according to many on this site Cotto already has a better resume.

[compukiller]

Yes Great comp.
NO DOUBT ABOUT IT.

Quintana, Pinto, Abdullaev, Malignaggi, and the list goes on.

IF you look at his list of opponents you really start to say to yourself "Fuck this is some list for a guy with 30 fights, who is still undefeated and still winning."

Has he overtaken PBF yet?
No

Does he have a shot? EAS-ILY
IT would depend on him not fuckin around with negotiations but even so the kid is special and once some of these guys he beat start moving forward themselves like Malignaggi more folks will realize it.

What distresses me is his win over Judah is somehow being made out to be his biggest accomplishment :patsch is all i can say to that.

The dominance with which he handled the above means more then the dominance with which he handled a guy who was dominated before.

PBF is still in his prime, and is still fighting. And those names on Cotto's list is not a murderer's row. Certainly not on the level of Castillo, Corrales, DLH, Gatti, Hernandez, or Chavez.

Cotto has a LOT of work to do if he wants to overtake pBF. A lot. :deal

[igotJUIC3]

before Judah his best fight was Malignaggi...nuff said.

[igotJUIC3]

Exactly beatin Judah meant shit IMHO.

After Baldomir PBF should be ashamed of himself.

Cotto i forgive because of how hard he was matched in COMPETITIVE FIGHTS so if people will give him cred (for the wrong reasons) fine as long as he gets it.

why....he fought ODH after Baldy. Made 20 plus millions plus faced a great veteran boxer.

[kg0208]

Yes, THAT is.:deal

No man, that is good comp. Not great comp. Not a single P4P fighter. Not a single time did Cotto beat a champion who had a belt when they fought. Most were good prospects whose best wins were over prospects. He has a GOOD resume so far.....but not great.

[Amsterdam]

He certainly could. He is young and hungry and on his way.

Yes, you don't have to jump divisions to have an amazing resume, Floyd's is very good, but a bit dry in comparison to his ATG contemporaries.

The Hatton win will give him a good plus though.

[MSTR]

Not really. Gatti? for fucks sake come on now.
You cannot use Gatti.

DLH is a big name. A guy who takes big fights but losses them consecutively.
Corrales and Castillo are basically accomplished versions of the undefeated guys Cotto has fought in Torres and Malignaggi.


He does have work to do but he can EASILY overtake PBF.

PBf is in his prime but these showcase fights against Brusseles and Gatti are BS IMHO.

If PBF wanted to he could find some challenges.

I would give him more cred for beating Torres then Gatti.
I agree with your posts. Cotto has fought very good undefeated and dangerous opponents. He is looking to step it up and is a very good chance at surpassing floyd provided he can beat the top guys when the time comes

[Amsterdam]

I agree with your posts. Cotto has fought very good undefeated and dangerous opponents. He is looking to step it up and is a very good chance at surpassing floyd provided he can beat the top guys when the time comes

He'll clean 147 in my opinion, that's a damn fine start.:good

Mosely is the only one that poses a competitive threat, the rest will get destroyed. I don't expect Floyd to mess with Cotto because it is a hard fight for him.

[MSTR]

Yes, you don't have to jump divisions to have an amazing resume, Floyd's is very good, but a bit dry in comparison to his ATG contemporaries.

The Hatton win will give him a good plus though.
Floyd is good, but his resume doesn't really excite me either. He chose the path of least resistance in most cases, especially in gatti and Baldomir. He might get credit with the casual fan, but anyone who knows boxing realises that the multiple world titles are fairly meaningless in the big scheme of things, when taken from fairly average fighters.

[Amsterdam]

Floyd is good, but his resume doesn't really excite me either. He chose the path of least resistance in most cases, especially in gatti and Baldomir. He might get credit with the casual fan, but anyone who knows boxing realises that the multiple world titles are fairly meaningless in the big scheme of things, when taken from fairly average fighters.

Well, I regard the Baldomir win equal to a win over Margarito, because both are B level.

But after 135, he did become a comfort zone cunt, even though it's still pretty decent. Fighting Hatton is a good name for him and I give him respect for that, but I can't see anyway for Hatton to win.

[Lance_Uppercut]

Cotto CAN finish with a better resume if he gets the right fights. Doesn't matter that Floyd won more belts.

[igotJUIC3]

i think people are downgrading fighters to prove a point.

[KO Boxing]

Floyd is good, but his resume doesn't really excite me either. He chose the path of least resistance in most cases, especially in gatti and Baldomir. He might get credit with the casual fan, but anyone who knows boxing realises that the multiple world titles are fairly meaningless in the big scheme of things, when taken from fairly average fighters.
But apart from Gatti, he didn't take the titles from average fighters. Hernandez, Castillo and Dela Hoya for 3 titles in 3 weight classes, and Baldormir for the welterweight title, the lineal undisupted no. 1.

[MSTR]

But apart from Gatti, he didn't take the titles from average fighters. Hernandez, Castillo and Dela Hoya for 3 titles in 3 weight classes, and Baldormir for the welterweight title, the lineal undisupted no. 1.
But Bladomir is average. And I didn't say he took it off all easy fighters. The point is at the tail end of his career he has chosen the path of least resistance to some degree, whilst gaining those belts. Even against Oscar, he is not a natural 154 pounder and was largely inactive. Still a very tough opponent, but the p4p no.1 in the world should have been more impressive then he was. If Floyd fights hatton he will get a lot of credit though in my book, as Hatton is a tough opponent. Floyd still has a chance to really cement his legacy also, provided he pushes the retirement talk aside which I believe he will.

[kg0208]

At the time PBF fought Castillo and Corrales they were "Good" not great.

Ditto all other PBF opponents basically.

THUS after PBF beat Corrales people saw what that win meant.

The more undefeated prospects Cotto fights the more chance he has to be recognized in time as those guys do things later on with their careers.
Corrales was ranked #5 p4p when PBF fought him. He held the IBF title and was a champion.

Castillo was not ranked p4p and but was a champion and won his belt off of a p4p fighter.

That is not the same as Quintana who has never held a belt and whose best win is over another prospect, or Malignaggi who's best win is probably Lovemore Ndou. Or Maussa, who actually beat a champion AFTER he lost to Cotto, only to lose his next fight.

Remember, in the same amount of time, PBF had beaten Chavez and both Hernandez's as well.

Also, remember Cotto's best win is someone PBF beat already, and is not PBF's best win. Cotto STILL has not won a belt from a champion. Not taking shots at Cotto, just pointing out the perspective.

He has not reached PBF's level yet. And by the by, PBF's resume isn't considered GREAT to me either. A word overused on this site all too often. So if Cotto's is not as good as PBF's and PBF's is not great...well.

[MSTR]

Cotto's career gets put into perspective when he fights Margo.

He will get stopped and then we will see how he bounces back.
Yeah right. Cotto will chop that lanky body down and leave him a quivering mess.

[Amsterdam]

Yeah right. Cotto will chop that lanky body down and leave him a quivering mess.

Damn right, and Requiem will owe me 50$.:yep

Of course, I was so confident in Cotto that I offered him a 500$ bet.

[compukiller]

Not really. Gatti? for fucks sake come on now.
You cannot use Gatti.

DLH is a big name. A guy who takes big fights but losses them consecutively.
Corrales and Castillo are basically accomplished versions of the undefeated guys Cotto has fought in Torres and Malignaggi.


He does have work to do but he can EASILY overtake PBF.

PBf is in his prime but these showcase fights against Brusseles and Gatti are BS IMHO.

If PBF wanted to he could find some challenges.

I would give him more cred for beating Torres then Gatti.

:rofl :rofl :rofl :rofl

Gatti is a former titlist, and has fought [Only registered and activated users can see links] better comp than any of those guys.

And Cotto would lose to everyone DLH lost too, and badly.

[kg0208]

I never said he reached PBF's level yet.

What i said was the Corrales and Castillo wins were really appreciated as those two guys went on to not quit and fade away.


By fighting guys like Quintanna and Malignaggi (guys who are of a similar caliber and experience and who are still young and hungry) Cotto will most likely statistically earn recognition as time goes on.

BECAUSE he fought those future potentials in their prime and put the 1 on their perfect record in the loss column.


So its the same situation as Corrales and Castillo.

Corrales was of course a better win for PBF and so was Castillo (IMHO not so much OSDH and Baldo but that is opinion) but the quality of Cotto's wins against quality opp merits the same sort of recognition IMHO.

NOT as much but definately more then he is getting at this point.

Undefeated young and powerful hungry fighters are very hard to beat.
Much harder then older and experienced champs in many cases.

The point is, I am not sure how powerful or good those fighters were. When PBF beat the guys he beat, we knew how good they were.

With Cotto we are playing wait and see. For him AND the fighters he fought. These guys could turn out to be average fighters or even journeyman.

[MSTR]

Corrales was ranked #5 p4p when PBF fought him. He held the IBF title and was a champion.

Castillo was not ranked p4p and but was a champion and won his belt off of a p4p fighter.

That is not the same as Quintana who has never held a belt and whose best win is over another prospect, or Malignaggi who's best win is probably Lovemore Ndou. Or Maussa, who actually beat a champion AFTER he lost to Cotto, only to lose his next fight.

Remember, in the same amount of time, PBF had beaten Chavez and both Hernandez's as well.

Also, remember Cotto's best win is someone PBF beat already, and is not PBF's best win. Cotto STILL has not won a belt from a champion. Not taking shots at Cotto, just pointing out the perspective.

He has not reached PBF's level yet. And by the by, PBF's resume isn't considered GREAT to me either. A word overused on this site all too often. So if Cotto's is not as good as PBF's and PBF's is not great...well.
Cotto is still a young fighter though. Fair enough at this point of his career Floyd had done more, but Cotto has established himself as a force and now has the opportunity to make some great fights happen which I believe he will do. Floyd was in the same position but in reality blew it by fighting guys who weren't on his level, in sosa, ndou, gatti, bruseles, mitchell and baldomir. A guy of floyds talent should have been pushing for bigger fights then those.

[Amsterdam]

Yea and Castillo has lost what 10 times now?:roll:

How does that make Castillo better then Cotto if MC gets owned badly by all those great fighters?

Don't give me the excuse shit about "Castillo's situation" either.


Gatti is a glorified club fighter.
He could have been something in his early days but by the time PBF got to him he was a punching bag for any half decent fighter.

Titlist?
SHIT man i would give PBF more cred for a win over any of hte undefeated guys Cotto fight.
EASY.:-(

This is a great post Novi.:good

[Amsterdam]

Not really. It was only when Castillo and corrales fought each other and beat Casa did people say "oh what does that say about PBF?"

If they would not go anywhere it would be an issue of them not being great fighters as they could not handle a loss.

Maussa went on to become a titleholder.
Malignaggi ditto.
2 undfeated fighters Cotto beat badly.

That tells me something about those guys IMHO.

Not Corrales or Castillo but still a tall tale sign of the quality of that opp.

How about brutally dominating the best version of Judah since Spinks 2?

Quintana is a 2nd tier, about on the level of Clottey, Margo, Baldomir etc.

I am sick of Clottey being overrated for one, especially since he struggled heavily with Gutierez, whom is 3rd tier at best and gets his recognition from brutalising the shitty and overrated Margarito before breaking his hands.

Yet Margarito is to be taken seriously? Pfft. Cotto wipes the floor with this guy and that's yet another notch.

[kg0208]

Cotto is still a young fighter though. Fair enough at this point of his career Floyd had done more, but Cotto has established himself as a force and now has the opportunity to make some great fights happen which I believe he will do. Floyd was in the same position but in reality blew it by fighting guys who weren't on his level, in sosa, ndou, gatti, bruseles, mitchell and baldomir. A guy of floyds talent should have been pushing for bigger fights then those.

Yes, but lets be realistic.

Baldomir, Gatti, and Ndou were certainly on the same level as the fighters that Cotto has already beaten. Ndou is certainly every bit as good (or was) and was higher ranked than most of the fighters Cotto has fought. We are judging PBF by a different standard than Cotto.

The original question is can he pass PBF. I answered he certainly has a shot.

However, Nova says that Cotto has fought great opposition. I don't believe he has and that's entirely different than what the thread starter asked, which is what the post you quoted is addressing. He has fought some good fighters, but no great ones. And we aren't sure how good those fighters are. Malignaggi, Maussa, etc.....compare them to Gatti, Baldomir, etc. They are at the very least equal, and probably favor PBF a bit considering that Baldomir beat Cotto's best win so far. In other words, they can't "blow it" for PBF's resume, but the same level fighter enhances Cotto's.

[ajohnfp]

He could. Will he? Real hard to say right now.

[Amsterdam]

Yes, but lets be realistic.

Baldomir, Gatti, and Ndou were certainly on the same level as the fighters that Cotto has already beaten. Ndou is certainly every bit as good (or was) and was higher ranked than most of the fighters Cotto has fought. We are judging PBF by a different standard than Cotto.

The original question is can he pass PBF. I answered he certainly has a shot.

However, Nova says that Cotto has fought great opposition. I don't believe he has and that's entirely different than what the thread starter asked, which is what the post you quoted is addressing. He has fought some good fighters, but no great ones. And we aren't sure how good those fighters are. Malignaggi, Maussa, etc.....compare them to Gatti, Baldomir, etc. They are at the very least equal, and probably favor PBF a bit considering that Baldomir beat Cotto's best win so far. In other words, they can't "blow it" for PBF's resume, but the same level fighter enhances Cotto's.

We can tell how good some are just by watchint their ability and skill level however, you don't need concrete paper wins JUST YET to tell that a fighter is better than another...

And I already gave examples on how the highly regarded and overrated Clottey would make little difference and how Judah is a superior victory than Margarito.

[kg0208]

Not really. It was only when Castillo and corrales fought each other and beat Casa did people say "oh what does that say about PBF?"

If they would not go anywhere it would be an issue of them not being great fighters as they could not handle a loss.

Maussa went on to become a titleholder.
Malignaggi ditto.
2 undfeated fighters Cotto beat badly.

That tells me something about those guys IMHO.

Not Corrales or Castillo but still a tall tale sign of the quality of that opp.

That was out of other peoples ignorance. PBF beat those 2 fighters AFTER they were champions and when they were holding belts. And those fighters won more than alphabet titles. Before they fought each other, Castillo has already beaten Casamayor and Johnston.

Maussa won A title, and then lost it immediately. He is 3-3 in his last 6 fights.

Malignaggi's best win has been against an old Lovemore Ndou.

Those guys accomplished no where NEAR what Corrales or Castillo did BEFORE they fought PBF. Not to mention after.

[kg0208]

We can tell how good some are just by watchint their ability and skill level however, you don't need concrete paper wins JUST YET to tell that a fighter is better than another...

And I already gave examples on how the highly regarded and overrated Clottey would make little difference and how Judah is a superior victory than Margarito.
We can GUESS at how good we THINK they are. Not tell.....you and I have both made mistakes when judging a fighter. I would bet a ton of money that if Clottey fought Judah that Judah would be beaten badly. Wins and Losses are the only concrete way to tell anything. And who the wins and losses are against.

Maussa is not very good. Malignaggi is a good but not great fighter. Quintana is a good not great fighter. Cotto has not beaten a great fighter. His competition has been good....it is not great. Neither in fact is PBF's.

[Toopretty]

That was out of other peoples ignorance. PBF beat those 2 fighters AFTER they were champions and when they were holding belts. And those fighters won more than alphabet titles. Before they fought each other, Castillo has already beaten Casamayor and Johnston.

Maussa won A title, and then lost it immediately. He is 3-3 in his last 6 fights.

Malignaggi's best win has been against an old Lovemore Ndou.

Those guys accomplished no where NEAR what Corrales or Castillo did BEFORE they fought PBF. Not to mention after.

Good post, Couldnt say it better.:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup

[MSTR]

Yes, but lets be realistic.

Baldomir, Gatti, and Ndou were certainly on the same level as the fighters that Cotto has already beaten. Ndou is certainly every bit as good (or was) and was higher ranked than most of the fighters Cotto has fought. We are judging PBF by a different standard than Cotto.

The original question is can he pass PBF. I answered he certainly has a shot.

However, Nova says that Cotto has fought great opposition. I don't believe he has and that's entirely different than what the thread starter asked, which is what the post you quoted is addressing. He has fought some good fighters, but no great ones. And we aren't sure how good those fighters are. Malignaggi, Maussa, etc.....compare them to Gatti, Baldomir, etc. They are at the very least equal, and probably favor PBF a bit considering that Baldomir beat Cotto's best win so far. In other words, they can't "blow it" for PBF's resume, but the same level fighter enhances Cotto's.
What I was pointing out though is that when Floyd was at the point that Cotto is now, he basically went backwards by fighting the guys I mentioned, instead of looking for the best fights available. Cotto has moved forward or at least tried to with every fight, which is why I think he can surpass floyd. I am not saying Cottos opponents are better (because they aren't), just that floyd as the p4p no.1 should have fought better guys while on top then what he has done. You are right though in that my original intention for the thread was to speculate, as floyd has the better resume currently no question.

[Amsterdam]

We can GUESS at how good we THINK they are. Not tell.....you and I have both made mistakes when judging a fighter. I would bet a ton of money that if Clottey fought Judah that Judah would be beaten badly. Wins and Losses are the only concrete way to tell anything. And who the wins and losses are against.

Maussa is not very good. Malignaggi is a good but not great fighter. Quintana is a good not great fighter. Cotto has not beaten a great fighter. His competition has been good....it is not great. Neither in fact is PBF's.

But you don't understand, I would have said before this thread was opened that Maussa is subpar, Malignaggi is very good, but not great and that Quintana is a solid 2nd class fighter(I already stated this).

Margarito is piss shit, that's from observation. You have to look beyond the paper.

I'll up that and garauntee that the very flat footed, stationary Clottey can't deal with a quick mover. He also doesn't hit hard enough to put away Judah...

I'll take Judah over Clottey anyday, wide decision.

[kg0208]

But you don't understand, I would have said before this thread was opened that Maussa is subpar, Malignaggi is very good, but not great and that Quintana is a solid 2nd class fighter(I already stated this).

Margarito is piss shit, that's from observation. You have to look beyond the paper.

I'll up that and garauntee that the very flat footed, stationary Clottey can't deal with a quick mover. He also doesn't hit hard enough to put away Judah...

I'll take Judah over Clottey anyday, wide decision.

If the fight ever happens, then sure, I will bet you on it. I think he catches and plants Judah.

Margarito is piss shit to you thought observation. But his wins over solid fighters make him AT LEAST solid in my eyes.

You are missing my point. I am debating with Nova about whether Cotto has fought great competition in his career. When Judah is your best win, then no you have not fought great opposition. If were saying he has fought great competition for a new champion....maybe. But he is listed as P4P now, and that is not great comp.

[Toopretty]

But you don't understand, I would have said before this thread was opened that Maussa is subpar, Malignaggi is very good, but not great and that Quintana is a solid 2nd class fighter(I already stated this).

Margarito is piss shit, that's from observation. You have to look beyond the paper.

I'll up that and garauntee that the very flat footed, stationary Clottey can't deal with a quick mover. He also doesn't hit hard enough to put away Judah...

I'll take Judah over Clottey anyday, wide decision.

I never thought about that match up. I think Clottey is alot more talented then you say. But he does have an akward pace and sometimes goes into his defensive shell too long. But he does have a tight D. Judah ..yeah you are right clottey style of being stationary and kind of waiting to counter would not fair well with a speed in and out guy. They would beat him to the punch everytime. I see I have some boxing analytic competition on here..lol:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think

[compukiller]

Zab gets alot of credit for losing 3 of his last 4, including one no decision. :bart

[kg0208]

What I was pointing out though is that when Floyd was at the point that Cotto is now, he basically went backwards by fighting the guys I mentioned, instead of looking for the best fights available. Cotto has moved forward or at least tried to with every fight, which is why I think he can surpass floyd. I am not saying Cottos opponents are better (because they aren't), just that floyd as the p4p no.1 should have fought better guys while on top then what he has done. You are right though in that my original intention for the thread was to speculate, as floyd has the better resume currently no question.

Nova and I are debating not the original thread, but my contention that Cotto has not fought great competition thus far, only good competition. I feel that even now, PBF has not fought great competition, but good competition. And Cotto's resume is weaker than his. So he certainly has not fought great comp then.

If were are doing it based on their respective places in the boxing world, then PBF's grade is lowered because for a p4p #1 his comp has been average. But just straight up all is equal, his comp is good overall, not great. Very few fighters fight great competition....great should be reserved for guys like DLH who fought all kinds of champs.

[Lance_Uppercut]

But you don't understand, I would have said before this thread was opened that Maussa is subpar, Malignaggi is very good, but not great and that Quintana is a solid 2nd class fighter(I already stated this).

Margarito is piss shit, that's from observation. You have to look beyond the paper.

I'll up that and garauntee that the very flat footed, stationary Clottey can't deal with a quick mover. He also doesn't hit hard enough to put away Judah...

I'll take Judah over Clottey anyday, wide decision.

:lol:

Sorry man....I gotta laugh when guys here act like they are SO SURE of their post considering many fight picks going against them.

"The first step to knowlege in knowing you don't know everything...." :deal

If Margarito is shit, then he should have lost a long time ago. But I guess you can just call his comp shit to justify your opinion.

Until Margarito is PROVEN to be shit, sorry mate, then he isn't.

As for Clottey - Judah, does Clottey have to put him away to win? Don't think so. He's not fast, but he's far from slow. And he's technically sound with good whiskers. Doubtful Judah ever fights someone like that unless it's a fight he cannot say not to. Like vs. Cotto for example.

[Amsterdam]

I never thought about that match up. I think Clottey is alot more talented then you say. But he does have an akward pace and sometimes goes into his defensive shell too long. But he does have a tight D. Judah ..yeah you are right clottey style of being stationary and kind of waiting to counter would not fair well with a speed in and out guy. They would beat him to the punch everytime. I see I have some boxing analytic competition on here..lol:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think:think

Most of the time, when I know about two competitors to a good degree, I call them right after analysing it.

I'm certain Judah beats a guy like Clottey. Clottey is by no way a hard hitter at WW, I've seen plenty of his fights. He stunned Margarito, but Margarito is an overrated, glorified journeyman.

[Toopretty]

Most of the time, when I know about two competitors to a good degree, I call them right after analysing it.

I'm certain Judah beats a guy like Clottey. Clottey is by no way a hard hitter at WW, I've seen plenty of his fights. He stunned Margarito, but Margarito is an overrated, glorified journeyman.

Dude, you are my brother from another mother. Damn somebody that sees threw BS and Hype. And if you watch margarito fight you see.. like you said. the wins he got, he was getting outboxed every single time and went into fling a wild haymaker mode. And caught the other guy with what I call a WISH punch. The only guy I seen him actually outbox was that amateur Cintron. But you know you are going to raise holy hell on ESB calling there internet champ margarito a bum.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

[Lance_Uppercut]

Dude, you are my brother from another mother. Damn somebody that sees threw BS and Hype. And if you watch margarito fight you see.. like you said. the wins he got, he was getting outboxed every single time and went into fling a wild haymaker mode. And caught the other guy with what I call a WISH punch. The only guy I seen him actually outbox was that amateur Cintron. But you know you are going to raise holy hell on ESB calling there internet champ margarito a bum.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Basically, you're saying Margarito was losing most of his fights till a KO win for him? :patsch

[kg0208]

Dude, you are my brother from another mother. Damn somebody that sees threw BS and Hype. And if you watch margarito fight you see.. like you said. the wins he got, he was getting outboxed every single time and went into fling a wild haymaker mode. And caught the other guy with what I call a WISH punch. The only guy I seen him actually outbox was that amateur Cintron. But you know you are going to raise holy hell on ESB calling there internet champ margarito a bum.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl
Calling him a BUM is extreme. He didn't hit a MAKE A WISH punch everytime. One time....ok, 2 times? Coincidence MAYBE. But if he has done that in every win he has gotten and simply gone into haymaker mode, that's called strategy and part of his crude but effective skill set.

Foreman went into Haymaker Mode often. At the very LEAST, Margarito is a solid fighter. At his best, he is a good champion, perhaps not a great one or p4p one. But he is not a bum.

[Amsterdam]

Dude, you are my brother from another mother. Damn somebody that sees threw BS and Hype. And if you watch margarito fight you see.. like you said. the wins he got, he was getting outboxed every single time and went into fling a wild haymaker mode. And caught the other guy with what I call a WISH punch. The only guy I seen him actually outbox was that amateur Cintron. But you know you are going to raise holy hell on ESB calling there internet champ margarito a bum.:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Exactly mate.

Clottey, Cintron are his best wins and I have already outlined why they are 2nd tier fighters at BEST. I don't care if they raise hell, I go at it with them everytime the subject has been brought up, and I've been here for 2 and a half years!:lol: :lol:

Cintron gets starched by Margarito, but never showed anything proficient before that except power, then he improves and goes into a brutal war with a light hitting gate keeper in Estrada.

Then we have Clottey, who fails to stop a glass chin joke that the tomato can Carlos Bojorquez easily KO's, he barely gets by a 3rd tier in Guttierez and then owns Margarito until he busts his hands, which is where he gets his hype from and then he goes on to fail to stop the shot, moving up in weight, chinny Corrales.

Give me a fucking break, this is more proven comp than Malignaggi, Corley and Judah?:nut

[Amsterdam]

Calling him a BUM is extreme. He didn't hit a MAKE A WISH punch everytime. One time....ok, 2 times? Coincidence MAYBE. But if he has done that in every win he has gotten and simply gone into haymaker mode, that's called strategy and part of his crude but effective skill set.

Foreman went into Haymaker Mode often. At the very LEAST, Margarito is a solid fighter. At his best, he is a good champion, perhaps not a great one or p4p one. But he is not a bum.

Margarito is a glorified journeyman, end of story. Wait until he finally steps up to an adequate fighter whom is not a hype job like Cintron or a decent 2nd tier like Clottey(whom was on his way to stopping him by the way) and see what happens.

He'll get raped in the ring and this is so easy to predict that it's not even anything to brag about.:yep

[Toopretty]

Basically, you're saying Margarito was losing most of his fights till a KO win for him? :patsch


Yes, he was getting outboxed before landing a haymaker.IE Lewis/Gomez/Clottey(though his haymaker did not land)

[MSTR]

:lol:

Sorry man....I gotta laugh when guys here act like they are SO SURE of their post considering many fight picks going against them.

"The first step to knowlege in knowing you don't know everything...." :deal

If Margarito is shit, then he should have lost a long time ago. But I guess you can just call his comp shit to justify your opinion.

Until Margarito is PROVEN to be shit, sorry mate, then he isn't.

As for Clottey - Judah, does Clottey have to put him away to win? Don't think so. He's not fast, but he's far from slow. And he's technically sound with good whiskers. Doubtful Judah ever fights someone like that unless it's a fight he cannot say not to. Like vs. Cotto for example.
He did lose though to Santos. A b level fighter AT BEST. And it wasn't like it was at the start of his career either.

[Toopretty]

Oh and I forgot the Santos fight. He was fighting for his life that fight. I mean..lol he threw boxing out of the window. And was just trying to land any haymaker he can throw. He is slow as all shit with his punches as well. I mean the way clottey was countering him with not one but two punches before slow ass could wind up for another wide looper...:yep :yep :yep

[Amsterdam]

He did lose though to Santos. A b level fighter AT BEST. And it wasn't like it was at the start of his career either.

Exactly! There is nothing to "disprove" here, the guy is plain and simply not THAT GOOD. Christ, Margarito has been SOLD to the boxing public better than any average fighter I can think of.

[Amsterdam]

Oh and I forgot the Santos fight. He was fighting for his life that fight. I mean..lol he threw boxing out of the window. And was just trying to land any haymaker he can throw. He is slow as all shit with his punches as well. I mean the way clottey was countering him with not one but two punches before slow ass could wind up for another wide looper...:yep :yep :yep

He throws fucking arm punches, the guys technique is so poor that it's just astonishing that nobody see's this guy for what he is.

He gets by on conditioning, workrate and a solid beard, but that's not going to work against a top class opponent, it ALMOST didn't get him past a B level opponent in Clottey and wouldn't have had Clottey not injured his hand.

[Lance_Uppercut]

Yes, he was getting outboxed before landing a haymaker.IE Lewis/Gomez/Clottey(though his haymaker did not land)

SO you've seenTHREE margarito fights? So you say he was getting outboxed for ONE round against Gomez and two against Lewis? GEE...good thing Margarito go lucky.:patsch

And he OUTBOXED Clottey BTW. That's what UD means.

[kg0208]

Margarito is a glorified journeyman, end of story. Wait until he finally steps up to an adequate fighter whom is not a hype job like Cintron or a decent 2nd tier like Clottey(whom was on his way to stopping him by the way) and see what happens.

He'll get raped in the ring and this is so easy to predict that it's not even anything to brag about.:yep
You cannot say "end of story" then say "wait and see". So far he has proven to be more than that. Much more than a journeyman.

Malignaggi? He hasn't beaten anyone as good as Cintron. He hasn't FOUGHT anyone besides Cotto as good as Cintron, Lewis, Clottey, etc. Corley....have you looked at the guys Corley has lost to recently? Or even before hand?

Hey, I respect what you have to say, but we have different views entirely on this. You go ONLY by what you see. I go by what I see and then cross reference it to what they have DONE.

[Amsterdam]

You cannot say "end of story" then say "wait and see". So far he has proven to be more than that.

Malignaggi? He hasn't beaten anyone as good as Cintron. He hasn't FOUGHT anyone besides Cotto as good as Cintron, Lewis, Clottey, etc. Corley....have you looked at the guys Corley has lost to recently? Or even before hand?

Hey, I respect what you have to say, but we have different views entirely on this. You go ONLY by what you see. I go by what I see and then cross reference it to what they have DONE.

I have already given what Cintron and Clottey ARE.

Also, the way the wins are counts, N'dou is a B level guy, as is Clottey and honestly they are on the same general level when you compare weight classes.

Throw Clottey in with Judah, Mosely, Collazo and Cotto and he now has as many losses at N'dou has, that I'd GARAUNTEE you.

Hell, I'll step it up and would bet anybody 500$ that Malignaggi would easily outbox Clottey for a wide UD. All of this shit is completely predictable if you see ENOUGH of each fighter and Clottey can't deal with a good, quick mover.

Clottey is similiar to Ngoudjo in ways as well, a guy who just barely got past Bailey and will be outboxed 12-0 by Malignaggi to top off my theory.

[Toopretty]

He throws fucking arm punches, the guys technique is so poor that it's just astonishing that nobody see's this guy for what he is.

He gets by on conditioning, workrate and a solid beard, but that's not going to work against a top class opponent, it ALMOST didn't get him past a B level opponent in Clottey and wouldn't have had Clottey not injured his hand.

The funny thing is PRO-margarito people say that he would cut off the ring and pummel all these good boxers with good footwork and ring smarts. I mean I find that comical. I has a haymaker chance and he does throw SIDE ARMED ARM PUNCHES AND HITS YOU WITH THE INNER PART OF THE GLOVE AND THUMB AREA. HE CANT TURN HIS PUNCH FOR SHIT. IS IT ME OR IS THAT HOW A GIRL PUNCHES :fight:fight:fight:fight:fight

anyway Im surprised his rock head tail has not broken his wrist. And watching him throw a str8 right hand is just too funny I mean the whole process takes about 5 seconds.lo

[Amsterdam]

Toopretty -

The funny thing is that an injured Clottey resorted to pulling an amatuerish "stick and move" tactic late in the fight for one of the later rounds and I clearly remember Margarito having NO answer for it.

I'll up it to say Quintana easily outboxes this clown.

[Toopretty]

SO you've seenTHREE margarito fights? So you say he was getting outboxed for ONE round against Gomez and two against Lewis? GEE...good thing Margarito go lucky.:patsch

And he OUTBOXED Clottey BTW. That's what UD means.

Yes if you watch the fight. You tell me the punch he landed and whether it was set up off a jab. Or was he just fucking swinging wildly and landed one punch out of the 20 he was flinging wide and all over the place. Get a grip you lose clown.:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired

[Lance_Uppercut]

Yes if you watch the fight. You tell me the punch he landed and whether it was set up off a jab. Or was he just fucking swinging wildly and landed one punch out of the 20 he was flinging wide and all over the place. Get a grip you lose clown.:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired:tired

WHo gives a fuck. Margarito won, and until he loses to bums or loses consistenly, he's NOT. Until then, those who's opinion's count or is respected (not yours or many others here) see his as a top WW.

[Toopretty]

Toopretty -

The funny thing is that an injured Clottey resorted to pulling an amatuerish "stick and move" tactic late in the fight for one of the later rounds and I clearly remember Margarito having NO answer for it.

I'll up it to say Quintana easily outboxes this clown.

He cant even punch str8 I have quintana beating him as well. Cotto is a different beast. He throws fast hard shots that dont loop around the universe. I said that 1-2 years ago. Margarito would never fight a guy who can move in the ring. NEVER. Another thing a mover like Quintana would not have to worry about. The guy needs to have both feet planted to get any snap out of his punch. When he is moving and in the middle of the ring he is shit. I have never seen a boxer be that shitty in the middle of the ring and got damned near all of his knockouts with the other guy back against the ropes.

[kg0208]

I have already given what Cintron and Clottey ARE.

Also, the way the wins are counts, N'dou is a B level guy, as is Clottey and honestly they are on the same general level when you compare weight classes.

Throw Clottey in with Judah, Mosely, Collazo and Cotto and he now has as many losses at N'dou has, that I'd GARAUNTEE you.

Hell, I'll step it up and would bet anybody 500$ that Malignaggi would easily outbox Clottey for a wide UD. All of this shit is completely predictable if you see ENOUGH of each fighter and Clottey can't deal with a good, quick mover.

Clottey is similiar to Ngoudjo in ways as well, a guy who just barely got past Bailey and will be outboxed 12-0 by Malignaggi to top off my theory.

I am not going to go with IF's. You are telling me what you think they are. There are a ton of other experts would not agree. I will go with what happened. Clottey has 2 losses. One was a DQ, the other he go hurt and was to a champion. Until I have seen him try to adjust to a speed guy, I cannot, nor can you, say with any certainty that he doesn't have the timing to clock one.

[Toopretty]

I am not going to go with IF's. You are telling me what you think they are. There are a ton of other experts would not agree. I will go with what happened. Clottey has 2 losses. One was a DQ, the other he go hurt and was to a champion. Until I have seen him try to adjust to a speed guy, I cannot, nor can you, say with any certainty that he doesn't have the timing to clock one.

I can respect that, but remember all this is sheer opinion. I think margarito is a bum. I always did. When I seen the santos fight I thought he was a bum with stamina. When I watched the gomez fight. I thought he was an overgrown welter bum fighting an old SHOT-shotgun. When I seen the clottey fight I just seen a guy throwing 80 punches after round 5 when clottey stopped countering him at will. Out of those 80 punches a round he landed about 10 not even clean and they were to the body. Clottey came out of that fight complaining about his finger and you see the camera on margarito and his face look like shredded pork. After 12 rounds with the Tornado and him punching every round and you are complaining about your finger and telling him to his face that Guitterrez fight was alot tougher and that you are ordinary. I mean clottey shitted on him even in a loss. lol:-(:-(:-(

[Amsterdam]

I am not going to go with IF's. You are telling me what you think they are. There are a ton of other experts would not agree. I will go with what happened. Clottey has 2 losses. One was a DQ, the other he go hurt and was to a champion. Until I have seen him try to adjust to a speed guy, I cannot, nor can you, say with any certainty that he doesn't have the timing to clock one.

But I can!:lol:

I really know this situation and fighter all too well KG. I don't have to act like a confused duck just to be fair to rankings, fans on forums and other factors, I know that the guy can't deal with anyone really competant in the WW class.

[kg0208]

But I can!:lol:

I really know this situation and fighter all too well KG. I don't have to act like a confused duck just to be fair to rankings, fans on forums and other factors, I know that the guy can't deal with anyone really competant in the WW class.

You can say the sky is Flourescent Green too....

Point is, I consider champions competent. I know thatr Clottey was beating Baldomir when he was DQ'd. I know that Baldomir beat Judah. I know that Cintron beat the same Estrada that gave Mosley trouble. I know Margarito has beaten both.

I am not calling Margarito a great super caliber all time fighter. I am not going to call a long time champion a bum either.

[kg0208]

I can respect that, but remember all this is sheer opinion. I think margarito is a bum. I always did. When I seen the santos fight I thought he was a bum with stamina. When I watched the gomez fight. I thought he was an overgrown welter bum fighting an old SHOT-shotgun. When I seen the clottey fight I just seen a guy throwing 80 punches after round 5 when clottey stopped countering him at will. Out of those 80 punches a round he landed about 10 not even clean and they were to the body. Clottey came out of that fight complaining about his finger and you see the camera on margarito and his face look like shredded pork. After 12 rounds with the Tornado and him punching every round and you are complaining about your finger and telling him to his face that Guitterrez fight was alot tougher and that you are ordinary. I mean clottey shitted on him even in a loss. lol:-(:-(:-(

But I consider Clottey a good fighter. When healthy, I consider him a top 3 WW. Many here do....

No one can fault another for not taking someone else's opinion as the end of a debate. I am a proof kinda guy.

[o_money]

After beating floyd he sure as hell will.


(haven't read any of this thread guy so i'm just responding to the title)

[princedigital]

Man I don't think so the divison is a beast right now...if he ran through it he would be the man without a doubt.

[Chiko_Tech]

hard my ass its impossible.i dout cotto will go pass 147.and hes not the best in that divsion either.
pbf will ud him
mosley late stop
margo would be a 50 50 fight
the answer is no no no no no no no no.

he dont have a resume close to pbf's and as long as pbf still fights he never will.

pbf is looking to fight mosley or hatton
cotto is looking for the winner of margo and williams.big differ in the whos whos list.

both fighters are still active even mayweather jr, you as question like that when they are both retired but i can answer that one its no.

Floys had not fought superb competision either only a past his best DLH, judah and Castillo all the other wins are overated and are only papaers champions like cotto none of them are hall of fame material Floys have fought shit competition to. so don't hang so much to his nuts.