Greatest Euro Boxer ever?

[PH|LLA]

Marcel Cerdan french boxer of Algerian descent won the world middleweight title.

Retired with a record of 111 wins and 4 losses
2 by DQ, one by UD which was avenged, and one by TKO10 to Jake Lamotta in the last fight of his career. In his fight against Lamotta he injured his left shoulder when he fell in the first round and fought on for 8 rounds throwing only the right hand until he retired after the ninth round.

The rematch was signed but his plane crashed on the way to New York 4 months later

His most notable win is a TKO12 win over Tony Zale for the title.

died at 33 years old.

laAN5PhKgKI

[Russell]

How did a guy like Cerdan end up DQ'ed twice?

What happened?

[PH|LLA]

good question

here's another clip of Cerdan

f-QLAo4r7_8

[fists of fury]

Ta mate. Cerdan is one of my faves. I don't think he was ever really appreciated in the States.

That Lamotta clip is interesting, but it must be noted that by then Cerdan had already injured his shoulder.

[OLD FOGEY]

How did a guy like Cerdan end up DQ'ed twice?

What happened?

I don't know for certain, but there were very tight on the rules in the old days. A video recently ran of a series of David Tua knockouts. In one he hit a man who had clearly been down for quite some time. That would have been a DQ in the old days. Fighters such as Harry Wills suffered DQ's for this sort of thing.

It was interesting that there was no neutral corner rule in the fight with Ferrar. Cerdan swarmed all over him when he was barely up.

[jowcol]

In looking over his career, I found some of his fight locations/dates very interesting. Looks like for most of the war he was fighting in buffered N. African venues but he fought inside France in 1941 and thru 1942 and in Italy in 1944-45. Wasn't France occupied at that time? And 44-45 Italy was still right in the middle of the war.

Any ideas/thoughts/info?

[The Kurgan]

In looking over his career, I found some of his fight locations/dates very interesting. Looks like for most of the war he was fighting in buffered N. African venues but he fought inside France in 1941 and thru 1942 and in Italy in 1944-45. Wasn't France occupied at that time? And 44-45 Italy was still right in the middle of the war.

Any ideas/thoughts/info?

Vichy France was a de jure independant state. Italy, I think, had been in the hands of the Allies for some time by 1944 (especially Sicily) although I don't know much about the Mediterrenean frontier.

Cerdan is one of those boxers who is very hard to criticise. I think, to some extent, his early death helped him in that he never became known by shot performances.

[Luigi1985]

Cerdan was a very good fighter and is today outside of France pretty unknown. But he´s IMO overrated, head-to-head and also legacy-wise. Except a totally shot Zale and Abrams he beat no good fighters, only journeymen and bums. And judging him from tapes, he´s IMO too wide open and would be countered to death by technically fine fighters like most ATG´s MW´s and WW´s. Unfortunately he died so young, so he´s just a talent, we don´t know what he could have archieved more...

[Mendoza]

Cerdan was a bull of a fighter. Good power, good defense, good technique. I beleive one of his DQ losses was a bad call.

[OLD FOGEY]

Cerdan was a very good fighter and is today outside of France pretty unknown. But he´s IMO overrated, head-to-head and also legacy-wise. Except a totally shot Zale and Abrams he beat no good fighters, only journeymen and bums. And judging him from tapes, he´s IMO too wide open and would be countered to death by technically fine fighters like most ATG´s MW´s and WW´s. Unfortunately he died so young, so he´s just a talent, we don´t know what he could have archieved more...

Hello, Luigi. On Cerdan, when did Zale look totally shot until Cerdan defeated him. He was coming off a smashing knockout of Graziano just a few months earlier.
Cerdan also had an impressive victory over Holman Williams. He fought ten fights against rated opposition, not a high number, but did win an impressive eight of them, and was arguably past his best when he lost to LaMotta.

The bottom line on Cerdan is that one could view his career in one or two ways. It is certainly valid to see him as a man who did not have that many fights against really top men. On the other hand, his best years might have been lost to WWII and while his resume is thin, he has some quality wins.

He does look impressive on film also.

[RoccoMarciano]

James Figg

[Bummy Davis]

Did you notice Lamottas left hook to the body, wicked

[Vantage_West]

James Figgi have seen the tapes of him he is a superior fighter to everybody

FACT:good

[dpw417]

I really like Cerdan, enjoy watching his fights quite a bit...but I'd have to go for Ted Lewis due to his resume...

[brownpimp88]

Cerdan was a very good fighter and is today outside of France pretty unknown. But he´s IMO overrated, head-to-head and also legacy-wise. Except a totally shot Zale and Abrams he beat no good fighters, only journeymen and bums. And judging him from tapes, he´s IMO too wide open and would be countered to death by technically fine fighters like most ATG´s MW´s and WW´s. Unfortunately he died so young, so he´s just a talent, we don´t know what he could have archieved more...
I agree 100 percent, technically alan minter and vito antuofermo have better resumes than him. Especially vito, i dont think anyone can tell me his resume is thinner.

[markedwardscott]

I would also consider Max Schmeling as up there with Cerdan. He had a very impressive record before his fights with Joe Louis. Schmeling was a clever boxer with a great right hand counter punch.