The Amir Khan Debate

[srb31079]

On June 21st one of the UK's next world title hopes steps into the ring against one of boxing's more colourful characters, Michael Gomez.

I for one, and probably like most of you, are pretty annoyed at this fight even taking place. Yes, it's another opportunity for Khan to look good. But what are we going to learn from this fight? That Gomez should be on sale in all good sports shops as a walking punch bag? We can never predict what will happen in boxing because "one punch can end it all" but for once I would safely bet all my money that Khan will certainly stop the Mancunian before the 12 rounds is done.

There is absolutely no doubt that Khan is a sensational talent and whilst he may be still a bit rough round the edges. He has what it takes to grab a portion of the lightweight title. Unfortunately this fight against Gomez is a backwards step. Gomez has power for sure and when he gets hit and the shot lands sweetly he almost laughs in your face and encourages his opponent to continue their onslaught. And that's what this fight will be - a slaughtering in more ways than one.

A couple of weeks ago I watched an HBO boxing event that showcased three of the rising stars in world boxing today. All three were in fights where they faced dangerous opponents. I'll use Yuriorkis Gamboa as the example. He faced an opponent named Darling Jimenez in only his tenth fight. And this was a heck of a dangerous opponent for only his tenth fight. And whilst he got dropped, Gamboa will have learned more from his first ten fights than Khan will have from his. The argument for that lies with the promoter. I wont waste my time with the Frank ****** debate as I don't have enough room for it. But when it comes round to Gamboa's 18th fight I feel confident that he'll be fighting for, or defending, a legitimate world title.

I know that Amir Khan's contract with Frank ****** expires soon and we can all see his eagerness to fight bigger names and really get himself in the mix for a world title shot. He is the WBO number two contender but it seems like he'll have to wait a while to get a shot at that or any other world title.

Unless the current lightweight champions are forced to vacate or defend theit title, the current lightweight scene seems to involve Nate Campbell, Joel Casamayor, David Diaz, Manny Pacquaio, Juan Diaz, Michael Katsidis and possibly even Juan Manuel Marquez all in with more of a shot of fighting for world titles with Amir Khan looking on with envy. That is unless he gets away from ******. And there is no doubt that Khan wants a world title shot sooner than the rumoured summer 2009.

If he does not renew his contract then the vultures will be waiting, ready to offer him the deal he craves. I for one would be delighted if he signed with Golden Boy or dare I say it Don King. He'll be fighting a better standard of opponent and will get his title shot sooner.

That's not to say it's a guarantee he'll win one.

[pne buz]

Lets debate the guys boxing credentials when his career starts!No seriously he needs to step up quite a bit on what ****** has been feeding him.At current rate he will only be ready for a genuine title shot in about 7 years.They are so obviously protecting his chin its untrue.Im sure Khan wants to get on with it and should have be in with your Murrays of this world already.

[dan-b]

If he stays with ****** he'll end up like Ricky Hatton, treading water for too long. He needs to break the mould & walk away sooner rather than later.

[J-Dog]

If he stays with ****** he'll end up like Ricky Hatton, treading water for too long. He needs to break the mould & walk away sooner rather than later.

It would be the right move, whether it will happen is a different matter, if Calzaghe had have done that he may have had his world appreciation many years ago....

Khan needs inducted into the Big Ocean from the small pond we can see him treading water in asap

[dan-b]

It would be the right move, whether it will happen is a different matter, if Calzaghe had have done that he may have had his world appreciation many years ago....

Khan needs inducted into the Big Ocean from the small pond we can see him treading water in asap

Frank has come a bit unstuck this time though. He usually targets the WBO because their champions are weak. This time though it's held by a recognised champ & Khan isn't the mandatory. Plus Nate seems fine about fulfilling his mandatories so Khan will have to wait as long as Frank's in charge because he won't be prepared to risk his new golden goose just yet.

[D-MAC]

It struck home to me a bit the other week when SKY showed the delayed coverage of the prospects fighting from America.

I think the Mexican fella Angulo had only had 12 fights, and yet they chucked him in with a very live contender, Guitterez (sp?) i think he was called. This guy, who had twice as many fights as Angulo, and who had only lost once (to contender Clottey), came into the ring to beat the prospect. Angulo got rocked badly at the start of the 5th, but came through the rough patch to force the stoppage at the end of the same round.

Now that is what is called a good progression fight. The opponent not only wanted to win, but still had the tools (ie: he wasn't washed up). Angulo will be a better boxer because of that test.

I don't see the Khan-Gomez fight as anything of a test. Over here we just don't test our fighters like we should; obviously the talent pool isn't as great, but the protection of the fighter's "0" in the loss column seems to be the prime objective.

I believe that this will be the second regression fight in a row for Khan (St.Clair better than Kristjansen, Kristjansen (at this stage) better than Gomez), and that is frankly scandalous.

Frank ****** should go hang himself.

[pne buz]

It struck home to me a bit the other week when SKY showed the delayed coverage of the prospects fighting from America.

I think the Mexican fella Angulo had only had 12 fights, and yet they chucked him in with a very live contender, Guitterez (sp?) i think he was called. This guy, who had twice as many fights as Angulo, and who had only lost once (to contender Clottey), came into the ring to beat the prospect. Angulo got rocked badly at the start of the 5th, but came through the rough patch to force the stoppage at the end of the same round.

Now that is what is called a good progression fight. The opponent not only wanted to win, but still had the tools (ie: he wasn't washed up). Angulo will be a better boxer because of that test.

I don't see the Khan-Gomez fight as anything of a test. Over here we just don't test our fighters like we should; obviously the talent pool isn't as great, but the protection of the fighter's "0" in the loss column seems to be the prime objective.

I believe that this will be the second regression fight in a row for Khan (St.Clair better than Kristjansen, Kristjansen (at this stage) better than Gomez), and that is frankly scandalous.

Frank ****** should go hang himself.

Spot on.The Murrays,Thaxtons and even Johanessons are where he would have learned up to now.But with those fights does come a small element of risk and ****** doesnt go in for that risk lark!

[J-Dog]

Frank has come a bit unstuck this time though. He usually targets the WBO because their champions are weak. This time though it's held by a recognised champ & Khan isn't the mandatory. Plus Nate seems fine about fulfilling his mandatories so Khan will have to wait as long as Frank's in charge because he won't be prepared to risk his new golden goose just yet.

His relationship with WBO is very questionable......

Frank not gonna wanna risk him for a while with the slow learning curve he's on it could be a long while, its a shame Frank as at the helm and causing this problem....Nate was recently saying that he would give Khan his shot no problem, if Khan could get some real dipping in the vat he would sharp have his shot with a real Champ and take a worthy World Title win home....

Beating Nate is a different matter considering we just dont know how good or bad Khan actually is yet....

[trotter]

I think some of the criticism is harsh.

Gomez will be a test of sorts, out of the ring as much as anything.

I don't think Amir's opposition has been too bad to this point but after Gomez I'd be expecting him to step it up.

Best thing he could do would be to leave these shores, if he seriously wants to be all that he can be. Get to the States, get out of the newspapers, and be a real boxing pro for the next few years.

[dan-b]

get out of the newspapers

I think you're onto something there. He's very much part of the Jade Goody, Sheryl Cole, OK magazine, Sun brigade now. Does he want to be a celebrity or a fighter?

[Cobbler]

I'll use Yuriorkis Gamboa as the example. He faced an opponent named Darling Jimenez in only his tenth fight. And this was a heck of a dangerous opponent for only his tenth fight. And whilst he got dropped, Gamboa will have learned more from his first ten fights than Khan will have from his.

Wouldn't it be better to use an example of someone vaguelly similar in circumstances to Khan?

Rather than a 26 year old who turned pro after the experience of several hundred amateur bouts.

[Cobbler]

I'm not an expert on the Filipino local scene, for instance, but in his 16th and 17th fights Manny Pacquaio fought opponents with a combined total of one win and 13 defeats between them.

I'm thinking they probably weren't a class above St Clair and Kristjansen...

[dan-b]

Wouldn't it be better to use an example of someone vaguelly similar in circumstances to Khan?

Rather than a 26 year old who turned pro after the experience of several hundred amateur bouts.

So being an Olympic silver medallist isn't good enough pedigree? History generally speaks differently.

[dan-b]

I'm not an expert on the Filipino local scene, for instance, but in his 16th and 17th fights Manny Pacquaio fought opponents with a combined total of one win and 13 defeats between them.

I'm thinking they probably weren't a class above St Clair and Kristjansen...

:? At 20 he held a WBC title.

[Cobbler]

So being an Olympic silver medallist isn't good enough pedigree? History generally speaks differently.

What's pedigree got to do with it.

Just common sense that someone with a long amateur career turning pro in their mid twenties is likely to get moved along faster than someone with a much shorter amateur career turning pro in their late teens.

Do you think Gamboa leant nothing between the age of 17 and 25? That he didn't improve as a fighter at all?

[Cobbler]

:? At 20 he held a WBC title.

Yes, exactly the point. No reason Khan can't do likewise by his 25th fight.

[dan-b]

What's pedigree got to do with it.

Just common sense that someone with a long amateur career turning pro in their mid twenties is likely to get moved along faster than someone with a much shorter amateur career turning pro in their late teens.

Do you think Gamboa leant nothing between the age of 17 and 25? That he didn't improve as a fighter at all?

Tell that to Audley Harrison. So what is the next move for Khan then? Winning a bauble of some kind & making several defences against inferior opposition?

[dan-b]

Yes, exactly the point. No reason Khan can't do likewise by his 25th fight.

Doesn't look likely with ****** at the helm though does it?

[Cobbler]

Doesn't look likely with ****** at the helm though does it?

Who knows? By all accounts the Gomez fight represents the last of the current contract with Khan and I doubt Khan will sign up with ****** again if he's not going to deliver the requisite matches.

On the other hand, the ****** angle is a bit over stressed. He has a record of delivering big fights for his fighters arguably superior to any other British promoter anyway.

[dan-b]

Who knows? By all accounts the Gomez fight represents the last of the current contract with Khan and I doubt Khan will sign up with ****** again if he's not going to deliver the requisite matches.

On the other hand, the ****** angle is a bit over stressed. He has a record of delivering big fights for his fighters arguably superior to any other British promoter anyway.

His record at delivering proper world title bouts is poor though. Gomez is a bad match up, especially when ****** has been quoted as saying Khan is beyond euro level already.:rofl

[treva1977]

i think it is now time for a challenge to find out how good he really is.
there are five people ranked above him ,nate campbell,joel casamayor,juan diaz,michael katsidis and david diaz.
he needs to fight any one of these.
might as well be a title fight.

[dan-b]

i think it is now time for a challenge to find out how good he really is.
there are five people ranked above him ,nate campbell,joel casamayor,juan diaz,michael katsidis and david diaz.
he needs to fight any one of these.
might as well be a title fight.

Whether it's for a strap or not, anything has to be better than Michael Gomez for a fighter who's promoter claims is already beyond euro level.

[rooq]

His record at delivering proper world title bouts is poor though. Gomez is a bad match up, especially when ****** has been quoted as saying Khan is beyond euro level already.:rofl

yes, strange how thaxton is a step backwards but gomez is a good learning fight. :think

what are the odds on romanov or an immediate title shot being mentioned as the next fight after khan stops gomez?

[dan-b]

yes, strange how thaxton is a step backwards but gomez is a good learning fight. :think

what are the odds on romanov or an immediate title shot being mentioned as the next fight after khan stops gomez?

High I'd say. ****** must have been gutted to hear Campbell actually thinks his WBO belt is worth keeping.:lol:

[pne buz]

i think it is now time for a challenge to find out how good he really is.
there are five people ranked above him ,nate campbell,joel casamayor,juan diaz,michael katsidis and david diaz.
he needs to fight any one of these.
might as well be a title fight.

Id like to see him fight for the British and European in that order.

[Cobbler]

His record at delivering proper world title bouts is poor though.

Well, it's a little subjective. But he delivered Eubank for Calzaghe in Joe's first 20 fights, then Lacy, Kessler and Hopkins later. Tszyu for Hatton. Both careers have 2 or 3 years that could have been better utilised I think we agree, but the names that are there are good.

Would Maccarinelli really have got to fight the linear CW champion with another promoter?

Like I said I don't see another British promoter who delievers better than that. When you look at the records of non-****** British fighters that have been mixing or claiming to mix in World Class then they hardly blow that away, to say the least. Witter, Froch et al.

[pne buz]

There is also a big chance that Khan could step up a weight before even fighting a world class lightweight IMO.Weak division and a whole new set of bums to start on!I bet Malignaggi would be high on ******s agenda in the not too distant future!(fits the bill perfectly,high profile and no punch)

[mstar]

i am sorry but us who on ESB who know our boxing, just want amir to STOP fighting bums and fight some REAL world class opponents. Until he does he is just a fighter fighting bums climibing up the rankings does he really think he beat nate campbell??

[kurt2006]

High I'd say. ****** must have been gutted to hear Campbell actually thinks his WBO belt is worth keeping.:lol:

Don't worrk fwankie will have been on the phone to his brother at the WBU to get a title shot for Khan. If we can't have the WBO title we can have the next best thing the WBU.

[Ubersteve]

Gomez fight to me just seems like a stay busy fight mid trainer switch. When he's looking to change his training routine, at the stage it's at, I don't think it's worth the risk to put him in with someone who could beat him.

Once he's training with whoever he ends up with, he'll get bigger fights I think.

Not going to judge him now, his opposition has been stagnant the past couple of fights (I thought he was moving up okay before then) but understandable given the circumstances of his trainer switch and TV deal ending.

[TFFP]

I downloaded Campbell vs. Diaz today, and I can actually confirm he will beat the fuck out of Khan on the inside

He ain't going anywhere either :yep

[dwilson]

Gomez will stop Khan by the 5th round.

[Eubank]

You guys are a joke, it is right and propper that Khan is held back from te world level until he has matured. Nothing wrong with the level Khan is fighting. for a 21 year old he is fighting at a very high standard.

[kurt2006]

You guys are a joke, it is right and propper that Khan is held back from te world level until he has matured. Nothing wrong with the level Khan is fighting. for a 21 year old he is fighting at a very high standard.

Then Khan is a joke because on more than one occassion he has mentioned he is ready for world title shot and all the talk about breaking the record set by Naz.

[Eubank]

Khan thinks he can beat anyone but there is no need to take unnecessary risks so early. Frank ****** is doing a great jog trying to keep Khan grounded.

[kurt2006]

Then Khan should keep his mouth shut and stop going on about world title shots till he is mature enough.

He does not help himself by making big claims then only fighting cans or fighters who are not natural at the weight.

[toffeejack]

Then Khan is a joke because on more than one occassion he has mentioned he is ready for world title shot and all the talk about breaking the record set by Naz.

Exactly, him and his followers can't have it both ways.

I can't wait till he gets sparked out when he steps up in class and I think it's a complete joke that he's worth so much money off winning a silver medal when there's other more worthy pros not earning anywhere near as much.

[Beeston Brawler]

You shouldn't be able to get a title shot without proving that you are the best in your division in your own country.

Forget all this inter-alphabetty nonsense - if Khan never wins a world title what will people say of his career?

Former WBO Intercontinental champion Amir Khan was today arrested on suspicion of speeding, and is due to appear in court on......... blah blah

Where the likes of Jon Thaxton could appear on Sky Sports as summarisers, and the caption would come up saying British Champion 2006 - whenever

The thing that pisses people off is the hypocracy - fine if he is being held back, but don't start bleating on about title shots, saying you are above European level, then set up a fight with a bloke who got chinned in a 130lb British title challenge last year.

OK - Gomez will probably give him an examination the like of which he has never had, i.e. a guy who will mix it up and go toe-to-toe, but he won't correct the gammy jab or the fact that Amir looks totally lost when fighting inside. To progress as a fighter you need to be able to fight different ways against different kinds of opponents - not going in there with feather fisted, sluggish, upright operators as he has done.

[pne buz]

You shouldn't be able to get a title shot without proving that you are the best in your division in your own country.

Forget all this inter-alphabetty nonsense - if Khan never wins a world title what will people say of his career?

Former WBO Intercontinental champion Amir Khan was today arrested on suspicion of speeding, and is due to appear in court on......... blah blah

Where the likes of Jon Thaxton could appear on Sky Sports as summarisers, and the caption would come up saying British Champion 2006 - whenever



The thing that pisses people off is the hypocracy - fine if he is being held back, but don't start bleating on about title shots, saying you are above European level, then set up a fight with a bloke who got chinned in a 130lb British title challenge last year.

OK - Gomez will probably give him an examination the like of which he has never had, i.e. a guy who will mix it up and go toe-to-toe, but he won't correct the gammy jab or the fact that Amir looks totally lost when fighting inside. To progress as a fighter you need to be able to fight different ways against different kinds of opponents - not going in there with feather fisted, sluggish, upright operators as he has done.

Nail on the head.

[Beeston Brawler]

[quote=Beeston Brawler]Former WBO Intercontinental champion Amir Khan was today arrested on suspicion of speeding, and is due to appear in court on......... blah blah
quote]

The presenter would probably have a tongue twist when trying to say WBO intercontinental champion :lol: