Mike Tyson vs. George Foreman

[teeto]

This is most likely not a rare thread, but the reason ive done this is because of 2 certain viewpoints that can be taken here.

My good friend Bing, who posts here, recently give the view that Tyson cannot fight going backwards, and George Foreman is so immensely strong, that Tyson WOULD be going backwards in this one. That eould be Tyson's demise in this one. Very good point, but i think there is a counter-argument- i think Foreman's biggest weakness is stamina, what about when Foreman receives the most accurate pin-point combinations to body and head (body being the main focal point of this sentence)?

No disrespect to Frazier, but Mike Tyson is not Joe Frazier, in a million years of evolution Frazier does not posess the variation in offense that prime Tyson does. Also, Tyson has the footwork to take advantage of Foremsn's not great defense and land the speedy body and head shots imo.

Both points are very good imo, what do you guys think?

The other argument is that Mike never fought as good opposition as Tyson, but Mike did have a more prolific period of dominance imo.

Bing, i put your name on the thread cos i didnt wanna steal your thunder with the very good point that you made!! Not a way of tryin to piss you off or anything!!!:good

[mr. magoo]

While Tyson certainly had the power and handspeed to bust up Foreman, he simply did not have the style that I'd favor to beat him. Fighters who who shorter and fought by lowering their center of gravity into a crouching stance generally got destroyed by Foreman. I know we can't name anyone of Tysons' calibur who Foreman did this to, but the blue print is still pretty well defined. The larger and stronger the opponents got, the more trouble Mike typically had with them, and I can think of know one during Tyson's prime who resembled Foreman in most aspects.

[teeto]

While Tyson certainly had the power and handspeed to bust up Foreman, he simply did not have the style that I'd favor to beat him. Fighters who who shorter and fought by lowering their center of gravity into a crouching stance generally got destroyed by Foreman. I know we can't name anyone of Tysons' calibur who Foreman did this to, but the blue print is still pretty well defined. The larger and stronger the opponents got, the more trouble Mike typically had with them, and I can think of know one during Tyson's prime who resembled Foreman in most aspects.
Yea, but Tyson always fought taller guys himself, you're right on the stylistic point though

[mr. magoo]

Yea, but Tyson always fought taller guys himself, you're right on the stylistic point though

Agreed,

but if we study the trends, we will see that the more larger opponents, usually gave Tyson the most trouble. Tony Tucker, Boncrusher Smith, Frank Bruno, Razor Ruddock and Buster Douglas were all over 6'3", and had larger builds. These men either took Tyson the distance, troubled him, or beat him. Foreman would be right up in with that bunch, and likely the best of them.

I realize that this comparison doesn't tell the whole story and for all I know, may mean nothing, but its just more food for thought.

[Muchmoore]

Tyson has the perfect style for Foreman. Tyson's short, and has to come in to land punches which is what Foreman wants. Foreman could certainly push him back and land big punches as well. BUT, Tyson's handspeed will cause all kinds of trouble here. Foreman even at his best didn't possess great speed of hand or foot and his defense was poor. To his credit his defense improved during his comeback. Tyson WILL be able to land punches on Foreman and with his punching ability which is at the very top of all time, I think he would stop Foreman. Foremans punches were devastating, but Tyson had great defense at his peak and was hard to hit with a big punch.

It would be an absolute war, however and I could see Foreman knocking Tyson out as well. But if I had to bet, I would pick peak Tyson by KO.

[Hatesrats]

One thing is for sure, this fight would not reach the score cards....
(IMO a Young George Foreman would be the better matchup for Tyson)


George's uppercut's on the inside would be a nightmare for Mike,
Tyson's "Iron chin" would defo get put to the test right from the start.
If Mike can survive an upperct from George and continue to press then more than likely I see Foreman's confidence dwindle as the round's progressed. (That's assuming Foreman can also survive Mike's Bomb's that is...) Both have had stamina prob's in the past, but for the sake of "Fantasy" I'm going to assume they are both at their best. Tyson's movement and speed seperates him from Fraizer's crab defense up, croutch, down predictable defensive style.. IMO Tyson has a more potent arsenal of punches that can all K.O. anyone at any time. George would have to keep away and find a way to frustrate Tyson without putting himself at risk, if Foreman can do that I can see him wearing down Tyson. If George confuses Tyson and decides to slug it out like he did with Fraizer & Norton then I see a short night for George. Young Mike know's nothing else but to seek & destroy.

I got Mike Tyson by 8th RD. K.O.
If Foreman lands that Uppercut early tho, I got George by K.O. in 3

[Muchmoore]

but if we study the trends, we will see that the more larger opponents, usually gave Tyson the most trouble. Tony Tucker, Boncrusher Smith, Frank Bruno, Razor Ruddock and Buster Douglas were all over 6'3", and had larger builds. These men either took Tyson the distance, troubled him, or beat him. Foreman would be right up in with that bunch, and likely the best of them.



But in fairness to Tyson, those guys are the best fighters Tyson fought. Tony Tubbs was 6'3", Larry Holmes was 6'3", Tyrell Biggs was 6'5", Carl Williams had freakishly long arms and stood 6'4", and Pinklon Thomas was also 6'3". These are all fighters that Tyson destroyed that are large opponents.

[SuzieQ49]

I actually like a peak tyson by knockout in this one

[AnthonyJ74]

While Tyson certainly had the power and handspeed to bust up Foreman, he simply did not have the style that I'd favor to beat him. Fighters who who shorter and fought by lowering their center of gravity into a crouching stance generally got destroyed by Foreman. I know we can't name anyone of Tysons' calibur who Foreman did this to, but the blue print is still pretty well defined. The larger and stronger the opponents got, the more trouble Mike typically had with them, and I can think of know one during Tyson's prime who resembled Foreman in most aspects.

You make valid assertions. While I think a Tyson/Foreman fight would be explosive, it's awfully hard to make a prediction with any certainty either way.

As far as Tyson having trouble with larger and stronger opposition - I think most fighters have trouble when their opposition gets bigger and stronger. I don't think that's something that only applies to a guy like Tyson. And not only that, most of the guys that Tyson brutally knocked out were big and strong, many of whom were at least as big, or bigger, than George Foreman in his prime.

[Chinxkid]

I would love to see this one. I guess in these hypotheticals we're always talking prime for prime, so I'm imagining the Foreman that fought Frazier versus a pre-meltdown Mike.

In my view it's the long, hard, straight-shooters that were textbook trouble for Mike, 'cause Tyson's comin' at you, guarantee that, and Foreman does fit that bill, he's got the range and the heavy-leather to stop Mike in his tracks. Question for me always, in a big-man, little-man match-up, is (a) does the little guy with the reach disadvantage have the elusiveness to get in, and (b) does the big guy have the accuracy and enough starch on his shots to keep him out?

Here we're dealing with a little guy who got in as well as any; Tyson early on was taught to use angles with good upper body and head movement on his way in, and to launch big shots off of that movement, that momentum, and we all know how hard Big George could hit. There may be some question as to his accuracy, he did seem to lope some of his shots in the early days, but no doubt he would land enough solids that make this hypothetical an intriguing one.

If I gotta pick, I see Tyson getting inside, in between George's slightly roundhouse shots, bringing thunder the way only he did. Big George could be in big trouble.

[Bing]

Thanks Teeto, I just cant see Tyson withstanding Foremans brutal assault both were on top fighters but Foreman has a greater resolve imo. Also can see Tyson falling apart when pushed back and getting took out in about 4. Can see the argument for Tyson and he would have a chance but just feel George has a bigger chance of succeeding.

[mr. magoo]

most of the guys that Tyson brutally knocked out were big and strong, many of whom were at least as big, or bigger, than George Foreman in his prime.

True, but many of the contenders or champions who troubled or beat Tyson were only slightly bigger than Foreman, or right around the same size. In addition, none of whom had ever utterly destroyed a fighter who fought a somewhat similar style to Tyson's, such as the type that Joe Frazier fought... Foreman would be a very dangerous test for Tyson. I am not claiming with any certainty that George would just walk away with this one, nor vice versa, but when we have a case where two all time great punchers are going at it, anything can happen. In such a situation, styles are critical, and for that reason, I think Foreman has the edge based on his performances against men of similar stances, size and talent level...

[Bing]

tyson by easy knockout.

he holds every singe advantage

Handspeed, power, chin, stamina, skill, size.


Foreman was almost always dead on his feet after six rounds against bums.

He wouldnt see the end of the first round in this one.

Ha ha i see we have a wind up merchant joining the party.

[McGrain]

Tyson.

Foreman sometimes punches from behind himself for christ sake. The straight punches he throws aren't exactly lightning. Tyson, meanwhile, has really fast feet, is good at gettin under shots, hits very accurately with speed and power. Foreman is an open target for this type of arsenal.

Secondly, if Foreman catches Tyson, Tyson can survive, he has a very good chin. He gets discouraged when he gets hit, Tyson, but not when he's having his own joy, and he would be scoring plenty here.

Assuming he doesn't get excited, a la Marvin Frazier, he would score a stoppage pretty early in my view, first half of the fight.

[Moralman]

Dear Friends
kind regards
Mike Tyson versus George Foreman.
I have covered this match up in my Fantasy warfare threads at the general forum.
My prediction is the same now as it was back in December 2003.
George Foreman would KO Mike Tyson in round 8.
Foreman was Tyson's match, he'd win a slugfest and bully the bully.
Whenever Tyson comes forward, he either gets jabbed, pushed back or the dreaded uppercut.
Foreman would gradually pick him apart and then finish him off.
George Foreman wins by KO in round 8.
yours thankfully
John

[jones1]

Something else to consider in a matchup like this would be Tyson's mental state: Cus obviously tried to make Tyson replicate Frazier's style. Thus he probably warned Mike about fighting someone like Foreman. I think Mike's style was superior to Frazier's with simple things such as he didn't lead with his head and could put you down with either hand. So in conclusion to all of this I think that Foreman would knock Tyson out on the count of Mike would have no confidence against him and with someone like Mike he would need that confidence to make a fight out of it. He would have been defeated before he ever stepped in the ring and probably would never have even accepted the fight. I think an easily discouraged and fearful Mike gets taken out within the first four rounds. Now you could flip flop the situation and say that if somehow Mike went into this fight with confidence and a set mindframe, I believe he would knock out Foreman somewhere around the 6th round.
Either way it would be a hell of a fight.

[Blacc Jesus]

Who takes a fight between Tyson/Foreman in '91?

[Bing]

Who takes a fight between Tyson/Foreman in '91?
Think Tyson would win. Foreman wasn't as fast as in his prime and wouldn't have the offense to keep mike off. Tyson would be landing at will and when Tysons hitting you at will.... well you know the rest

[teeto]

Ha ha i see we have a wind up merchant joining the party.
I see we do!!!

[Chinxkid]

Something else to consider in a matchup like this would be Tyson's mental state: Cus obviously tried to make Tyson replicate Frazier's style. Thus he probably warned Mike about fighting someone like Foreman. I think Mike's style was superior to Frazier's with simple things such as he didn't lead with his head and could put you down with either hand. So in conclusion to all of this I think that Foreman would knock Tyson out on the count of Mike would have no confidence against him and with someone like Mike he would need that confidence to make a fight out of it. He would have been defeated before he ever stepped in the ring and probably would never have even accepted the fight. I think an easily discouraged and fearful Mike gets taken out within the first four rounds. Now you could flip flop the situation and say that if somehow Mike went into this fight with confidence and a set mindframe, I believe he would knock out Foreman somewhere around the 6th round.
Either way it would be a hell of a fight.
Great take! Mike's mental state up until he climbs into the ring could be #1 factor here; which Tyson shows up that night, the stone killer or the little boy?

[jones1]

that just might be the single most stupid thing ever said in all of human history.
what? frazier isnt the heavyweight that tyson was compared to the most? tyson didnt have the same swarming style with head movement to get him inside? if not frazier then who else?

[teeto]

what? frazier isnt the heavyweight that tyson was compared to the most? tyson didnt have the same swarming style with head movement to get him inside? if not frazier then who else?
I get you, but if you read my initial post (the thread), i have outlined some of their differences. The style maybe similar, but Tyson used much more footwork to his advantage to open guys up, whereas Frazier really was a swarmer who relied on his big left.

[jones1]

I get you, but if you read my initial post (the thread), i have outlined some of their differences. The style maybe similar, but Tyson used much more footwork to his advantage to open guys up, whereas Frazier really was a swarmer who relied on his big left.
true and Tyson didnt have Frazier's biggest flaw which imo was leading with his head. I was just saying that I thought that Cus used Frazier as something to look up to while training Tyson if you know what I mean.

[teeto]

true and Tyson didnt have Frazier's biggest flaw which imo was leading with his head. I was just saying that I thought that Cus used Frazier as something to look up to while training Tyson if you know what I mean.
Yea, much better technically Tyson was, i get you though

[teeto]

I was gunna say Tyson is more Patterson than Frazier, didnt wanna get argumentative though!!!

[radianttwilight]

Tyson was a shorter, beefier version of Floyd Patterson.

When you think about it it's really obvious.

[jones1]

Cus D'amato molded floyd patterson's style after jack dempsey. tyson's style was molded on floyd patterson's style.

Frazier doesnt fit in anywhere.
Oh my bad :patsch , I just assumed because of all the similarities between Tyson and Frazier. But I didnt really mean to stress that as much as I thought that Cus would have told Tyson that someone with Foreman's style would be his cryptonite. Like it would have hurt his confidence to be fighting Foreman, a puncher who has the potential to keep mike off him if he can land on him.

[fists of fury]

We've had this matchup many, many times and each time I've picked Tyson.

The thing for me is this:

In his heyday, Tyson was disciplined. George never was. George was reckless and extremely wild at times. His defence was also sorely lacking, consisting of throwing his arms up in the air to deflect punches, which is barely a defence at all. He also wound up his punches like a barroom brawler.
He is going to be there to be hit all day since Tyson brings handspeed vastly superior into the ring and will exploit those technical deficiences.

[ironchamp]

Tyson,

Better handspeed, better stamina, better chin and techinically more proficient.

George will have problems establishing himself. He'll land a big shot or two but not nearly enough to change the tide nor will it be enough to keep Tyson off him. Foreman's inability to keep Tyson from landing is why I lean towards Mike.

Tyson TKO5

[markedwardscott]

Great match. I think Tyson catches an uppercut and gets kayoed.

[Holmes' Jab]

Tyson, late round stoppage.