Who is the Greatest British fighter of All-Time?

[Hatesrats]

Discuss? :bbb
Lennox Lewis
Nigel Benn
Chris Eubank
Frank Bruno
Joe Calzaghe
Prince Naseem Hamed
Ricky Hatton
Other.....?

[kurt2006]

Baz Carey, the guy fights nearly twice a month. None of those mentioned above could fight once a month let alone twice.

[TFFP]

Fitzsimmons, by a distance

Wilde, Ted 'Kid' Lewis, the other Lewis comfortably make the top 5

[Hatesrats]

Fitzsimmons, by a distance

Wilde, Ted 'Kid' Lewis, the other Lewis comfortably make the top 5
Cool, keep 'em coming I'm trying to learn British Boxing bro's.
(I'm just going by the consenus of Modern's who made it here in the U.S., by no means do I say they are the best...drop some knowledge.)

Where do the Modern names fit in a British top 10?
like a Calzaghe, Hatton , Haye rank? ect...

[TFFP]

Well, a lot of the names you mention are more like in the teens to 25 range, with the obvious exception of Lewis and maybe Calzaghe. These guys simply don't fight enough, and/or are too protected to rack up the sort of resume some of the great old timers did. You'll get people who are modernists and see it differently though. Personally my top 10 would be something like

1. Bob Fitzsimmons
2. Jimmy Wilde
3. Ted 'Kid' Lewis
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Jim Driscoll
6. Freddie Welsh
7. Ken Buchanan
8. Benny Lynch
9. Joe Calzaghe
10. Randy Turpin

Then I'd starting looking to some of the more recent names.

[robpalmer135]

Calzaghe, Hammed or Lewis in my opinion.

[Hatesrats]

Well, a lot of the names you mention are more like in the teens to 25 range, with the obvious exception of Lewis and maybe Calzaghe. These guys simply don't fight enough, and/or are too protected to rack up the sort of resume some of the great old timers did. You'll get people who are modernists and see it differently though. Personally my top 10 would be something like

1. Bob Fitzsimmons
2. Jimmy Wilde
3. Ted 'Kid' Lewis
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Jim Driscoll
6. Freddie Welsh
7. Ken Buchanan
8. Benny Lynch
9. Joe Calzaghe
10. Randy Turpin

Then I'd starting looking to some of the more recent names.
THX TFFP, I'll check these guy's out.
I appreciate it bro. :good

[BritInvasion]

Some of the old school: Ted Kid Lewis, Benny Lynch, Jimmy Wilde, Ken Buchanan, Jack Kid Berg, Jim Driscoll, Fitz (if we're claiming him).

[TFFP]

I mean the top 3 are really no brainers

Bob Fitzsimmons, although it can be disputed he's even British, was the first 3 division world champion winning at middle lightheavy and heavyweight. Obviously an incredible achievement, in days when you didn't have ABC's to pick off

Jimmy Wilde is universally considered the greatest flyweight of all-time, one of the greatest punchers of all time and his resume really speaks for itself. Despite being a tiny man and almost always giving up weight. It is quite possible he'd be a 3 division world champion today given we have straw, jr fly and flyweight

Ted Kid Lewis is another with an amazing resume, over 300 recorded fights, fighting across 6 divisions.

[Hatesrats]

I mean the top 3 are really no brainers

Bob Fitzsimmons, although it can be disputed he's even British, was the first 3 division world champion winning at middle lightheavy and heavyweight. Obviously an incredible achievement, in days when you didn't have ABC's to pick off

Jimmy Wilde is universally considered the greatest flyweight of all-time, one of the greatest punchers of all time and his resume really speaks for itself. Despite being a tiny man and almost always giving up weight. It is quite possible he'd be a 3 division world champion today given we have straw, jr fly and flyweight

Ted Kid Lewis is another with an amazing resume, over 300 recorded fights, fighting across 6 divisions.
Yeah, I defo need to brush up on my classic stuff 'pre 50's/60's ect, I'm 32 Yrs old.
and hella stuck on my era stuff and more modern stuff, but I defo appreciate History.
I'll study up on these guy's bro, THX.

[TommyV]

1 Bob Fitzsimmons
2 Kid Ted Lewis
3 Jimmy Wilde

[robpalmer135]

really it is hamed though. I mean boxing is entertainment at the end of the day, and he got more people intrested in boxing than any other fighter in this country. i became intrested in boxing because of Hamed, i would imagine there are alot of people on here that our the same.

Even if u dont agree u must see my point, i mean Ministry of Sound and Adidad sponserd his fights, i cant imagine that happening again!

[kurt2006]

really it is hamed though. I mean boxing is entertainment at the end of the day, and he got more people intrested in boxing than any other fighter in this country. i became intrested in boxing because of Hamed, i would imagine there are alot of people on here that our the same.

Even if u dont agree u must see my point, i mean Ministry of Sound and Adidad sponserd his fights, i cant imagine that happening again!

Khan has reebok, Lewis had SPX :hey

[columbo man]

lennox lewis !!!!!

[robpalmer135]

reebok are with Khan cos of bolton connection. Adidas were with Naz becos he was bloody cool

[kurt2006]

reebok are with Khan cos of bolton connection. Adidas were with Naz becos he was bloody cool

What about SPX then ? Did anyone ever buy an SPX tracksuit or trainers ?

[girv]

Ken Buchanan is my #1

[TFFP]

Ken Buchanan is my #1
No Scottish bias at all then? :D

[dukestreet]

my favourite is nigel benn, the greatest is hard to choose from fitzimmons if you class him as british

[Hatesrats]

Nice, this thread is great.
THX. keep them coming.

[girv]

No Scottish bias at all then? :D

Ha ha, i've been found out!

If Im being honest TFFP your list is pretty much spot on although I would make Buchanan 4th.

It was easier to tell who were the real rulers before all these belts appeared. 20+ years ago and more you did not win a world title and have a long reign unless you were absolute class, now its possible to hold onto a belt for a long time without facing real opposition.

This is great for the fighter as it makes them wealthy in a lot of cases but in terms of legacy its very hard to put an undefeated Calzaghe higher as for a long time his opposition sucked.

Not saying for one minute Calzaghe aint a great fighter but had he consistently faced the best over the last 10 years, even with a loss or two he might have been higher on your list

[Hatesrats]

Has it always been expected for fighter's from over sea's to fight in the U.S.?
Or did fighter's tend to travel more based on championship.

[TFFP]

Ha ha, i've been found out!

If Im being honest TFFP your list is pretty much spot on although I would make Buchanan 4th.

It was easier to tell who were the real rulers before all these belts appeared. 20+ years ago and more you did not win a world title and have a long reign unless you were absolute class, now its possible to hold onto a belt for a long time without facing real opposition.

This is great for the fighter as it makes them wealthy in a lot of cases but in terms of legacy its very hard to put an undefeated Calzaghe higher as for a long time his opposition sucked.

Not saying for one minute Calzaghe aint a great fighter but had he consistently faced the best over the last 10 years, even with a loss or two he might have been higher on your list
Yep, exactly. This is the reason I find it difficult to rank modern fighters over some of the old timers, unless they have an exceptional case, like Lennox Lewis

They fight a couple of times a year, so less fights are made. Less fights are made anyway, due to politics. It is very easy to pickup an ABC, therefore being a champion doesn't mean as much

It's very difficut for anybody to do these days. For Calzaghe to have made the top 5 he would have had to beat Ottke and Beyer to unify the division earlier in his career (not really his fault), fought Hopkins earlier (no fault of his own here), put up a good fight against RJJ (Jones didn't want it anyway), move up to LHW earlier and have beaten guys like Tarver and Johnson

Which just illustrates the point, politics makes it very difficult.

[girv]

Has it always been expected for fighter's from over sea's to fight in the U.S.?
Or did fighter's tend to travel more based on championship.

In Ken Buchanans instance he had to travel to the baking hot heat of San Juan, Puerto Rico to fight outdoors to get his title shot. Thats what makes his win all the more remarkable.

How many modern Brits could have pulled that one off?

I suppose the fights will always be where the money is and like it or not that has often meant the US for the biggest fights.

[TFFP]

Has it always been expected for fighter's from over sea's to fight in the U.S.?
Or did fighter's tend to travel more based on championship.
Most of the old guys would fight at home in the UK, before moving onto the US. There wasn't such a strong European scene, as there is now, so there was nothing to stay for and the money was made in America. You couldn't pack out a football stadium fighting a can like now :lol:

You had to fight tough competition, and often, to make money. No easy pay days

You'll find most of these guys fought in the US, if not all of them

[janitor]

Bob Fitzsimmons as others have said is the clear choice among the gloved champions.

If we include great pound for pound British fighters of the bare knuckle era such as Jem Mace and Tom Sayers then the picture becomes a lot more complicated.

[Betty Swollocks]

:lol:
well I need to brush up on my boxing history, but I still wouldn't suggest the likes of Ricky Hatton and Frank Bruno to be up there, laughable.

thanks for the insightful posts from the likes of TFFP.

I've always had Buchanan number 1, but admit to not knowing enough about the likes of Wilde and Fitsimmons. So i'm bias. The only guy from the last 20 years that should be in that company is Lennox, surely?

[janitor]

Most of the old guys would fight at home in the UK, before moving onto the US. There wasn't such a strong European scene, as there is now, so there was nothing to stay for and the money was made in America. You couldn't pack out a football stadium fighting a can like now :lol:

You had to fight tough competition, and often, to make money. No easy pay days

You'll find most of these guys fought in the US, if not all of them

For much of the 19th century Britain was the meca of boxing and the top American fighters had to come here.

[TFFP]

For much of the 19th century Britain was the meca of boxing and the top American fighters had to come here.
I wasn't aware of that, my knowledge pre-1900 is poor. I always think of Wilde fighting in the States later in his career, but I suppose it also true he fought Americans in the UK. Also Fitzsimmons doing virtually all his work there, although he was never based in the UK to begin with.

[Hatesrats]

:lol:
well I need to brush up on my boxing history, but I still wouldn't suggest the likes of Ricky Hatton and Frank Bruno to be up there, laughable.

thanks for the insightful posts from the likes of TFFP.

I've always had Buchanan number 1, but admit to not knowing enough about the likes of Wilde and Fitsimmons. So i'm bias. The only guy from the last 20 years that should be in that company is Lennox, surely?

How so?
Bruno is a Former Heavyweight Champion
Hatton is a Multiple X Champion, not far fetched at all, IMO
(Who would fare very well H2H Matches Vs.)

[Betty Swollocks]

How so?
Bruno is a Former Heavyweight Champion
Hatton is a Multiple X Champion, not far fetched at all, IMO
(Who would fare very well H2H Matches Vs.)

Bruno won a single belt against a weakish champion, after getting beat bu other weakish champions in previous efforts. I wouldn't go so far as to say he was just a celebrity boxer, but come on man...he is no great.

Hatton is the epitome of what is wrong with the sport now...handpicks a bunch of paper titlists and guys who stumbled across belts and walks round saying he's won 7 world titles. I'll leave it to others to tell you where he belongs in the British all time p4p, I've made my rating very clear.

[TFFP]

Hatton would probably be 20-30. I wouldn't rank him above Benn, Eubank, Calzaghe perhaps even Hamed of the recent fighters, and then there are quite a few other old timers that havn't even had a mention.

[girv]

How so?
Bruno is a Former Heavyweight Champion
Hatton is a Multiple X Champion, not far fetched at all, IMO
(Who would fare very well H2H Matches Vs.)

I wouldnt consider Bruno, he may have been popular with the general public and in the UK in his own way he became bigger than boxing, but no way was he anywhere near top 10. He won a belt granted but I doubt if anyone would ever have considered him the man at heavy. Nice guy though.

Ricky Hatton has done well and made the most of his talent. If he had beaten Mayweather then he would have definately been in the all time UK top 10. Unfortunately he was outclassed which is a pity as it cost me a fortune to go to that fight!

[robpalmer135]

surley u realised he was gonna loose girv. and i bet you would have still gone win lose or draw????

Hatton would be number one of all time on my list as Mayweather is number 1 on my p4p of all time, so to beat hime when Floyd was still in his prime would put him way above 10.

I dont rate hatton for several reasons, and dislike him for severall more. But he has ashcieved more than 99.9% of not just british fighters but world wide fighters, inluding some that have been mentioned in the lists in this thread. 2 weight world champ, went to america wen he could have stayed with ****** and thougt wbu bums, beat the number 1 at light welter who was avoided by one and all.

still gets on my bloody nerves though.

[TIGEREDGE]

In Ken Buchanans instance he had to travel to the baking hot heat of San Juan, Puerto Rico to fight outdoors to get his title shot. Thats what makes his win all the more remarkable.

How many modern Brits could have pulled that one off?

I suppose the fights will always be where the money is and like it or not that has often meant the US for the biggest fights.


great point. there aren't many boxers in the history of the sport that have been effective when fighting in conditions that they are not used to. if not for duran, ken would of reigned for years

the win over laguna was the stuff of absolute greatness. to beat an ath champ in his own backyard, in an inferno of heat, takes some doing

[Dunky McCafferty]

Randy Turpin no1.

He beat a prime version of the best p4p fighter in the history of the sport, Sugar Ray Robinson.

He beat the best of the best at the peak of his powers. It doesnt get any better than that.

Even if Hatton had beat Mayweather, it would have come in a distant second to beating a prime SRR. THATS how big that win was. I have never understood why englanders in particular dont give Turpin more credit for this win.

For people to have him no10 in their all time brit rankings makes me sad considering he holds a win over a prime Sugar Ray Robinson... Come on. Lets get real here.

[robpalmer135]

Hatton would probably be 20-30. I wouldn't rank him above Benn, Eubank, Calzaghe perhaps even Hamed of the recent fighters, and then there are quite a few other old timers that havn't even had a mention.

How could Hamed be around 20-30?????

[SouthLondonsFinest]

Discuss? :bbb
Lennox Lewis
Nigel Benn
Chris Eubank
Frank Bruno
Joe Calzaghe
Prince Naseem Hamed
Ricky Hatton
Other.....?

how the hell did frank get on that list?

[TFFP]

How could Hamed be around 20-30?????
Because he delivered less than he promised. Simple.

[Benjiabc]

hes probably not in many peoples eyes but to me its lennox lewis

[Beatboxer]

I would say Fitzsimmons is British: he was born here after all and I have never really heard Austrailians claim him as their's.

If we go down that road, we could start saying Lewis is Canadian(though he did live here signficantly longer).

For me, it's always been Jimmy Wilde but I suppose a strong argument could be made in favour of Fitz...Turpin is less arguable even with the victory over SRR...and the valiant effort in the rematch.

[SouthLondonsFinest]

I would say Fitzsimmons is British: he was born here after all and I have never really heard Austrailians claim him as their's.

If we go down that road, we could start saying Lewis is Canadian(though he did live here signficantly longer).

For me, it's always been Jimmy Wilde but I suppose a strong argument could be made in favour of Fitz...Turpin is less arguable even with the victory over SRR...and the valiant effort in the rematch.


if anyone was to cliam him it wud be NZ, DEFO A BRIT :)

[Beeston Brawler]

I would have Hatton around the top 10 - above both Benn and Eubank to be honest.

Sky Sports had him about 8, with Calzaghe 9 (prior to PBF fight), with Lennox Lewis 1, and Lloyd Honeyghan 10 - don't remember the rest!

[Govanmauler]

Benny Lynch
Lennox Lewis
Ken Buchanan
John Conteh
Nigel Benn
Calzaghe / Eubank ( take your pick )
Hatton / Watt ( and again )
David Haye - he'll probably move up !

the only Turpin fight I have seen any of was Robinson and he lost the title right back so I can't comment and I have never seen any film of Kid lewis

[TFFP]

Ricky Hatton as a top 10 is disgraceful. Research the history of British boxing.

[Govanmauler]

Ricky Hatton as a top 10 is disgraceful. Research the history of British boxing.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dude you sure like throwing it about dont you ?

" research the history of british boxing " Yikes !!!

This is my opinion only I dont expect Jim Watt on many lists either but he's on mine.

Seriously , you can bite ma banger if you dont like it ! :nut

[Govanmauler]

Oh by the by, depsite the fact I know fuck all about biritish boxing , how about Dick McTaggart never went pro but probably the best amatuer the UK ever produced

[Fat Joe]

What about SPX then ? Did anyone ever buy an SPX tracksuit or trainers ?

FCUK NO

[Smith]

Hatton in no way shape or form should be included in the top ten.

It seems some of you are getting mixed up between 'greatest' and 'most popular'.

Hatton is certainly one of the most popular of all time, but ability wise, H2H, resume and so on, he is not even in the top 20.

[Govanmauler]

Hatton in no way shape or form should be included in the top ten.

It seems some of you are getting mixed up between 'greatest' and 'most popular'.

Hatton is certainly one of the most popular of all time, but ability wise, H2H, resume and so on, he is not even in the top 20.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dont you start !!

Thats your feelings on it amigo , those are mine. Im not mixing up great with popular.

Ricky on the night he beat Zoo has a chance against anyone of his weight , Just like Frazier stepped to another level to beat Ali thats what Hatton did that night and its on that basis that I have him there

That alright with you ?

[Smith]

No...............



Like I said, do some reserch on British fighters from the past 100 years, not the past 3.

[TFFP]

If you know fuck all about British boxing, as you have so clearly demonstrated and freely admit, perhaps you shouldn't comment in a thread entitled "Great British fighter of all-time"

Or at the very least, you should expect people to question your wisdom

[Fat Joe]

Ricky on the night he beat Zoo has a chance against anyone of his weight , Just like Frazier stepped to another level to beat Ali thats what Hatton did that night and its on that basis that I have him there

That alright with you ?

Using that reasoning, where do you place Lloyd Honeyghan?

[kurt2006]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dont you start !!

Thats your feelings on it amigo , those are mine. Im not mixing up great with popular.

Ricky on the night he beat Zoo has a chance against anyone of his weight , Just like Frazier stepped to another level to beat Ali thats what Hatton did that night and its on that basis that I have him there

That alright with you ?

On the night Honeyghan beat Curry so is Lloyd a British ATG ?

Sorry Joe I had not scrolled down to see you had mentioned Honeyghan.

[clubberlang]

Lennox Lewis
2. Jimmy Wilde
3. Bob Fitzsimmons
4. Ted 'Kid' Lewis
5. Joe Calzaghe
6. Jim Driscoll
7. Ken Buchanan
8. Benny Lynch
9. Freddy Welsh
10. Randy Turpin

In my opinion Lennox Lewis be No 1 as he fought god knows how many times in america, fought all the best fighters out there at his time, rematched and beat the 2 losses on his career and was one of the best heavyweights there has ever been.
In Calzaghe's case i think he has to be in the top 5, he is overlooked as higher on the top ten list because of the fact that he is undefeated, yes you can say that the SMW division is not that strong but he has beat everybody conceivably put in front of him and that is all you can do, some great fighters slip up and lose but Calzaghe has never done this and I this influences people opinions of him. Even Lewis lost to Rahman, can't ever see Calzaghe losing to a limited fighter like this.

As a sidenote i'd just like to add that it is really good to read a genuine boxing thread rather than all the crap that is on the general forum, the Pavlik vs evrybody else shit is boring the hell out of me!

[toffeejack]

I don't have enough knowledge of fighters before the 80's era so I can't really do an accurate list which makes me think how can some of you put fighters such as Ted "Kid" Lewis in there without actually seeing them fight?

[TFFP]

I've seen Ted 'Kid' Lewis fight, I've got an avi on my computer from ESPN classics if anybody is interested. He is very impressive on film, for a fighter of his era. You can see these guys on film if you really want to

But thats besides the point. Achievements are achievements, and are relative to the era.

[girv]

surley u realised he was gonna loose girv. and i bet you would have still gone win lose or draw????

Hatton would be number one of all time on my list as Mayweather is number 1 on my p4p of all time, so to beat hime when Floyd was still in his prime would put him way above 10.

I dont rate hatton for several reasons, and dislike him for severall more. But he has ashcieved more than 99.9% of not just british fighters but world wide fighters, inluding some that have been mentioned in the lists in this thread. 2 weight world champ, went to america wen he could have stayed with ****** and thougt wbu bums, beat the number 1 at light welter who was avoided by one and all.

still gets on my bloody nerves though.

I never thought he had much chance but I wanted to see what it was like being at a really big fight. It was well worth every pound I spent.

[Betty Swollocks]

Hatton in no way shape or form should be included in the top ten.

It seems some of you are getting mixed up between 'greatest' and 'most popular'.

Hatton is certainly one of the most popular of all time, but ability wise, H2H, resume and so on, he is not even in the top 20.

totally agree.

[Eubank]

Eubank

[Dunky McCafferty]

Eubank

Great joke there fella, your username is Eubank, & you said Eubank is the best fighter of all time, right? Cos your username is Eubank! My sides are splitting!!! uh oh, here comes a ROFL!

:rofl

oh, my stomach is aching with laughter, someone call a doctor!

A poster called Eubank saying Eubank is the best fighter ever, its SO original & funny, I just cant get over it!

[altitudetrainin]

Fitzsimmons, by a distance

Wilde, Ted 'Kid' Lewis, the other Lewis comfortably make the top 5Just wondering how much of his boxing have you seen? I've seen a bit of Jimmy Wilde and Ted Kid Lewis and they are good, but not enough seen to make judgement. Randy Turpin shoulod be right up there in the post war list. One thing for sure is Calzaghe is not in the top 5 never mind the best! Barry McGuigan has started talking some right shite since becoming part of the ****** propoganda machine. ITV take the mick absolutley. The thing is non boxing people fall for that shite and go on about Joe at work like he is Superman. We all really know who Superman really was.

[Govanmauler]

Using that reasoning, where do you place Lloyd Honeyghan?

To be honest Lloyd kinda slippied my mind :oops:

I prefer brawlers and guys who maybe through a lack of natural athletic ability have to put their bodies on the line a bit more , which my list probably reflects.

Didnt think this would cause such a f**kin uproar mind you. Guess there were a lot of maws putting toys back in prams last night

[Smith]

Great joke there fella, your username is Eubank, & you said Eubank is the best fighter of all time, right? Cos your username is Eubank! My sides are splitting!!! uh oh, here comes a ROFL!

:rofl

oh, my stomach is aching with laughter, someone call a doctor!

A poster called Eubank saying Eubank is the best fighter ever, its SO original & funny, I just cant get over it!Ironic ain't it.:yep

[Fat Joe]

A poster called Eubank saying Eubank is the best fighter ever, its SO original & funny, I just cant get over it!

Who is it then Dunks. Buchanan or Harrison?

[Smith]

Who is it then Dunks. Buchanan or Harrison?Stop your fishing.

Dunks has already said he thinks it's Turpin.

[Fat Joe]

Stop your fishing.

Dunks has already said he thinks it's Turpin.

Has he? In that case apologies Dunks.

[Smith]

Whos the new face in your avatar Joe?

[Fat Joe]

Whos the new face in your avatar Joe?

My good self

[Smith]

Ahr. Fresh from the weight loss challenge, kudos.

[Fat Joe]

Ahr. Fresh from the weight loss challenge, kudos.

I've actually put on weight:oops:

If Arran is to be believed he's dropped about 2 stone which is quite impressive.

[Smith]

Yes, but no doubt he's put it straight back on. Anyone who doesnt eat for 2 weeks will lose weight, as soon as he eats a few raisins his body will go back to normal.

Fuck Arran ;).

[JOSEY WALES]

Well, a lot of the names you mention are more like in the teens to 25 range, with the obvious exception of Lewis and maybe Calzaghe. These guys simply don't fight enough, and/or are too protected to rack up the sort of resume some of the great old timers did. You'll get people who are modernists and see it differently though. Personally my top 10 would be something like

1. Bob Fitzsimmons
2. Jimmy Wilde
3. Ted 'Kid' Lewis
4. Lennox Lewis
5. Jim Driscoll
6. Freddie Welsh
7. Ken Buchanan
8. Benny Lynch
9. Joe Calzaghe
10. Randy Turpin

Then I'd starting looking to some of the more recent names. A post of quality . :good

[Fat Joe]

How good was Howard Winstone?

Just been watching one of his fights I taped the other day.

[JOSEY WALES]

How good was Howard Winstone?

Just been watching one of his fights I taped the other day.Howard was a tough bloke but not top ten , i met him a few times and he was a true gent . :deal

[Mantequilla]

Winstone is among the best five post-war Brits IMO.

Winstone, Buchanan, Conteh, Lewis and i'm not too sure who i would give the fifth spot to.

Howard would get at least as much recognition as Calzaghe were he around today, especially if he avoided the WBO route.

[riot187]

Would have to say Lennox Lewis from my era and I can't really comment on the earlier fighters. Grudging respect for Calzaghe, too. Having a fantastic end to his career, but I just can't get past the bad old days of fighting bum after bum for his WBO bauble. Frank ******'s primarily to blame of course, but it just seems to me that Calzaghe was happy to go along with it. Oh, and his Dad does my head in, too! Mouthy little fella isn't he?!

[Fat Joe]

Howard was a tough bloke but not top ten , i met him a few times and he was a true gent . :deal

Originally Posted by Mantequilla Winstone is among the best five post-war Brits IMO.


I've got his 2nd fight against Salvidar on Sky+. I watched the first 3 rounds earlier - he looks a very good technician.

[KCD]

Jimmy Wilde and Bob Fitzsimmons.

From recent times Calzaghe.

[jc]

Wilde
Fitz
Kid Lewis
Lennox
Joe Calzaghe
Jim Driscoll
Freddie Welsh
Benny Lynch
Ken Buchannen
Randy Turpin

Thats the top ten, where you place them in that top 10 is the only debate.

[TFFP]

Wilde
Fitz
Kid Lewis
Lennox
Joe Calzaghe
Jim Driscoll
Freddie Welsh
Benny Lynch
Ken Buchannen
Randy Turpin

Thats the top ten, where you place them in that top 10 is the only debate.
Beautiful list :hey

[TIGEREDGE]

Ricky Hatton as a top 10 is disgraceful. Research the history of British boxing.

hatton is a contendor for the top 10. he has beaten an atg in KOstya Tszyu who was still a great force on the world scene.

many will argue that he got Tszyu at the right time. but you could put a strong case for randy turpin getting ray robinson at the right time. many say robinson was out of shape for that fight


hatton should of been one of the best of all time. but his excessive boozing and eating has made him peak too soon

[TIGEREDGE]

where will david haye be if he beats klitchko

[Fat Joe]

hatton should of been one of the best of all time.

I think that is getting a bit carried away.

[dan-b]

I think that is getting a bit carried away.

Thats an understatement.:lol:

[TIGEREDGE]

I think that is getting a bit carried away.

you forgot to put "but his excessive boozing and eating has made him peak too soon"

[Fat Joe]

you forgot to put "but his excessive boozing and eating has made him peak too soon"

I don't think Hatton would be an ATG if he had lived a more professional lifestyle. But I guess we'll never know.

[Olu G. Rotimi]

I liked him, found him frustrating but all said and done I have to give it to that great gentleman Lennox Lewis. He took on the best of his era except for a peak Riddick Bowe. They did not duck each other that was just the way the cookie crumbled. Unfortunately Bow declined rapidly after the Holyfield wars. Manny Steward helped him realise his true potential and learn how to use his physical advantages but boy he could be frustrating. To much chess rather than being a consistent gunslinger like Tommy Hearns the most exciting fighter I have ever seen.

[Beatboxer]

I liked him, found him frustrating but all said and done I have to give it to that great gentleman Lennox Lewis. He took on the best of his era except for a peak Riddick Bowe. They did not duck each other that was just the way the cookie crumbled. Unfortunately Bow declined rapidly after the Holyfield wars. Manny Steward helped him realise his true potential and learn how to use his physical advantages but boy he could be frustrating. To much chess rather than being a consistent gunslinger like Tommy Hearns the most exciting fighter I have ever seen.

Did I just dream of Bowe breaking a contractual agreement and then throwing his WBC Title in the trash rather than fighting Lewis :rofl

[dan-b]

Did I just dream of Bowe breaking a contractual agreement and then throwing his WBC Title in the trash rather than fighting Lewis :rofl

Maybe you're just suffering some Bowe style, temporary "brain damage".

[TFFP]

hatton is a contendor for the top 10. he has beaten an atg in KOstya Tszyu who was still a great force on the world scene.

many will argue that he got Tszyu at the right time. but you could put a strong case for randy turpin getting ray robinson at the right time. many say robinson was out of shape for that fight


hatton should of been one of the best of all time. but his excessive boozing and eating has made him peak too soon
I think there might be a slight difference between a 35 year old Kostya Tszyu and a 30 year old Sugar Ray Robinson :lol:

You know, thats Sugar Ray Robinson, a lock for top 10 all-time.

And that in itself is the only thing going for Hatton's resume. The rest is filled with either old fighters or fringe world class fighters.

[martin0792]

Ken Buchanan

[Haye]

really it is hamed though. I mean boxing is entertainment at the end of the day, and he got more people intrested in boxing than any other fighter in this country. i became intrested in boxing because of Hamed, i would imagine there are alot of people on here that our the same.

Even if u dont agree u must see my point, i mean Ministry of Sound and Adidad sponserd his fights, i cant imagine that happening again!


Translation - I know fuck all. Please shoot me in the head.

[JonOli]

I think there might be a slight difference between a 35 year old Kostya Tszyu and a 30 year old Sugar Ray Robinson :lol:

You know, thats Sugar Ray Robinson, a lock for top 10 all-time.

And that in itself is the only thing going for Hatton's resume. The rest is filled with either old fighters or fringe world class fighters.

Your posts might actually have some credibilty to them if you didnt so much lord the fact of Calzaghe being placed in a top ten, yet totally ridicule the idea of Hatton being in there.

When both their careers are finished there is more then a good argument that Hattons resume will be superior to that of Calzaghes.

Include them both, or exclude them both, but don't say it's perfectly acceptable to include the one, and ridicule anyone dares to include the other. That's total nonsense.

[TFFP]

Your posts might actually have some credibilty to them if you didnt so much lord the fact of Calzaghe being placed in a top ten, yet totally ridicule the idea of Hatton being in there.

When both their careers are finished there is more then a good argument that Hattons resume will be superior to that of Calzaghes.

Include them both, or exclude them both, but don't say it's perfectly acceptable to include the one, and ridicule anyone dares to include the other. That's total nonsense.
Where is your list?

[JonOli]

In no order... top 5...

Jimmy Wilde, Lennox Lewis, Bob Fitzsimmons, Ken Buchanan, Ted Kid Lewis

[TFFP]

Well, that looks remarkably like mine

I'm tempted to believe you just went with consensus given your past record for being a douche, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt

Post a list before tearing into others, its easy to be an expert when nobody can question your wisdom.

[toffeejack]

Nobody can say who was the greatest british boxer ever.

I don't think there is anyone on this forum who has seen the likes of Kid Lewis and Jimmy Wilde fight so how can you make statements like they were the best on no evidence other than what you have read?

[TFFP]

Nobody can say who was the greatest british boxer ever.

I don't think there is anyone on this forum who has seen the likes of Kid Lewis and Jimmy Wilde fight so how can you make statements like they were the best on no evidence other than what you have read?
Erm, there is film available if you choose to look for it

It ain't from the fucking stone age.

[toffeejack]

Erm, there is film available if you choose to look for it

It ain't from the fucking stone age.

It's not just that, it's the lack of knowledge of other fighters in the era who you are watching in that poor quality of film in Kid Lewis' example.

Plus the fact that the sport is totally different these days with the likes of better nutrition, training methods etc.

I just dont' believe for a second that you can compare Kid Lewis to the likes of Calzaghe, we are talking a difference of nearly 100 years here.

[TFFP]

It's not just that, it's the lack of knowledge of other fighters in the era who you are watching in that poor quality of film in Kid Lewis' example.

Plus the fact that the sport is totally different these days with the likes of better nutrition, training methods etc.

I just dont' believe for a second that you can compare Kid Lewis to the likes of Calzaghe, we are talking a difference of nearly 100 years here. Who cares if you got a tin of whey, its a ludicrious theory. If fighters are so much fitter and stronger, tell me why these guys fought 15-20 rounders and 10+ times a year?

Besides, its completely irrelevant. Nobody is even saying Ted Kid Lewis beats Ricky Hatton, or anything like that. Achievements are achievements, and are relative to ones era. These guys tend to be found higher up lists, because they fought more, didn't suffer from politics, didn't have alphabets to feast on therefore you know they were undoubtedly the best of their divison.

[Dubstep]

I really don't like the level of Boxing snobbery going on in this thread. Flexing your Boxing knowledge muscles naming fighters from the 30s and 40s is really underminding this thread which was a refreshingly inquisitive post from our normally dismissive friends from across the pond.

1. Nobody saw these boxers fight and there is too little coverage so effectively your judgement is hearsay.

2. Saying the oldies fought more and so should be considered greater is a terrible argument. Just last week this website did an article on Boxers who were nearing their 100th professional loss - does that mean they are great? Fighting more frequently meant they lost more frequently to lower opposition because they were weight drained or not fully prepared. The modern Boxer fights less to be at the physical pinnacle for his fights.

3. This rolls onto my next observation that the sport of Boxing has evolved to such an extent that old fighters would not stand a chance in the modern era. Would a prime Fitzsimmons beaten a prime Nigel Benn? Of course not because Benn had an advanced dietary plan, fitness regime and a level of mental preperation that simply wasn't around 40 years ago. Similarly, a prime George Best would not get in the current Man Utd side!

4. "Greatness" in itself is a subjective term. For me it involves adding up not just achievement but style, personality and popularity. Bruno bags of popularity not so much achievement and so would feature lower down the list. Ricky Hatton - bags of popularity, exciting style and considerable achievement. Got people interested in Boxing who weren't interested in Boxing. Sold out venues on both sides of the pond. Controversial as it sounds but he will have a fair claim to greatness simply because people in future generations will have heard of him and only Boxing fans have heard of say, Jim Watt.

My greatest fighters would all be from the modern era because they are the fighters I know the most about. I can remember fights and opposition. How can I say Ken Buchanan was the finest British Boxer ever when I don't know anybody (Duran the low blower excluded) he fought? I shouldn't be told to go and "do my research" because all I will get is figures, wins and losses against opponents I don't know!

1. Lennox Lewis - Total domination of the Heavyweight division for almost a decade.
2. Nigel Benn - Excited everybody with his style and won meaningful titles against meaningful opposition and held them until he was past his peak.
3. Prince Naseem - Exceptional talent. He beat everyone in the division, in style until he was slightly descending and met a future Hall of Famer firmly ascending.

[icemax]

Ken Buchanan
Buchanan definately in my top five....a man who because of circumstances knew how to fight away from home, unlike some of todays legends (both sides of the pond)

[Bill Butcher]

Joe Calzaghe is the best British boxer of all time.

Naseem Hamed had the potential to be (whether you liked his personality or not) but started focusing too much on his power in the late 90s rather than what made him special, his speed, reflexes & unorthodox style.

Naz at 122 lbs was freightening & even his 1st year or 2 at 126 lbs, especially when he beat Steve Robinson, that was just a plain & simple masterclass.

That version of Naz might have beaten Barrera or Morales.
He`d have a better shot at beating Barrera as Morales had the better chin & was the superior boxer to Barrera but at least Naz could live with these guys at that stage I believe.

[Smith]

There are ridiculous posts floating in this thread, namely the last and third last post.

[JonOli]

Joe Calzaghe is the best British boxer of all time.



Your certainly not in the minority in stating that Bill B. Personally I don't go with it; but that's just my opinion.