Did gerry Cooney's management make a mistake?

[TIGEREDGE]

in choosing larry holmes for his first title shot. the wba title was available.

why didnt they go for mike weaver first then?

IMO it would of been better to wait another year or 2 before going for Holmes

[salsanchezfan]

................It's easy to say in retrospect, but at the time, picture yourself as Jones and Rappaport; if someone comes to you with the amount of money they offered to fight Holmes, you're most likely not going to say "no thanks; we'll take five times less to develop our guy a bit more."

Seeing what transpired, they could have parlayed a victory over Weaver (which would have happened I think) into an even bigger payday as a unification match, but there's no certainty the WBA would have wanted to sanction it. Big gamble there. Of course, money talks and if nothing else Cooney could have pulled a Riddick Bowe and dumped his belt in the trash to then fight Holmes for more money than he got by jumping stright into a fight with The Easton Assassin right away, but there's that old saying; "A bird in hand is worth fighting Larry Holmes now."


...........Or something like that. :think

[ThinBlack]

Yeah, they did.The money was right, but no way was Cooney ready for Holmes.He had a better chance against Weaver, and even that victory wasn't a certaincy.

[kenmore]

Yeah, they did.The money was right, but no way was Cooney ready for Holmes.He had a better chance against Weaver, and even that victory wasn't a certaincy.

My thoughts exactly.

[mcvey]

in choosing larry holmes for his first title shot. the wba title was available.

why didnt they go for mike weaver first then?

IMO it would of been better to wait another year or 2 before going for Holmes
The mistake was in keeping him in cotton wool ,only allowing him to feed on well done meat like Young ,Lyle and Norton.Cooney could have been a lot better but he never got the schooling ,he didnt move his head and kept it up like a lamp post.When he got in there with a live fighter he lacked self belief,and the experience to cope with adversity,still he gave it a good try,he is a "what might have been", I feel.

[la-califa]

The Managers knew they didn't have the next Rocky Marciano. & they milked it for everything it was worth. Got a huge payday. & didn't worry about the rest of Cooney's career. They went after a undefeated Heavyweight Champion. Played the race card & cashed in.

[la-califa]

Look at Cooney's stamina. If Weaver had survived into the late rounds. Cooney would have been beaten for a fraction of what he could have made from fighting Holmes.

[heehoo]

Cooney's guys made a mistake by not forcing Cooney to be more active after the Holmes fight.

[TIGEREDGE]

Cooney's guys made a mistake by not forcing Cooney to be more active after the Holmes fight.

that was gerry;s fault. he didnt want to fight anymore

[TIGEREDGE]

Look at Cooney's stamina. If Weaver had survived into the late rounds. Cooney would have been beaten for a fraction of what he could have made from fighting Holmes.

there would of been good money in him fighting weaver for title. it would be a big fight

[CottoDaBodykill]

i watched a thing on youtube with bert suger saying he coulda fought renoldo snipes??

[Rico Spadafora]

They (Rappaport & Jones) cashed Cooney out. I saw an interview where Cooney told Howard Cosell he was going to fight Weaver after he beat Norton for like 4 million or so. They then got the 10 million offer for the Holmes fight and took it.

Rappaport and Jones were afraid Gerry was going to get beat before they could make a Holmes fight and lose all of that money.

In retrospect they should have fought Weaver for the WBA it is a fight Cooney could have won as Weaver was a very slow starter and Gerry could have caught him cold. They did not want to risk a loss though. Had Gerry won no telling how much they could have got for a Holmes fight.

Bottom line they cashed Gerry out for the money. Cooney could have been better if he had a better trainer and management. Either way I don't think he would have ever beat Holmes but he might have made a better fight of it had he waited a year or 2 and fought Weaver and another contender first.

[la-califa]

there would of been good money in him fighting weaver for title. it would be a big fightYeah a big fight. And Holmes was the Mega fight, with three times the money. Weaver was too risky. Look what happened to Forrest, When he beat Mosley twice. Before he could cash in with a big name. he lost to a relative unknown at the time, Ricardo Mayorga. He could have cashed in big with De La Hoya.

[TIGEREDGE]

Yeah a big fight. And Holmes was the Mega fight, with three times the money. Weaver was too risky. Look what happened to Forrest, When he beat Mosley twice. Before he could cash in with a big name. he lost to a relative unknown at the time, Ricardo Mayorga. He could have cashed in big with De La Hoya.

great point. i never knew that dlh forrest fight was in the air before mayorga

[tommy the hat]

In my opinion, I feel Cooney had a very solid team around him. He did have an excellent trainer in Victor Valle. Rappaport and Jones made Cooney a very wealthy man. There is no shame whatsoever in losing to a prime Larry Holmes. The only thing different that could have been done with Cooney is that he should have been kept more active. Leading up to the Holmes bout in June 1982 Cooney only fought two times in 1980 (KO 1 Ron Lyle) (KO 4 Jimmy Young) and once in 1981(54 seconds versus Ken Norton) This was hardly enough preparation for the 13 rounds he fought in 90 degree heat in Vegas against Holmes. Shoulda been given bouts versus guys that woulda gave him the rounds and went he distance to give him that experience. But from a monetary standpoint Cooney's team did great

[TBooze]

Cooney made no mistake. He had a superfight and made serious dollars, so he (IMO) made the right decision.

What he should of done (without hindsight) is fight more often post Holmes, that is where the demons set in in mine, and many others opinion.

[shavers]

Cooney made 10 million against Holmes, 5 against Spinks and 1 when he fought Foreman...

Thats 16 million, and mind you the dollar were worth more those years, so You cant really say anyone made mistakes here...
At least seen from a money perspective.

[ThinBlack]

i watched a thing on youtube with bert suger saying he coulda fought renoldo snipes??

Under the right circumstances, Snipes may have beaten Cooney.

[mr. magoo]

................It's easy to say in retrospect, but at the time, picture yourself as Jones and Rappaport; if someone comes to you with the amount of money they offered to fight Holmes, you're most likely not going to say "no thanks; we'll take five times less to develop our guy a bit more."

Seeing what transpired, they could have parlayed a victory over Weaver (which would have happened I think) into an even bigger payday as a unification match, but there's no certainty the WBA would have wanted to sanction it. Big gamble there. Of course, money talks and if nothing else Cooney could have pulled a Riddick Bowe and dumped his belt in the trash to then fight Holmes for more money than he got by jumping stright into a fight with The Easton Assassin right away, but there's that old saying; "A bird in hand is worth fighting Larry Holmes now."


...........Or something like that. :think

I agree with Sal here. You don't just abandone $10,000,000 ( the equivalent of about 25,000,000 today ) to polish up your fundamentals with the hope that the same offer will be there in a year. Cooney probably should have fought a tuneup or two before facing Larry, but pass up on the opportunity? Hell no..

[sthomas]

Cooney's delimna was being the great white hope of the early 80's. From a boxing standpoint it was a mistake and he should have been more active and have worked his way up throught the ranks more to gain experience. However, his market value was inflated to the point of where if he did not take the Holmes fight, it would have been a very bad business decision. Overinflated white hope money won out in this one and Cooney capitalized on it. Would be interesting to see how his career would have gone if there were more good white heavies back then. I imagine if Cooney were coming up now, he'd be a promising fighter and he would work his way through the ranks, become better than he was in his real career, and win a belt or two

[rekcutnevets]

I personally spoke with Victor Valle in 1993, and he told me that he could not get Cooney to train properly anymore after the Norton fight. He said that Cooney started believing all of the media's hype about his power and lost his focus.

After speaking with Valle, I'm sure the timing was right for the Holmes fight. Weaver would have been too big a risk. If Cooney had stayed focused on his boxing career, he could have challenged for another title after Holmes. He would have probably made as much money for any non-Holmes fight, post or pre-Holmes. For all of these reasons, I must say Cooney's management made the correct decision in facing Holmes when they did.

[tommy the hat]

In my opinion, I feel Cooney had a very solid team around him. He did have an excellent trainer in Victor Valle. Rappaport and Jones made Cooney a very wealthy man. There is no shame whatsoever in losing to a prime Larry Holmes. The only thing different that could have been done with Cooney is that he should have been kept more active. Leading up to the Holmes bout in June 1982 Cooney only fought two times in 1980 (KO 1 Ron Lyle) (KO 4 Jimmy Young) and once in 1981(54 seconds versus Ken Norton) This was hardly enough preparation for the 13 rounds he fought in 90 degree heat in Vegas against Holmes. Shoulda been given bouts versus guys that woulda gave him the rounds and went he distance to give him that experience. But from a monetary standpoint Cooney's team did great
I would like to add to my previous reply. After reading up on the subject I learned that Cooney was in fact supposed to fight Mike Weaver first, but the WBA told Weaver he had to fight James 'Quick' Tillis or he would be stripped of the title. It was then that the Holmes fight came through for Cooney. But just the same Cooney should have had a tuneup bout against a non threatening opponent who was a boxer to bridge the gap between May 1981( his last bout before facing Holmes,which was a 54 second blowout of Ken Norton) and June 1982, when he did fight Holmes.

[tommy the hat]

If I'm not mistaken, Cooney was supposed to have fought the now shot but still powerful Earnie Shavers before facing Holmes....I believe Cooney suffered an injury in training, and Shavers would go on to fight Tex Cobb and lose...I think Cooney should have fought more before Holmes, as well as after...I still believe had he fought Gerrie Coetzee instead of Holmes, he might have made champion of the WBA.
Shavers fought Cobb on August 2, 1980. The reason I remember that is because it was my 8th birthday and Tommy Hearns also became champion that day. The Holmes fight would take place almost 2 years later in June 1982. The time period Cooney needed to stay active was from May 1981 to June 1982, and it would have been best to take on someone who was more of a boxer and couldn't hurt Cooney and not a dangerous puncher like Shavers who although was over the hill then still had the power to screw up a 10 milllion dollar payday.

[Rico Spadafora]

I also remember Cooney was also supposed to fight Greg Page I believe before Holmes and he suffered a cut in sparring and was out for a year. Cooney had a lot of injury problems like his shoulder and cuts etc. in training. Cooney just had bad luck. Either way his management (Rappaport & Jones) were idiots not getting him ready for Holmes and fighting only 3 rounds in 3 years up to the Holmes fight. Cooney was just not ready for the fight and it showed.

[mr. magoo]

The time period Cooney needed to stay active was from May 1981 to June 1982, and it would have been best to take on someone who was more of a boxer and couldn't hurt Cooney and not a dangerous puncher like Shavers who although was over the hill then still had the power to screw up a 10 milllion dollar payday.

Agreed,

I have always contemplated why Cooney was not active for much of that two year period from 1980-1982, with the exception of boxing 55 seconds with Ken Norton in the spring of 1981. Another poster named Duodenum, once mentioned that apparently Cooney had spent some months in drug rehab sometime within that duration, prior to the Holmes fight ( source needed. ) Additionally, his team was campaigning hard to get Gerry a title shot, and was going back and forth with both the Holmes' and Weaver camps. Therefore, these things may explain why he wasn't fighting as much as he needed to be, nor against the calibur of opponents that could have polished his skills. The fight that he had with Jimmy Young sometime in 1980, was exactly the sort of match that he needed more of. Young was past his prime, but still active and capable of giving Cooney some hard fought rounds of boxing, yet didn't have the capability to ruin his confidence. If only his team had gotten Gerry a few more fights like that ( along with keeping him off of drugs ), his career may have gone a bit further...

[Rico Spadafora]

Agreed,

I have always contemplated why Cooney was not active for much of that two year period from 1980-1982, with the exception of boxing 55 seconds with Ken Norton in the spring of 1981. Another poster named Duodenum, once mentioned that apparently Cooney had spent some months in drug rehab sometime within that duration, prior to the Holmes fight ( source needed. ) Additionally, his team was campaigning hard to get Gerry a title shot, and was going back and forth with both the Holmes' and Weaver camps. Therefore, these things may explain why he wasn't fighting as much as he needed to be, nor against the calibur of opponents that could have polished his skills. The fight that he had with Jimmy Young sometime in 1980, was exactly the sort of match that he needed more of. Young was past his prime, but still active and capable of giving Cooney some hard fought rounds of boxing, yet didn't have the capability to ruin his confidence. If only his team had gotten Gerry a few more fights like that ( along with keeping him off of drugs ), his career may have gone a bit further...

Interesting I knew Cooney had drug problems but thought that was after the Holmes fight. Cooney had potential but I read an interview with Gil Clancy where he said his management did not have faith in him and were worried he would lose before they could cash him in with a Holmes fight.

[mr. magoo]

Interesting I knew Cooney had drug problems but thought that was after the Holmes fight. Cooney had potential but I read an interview with Gil Clancy where he said his management did not have faith in him and were worried he would lose before they could cash him in with a Holmes fight.

Yeah, the other poster that I mentioned said something about him having substance and alcohol abuse problems throughout his whole career, but again a source needs to be found, and not just something off of wikapedia.

As for Cooney's management keeping him covered until he could fight Holmes, I have heard the same thing on multiple occasions, and frankly I believe it. I think his handlers knew he had some weaknesses and were leary about putting him in the ring with the likes of guys like Cobb, Shavers, Berbick, etc. Needless to say they were protecting a huge investment. At one point, they were looking at going after Mike Weaver's WBA title, but held off when they smelled a much bigger fish frying in Larry Holmes.

[la-califa]

I personally spoke with Victor Valle in 1993, and he told me that he could not get Cooney to train properly anymore after the Norton fight. He said that Cooney started believing all of the media's hype about his power and lost his focus.

After speaking with Valle, I'm sure the timing was right for the Holmes fight. Weaver would have been too big a risk. If Cooney had stayed focused on his boxing career, he could have challenged for another title after Holmes. He would have probably made as much money for any non-Holmes fight, post or pre-Holmes. For all of these reasons, I must say Cooney's management made the correct decision in facing Holmes when they did.Intersting story, I never heard that before. Well if Cooney had taken a shot at Weaver & was beaten. A rededicated Cooney may have given Holmes a much better match in a second title opportunity. But it still wouldn't have made the money of the actual fight though. Because Cooney was undefeated in thier actual fight & had a sort of mystique, after the way he destroyed Norton in 54 seconds.

[AlFrancis]

Intersting story, I never heard that before. Well if Cooney had taken a shot at Weaver & was beaten. A rededicated Cooney may have given Holmes a much better match in a second title opportunity. But it still wouldn't have made the money of the actual fight though. Because Cooney was undefeated in thier actual fight & had a sort of mystique, after the way he destroyed Norton in 54 seconds.
Is right, apart from being white, it was the mystique of those crushing wins over Norton and Lyle. One bum fight could of cost them that 10 million purse. Cooney would never have been ready to beat Holmes, so it was a good business decision.
I do take my hat off to Cooney though for the bottle he showed in the fight.

[ironchamp]

................It's easy to say in retrospect, but at the time, picture yourself as Jones and Rappaport; if someone comes to you with the amount of money they offered to fight Holmes, you're most likely not going to say "no thanks; we'll take five times less to develop our guy a bit more."

Seeing what transpired, they could have parlayed a victory over Weaver (which would have happened I think) into an even bigger payday as a unification match, but there's no certainty the WBA would have wanted to sanction it. Big gamble there. Of course, money talks and if nothing else Cooney could have pulled a Riddick Bowe and dumped his belt in the trash to then fight Holmes for more money than he got by jumping stright into a fight with The Easton Assassin right away, but there's that old saying; "A bird in hand is worth fighting Larry Holmes now."


...........Or something like that. :think


My thoughts exactly.

Hindsight is 20/20.

[Rico Spadafora]

Another often forgotten thing about Cooney:

when he first turned Pro he wanted Cus D'Amato as his trainer, Cus agreed but wanted to be both trainer and manager. Jones & Rappaport did not agree with this as that would have cut them out of the picture so Cus recommended Victor Valle for Cooney and that is who he went with.

Wonder how things would have gone under D'Amato?

[zadfrak]

He wasn't going to get along with those guys & they would've stayed in the picture as promoters or taken a nice % of Cooney. Jones & Rappaport were like Butch Lewis--they open doors for you and at the same time close a lot of doors.

I'm not sold on that D'Amato style and it would've been interesting to see if they'd have tried the peekaboo with Cooney or tried something more conventional.

[Bo Bo Olson]

Holms was considered the Champ...so it was sill back when there should have been only one champ, so one went after the Champ...had Cooney not retired then, he could have gone after Weaver and a Rematch...

[Bummy Davis]

Holmes was the more complete fighter of the division, not the puncher than Weaver was and I think Cooneys people felt that Cooney could stop Holmes. I think it was a mistake because Larry was a mover and had tested 12-15 rd stamina, Weaver fought at a slower pace but did not move. I think Gerry would have had a better chance to land his lethal hook on Weaver. Larry had a problem with the Right over the jab, Cooney had no right hand. Cooney may have went out quicker vs Weaver but he would have been able to make Weaver feel his power early in the fight, Weaver was a slower fighter and stationary.

[Charles White]

Cooney made 10 million against Holmes, 5 against Spinks and 1 when he fought Foreman...

Thats 16 million, and mind you the dollar were worth more those years, so You cant really say anyone made mistakes here...
At least seen from a money perspective. My thoughts exactly. I didn't know that he got 10 million for Holmes. That's awesome. Pretty sad looking back on this compared to todays heavyweight title purses. Dudes today don't make squat.

[Charles White]

Another often forgotten thing about Cooney:

when he first turned Pro he wanted Cus D'Amato as his trainer, Cus agreed but wanted to be both trainer and manager. Jones & Rappaport did not agree with this as that would have cut them out of the picture so Cus recommended Victor Valle for Cooney and that is who he went with.

Wonder how things would have gone under D'Amato? I think that Victor Valle was the right fit for Cooney. D'Amato's style wouldn't have been good for a man like Cooney imo. Too tall. Perfect for a shorter fighter like Tyson.

[Rico Spadafora]

He wasn't going to get along with those guys & they would've stayed in the picture as promoters or taken a nice % of Cooney. Jones & Rappaport were like Butch Lewis--they open doors for you and at the same time close a lot of doors.

I'm not sold on that D'Amato style and it would've been interesting to see if they'd have tried the peekaboo with Cooney or tried something more conventional.

I see no way Cooney could have done the peekabo style it would have been interesting to see what Cus would have done with him.

[Charles White]

Cooney made 10 million against Holmes, 5 against Spinks and 1 when he fought Foreman...

Thats 16 million, and mind you the dollar were worth more those years, so You cant really say anyone made mistakes here...
At least seen from a money perspective. And the last time I saw Cooney, he looked pretty pimped out. Nice clothes, some bling, etc.

[tommy the hat]

Holmes was the more complete fighter of the division, not the puncher than Weaver was and I think Cooneys people felt that Cooney could stop Holmes. I think it was a mistake because Larry was a mover and had tested 12-15 rd stamina, Weaver fought at a slower pace but did not move. I think Gerry would have had a better chance to land his lethal hook on Weaver. Larry had a problem with the Right over the jab, Cooney had no right hand. Cooney may have went out quicker vs Weaver but he would have been able to make Weaver feel his power early in the fight, Weaver was a slower fighter and stationary.
You make a lot of good points, Cooney probably could have knocked out Weaver. But he never would have gotten 10 million for fighting Weaver like he did for Larry Holmes. And Weaver was a kill or be killed fighter. He was knocked out alot, but he had dangerous power and could end a fight in one punch.For Cooney it was a lot of risk for alot less reward if he fought Weaver.Cooney actually was going to fight Weaver before the Holmes deal was made, but the WBA was threatening to strip Weaver if he didn't defend against James Quick Tillis, their #1 contender, who Weaver would decision but for a lot less money. Weaver got a raw deal in that he got fucked out of a very big payday by not getting to fight Cooney. For Cooney, fighting Holmes instead, although much tougher an opponent, was a financial windfall.

[Charles White]

I just read an interview of Kevin Rooney and he said that he has it from an inside source that Larry Holmes did not make his projected 10 million because Don King and his son charged like 8.5 million for expenses, and he had to pay trainers fees as well. Is this true? Has anybody heard about this? Here is the link:

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

[kickbxn5]

Gerry Cooney's rise to stardom pre Holmes was all about the marketability and Big Ca$H. His handlers/management did the correct thing if the end result was all about money. If it was for developing a fighter, they srewed up big time.

[zadfrak]

Okay---he got big bucks for the Holmes and later the Spinks fight. But imagine how much $$$ the guy gets for fights if say he beats Weaver. And lets face it--if he beat Mike, it'd probably be another devastating ko result. Then a few title defense softies with beatable guys like Ledoux. Or a ruined John Tate. Or a Leon Spinks.

There was plenty of beatable cannon fodder around at the time that was not signed to Don King. They could've been like Holmes and faced a Rodriguez & an inexperienced guy like a Bey even. Now all of a sudden the guy has 5 or 6 title defenses. Plus, Larry is steadily going down the ladder and by 1985, Cooney has a better chance of winning and maybe it's a $25 million fight & not $10, since it'd be a WBA/IBF unification.

So there were other paths that Cooney management team could've taken. But they didn't. They could've parlayed that career into $40-$60 million, not $15. Plus, 86 rolls around and you could've fed Cooney for big $$ to the upcoming Tyson for a huge payday.

[Bummy Davis]

The Wako Twins wanted to keep him undefeated rather get him a fight vs a durable Tex Cobb to give him 10 round confidence and work....It was all money with them...where they wrong for a fight fans perspective yes, for a businessmans point NO

[salsanchezfan]

Okay---he got big bucks for the Holmes and later the Spinks fight. But imagine how much $$$ the guy gets for fights if say he beats Weaver. And lets face it--if he beat Mike, it'd probably be another devastating ko result. Then a few title defense softies with beatable guys like Ledoux. Or a ruined John Tate. Or a Leon Spinks.

There was plenty of beatable cannon fodder around at the time that was not signed to Don King. They could've been like Holmes and faced a Rodriguez & an inexperienced guy like a Bey even. Now all of a sudden the guy has 5 or 6 title defenses. Plus, Larry is steadily going down the ladder and by 1985, Cooney has a better chance of winning and maybe it's a $25 million fight & not $10, since it'd be a WBA/IBF unification.

So there were other paths that Cooney management team could've taken. But they didn't. They could've parlayed that career into $40-$60 million, not $15. Plus, 86 rolls around and you could've fed Cooney for big $$ to the upcoming Tyson for a huge payday.



...........Again, all this looks just spiffy on paper 26 years down the road. Boxing history is only static and as objective as you'e making it when you're looking in the rear-view mirror. It's a lot more fluid and fraught with risk when you're the one presented with the big-money contract to sign.

From a business angle (which of course is why they were there in the first place) Jones and Rappaport did the job. Any sensible person would have signed to fight Holmes precisely when they did.

[zadfrak]

This isn't hindsight. This is the path they chose with the guy at the time. Foresight is what the manager has. Or is supposed to have with the capability to oversee the landscape for the near future for their guy.The Cooney management team had other paths they could've taken and selected not to. But to think they only possible way to make big $$$ with the guy was the Holmes fight is incorrect. If cooney was WBA champ do you think any title challenger is going to receive any sort of equitable payday?

I disagreed strongly at the time and still do with the management of Cooney. You even had Harold Smith throwing big $$ around for awhile and Cooney could've got in on that while it lasted.

[salsanchezfan]

This isn't hindsight. This is the path they chose with the guy at the time. Foresight is what the manager has. Or is supposed to have with the capability to oversee the landscape for the near future for their guy.The Cooney management team had other paths they could've taken and selected not to. But to think they only possible way to make big $$$ with the guy was the Holmes fight is incorrect. If cooney was WBA champ do you think any title challenger is going to receive any sort of equitable payday?

I disagreed strongly at the time and still do with the management of Cooney. You even had Harold Smith throwing big $$ around for awhile and Cooney could've got in on that while it lasted.


...........I think his management was astute in sizing up not only Gerry's strengths but also his weaknesses (both physical and mental) and probably knew they didn't have a guy who was gonna be in it for the long haul. Cooney proved that after losing to Holmes. He never had the attitude or desire to be a long-term proposition.

Knowing this, why in the world would any sane person say no to the kind of money the Holmes fight promised and gamble on some long-term buildup as you propose? That's assuming a hell of a lot. Lot of pratfalls along the way.

[tommy the hat]

This isn't hindsight. This is the path they chose with the guy at the time. Foresight is what the manager has. Or is supposed to have with the capability to oversee the landscape for the near future for their guy.The Cooney management team had other paths they could've taken and selected not to. But to think they only possible way to make big $$$ with the guy was the Holmes fight is incorrect. If cooney was WBA champ do you think any title challenger is going to receive any sort of equitable payday?

I disagreed strongly at the time and still do with the management of Cooney. You even had Harold Smith throwing big $$ around for awhile and Cooney could've got in on that while it lasted.

Yes Cooney would have made very lucrative paydays if he was WBA champ, IF! Yes Gerry was quite capable of beating Mike Weaver, but it still was a very risky fight with a much lower payday than he ultimately got with Larry Holmes. Weaver could end a fight with one punch, whether he was winning or way behind. Look at what he did with John Tate and Carl Williams, and the rally he put forth to stop Gerrie Coatzee. At least when he lost to Holmes it was to the recognized champion and he got 10 million for his effort. A loss to Weaver would have been much worse for Cooney, and very non lucrative.

[natonic]

Cooney's management was brilliant. They got him million dollar paydays for minimal risk. They had a fighter who, although he had devastating power, had minimal skills, and was by most accounts to nice to be a fighter. I'd like to be mismanaged like that.

[zadfrak]

Do you guys actually think no other management team could've done a good job with the guy? Just exactly what other top notch job did Jones and Rappaport do anyway?

Like lots of folks at the time, I thought Cooney was going to be the first guy to earn $100 milion in the ring. The Tyson mangement team came along and made that much just a few years later. But then you are seeing results of a top shelf management team.

[JohnThomas1]

The trouble was Cooney lacked that something mentally as an athlete or person. Even after the Holmes fight the guy was set up perfectly!!

He was financially secure almost overnight, he'd lost in a reasonable effort for the title without any real hiding or physical drama and was supremely well set up to round out his game from lessons learnt in the Holmes bout. Future well chosen opponents and a busy schedule would have aided his development and turned him into a genuine title threat. There was also the WBA title to go after, which would only make a Holmes rematch even more lucrative.

But no he let it all get to him and never really performed much chop ever again. When he performed at all that is. Huge disappointment. The Holmes loss was VERY light comparative to what boxers come back from again and sometimes again.

[Titan1]

in choosing larry holmes for his first title shot. the wba title was available.

why didnt they go for mike weaver first then?

IMO it would of been better to wait another year or 2 before going for Holmes

They did make a big mistake, but the money was right for them, and they took it.And Gerry was never the same again.