View Full Version : De La Hoya vs Pacquiao
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Prenote
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Not such a joke fight in my opinion. It is not ideal to have these sorts of "superfights" that are not relevant to a division, its bad for boxing overall. Although, I say its more competetive than made out, and the people that have steam coming from their ears at the prospect could look silly...
View from the Panties
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On the one hand, simple logic would tell you Golden Panties is way too big for Pacquiao. He should be able to keep him it at bay with his jab, and counter his midget looking ass as he comes in. On the inside he should be way too physically strong. A body shot would probably end Pacquiao's life, which has been his Achilles heal in the past. Started at super feather peaked at welterweight however has fought as high as middleweight
However...
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Pacquiao has relative youth, speed and in my opinion hunger on his side. Fishnets did look utterly horrible against another former lightweight/superfeather in Steve Forbes. He got his pretty boy face busted up. He generally lacked killer instinct and was never in danger of stopping the defensively cute Forbes yet won wide. Of course Pacquiao will be more ambitious and open, but also more dangerous. Started at flyweight peaked at featherweight currently at lightweight
The weight issue
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This is a very important factor in this fight. Yes, De La Hoya is going to be much bigger but it is also a double edged sword that the fight is at 147 - a weight he has not made in going on SEVEN years. He will look like a scarecrow on those scales. He won't be able to rehydrate as high, so as to be closer to Pac's weight on fight night which will likely be what he weighs in at. Clever from team Pacquiao. How will Pacquiao go from 135 to weigh in at welterweight, will he come in well under? Will he retain speed? Many things to think about here.
Conclusion
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In my opinion, Pacquiao can win this fight if he gets back to his old buzzsaw style where he wasn't thinking about trying to box and appease the critics so much. He needs to rely on his physical gifts which have always been his strength. Don't get involved on the inside, caught on the ropes or stuck on the end of his jab. In and out quickly.
Darts
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This fight could have repurcussions for him, so I'm posting it here. Which is really just a weak excuse to post here, because I fucking hate those cocks in the general.
Vote + Discuss
Beeston Brawler
09-09-2008, 03:47 PM
Very good post.
If Hoya has anything left I would back him to beat Pacquiao.
He is more hittable than ever, but has an excellent chin.
trotter
09-09-2008, 04:01 PM
I agree that this is not the mismatch many think.
It's a shit fight to make for so many reasons, but not necessarily a one sided one, not at all.
The first thing that struck me when I first watched Pacquaio was his bounce, on his toes all the time like a kick boxer, bouncing in and out.
Roach has tried to broaden his scope and make him more than a one-two merchant but he's become a little more flat footed as a result.
Like you say TFFP, in this fight he needs to be in, throw, out. Over and over. I think he can decision Oscar if he does this and resists the urge to brawl.
All that said you just cannot rule out Oscar throwing him around and walking right through him. Realistically Oscar is a 154 fighter and Pacman was 130 until his last fight. It's unprecedented in the lower weights to my knowledge. And quite ridiculous.
I didnt think Oscar could do 147, very surprised he can
All in all there's a stack of unanswerable variables in this fights, tough one to call
I agree that this is not the mismatch many think.
It's a shit fight to make for so many reasons, but not necessarily a one sided one, not at all.
The first thing that struck me when I first watched Pacquaio was his bounce, on his toes all the time like a kick boxer, bouncing in and out.
Roach has tried to broaden his scope and make him more than a one-two merchant but he's become a little more flat footed as a result.
Like you say TFFP, in this fight he needs to be in, throw, out. Over and over. I think he can decision Oscar if he does this and resists the urge to brawl.
All that said you just cannot rule out Oscar throwing him around and walking right through him. Realistically Oscar is a 154 fighter and Pacman was 130 until his last fight. It's unprecedented in the lower weights to my knowledge. And quite ridiculous.
I didnt think Oscar could do 147, very surprised he can
All in all there's a stack of unanswerable variables in this fights, tough one to call
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I agree with everything you just said, however...
Vote! Nail your colours to the mast.
trotter
09-09-2008, 04:51 PM
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I agree with everything you just said, however...
Vote! Nail your colours to the mast.
It's with a heavy heart I voted for an Oscar decision. Marquez and Morales have out-thought Pacquaio before. Oscar can do the same I fear, he'll look to catch Pacquaio on the way in, and with his size advantage the punches he lands could really discourage him.
I can't see Pacman fighting on the back foot, in fact he really doesn't have a plan B, he only fights one way. So Oscar knows what's coming and will plan accordingly.
It's with a heavy heart I voted for an Oscar decision. Marquez and Morales have out-thought Pacquaio before. Oscar can do the same I fear, he'll look to catch Pacquaio on the way in, and with his size advantage the punches he lands could really discourage him.
I can't see Pacman fighting on the back foot, in fact he really doesn't have a plan B, he only fights one way. So Oscar knows what's coming and will plan accordingly.
I thought you were with me man :-(
I respect your pick though, and everybody elses and see the logic behind it. Which is unusual.
martin0792
09-09-2008, 04:54 PM
Oscar is simply to big for Manny, Oscar will force a stoppage in the mid part of the fight.
GazOC
09-09-2008, 05:11 PM
I'll take Oscar, he's just too big. The fight is at 147 (yep, he might struggle slightly), he'll be up around 152 for the fight with Pac around 140 in only his second fight above 130.
Pac has the speed to pressure Oscar and cause him problems and I'm not sure Oscar has the stamina to force a stoppage but I think a clear UD is the least he'll get. I'll vote for a stoppage.
Ok, looks like I'm going it alone on this one
I will be the oracle
Fat Joe
09-09-2008, 06:27 PM
I agree with you TFFP. A couple of weeks ago I posted a thread in the General along the lines of, "How shocked would you be if De La Hoya sparked Pacman in 1". At the time I posted it I would have picked De La Hoya early, but now I've thought it through a bit more I'm going for a Pac decision, for much the same reasons you've given.
I've only actually seen Pac in his last two fights, the 2nd fight with Marquez left me wondering what all the hype was about, I thought he lost, but he was awesome against Diaz. I didn't see the Forbes fight but if I'm correct De La Hoya failed to make 147 so I think if he does boil down to this he weakens himself and allows a highly motivated Pacman to win a close decision.
GazOC
09-09-2008, 06:36 PM
The form line with Forbes and Diaz is a funny one. Oscar didn't look good against a smaller man but won clearly whereas Pac looked very good stepping up in weight against Diaz but couldn't really put a dent in him despite hitting him with everything but the kitchen sink and still won by KO.
Based on those two fights you could make a decent argument for either Oscar or Pac.
Pacquiao is continually touted as a potential fight, but would Phil Taylor fight De La Hoya should he win and if he came through Malignaggi?
trotter
09-10-2008, 04:48 AM
Pacquiao is continually touted as a potential fight, but would Phil Taylor fight De La Hoya should he win and if he came through Malignaggi?
Without doubt IMO
Hatton will fight the winner of this fight, barring disaster against Paulie (which I think is going to be a very untidy, close verdict one way or the other).
fidds
09-10-2008, 05:30 AM
Be honest though no matter how good manny is, if he walks onto a big hook or something from oscar he will get ktfo :dead. Ok its a big if but is more then possible, manny cant hurt oscar imo and thats the big difference in this fight and with manny's style he isnt going to go 12 rounds with out getting hit.
El Cepillo
09-10-2008, 05:30 AM
Pacquiao is continually touted as a potential fight, but would Phil Taylor fight De La Hoya should he win and if he came through Malignaggi?
Phil Taylor :rofl
Without doubt IMO
Hatton will fight the winner of this fight, barring disaster against Paulie (which I think is going to be a very untidy, close verdict one way or the other).
Yes, there is a distinct possibility Malignaggi could win that fight much to the amazement of the Brit forum.
I thought he didn't want to go above 140 again - as he would have to with De La Hoya?
trotter
09-10-2008, 06:20 AM
Yes, there is a distinct possibility Malignaggi could win that fight much to the amazement of the Brit forum.
I thought he didn't want to go above 140 again - as he would have to with De La Hoya?
If Manny jumps 3 divisions in a matter of months to fight Oscar I'm sure Hatton will accomodate a move back up !
If Manny jumps 3 divisions in a matter of months to fight Oscar I'm sure Hatton will accomodate a move back up !
Although Pacquiao seems to make the transition through weights more convincingly, it had to be said. This is a big ask though, of course.
Hatton always bangs on about how "junior welter is me natural weight". I'm sure he could be tempted by the $ though.
Nice one Flux.
Bull Terrier
09-10-2008, 07:43 AM
I also think that the weigh-in on the day of the fight will hurt De La Hoya. But since it's (hopefully) his last fight I really don't think that he would have taken it unless he was pretty sure he could make the weight and win the fight.
For me it really comes down to how De La Hoya will fare at such a low weight for him. Quite honestly if he can handle the transition then I think that he could potentially brutalise Pac-man. De La Hoya is no mug though - if he didn't think he could make the weight then he wouldn't have accepted the fight.
For me De La Hoya is going to win by KO or TKO. I think that Pac-man made a mistake in accepting the fight, although full kudos to him for taking a risky fight, despite the money he's making.
GazOC
09-10-2008, 07:50 AM
Its an easy fight for Pac to take, the worse case is that he loses a fight 1 stone over his natural weight, gets paid a fortune and goes back to 135 or 140. De La Hoya is the man who stands to lose the most out of this.
Bull Terrier
09-10-2008, 10:20 AM
I thinK Pac is fast enough and punches hard enough to cause Oscar problems, especially since his stamina has always been lacking after 8 rounds.
If Oscar can land a big, telling shot in the fight then yes. But Pac can box smart. I think he can do it on points.
Pac-man is a massive puncher at super-featherweight and seemed to be hard enough at lightweight. However nobody knows if he can carry the power up to welterweight. Somehow I doubt that he'll have the power of some of the guys who De La Hoya has faced and not been knocked out by. De La Hoya has a very good battle-tested chin. I agree about his lack of stamina however, but I reckon that he'll get Pac-man out of there before the stamina issue comes into play.
trotter
09-10-2008, 11:13 AM
Pac-man is a massive puncher at super-featherweight and seemed to be hard enough at lightweight. However nobody knows if he can carry the power up to welterweight. Somehow I doubt that he'll have the power of some of the guys who De La Hoya has faced and not been knocked out by. De La Hoya has a very good battle-tested chin. I agree about his lack of stamina however, but I reckon that he'll get Pac-man out of there before the stamina issue comes into play.
Oscar has been fighting bigger men, of course. But in the last five years he's only stopped Mayorga.
If Pacquaio can be elusive (and with his speed advantage he should be, relatively) I don't know if Oscar has the tools to stop him. Oscar seems like a real plodder to me these days.
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