Roberto Duran .Vs. Thomas Hearns 1980

[la-califa]

If Roberto Duran fought Tommy Hearns in 1980 at Welterweight. Would the result have been different than thier actual fight?

[Robbi]

If Roberto Duran fought Tommy Hearns in 1980 at Welterweight. Would the result have been different than thier actual fight?

Duran lasts longer, until around the 8th round. His reflexes and speed of hand and foot were better than four years later at jr middleweight. Physically he'd be tuned finer, but he still gets KO'd based on Hearns' height, reach, power, and handspeed.

[the cobra]

Montreal Duran certainly could pull it off, and I could easily see him getting to Tommy late, but I'd favor Hearns. Partly due to style, but more so size. Hearns has what, 6 or 7 inches in height and reach on Duran. That's hard to overcome for a fighter who is at his best on the inside facing one of the all-time greatest punchers.

[Robbi]

Montreal Duran certainly could pull it off, and I could easily see him getting to Tommy late, but I'd favor Hearns. Partly due to style, but more so size. Hearns has what, 6 or 7 inches in height and reach on Duran. That's hard to overcome for a fighter who is at his best on the inside facing one of the all-time greatest punchers.

11 inches in reach. Duran 67" and Hearns 78". I can see Hearns' uppercut being a key weapon when Duran got inside his reach and past his jab, also the right hand. When Hagler pressed and tried to get inside we all know what happened, Hearns fired right back to try and keep him in check. Duran never had Hagler's reach and outside ability while trying to close the distance to do equally as well. I'm looking at the comparison with both fights based on styles rather than strength and power as Duran clearly wasn't the physical specimen that Hagler was when he faced Tommy. However, maybe thats evened out a little as Duran slipped and feinted as well as Hagler, probably better.

[MAG1965]

If Roberto Duran fought Tommy Hearns in 1980 at Welterweight. Would the result have been different than thier actual fight?
Same result but a few rounds later. Hearns would be too fast and the right would be landing flush. And in this case Duran fans could not make up the excuses they do. Yet they still would. Hearns would do to Duran what he did to Cueves and to Duran himself in 1984, but it might take a little longer. I think he would almost punish Duran longer and make it more devastating.. It would not be good for Duran. He could never beat a prime Hearns. Hearns was too fast and sharp. Duran always loses.

[FromWithin]

Yes, the fight may last a little longer, to rounds 7-8-9, but I agree that Hearns has always had Duran's number, just a bad style match-up.

[MAG1965]

Bad speed matchup also

[WhataRock]

Roberto completely mugged Leonard in 1980...I dont think Sugar expected such a skilled fighter to be coming at him.

If Duran was to have the same element of suprise its a lot closer then people may think.
I do think however if he was to win or give Hearns a close fight a rematch would be a much clearer win for Tommy.

I strongly disagree that Tommy would do to him what Hearns did to Pipino as that was as emphatic a win as you will ever see. Pipino is completely inferior to Duran in every way except pure punching power (but that doesnt neccesarily make him the more effective puncher), especially the version that took on Leonard the first time.

I dont think Duran in the Hearns fight was the same guy who beat Davey Moore a year earlier nor the same fighter who even took on Hagler 6 months earlier. I dont want to take away from Tommy's amazing demolishen but I think Roberto's inconsistencies at those higher weights prior to and after this loss had a lot more to do with elements outside the ring.

This would more then likely be a Hearns victory but Duran's ability to slip and feint his way inside would definitely make this interesting. A prime Duran was in such great shape he could take very big bombs and recover quickly. Tommy's bombs are a different ball game but I think this is a good fight especially if we a taking into consideration that Hearns may have underrated Duran, much like Leonard probably did.

[Curtis Lowe]

The Duran that fought Hearns was a completely diiferent fighter than the Duran of 1980. I think the 1980 Duran beats Hearns.

[Rebel-INS]

I actually think Duran would fight the same if they fought in 1980. If you watch interviews with him, he was very confident that all he'd have to do is hit Tommy once and that would be it. As such I think he would go straight at Hearns for the ko, and end up getting flattened again.
Possibly a little later, around the 5th or 6th I think.

[Longhhorn71]

As been said before on this forum, per Manny Steward, Duran was always very quiet around Hearns when they saw each other at banquets and events (pre- when they fought).

Duran knew he would have to face Tommy sometime down the line.

For a smaller fighter, looking at a 6'2" Hearns gives you something to think about.

[MRBILL]

If Roberto Duran fought Tommy Hearns in 1980 at Welterweight. Would the result have been different than thier actual fight?

I'm a Roberto Duran nut-grabber to the max, but 1980 doesn't really matter at all..... Duran was just too short with short arms compared to the lanky Tommy Hearns..... Hearns just has Duran's number......

MR.BILL:bbb

[Robbi]

I'm a Roberto Duran nut-grabber to the max
MR.BILL:bbb


MR.BILL. You're certainly an honest man. :lol:

[Rise Above]

The old adage of styles make fights is why I think Hearns would have still won this fight whatever year.

[JohnThomas1]

Hearns any year for me. Foreman - Frazier all over again.

[Doppleganger]

It might go longer but the result is still the same for me.

Hearns via stoppage, by round 6.

[Rise Above]

Great avatar Doppelganger. :blurp:blurp

[Jbuz]

the smaller duran is, the more dangerous he is...he beats Hearns ass

Agreed.

Duran would smoke Wlad.

But no, Hearns would always beat Duran.

[laxpdx]

Either the Cobra by late KO or Duran by narrow decision.

[SOMERSETDURAN]

It's so hard to judge this one. Duran was simply awesome in 1980, but Hearns is a stylistic nightmare for him, and I think the most likely outcome is a mid rounds Hearns TKO.

Given that Hearns is undoubtedly the heaviest hitting Welter ever, and a top 5 all time welter, it's testament to Duran that people feel he could possibly push him despite being 2 weights above his optimum

[ThinBlack]

Thomas would still win, but probably around the eighth to ninth round.Too much skill and size for Roberto to overcome.

[lufcrazy]

If he hasn't already, mag will come on here and shut this thread down.

Even in 72 a teenage boy lightweight version of hearns obliterates duran, hearns proved it in 84 against peak duran at his peak weight.

[orriray59]

I think Hearns just had his number. But make no mistake, Duran would make it hard.

[Duodenum]

This is the match I believe Duran should have made after Hearns-Cuevas, not New Orleans. On high alert, with the realization that he was fighting for his life, there's no way he drinks and parties his way into this WW unification match. Plus, Tommy, at just 21 years of age, didn't yet have the experience and stamina El Cholo had just displayed in Montreal. Roberto would have had a huge competitive edge at this point in time. Hearns, not Duran, would have been more likely to come in overconfident. We saw how SRL was able to buckle Tommy's body at 147, and Ray himself came out of Montreal with a severely bruised torso.

Hearns wasn't ready yet. This would have been the last time we saw Roberto in Montreal condition and motivation, and the Panamanian would make it pay off by slipping inside and belaboring the body en route to a late stoppage win.

[DDDUUDDDEE]

Hearns just straight up had his number, it's styles yo

[TAC602]

This is the match I believe Duran should have made after Hearns-Cuevas, not New Orleans. On high alert, with the realization that he was fighting for his life, there's no way he drinks and parties his way into this WW unification match. Plus, Tommy, at just 21 years of age, didn't yet have the experience and stamina El Cholo had just displayed in Montreal. Roberto would have had a huge competitive edge at this point in time. Hearns, not Duran, would have been more likely to come in overconfident. We saw how SRL was able to buckle Tommy's body at 147, and Ray himself came out of Montreal with a severely bruised torso.

Hearns wasn't ready yet. This would have been the last time we saw Roberto in Montreal condition and motivation, and the Panamanian would make it pay off by slipping inside and belaboring the body en route to a late stoppage win.

Awesome post Duo, a pleasant surprise (not in quality, but prediction).

There aren't five welterweights I'd favor over Duran at his 147 best (which kind of begs the question as to where he could rate, especially considering he beat Palomino and SRL).

[lufcrazy]

Straight up, i'd bet on hearns against any ww in history over 12 rounds bar robinson. I think his chin is a myth, especially at ww.

Even greats like gavilan, napoles, armstrong, ryan etc at best I give them all a punchers chance and that alone isn't enough for me to pick them over tommy.

I think even ray robinson i'd only give a punchers chance, but i'm sure he finds that punch, just as he did so many times in his career.

As duo says, the best time for duran is right after tommy beat cuevas and maybe just maybe roberto outlasts him but to be honest it's a big maybe and I can't see tommy being behind on points at any stage; the guy was a physical freak and a technical marvel. It's just unfortunate he was in the same era as two of the greatest divisional fighters in history. If he'd have come 5 years earlier or 5 years later people might just be talking about him as a top 5 ww.

As it is we can only judge what happened and the night he destroyed cuevas, I believe he was the best ww in the world even if he wasn't quite as mature as he needed to be to fight in the era he fought in.

[duranimal]

This is the match I believe Duran should have made after Hearns-Cuevas, not New Orleans. On high alert, with the realization that he was fighting for his life, there's no way he drinks and parties his way into this WW unification match. Plus, Tommy, at just 21 years of age, didn't yet have the experience and stamina El Cholo had just displayed in Montreal. Roberto would have had a huge competitive edge at this point in time. Hearns, not Duran, would have been more likely to come in overconfident. We saw how SRL was able to buckle Tommy's body at 147, and Ray himself came out of Montreal with a severely bruised torso.

Hearns wasn't ready yet. This would have been the last time we saw Roberto in Montreal condition and motivation, and the Panamanian would make it pay off by slipping inside and belaboring the body en route to a late stoppage win.

TRUTH:deal:yep

I've been saying it for years:bbb

[teeto]

Their fight in reality was not close at all, Duran would not win. If the fight was of a close nature then you could make the case for a prime Duran, but we're talking a one sided annihilation in two rounds being the only empirical evidence at hand. Hearns by knockout.

[Kid Bacon]

Hearns is Duran's kryptonite.

Duran is not going to overcome the huge physical gap in order to reach a stoppage, and no way he is going to outbox Tommy to reach a decision.

As already mentioned, a prime Duran only last a little longer and makes his defeat a little less abject

[PowerPuncher]

There would always be too good of a long jab, too much reach and too much speed for Duran to overcome. Before Duran get's hurt Hearns is owning him with the jab and counters. Now Duran would be a bit quicker but I can't see it making much of a difference, Hearns would boss him again and would always have the power to KO Duran.

Hearns isn't Leonard, he's bigger, a better jab and doesn't make some of the same technical mistakes

[DDDUUDDDEE]

Straight up, i'd bet on hearns against any ww in history over 12 rounds bar robinson. I think his chin is a myth, especially at ww.

Even greats like gavilan, napoles, armstrong, ryan etc at best I give them all a punchers chance and that alone isn't enough for me to pick them over tommy.

I think even ray robinson i'd only give a punchers chance, but i'm sure he finds that punch, just as he did so many times in his career.

As duo says, the best time for duran is right after tommy beat cuevas and maybe just maybe roberto outlasts him but to be honest it's a big maybe and I can't see tommy being behind on points at any stage; the guy was a physical freak and a technical marvel. It's just unfortunate he was in the same era as two of the greatest divisional fighters in history. If he'd have come 5 years earlier or 5 years later people might just be talking about him as a top 5 ww.

As it is we can only judge what happened and the night he destroyed cuevas, I believe he was the best ww in the world even if he wasn't quite as mature as he needed to be to fight in the era he fought in.

This is a good post, people get caught up too much on Hearns "chin" and forget what a destroyer he was at WW, no one with Durans physical dimensions is ever beating him, period

Plus it really isn't Duran's natural weight, which makes the first Leonard win all that more impressive

[JimmyShimmy]

I do think Duran's loss to Hearn's was greatly influenced by circumstance.

A slimmer, less imposing Hearn's against a fitter, sharper Duran would probably play out rather differently.

Whether Duran would win is another question but I think it would be a great fight.

[Brownies]

I'm a big fan of both, as most people around here. Duran would definitly do better, because he was in a bad period of his career when he fought Tommy. After his fight against Hagler in 1983, Duran didn't make much noise until 1987. However, the result would not be that much different. I've got Hearns by KO, but Duran would look much better.

[red cobra]

Hearns may have just replicated the result and the round 4 years later..maybe Duran could have lasted to the 3rd, but I doubt it.

[lufcrazy]

This is a good post, people get caught up too much on Hearns "chin" and forget what a destroyer he was at WW, no one with Durans physical dimensions is ever beating him, period

Plus it really isn't Duran's natural weight, which makes the first Leonard win all that more impressive

Exactly it's a tough ask with it being above his idea weight. I think he'd beat tommy if he could drain him down to lw.

[Stevie G]

If Roberto Duran fought Tommy Hearns in 1980 at Welterweight. Would the result have been different than thier actual fight?
Hearns was always wrong for Duran,imo. I can see Roberto taking him the distance though.

Duran was the best one,pound for pound,out of the '4 Kings' Just a shame that he was the oldest and of the lightest peak fighting weight.

[Stevie G]

Great avatar Doppelganger. :blurp:blurp
Is n't it just ? :fire

[kingfisher3]

i agree with the general consesus.
if i was promoting for a duran win i would want tiny ring, sweltering humidity and a ref who wont break much, plus i would want him to hit the body. But as you say he is unlikely to get past tommy's jab whatever.

[Robbi]

I'm a big fan of both, as most people around here. Duran would definitly do better, because he was in a bad period of his career when he fought Tommy. After his fight against Hagler in 1983, Duran didn't make much noise until 1987. However, the result would not be that much different. I've got Hearns by KO, but Duran would look much better.

He might last between 6 and 8 rounds.

[TAC602]

Interesting that Duran beat arguably the greatest welterweight you could put on his resume sans the original Sugar Ray, yet from a stylistic/physical standpoint, beating Hearns may of been an even more astonishing achievement.

[techks]

Hearns knocks him out 10 out of 10 times. I'm a big fan of both BTW.

[red cobra]

Duran is of course the greater fighter p4p, but Hearns knocks him out in brutal fashion 10 out of 10 times.

[Bogotazo]

I posted my thoughts on this in a rather similar thread:

Taller rangier fighters are often cited as the kryptonite to their shorter counter-parts in fantasy match-ups, but one could also argue the opposite just as often. At 147, Hearns would be facing arguably the best most technical swarmer in the business with hard punches at either side at all times. While Hearns was skilled and gifted in many areas, his ability to take a punch (while sometimes underrated) is not conducive to an inside fight. Hearns wasn't terrible on the inside, but it's Duran we're talking about here. The way we imagine him winning this fight is if he can get inside on Hearns, which is ultimately the question.

Hearns is going to be one of the most difficult opponents for Duran to pressure, due to his lateral movement, elite and consistent jab, and raw power. In my opinion, Duran's best option is to rush him. Hearns is going to win the battle on the outside once he gets into a rhythm, so Duran has to pull a Hagler. His lack of physical strength and durability in comparison to Hagler would be a setback, but his relative height and superior upper-body movement would enable him to bring an inside war to Hearns' body and head through defensive access. Even if Duran doesn't stop him early or hurt him badly and only has limited success getting on the inside, intimidating him from the start with a rush of aggression would likely drop Hearns' output and turn him into a more gun-shy and negative fighter, similar to how we saw him revert in the first Leonard fight. Then at that point would be Duran's opportunity to strike with his alternative boxer-puncher mix of aggression and methodical setup, countering the now less threatening jab with his own right without the same fear of a confident Hearns timing a dangerous right hand behind it. Countering his way on the inside, getting closer each time, Duran could out-hustle Hearns and get a convincing decision or a late stoppage, with some scary moments (even a possible knockown) along the way.

This scenario, of course, is on Roberto Duran's best possible night, and the event of the Brawl in Montreal showed us just what that really was.

Could Hearns just end it all with one well-timed right hand? Of course. But we can never count out Duran's inner beast, driving his formidable durability and destructive relentlessness guided by the precision of a mind belonging to a master of his craft.

[duranimal]

I posted my thoughts on this in a rather similar thread:

:good Yep i said similar & uploaded Leonards assault in round 6 that had Tommy reeling along the ropes & was only saved by the bell. That round 6 changed the whole dynamic of that fight 180 & Duran would employ similar from the off & keep it up for the whole 15. It's a UD or TKO for Roberto plain as day:deal

[JohnThomas1]

:good Yep i said similar & uploaded Leonards assault in round 6 that had Tommy reeling along the ropes & was only saved by the bell. That round 6 changed the whole dynamic of that fight 180 & Duran would employ similar from the off & keep it up for the whole 15. It's a UD or TKO for Roberto plain as day:deal

One has to get to round 6! It's a Hearns stoppage as sure as the sun sets in the west.

[1_man_army]

Even as a Duran fan I'll freely admit that Hearns with his size and ability as a package is just kryptonite for Duran. Even if Roberto came in against Hearns in 1980, I would say Tommy takes it.

[duranimal]

One has to get to round 6! It's a Hearns stoppage as sure as the sun sets in the west.

Once Duran feints & slips under Hearns jab & starts punching holes through tommys rib-cage you'll see Hearns on the ropes flapping his arms around like that aussie surfer who's being chewed in half by a great white shark:yep

Tommy did'nt know how to clinch as SRL exposed.:deal

[JohnThomas1]

Duran wouldn't get close enough often enough anyways. Duran couldn't handle fast hands and feet at 147 as SRL exposed. Hearns power is obviously proven as enough to put Roberto sound sleep.

[Garrus]

If Duran can handle Leonard's fast ass combos, he can handle Hearns two piece.

How you doing JT?

[Nightcrawler]

hearns, for me, was h2h better at 154 than 147. not saying he loses but the fight at 154 doesn't not necessarily indicate how either would fare.

154 very much favours hearns

at 147 duran was closely to his prime and hearns MIGHT have been more vulnerable to duran's attacks

[Vanboxingfan]

I personally see it being a much more competitive fight, but like most on this thread, it's hard to argue a different outcome. The only way I would envision a different outcome is if Duran got inside on Hearns and basically stayed there. This would to some extent nullify much of Hearns weapons, but obviously there's going to be breaks and other events that force the fighters apart and the more often this happens the worse it is for Duran.

[MAG1965]

If Duran can handle Leonard's fast ass combos, he can handle Hearns two piece.

How you doing JT?Dealing with Leonard and dealing with Hearns is completely different. Duran would have had to take the right hand anytime he fought Duran, and in 1984 he could not. So he would have to absorb it better if he won obviously, or get Hearns out of there quickly before he has to get hit with it.

[Robbi]

Duran ain't superman folks.......When I see people picking him over Hearns at 147lbs, I know they think he's just that - Superman.

[TAC602]

Duran ain't superman folks.......When I see people picking him over Hearns at 147lbs, I know they think he's just that - Superman.

I know, right.

But he's the only fighter of nearly the last half century with the slimmest hope of making a top ten list, so who are you to kill the dream? :rofl

BTW, Hearns wouldn't even be rated at 147 back in the days. He's just that inferior. :deal

[TAC602]

Duran is of course the greater fighter p4p, but Hearns knocks him out in brutal fashion 10 out of 10 times.

Hearns may actually be a little underappreciated, pound-for-pound, IMO. He beat a slew of rated fighters (with some HOF names mixed in) from 147 all the way up to 175 and for the most part was able to carry his power with him.

THOMAS HEARNS
01/79: Clyde Gray [65-6] (#2 WW) W-TKO10
05/79: Harold Weston [27-8] (#5 WW) W-RTD6
03/80: Angel Espada [43-10] (#7 WW) W-TKO4
08/80: Jose Cuevas [27-6] (#2 WW, WBA) W-TKO2
12/80: Luis Primera [15-0] (#8 WW) W-KO6
04/81: Randy Shields [38-6] (#5 WW) W-TKO12
09/81: Ray Leonard [30-1] (WW Champ, WBC) L-TKO14S
12/82: Wilfred Benitez [44-1] (#1 JMW, WBC) W-MD15
06/84: Roberto Duran [77-5] (#2 JMW) W-TKO2
09/84: Fred Hutchings [27-1] (#5 JMW) W-TKO3
04/85: Marvin Hagler [60-2] (MW Champ) L-TKO3
03/86: James Shuler [22-0] (#2 MW) W-KO1
06/86: Mark Medal [24-2] (#5 JMW) W-TKO8
10/86: Doug DeWitt [27-3] (#7 MW) W-UD12
03/87: Dennis Andries [28-6] (#3 LHW, WBC) W-TKO10
10/87: Juan Roldan [65-3] (NR MW, V-WBC) W-KO4
06/88: Iran Barkley [24-4] (#8 MW, WBC) L-TKO3
11/88: James Kinchen [45-4] (#8 SMW, V-WBO) W-MD12
06/89: Ray Leonard [35-1] (#1 SMW, WBC) D-PTS12
06/91: Virgil Hill [30-0] (#1 LHW, WBA) W-UD12

Pretty sick resume.

He obviously beat Leonard in their second fight.

[JohnThomas1]

If Duran can handle Leonard's fast ass combos, he can handle Hearns two piece.

How you doing JT?

Hey dude, i'm great thanks. Been enjoying the Aussies tennis success tho it could come to an abrupt end in the next 30 hours.

[Vanboxingfan]

Hey dude, i'm great thanks. Been enjoying the Aussies tennis success tho it could come to an abrupt end in the next 30 hours.


I was enjoying it too until Hewitt beat my man Raonic. Stayed up til 4:00am to watch that damn match. lol

[Garrus]

Hey dude, i'm great thanks. Been enjoying the Aussies tennis success tho it could come to an abrupt end in the next 30 hours.

Damn. :lol:

Never could get into tennis myself.

[KuRuPT]

Hearns is a bad style matchup for Duran.. BUT.. I don't think he was ready for the Duran of montreal at this point in his career.

[JohnThomas1]

I was enjoying it too until Hewitt beat my man Raonic. Stayed up til 4:00am to watch that damn match. lol

Oooooops :D

[round15]

Straight up, i'd bet on hearns against any ww in history over 12 rounds bar robinson. I think his chin is a myth, especially at ww.

Even greats like gavilan, napoles, armstrong, ryan etc at best I give them all a punchers chance and that alone isn't enough for me to pick them over tommy.

I think even ray robinson i'd only give a punchers chance, but i'm sure he finds that punch, just as he did so many times in his career.

As duo says, the best time for duran is right after tommy beat cuevas and maybe just maybe roberto outlasts him but to be honest it's a big maybe and I can't see tommy being behind on points at any stage; the guy was a physical freak and a technical marvel. It's just unfortunate he was in the same era as two of the greatest divisional fighters in history. If he'd have come 5 years earlier or 5 years later people might just be talking about him as a top 5 ww.

As it is we can only judge what happened and the night he destroyed cuevas, I believe he was the best ww in the world even if he wasn't quite as mature as he needed to be to fight in the era he fought in.

This is key. I can't see Hearns losing on the scorecards at any given time against Duran. A younger WW Duran might be able to move better and get inside Hearns' long jab and work the body. This is his best chance at beating Hearns. Slip and counter on the inside and slow him down and stop him late with body shots.

Hearns is the favourite at any stage in their careers though.