Joe Louis 1930's vs Sam Peter today.

[young griffo]

I know when I've previously posted about fantasy match ups involving modern fighters and old time greats I've suspended my natural inclination to favour the modern guy purely out of sentiment.But secretly I've always had a nagging feeling that fighters with todays modern training,diet,tactical analysis,and superior conditioning would always have a huge advantage over the greats of yesteryear and would more than likely win.

Never again.

After watching Sam Peter plodding about today it got me wondering whether an old great like a Joe Louis could literally step from a ring 70 years ago and compete with one of the so called top modern Heavyweights.

My conclusion is a resounding yes.

I watched some old Louis fights and footage against the likes of Schmeling,Baer,Conn and Carnera and even with the inferior quality film,lack of close ups and multi-camera angles,Louis looked vastly superior to Peter (and Klitschko to be honest).Joe's technique,power,speed,jab and defense were all way better than Peters',and I'd favour Louis to step out of a 1930's ring and spank Sam within 8 rounds,despite being much smaller physically.

This isn't a nostalgia thread but what I now truly believe.I know Peter is no ATG but even with the progression of time and science he would never,never beat a prime Joe Louis.

Do you guys agree or do you think even a fighter of Peters' limited ability would still prevail against an old fighter from the 1930's even one of Louis's ilk?

[he grant]

You refer to the 1930's as if they were 18th Century England. Joe Louis would have destroyed the "modern trained and conditioned" Peter in four or five rounds ...

[TommyV]

Louis style isn't that dated. He may not have the modern training techniques and condition, but his natural speed and amazing power, and offensive composite punching skills and solid chin and under-rated defence mean he would knock Peter out within 6.

[young griffo]

You refer to the 1930's as if they were 18th Century England. Joe Louis would have destroyed the "modern trained and conditioned" Peter in four or five rounds ...
Well it's clearly obvious in most sports (football,cricket,athletics etc) that advances have been made re training,fitness and tactical analysis,since these sports are now almost completely professional,and I'd've thought boxing would've likewise have benefitted from professionlism and improved as well.

My point was that I don't think this is the case at all and if anything todays fight showed how much boxing and in particular the glamour Heavyweight division has regressed.

[JohnThomas1]

Peter is made for Joe.

[Loewe]

I know when I've previously posted about fantasy match ups involving modern fighters and old time greats I've suspended my natural inclination to favour the modern guy purely out of sentiment.But secretly I've always had a nagging feeling that fighters with todays modern training,diet,tactical analysis,and superior conditioning would always have a huge advantage over the greats of yesteryear and would more than likely win.

Never again.

After watching Sam Peter plodding about today it got me wondering whether an old great like a Joe Louis could literally step from a ring 70 years ago and compete with one of the so called top modern Heavyweights.

My conclusion is a resounding yes.

I watched some old Louis fights and footage against the likes of Schmeling,Baer,Conn and Carnera and even with the inferior quality film,lack of close ups and multi-camera angles,Louis looked vastly superior to Peter (and Klitschko to be honest).Joe's technique,power,speed,jab and defense were all way better than Peters',and I'd favour Louis to step out of a 1930's ring and spank Sam within 8 rounds,despite being much smaller physically.

This isn't a nostalgia thread but what I now truly believe.I know Peter is no ATG but even with the progression of time and science he would never,never beat a prime Joe Louis.

Do you guys agree or do you think even a fighter of Peters' limited ability would still prevail against an old fighter from the 1930's even one of Louis's ilk?

I thought all that you mentioned there was always very obvious :huh

[JohnThomas1]

I thought all that you mentioned there was always very obvious :huh

Many would argue tho and he's looking for opinions both ways. From the 30's forward i agree with him.

[bum of the week]

I know when I've previously posted about fantasy match ups involving modern fighters and old time greats I've suspended my natural inclination to favour the modern guy purely out of sentiment.But secretly I've always had a nagging feeling that fighters with todays modern training,diet,tactical analysis,and superior conditioning would always have a huge advantage over the greats of yesteryear and would more than likely win.

Never again.

After watching Sam Peter plodding about today it got me wondering whether an old great like a Joe Louis could literally step from a ring 70 years ago and compete with one of the so called top modern Heavyweights.

My conclusion is a resounding yes.

I watched some old Louis fights and footage against the likes of Schmeling,Baer,Conn and Carnera and even with the inferior quality film,lack of close ups and multi-camera angles,Louis looked vastly superior to Peter (and Klitschko to be honest).Joe's technique,power,speed,jab and defense were all way better than Peters',and I'd favour Louis to step out of a 1930's ring and spank Sam within 8 rounds,despite being much smaller physically.

This isn't a nostalgia thread but what I now truly believe.I know Peter is no ATG but even with the progression of time and science he would never,never beat a prime Joe Louis.

Do you guys agree or do you think even a fighter of Peters' limited ability would still prevail against an old fighter from the 1930's even one of Louis's ilk?


Modern training?
What signs were there that Peter had done any training at all?

Modern diet?
From the look of ol' Sams' body I'll say that Two-ton Tonys' diet probably was more modern!

If Peters gameplan was to stay just inside Vitalis range so he could catch his jab with his face and then miss with his hook in order to allow Vitali to land his right he made a perfect job of it.

Louis would certainly have beaten Peter, as would Ali, Holmes, Foreman and , Liston to name a few of yesteryears champs.

You can't compare an individual sport with teamsports like football, baseball, basket or soccer. Any team is likely touses dozens of players during a season. Let's say that 95% of the players are like 5% better then the players of 20 years ago. If you add all the players together that will mean a considerable improvement for a team, yet there might still just have been that special individual of the past who iwas as good or better than the best of today.

Louis Ali(60's version) and Holmes were that kind of special talents, standouts in comparison to their contemporaries in a way that no current heavy is close to being. And I can´t see any evolution in training, diet etc. to make up for that gap in talent( or in some cases determination for that matter)

[Mendoza]

Just watch Joe Louis fight Tony Galento, another slow fat boy.

Louis had slow feet, low guard, and was just so-so on defense. Films or news reads will show us this. Louis also wasn't 6'8", with long arms.

Peter has no problem out boxing or out slugging fighters who can't run away from him such as Toney, or Maskaev, or fighters who like to stand and trade.

Peter could land on Louis. Of course I think Louis would land more on Peter. IMO, Peter's got the better chin. Louis has the better speed/skills.

Give the nod to Louis, but the fight is dangerous for him. It could be a Galento like fight for Louis, where he goes down and comes close to disaster.

[Minotauro]

If Peter tried to brawl with Louis then this fight will look like Louis vs Max Baer. Joe would destroy Peter in a few rounds with Samuel's chin helping him get past three but then he'll get stopped in the fifth or sixth round. Peter is not a dangerous fight for Louis he simply has a punchers chance and since Louis was very hard to finish it ain't happening.

[PowerPuncher]

Peter has no problem out boxing or out slugging fighters who can't run away from him such as Toney, or Maskaev, or fighters who like to stand and trade..

Except an old fat 38yo Toney deserved the decision in their first fight

[PowerPuncher]

Louis KO6 - Louis's fast compact punches land at will and Peter slow wide punches are easy for him to anticipate and counter

[young griffo]

Louis KO6 - Louis's fast compact punches land at will and Peter slow wide punches are easy for him to anticipate and counter
Agreed.
Just the difference in punching technique gives Louis a huge edge imo.Peter has to be one of the slowest fighters I've ever seen,and not having seen a whole lot of his fights before it makes me wonder how he ever won a world title.
He's certainly not beating Louis,Ali,Holmes or probably even Dempsey or Tunney for that matter.

[MachineGunMitch]

LOL,funny..........You take the best of all time and place him in front of
some fat slow lathargic POS fighter ....What do you think is going to happen?

[RealIzm]

Louis style isn't that dated. He may not have the modern training techniques and condition, but his natural speed and amazing power, and offensive composite punching skills and solid chin and under-rated defence mean he would knock Peter out within 6.ditto:good

[The Kurgan]

Except an old fat 38yo Toney deserved the decision in their first fight

:rofl

My thoughts exactly!

[RockyJim]

Joe Louis is charged with manslaughter against Peter...can we finally stop talking about how Peter would have beaten Marciano..Louis..Dempsey...Ali..etc now??

[JohnThomas1]

Peter would be very lucky to beat a good version of Joe Bugner, let alone Louis.

[SteveO]

Joe Louis is charged with manslaughter against Peter...can we finally stop talking about how Peter would have beaten Marciano..Louis..Dempsey...Ali..etc now??

I hope so.

[JohnThomas1]

I hope so.

Hence my realistic thread vs Bugner.

[young griffo]

Hence my realistic thread vs Bugner.
I finally got around to seeing Frazier-Bugner the other day and I've got no doubt that version of Bugner would box the ears off of the fat,slow,inept version of Peter we got yesterday.

[JohnThomas1]

I finally got around to seeing Frazier-Bugner the other day and I've got no doubt that version of Bugner would box the ears off of the fat,slow,inept version of Peter we got yesterday.

Totally agree, totally. I was actually thinking of making it Tex Cobb instead of Bugner.

[young griffo]

Joe Louis is charged with manslaughter against Peter...can we finally stop talking about how Peter would have beaten Marciano..Louis..Dempsey...Ali..etc now??
Did people seriously think Peter could beat these guys before yesterday??

As I said earlier I hadn't seen much of him before yesterday but it really opened my eyes to how bad todays Heavies are if someone of Peter's limitations can be a World champion today.

I'd class him with Seldon,Botha and probably Leon Spinks as one of the poorer fighters to hold a Heavyweight world title.

[young griffo]

Joe Louis = Slow glass chinned 205 pounder vs Sam Peter who has a glass chin is a fat slob with no skill. I pick Peter by knock out early though. At least he wasn't almost knocked out by a guy like Billy Conny who couldnt punch at his own weight glass (66 wins and 11 knockouts)
Could you kindly keep away from threads started by me in the future thanks.
I'm after the opinions of the 99% of posters on this forum whose opinions I'm interested in and respect.
I'm neither interested in or respect what you've got to say as you've shown yourself time and again to be a classless,racist,half-wit without a single redeeming feature.
Cheers:good

[fists of fury]

I know when I've previously posted about fantasy match ups involving modern fighters and old time greats I've suspended my natural inclination to favour the modern guy purely out of sentiment.But secretly I've always had a nagging feeling that fighters with todays modern training,diet,tactical analysis,and superior conditioning would always have a huge advantage over the greats of yesteryear and would more than likely win.

Never again.

After watching Sam Peter plodding about today it got me wondering whether an old great like a Joe Louis could literally step from a ring 70 years ago and compete with one of the so called top modern Heavyweights.

My conclusion is a resounding yes.



...Slightly off topic, but the Klit brothers aside, the heavyweight division stinks. Really, it stinks.

It's so bad, they are looking to an untested cruiserweight to generate some excitement. Some division.

On the undercard of the Klitschko - Peter fight, I watched 2 other heavyweight fights. All four fighters were fat. One was a grotesque pig whose back wobbled about like a bowl of jelly when he moved. His opponent, the hyped Odlandier Solis, who looked as slow as a glacier, was also overweight, although he showed at least some athletic ability.
(Read: he looked like a poor man's Frank Bruno, with a layer of fat around his middle.)

People go on about superior conditioning, superior diets and superior training. In the lighter weight classes that seems obvious, but the heavyweights? They should just call it 'fatweight' and be done with it.

We're too easily fooled by sheer weight these days. These fatties and their GH bloated physiques aren't impressing me.

[Holmes' Jab]

Louis KO4.

[Holmes' Jab]

...Slightly off topic, but the Klit brothers aside, the heavyweight division stinks. Really, it stinks.

It's so bad, they are looking to an untested cruiserweight to generate some excitement. Some division.

On the undercard of the Klitschko - Peter fight, I watched 2 other heavyweight fights. All four fighters were fat. One was a grotesque pig whose back wobbled about like a bowl of jelly when he moved. His opponent, the hyped Odlandier Solis, who looked as slow as a glacier, was also overweight, although he showed at least some athletic ability.
(Read: he looked like a poor man's Frank Bruno, with a layer of fat around his middle.)

People go on about superior conditioning, superior diets and superior training. In the lighter weight classes that seems obvious, but the heavyweights? They should just call it 'fatweight' and be done with it.

We're too easily fooled by sheer weight these days. These fatties and their GH bloated physiques aren't impressing me.


Agree with all of this. Suddenly the 80's doesn't look so bad given todays lack of depth, infact the likes of Thomas, Dokes, Page, Tubbs and Berbick all at their best would definitely stand a great chance of holding at least one belt in todays climate. All had ability for sure, more talented than virtually any of todays punters, but most of 'em never quite pieced it together consistently enough. Holmes and Tyson would sweep up the current division, not to mention the 90's top men (the likes of Lewis and Bowe). The Klitchskos, Wlad in particular are good enough fighters, but nothing that daunting.

[Loewe]

Agree with all of this. Suddenly the 80's doesn't look so bad given todays lack of depth, infact the likes of Thomas, Dokes, Page, Tubbs and Berbick all at their best would definitely stand a great chance of holding at least one belt in todays climate. All had ability for sure, more talented than virtually any of todays punters, but most of 'em never quite pieced it together consistently enough. Holmes and Tyson would sweep up the current division, not to mention the 90's top men (the likes of Lewis and Bowe). The Klitchskos, Wlad in particular are good enough fighters, but nothing that daunting.


Just because one era looks even worse than another one does not make that one any better.

[fists of fury]

Agree with all of this. Suddenly the 80's doesn't look so bad given todays lack of depth, infact the likes of Thomas, Dokes, Page, Tubbs and Berbick all at their best would definitely stand a great chance of holding at least one belt in todays climate. All had ability for sure, more talented than virtually any of todays punters, but most of 'em never quite pieced it together consistently enough. Holmes and Tyson would sweep up the current division, not to mention the 90's top men (the likes of Lewis and Bowe). The Klitchskos, Wlad in particular are good enough fighters, but nothing that daunting.

Not to sound like a whining git, but yes. The 80's fatties were almost skinny by the standards of some fighters today.

You have the Adonis-like Klits...and everyone else, most of whom are fat, fat, fat.

Joe Louis would tear the contenders today a new one, no question.

[Muchmoore]

You refer to the 1930's as if they were 18th Century England. Joe Louis would have destroyed the "modern trained and conditioned" Peter in four or five rounds ...

I don't think anyone has ever said Peter and conditioned in the same sentence before unless there's an "isn't" between them :lol:

[abraq]

Sam Peter ends up with a mangled face. Stopped in the sixth.