Sam McVey(a) underated?

[mattdonnellon]

Just been reading up on Sam and maybe he was one of the unluckies and under-rated HW's ever. He beat prime or near-prime Langford, Wills, Carter, Denver Ed Martin, Jeff Clarke, Devere, Battling Jim Johnson, Lang, Stewart, Jeannette, Jim Barry and many more. He lost too, but usually only to top tier fighters Martin, Jack Johnson, Langford, Jeannette, from his begining as a teenage sensation around 1900 until his first defeat by Wills in 1915 and he defeated all of these in the same time-span except Johnson whom he lost two 20 rounders too.
Any thoughts?

[Mendoza]

Just been reading up on Sam and maybe he was one of the unluckies and under-rated HW's ever. He beat prime or near-prime Langford, Wills, Clarke, Denver Ed Martin, Jeff Clarke, Devere, Battling Jim Johnson, Lang, Stewart, Jeannette, Jim Barry and many more. He lost too, but usually only to top tier fighters Martin, Jack Johnson, Langford, Jeannette, from his begining as a teenage sensation around 1900 until his first defeat by Wills in 1915 and he defeated all of these in the same time-span except Johnson whom he lost two 20 rounders too.
Any thoughts?

McVey did not fight like Johnson or Jeanette. He was in there to mix it up and trade punches. I have seen a good 3 rounds on McVey. He looks like a beast in the ring, but he was not much for defense, a jab, or skills in general.

Chalk McVey up as a durable puncher type, and a legit heavyweight threat.

One odd thing about McVey, he looks like an intimidating dude, but in news read and even on flim he doesn't quite seem to have the mean streak I thought he might.

[he grant]

INteresting. What film are you refering to? Is it the Jim JOhnson on Youtube ?

Clay's book on Langford gets heavily into McVey and in fact McVey was quite a boxer and made use of what he refers to as a very good jab ... that was the style he used to beat and then remain competitive with Sam Langford with many times ..

I think McVey is underated and much is not really known about him ...

[Mendoza]

INteresting. What film are you refering to? Is it the Jim JOhnson on Youtube ?

Clay's book on Langford gets heavily into McVey and in fact McVey was quite a boxer and made use of what he refers to as a very good jab ... that was the style he used to beat and then remain competitive with Sam Langford with many times ..

I think McVey is underated and much is not really known about him ...

I have a full 3+ rounds at normal speed of McVey vs Jim Johnson, some of which is on youtube.

Langford said McVey could not jab well because he was a bow armed fighter. On flim McVey doesn't throw any lead jabs for offense.

[TAC602]

Good enough to be avoided the same as his other elite peers.

Johnson obviously beat him as well, although I dont know how much value can be put on it considering McVey was 18 years old. (?)

[Seamus]

He sounds better when described by his contemporaries than when seen on film. But then most of his contemporaries did not live long enough to see boxers who knew what they were doing in the ring.

[McGrain]

McVey did not fight like Johnson or Jeanette. He was in there to mix it up and trade punches. I have seen a good 3 rounds on McVey. He looks like a beast in the ring, but he was not much for defense, a jab, or skills in general.

Chalk McVey up as a durable puncher type, and a legit heavyweight threat.

This is not something I agree with. he grant is correct to underline Clay's opinions on McVey, and i'd echo them myself. The more lurid embelishments of the Jeanette war and his looks have led to mis-understandings about his type.

This is a perfect example of how McVey can be underated or mis-understood. Matt is right.

[Seamus]

I thought I remember Clay describing him as fighting in retreat, but then again, who wouldn't want to do that against Langford?

He certainly got fed to the wolves early and often in his career, had a few nice pelts, but mostly by having the chance to fight the same good opponents so often. He was bound to pick up a win in that many contests. I think he had a rather haphazard, and a bit unfortunate career. Still, he seems a bit overrated in my book.

[mcvey]

This is not something I agree with. he grant is correct to underline Clay's opinions on McVey, and i'd echo them myself. The more lurid embelishments of the Jeanette war and his looks have led to mis-understandings about his type.

This is a perfect example of how McVey can be underated or mis-understood. Matt is right.



And a perfect example of how some one summarizes, and delivers an opinion of his style ,based on 3 rounds of grainy film.

Below is a description of the 1915 fight between Mcvey & Harry Wills, note the use of the word LEFT JAB.

For heavyweights the men fought hard and fast throughout, McVey taking every round but the second. In the fourth a left jab cut Wills' right eye, which troubled him in the remaining rounds. Wills took a count of nine in the ninth round after receiving a left to the body and a left hook to the jaw." (Lincoln Daily Star


Below, Graham Huston's opinion of Sam.

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[mcvey]

Good enough to be avoided the same as his other elite peers.

Johnson obviously beat him as well, although I dont know how much value can be put on it considering McVey was 18 years old. (?)
207lbs McVey was a month off of 20 for his last fight with Johnson, in between his 3 fights with Jack, he had kod Denver Ed Martin ,[1rd ] and Kid Carter,and previously Fred Russell.

[mcvey]

I have a full 3+ rounds at normal speed of McVey vs Jim Johnson, some of which is on youtube.

Langford said McVey could not jab well because he was a bow armed fighter. On flim McVey doesn't throw any lead jabs for offense.



Wills v McVey, below.

For heavyweights the men fought hard and fast throughout, McVey taking every round but the second. In the fourth a left jab cut Wills' right eye, which troubled him in the remaining rounds. Wills took a count of nine in the ninth round after receiving a left to the body and a left hook to the jaw." (Lincoln Daily Star

[McGrain]

I thought I remember Clay describing him as fighting in retreat, but then again, who wouldn't want to do that against Langford?

He certainly got fed to the wolves early and often in his career, had a few nice pelts, but mostly by having the chance to fight the same good opponents so often. He was bound to pick up a win in that many contests. I think he had a rather haphazard, and a bit unfortunate career. Still, he seems a bit overrated in my book.

How nice to read a couple of balanced posts from you on this subject.

[TAC602]

207lbs McVey was a month off of 20 for his last fight with Johnson, in between his 3 fights with Jack, he had kod Denver Ed Martin ,[1rd ] and Kid Carter,and previously Fred Russell.

:good

5-10 207 lbs before 20?

Almost the same as a well known 1980s heavyweight dubbed a freak of nature.

And in McVey's day of athletic nutrition, they may as well of been malnourished. This is amazing, see.

[Seamus]

How nice to read a couple of balanced posts from you on this subject.

Thank you. I try to balance the availability of evidence within a rational context in these matters. Glad it is appreciated.

[Cael]

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[Seamus]

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I love the running jab technique wherein you extend the left, then run straight toward your opponent with it, as though jousting.

A forgotten gem of a technique.

[mcvey]

I love the running jab technique wherein you extend the left, then run straight toward your opponent with it, as though jousting.

A forgotten gem of a technique.
The ring appears to be about 14 foot square and the ropes just there for decoration.